Emily and Richard/Blair and Chuck

0:00 [SPEAKER_02]: 5, 6, 7, 8, gossip girl, we're going to talk about girls, you love me, you're all exo, exo, go more sales. [SPEAKER_02]: All right, here we go. [SPEAKER_02]: Hi, everybody. [SPEAKER_02]: Welcome back to go more to say with Tara and Haley. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm Tara. [SPEAKER_02]: This is Haley.

0:20 [SPEAKER_02]: Hi, Haley. [SPEAKER_02]: Hi, Tara. [SPEAKER_02]: Hi. [SPEAKER_00]: Thank you. [SPEAKER_02]: It's my first Gilmour to say birthday episode on my birthday last year was yours. [SPEAKER_02]: This year is mine I love it. [SPEAKER_00]: I love birthday week. [SPEAKER_00]: It's so fun. [SPEAKER_00]: What is that from last year?

0:37 [SPEAKER_00]: And this year is me out last year He was the editor this year. [SPEAKER_00]: I am last year. [SPEAKER_00]: He was leaving with the editor this year. [SPEAKER_00]: I am so that's the way you said [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, it was so unintentional on my love. [SPEAKER_00]: I love it. [SPEAKER_00]: I love it.

0:51 [SPEAKER_00]: Are you doing anything special? [SPEAKER_00]: Anything fun for 34? [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, three, four, one, two, three, four. [SPEAKER_00]: Exactly. [SPEAKER_02]: That is famously how the numbers go famously. [SPEAKER_02]: We're going to love doing anything for my 34th birthday. [SPEAKER_02]: I don't really have any plans admittedly.

1:08 [SPEAKER_02]: The only thing that I think we're going to do is go play trivia, which I'm really excited about. [SPEAKER_02]: Actually, I do have a really fun plan of all it is going to go as expected, as you're going to be on the plane here. [SPEAKER_00]: Oh my gosh, that's so true. [SPEAKER_00]: I'm What do you about to say you yeah?

1:26 [SPEAKER_00]: I also have plans for your birthday. [SPEAKER_00]: I might be going there. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, if all goes according to play on Okay, I'm gonna be on a plane when some people listen to this coming to New York City [SPEAKER_00]: You're so right. [SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to go to trivia y'all.

1:38 [SPEAKER_00]: I'm so excited. [SPEAKER_00]: I know. [SPEAKER_00]: Listen, I'm on the trivia team. [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know if you guys know this, but Tara cheats every week. [SPEAKER_00]: No, but it's because I'm I'm the long-distance trivia member. [SPEAKER_00]: And so sometimes I get a little text, be like, hey, these are about Taylor Swift.

1:56 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it's almost one time. [SPEAKER_00]: It was not crazy. [SPEAKER_02]: Not any. [SPEAKER_02]: I was going to say sometimes it's about books. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, which is where one time I'm going to show up strong for us. [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, I'm ready. [SPEAKER_00]: If it's romance. [SPEAKER_00]: Otherwise, just, if I get married.

2:08 [SPEAKER_00]: No, I know. [SPEAKER_00]: You might know stuff. [SPEAKER_00]: I might know. [SPEAKER_00]: But there was one time when Brett was doing it and you were with me and it was like, Georgia facts and I was like, what are the odds that you're in Georgia and they're doing Georgia? [SPEAKER_00]: I know.

2:19 [SPEAKER_00]: So funny. [SPEAKER_00]: I'm excited to finally be in person and just realize that it's like that episode of the office when that one team does really, really well. [SPEAKER_00]: And it just so happened that like all the trivia was like curated to them. [SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to like, [SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely destroy your team.

2:34 [SPEAKER_00]: Like we are not going to do well. [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not going to be well. [SPEAKER_00]: Who knows? [SPEAKER_02]: It'll be a magic break. [SPEAKER_02]: Listen, either way, we're going to have a good time. [SPEAKER_02]: And that's really all the matters. [SPEAKER_02]: We're just there to have a good time.

2:42 [SPEAKER_02]: If we win, it's just gravy. [SPEAKER_02]: You know? [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_00]: Famously, we're just here to have a good time. [SPEAKER_00]: We're just here to have fun. [SPEAKER_00]: You know what? [SPEAKER_00]: You know what? [SPEAKER_00]: You know what? [SPEAKER_00]: I'm excited about it.

2:48 [SPEAKER_00]: It's almost so excited because I get to meet Nancy and she's so excited to be here. [SPEAKER_00]: She's so excited to meet you. [SPEAKER_02]: I told her I was like, you know, for my birthday, we're just going to my plan. [SPEAKER_02]: It's just to go out and do some trivia. [SPEAKER_02]: But I think Hayley's going to be coming here and she was like, [SPEAKER_02]: I get to me, Haley, so I'm so excited.

