363: I Met Paladin Danse (& more!) - GCX 2025 Interviews

0:00 [SPEAKER_07]: Hey friends, welcome to a very special episode. [SPEAKER_07]: I just got back from GCX, twenty twenty five in Orlando, Florida, and I got a wonderful opportunity to meet so many cool people and to get to chat with a variety of different people who have actually worked in video games and not just video games, but the Fallout TV show.

0:22 [SPEAKER_07]: So get ready for a really cool episode. [SPEAKER_07]: I have five different interviews for you. [SPEAKER_07]: People who have worked in Fallout and Elder Scrolls, but also other games, plus a content creator who's making a big difference in the community. [SPEAKER_07]: So this is going to be wonderful.

0:34 [SPEAKER_07]: One of these voice actors worked both in Fallout and Elder Scrolls as Paladin Dance and Mirac. [SPEAKER_07]: Another has done voices from the nineteen eighties onward and has voiced characters and things like transformers and just bend ten in all of these popular cartoon type shows and then has also done characters across so many different video games.

0:57 [SPEAKER_07]: I can't even list them all. [SPEAKER_07]: Another voice actor who is very well known from the Mass Effect series, but has also done a lot of other cool stuff, including runs and dungeons in dragons campaign for people in a castle, and does this every year, actually multiple times a year.

1:12 [SPEAKER_07]: But to get started, we're going to go talk to the guy who runs the teams of people who handle all of the makeup in the Fallout TV show. [SPEAKER_07]: I'm so excited for you to hear all of this. [SPEAKER_07]: But also, please keep in mind, I had to do these recordings with a handheld mic, just a little lapel mic that I could record to in the midst of this big convention.

1:34 [SPEAKER_07]: So some of these, there's a little bit more background noise and sound like that. [SPEAKER_07]: Some of them are a little bit better off isolated in a room because we got the conference room. [SPEAKER_07]: So please be patient with the audio. [SPEAKER_07]: I've cleaned it up as best I can and I hope you enjoy this as much as I did, getting to chat with all these awesome people.

1:51 [SPEAKER_07]: Also, this episode is long enough as it is, so I'm not going to take a break in order to do the whole patron thing, but if you'd like to support the show, then go to Patreon. [SPEAKER_07]: You know how all that stuff works, and I will read out our new patron guests and all of that stuff next week's show.

2:04 [SPEAKER_07]: But if you do have some money burning a hole in your pocket, don't donate to us right now. [SPEAKER_07]: Take it, donate it to St. [SPEAKER_07]: Jude, Children's Hospital. [SPEAKER_07]: That's what this event is all about. [SPEAKER_07]: There is a link in the description of this episode, and there are a lot of people that could use your help.

2:20 [SPEAKER_07]: So this event has been awesome. [SPEAKER_07]: They've raised a ton of money so far. [SPEAKER_07]: Almost, almost half a million dollars raised, four hundred and thirty nine thousand as I'm looking at it right now. [SPEAKER_07]: So consider doing that instead if you'd like to help out and I hope you enjoy the rest of this episode.

2:36 [SPEAKER_07]: What's your feet up? [SPEAKER_07]: Grab a cup of coffee or I don't know going and extended run because this is going to be a long episode and I hope you enjoy. [SPEAKER_07]: Now I'm sitting here with Michael Harvey, a man who is probably a lot more deeply involved with the follow universe than any of us because he is the guy who has done well, you probably run a team, correct?

3:01 [SPEAKER_07]: There's a team of [SPEAKER_07]: several teams of makeup artists who work on the fallout TV series. [SPEAKER_07]: And as we're sitting here talking before we actually start recording, he said, I can't ask. [SPEAKER_07]: There's really not much you can tell me about season two. [SPEAKER_07]: So don't be upset if I'm not revealing any hot secrets.

3:17 [SPEAKER_07]: But I have a feeling you'll be able to tell some really cool details about the world of fallout from behind the scenes of making a TV show and all that. [SPEAKER_07]: So welcome to the show. [SPEAKER_07]: This is very exciting to get talk to you. [SPEAKER_07]: I'm so glad to meet you. [SPEAKER_00]: Thanks for having me.

3:29 [SPEAKER_00]: This is exciting. [SPEAKER_07]: So let's get back to some of your experience start with your background, both in makeup and also in fallout because you're a fallout fan. [SPEAKER_07]: When did you get into each of these things? [SPEAKER_07]: And it's still fun that two interests like that can coincide.

3:47 [SPEAKER_00]: It was a perfect storm of a situation between gameplay and my work. [SPEAKER_00]: My background was all special effects makeup, which started here in Orlando, worked behind the scenes at Universal Studios, worked on TV shows behind the scenes here at Universal Studios. [SPEAKER_00]: And then that career moved me up north to Philadelphia in New York.

4:11 [SPEAKER_00]: And I got my feet wet with doing just regular beauty makeup. [SPEAKER_00]: And so now I have enough special effects knowledge and enough beauty makeup knowledge. [SPEAKER_00]: It made me more desirable to productions. [SPEAKER_00]: One guy that has both things. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_00]: So many doors open for many different reasons because now I have a bigger toolbox if you want to call it that.

4:34 [SPEAKER_00]: So my career went from Orlando to Philadelphia to New York and once I was in New York that was maybe two thousand eight. [SPEAKER_00]: I've never stopped working since. [SPEAKER_00]: And there was always something, no we spun little projects coming to town. [SPEAKER_00]: And so you always said to go, oh, I mean, I would love to have been on that, or I love to have been on that.

4:52 [SPEAKER_00]: And then a friend of mine said, hey, I got this job. [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know. [SPEAKER_00]: It's kind of weird. [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not too sure what it is. [SPEAKER_00]: It's about a video game. [SPEAKER_00]: It's something about people living underground and post-apocalyptic. [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know.

5:06 [SPEAKER_00]: Have you heard of this? [SPEAKER_00]: It's called fallout. [SPEAKER_00]: My I had to take a minute go wait. [SPEAKER_00]: It's coming to New York. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, they're going to be filming in here in New York. [SPEAKER_00]: I'm like, I got a kid on this. [SPEAKER_00]: How do I get on this?

5:20 [SPEAKER_00]: Because they've already staffed up the American to make up department. [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I could put a word in for you. [SPEAKER_00]: See what happens. [SPEAKER_00]: You know what? [SPEAKER_00]: We'll see where Pete takes us. [SPEAKER_00]: See what happens. [SPEAKER_00]: Come to find out the guy who had the job.

5:34 [SPEAKER_00]: Backed out. [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, wow. [SPEAKER_00]: Wow. [SPEAKER_00]: He backed out. [SPEAKER_00]: There's rumors. [SPEAKER_00]: Why don't know why. [SPEAKER_00]: It's not that it matters. [SPEAKER_00]: It was a monumental project. [SPEAKER_00]: And I know the makeup artist who had the job just came off of another monumental project.

5:50 [SPEAKER_00]: I probably felt, you know what? [SPEAKER_00]: I don't want to do this again. [SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to go. [SPEAKER_00]: So my friend, who was the hair department head for the show, [SPEAKER_00]: The production came to him and they were like, well, we got a scramble to find somebody. [SPEAKER_00]: Well, you got any names, you got anybody that might be able to do this.

6:07 [SPEAKER_00]: And he says, hey, got this guy, call him. [SPEAKER_00]: And that's how it started. [SPEAKER_00]: It's like, I got in the game a little too short as far as the production. [SPEAKER_00]: Because when a show starts, there's like six weeks of pre-production. [SPEAKER_00]: Doing makeup tests, doing hair tests, building the sets, doing the crosses, doing everything.

6:25 [SPEAKER_00]: I felt a little short because this guy that was there before me was there for like three weeks. [SPEAKER_00]: So I came late, so I had to catch up well fast. [SPEAKER_00]: The one thing about catching up, I didn't have to catch up. [SPEAKER_00]: I knew the game. [SPEAKER_00]: Because I've been playing the game since fallout three, whenever that came out.

6:43 [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, that was like, two thousand eight nine. [SPEAKER_07]: Something like that. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_00]: As soon as they said, oh, we got to do Raiders. [SPEAKER_00]: We got to do away Sanders. [SPEAKER_00]: We got to do these different passions. [SPEAKER_00]: We got to do ball dwellers.

6:53 [SPEAKER_00]: We got to do goals. [SPEAKER_00]: I'm like, oh, check, check and check. [SPEAKER_07]: I'm familiar with those. [SPEAKER_07]: Yes. [SPEAKER_00]: So we had to put together, they gave us all the books of all the reference. [SPEAKER_00]: I said, I already got them. [SPEAKER_00]: I'm flipping through them, they're like, we want this, but we don't want that.

7:09 [SPEAKER_00]: We want likenesses. [SPEAKER_00]: We don't want to pull anybody right out of the game. [SPEAKER_00]: Put it right in the screen. [SPEAKER_00]: They gave us a lot of them to say room to play with the likenesses and the books, but everything was scrutinized down to [SPEAKER_00]: the right blue of the vault suits.

7:27 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, the right color of blood that they wanted, the right color of blood for the ghouls, everything was very, they were very hands on on making sure it's accurate. [SPEAKER_00]: And what a lot of people don't know is that every day of filming fall out, we had a representative. [SPEAKER_00]: But that's the there to make sure we were saying true to the story.

7:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, which was fun. [SPEAKER_07]: One of the things that the show was loaded for among many things, but one of the things that were loaded for the most by fans was the accuracy of the visuals matching their expectations from the games, whether that came from the power armor or the guns or the Nucocola bottle.

8:05 [SPEAKER_07]: But especially, I would imagine the characters, the faces of individuals, the way, like you said, Raiders look, the way the ghouls look, the way that, and all of that has something to do with, well, something that you touched. [SPEAKER_07]: That was, you were a part of all of that. [SPEAKER_00]: The hardest part that they, they wanted to have the likeness of the game.

8:28 [SPEAKER_00]: They wanted to be locked into the reality of what it really meant to be irradiated, hungry, dehydrated, tired, all these things. [SPEAKER_00]: But they said, make it feel like the game, but make it read. [SPEAKER_00]: Don't make it cartoony and make it look fake. [SPEAKER_00]: Make it look real.

8:46 [SPEAKER_00]: So it was like, oh, this is a tall order. [SPEAKER_00]: because you can make it look too real, but then it falls short for the haul out bands. [SPEAKER_00]: Right. [SPEAKER_00]: Right. [SPEAKER_00]: So you had to kind of stick with that. [SPEAKER_00]: Some of it was campy and a little bit funny cartoony, but it also had a little real.

9:03 [SPEAKER_00]: Right. [SPEAKER_00]: Right. [SPEAKER_07]: And I think you guys, that is a fine line to tread. [SPEAKER_07]: And I think you really nailed it. [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, one of the, I'm sure all of the people who are following fans are listening to this. [SPEAKER_07]: had a very similar experience that I did, watching the show for the first time.

9:17 [SPEAKER_07]: You see the trailer come out and you go, wait a minute, I think this might actually be good. [SPEAKER_07]: And then you watch the show and you've got chills and you've got like that experience of like, they know way. [SPEAKER_07]: No way. [SPEAKER_07]: This is a vault. [SPEAKER_07]: This actually looks like a vault.

9:32 [SPEAKER_07]: These vault dwellers, these vault suits. [SPEAKER_07]: These, the way the ghouls of faces look is it's different, but yet it's still accurate. [SPEAKER_07]: It still fits what we would expect. [SPEAKER_00]: It's what you would like to think if you could [SPEAKER_00]: literally transport yourself into the game and then the game became reality.

9:47 [SPEAKER_00]: That's the show. [SPEAKER_00]: Right. [SPEAKER_00]: Right. [SPEAKER_00]: And what what we did, what the, uh, Jonah Nolan did is that he likes everything practical. [SPEAKER_00]: Vault doors moving real. [SPEAKER_00]: Burger bird real. [SPEAKER_00]: Um, the Philly set. [SPEAKER_00]: All of it was real.

10:04 [SPEAKER_00]: Everything was not digital. [SPEAKER_00]: I would say, seventy percent was practical. [SPEAKER_00]: thirty percent was obviously enhanced digitally and so now we're working and we're we're almost done everybody's tired of what is beaten down everybody's like what are we doing we have no idea this this looks great we're shooting it it's all shot on film to all three five millimeter and we're like they're spending a ton of money what is this look like so we're almost at the end and where was filmed in New York stiner studios in Brooklyn [SPEAKER_00]: There was this venue, big bar, who was meant for like viewings and things, and he brought the entire crew, brought out the place.

10:46 [SPEAKER_00]: And he says, look, I've got a ninety-second teaser. [SPEAKER_00]: I want to show everybody. [SPEAKER_00]: This is what's going to be released to the public in about two months. [SPEAKER_00]: Just want to let you to see. [SPEAKER_00]: Everybody is seeing what you guys have been working for.

10:58 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, great. [SPEAKER_00]: We're all like, all right, what's this going to be? [SPEAKER_00]: Watched it. [SPEAKER_00]: And you thought you're watching a movie. [SPEAKER_07]: And yeah, yeah, the production quality was, it does not look like a TV show. [SPEAKER_07]: It looks like a movie.

11:12 [SPEAKER_00]: Every episode was a movie. [SPEAKER_00]: And after that trailer, Andy, I say there was probably a good five seconds of silence. [SPEAKER_00]: Everybody was just jaw-trapped on how amazing it looked, how well it was put together, the effects, everything, the music, the stuff, everything was just perfect.

11:31 [SPEAKER_00]: We still had like another month to go. [SPEAKER_00]: but it completely rejuvenated everybody going. [SPEAKER_00]: Wow, that's what this is. [SPEAKER_00]: Let's go. [SPEAKER_07]: That's amazing. [SPEAKER_07]: That's amazing. [SPEAKER_07]: So it sounds like if I were to ask you the hardest thing that the trading that felt like let that line would be the hardest thing is there's something that you worked on that you felt was probably your greatest accomplishments.

11:53 [SPEAKER_07]: when it comes to representing that world or a specific character or, I mean, I'm sure the ghouls were very difficult because you have to take human beings who are not qualified and it's, you know, just like movie monster makeup, you have to do it in a way where you could still say, okay, yeah, that's a person's face.

12:14 [SPEAKER_07]: and yes, they're qualified and yes, they are disgusting and creepy looking like they show up in the games, but yet it still works for the lighting and the scene and being around other human beings and all of that. [SPEAKER_07]: Would that be one of them or do you have other ideas? [SPEAKER_00]: I can't take credit for the goal work.

12:32 [SPEAKER_00]: Like I said, there was many teams that we were all under the same umbrella. [SPEAKER_00]: There was a dedicated, I mean, I ran the makeup department, but there was a special, special makeup effects group. [SPEAKER_00]: Under that umbrella there was a group just for Walton Under that umbrella we worked all together.

12:49 [SPEAKER_00]: We all had to help each other out [SPEAKER_00]: They're an amazing makeup designer and makeup artist called Vincent Van Dyke out in LA. [SPEAKER_00]: He handled all of Walton's prosthetic pieces. [SPEAKER_00]: And they did many tests to get it to where what you saw on screen. [SPEAKER_00]: And the biggest thing that they didn't want to do that Jonah did want to do is use Walton behind them.

13:11 [SPEAKER_07]: Right. [SPEAKER_07]: Right. [SPEAKER_07]: There's a balance there. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_00]: It was purposeful because nobody knew it at the time. [SPEAKER_00]: We didn't know where his head mean Jonah, where he was going. [SPEAKER_00]: There's a lot of flashbacks now that we see.

13:22 [SPEAKER_00]: And now your, the audience is going, oh, I'm connecting these pieces. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, you still have to recognize the actor underneath the makeup. [SPEAKER_00]: And that's, they wanted to make sure Walton didn't get lost in there. [SPEAKER_00]: And one of Walton's iconic personal, let's say, representations or personal looks.

13:38 [SPEAKER_00]: It's got very large white teeth. [SPEAKER_00]: so they had to give them specific dentures to kind of turn it down a little bit but you still want to know that no that's Walton and that's his teeth and that's the actor that's who he is and he's playing Cooper Howard we're putting that connection together the other team the effects team under that same umbrella they they handled they did the heavy lifting for um Lucy's husband in the very beginning the big blender to the face yeah yeah oh he gets a chunk taken out yeah for sure [SPEAKER_00]: wonderful artists, great peace, nice bloody and gory and just they really did a great job.

14:16 [SPEAKER_00]: They handled the Michael Emerson head, Dr. Willzig. [SPEAKER_00]: They did his head, they did his foot. [SPEAKER_00]: So we all work together on a lot of stuff. [SPEAKER_00]: Going back to the beginning, I have a special effects background. [SPEAKER_00]: Anything with the main actors was me.

14:34 [SPEAKER_00]: I did all of the scars on Aaron Moton, Maximus character, Thadias, Johnny Pepperton, anything on Lucy was me. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and they get beat up a lot in the end. [SPEAKER_00]: The one thing that a lot of people don't understand how these shows are shot. [SPEAKER_00]: If we're in a location and like Amazon's famous for Apple's famous for it, they'll release an entire season right away.

14:56 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, done. [SPEAKER_00]: All eight episodes. [SPEAKER_00]: And Amazon did three at a time and then they trickled them out. [SPEAKER_00]: But if we had one location, we had to shoot all the scenes for the entire season in one location. [SPEAKER_00]: So you had to have like a Bible of the timeline, the story, what the wounds were, where they got to wounds, how they got to wounds, what's the timeline of the wounds?

15:19 [SPEAKER_00]: Because now you're filming something here that was [SPEAKER_00]: three days earlier, but now we're filming the exact same location with the exact same person that happened a week later, so you kind of have to do that. [SPEAKER_00]: Well, all the consistency, yeah, the consistency, and then you got to wrap your brain around doing that for everybody.

15:34 [SPEAKER_00]: And then for me, running a team of thirty plus makeup artists. [SPEAKER_00]: And there's some days we started at two in the morning. [SPEAKER_00]: To be ready by. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_00]: So by six a.m. [SPEAKER_00]: We've already bought five hours worth of work in four hours worth of work in to get three hundred people ready.