3:05 [SPEAKER_01]: And she's like a son of them. [SPEAKER_02]: She has a son of them. [SPEAKER_02]: She totally is. [SPEAKER_02]: And maybe they'll bring the puppies. [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know, and I don't know what the problem is. [SPEAKER_02]: But okay, don't make puppy promises. [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know if I want to make puppy promises.

3:14 [SPEAKER_02]: But you get to me Emily, who runs trivia, who I absolutely adore. [SPEAKER_02]: And like just me, people I've talked about for years and Gerardo and I think you're going to lunch with it. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm really excited about, and I told him that you were potentially coming as well. [SPEAKER_02]: Maybe I am too far to figure it out.

3:34 [SPEAKER_02]: I think if he knows you're coming, he'll definitely come Not that I'm not a lot of blood. [SPEAKER_02]: We're definitely He asked me last night. [SPEAKER_02]: He texted me and was like okay, what are you doing for the birthday and I was like I don't really have any plans This is the first year.

3:46 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't really have any plans [SPEAKER_02]: It's on a Tuesday, it's kind of tough because a lot of my Broadway friends have shows where I'm going to be in tech, so I don't even think he's going to be able to make it to trivia. [SPEAKER_02]: So, you know, my mom is coming in later that week because we're going to tour our wedding venue and she hasn't seen it yet.

4:03 [SPEAKER_02]: So it's like, I told her, I said, you don't have to come in twice that week if you don't want to. [SPEAKER_02]: I would love to see you. [SPEAKER_02]: It's like our tradition to spend my birthday together. [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, like, she's the first person I ever met. [SPEAKER_02]: Um, first time we met.

4:13 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it's very important for both of us. [SPEAKER_02]: So I love when she comes in and we get lunch. [SPEAKER_02]: So maybe she'll come in. [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know. [SPEAKER_02]: It's very catch this year, which I'm excited about because, you know, there's so much happening. [SPEAKER_02]: We're moving.

4:25 [SPEAKER_02]: Scarlet is going to be. [SPEAKER_02]: She's doing any day now. [SPEAKER_00]: We love Tara here on this podcast. [SPEAKER_00]: We do like it's one of our one of our favorite people here on the podcast But it wasn't the reason why it's going to New York potentially There's another reason.

4:50 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, we'll see if you guys on our Instagram because I think that you guys will be very just close your eyes Just close your eyes Yeah, because if what is happening is actually happening. [SPEAKER_02]: It's going to be huge. [SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to be sick. [SPEAKER_00]: I know you are going to be sick [SPEAKER_00]: because I'm too excited.

5:07 [SPEAKER_00]: I want to tap, then I'm excited. [SPEAKER_00]: And hopefully next time I want to tap and so bad, I want to die. [SPEAKER_00]: But like I also, it cannot happen at all. [SPEAKER_00]: That's true. [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, I was going to say, hopefully next episode, we can tell you, but we're recording that later this week.

5:18 [SPEAKER_02]: So that's actually not factual. [SPEAKER_00]: you will know but you guys will know if you follow us on Instagram you will know you will know right is you won't even have to hear about it no you'll know you'll know you'll feel it yeah oh yeah I feel like such a tease but just wait stay tuned stay tuned stay vigilant I got you just talking about it I felt my heart rate go [SPEAKER_02]: It's an exciting thing, but anyway, we have to stop talking about it because I hate what we have to do like, we have this exciting thing.

5:49 [SPEAKER_00]: We have to do exciting things. [SPEAKER_00]: No, but we genuinely can't. [SPEAKER_00]: We've been told not to. [SPEAKER_00]: We've been sworn down. [SPEAKER_00]: So it doesn't have anything to do with gummark rolls either. [SPEAKER_00]: Yes, you know what, let's just give it up. [SPEAKER_00]: Nothing with Gilmore girls.

6:01 [SPEAKER_00]: Nothing to do with Gilmore girls because I feel like we just like primed that we were going to like be a part of then Gilmore girls Christmas special. [SPEAKER_00]: No. [SPEAKER_00]: No, not for sure happening, but that is what we're talking about next week, which I'm really excited. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes.

6:25 [SPEAKER_02]: Haley and I are the consulting beef service on and watching it very differently. [SPEAKER_00]: Very different pieces. [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not even finished season one. [SPEAKER_00]: I want season 17. [SPEAKER_00]: But as Tara was saying, working with the producers on a gossip go podcast. [SPEAKER_00]: If you guys ever listen to pretty little podcast with Phoebe and Caroline Caroline and Phoebe Whichever way they want to say it.

6:45 [SPEAKER_00]: Which they say it. [SPEAKER_00]: Thank you. [SPEAKER_00]: Caroline and Phoebe. [SPEAKER_00]: It's off-Bedagolia. [SPEAKER_00]: Okay. [SPEAKER_00]: Well ours isn't so I don't know [SPEAKER_02]: Um, but we always say it's nice to end with an EY or with an E sound. [SPEAKER_02]: So Carolina VB.

7:00 [SPEAKER_00]: Turn, hey, um, but they are reb, they've re-randed to your one and only source because they're covering gossip girl. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, which is of course why we're watching it. [SPEAKER_00]: Um, and then we thought it would be fun, or our little girl Tara little girl. [SPEAKER_00]: I'm gonna say a little girl.

7:14 [SPEAKER_00]: Got Tara. [SPEAKER_00]: I thought it would be fun to bring a girl more to watch back because yeah, that episode was so much fun, like you knocked it out of the park with Sarah. [SPEAKER_02]: Thank you. [SPEAKER_02]: That was so that's so generous of you to say, because I, I had a great time, but also was like, am I doing this right?

7:30 [SPEAKER_00]: hoping that this there's really no way to do it wrong other not do it at all that's true that is it was so much fun and I really wanted you to come back and do it again I actually listened to it on an airplane you did yeah for that one day where I like got on the plane got off the plane the plane went to another gate like that whole thing that you and Sarah were keeping me company [SPEAKER_00]: I do remember that good time.

7:54 [SPEAKER_00]: But I felt like it was time to bring a Gilmour to watch. [SPEAKER_00]: So we decided to do it for your birthday. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_00]: We wanted to, or not, we, you and Caroline felt like Gilmour girls in gossip girl had a lot of crossover, which it does. [SPEAKER_00]: So it's even a Gilmour girl's reference in gossip.

8:08 [SPEAKER_02]: There is. [SPEAKER_02]: I love that Gilmour girls exist in the world of gossip girl. [SPEAKER_02]: I love the player world or if watch is it. [SPEAKER_02]: And gets herself ready primed and ready to go to Yale. [SPEAKER_02]: But if you guys are not familiar with the show, [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know how much you're gonna appreciate it, but you might really appreciate it.

8:24 [SPEAKER_02]: It is going to be spoiler fall. [SPEAKER_00]: Like, you were going to, you know, one in Gamma Girls, you guys already. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_00]: You're already here for Gamma Girls. [SPEAKER_02]: But Burgasa Girl, if you haven't seen the entire show, maybe hold off, it's, we are going to talk about.

8:38 [SPEAKER_02]: If you don't care about spoilers, I mean, the show's been out for, you know, 15, but here. [SPEAKER_00]: So someone commented spoiler on a real I made recently. [SPEAKER_00]: I don't remember if it was go more to reader, go more to say. [SPEAKER_00]: And I was like, I just ignored it because I was like, girl, the show has been out.

8:54 [SPEAKER_00]: So old for a long time. [SPEAKER_00]: This car, the show can rent a car. [SPEAKER_02]: literally the shits and if well they have to spoil and learn so I'm sorry we're not issuing spoiler alerts anymore No, but I will forgot some girl just because you know I don't want to tease this not about exactly.

9:10 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't want to tease [SPEAKER_02]: You know, chatting about gossip girl because when I did go more to watch with Sarah Lambert from what I can remember about Jenny and Georgia, I don't think we necessarily gave away any like deep spoilers about the show, I think we compare it a lot of the characters which is what I'm about to do in this episode with Caroline.

9:29 [SPEAKER_02]: Who I think you guys are just going to absolutely love. [SPEAKER_00]: She is fairly new and Phoebe are fantastic. [SPEAKER_02]: Well, they're wonderful. [SPEAKER_02]: And they're sisters, they have this podcast. [SPEAKER_02]: You've heard us talk about pretty little podcasts. [SPEAKER_02]: But it was really fun to do the show, to do this episode with Caroline, because she's just such a hoot and she's so easy to talk to.

9:46 [SPEAKER_02]: And we had a great time. [SPEAKER_02]: So I'm excited for you to listen to it too, because I know you're also a big cast girlfriend. [SPEAKER_01]: Yes. [SPEAKER_02]: I think you're really, I really want to know. [SPEAKER_00]: How you feel about the comparisons we make and if you have different opinions and maybe we can chat about that in another episode because Yeah, maybe in the in a future episode and like maybe future GTC will start with some some Haley thoughts on gosh heroin interest.