15:54 [SPEAKER_00]: And the production company, the producers and everything is like, well, this isn't a period piece. [SPEAKER_00]: You don't have to touch everybody. [SPEAKER_00]: Like, no, we do. [SPEAKER_00]: Everybody needs dirt, grind, slime, wounds, tattoos, all of this stuff. [SPEAKER_00]: It's like, you can't go on camera unless you're dirt.

16:09 [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, I would imagine a scene in the town and like in the background, you're like, that guy's on his lunch break. [SPEAKER_07]: What does he do? [SPEAKER_00]: And he's perfectly clean. [SPEAKER_00]: Right. [SPEAKER_07]: He works in IT, clearly. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_00]: And that was the thing.

16:23 [SPEAKER_00]: I call it my team and I call it. [SPEAKER_00]: I don't want to use a word for it, but we had to really go in this, say, tell them, we need our time because this, Jonah has a vision. [SPEAKER_00]: He's trusting has to bring that vision to like, this is what it takes. [SPEAKER_00]: Give us our time.

16:42 [SPEAKER_00]: And obviously paid off. [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yeah. [SPEAKER_00]: It's been nominated. [SPEAKER_00]: It's seventeen Emmys. [SPEAKER_00]: One of them was mine. [SPEAKER_00]: That's amazing. [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, come on. [SPEAKER_00]: This is what hard work translates into. [SPEAKER_00]: Obviously the fans love it.

16:55 [SPEAKER_00]: Obviously it's taken off. [SPEAKER_00]: Season two's done. [SPEAKER_00]: Season three's already been renewed. [SPEAKER_00]: And for what? [SPEAKER_00]: But that's that Todd Howard. [SPEAKER_00]: He said he was approached many times for many other production companies to do a fallout series.

17:09 [SPEAKER_00]: And he was like, I don't know. [SPEAKER_00]: And someone said the story goes that he made us like a tweet or a comment to somebody or something online said, well, I'll do it at the Nolan Brothers getting points. [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know how true that is, but that's the story. [SPEAKER_00]: And then obviously, Joan and Owen got into that.

17:26 [SPEAKER_00]: He said, I'm a fan of the game. [SPEAKER_00]: Let's talk. [SPEAKER_00]: And so they did, and there we are. [SPEAKER_00]: They did, and they found out that they couldn't have a little job on this thing together. [SPEAKER_00]: And it's not just short amount of time too. [SPEAKER_00]: So I can't complain one day.

17:40 [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, that's amazing. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, the work is evident on the screen. [SPEAKER_07]: And one of my interests outside of just podcasting and fallout and elder scrolls and things like that is movie production and VFX. [SPEAKER_07]: I watch a lot of shows on YouTube that take you behind the scenes and like, how did you do this?

17:58 [SPEAKER_07]: Or Adam Savage, you'll be like, oh, check out these props or whatever, right? [SPEAKER_07]: And I love, that's one of my go to like, I'm in the evening and I'm just chilling out. [SPEAKER_07]: teach me something cool about making cool movies, right? [SPEAKER_07]: The other, the flip side of that is so many shows and movies also get show back up on YouTube as like, hey, let's look at this sci-fi masterpiece from nineteen eighty three and everyone laughs at this special effects on all of that.

18:24 [SPEAKER_07]: I feel like we're at a place now when it comes to makeup. [SPEAKER_07]: and physical effects and computer generated things that when you combine all of that together in the right way, you end up with something that is timeless. [SPEAKER_07]: I would be very surprised if twenty to thirty years from now.

18:43 [SPEAKER_07]: We look back at the Fallout TV show from today and it doesn't hold up. [SPEAKER_00]: I don't see that happening. [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, I think technology, at the today, meaning, two thousand twenty five, is that, oh my god, a pinnacle point of, you can marry all these different crafts together.

19:01 [SPEAKER_00]: And it's hard to go, I could see with the transition wife. [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, that could see with that's fake, right? [SPEAKER_00]: And that wasn't real. [SPEAKER_00]: And for fallout, and this is what I tell anybody who walks over to that table of mine to go, what you saw on screen, mostly was real.

19:16 [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, there's a little bit of CG and like a monster moving in the background in certain scenes, but then when it's up close, it's real. [SPEAKER_00]: Practical. [SPEAKER_00]: And that's what the Nolan Brothers, including Jonah, they love building real things. [SPEAKER_00]: And it really lends to not only the dedication of the craft, but honoring the world as it is, instead of just being all green screen and video playback screens and things like that, walking through that vault, I felt I was walking through the vault.

19:45 [SPEAKER_00]: the pipes, leaky water, rusts, the doors, the doors, the doors, everything. [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, it was just being a fan of the game, I'm sitting there and I got to say, this is not real. [SPEAKER_00]: It was so well done. [SPEAKER_00]: Howard, the set designer, same thing, got nominated.

20:02 [SPEAKER_00]: phenomenal job. [SPEAKER_00]: And it's just taking all these amazing individuals, artists, craftsmen and bringing them together, you can see what happens when you, you give them a time, you can look budget, you kind of let them off the leash a little bit and you say, go make something great.

20:18 [SPEAKER_00]: And for this world, [SPEAKER_00]: It's never been done. [SPEAKER_00]: Never been done to do something post-apocalyptic like this with such a funny, can't be feel all out of the way. [SPEAKER_00]: It's got that little dark bits of comedy. [SPEAKER_00]: And then burn Nolan and, but that's the kind of agree on this, you know, doing the flashbacks and understanding some of the history and where these characters come from in the world and how it became what it was and really paying attention to the canon.

20:47 [SPEAKER_00]: and making it part of the story. [SPEAKER_00]: And that's what Bethesda said, here's your world. [SPEAKER_00]: Here's the left wall. [SPEAKER_00]: Here's the right wall. [SPEAKER_00]: You can play in this. [SPEAKER_00]: You do whatever you want. [SPEAKER_00]: And that's what they gave Jonah and the writers and everything that said, go play.

21:03 [SPEAKER_00]: And that's what I said that there was somebody from Bethesda there every day, just making sure that they stay true. [SPEAKER_00]: And one an amazing thing. [SPEAKER_00]: I cannot tell me it's just to me it's so surreal that they even tried to do this and they did it so well. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, yeah.

21:17 [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, it was a very pleasant surprise, especially in a time where we had other video game shows and people were like, yeah, this is, did they even play the game? [SPEAKER_07]: But I don't know, but he can level that complaints on the follow TV show because so much of it is so accurate. [SPEAKER_07]: And some people try to complain about, well, now they're going to change the timeline or whatever, but I do a lore show like those complaints are ridiculous.

21:41 [SPEAKER_00]: And that's the funny thing is that when this all started. [SPEAKER_00]: The little leaks on Reddit started coming out. [SPEAKER_00]: The little comments on Reddit started coming out. [SPEAKER_00]: We did the super duper mark was shot on Staten Island at an old defund grocery store. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, I remember the pictures.

21:56 [SPEAKER_00]: So at first, they just put up a fence. [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, no big deal. [SPEAKER_00]: They did their thing. [SPEAKER_00]: People were breaking in, taking pictures and stealing, since stealing posters and stealing things. [SPEAKER_00]: Fans got taller. [SPEAKER_00]: I got corn dog security was there and then we're everybody's like, oh, this is kind of a big deal.

22:17 [SPEAKER_00]: But then there, you know, Reddit was this, oh, that looks great, but how good is this going to be? [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, red rocket. [SPEAKER_00]: We've thrown the red rocket gas station upstate New York at this one gas station that almost looks like a real red rocket to begin with. [SPEAKER_00]: Howard again went through and put all his magic on it.

22:33 [SPEAKER_00]: Looks so great. [SPEAKER_00]: Photos of that leaked online. [SPEAKER_00]: And then it's just one of the things the show comes out. [SPEAKER_00]: Reddit goes quiet. [SPEAKER_00]: Nobody had any in the complaint about it. [SPEAKER_00]: Right. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_00]: Ain't anything wrong with it.

22:47 [SPEAKER_00]: And for the people that my family included, friends included, this fall out thing, what is this about? [SPEAKER_00]: I go, it's about a video game. [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, I guess I'm not gonna understand what it's about. [SPEAKER_00]: I go, no. [SPEAKER_00]: You're gonna understand. [SPEAKER_00]: Watch it.

22:59 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_00]: You don't need to be. [SPEAKER_00]: It's great if you are a fan of the video game. [SPEAKER_00]: You don't need to be. [SPEAKER_07]: Right. [SPEAKER_07]: Right. [SPEAKER_07]: Well, I have a story. [SPEAKER_07]: My father who doesn't play role playing games and things like that, he's retired.

23:13 [SPEAKER_07]: He's older now. [SPEAKER_07]: The show came out and he noticed it on Amazon before I told him about it. [SPEAKER_06]: Okay. [SPEAKER_07]: And then he knows I do the podcast and he was like, [SPEAKER_07]: Hey, what what's this about this fallout show? [SPEAKER_07]: And I was like, hey, you should go watch it.

23:29 [SPEAKER_07]: Let me know what you think. [SPEAKER_07]: Gee is the one every time we get together and hang out, he'll bring it up and go. [SPEAKER_07]: So when the season two come out again, he is he is the biggest fan. [SPEAKER_07]: And he's never played any of the games. [SPEAKER_07]: That's it's it's good writing.

23:42 [SPEAKER_00]: It's good storytelling. [SPEAKER_00]: It's good sets of props. [SPEAKER_00]: You can get immersed in the world regardless of what your fan base is about the show or about the video game. [SPEAKER_00]: It's just, it's fun. [SPEAKER_00]: It's great. [SPEAKER_00]: It's a great watch. [SPEAKER_00]: You know, everybody who comes over and talks to me, but I'm gonna go home and rewatch it.

23:58 [SPEAKER_00]: Like, yeah, yeah. [SPEAKER_00]: Because you're gonna see something, you didn't see before. [SPEAKER_00]: And that's, I think that's a tip to Amazon had, and tip to, but there's a, and Kiltre, who was Jonah and all his production company. [SPEAKER_00]: but they did a great job. [SPEAKER_00]: They did a great job.

24:13 [SPEAKER_00]: Season two, December late December comes out. [SPEAKER_00]: They said like, December, twenty fifth, twenty six, twenty seven. [SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, I mean, they had to rush it. [SPEAKER_00]: This is the fan base was hot to try. [SPEAKER_00]: They want more. [SPEAKER_00]: We want more.

24:24 [SPEAKER_07]: Oh, absolutely. [SPEAKER_07]: Absolutely. [SPEAKER_07]: Everyone's waiting and I can't wait to see it either. [SPEAKER_07]: Now while we're sitting here in our interview, we're sitting inside the elder scrolls online tavern. [SPEAKER_07]: I'm sure maybe if the background, I'm sure there's a lot of background noise bleeding and [SPEAKER_07]: but there's some music playing you might have noticed the Elder Scrolls music.

24:41 [SPEAKER_07]: Are you an Elder Scrolls fan also? [SPEAKER_00]: I was and, you know, what life happens, you know, for me, I was... [SPEAKER_00]: I had, I was in a cast, my arm, I broke my arm and I was in a cast for twenty-two months. [SPEAKER_00]: I had nothing to do. [SPEAKER_00]: I just played all out.

25:01 [SPEAKER_00]: That was where I dove in the fallout. [SPEAKER_00]: And then life happened and my career took off. [SPEAKER_00]: So video games kind of took a backseat a little bit. [SPEAKER_00]: Sure. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_00]: So I don't have much time to do. [SPEAKER_00]: Right. [SPEAKER_00]: And then a friend of mine bought me a PlayStation.

25:16 [SPEAKER_00]: And it's a good way to stay connected. [SPEAKER_00]: He's in Philly, I'm in New York. [SPEAKER_00]: We got a friend in Vegas and another guy in South Carolina. [SPEAKER_00]: So whenever we can, we get together, we place a video of games fall out, seventy six fall out forward, destiny. [SPEAKER_00]: And it's just something for us to come together, just without just talking on a phone, at least we get to do something.

25:34 [SPEAKER_00]: So I want to say, hi, I'm a gamer. [SPEAKER_00]: I just wish I'm glad I don't have the time. [SPEAKER_07]: Well, yeah, if you were, I mean, Skyrim is extremely addictive. [SPEAKER_07]: If you got to Elder Scrolls Online, especially about their friends playing, you're going to get addicted to that.

25:51 [SPEAKER_07]: The reason I bring it up is, Fallout was one of those series that a lot of people in the past had said, well, I wish there was a TV show or a movie, but there's no way they're going to get it right. [SPEAKER_07]: It would be impossible. [SPEAKER_07]: People have said the same thing about Elder Scrolls.

26:05 [SPEAKER_07]: And, of course, the community, I put out this out there, wondering, okay, now that Todd has seen that a follow TV show can work with an Elder Scrolls TV show or movie work, do you think that's possible? [SPEAKER_00]: You know, here's the deal. [SPEAKER_00]: And I want to say they got lightning in the bottle.

26:22 [SPEAKER_00]: And I'm all going to use another television show as a reference. [SPEAKER_00]: And I like the show. [SPEAKER_00]: And I think it had a, [SPEAKER_00]: possibility of really taking off and I don't know why it didn't Halo. [SPEAKER_00]: And I know Pablo Schreiber, I've worked with him before and I was like, wow, good for you brother, go.

26:42 [SPEAKER_07]: And it only lasted two seasons. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, people were kind of the biggest complaint I heard was Master Chief was in what they expected. [SPEAKER_00]: Well, that's the other thing you said. [SPEAKER_00]: they kind of took the lure and I want to say blue out the window. [SPEAKER_00]: But never take your mascot.

26:59 [SPEAKER_00]: That was my right. [SPEAKER_00]: Right. [SPEAKER_00]: But no actor. [SPEAKER_00]: And the realm of reality. [SPEAKER_07]: Well, Pedro Pascal. [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, he's talking Mandalorian. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_00]: So we're in that same realm of like no stick to the stick to the lure of the game, stick to the lure of what people know.

27:17 [SPEAKER_00]: And one of them was, don't take it home at home. [SPEAKER_00]: Mandalorian. [SPEAKER_00]: Master Chief. [SPEAKER_00]: Fallout. [SPEAKER_00]: There's one piece of lore. [SPEAKER_00]: I know my, make this a trivia point on my Q&A tomorrow. [SPEAKER_00]: There's one, I'll give it up to you.

27:33 [SPEAKER_00]: There's one piece of lore that I don't think anybody knows about. [SPEAKER_00]: A couple of people really teach hardcore fans. [SPEAKER_00]: The, the files that the Google takes are not canon. [SPEAKER_07]: Yes, that was something they invented for the show and a lot of people have debated about what is it actually?

27:49 [SPEAKER_07]: How does that work? [SPEAKER_07]: Does this change the way that we are supposed to understand the way goals work? [SPEAKER_00]: We'll find out season two. [SPEAKER_00]: Okay. [SPEAKER_00]: Cool. [SPEAKER_00]: Cool. [SPEAKER_00]: I've got my theories. [SPEAKER_00]: Yes. [SPEAKER_00]: And the thing is is that they wrote it and they had to get it cleared.

28:02 [SPEAKER_00]: Apparently, but that's the going what this is outside of the world. [SPEAKER_00]: But they needed something story wise to keep the Cooper Howard character from turning old Pharaoh. [SPEAKER_07]: Right. [SPEAKER_07]: Right. [SPEAKER_07]: They know like plot point of tension. [SPEAKER_07]: So one of the things that they've incorporated in seventy six about ghouls, now that you can become a ghoul, is that your feral meter increases and by taking any form of what's any sort of drug or or chems, that's the word, any sort of chems, it lowers that meter, especially the ghoul serum, which does that the most.

28:38 [SPEAKER_07]: my because they like to keep things consistent and you don't have to confirm or deny this and because I know this is the season two thing. [SPEAKER_07]: But my theory is that in the show it works very similarly that ghouls can possibly turn feral they don't know if every they will or when that will happen but everybody's kind of on a ticking clock or at least they think they might be on a ticking clock and therefore they need to take some sort of chem [SPEAKER_07]: And something like jet or something might might be temporarily a fix, but the best one is whatever that thing is isn't that violent.

29:11 [SPEAKER_00]: What a name to it yet so far. [SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, it was, yes, it was a point of tension in the storyline where they're at the goal for situation and the vials get crushed and, you know, [SPEAKER_00]: Howard Cooper, the goal is going to go, oh, here we go. [SPEAKER_00]: I got so much time.

29:28 [SPEAKER_00]: What do we do? [SPEAKER_00]: He knows that he sells Lucy to these raiders, right, which creates a moral dilemma for him. [SPEAKER_07]: What the lemon blah blah blah. [SPEAKER_00]: So we all know where that went through if we watched the show. [SPEAKER_00]: So now he's got a big old pocket of aisles and he's good for a while, but then we run into [SPEAKER_00]: Um, kind of moving around in the timeline, Roger, the guy who's, the Google's talking to San, that, you know, they talked to him.

29:54 [SPEAKER_00]: He's like, oh, you know, he says he's been around the longest of all of his two hundred years. [SPEAKER_00]: It's like, okay, so he's been doing bounty hunting and doing whatever he has to to stay alive. [SPEAKER_00]: Why is he staying alive? [SPEAKER_00]: Right, right. [SPEAKER_00]: We don't know.

30:08 [SPEAKER_00]: She's in two might reveal something at the end of season one. [SPEAKER_00]: We found out what happened to truly Lucy's mother. [SPEAKER_00]: We don't know what happened to the door. [SPEAKER_07]: Right. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: There's all these mysteries that are there. [SPEAKER_07]: And I'm sure we'll get some stuff in season two.

30:23 [SPEAKER_07]: And then though, maybe they'll hold it out to season three. [SPEAKER_07]: Do you have it? [SPEAKER_07]: And again, if this is too far, feel free not to answer. [SPEAKER_07]: Do you have a sense of how many seasons they will potentially go for? [SPEAKER_00]: In the world of networks. [SPEAKER_00]: Five is the magic number.

30:41 [SPEAKER_00]: As far as characters, I've heard some characters are last all five, some are not going to last only three, but you're not going to see all the characters survived till the end. [SPEAKER_00]: That's. [SPEAKER_07]: Oh, I mean, it's it's fall out. [SPEAKER_07]: I would expect that there will be death.

30:57 [SPEAKER_00]: I have my own theories about certain things. [SPEAKER_00]: And I talk to Genevieve and Graham, the writers, have like, you guys got to think about this. [SPEAKER_00]: Here's because, and this is a contentment for me, and it still brings PTSD to my, to me almost all the time I think about it, is that she gets her finger cut.

31:15 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes. [SPEAKER_00]: She goes to super duper mart. [SPEAKER_00]: They sell one on. [SPEAKER_00]: The goal keeps Lucy's finger. [SPEAKER_00]: And then obviously, she shows it onto himself. [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, fine. [SPEAKER_00]: They should have Lucy when how a Cooper's character made me that whatever the serum is slowly starts to not work.

31:36 [SPEAKER_00]: Lucy has to kill him. [SPEAKER_00]: And what does she do? [SPEAKER_00]: It cuts her finger back off. [SPEAKER_00]: It's so easy to back on. [SPEAKER_00]: I love it. [SPEAKER_00]: Because when that happened, I go, guys, to the writers, great-grandma, she knew as a guy. [SPEAKER_00]: I can't paint her finger.

31:52 [SPEAKER_00]: every day. [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, it's a cleaner. [SPEAKER_00]: It's, I mean, pockets, washing hands, eating everything. [SPEAKER_00]: I said, it's going to be, it's going to need its own artist following her. [SPEAKER_00]: It doesn't touch it up. [SPEAKER_00]: It's so much work. [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know where about it.

32:04 [SPEAKER_00]: Storylines that take her in a vault for, they're going to give her a serum. [SPEAKER_00]: She'll have a glove. [SPEAKER_00]: No, heal that finger back to human. [SPEAKER_00]: Okay. [SPEAKER_00]: Like, thank you. [SPEAKER_00]: So that was like an episode away. [SPEAKER_00]: Like, I can do this for another three weeks.

32:16 [SPEAKER_00]: No problem. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that never happened. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's so much so and she talked about Ella. [SPEAKER_00]: She talked about it on an interview and I nicknamed it. [SPEAKER_00]: All right, we're time to do your poop finger. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, because it's darker and darker and she said it and it became an industry on not an industry, but I show why term.

32:38 [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yeah, call Mike we're poop finger needs touch up. [SPEAKER_00]: So it became one of the things so much so [SPEAKER_00]: Amazon with but as the conversation happens so long though, it might be a little convoluted is that they were making action figures of them. [SPEAKER_00]: And they had to get the likeness, right?

32:58 [SPEAKER_00]: So they ran them kind of through me. [SPEAKER_00]: They said, is this right? [SPEAKER_00]: Is this right? [SPEAKER_00]: I go, yes, but no. [SPEAKER_00]: They're like, what do we know? [SPEAKER_00]: I go, is this after she comes out of the super duper mark? [SPEAKER_00]: This look, yeah, for fingers not brown.

33:10 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, not brown. [SPEAKER_00]: And it was in a prototype one of the, of her little action figure. [SPEAKER_00]: Like, oh, yeah, no problem. [SPEAKER_00]: We'll take care of that. [SPEAKER_00]: They never did. [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, no. [SPEAKER_00]: And people will notice that. [SPEAKER_00]: They will notice it.

33:20 [SPEAKER_00]: So when look at the finger, make sure it's brown or make sure it's not brown, you got yourself a collectible. [SPEAKER_07]: There you go. [SPEAKER_07]: Collectible. [SPEAKER_07]: Um, very cool. [SPEAKER_07]: Well, thank you so much for this for your time and being able to, it's very cool meeting you and getting to speak with somebody behind the scenes on such an awesome project.

33:37 [SPEAKER_07]: Um, I'm [SPEAKER_07]: I'm shopping at the bit to find out what happens in New Vegas because, of course, it seems like that's where they're going at the end of season one. [SPEAKER_07]: And I've seen some of the, the leech photos. [SPEAKER_07]: So it looks like they're the stripper least show up.

33:50 [SPEAKER_06]: Yes. [SPEAKER_07]: There's all sorts of cool stuff. [SPEAKER_07]: I have no idea where they're going to go for season three because clearly, yeah, but I'm excited to hear that. [SPEAKER_07]: And hopefully I get to run into you again in one of these things in the future. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, please do that would be a great fun.

34:03 [SPEAKER_00]: I will talk to you again. [SPEAKER_07]: Awesome. [SPEAKER_07]: If people wanted to follow you, I don't know if you're on social media, follow your stuff and reach out to you any of that kind of stuff. [SPEAKER_07]: What would they do? [SPEAKER_00]: The best way to go Instagram might make up.

34:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Just look up, might make up. [SPEAKER_00]: Or look find the fallout for hope. [SPEAKER_00]: And you'll find me there or one of the fallout podcasts. [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know if that was fallout for hope podcast. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, so the fallout forecast is this show. [SPEAKER_07]: Ken and I used to do a show together, but Ken, he does the Chad falls in a six story podcast and all of that.

34:32 [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, so you find me through Instagram, Mike make up or just go to one of the fallout for hope pages and I'm linked to them. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, yeah, we all have links in the show notes and all that stuff. [SPEAKER_07]: So thank you so much. [SPEAKER_07]: It's been great. [SPEAKER_00]: Thank you.

34:52 [SPEAKER_07]: All right, so now I am sitting down with Mark Meer, who you might recognize. [SPEAKER_07]: Primarily, most famously, as the voice of Commander Shepherd, and he's done a lot of different projects. [SPEAKER_07]: And we've been talking about some of the things that he's been doing. [SPEAKER_07]: And he actually just got off stage with a bunch of other voice talent doing this fun improv reading thing, which was a blast.

35:13 [SPEAKER_07]: Mark, thank you so much for taking the time to sit down with me and talk. [SPEAKER_07]: It's so nice to actually get to meet you in person. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, thank you for having me. [SPEAKER_05]: And yes, face to face in the flesh, in meat space, as they say. [SPEAKER_07]: And in meat space, yeah.

35:24 [SPEAKER_07]: So for those of you who don't listen to the Mass Effect Lorca, as Mark and I got a chance to talk, it was about two years ago, I think, a year and a half. [SPEAKER_07]: And I got to interview you, interview you about Commander Shepherd and your experience with the Mass Effect Games. [SPEAKER_07]: But your expertise goes well beyond simply space.

35:45 [SPEAKER_07]: into a variety of different titles, you've done Baldur's Gate II. [SPEAKER_07]: So your, in fact, D&D is a thing, if I recall from our previous conversation that you do regularly. [SPEAKER_05]: I do a lot of events with D&D and a castle, which is exactly what it sounds like. [SPEAKER_05]: It's playing Guggison Dragons in a castle, a variety of castles across the UK, and more recently, some castles in America.

36:10 [SPEAKER_05]: It's amazing. [SPEAKER_05]: I just did one in Ohio, landals, movie can castle, which is a castle in the middle of the bogey can forest. [SPEAKER_05]: That's crazy. [SPEAKER_07]: That's weird that we have castles. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, that's a map of latch in castles, yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: That's great.

36:22 [SPEAKER_07]: That's great. [SPEAKER_07]: So, let's talk about the experience of being a character in video games, because video games hit people. [SPEAKER_07]: I think in ways that things like movies and TV shows don't hit exactly the same way. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, definitely. [SPEAKER_05]: And I think that's in large measure because of the amount of time that you spend with the characters.

36:46 [SPEAKER_05]: So if you are the lead character in a movie, the audience will spend about two hours with you. [SPEAKER_05]: If you're the lead character in a video game, as I was, [SPEAKER_05]: just on one playthrough, player might spend a hundred hours with you. [SPEAKER_05]: And when they do five or six playthroughs, then that just increases the amount of time that they spend not only with your voice, but also inhabiting your character.

37:10 [SPEAKER_05]: Commander Shepherd of course was one of the very first fully voiced protagonists. [SPEAKER_05]: So both Jennifer and I were kind of guinea pigs in a way, but the sheer amount of time that they spend with you and with you essentially being their avatar in the game world. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I think that's what really promotes this sense of connection.

37:31 [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, and this is something, if you guys are interested in the full conversation about Commander Shepherd, definitely go look up that episode of the Mass Effect Lorcass. [SPEAKER_07]: You shared a ton of really great information on that episode. [SPEAKER_07]: You did mention on that as well that if we go back in time to Mass Effect One, the idea of a voiced protagonist in a game, carrying that game [SPEAKER_07]: the entire length of, you know, hundred hours that you're gonna spend in the game was very new.

37:59 [SPEAKER_07]: It's something that they tried to recreate and fall at four would fall at four came out to a mixed reception because people were more comfortable, at least familiar with the voiceless protagonists of previous games. [SPEAKER_07]: Do you feel that that is [SPEAKER_07]: something that you see the industry doing more and more of.

38:18 [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, it feels like the further we get into games, the more cinematic they become, but there's that line. [SPEAKER_07]: There's still games. [SPEAKER_07]: There's this weird balance between expressing what the actor was expressing and being a stand-in for the player. [SPEAKER_07]: You have two minds in the same being in a way.

38:37 [SPEAKER_07]: It's tricky, right? [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, and as you mentioned, some people prefer, they prefer the block of text because then they can put whatever reading or inflection on it that they want. [SPEAKER_05]: So some people prefer that that they can, they find that it's easier to role play if they don't have a voice guiding them through as it were.

38:56 [SPEAKER_05]: But as for which way it's going to go in the future, it's hard to say, I'm not a predictor of trends in video games. [SPEAKER_05]: But I think, yeah, I'm not sure if [SPEAKER_05]: There is another game besides Fallout four that did it on the scale that the Mass Effect trilogy did. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, that's an interesting point.

39:15 [SPEAKER_07]: Oh, well, something like cyberpunk. [SPEAKER_07]: Sure, cyberpunk would be one. [SPEAKER_07]: The protagonist in Baldur's Gate three is your character, but you can pick a character that already has a voice and a character, putting those in quotes. [SPEAKER_07]: If you wanted to be Carlac, on your right, right.

39:32 [SPEAKER_07]: So like some of those games, and typically it's these big RPGs that are that are the most like that. [SPEAKER_07]: To kind of connect this through, a big role playing game is where you're playing as a character, right? [SPEAKER_07]: And with something like Mass Effect, you are stepping in, especially like let's go back to the beginning of Mass Effect one, you're hired to do this character.

39:55 [SPEAKER_07]: But this character doesn't exist previous to that. [SPEAKER_07]: It's like on stage. [SPEAKER_07]: I think it was at Paul who said something or one of you said something like, yeah, you could hire me to be like Superman or Batman or whatever. [SPEAKER_07]: But it would be amazing to be a brand new character.

40:07 [SPEAKER_07]: Yes, that's Neil. [SPEAKER_07]: Neil mentioned that. [SPEAKER_07]: It would be the real, the real prize would be to be able to do a brand new character that becomes popular in its own right. [SPEAKER_07]: And now you are, you are that character because you are acting, you are voicing that character.

40:23 [SPEAKER_07]: I feel like that's very similar to what happened with Commander Shepherd [SPEAKER_07]: Do you feel like did they give you like a like a sheet that said, okay, these are the characteristics of this person. [SPEAKER_07]: And well, how did that go? [SPEAKER_05]: I'd be able to, in the case of Vander Shepard, the challenge for both Jennifer and I in approaching that role was the fact that there is no Canon Commander Shepard.

40:42 [SPEAKER_05]: Right. [SPEAKER_05]: First of all, the Commander Shepard Mailer female. [SPEAKER_05]: Well, that's up to the player. [SPEAKER_05]: Right. [SPEAKER_05]: Also is Commander Shepard a by the books, you know, essentially a Boy Scout or borderline sociopath that is also up to the player. [SPEAKER_05]: What's [SPEAKER_05]: Commander Shepherd's background, were they raised on earth, were they raised in space?

40:59 [SPEAKER_05]: All these things, right? [SPEAKER_05]: It was all very malleable. [SPEAKER_05]: I guess, oh, we were talking about, you know, what other games have fully voiced protagonists? [SPEAKER_05]: Totally forgot about the Witcher. [SPEAKER_05]: Witcher? [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, and so... [SPEAKER_05]: Yes, so you're looking at if you've got a girl is a established character and so you can very from novels.

41:18 [SPEAKER_05]: Yes, so you can very clearly say this is what he is like and this is what his characteristics are with commander shepherd a lot of it is going to be player choice. [SPEAKER_05]: Right. [SPEAKER_05]: So we had to find the core of commander shepherd and we worked with our directors for that and what we sort of came up with was [SPEAKER_05]: the thing that's whether renegade or paragon, whether space forward or the commander shepherd is a highly decorated military officer who's used to giving orders under pressure.

41:48 [SPEAKER_05]: So that is the one common thread that runs through all versions of commander shepherd. [SPEAKER_05]: other than that, it's very much up in the air. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, okay. [SPEAKER_07]: So that makes a lot of sense because whether you pick the Paragon or Renegade choices, they're still that core of the character that although he might be saying something a little bit more psychopathic in one of those options, he still comes across as the same person.

42:14 [SPEAKER_05]: Yes. [SPEAKER_07]: He's still like that core and that feels like an amorphous thing. [SPEAKER_07]: I used to do improv and I've dabbled in acting. [SPEAKER_07]: I'm by no means experienced in the things that you are. [SPEAKER_07]: So I would imagine that finding and keeping that core is a delicate process.

42:32 [SPEAKER_05]: It can be, yes. [SPEAKER_05]: And again, for that, we relied very heavily on our directors. [SPEAKER_05]: In my case, was Shana Perry and Caroline Livingstone and later Suzanne Hangpah, the ladies that I worked with. [SPEAKER_05]: And there were varied directors. [SPEAKER_05]: I think the LA people worked with Caroline and Shana in a fair bit as well, but there were other directors involved too.

42:56 [SPEAKER_07]: So let's talk about some other characters that you've done. [SPEAKER_07]: What are some other ones that come to mind that you particularly enjoyed being? [SPEAKER_07]: Well, let's see. [SPEAKER_05]: The ones that one of the ones that's had sort of a life beyond video games would be Bayloth the entertainer, Bayloth Baratil, from the Baldur's Gate and Hans tradition.

43:16 [SPEAKER_05]: So as mentioned, my very first voice work in video games ever was Baldur's Gate II. [SPEAKER_05]: Which is a classic. [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, well, thank you. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, absolutely. [SPEAKER_05]: And I've told this story before, but I did literally one line in that game in the final cutscene.

43:29 [SPEAKER_05]: So you had to finish that very long game to get to even see my scene. [SPEAKER_05]: But that one line apparently was good enough to buy a wire went, yes, keep hiring was good. [SPEAKER_05]: Uh, when it came time to do the Baldur's Gate and Hans traditions, that was done by a company called Beamdog and these were a lot of, in some cases, some of the original by where people who got off their own, started their own company, and they got the license to spruce up the old Baldur's Gate.

43:56 [SPEAKER_05]: Baldur's Gate games make them so you could play them on an iPad, that sort of thing. [SPEAKER_05]: And they added in lots of new content, including entirely new characters. [SPEAKER_05]: Baeloth was the final boss of the sort of mini game called the Black Pits, which was like a Black tutorial game.

44:13 [SPEAKER_05]: You basically get kidnapped by this insane Drow source where taken to the underdog and made to fight in his Black tutorial. [SPEAKER_05]: And I played a variety of characters in that, so not only Baeloth, [SPEAKER_05]: But also his the holder. [SPEAKER_05]: I wouldn't say assistant more like the holder prisoner who was quite mad at him.

44:33 [SPEAKER_05]: I called blue rock and I played his right hand man who was a like Shasa called Elan Garak. [SPEAKER_05]: And yeah, that's a fancy name. [SPEAKER_05]: Yes. [SPEAKER_05]: And Bayloth, the thing about Bayloth is that, so he was the final boss of this and you killed him to win through the black pits.

44:52 [SPEAKER_05]: But he had a gym and he'd made a wish that if I ever slain, I will be instantly resurrected. [SPEAKER_05]: And the problem was the gym hated him. [SPEAKER_05]: And so did resurrect him. [SPEAKER_05]: But he wasn't like a twenty-eighth level archmage anymore. [SPEAKER_05]: He was [SPEAKER_05]: was erected at the same level as the rest of the party, whatever.

45:14 [SPEAKER_05]: And so they can actually get him into your party, if you didn't mind having a chaotic evil drought in the world. [SPEAKER_05]: Sure. [SPEAKER_05]: Some people won't. [SPEAKER_07]: Well, everybody's no parties complete without a chaotic evil drought. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, if you don't mind men skin all the good people leaving and you know, just play with the evil guys.

45:29 [SPEAKER_05]: So, Baylock, he was a lot of fun and he was sort of like a secret party character. [SPEAKER_05]: Subsequently, I, because I dungeon master a lot, I wrote some stuff that involved him, and so I was like used to him as like an NDC villain in my own games, and then later at the games I played at D&D in a castle, and I played him at a bunch of live D&D events like D&D live back in twenty nineteen, and [SPEAKER_05]: various online things and whatnot and even cosplayed him once.

45:58 [SPEAKER_05]: Uh, I hosted a cosplay contest with Jessica Negry as as bailout and beam dog went all out like they paid for the rental of like this two thousand dollar lace front wig. [SPEAKER_05]: Wow. [SPEAKER_05]: the real human here along the big. [SPEAKER_05]: They got to make up artists to do like the drown make up on me.

46:14 [SPEAKER_05]: They, you know, because they got a prop maker, they custom made his staff and everything. [SPEAKER_05]: So yeah, Bailoth has continued to have a life outside of video games and so around the RPG team. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, I've interviewing in the past voice actors yourself and other voice actors.

46:32 [SPEAKER_07]: Some of the others who I hope to actually get to speak with again here. [SPEAKER_07]: They have mentioned that oftentimes you grow attached to a character. [SPEAKER_07]: You spend so much time in that character's head, basically. [SPEAKER_07]: You, again, you're voicing them, but you are thinking like them in order to act in order to become them.