10:13 [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I could be a lot of fun because like this is another show for me that was like [SPEAKER_00]: It's like the three-inch formative. [SPEAKER_00]: Go more girls, gossip girl, Grey's Anatomy. [SPEAKER_00]: Like those were my shows. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_00]: And gossip girl for sure, because like Blair was just like very formative for me.

10:28 [SPEAKER_00]: Unfortunately. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it was a girl. [SPEAKER_01]: Like the two, she was like, oh. [SPEAKER_00]: Because, well, I was wearing headbands in middle school. [SPEAKER_00]: And then gossip girl started and Blair was wearing headbands. [SPEAKER_00]: And everyone was like, Hailey wears headbands because of Blair Waldorf.

10:41 [SPEAKER_00]: And I was like, you guys better fucking shut up. [SPEAKER_00]: I got this first. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_00]: I secretly update this. [SPEAKER_02]: Me. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's inspired by me they came to my school and saw me. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, absolutely. [SPEAKER_00]: And like the episode Roman holiday where it's Christmas and Blair has that red Valentino, like Pat and Leather, shiny bag and she has those giant candy canes for her and her dad.

11:03 [SPEAKER_00]: That is just like lived rent free in my mind since that episode aired. [SPEAKER_00]: That was probably like my most watched episode because of course I had like the box up for those. [SPEAKER_00]: Like I watched it literally all the time and I would like literally looked up how much a Valentino red bag would be at What the right age of like whatever teenage AJ was and I was like, oh, and you were like, that was not that's not me Oh, we go into the TJ Max exactly.

11:30 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm getting a dupe one hundred percent. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, no, she's such a great line And what I said to Caroline is like despite the fact that a lot of the parts of the show are [SPEAKER_02]: kind of the antithesis of small-town Connecticut. [SPEAKER_01]: This show is treated like a small town within a big city.

11:46 [SPEAKER_01]: And that's what I think, that's one of the many comparisons. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, that you can make to the show. [SPEAKER_02]: And we draw a lot of comparisons. [SPEAKER_02]: We didn't have time to really get into the scenario comparisons, but we talked a lot about the relationships, the characters.

12:00 [SPEAKER_02]: and our love for the show and I'm really excited for you and the rest of our listeners too. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, for us to kind of do a little debrief about it afterwards. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, but the reason I brought up the Christmas special is because of course, at the end it's going to end with me and Caroline and we're not going to have our MLA more to say on that.

12:17 [SPEAKER_02]: In the next episode, it's sent off as we normally do. [SPEAKER_02]: So this week is all gossip girl and next week we're going to be having a little episode about a potential Christmas special that has been through the rumor mill in the Gilmore Girls world for the last couple months. [SPEAKER_00]: Well, the rumor mill, it was it was Ms. Lauren Graham, our darling darling Lauren Graham when she was at the Emmys on the red carpet, she was the one that suggested a Christmas special.

12:42 [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, I know, but do it, do it. [SPEAKER_00]: So we thought we might imagine it before they do it next year. [SPEAKER_00]: Which they built, right? [SPEAKER_00]: I was thinking that we're going to say that out loud. [SPEAKER_00]: I know. [SPEAKER_00]: And something like that to the public.

12:56 [SPEAKER_02]: And her and Kelly and Amy, like, come on. [SPEAKER_02]: No, I agree. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm very intrigued to see if it actually comes to fruition, but we wanted to dream up some scenarios that we think could be really fun for the Christmas special. [SPEAKER_02]: Now that we're about, [SPEAKER_02]: Nine years removed from the life and even more so bye from [SPEAKER_02]: the series finale so I'm really excited to bring that up with you but before we do that let's talk a little gossip girl again more girls a little g g g g g with Caroline g g g you're one of the [SPEAKER_05]: Caroline, hi, you're here.

13:43 [SPEAKER_05]: Oh my god, this is finally on the mic together. [SPEAKER_05]: This is long over to it honestly. [SPEAKER_05]: Dangerous, obviously. [SPEAKER_05]: They can't give us a podcast together because it'll be way too much. [SPEAKER_05]: No, we'll never show the podcast together. [SPEAKER_05]: It's just called the voice no.

13:56 [SPEAKER_05]: It's true. [SPEAKER_02]: It's just on your voice memos back and forth to each other. [SPEAKER_02]: We're like, sorry, this is a podcast. [SPEAKER_02]: And then we remember where podcasters. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, we're actually totally fine with that. [SPEAKER_05]: It's what we, I mean, sister, it's what we do.