46:52 [SPEAKER_07]: And there's this quality of ownership where you're sharing ownership with the people who write it, the people who produce the game, all that. [SPEAKER_07]: But then also yourself. [SPEAKER_07]: So it seems like it's a really fun thing to be able to take a character that you started out with in just kind of this, you know, as a few lines at the end of the game.

47:09 [SPEAKER_07]: And then really grow it, like, flesh it out into, like, actually acting, putting on the makeup and the outfit. [SPEAKER_07]: That sounds amazing. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, and in Baylott's case, like some people say, oh, that character of yours, and I have to always go, it's like, I didn't actually create him, he was created by being dug for this, but again, one does feel somewhat of a sense of, I get to borrow him and take him out every so often.

47:28 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, yeah, and you get to, you know, the version of him that's in the game is somewhat different than the, because he was a villain for starters. [SPEAKER_05]: And the thing I always liked about him was that he was very much in the vein of like, [SPEAKER_05]: some of the more zaneer x-man villains like mojo or arcade especially the whole kidnapping the group and putting them through their their weird death traps and right shows first and yeah all the weird the mojo thing definitely because it's concerned about ratings and he wants to please the crowd and yeah entertainment that's what he's all about [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.

48:03 [SPEAKER_05]: So, yeah, be it definitely bail off is one of those characters that that I enjoyed doing. [SPEAKER_07]: That's awesome. [SPEAKER_07]: Now, for a lot of these projects, we've done more than just one character. [SPEAKER_07]: So in Mass Effect, your Commander Shepherd, you got tons of lines with that, but you're a fortune.

48:18 [SPEAKER_07]: You're a number of the fortune. [SPEAKER_07]: You're all of the fortune. [SPEAKER_05]: You see a member of that species, it's me. [SPEAKER_07]: Right. [SPEAKER_07]: And so in those kinds of projects and in Vorca, this question doesn't apply as much to that because that voice is so distinctly different.

48:30 [SPEAKER_05]: It's so that's why I'm all of them. [SPEAKER_05]: They got me to do the first one and I basically just screamed and screeched with a mouthful half of water in the booth. [SPEAKER_05]: And they were like, oh, we like that. [SPEAKER_05]: We actually do like that for the fortune, but we don't want to ask any other actors to, we don't want to make them have to do that.

48:47 [SPEAKER_05]: So why don't you just be all of it? [SPEAKER_07]: Right. [SPEAKER_07]: Right. [SPEAKER_07]: So the where I was going with the question outside of work, because that's so distinctly different in my own dabbling with voice work and those kinds of things. [SPEAKER_07]: One of the things I've learned through practicing recording myself is you have to commit to a point with each character where [SPEAKER_07]: At least in, this is just my perspective, so please correct me if I'm wrong.

49:09 [SPEAKER_07]: One of the things I noticed was, oftentimes there was a commonality that would come through in each of those voices that was kind of like me peeking out. [SPEAKER_07]: as opposed to fully committing and getting to a place where it would be much harder to tell the same person did that voice.

49:26 [SPEAKER_07]: Does that make sense? [SPEAKER_07]: Is that a thing? [SPEAKER_07]: Is that something you take in, especially when you say two characters in the same game, maybe even talking to each other? [SPEAKER_07]: Is there an awareness of that? [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, I definitely, there are scenes where my characters speak to each other in Mass Effect.

49:40 [SPEAKER_05]: It's kind of an in-joke in the Citadel DLC because Shepherd actually runs into Blasto, who Blasto was created as an audio easter egg. [SPEAKER_05]: You certainly was never intended to actually be on camera as it were, let alone interacting with Shepherd. [SPEAKER_05]: So that was a lot of fun because there was also a Vorce in that scene, so it was like three to two.

50:02 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, there was still a week in that scene. [SPEAKER_05]: It was, it was lots of fun. [SPEAKER_05]: And there, I mean, I never worried about that with those characters. [SPEAKER_05]: Because again, the board shows just like a monster, screechy voice. [SPEAKER_07]: It's hard to tell. [SPEAKER_07]: It's the same actor because it's so distinctly different.

50:16 [SPEAKER_05]: And then Blasto is a Hanar. [SPEAKER_05]: So he has that sort of this one. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, we'll pop a cap in your ass. [SPEAKER_05]: It doesn't say that, but something similar. [SPEAKER_05]: And shepherd, ultimately, shepherd is one of those, that of those three is the closest to my own voice.

50:32 [SPEAKER_05]: Yes. [SPEAKER_05]: I often say, can I ever shepherd is basically me trying to sound tough. [SPEAKER_05]: So yeah, yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: And that's what's so with what I find so interesting about this is sometimes you get a character and it's like your own voice works for that. [SPEAKER_07]: You just now have to play a different person.

50:45 [SPEAKER_07]: But it's really just a tweak of your own voice. [SPEAKER_07]: But then there's other characters that are [SPEAKER_07]: Like, you are legitimately doing something that does not normally come out of this face. [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, if you're looking to differentiate, just give them different accents.

51:00 [SPEAKER_05]: This guy's French, this guy's German. [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, my, all of my French just comes from Peppy Lake, which I'm sure is super insulting to French people. [SPEAKER_07]: So we're here at this convention where GCX is raising money for St. [SPEAKER_07]: Jude. [SPEAKER_07]: And there's a lot of fallout stuff in Elder Scrolls stuff, which is part of why I got invited to begin with because that's the podcast that this is going to go on.

51:27 [SPEAKER_07]: And I know that you haven't gotten the chance. [SPEAKER_07]: The opportunity to play characters in those universes, but you're a gamer. [SPEAKER_07]: You love playing that stuff. [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, I've probably logged the most hours in the Fallout universe of any other, and it's largely due to Fallout four.

51:41 [SPEAKER_05]: And I got very into building settlements. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, right. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, and I've done replays and most recently when the big update basically wiped all mods. [SPEAKER_05]: I went back and looked and, you know, all of my modded games have been wiped out, but I realized, oh, that means I can just replay all the DLC fresh.

52:02 [SPEAKER_05]: So after the TV show aired, everybody was like, ah, I got a place to pull out. [SPEAKER_05]: I went back and I replayed, uh, Nuka World and Farber and actually built a vault this time. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: In my first playthrough, I kind of did the bare minimum to get through the story part of that.

52:18 [SPEAKER_05]: last year after the after the show aired, I spent probably several weeks just going back and like making a vault that was immaculate and exactly how I wanted it. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I got right up to the build limits. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, as we all do. [SPEAKER_07]: So you did mention that although you haven't been an actual like main type of well an official character, let's call that an official character hired by Bethesda you have worked in mods and you got to play a very famous character [SPEAKER_05]: the guy who started the brotherhood of steel in a mod the original max and yet yeah or max and that was for a mod called brotherhood which was put out by the same folks who did if you remember a series of vids called the storyteller yes yes yeah so it was it was those folks and it was basically a

53:10 [SPEAKER_05]: the memory den was you they found you know they'd recreated like the origin of the brotherhood of steel so in game you would go to the memory den and then go into this this program that showed the origins of the brotherhood of steel and I got to play Roger Max. [SPEAKER_07]: Wow that's fun because he is one of those characters that [SPEAKER_07]: I don't expect in any future follow games that we're actually going to get him because he's unless it's set with less of a future game is set.

53:36 [SPEAKER_07]: In fact, that was one of my ideas for a TV show was what if they did the TV show, but it was Roger Max and story. [SPEAKER_07]: Instead of doing it like instead, they went more in the future with the story. [SPEAKER_05]: Although they didn't, they started. [SPEAKER_07]: That's true. [SPEAKER_07]: They do flashback to the past.

53:51 [SPEAKER_07]: So do you guys see Cooper Howard story? [SPEAKER_07]: Right. [SPEAKER_07]: Right. [SPEAKER_07]: But what if there's flashbacks like, now that the brotherhood is involved, flashbacks to Roger Maxon and the founding of the brotherhood? [SPEAKER_05]: That would be amazing. [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, maybe Cooper Howard is somehow tangently involved.

54:06 [SPEAKER_07]: He's got his, he's been around so long. [SPEAKER_07]: He's kind of affected everything in some way. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, so so if you were to work on a mainline fallout game, is there a character or a type of character or something that you would enjoy playing? [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, uh, of course your listeners can't see what I'm wearing, but I'm I've caused playing a Google.

54:27 [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, so when, okay, so I didn't realize it was Mark, this is for the listeners who obviously can't see us right now. [SPEAKER_07]: When I got here, Ken is introducing me people and he's like, oh, and Mark Mears here and you were in a glucose room with a whole mask on and everything and I was like, oh my god, I didn't even [SPEAKER_07]: I don't know if I was knowing him.

54:44 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, right to paint the pull, full picture. [SPEAKER_05]: So I'm a ghoul, but I'm not Walton Goggins' as ghoul. [SPEAKER_05]: Right. [SPEAKER_05]: I am an OC, a regioperator that I've played. [SPEAKER_05]: I hosted the DragonCon parade at the same last year and I've done some cosplay contests.

54:58 [SPEAKER_05]: So now I'm here at this. [SPEAKER_05]: His name is Max Rads. [SPEAKER_05]: Nice. [SPEAKER_05]: And that's so bad. [SPEAKER_05]: He was around when the bombs dropped and he does wear a vault suit because he was supposed to be in a vault and stepped outside. [SPEAKER_05]: stepped outside for a cigarette during orientation right at the wrong time.

55:14 [SPEAKER_05]: It closed the door. [SPEAKER_05]: So he has a vault suit, but he never really spent much time in a vault and he's just been for the last few centuries. [SPEAKER_05]: He's just been wandering across America. [SPEAKER_05]: And his current job is like a pit boy radio DJ. [SPEAKER_05]: And yeah, so I would I got a soft spot for ghouls.

55:31 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I'd love to play a ghoul. [SPEAKER_07]: That's awesome. [SPEAKER_07]: So I know sometimes the developers will actually listen to this podcast as well. [SPEAKER_01]: Okay. [SPEAKER_07]: So yeah, if this character shows up in a feature fallout game, that will be phenomenal because we'll know we'll know with the origin of the character.

55:47 [SPEAKER_05]: X. Okay. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: That's Max Rads and AX are ADS. [SPEAKER_07]: That's great. [SPEAKER_07]: That's great. [SPEAKER_07]: What about Elder Scrolls? [SPEAKER_07]: Have you have you doubled in Elder Scrolls? [SPEAKER_05]: I certainly played a lot before Baldur's Gate III came out.

56:02 [SPEAKER_05]: I think Skyrim was the most popular venue to train your Dungeons & Dragons character in a new game. [SPEAKER_05]: I began much like I did in Fallout where I would spend so much time building settlements and whatnot. [SPEAKER_05]: There were Skyrim characters that I had where I didn't even attempt to address the dragon problem, because it's like, no, I need those to build armor.

56:26 [SPEAKER_05]: And you know, I just had an orchish Smith who had a very nice house that he'd built, and I'd carefully arranged all the books, according to subject matter in my house. [SPEAKER_05]: And you know, I earned money by, you know, killing dragons and making them an armor. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, it was, you know, it's a peaceful life.

56:43 [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, so you mentioned in Ork in one of the one of the big things about Elder Scrolls, just like D&D, as you got all the different races, is there a race that you're more, you kind of lean more toward, or you would actually, would you prefer, can you do like a Nord voice, would you want to do a Nord, or would it be cool to be a type of elf?

57:00 [SPEAKER_05]: I always lean towards non-human, so I like, yeah, I probably want an Ork, or Argonian, or something like that. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, yeah, or Ashit, you know? [SPEAKER_07]: Oh, this one, this one thinks that it's a great idea. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I like the kageats a lot. [SPEAKER_05]: In fact, for Max Rads, I actually made a kageat joke because I had him with like a bunch of stuff and was what was the joke.

57:22 [SPEAKER_05]: Google as well as if you have caps. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: Nice. [SPEAKER_07]: That's great. [SPEAKER_07]: That's great. [SPEAKER_07]: Well, thank you so much for taking the time to sit down and talk and share your experiences with all of this. [SPEAKER_07]: This has been very, very, very cool.

57:35 [SPEAKER_07]: I know that you kind of wrap this up. [SPEAKER_07]: I know that you do a lot of these public events and the community aspect of it. [SPEAKER_07]: Can you speak on just a little bit of what it means to you to be part of this bigger community and how that works into your career? [SPEAKER_05]: Well, I mean, I know nothing else because I was a nerd long before I ever landed a voice acting game.

57:55 [SPEAKER_05]: So things really worked out well for me. [SPEAKER_05]: And yeah, in those terms. [SPEAKER_05]: So I was the sort of person who would go to cons, like long before I was doing this professionally. [SPEAKER_05]: So getting to go to cons as a guest, like that's really the icing on the cake.

58:08 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, it's like, well, I would do it anyway. [SPEAKER_05]: But now I, when I go to concert, I will spend a fair bit of time in the merch room buying stuff for my collection and just hanging out and taking pictures of cosplay and doing cosplay myself and, you know, having a good time.

58:23 [SPEAKER_05]: That's why DragonCon actually is one of my favorite conventions in the multiverse because it is so fan oriented, completely fan driven and so much creativity and positivity. [SPEAKER_05]: I look forward to it every year. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, the community, the follow-up community, the elder scrolls community, I've found is as a place that a lot of people call home because it is so positive.

58:48 [SPEAKER_07]: It is so supportive. [SPEAKER_07]: We all can nerd out about the things that we love together and we all grow close together because of that. [SPEAKER_07]: So it is pretty wonderful. [SPEAKER_07]: So do you have anything coming up that you would like to share or do you're doing school D&D stuff, people can sign up for or anything or ways people can get a hold of you or just keep track of what you're doing?

59:07 [SPEAKER_05]: Yes, actually. [SPEAKER_05]: Well, D&D and Castle is open to the public. [SPEAKER_05]: I won't lie and tell you that it's a very cheap and economical thing. [SPEAKER_05]: It is more of a bucket list item, but it's amazing. [SPEAKER_05]: I have a great time there. [SPEAKER_05]: And I think they have just released the sign up for our spring, twenty twenty six.

59:27 [SPEAKER_05]: sessions, which will be at wall worth castle in the UK. [SPEAKER_05]: I do know my first table is completely sold out, but there should be seats available at my second table, which will be right at the end of April. [SPEAKER_05]: So I think the ones that tickets are available for is April twenty six to thirty at twenty twenty six.

59:45 [SPEAKER_05]: Also, I DM at Jen Khan. [SPEAKER_05]: I'll be running a game for the Indian Castle. [SPEAKER_05]: Not in a castle at a convention. [SPEAKER_05]: I can mention sort of. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, at Gencon though. [SPEAKER_05]: And that you sign up for those like you sign up for normal Gencon games.

1:00:02 [SPEAKER_05]: I will be doing DragonCon as mentioned this year and we'll be doing improvise Dungeons and Dragons, which is a show that I do that with that garage theater out of Atlanta. [SPEAKER_05]: There are fantastic bunch. [SPEAKER_05]: We'll be doing that again this year with some special guests.

1:00:16 [SPEAKER_05]: And last year at DragonCon, I had the opportunity to actually DM a game for the Baldur's Gate III voice cast. [SPEAKER_05]: And I think there's another batch of them this year. [SPEAKER_05]: So I'll be running bad again at this year's DragonCon, including with one of the members of the cast that's coming is Samantha Bayer.

1:00:37 [SPEAKER_05]: And I just did a UK tour of Call of Cthulhu with them. [SPEAKER_05]: So it'll be a bit of a reunion. [SPEAKER_05]: And Sam is fantastic. [SPEAKER_05]: I always have great time with them. [SPEAKER_07]: Awesome, awesome. [SPEAKER_07]: So lots of opportunities to meet Mark and go to these big events.

1:00:51 [SPEAKER_07]: And heck, if you can make your way to the UK and go to a castle and play D&D, I don't, that seems, I can't think of anything much more fun than that. [SPEAKER_05]: I'm constantly doing convention. [SPEAKER_05]: So I'll watch my social media. [SPEAKER_05]: And I think it's been announced that, yes, I think we have actually announced this when we are going to be a bunch of the Mass Effect cast is going to be at Pittsburgh at the beginning of October.

1:01:15 [SPEAKER_05]: We can look out for that. [SPEAKER_07]: Wow. [SPEAKER_07]: That's amazing. [SPEAKER_07]: Well, thank you so much for taking the time and I hope you have a fun rest of the convention. [SPEAKER_05]: Thank you. [SPEAKER_07]: So now I'm able to sit down with Paul Eiting, who is the voice of the vault tech rep in Fallout four, along with a very large cast of other characters across all sorts of games.

1:01:43 [SPEAKER_07]: And Paul, thank you so much for taking the time to sit down and talk. [SPEAKER_07]: It's so nice to actually get to meet you in person. [SPEAKER_07]: It's my pleasure. [SPEAKER_07]: I'm happy to be here. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, so I just watched you and some other voice actors do this improv kind of reading thing where you had to as people would ding a bell and you'd have to change your voice and do a different different voice and different impression or whatever and it's always I find it always so intriguing how [SPEAKER_07]: how gifted actors, especially actors who use their voices in these games are, even just on stage, turning on a dime and all of a sudden being a different person and really leaning into that.

1:02:24 [SPEAKER_07]: And I know you have a ton of experience through lots of different games, a lot of games that the follow community loves, but other games that we've played as well. [SPEAKER_07]: What got you into this as a career? [SPEAKER_02]: Wow, as a career. [SPEAKER_02]: The interesting thing is, I never thought of it as a career.

1:02:45 [SPEAKER_02]: I look back in silence and man, you've had a [SPEAKER_02]: a nice career. [SPEAKER_02]: I never thought of it as that. [SPEAKER_02]: I always thought of it as the next job. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm an actor. [SPEAKER_02]: I started out on stage. [SPEAKER_02]: That's my first love because that's where I feel my soul every time I go back on stage.