14:07 [SPEAKER_05]: It's what we do. [SPEAKER_02]: Absolutely. [SPEAKER_02]: Which on that topic, you are just at the beginning of your journey of a gossip girl podcast with your sister sleeping in the air and that's a hard talk a little bit about today. [SPEAKER_05]: I'm so excited. [SPEAKER_05]: I know. [SPEAKER_05]: it's crazy because you're talking about like obviously we started with pretty little liars now we're doing gossip girl and it really feels like we just graduated sort of like the metropolitan mature older sister of little liars, you know, total lot of similarities there, but I'm excited to get into the similarities between gossip girl and Gilmour girl.

14:42 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my god, the two GGs, I literally have like a whole what you can see this. [SPEAKER_02]: I like wanted it to, I wanted the element of surprise to be [SPEAKER_02]: It's no it's I'm like you need to calm down Tara If I know anything about you it's true. [SPEAKER_05]: It's beautiful. [SPEAKER_05]: It's a thank you man.

15:02 [SPEAKER_05]: It's very thorough Or really trying to be yeah, I was nervous because I was like I in my mind like I'm an expert on gossip girl like I've watched it a million times But like there's a different there's a difference between being an expert on a show and being like Tara and Haley level of an expert on a show [SPEAKER_02]: you know what I mean?

15:20 [SPEAKER_02]: Some of that is because we do the podcast, right? [SPEAKER_02]: Like I didn't about how much I knew about Gilmore girls because that was just like years in the making. [SPEAKER_02]: And then I think about how much I know now because we do the podcast and it's just like, you know, you have to know a lot about the show where you just learn a lot and discover a lot about the show and I've learned so much from Haley and and [SPEAKER_02]: she me.

15:43 [SPEAKER_02]: So it's it truly I think that by the time you guys are at the end of your rewatches which is going to be years from now. [SPEAKER_05]: Yes. [SPEAKER_02]: I think that you are going to feel like a gossip girl expert, like even more than you now. [SPEAKER_05]: I know, I really, even just going through like we just did the pilot and going through that, which we've already recapped together because we did it on our Patreon like years ago.

16:05 [SPEAKER_05]: But this time getting into it, like, it's just watching the show in a whole new light. [SPEAKER_05]: And you know, when you're doing like the recap episodes, it's like, you're getting beat for be just noticing things you didn't notice and then hearing like someone else's perspective and what they bring to it and really diving in.

16:22 [SPEAKER_05]: So it just made me so excited to like keep. [SPEAKER_05]: going through it with with new eyes, you know? [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, yeah, same. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm so excited to listen. [SPEAKER_02]: So rewinding for a second. [SPEAKER_02]: I know we've already kind of gotten into it, but tell the folks at home who might not know about your podcast, all about pretty little podcast, who you and CBR, and how you decided to, you know, transition from pretty little iris to gossip girl.

16:47 [SPEAKER_05]: Okay, so I'm Caroline. [SPEAKER_05]: My sister is Phoebe and we are the co-hosts. [SPEAKER_05]: Formerly, the pretty little podcast, now you're one and only source and excellent. [SPEAKER_05]: I feel, well, thank you so much. [SPEAKER_05]: We had help from the best. [SPEAKER_05]: I mean and that is one thing like we had to be so careful and if any of you guys do listen to our podcast Which it is so fun to find out that there's crossover like we just had someone message us on TikTok and they were like Just sending like a random video and then I responded and they were like by the way like we I love realizing that they're like you and the Gilmour to say girls No, each other.

17:22 [SPEAKER_05]: It's like I was gliding was like, well, if you like that Just stay tuned Yeah, but I feel like a lot of people found our podcast [SPEAKER_05]: through some high drama, which is actually how Tara and I met as well, we call it name gate, but back in June, June 24, you know, you may remember everyone that there are two former pretty little Liars stars who started their own pretty little podcast with that name and some of our road warriors as we affectionately call their listeners, you know, got [SPEAKER_05]: on that quick.

17:55 [SPEAKER_05]: They were like, I don't think so. [SPEAKER_05]: There's already a podcast with this name and they really kind of started the battle and then and then it was it was out of our hands from there and and we ended up getting really lucky and getting to keep our name. [SPEAKER_05]: But that is how a lot of people found us and looking back were like that is the best thing that ever.

18:12 [SPEAKER_02]: into our shows. [SPEAKER_02]: Isn't that easy? [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: That's a big deal. [SPEAKER_02]: So catastrophic. [SPEAKER_02]: I actually, in fact, was something so good for you guys. [SPEAKER_02]: It was. [SPEAKER_02]: It was exposure. [SPEAKER_05]: The best thing. [SPEAKER_05]: And you know, it brought a lot of eyes to our recaps.

18:25 [SPEAKER_05]: And one thing that I knew going into that is like, I was really confident in our recapping ability. [SPEAKER_05]: I wasn't worried about all these new people finding our show and being like, oh, we'll just let the stars have the the name because they're going to do this really great podcast.

18:39 [SPEAKER_05]: Like, I knew we really have something great and even having all these new people find it was like, great for reinforcing that idea and so the way that our recaps sort of took. [SPEAKER_05]: life like with our sister lore and our family lore and our world building and our relationship like it just really blossomed into something so awesome that there was no way we could stop when it was over and that moment kind of like gave us the confidence to like really keep plowing forward and because of that we needed to be really careful about the name.

19:11 [SPEAKER_05]: We were like a first of all if we change our name people are going to be like all that. [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, all that. [SPEAKER_05]: And now we're changing the name. [SPEAKER_05]: You know, you could change the name. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: Right. [SPEAKER_02]: No, but they don't care.

19:21 [SPEAKER_02]: You can't call yourself the pretty little podcast and recap. [SPEAKER_02]: We got a girl podcast. [SPEAKER_05]: We got a girl podcast exactly like it. [SPEAKER_05]: And the truth is, like, we didn't even love the name. [SPEAKER_05]: Like we, it was just like the name, you know. [SPEAKER_02]: Uh-huh.

19:32 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, but it's also, it was more of the principle. [SPEAKER_02]: It wasn't about whether or not you were going to change your name. [SPEAKER_02]: Also that podcast, those other two people were doing. [SPEAKER_05]: No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no [SPEAKER_02]: And now we're doing gossip girl and That was kind of a way word way of explaining everything, but you get to know it and you guys are called You're one and only source which was also the name of another podcast and you reach out to that was the former podcasters Because they haven't done it since like yeah, this was all about the reboot of gossip girl.

20:15 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, you just know they never touch it [SPEAKER_05]: yeah exactly and like we went through like multiple names that we were interested in and then you know all takes us one quick little google search and we found that there were existing podcasts or you know recent podcasts that were in the gossip girl realm or not that were using these names and not something we wanted to touch obviously so when we decided on your word and only source we found that there was this gossip girl reboot podcasts but they weren't active for [SPEAKER_05]: Four years.

20:42 [SPEAKER_05]: Well years. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, but they did have the Instagram handle and so I reached out to them had like an awesome conversation The host was so nice. [SPEAKER_05]: She was like she was so excited. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, she was like we're so excited like past the torch on to you Take the handle like we're just excited.

20:58 [SPEAKER_05]: It's going to like another gossip girl fan like she was so nice And I was like, and not it's how it's done. [SPEAKER_05]: That is how you do it. [SPEAKER_05]: That is how it's different. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, literally you guys did the right thing You took the proper channels like yeah [SPEAKER_02]: That's how it was.

21:10 [SPEAKER_05]: And there was a risk. [SPEAKER_05]: I was like, oh my god, they're going to come back and be like, oh no, because yeah, I know. [SPEAKER_05]: I would have said to do the people who wanted our name, but no, no, absolutely, well, it was different. [SPEAKER_02]: You guys were an active podcast.

21:22 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: Also, I think one of the reasons that I was drawn to you when I saw your video on TikTok is, I mean, because I think you and I are very similar in general and I could tell by the everything about you when I saw you online. [SPEAKER_02]: Um, but I also was just taken by everything you explained having gone through and having built over those two years that you guys have been active because this was in what like April of 24 you started pretty little podcast in April of 22 so it was like you spent two years.

21:52 [SPEAKER_02]: building organically from the ground up a show, and that came with a patreon that came with March, and who understands that better than the girls over at Gilmortissa? [SPEAKER_05]: Exactly. [SPEAKER_05]: I'm like, so totally just get it, and it's, I mean, yeah, because they just wouldn't have been the same experience.

22:08 [SPEAKER_05]: Like, for them, they could have chosen any name. [SPEAKER_05]: They knew they were going to have a successful podcast when you come into it, and you each have a million followers. [SPEAKER_05]: It's just a completely different ballgame, you know, so totally that's something like seeing that end up in a podcaster and being like, No, this is a passion project, but it's also something we've put a ton of blood sweat and tears into.

22:27 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, and we're not sure if it would be like side swept by. [SPEAKER_05]: Right, exactly. [SPEAKER_02]: you guys either not doing your research or not caring that we had the same name and so subsequently when you know we as a group kind of decided on your one and only source it was like well let's reach out to them let's see if we have their blessing we're not going to do with those other people did right he did mostly because it wasn't active anymore you guys were in active independently produced podcast [SPEAKER_02]: So I love a full circle moment.