1:03:01 [SPEAKER_02]: In fact, I'm working on a play right now. [SPEAKER_02]: It's too care to play. [SPEAKER_02]: The voiceover happened because someone actually saw me on stage. [SPEAKER_02]: I played a play called Cloud Nine, where I played three characters, an African man servant, intentionally with no makeup, a white man, but with a different accent.

1:03:27 [SPEAKER_02]: And I played a cockney soldier, and I played a five-year-old girl. [SPEAKER_02]: Wow. [SPEAKER_02]: Wow. [SPEAKER_02]: And it took about range. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, that was a stretch. [SPEAKER_02]: And a gentleman saw me. [SPEAKER_02]: My name is Gordon Hunt, Helen Hunt, I'm famous actresses all there.

1:03:43 [SPEAKER_06]: Wow. [SPEAKER_02]: He directed everything at Hannah Barbara. [SPEAKER_02]: Well, he came to see the show, like what he saw, called me and I did ten different types of characters. [SPEAKER_02]: And it started. [SPEAKER_02]: There's a quick story before that as I was signed when I first moved to LA, only on camera.

1:04:03 [SPEAKER_02]: But the voice over person came through was they were watching my on camera reel heard something in my voice called me in for an audition and I booked it. [SPEAKER_02]: And then she started me sending me out. [SPEAKER_02]: But the big thing that happened that changed my career was meeting Gordon Hunt and him thinking that I had some talent.

1:04:28 [SPEAKER_02]: And then it just started after doing saturday morning cartoons. [SPEAKER_02]: The go bots and the sky commanders and Johnny Quest all those. [SPEAKER_02]: Although the stuff in my generation grew up on yeah, then I got the yellow and starcraft and. [SPEAKER_02]: Metal Gear Solid and the Transformers.

1:04:51 [SPEAKER_07]: Wow, that's, I mean, you've just listed off, not just a lot of famous cartoons, but some of the most storied games in video game history. [SPEAKER_07]: We're talking Blizzard with Diablo and Starcraft. [SPEAKER_07]: We're talking Metal Gear. [SPEAKER_07]: You've been a part of Fallout. [SPEAKER_07]: You've played your, well, it's not really fingerprint.

1:05:07 [SPEAKER_07]: Your voice print. [SPEAKER_07]: Some of the best, most famous, most popular games ever. [SPEAKER_07]: That's phenomenal. [SPEAKER_07]: That is, [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I've been very lucky. [SPEAKER_02]: I really have been. [SPEAKER_02]: It's one thing that says that luck is opportunity with preparation.

1:05:30 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, everyone's all something, you'll get lucky because you're in the right place at the right time, but then you have to be able to follow through with it. [SPEAKER_02]: Right. [SPEAKER_02]: And I've been very lucky to be involved with some really terrific projects. [SPEAKER_02]: At the time, you don't know it's going to be anything [SPEAKER_02]: It was super like that.

1:05:46 [SPEAKER_02]: I knew Metal Gear was going to be something different because because we saw the script, which was like a telephone book. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, they were pushing like a cinematic experience in a video game before a lot of other games even considered that as an option. [SPEAKER_07]: And I think they inspired a lot of games to kind of go in that direction and change the way video games were made.

1:06:06 [SPEAKER_02]: It really did. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm really proud of it. [SPEAKER_02]: Especially that it's still going on. [SPEAKER_02]: You know, something like that. [SPEAKER_02]: And then with fallout, and Skyrim came first. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm didn't know either. [SPEAKER_02]: I think fallout three. [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.

1:06:22 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: And I did like nineteen characters in that. [SPEAKER_02]: And then three characters in Skyrim. [SPEAKER_02]: Um, which I love doing, especially, uh, Gaulma, Gaulma are so feast. [SPEAKER_02]: And also, uh, Septimus Signus. [SPEAKER_02]: He's a little fellow. [SPEAKER_02]: I, they didn't, the ice can't do.

1:06:44 [SPEAKER_01]: No, the Elder Scrolls. [SPEAKER_01]: Yes. [SPEAKER_02]: And, um, I was saying earlier in the panel, we did that somebody taken my character from, um, fallout. [SPEAKER_02]: from the Baltic rep and made print calls. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, I've seen these. [SPEAKER_02]: I've seen these. [SPEAKER_07]: They're hilarious.

1:07:04 [SPEAKER_07]: You see Septimus Signus? [SPEAKER_07]: I think so. [SPEAKER_07]: Yes. [SPEAKER_07]: I've had the same, the same creator did a number of these on their YouTube channel. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: We're Septimus calls libraries. [SPEAKER_07]: That's right. [SPEAKER_02]: Where was did it?

1:07:19 [SPEAKER_07]: Did a great job. [SPEAKER_07]: It's hilarious. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, they chopped up your performance into it. [SPEAKER_07]: What I'm guessing was a series of different voice clips. [SPEAKER_07]: And then as they were on the call, they were able to pick the right voice clip that would make sense for the person they were talking to.

1:07:33 [SPEAKER_07]: And because it was a legitimate voice performance, they thought they were talking to a real person. [SPEAKER_07]: And it turned into, you know, wackiness and soos, the person gets upset and hangs up the phone or whatever. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, so Paul Lightning is being a jerk and didn't even know it.

1:07:46 [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, I guess from that perspective. [SPEAKER_07]: Wow, you're such a jerk. [SPEAKER_07]: When so when people take let let let me go back in time because your career started with these characters in the nineteen eighties. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: So in the nineteen eighties, the internet wasn't a thing.

1:08:05 [SPEAKER_07]: You would never have been able to predict that people would have taken your voice and use it to do prank calls twenty thirty years later, right? [SPEAKER_07]: Like what is from your perspective, how first of all [SPEAKER_07]: Does it feel different doing a voice today with the way the internet interacts with that?

1:08:26 [SPEAKER_07]: Do you have different concerns or considerations? [SPEAKER_07]: Is it flattering? [SPEAKER_07]: How does that feel? [SPEAKER_07]: And speak on that a little bit. [SPEAKER_02]: That's a great question. [SPEAKER_02]: You know, back in the eighties and early nineties. [SPEAKER_02]: There wasn't any kind of fandom for voice actors.

1:08:45 [SPEAKER_02]: We were other than like Mel Brooks or somebody. [SPEAKER_02]: Mel Brooks and I mean how Mel Blank and Dolls Butler. [SPEAKER_02]: But most of us, you're in the dark. [SPEAKER_02]: Your voice is there. [SPEAKER_02]: The voice of God or the voice of any kind of character or creature. [SPEAKER_02]: But there's not a human being behind it.

1:09:11 [SPEAKER_02]: Right, and there are a few people think about the person behind the character, they just think about the character. [SPEAKER_02]: Exactly. [SPEAKER_02]: And now, often you type them to a particular type of character. [SPEAKER_02]: I'll tell you, one of the nicest things that happened is when they started having Comic-Con's and whatnot, where I'll speak to myself personally, [SPEAKER_02]: I'm a stage actor and we do performance on stage when you're acting.

1:09:47 [SPEAKER_02]: You're there with the audience and it's a shared event. [SPEAKER_02]: So you know you get the feel of how the audience feels, whether you're connecting with the audience, whether you're a good guy or bad guy, and at the end whether there's applause or booze or whatever. [SPEAKER_07]: Right.

1:10:09 [SPEAKER_02]: There's a connection there and you feel like you're it's real sharing. [SPEAKER_02]: With voiceover, you didn't know that. [SPEAKER_02]: Right? [SPEAKER_07]: There's no feedback. [SPEAKER_07]: So I used to torn bands. [SPEAKER_07]: I've played shows in front of, fifteen hundred people. [SPEAKER_07]: I've done that.

1:10:26 [SPEAKER_07]: And it's the same kind of experience. [SPEAKER_07]: You get the feedback from the energy of the room, the people reacting to the music and being in a stage performance like plays. [SPEAKER_07]: Very much the same thing. [SPEAKER_07]: Did the laugh land? [SPEAKER_07]: Did they like the way I delivered that line?

1:10:40 [SPEAKER_07]: Are they paying attention to the dialogue or are they zoning out? [SPEAKER_07]: You know, like all of that. [SPEAKER_07]: So from your perspective, it's very different when it's over-cording. [SPEAKER_02]: Right. [SPEAKER_02]: And one of the nicest things that happened for me when Comic Con started happening and voice actors are being invited to meet fans of their work.

1:11:01 [SPEAKER_02]: It's so wonderful to get feedback. [SPEAKER_02]: And I make sure that I don't take it as them, how do I put this? [SPEAKER_02]: Loving me, they love the work that I do, they love the characters that you create, and they mean something to people, even when you don't know. [SPEAKER_02]: You think, oh, I'm just like with the Transformers.

1:11:32 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, they were just selling toys and selling commercials. [SPEAKER_02]: And then you hear stories, sorry, I have to story from different people about how your voice or something that happened in that show or film touched them and changed them in some ways. [SPEAKER_02]: That's what an actor.

1:11:53 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: That's why I became an actor. [SPEAKER_02]: Right. [SPEAKER_02]: You know, it's the human element. [SPEAKER_02]: Exactly. [SPEAKER_02]: Exactly. [SPEAKER_02]: So that's why I love going to to come accounts and meeting fans. [SPEAKER_02]: Truly. [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, psych because we're in it.

1:12:08 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm nothing. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: No actor is anything without audience. [SPEAKER_07]: Right. [SPEAKER_07]: It's an art form. [SPEAKER_07]: Any artist, if they don't have fans of their art, then there's no communication happening. [SPEAKER_07]: You might as well just block yourself in your basement and do things for yourself.

1:12:24 [SPEAKER_07]: Right. [SPEAKER_07]: You can be a great musician. [SPEAKER_02]: You're sitting in your basement, you're living your whatever. [SPEAKER_02]: And nobody hears it. [SPEAKER_02]: Okay. [SPEAKER_02]: Yay. [SPEAKER_02]: Yay. [SPEAKER_02]: I get to play my guitar really good. [SPEAKER_07]: Right.

1:12:38 [SPEAKER_07]: Listen to well listen to my voice hard. [SPEAKER_07]: Oh, I sound good today. [SPEAKER_07]: I can do an impression of a kajit. [SPEAKER_07]: This one. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: So yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: So that is so interesting to go from a place where like you said, you were in the dark.

1:12:52 [SPEAKER_07]: Nobody even thought about the voice actor to being a place where you come out into the light. [SPEAKER_07]: And from my experience, being somebody who has I've been doing podcasts for almost seven years now, I've been a gamer for a very long time. [SPEAKER_07]: I'm old enough to have seen the evolution of these games through a lot of the titles that you've played.

1:13:11 [SPEAKER_07]: The community resonates with the voice acting community. [SPEAKER_07]: In part because you are a piece of that story that meant something to them and it wouldn't have been the same without you. [SPEAKER_07]: But also from the perspective of [SPEAKER_07]: People, especially young people today are looking at the potential for jobs and what jobs will I actually enjoy doing.

1:13:35 [SPEAKER_07]: And the idea of you've inspired people to want to do what you do because they go well. [SPEAKER_07]: I love playing games. [SPEAKER_07]: These are the things that have really moved me. [SPEAKER_07]: I maybe I'm not a stage actor. [SPEAKER_07]: Maybe I don't have a face for movies or whatever, right?

1:13:51 [SPEAKER_07]: But I loved doing theater in high school. [SPEAKER_07]: And I love using my voice in creative ways. [SPEAKER_07]: And this is something that I just wish I had the opportunity. [SPEAKER_07]: And there are, I would say thousands of people out there who would love the opportunity, even to just do an interview to be able to play a character, even a bit part in the background somewhere.

1:14:13 [SPEAKER_02]: And you know, there are thousands of people out there who are doing it. [SPEAKER_02]: Not necessarily for, you know, big games and not making a lot of money, but they're actually doing it. [SPEAKER_02]: I have friends who sat a lot as fans of metal gear and transformers or whatever who live in the young man who live in York, England, another one outside of Edinburgh.

1:14:39 [SPEAKER_02]: very talented guys. [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, their voices were the characters they created once in the musician. [SPEAKER_02]: It was just great work. [SPEAKER_02]: And they kept wanting to do it, but they had no. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm living, he's in York. [SPEAKER_02]: This is why I'm not even close to London.

1:14:56 [SPEAKER_02]: What can I do here? [SPEAKER_02]: Well, I told him, I said, you get a microphone. [SPEAKER_02]: They don't have to be a three thousand dollar mic. [SPEAKER_02]: You know, a couple hundred bucks at the most. [SPEAKER_02]: and start recording stuff. [SPEAKER_02]: Go online, watch and see, and there's always somebody who's making something and looking for voices.

1:15:15 [SPEAKER_02]: And one, the gentleman in York with the time was twenty-one years old. [SPEAKER_02]: It's like it's been six, seven years ago. [SPEAKER_02]: And now it's really busy doing audio books. [SPEAKER_02]: Just a love doing audio books. [SPEAKER_02]: The other young man wrote music for Oh, God.

1:15:35 [SPEAKER_02]: Was it really a game called Dust? [SPEAKER_02]: Dust? [SPEAKER_02]: China, I don't remember, but he's writing music for video games and also does voices for them. [SPEAKER_02]: So there are ways of doing it, so I'm my feeling as always, if you, if you've got to do it, then there are ways now to do it, just get online, just, I'll be [SPEAKER_02]: I was gonna say I would be serious, but I'm not being serious.

1:16:06 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, if you got a great voice as long as you can't take any of my jobs. [SPEAKER_07]: Don't take my jobs. [SPEAKER_07]: That's a good tip. [SPEAKER_07]: Oh, he's applying for that one. [SPEAKER_07]: So I'm gonna, I'm gonna, I'll let him have that. [SPEAKER_07]: So, speaking of your jobs, are you said every actor has the potential of being typecast as a specific role and then you feel like, okay, well, I can do more than that.

1:16:33 [SPEAKER_07]: Let me spread my wings, that kind of thing. [SPEAKER_07]: Do you feel like that's something that has happened? [SPEAKER_02]: The four incarnations of Ben-Ten, okay, that we did. [SPEAKER_02]: When we did, the original Ben-Ten, then we moved to Alien Force, then ultimate Alien, then omniverse.

1:16:58 [SPEAKER_02]: Each time we went to another incarnation of the show, they changed directors and producer to get a different feel for it. [SPEAKER_02]: for the first three incontations. [SPEAKER_02]: I was basically gonna pull max. [SPEAKER_02]: And then maybe an ancillary truck driver would go by. [SPEAKER_02]: Hey, hey, hey, something like that would be it.

1:17:24 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, they just needed like a line. [SPEAKER_02]: So they're like, you're here. [SPEAKER_02]: Can you just do this? [SPEAKER_02]: I can't do that sort of stuff, but then it's four, about a different director who I'd worked with as an actress, Sue Blue. [SPEAKER_02]: And she said, why are you only doing that character?

1:17:39 [SPEAKER_02]: I said, because that's the only one that we're doing. [SPEAKER_02]: Is that okay, cool? [SPEAKER_02]: Am I a choice? [SPEAKER_02]: So I ended up doing five different regular characters, you know, which was as a voice actor, yes, which you want to do. [SPEAKER_02]: That's so much more fun.

1:17:53 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, you stretch out a little bit, you know? [SPEAKER_02]: See, hey, I can still do that stuff. [SPEAKER_02]: But you do get, you can get pigeonhole, even way back in the day. [SPEAKER_02]: I have a casting director, the guy who cast me for the Transformers. [SPEAKER_02]: He always saw me as a character, an actor who did basically upper register.

1:18:18 [SPEAKER_02]: Wow, okay. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I was always up here, you know? [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: But clearly your void, even just your speaking voice has a lower [SPEAKER_02]: My God, evaluation of Decepticon capability indicates a distinct tactical deficiency. [SPEAKER_02]: He had me up there.

1:18:32 [SPEAKER_02]: So I never did any of GI Joe. [SPEAKER_02]: Right. [SPEAKER_02]: All those guys right here or Optimus Prime. [SPEAKER_02]: Well, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. [SPEAKER_02]: Think about that. [SPEAKER_06]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: but then other casting directors would bring me in for the deeper characters.

1:18:46 [SPEAKER_02]: So it's like just because they knew you that way. [SPEAKER_02]: And there is ageism in the voice of just like on camera. [SPEAKER_07]: But yeah, that seems, so when you can't see somebody's face and they can do whatever voice you need, then does it really matter what age they are? [SPEAKER_02]: You know what I think you should be casting director?

1:19:10 [SPEAKER_02]: I agree. [SPEAKER_02]: I agree. [SPEAKER_02]: Absolutely. [SPEAKER_02]: Look, Daw's butler did Elroy, who was eight years old on the Jetsons. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: He did Elroy till he died at seven years old. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: It's like, you, the thing I love about voice over is that generally you're cast for your talent.

1:19:32 [SPEAKER_02]: not for your, and how much fun you are to be around. [SPEAKER_02]: Right. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: Because nobody wants to hire you if you, if you suck to work with. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: But then on camera, it's like, how tall are you? [SPEAKER_02]: How short are you?

1:19:42 [SPEAKER_02]: How fat? [SPEAKER_02]: How thin he, you know? [SPEAKER_02]: Are you a leading man or your character? [SPEAKER_02]: Voice over. [SPEAKER_02]: You can be anything. [SPEAKER_06]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: You're limited by your talent. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: And that's the way it should be.

1:19:57 [SPEAKER_02]: Right. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: That's well put. [SPEAKER_07]: That's well put. [SPEAKER_07]: And from the talent perspective, there's, I think a lot of people think, and I could be wrong. [SPEAKER_07]: But I think there's a significant percentage of people who think, oh, well, you just, you just were born with a good voice, you can do voice work.

1:20:14 [SPEAKER_07]: Right. [SPEAKER_07]: And it's, no, no. [SPEAKER_07]: There's, [SPEAKER_07]: And I'm just guessing here, ninety percent of it is acting, ten percent of it is the voice or something like that. [SPEAKER_02]: Like I said, you should be a casting director. [SPEAKER_02]: Absolutely. [SPEAKER_02]: That's the question we always get is what you do if you want to be a voice actor and always the first answer is taken acting class or an end improv class.