22:54 [SPEAKER_02]: I love that you and Phoebe have arrived at the next chapter of your podcast together because you guys are so good at it. [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, not only did I become a fan of you, I became a fan of your show and your dynamic with Phoebe, which is why we are now consulting producers on the, [SPEAKER_02]: on your podcast and like it just all it all came together so beautifully.

23:11 [SPEAKER_05]: It's really because it all happened the way it's supposed to like it's crazy to imagine that like if that had not happened, you and I would not have the friendship we have. [SPEAKER_05]: I literally feel like I've known you forever. [SPEAKER_05]: Like it doesn't feel like we met a year ago, but no, I know which is crazy almost years.

23:28 [SPEAKER_02]: I know I was thinking about that today as I was like prepping mentally for the episode. [SPEAKER_02]: I was like, [SPEAKER_02]: because I Carolina and I have known each other forever but that is how I think you make friends as an adult. [SPEAKER_02]: It's like you already have plenty of friends.

23:37 [SPEAKER_02]: The ones that speak in there are the ones that you're like, I feel like I've known you for a hundred years. [SPEAKER_05]: Come on, come on, and exactly exactly. [SPEAKER_02]: So that's a little bit of the lore on your show. [SPEAKER_02]: So you guys are at this point this is airing on my birthday next week.

23:50 [SPEAKER_02]: So you'll have been two or three episodes and because you started on Thanksgiving, you dropped the first episode of your one and only source. [SPEAKER_02]: part of episode on Thanksgiving, which is so fitting because gossip girl is a Thanksgiving show. [SPEAKER_05]: It is the Thanksgiving show.

24:04 [SPEAKER_05]: I 100% agree. [SPEAKER_05]: It's, it's, it's great. [SPEAKER_05]: We kind of went from like a Halloween style show, which we think is going to be Christmas, who's just there. [SPEAKER_05]: Exactly, who's just [SPEAKER_02]: I love. [SPEAKER_02]: So before we get into the gossip girl of it all, this is of course a Gilmore Girls podcast.

24:21 [SPEAKER_02]: You love Gilmore Girls. [SPEAKER_02]: You actually knew about our podcast before I met you. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I think I'm here for telling you. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, so funny. [SPEAKER_05]: Yes, absolutely. [SPEAKER_02]: And who's also a Gilmore fan, which is great. [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, yes.

24:35 [SPEAKER_05]: But like it is. [SPEAKER_04]: My husband's got one all there ever was. [SPEAKER_04]: No, literally. [SPEAKER_05]: And it's like, okay, great back. [SPEAKER_05]: Like, you know what I mean? [SPEAKER_05]: It's like literally non-ferencing straight man loves going work girls. [SPEAKER_05]: Could like, when we first started dating and I didn't know him as well, yeah.

24:51 [SPEAKER_05]: Like, he frequently would be like, oh my god, this happened to my friend once. [SPEAKER_05]: And he would start telling me like a story. [SPEAKER_05]: He would be like, yeah, like there was this crazy moment where like her mom and I take her to school and she wore these cowboy boots and like, you know, she'd make up like some random story, you know?

25:03 [SPEAKER_05]: And I'd be like, [SPEAKER_05]: Why, like, that's crazy. [SPEAKER_05]: And you've been like, yeah, it's my friend Laura Lie. [SPEAKER_05]: And I'd be like, is this a Gilmore girls plot line? [SPEAKER_05]: And he would, yes. [SPEAKER_05]: And it was so, now I can, like, wreck, I'm like, and that's a Gilmore girls plot line.

25:14 [SPEAKER_02]: You better shop it. [SPEAKER_05]: I don't get more girls. [SPEAKER_05]: Yes, I know that they're your friends. [SPEAKER_02]: But I... [SPEAKER_02]: I need you to be honest with me. [SPEAKER_05]: Do you know what I'm saying? [SPEAKER_05]: Exactly. [SPEAKER_05]: Do you actually know these people?

25:23 [SPEAKER_05]: I know. [SPEAKER_05]: And it's just like his ultimate comfort show, which I think is so sweet. [SPEAKER_05]: And he has a Gilmour to say the coffee cup, the coffee culture tea, and that's like your lips and right. [SPEAKER_02]: All together. [SPEAKER_02]: My head, I leave. [SPEAKER_05]: He packs it on.

25:36 [SPEAKER_05]: I reach up and go on. [SPEAKER_05]: It's like a favorite shirt. [SPEAKER_05]: So yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: We are a Gilmour girls stand household as well. [SPEAKER_05]: And he loves glass of girl. [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, perfect. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I just did a watch together. [SPEAKER_05]: What team are you on?