1:20:43 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: Although generally, you're not going to be improving once you get a gig. [SPEAKER_02]: But it's good to be able to think on your feet. [SPEAKER_02]: Absolutely. [SPEAKER_02]: Absolutely. [SPEAKER_02]: Because you've got to make that whatever your cool voice is, you've got to get that cool voice past the microphone.

1:21:01 [SPEAKER_02]: It's got to go through all those chords and out into people's auditorial canals. [SPEAKER_02]: You know, that character's got to live, not just sound particular way. [SPEAKER_07]: Right, yeah, it has to reach into them and touch their hearts. [SPEAKER_07]: And that's what creates a character that is memorable.

1:21:19 [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, I try to imagine somebody like the vault tech agent, right, coming to the door with a different voice and a different, that would change even if it even just looking at the same face. [SPEAKER_07]: that just breaks my brain to imagine even any of these other voice actors at this event that I've gotten a chance to, you know, if Mark Meer was the, was the vault tech agent, it would be a very different experience because he would portray that character very differently, even under the same direction with the same face, all of that.

1:21:49 [SPEAKER_07]: So to divorce a character from the actor and the performance, not just the sound of the voice, but the performance is what I think is the thing that you said. [SPEAKER_07]: It kind of reaches up into us and it's the thing that we remember. [SPEAKER_02]: It's really funny. [SPEAKER_02]: You said I just flashed on me doing instead of good morning, Baltic calling.

1:22:10 [SPEAKER_02]: No, I'm not trying to sell you anything. [SPEAKER_02]: Doing a good morning, Baltic calling. [SPEAKER_02]: Good morning, Captain Shepard. [SPEAKER_02]: You're like, oh, yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: It makes no sense. [SPEAKER_02]: And to that point, what cracked me up about Ben Tan, jumping back to Ben Tan, every time we changed producers and directors and the different incarnations, I had to re audition for my character.

1:22:39 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, wow. [SPEAKER_02]: Why did the re audition for Grandpa Max? [SPEAKER_07]: which is funny because he would assume that people who are fans of the series wouldn't want that character to change. [SPEAKER_02]: Well, one excuse to gave was that because the second then ten was then was now fifteen years old instead of ten years old and five whole years when they said [SPEAKER_02]: Well, you know what, maybe Grandpa Max isn't, doesn't have as much power.

1:23:06 [SPEAKER_02]: Maybe he's a little raspy. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: Maybe he's a little older. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: They said, well, no, we did that. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, he said, well, how I maybe it was a little more gravel. [SPEAKER_02]: Ben, what do you think? [SPEAKER_02]: It's been smoking a lot.

1:23:16 [SPEAKER_02]: And lots of fun. [SPEAKER_02]: Exactly. [SPEAKER_02]: So we did it two or three different ways. [SPEAKER_02]: Then finally, they came to those senses and said, [SPEAKER_02]: But you know, it's only five years and a male, I mean, an adult, there's always doesn't change that much in five years.

1:23:31 [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, a little kid, sure. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, a grown man, not so much. [SPEAKER_02]: They changed, you know, Tara to Yuri. [SPEAKER_02]: So that I got, but it's like, but they, they finally said, oh, yeah, never mind. [SPEAKER_07]: That's hilarious. [SPEAKER_07]: That's hilarious. [SPEAKER_07]: So we only have so much time.

1:23:49 [SPEAKER_07]: I've got other interviews to get to and I don't want to keep you too long because I know you're busy with other stuff as well. [SPEAKER_07]: When it comes to fall out, there are other games. [SPEAKER_07]: The official word has gone out. [SPEAKER_07]: At least I leave somewhere that the next fallout game has been greenlit.

1:24:05 [SPEAKER_07]: They're in production or they will be in production. [SPEAKER_07]: Elder Scrolls Six is [SPEAKER_07]: In production has been for a little while now, that's coming out soon. [SPEAKER_07]: I know you can't give away any secrets of these things, but from your perspective, if there was a character in either of those series, a type of character that you would love to play, they haven't had the opportunity to play.

1:24:25 [SPEAKER_07]: So for example, in Elder Scrolls, there's all the different races, and they all sound a little bit different. [SPEAKER_07]: or in Fallout, you have ghouls and you have humans and with the vault tech wreck, you got to be a human and a ghoul. [SPEAKER_07]: Or robots, those kinds of things.

1:24:37 [SPEAKER_07]: Is there a role in either of those that you would jump on and be like, oh, I'd really love to try that? [SPEAKER_07]: Wow. [SPEAKER_02]: I want to give a legit answer set of a joke. [SPEAKER_02]: I would like just, with the character, it's got some depth on any some humor. [SPEAKER_02]: I want to have some humor.

1:25:04 [SPEAKER_02]: We just fun. [SPEAKER_02]: When you're talking about fallout, it's like, hey. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes. [SPEAKER_02]: Let's have some fun with this stuff. [SPEAKER_02]: But then in particular, now the goal [SPEAKER_02]: Takes a little bit more out of your voice. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

1:25:20 [SPEAKER_01]: You're a scraff, you know. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_01]: I did it for a while during the pant panel. [SPEAKER_01]: I was like, yeah, you start to feel a little bit. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

1:25:31 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: Boy, I don't know. [SPEAKER_07]: It's just to somebody with some depth, somebody with some depth. [SPEAKER_02]: And a sense of humor. [SPEAKER_02]: And a sense of humor. [SPEAKER_02]: Or humor situations. [SPEAKER_02]: Like I said in the panel, a character that and a piece that changes the world for the good.

1:25:54 [SPEAKER_02]: That makes what we're living in. [SPEAKER_02]: not as palatable, but enjoyable, and joyful, and also makes me incredibly rich. [SPEAKER_07]: Yes, right. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, I agree. [SPEAKER_07]: I agree. [SPEAKER_07]: It feels good to make the world better. [SPEAKER_07]: It also makes living in that world a lot easier if you have more money.

1:26:20 [SPEAKER_07]: Yes, absolutely. [SPEAKER_07]: Well, thank you so much for taking the time. [SPEAKER_07]: Is there anything you would like to leave with everyone else or ways that they can follow your work or anything that you would like to promote while you're here? [SPEAKER_02]: Well, if you're in Los Angeles, you can come see the play that I'm working on called Heisenberg.

1:26:37 [SPEAKER_02]: It's a great play that woman that I'm working with. [SPEAKER_02]: It's a play about [SPEAKER_02]: a woman in her early forties who meets a man in my age, and you try and figure out where they end up. [SPEAKER_02]: And Heisenberg is based on actually a principal, the Heisenberg uncertainty principle.

1:26:56 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, physics, where you just don't know the harder you look at something, the less you know how fast it's going and where it's going to end up. [SPEAKER_07]: Right, right. [SPEAKER_07]: If you can pinpoint the location, you then you lose the direction, or if you can pinpoint the direction you lose the location, like the nature of quantum particles and all that.

1:27:16 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it's a great piece, plus I'm doing some more metal gear stuff. [SPEAKER_02]: And I'm a Twitter, I know I'm not. [SPEAKER_02]: I am now on Instagram, just my name, and Facebook. [SPEAKER_02]: All right, then the two and my, my page is poll-iting.com. [SPEAKER_02]: Got it. [SPEAKER_02]: Got it.

1:27:41 [SPEAKER_02]: Well, thank you so much, Paul. [SPEAKER_02]: This has been a pleasure. [SPEAKER_07]: Pleasure, man. [SPEAKER_07]: Really. [SPEAKER_07]: Great questions. [SPEAKER_07]: It's been fun. [SPEAKER_07]: Awesome. [SPEAKER_07]: Awesome. [SPEAKER_07]: Well, I'll let you get back to it and enjoy the rest of the convention.

1:27:49 [SPEAKER_07]: Thanks. [SPEAKER_07]: All right, so now I'm in a little dressing room. [SPEAKER_07]: Peter Jessup and I have hidden away in a corner in order to get this interview because we're running out of spaces that don't have lots of sound in the background. [SPEAKER_07]: You might recognize Peter from both fallout and from Elder Scrolls.

1:28:15 [SPEAKER_07]: as the Paladin dance fan favorite character and also as Mirac, who's very formidable, interesting character in Fallout in Elder Scrolls and Skyrim. [SPEAKER_07]: Thank you for taking the time to sit down with me. [SPEAKER_07]: Glad to be here. [SPEAKER_07]: So this is fun because I've got the opportunity to talk to a number of different voice actors and I love getting your perspective on playing these characters because other than the animators and the people who are actually designing the physical, the characters themselves in writing the lines of course, but like the characters and the performance of the characters.

1:28:48 [SPEAKER_07]: I believe are some of the things that really hit people where it counts. [SPEAKER_07]: And for characters like Paladin dance, he has a very interesting and unique story. [SPEAKER_07]: There's a, you know, people in the following community will say, well, he's a synth. [SPEAKER_07]: So he's not really a person, but then there's a whole other contingent of people who are like, oh my God, I love him.

1:29:06 [SPEAKER_07]: He's the best guy. [SPEAKER_07]: And you just just trying to do the right thing. [SPEAKER_07]: All of that. [SPEAKER_07]: What is it like when you get a character as intricate as somebody like dance and performing and portraying him? [SPEAKER_04]: Well, let's start it out. [SPEAKER_04]: They don't tell you what you're working on when you book the job.

1:29:24 [SPEAKER_04]: So I didn't know. [SPEAKER_04]: A that it was a fallout game while you were recording it until I got into the booth. [SPEAKER_04]: And like the second line I had had the term ferals in it. [SPEAKER_04]: And I was like, wait a minute, is this fallout? [SPEAKER_04]: No, I can't move fallout.

1:29:41 [SPEAKER_07]: But the early sessions with Palin and dance, I just assumed I was the brotherhood of steel companion character, just like all the players did before they got far enough in the storyline to realize that that was a little bit more to it than that. [SPEAKER_04]: And it wasn't until we'd done probably five or six sessions at that point.

1:30:00 [SPEAKER_04]: We got to the parts where we find out that he's a synth. [SPEAKER_04]: And you can develop a close relationship with dance prior to that revelation coming out. [SPEAKER_04]: So we've done all of the affinity dialogue, we've done all of the romantic dialogue, right? [SPEAKER_04]: You know, when you first meet Dan, she's kind of a dick.

1:30:23 [SPEAKER_07]: Right. [SPEAKER_07]: Yes, in the police station. [SPEAKER_07]: And he's, oh, go, go, go, do this job. [SPEAKER_04]: Make sure you do it right. [SPEAKER_04]: All that stuff. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_04]: I need somebody who can obey my orders without question and all that kind of crap.

1:30:34 [SPEAKER_04]: And then as he warms up to you, you realize, okay, maybe he's, he's just a by the book kind of guy. [SPEAKER_04]: Which is still okay. [SPEAKER_04]: And then once you get to know each other and you get to the affinity work and you become friends and or [SPEAKER_04]: You know, you fall in love or whatever.

1:30:53 [SPEAKER_04]: I like that character arc. [SPEAKER_04]: And then they threw this curve ball of being a synth, more character arc. [SPEAKER_04]: And I was like, holy crap, this is amazing. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, because there's so many of this whole life is a lie. [SPEAKER_04]: What actually am I? [SPEAKER_04]: Am I a person?

1:31:12 [SPEAKER_04]: I've been told my whole life that I know of that synths are not people. [SPEAKER_04]: Right. [SPEAKER_04]: And then to find out that I am one, and I think I'm a person. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, you know, bringing this up now, it feels like there are a lot of correlaries between somebody like dance realizing, oh, I'm a synth and I didn't even realize it, which is one of the big things that happens in Fallout four all the time with people who are diagnosed with something they didn't realize they had.

1:31:39 [SPEAKER_07]: whether it is some sort of neurodivergent thing. [SPEAKER_07]: Like, hey, you didn't know it, but you've been autistic all these years, or ADHD or other kinds of things. [SPEAKER_07]: And I think a lot of I'm neurodivergent. [SPEAKER_07]: In fact, I think most of the people at conferences like this are probably neurodivergent in some way.

1:31:56 [SPEAKER_07]: And do you feel like that's kind of an analogy, because a lot of times in games and literature and fantasy and those kinds of things, I mean, X-Men is the classic example of, you know, these are mutants, but that is really about racism, because it's the nineteen sixties, nineteen seventies, right?

1:32:12 [SPEAKER_07]: Did you pull from a place internally? [SPEAKER_04]: Absolutely, no, absolutely, I did. [SPEAKER_04]: And the [SPEAKER_04]: The really interesting options that you get with dance at that point, he's like, you got to kill me. [SPEAKER_04]: I'm an abomination, I should not exist. [SPEAKER_07]: Right, because he's been programmed to believe that his whole life.

1:32:37 [SPEAKER_04]: That's his worldview. [SPEAKER_04]: That's the stand that the brotherhood of steel takes and he's a loyal soldier and that's like you've got to do it. [SPEAKER_04]: And you have to convince him. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, just stay alive. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, they can go very dark places.

1:32:53 [SPEAKER_04]: And he does. [SPEAKER_04]: It goes through very dark places. [SPEAKER_04]: And then even worse, you got to jack your charisma way up so that you can convince Max and yeah, oh, yeah, to let him go. [SPEAKER_04]: Right. [SPEAKER_04]: Max and shows up and he's like, no, no, not going to have.

1:33:05 [SPEAKER_04]: And you're going to, we're going to kill this guy. [SPEAKER_04]: Right. [SPEAKER_04]: And Derek Phillips, who is a great dude. [SPEAKER_04]: He really is a good guy. [SPEAKER_04]: He's a friend of mine. [SPEAKER_04]: He does such a great [SPEAKER_07]: asshole. [SPEAKER_07]: Yes, yes, no.

1:33:20 [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, there are certain people who, uh, I interviewed Mark Meer, uh, a little bit ago, and I had an opportunity to interview him a few years ago for the Mass Effect Warcast, and I still, to this day, have a very hard time playing a male shepherd as, uh, renegade, because his, the way he plays that character is, he's such a jerk.

1:33:40 [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: And it, he does it so well that I have a hard time doing it. [SPEAKER_07]: So I feel like this is kind of similar to that. [SPEAKER_04]: No, that's exactly exactly. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, so that's my take on that whole character arc. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.

1:33:56 [SPEAKER_07]: So a very different kind of character would be Mirac from Elder Scrolls because you go from being a synth brotherhood person who didn't know it and all of that and a potential of interest in all of that. [SPEAKER_07]: To being what is the primary villain for a major DLC expansion and somebody who [SPEAKER_07]: One of the things that my co-host and I for the Elder Scrolls lorecast talk about all the time is how Mirac is such a jerk because he will steal the souls.

1:34:22 [SPEAKER_07]: You kill a dragon, he'll just swoop in and be like, nope, there might now. [SPEAKER_07]: That's got to be a completely different experience playing a villain type character like that as opposed to a tough but lovable character. [SPEAKER_04]: Honestly, I've done both. [SPEAKER_04]: I've been very lucky that I've had a chance to be.

1:34:41 [SPEAKER_04]: I've been some really cool villains. [SPEAKER_04]: And I've gotten to be some really great heroes. [SPEAKER_04]: And that's the joy of being a voice actor is that you're not tight cast usually into. [SPEAKER_04]: although we talked about that at the panel today. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, yeah, I just talked to Paul a little bit about it, too, and now that does happen, you know, I got typecast as artificial intelligence that's trying to find its humanity.

1:35:05 [SPEAKER_04]: It's a very specific, it's a very specific thing. [SPEAKER_04]: Battlestar, I mean, what else does that post or collect the good? [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, but like, well, the vision. [SPEAKER_07]: Okay, yeah, I was the vision. [SPEAKER_04]: Okay, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah [SPEAKER_04]: Mirac was fun because the casting call was so generic.

1:35:33 [SPEAKER_04]: We want a non-specific Nordic accent. [SPEAKER_07]: Right, this needs to be some sort of general, you northern European thing. [SPEAKER_07]: Well, some sort of Scandinavian Scandinavian kind of a thing. [SPEAKER_04]: And I was like, all right. [SPEAKER_04]: So when it did kind of a Norwegian thing, [SPEAKER_04]: It was not that involved, surprisingly, given that how present Mirac is throughout the whole Dragonborn section of the game really.

1:36:11 [SPEAKER_07]: You don't really talk to him much. [SPEAKER_07]: Right. [SPEAKER_07]: I feel like he has these moments of like a monologue. [SPEAKER_06]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: And then every song of it will pop up and say a thing. [SPEAKER_07]: And then he disappears. [SPEAKER_04]: And that's kind of it.

1:36:21 [SPEAKER_04]: And I will say this one. [SPEAKER_04]: I did get the DLC and played it. [SPEAKER_04]: I hate it, Mary. [SPEAKER_04]: And that final dragon back battle was just such a pain in the ass. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_04]: So I honestly, I don't really explore that tie that line of when I play elders but I agree.

1:36:46 [SPEAKER_04]: But yeah, so it was fun because you get to be a little over the top. [SPEAKER_04]: Your thousands of years old. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, you've been brought back from the dead. [SPEAKER_04]: All of this great sort of backstory stuff. [SPEAKER_04]: So yeah, Mirac was fun. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: So I know some actors really do enjoy when they get to play a villain character.

1:37:07 [SPEAKER_07]: Because there are things you can do as a villain character that are a little over the top. [SPEAKER_07]: They're a little bit more expressive or sinister or whatever. [SPEAKER_07]: The you never do as a hero character. [SPEAKER_07]: Do you find that you prefer one over the other or that experience is distinctly different?

1:37:21 [SPEAKER_04]: No, they're just, it's part of the variety of what you get to do as an actor. [SPEAKER_04]: You know, that's the fun thing. [SPEAKER_04]: Again, another artificial intelligence when in sovereign. [SPEAKER_04]: Mass Effect. [SPEAKER_07]: That's right. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.

1:37:36 [SPEAKER_04]: It's not a great feeling. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_04]: Best monologue that's I think ever been written for a video game is that whole monologue, you know, you you exist because we allow it. [SPEAKER_04]: Right. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_04]: There's some these because we demand it.

1:37:50 [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: There's some there's an intense stuff that goes on with a very cool that's a whole [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_04]: And so that's, you know, that was that was fun. [SPEAKER_04]: I got to play Stepan Wolf in Justice League action. [SPEAKER_04]: But I also played Superman in JLA Adventures.

1:38:07 [SPEAKER_04]: Right. [SPEAKER_04]: That's a little bit of both. [SPEAKER_04]: You get to do both. [SPEAKER_04]: And that's been fun. [SPEAKER_07]: That's great. [SPEAKER_07]: That's great. [SPEAKER_07]: Is there any other roles that really stick out to you that that are some of your favorites? [SPEAKER_04]: Honestly, Paladin dance was so well written.

1:38:22 [SPEAKER_04]: when people ask, well, what were some of the favorite roles you played? [SPEAKER_04]: He really is one of my favorites. [SPEAKER_04]: Because it's such a deep game. [SPEAKER_04]: You really got a chance to explore the character. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_04]: And that was great. [SPEAKER_04]: There was a whole section of the game that we recorded that ended up not getting used.

1:38:41 [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_04]: And I know people have talked about this. [SPEAKER_04]: I've talked about this before, where U.S. [SPEAKER_04]: the player character can take over the brotherhood of steel. [SPEAKER_04]: with dance as your companion still. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_04]: And I think that folks at Bethesda were like, yeah, that's never that would never fly.

1:38:57 [SPEAKER_07]: They wouldn't turn. [SPEAKER_07]: They wouldn't turn that much. [SPEAKER_04]: Oh, yeah, that once it is good. [SPEAKER_04]: No. [SPEAKER_04]: So they scrapped that whole thing. [SPEAKER_07]: But yeah, I can I can see the community having been a little bit upset about about that. [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, I mean, I mean, how is that possible?

1:39:13 [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, okay. [SPEAKER_07]: So I know we've got to limit it time is kind of the end of the day and I'm sure they're going to kick us out at some point, but last question is in a future and don't you don't need to reveal anything if you're involved with something you can't talk about, but in a future fallout or Elder Scrolls project is there a character type or character you know of that you would [SPEAKER_07]: like to be able to do with with Elder Scrolls, you have all the different races.

1:39:35 [SPEAKER_07]: It's a funny different accents for each of them. [SPEAKER_07]: And follow, you've got ghouls and robots and humans and all sorts of fun stuff. [SPEAKER_07]: Is there anything that you'd be like, oh, I'd be really cool to be this? [SPEAKER_04]: Honestly, I just enjoy playing in the sandbox with these guys.

1:39:49 [SPEAKER_04]: Bethesda's just been great. [SPEAKER_04]: I've done a bunch of stuff in Seventy-Six. [SPEAKER_04]: In some of the DLC and that kind of stuff that they put in. [SPEAKER_04]: And it's, you know, I love the worlds that they build. [SPEAKER_04]: I love the design of those worlds. [SPEAKER_04]: Excuse me, the Elder Scrolls stuff has sort of progressed from iteration to iteration.

1:40:19 [SPEAKER_04]: And, you know, so Skyrim's got a very sort of Nordic feel and oblivion had a very sort of medieval feel and, you know, going back. [SPEAKER_04]: the fallouts have been consistently cool. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, different kinds of wastelands, but still very much wastelands. [SPEAKER_04]: Still very much the same design, you know, okay.

1:40:41 [SPEAKER_04]: So new Vegas introduced census as per Allah. [SPEAKER_04]: Right. [SPEAKER_04]: Okay. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_04]: But, well, Nucacola needed some competition. [SPEAKER_04]: We still have a Nucacola. [SPEAKER_04]: Right. [SPEAKER_04]: It was still there. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.

1:40:56 [SPEAKER_04]: And then, you know, Nucacola world introducing all the weird [SPEAKER_04]: Bottle and Capy and all the, well, Bottle and Capy, and then all of the different flavors and all the other traits, you know, kinds of things you can get. [SPEAKER_04]: So, you know, that was fun. [SPEAKER_04]: And, you know, Jan Johns, who was scribe Halen, one of my buddies at Cambridge with Paladin dance, is also the Nucocoa Superfan.

1:41:19 [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, okay. [SPEAKER_04]: She does the voice for, I can't think of her name now. [SPEAKER_07]: But yeah, I've got, I'm so bad at names. [SPEAKER_07]: I'm so bad at names. [SPEAKER_07]: But the super fan from Nucacolo expansion. [SPEAKER_04]: Oh, three. [SPEAKER_04]: Right. [SPEAKER_04]: Yes.

1:41:29 [SPEAKER_04]: And then I bring your back in. [SPEAKER_04]: Right. [SPEAKER_04]: If she's got, oh, that's right. [SPEAKER_04]: And in Massachusetts, there are all places. [SPEAKER_04]: Right. [SPEAKER_04]: Right. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_04]: There's a few characters that make that jump. [SPEAKER_04]: So, and we'll call it in dance.

1:41:40 [SPEAKER_04]: The supposedly raised in the capital wasteland. [SPEAKER_04]: that we see thought it was. [SPEAKER_04]: You're right. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: Well, very cool. [SPEAKER_07]: It's been very nice getting to meet you and talk to you about this.

1:41:53 [SPEAKER_07]: Are there things that are going on, ways people can kind of plug into what you're doing, or things that you want to wish them out there? [SPEAKER_07]: Save. [SPEAKER_07]: But they can get all into you. [SPEAKER_07]: Sorry, are you on social media? [SPEAKER_07]: There are ways people can follow your look.

1:42:03 [SPEAKER_04]: Add, add, Jess up on Instagram. [SPEAKER_04]: Awesome. [SPEAKER_04]: Awesome. [SPEAKER_04]: Well, thank you so much for taking the time. [SPEAKER_04]: Pleasure. [SPEAKER_07]: Hey, so Scotty K fitness is here with me. [SPEAKER_07]: And we are at GCX, twenty twenty five. [SPEAKER_07]: Yes, and you've got this awesome booth set up over there for people who don't know you stream fallout.

1:42:30 [SPEAKER_07]: You stream. [SPEAKER_07]: I'm sure you're more than just fall out on occasion. [SPEAKER_03]: I'm a mostly fallout creator. [SPEAKER_03]: It's nice to be here. [SPEAKER_03]: GCX has been more than accommodating. [SPEAKER_03]: I stream variety as well, kind of whatever the community wants me to stream.

1:42:46 [SPEAKER_03]: I stream a lot of my workouts, which is fun because I get to educate and motivate at the same time and then I get to play video games, which is super fun. [SPEAKER_03]: And there's nothing better than getting like a really good chess pump and then playing fallout. [SPEAKER_07]: But no survival in the wasteland.

1:43:03 [SPEAKER_07]: Probably. [SPEAKER_07]: I mean, you want it. [SPEAKER_07]: You don't want to be in bad shape. [SPEAKER_07]: Exactly. [SPEAKER_07]: When you're on the wasteland and, you know, a favorable goal comes running at you. [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_03]: Speaking of the booth, man.

1:43:12 [SPEAKER_03]: So a couple of weeks ago, I think it was maybe a week and a half ago. [SPEAKER_03]: uh... can from fall off her home uh... great guy resound said hey uh... there's a booth is just opened up do you want it and i was like what in the world am i gonna put in a booth uh... yeah sure and so it turned out fairly well uh... again movie magic i don't think i could have planned it but uh...

1:43:32 [SPEAKER_03]: All of the backdrops and set design we had for the bunker stream that we did. [SPEAKER_03]: We ended up just bringing out here and getting it shipped out. [SPEAKER_03]: So it worked out really well. [SPEAKER_07]: Nice. [SPEAKER_07]: Nice. [SPEAKER_07]: Nice. [SPEAKER_07]: Well, this is pretty amazing.

1:43:43 [SPEAKER_07]: There's for anybody who hasn't been here, which is most of my audience who's currently listening. [SPEAKER_07]: You're right across from the fallout experience and there are [SPEAKER_07]: all sorts of like replica weapons and items and everything from like a power arm or suit. [SPEAKER_06]: Yeah.

1:43:59 [SPEAKER_07]: To, uh, I don't know. [SPEAKER_03]: Uh, there's so many weapons. [SPEAKER_03]: Uh, they have like two operational terminals. [SPEAKER_03]: Uh, they have a Mr. Handy. [SPEAKER_03]: They have so many cool set designs and props there where you can take photos with an amazing lighting and NCR Rangers and a Gatlin gun made out of laser rifles and that's operational even but not it's incredible to be across from them.

1:44:23 [SPEAKER_03]: There's such a [SPEAKER_03]: really welcoming community as well. [SPEAKER_03]: I showed up with a couple of boxes of things and a dream in my heart and they were very helpful. [SPEAKER_03]: There's a gentleman that's running around attached to them as well that has just this cart full of things to help people build their setups and stuff.

1:44:40 [SPEAKER_03]: And so he's been instrumental as well. [SPEAKER_03]: It's been really cool. [SPEAKER_03]: That's awesome. [SPEAKER_03]: That's awesome. [SPEAKER_07]: So let's talk, fall out. [SPEAKER_07]: You're your gamer. [SPEAKER_07]: You love playing fall out. [SPEAKER_07]: What is your go-to for current streams?

1:44:54 [SPEAKER_07]: Are you a seventy-six guy? [SPEAKER_07]: Do you like to go back to some of the older titles? [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, so I started on Fallout four. [SPEAKER_03]: Now, Fallout four, I found when I was obese and I was depressed and in this horrible [SPEAKER_03]: relationship and I just wanted to escape the world and you can fall into the universe I'll fall out really, really easily.

1:45:15 [SPEAKER_03]: And so I did that and I found myself a little bits and pieces of myself in the fall out worlds right in the wasteland. [SPEAKER_03]: And I realize, you know, you can level up. [SPEAKER_03]: You can become stronger. [SPEAKER_03]: You can become better at endurance. [SPEAKER_03]: You can become smarter.

1:45:30 [SPEAKER_03]: And your luck can change. [SPEAKER_03]: And all these amazing things. [SPEAKER_03]: And it gave me a different outlook on life. [SPEAKER_03]: It saved me. [SPEAKER_03]: And so fall out for is kind of my comfort game. [SPEAKER_03]: It's what it starts our go to. [SPEAKER_03]: But we make it fun.

1:45:41 [SPEAKER_03]: We play a lot of mods to make things even more interesting and more difficult to frost mod. [SPEAKER_03]: for any of the listeners here today if you guys want to try the hardest module ever try on fallout for the frost mod is like conjure yourself in the chest repeatedly for hours it's like I recognize the name I don't remember all the details the premise of the frost mod is that the storyline is out of the window it is purely survival and with all your survival mode quirks where you can only save if you sleep you have to manage [SPEAKER_03]: food and water and all these other things.

1:46:12 [SPEAKER_03]: But the additional difficulty comes from the storyline being gone and your character does not start out in a vault. [SPEAKER_03]: He wasn't asleep for two hundred years. [SPEAKER_03]: The air is immediately irradiated. [SPEAKER_03]: You have to find, you have to find a gas mask and weaponry.

1:46:31 [SPEAKER_03]: Everything wants to kill you. [SPEAKER_03]: I got one shot by a rad roach. [SPEAKER_03]: Holy crap. [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, there. [SPEAKER_03]: It's insane. [SPEAKER_03]: Um, everything is deadly. [SPEAKER_03]: You can't go to Diamond City. [SPEAKER_03]: It's full of Rangers and it's very militant.

1:46:42 [SPEAKER_03]: So it's very hard to level up. [SPEAKER_03]: It's very hard to find medicines, very hard to find weapons. [SPEAKER_03]: And it's just survival on crack. [SPEAKER_03]: It's so hard. [SPEAKER_03]: But it's a nightmare mode. [SPEAKER_03]: It is nightmare mode. [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, hundred percent.

1:46:52 [SPEAKER_03]: And the heavy dense fog as well. [SPEAKER_03]: And the rad storms are very bad. [SPEAKER_03]: I'm talking fifty plus rads a second. [SPEAKER_03]: And so if you, if you cannot find a gas mask quickly, you're you're ruined. [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_03]: You're ruined. [SPEAKER_03]: So, and we played Permadeath mode on my, yes, on my stream.

1:47:09 [SPEAKER_03]: So it's a lot of fun. [SPEAKER_03]: But we do that and we do like. [SPEAKER_03]: modern weapon mods and things like that. [SPEAKER_03]: So there's a lot of fun. [SPEAKER_07]: That's awesome. [SPEAKER_07]: That's awesome. [SPEAKER_07]: I enjoy modding. [SPEAKER_07]: I enjoy playing all the different Bethesda games.

1:47:21 [SPEAKER_07]: I went through a little phase a few months ago where I was modding the heck out of Skyrim again. [SPEAKER_07]: Sure, because everybody just keeps on making even cooler mods back and out. [SPEAKER_07]: And I always jump back to Fallout four and then mod that some and then play a little bit.

1:47:34 [SPEAKER_07]: And sometimes I stream these things and sometimes I don't because it's more of like a, you know, I do the podcast and things. [SPEAKER_07]: I prefer for living. [SPEAKER_07]: And so it's like, hey, I'm going to just [SPEAKER_07]: mess around with this tonight because this is just what I want to do.

1:47:46 [SPEAKER_07]: And to be able to take that and make it into an engaging community experience. [SPEAKER_07]: Yes, regularly. [SPEAKER_07]: I think what a lot of people who come to streamers don't understand is the amount of work it takes behind the scenes, the amount of like streaming is fun. [SPEAKER_07]: It's, it's a lot better than a lot of jobs I've ever had, you know, kind of thing.

1:48:07 [SPEAKER_07]: But there's the behind the scenes part. [SPEAKER_07]: There's the getting the mods to work together. [SPEAKER_07]: This is the figuring out how is this something my audience is even going to enjoy. [SPEAKER_07]: Right. [SPEAKER_03]: You know, there's all of that. [SPEAKER_03]: You take a lot of time and effort into things that very rarely pan out.

1:48:21 [SPEAKER_03]: But, and it is exhausting. [SPEAKER_03]: You know, because I'm a third year old fitness influencer, which is weird. [SPEAKER_03]: You know, and I have amazing sponsorships and amazing partnerships with companies and other creators. [SPEAKER_03]: And you get a chance to stream with amazing people like like batty streams or one peg or Professor Bromann and these guys are a part of GCX and some of them are even a part of follow for hope specifically and [SPEAKER_03]: getting to stream with these guys is a dream come true.

1:48:53 [SPEAKER_03]: But is your community going to be engaged, right? [SPEAKER_03]: Right. [SPEAKER_03]: Right. [SPEAKER_03]: And it can be exhausting, like I said, but how blessed are you to be tired in a pursuit of your own choosing? [SPEAKER_03]: You know, some people are tired on accident. [SPEAKER_03]: You know, they're being forced into into labor that they have to have to be a part of to pay their bills.

1:49:09 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, and we are blessed to have a community and not just a community, but an audience and [SPEAKER_03]: profitability from that. [SPEAKER_03]: You know, my bills are paid, which is why we do so much for charity, which why I was so happy to be a part of GCS, which happened on accident, my new.

1:49:25 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, a lot of people know this. [SPEAKER_03]: I was going to be here in Orlando, anyway, for my daughter's birthday. [SPEAKER_03]: She wanted to go to Epic Universal. [SPEAKER_03]: And so I was talking to my computer sponsor, a Power GPU shout out those guys, Jesse Martinez. [SPEAKER_03]: And I was like, yeah, here's all my travel coming up.

1:49:40 [SPEAKER_03]: He's like, are you going to GCS? [SPEAKER_03]: And I was like, what the hell is GCS? [SPEAKER_03]: he's like, oh, dude, why don't you talk to to batty or a bromine? [SPEAKER_03]: Cause they're a part of it. [SPEAKER_03]: So I call these guys or my friends. [SPEAKER_03]: And they're like, oh, I don't know why we didn't invite you.

1:49:53 [SPEAKER_03]: Right. [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, we've just been busy with. [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, we didn't even encourage them. [SPEAKER_03]: Like, they're like, yeah, you can come out. [SPEAKER_03]: We'll get you out here and [SPEAKER_03]: Then they were like, hey, would you mind streaming for a couple of hours just for the GCX marathon?

1:50:03 [SPEAKER_03]: It was absolutely. [SPEAKER_03]: I would love that. [SPEAKER_03]: And so it was supposed to be four hours in my garage. [SPEAKER_03]: And then I took an Adderall and had an idea. [SPEAKER_03]: And then we ended up in a bunker in Arkansas, sixty feet underground for forty eight hours. [SPEAKER_03]: It was four days total, one day set up, forty eight hours streaming, one day tear down.

1:50:19 [SPEAKER_03]: Wow. [SPEAKER_03]: And that was incredible, man. [SPEAKER_03]: You get those kinds of experiences when you say yes to things, you know? [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_03]: And that right there is kind of [SPEAKER_03]: social media and streaming and community around that in a nutshell. [SPEAKER_03]: Because if you believe in a cause and you truly, truly have passion for it and people can see that, they will rally around it.

1:50:42 [SPEAKER_03]: And I can't think of a better cause. [SPEAKER_03]: to run into a bunker and lock myself inside for four days out. [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, helping children, helping children and people in need overall, you know. [SPEAKER_03]: So it was incredible experience and some very blessed to be here. [SPEAKER_07]: So one of the things that has been, I've been doing my show for six and a half years now.

1:51:03 [SPEAKER_07]: And as far as I can tell by searching for you can't see numbers, you see numbers for streamers, you see numbers for YouTube videos, but for audio platforms, you know, you can't see numbers, right? [SPEAKER_07]: But my show does show up at the top. [SPEAKER_07]: As far as I know, where the biggest audio focused fall out podcast, elder scrolls podcast, you know, both lorecasts.

1:51:23 [SPEAKER_07]: So we talk a lot about the lore of the world and all of those things. [SPEAKER_07]: And both of those series are extremely tragic and dangerous worlds to live in. [SPEAKER_07]: Yes. [SPEAKER_07]: And yet there's this ironic thing that happens where like your story, they become some sort of [SPEAKER_07]: But reason to live, even though in universe, most likely all of us would be dead.

1:51:45 [SPEAKER_03]: They say that true strength comes from being broken. [SPEAKER_03]: Survivalability, learning to pick yourself back up. [SPEAKER_03]: Surviving and survivability comes from the need to survive. [SPEAKER_03]: And so I think that's where it comes from for me is being in a dark place and then finding myself canonically.

1:52:05 [SPEAKER_03]: and in a lower-wise in that same position where you feel powerless, you feel confused, disoriented, in a place where you don't feel like you belong yet to find your way. [SPEAKER_03]: Right. [SPEAKER_03]: You know, and how do you know you're going the right way in a video game? [SPEAKER_03]: You keep running into bad guys.

1:52:17 [SPEAKER_03]: Right. [SPEAKER_03]: Right. [SPEAKER_03]: And things keep getting different. [SPEAKER_03]: It's too easy, then you're hitting the wrong direction. [SPEAKER_03]: Exactly. [SPEAKER_03]: And that's how you can treat life as well. [SPEAKER_03]: Things are scaring you, if things are difficult or you're worried about something, you're doing the right thing.

1:52:27 [SPEAKER_03]: You know, you're challenging yourself, you're growing, not only yourself, but the people around you. [SPEAKER_03]: Right. [SPEAKER_03]: And so that's something that we focus on a lot as well. [SPEAKER_03]: It's incredible. [SPEAKER_03]: Speaking of the duality of these things, I learned something while I was in the Titan Ranch for the missile silo for the bunker.

1:52:44 [SPEAKER_03]: They have this Air Force patch down there next to the door. [SPEAKER_03]: And the lore here is incredible. [SPEAKER_03]: these missile silos would be manned for twenty four hours. [SPEAKER_03]: And they're air force, you know, airmen military personnel for twenty four hours at a time. [SPEAKER_03]: You go down there and you're with your friends.

1:53:04 [SPEAKER_03]: There's no way you're going to be in a dress uniform or class fees the whole time and like dates tucked in. [SPEAKER_03]: So you're looking at each other like, hey, I'm cool with you. [SPEAKER_03]: You're cool with me. [SPEAKER_03]: Let's get north of a job. [SPEAKER_03]: Right. [SPEAKER_03]: Right.

1:53:14 [SPEAKER_03]: And so somebody has, you know, [SPEAKER_03]: So becomes a big to job of party with a bunch of military guns. [SPEAKER_03]: And somebody's wearing bunny slippers, right? [SPEAKER_03]: But you, you might get that call to turn that key and drop that, that nuke. [SPEAKER_03]: And you in tens or hundreds of millions of lives.

1:53:29 [SPEAKER_03]: And so they're patched. [SPEAKER_03]: It says around the edge and a little artwork on the inside says death where his bunny slippers. [SPEAKER_03]: And if that's not fallout and I'm not so fallout. [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, so serious and yet so silly. [SPEAKER_03]: So silly and time and that that's the thing is is that that's something that I keep running into and that's how I know I'm on the right track.

1:53:47 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, it's like keep running. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: So to continue on that idea, this idea of follow up being a thing that has [SPEAKER_07]: brought people out of dark places has found community in friendship and in general is a very positive thing. [SPEAKER_07]: Yes, and it's something that everyone was surprised about when followed seventy six launched and the community stuck with it is super nice even to this day people like hey try it out for the first time and this you know level three thousand dude and power armor came and gave me a bunch of stuff and they were so nice to me.

1:54:19 [SPEAKER_07]: That is something that I've noticed and going back to the story about having done this for three and a half years is consistent. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: There's something that's consistent about people who are fans of this universe. [SPEAKER_07]: And yet there's a positivity to it.

1:54:33 [SPEAKER_07]: Even though the wasteland is a dark and terrifying place. [SPEAKER_03]: Well, I think what it is. [SPEAKER_03]: And the call of duty community is incredibly toxic, right? [SPEAKER_03]: Sure. [SPEAKER_03]: Because it's it's [SPEAKER_03]: competitive. [SPEAKER_03]: It's competitive. [SPEAKER_03]: It's everyone out for their own example.

1:54:46 [SPEAKER_03]: But all out, survivability is not competitive by nature because we are species of community, right? [SPEAKER_03]: We're heard like creatures and animals. [SPEAKER_03]: So it's all about building that community. [SPEAKER_03]: And so like, hey, I want you to survive. [SPEAKER_03]: So I want you to have these things that are going to help you.

1:55:04 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_03]: And I can reach the same thing when I started in. [SPEAKER_03]: I'm not a big seventy six guy. [SPEAKER_03]: Funny enough, I hopped into a seventy six stream with fall off her hope recently. [SPEAKER_03]: And I was on my way home from Dallas. [SPEAKER_03]: I was doing content for my protein.

1:55:20 [SPEAKER_03]: launch, which was super, super fun. [SPEAKER_03]: But on my way home, I was supposed to be on stream with these guys in time to like do a race and do like a fist fight in your underwear, had to build a character specific way. [SPEAKER_03]: And so I was like, man, I'm rushing home and we stopped at a gas station.

1:55:39 [SPEAKER_03]: Me and my army buddy, who's my videographer, Josh. [SPEAKER_03]: And we pulled into this gas station. [SPEAKER_03]: You went over to McDonald's. [SPEAKER_03]: I got a couple of snacks in there. [SPEAKER_03]: And I go to check out and there's this man laying on the ground. [SPEAKER_03]: Next to cash register and the ladies that are supposed to be checking everybody out are trying to tend to this guy.

1:55:55 [SPEAKER_03]: Well, I'm a registered EMT. [SPEAKER_03]: These are the firemen. [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, and a police officer. [SPEAKER_03]: So I like, hey, let me help out. [SPEAKER_03]: And I have somebody go get Josh, my videographer. [SPEAKER_03]: He gets my med bag out of the car. [SPEAKER_03]: He's I always have like five medical kits with me in my vehicle.

1:56:07 [SPEAKER_03]: And this guy's resting heart rate was like, one twenty eight. [SPEAKER_03]: His blood pressure was one ninety over one sixty. [SPEAKER_03]: And then he died. [SPEAKER_03]: And so we got him back. [SPEAKER_03]: And by the time you left, he was in a little better shape because I have an oxygen tank and nitro and all this stuff.

1:56:24 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_03]: So we got him back and then I finally get to my house and start loading up everything. [SPEAKER_03]: And I'm so late. [SPEAKER_03]: I miss the race. [SPEAKER_03]: I miss half the fights. [SPEAKER_03]: And I didn't have time to like build a character that would fit. [SPEAKER_03]: Sorry, guys.

1:56:38 [SPEAKER_03]: I was busy saving life. [SPEAKER_03]: It was so funny because I go in there and I got to fight wreck it Renee and she's a sweetheart. [SPEAKER_03]: I love her to death, but she was like a level two thousand in some change or whatever. [SPEAKER_03]: I'm a little twenty three twenty eight and I go in that she let me win one round.

1:56:53 [SPEAKER_03]: She's so sweet. [SPEAKER_03]: And I'm saying I'm trying to learn how to fist fight in seventy six and it was just so bad, but it was so much fun too because again in that moment [SPEAKER_03]: The community still came together, right? [SPEAKER_03]: It was so much fun. [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

1:57:06 [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: No, it is pretty amazing. [SPEAKER_07]: What the community does and coming together and the positivity and I don't know. [SPEAKER_07]: It's just it is I'm thankful to be part of all of this to and can have known for years and putting stuff together and just [SPEAKER_07]: It is very, very cool.

1:57:22 [SPEAKER_03]: So in an eye, a very similar in the way that we'll have ideas, we won't tell each other what those ideas are, and then we'll just find out about it later. [SPEAKER_03]: And they just they've never conflicted, which is very, very beneficial. [SPEAKER_03]: But she's even doing audio content and podcasting for how long.

1:57:40 [SPEAKER_03]: The hall or cast launched. [SPEAKER_03]: the January of twenty nineteen so if I can turn the table here sure what was your catalyst though because in my experience starting a podcast you know it either comes with an exuberant amount of confidence right or incredible conviction yeah right yeah and and they they rarely go hand in hand right so I have I have a conviction to make my own pockets [SPEAKER_03]: I don't have the confidence, too.

1:58:08 [SPEAKER_03]: I've always told my followers, if I started a podcast about myself, I would call it just another white guy with a podcast. [SPEAKER_03]: Because the world's got enough of it, right, right, right. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, that my joke. [SPEAKER_07]: So I run the robots ready to podcast network also.

1:58:19 [SPEAKER_07]: Okay. [SPEAKER_07]: And there are people who sign up to be part of the network and oftentimes they don't have an experience doing podcasting. [SPEAKER_07]: Maybe they've dabbled in streaming or videos or something. [SPEAKER_07]: But one of the things that I advise all of them on is, hey, when you start your podcast, when you start your first episode, think about the way you frame it, [SPEAKER_07]: Explain to the us just like in a good YouTube video.

1:58:39 [SPEAKER_07]: Hey, this is what the topic is today. [SPEAKER_07]: Whatever because nobody needs four white guys sitting around the table talking about what they for breakfast for fifteen minutes for the content's dark sack because there's already plenty of shows exactly like so yeah, yeah, so um and I [SPEAKER_07]: Honestly, I don't know.

1:58:56 [SPEAKER_07]: I think everybody kind of has to find their creative outlet and the thing that makes sense for who they are. [SPEAKER_07]: But I think a lot of times audiences define that for us. [SPEAKER_07]: Yes. [SPEAKER_07]: And so my journey was dabbling and all sorts of things throughout the years.

1:59:11 [SPEAKER_07]: I back in like twenty thirteen. [SPEAKER_07]: I was twitch streaming back before it was easy to even make money because people like to send you PayPal money. [SPEAKER_07]: All that kind of stuff. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: Right, and I was building up a stream and gone to a fifty consecutive viewers, which is pretty big back in twenty thirteen, and then lost my job, had to go, and I was like, okay, I can't, I can't devote all this time, because I was streaming in the evenings, right, after work, and all of that.

1:59:33 [SPEAKER_07]: So I didn't really work out, doubled in some YouTube content, and I'm sure my listeners have heard the story before, but [SPEAKER_07]: ended up getting a career in marketing and working my way up from the bottom because I had a non-compete with the other company, which meant I couldn't work in the entire state.

1:59:47 [SPEAKER_07]: So started back at Bob Square One, worked for marketing and startup companies, learned a ton about that stuff. [SPEAKER_07]: And then once that stuff clicked, I was able to apply that to my newest endeavor at the time, which was the fall of Warcast. [SPEAKER_07]: And just understanding, okay, and when you say marketing, most people think advertising.

2:00:07 [SPEAKER_07]: That's just an element. [SPEAKER_07]: It's a small, it's a small element. [SPEAKER_07]: When you're thinking about starting a stream or starting a podcast, you need to identify who is your target audience? [SPEAKER_07]: Is there demand for the thing that you want to make? [SPEAKER_07]: In fact, it's probably better to do the opposite and go, what is their demand for that doesn't exist?

2:00:22 [SPEAKER_07]: Or what is the out there? [SPEAKER_07]: But I could do better. [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, what are you good at? [SPEAKER_07]: What are my good at? [SPEAKER_07]: Well, you're passionate about. [SPEAKER_03]: Right. [SPEAKER_03]: Knowledgeable for it. [SPEAKER_03]: I tell a lot of people, I get people that ask me like, hey, how do I start making content?

2:00:32 [SPEAKER_03]: Because on TikTok is my main platform. [SPEAKER_03]: We just hit four million followers on Instagram. [SPEAKER_03]: We're at one and a half million. [SPEAKER_03]: And people are like, and then happen in a year, mind you. [SPEAKER_03]: I was at seven hundred and fifty followers and I made a million in thirty eight days.

2:00:46 [SPEAKER_03]: So I was on my heels. [SPEAKER_03]: I was a fireman. [SPEAKER_03]: I was a failing paramedic student, not the brightest current in the box, but I caught lightning in a bottle. [SPEAKER_03]: And I ran with it. [SPEAKER_03]: I said, yes. [SPEAKER_03]: That's my biggest thing is you have to say yes.

2:01:01 [SPEAKER_03]: There's the, you know, I was always going to kick myself if I didn't take the opportunity. [SPEAKER_03]: It's great. [SPEAKER_03]: Right. [SPEAKER_03]: Right. [SPEAKER_03]: And I have said a lot of people by leaving my job. [SPEAKER_03]: It was a highly coveted position that I didn't deserve in the first place.

2:01:11 [SPEAKER_03]: Right. [SPEAKER_03]: And I left my job and I started doing this and I treated like it's my full time job. [SPEAKER_03]: Yes, it's my passion. [SPEAKER_03]: You have to. [SPEAKER_07]: When I was doing, I started the fall of the forecast. [SPEAKER_07]: I was recording in the evenings and weekends outside of my regular work.

2:01:25 [SPEAKER_07]: Family kids, all of that stuff. [SPEAKER_07]: And it was one of those things that I was like, I'm going to commit to this. [SPEAKER_07]: I'm going to make sure I get an episode out every week. [SPEAKER_07]: I'm going to do the research. [SPEAKER_07]: I'm going to play the game. [SPEAKER_07]: So I'm going to do what I need to do in order to make it work.

2:01:37 [SPEAKER_07]: And then it started taking off. [SPEAKER_07]: And then I added another show. [SPEAKER_07]: And then I added another show. [SPEAKER_03]: A lot of the, a lot of the mistakes I see from people who start either podcasting or they make their content creation, whatever that may look like. [SPEAKER_03]: Is the same mistake that I made in the beginning, because I used to make content before I became the kind of man that I am now, but it was always like the really cringey stuff.

2:01:59 [SPEAKER_03]: I don't know if I can curse on your podcast. [SPEAKER_03]: The really cringey stuff where it's like the low light flexing videos were like, look how tough I am, like I'm quite my deems in the dark. [SPEAKER_03]: Nobody cares. [SPEAKER_03]: I just thought, right, that man asked me to [SPEAKER_03]: Right, right, but in your one of thousands of people who probably is exactly and that's the thing is I was doing it for me because I wanted to be accepted and liked and people to revere like my muscles or whatever the ego was in the front of everything Yeah, and I learned I learned to let go of that and started making content with the vein of what am I providing to make community rights by giving right what am I knowledgeable enough to give right

2:02:35 [SPEAKER_03]: And so that became the mental health aspect, it became nutrition, it became physical fitness and mental fortitude. [SPEAKER_03]: And that right there skyrocketed not only the content but the community, because there was a demand for it. [SPEAKER_03]: Because you're thinking about others before yourself.

2:02:53 [SPEAKER_03]: Exactly. [SPEAKER_03]: And there was something I will give to the fire department for what they taught me. [SPEAKER_03]: It's called the IM-third rule, right? [SPEAKER_03]: The first [SPEAKER_03]: on your priority list are the people who called on you. [SPEAKER_03]: The people who need you, the people who need help.

2:03:07 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_03]: The second are the man and women's here left and right. [SPEAKER_03]: And you are third. [SPEAKER_03]: If there's anything left in the tank, you can save yourself. [SPEAKER_03]: People in your team and then you're exactly it. [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_03]: And so that's how I've been trying to push myself forward every day is I am third.

2:03:22 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, that's great. [SPEAKER_07]: That's a great attitude. [SPEAKER_07]: And I think that will lend you survivability in the wasteland. [SPEAKER_07]: This is, I need to wrap up soon because I've got another interview scheduled. [SPEAKER_07]: But this is one of those things that I'd fight with the community wouldn't be the right way to say it.

2:03:36 [SPEAKER_07]: And one of the things I disagree with the greater community often. [SPEAKER_07]: Other people, not, not the people who tend to listen to my content. [SPEAKER_07]: But the people who post negative comments on your videos and those kinds of things, [SPEAKER_07]: For example, I did an episode recently about how House from New Vegas is in fact a villain.

2:03:55 [SPEAKER_07]: And I went through this is traditionally in literature in history, how we define villains. [SPEAKER_07]: These are his qualities that match that. [SPEAKER_07]: So therefore, even if he has good qualities, he's still a villain. [SPEAKER_07]: by definition and I went through this explanation and of course created a video out of that episode which is what I do with some of my episodes and of course the trolls come out and they start commenting but the majority of the sentiment against that was either well you got the lore wrong or some sort of they're picking something yeah or more likely this idea that well it's the wasteland so morals go out the window [SPEAKER_07]: Because it's all everyone for themselves.

2:04:30 [SPEAKER_07]: And you and I don't believe that. [SPEAKER_07]: If you're going to survive in the wasteland, it's not going to be because you're looking out for yourself and it's not going to be because you're just going to hook up with whoever's the most powerful leader who's available. [SPEAKER_06]: Yeah.

2:04:41 [SPEAKER_07]: It's going to be because you build a community who cares about each other. [SPEAKER_07]: Yes. [SPEAKER_07]: Who goes out of their way in order to make sure that the group survives, which is actually more in line with history, [SPEAKER_07]: Yes. [SPEAKER_07]: And the way that human beings throughout our entire existence have survived.

2:04:56 [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_07]: Because at any point, if you decide to go with a loan and even a terrible situation, you're not going to make it. [SPEAKER_03]: Well, what do they say? [SPEAKER_03]: You want to go fast, go alone, you want to go far, go together. [SPEAKER_03]: Right. [SPEAKER_03]: Right.

2:05:06 [SPEAKER_03]: Right. [SPEAKER_03]: So, yeah. [SPEAKER_03]: So, totally on the same wavelength there. [SPEAKER_07]: And also, it's been very nice getting to meet you. [SPEAKER_07]: Like the Chilean, hearing your story and all of this. [SPEAKER_07]: And I'm Charlie around and check out your booth. [SPEAKER_07]: For the listeners, we just shook hands.

2:05:19 [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, we're just, we're physically doing things in real meat space rather than over the internet, which is weird. [SPEAKER_07]: For people who want to get ahold of your stuff, what's the best way to do that? [SPEAKER_03]: So I'm Scottie K. Fitness on all platforms. [SPEAKER_03]: I also own fault line project, which I run my fault line fitness company through, and my fault line apparel company through.