25:50 [SPEAKER_05]: For Gilmore girls. [SPEAKER_05]: Well, I'm like, I got to like lower my voice because if I don't say the right answer here, but like it's got to be team dress for me. [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, and I know that girl over here that, yeah, I mean, realistically, like, in terms of, like, Rory's trajectory, I'm, I'm falling in love with Jess, like 100% when she does, but then I, like, am also falling in love with Logan.

26:14 [SPEAKER_05]: 100%. [SPEAKER_05]: That is, you know, 100%. [SPEAKER_05]: 100%. [SPEAKER_05]: Like, 100%. [SPEAKER_05]: And they couldn't be more different, but they're both somehow my type. [SPEAKER_05]: So I know that crazy. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes. [SPEAKER_05]: What does Anthony think? [SPEAKER_05]: Anthony, I think, would tell you that he's team dress, but he will always just be like, I'm team Luke.

26:33 [SPEAKER_05]: Like he is always like you know, like, and not that, and I was listening to your episode today where you got her, I don't think you dove into it. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, but you're planning on it. [SPEAKER_05]: I'm like, what is a team? [SPEAKER_05]: Like, what does the team really mean? [SPEAKER_05]: You know what I mean?

26:47 [SPEAKER_05]: And I was thinking that because like, Hill answered that question, but he won't choose one of Rory's boyfriend. [SPEAKER_05]: So it's like, is that the right answer. [SPEAKER_05]: You know what I mean? [SPEAKER_05]: Luke, but he's because he's always like we're a Luke in our life. [SPEAKER_05]: Like that's a lot that's so bad.

27:02 [SPEAKER_05]: So, but I feel like if your team Luke, you're kind of team Jess, that's kind of like the same. [SPEAKER_02]: They kind of like hold hands a little bit. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, of course. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes. [SPEAKER_02]: So, so with you there. [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, so. [SPEAKER_02]: What about your relationship with gossip girl when did you start watching how did it become one of your favorite shows because the other thing that we didn't mention is that the reason that you guys started watching pretty little layers and did a podcast about it is because that is Phoebe's favorite show and you hadn't seen the entire thing so you guys rewatched up until a certain point and then you were watching for the first time together yeah now you're doing your favorite show and how did gossip girl come to be your favorite show like when did you start watching when did you become attached did you watch live

27:41 [SPEAKER_05]: No, I have, so I'm the oldest in the eldest daughter and Phoebe is, uh, and, and again, that is why we are country spirits. [SPEAKER_05]: My sister Phoebe is the middle child, I'm one of three, and, um, like growing up, I think pretty little layers, but it came out like my freshman year of high school, and it was the show.

28:00 [SPEAKER_05]: Like you, I remember where I was when I watched the first episode. [SPEAKER_05]: And she wasn't allowed to watch it, because obviously, and so she would like wait for me a DVR at, you know, record it and then she'd wait to see that it had been watched and then she would go in our basement television and watch it once it was safe because like it had already been watched by somebody and she would stand at this close to the TV and she would have volume one in subtitles and she would watch it and it was just like this this moment for her.

28:28 [SPEAKER_05]: I sort of had a similar thing with God's girl because I was not a lot of, I was like, we had a strict strict household. [SPEAKER_05]: I wasn't allowed to see like a lot of the things that my friends were watching. [SPEAKER_05]: It was like, it's PG-13, then when you're 13, you can watch it.

28:43 [SPEAKER_05]: Maybe. [SPEAKER_04]: That was five. [SPEAKER_05]: That was the five, yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: I knew like I knew in my heart that my mom could not know about my affinity for gossip girl, but this was during the time when we were just talking about this and we recorded like do you remember when you would buy things on iTunes?

28:59 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know if you have this experience growing up like it was like our family account and I just like we just like buy things on iTunes and we just didn't know where it went. [SPEAKER_05]: It was like 99 cents and we didn't know you know whatever. [SPEAKER_05]: So I bought a few gossip girl episodes and I guess I just didn't think that like anyone would notice But I remember vividly laying in my bed watching on my iPod Touch.

29:20 [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, of course. [SPEAKER_01]: The slumber party. [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, yes. [SPEAKER_05]: The slumber party episode of gossip girl and I remember two choosing the episodes I purchased just by reading this inopsis synopsis because I wasn't watching it live I wasn't allowed to But a lot of my friends were like the youngest kids so they were like oh gossip girls on in the house [SPEAKER_05]: So I had a baby sitter at the time, or like a eighth grade, our family's babysitter, and she, I told her I was like, oh my god, I love gossip girl.

29:47 [SPEAKER_05]: Like I'm loving it, and she was like, oh, I love gossip girl. [SPEAKER_05]: Me had like had a little key key over it talking about it. [SPEAKER_05]: She turns around and tells my mother that I should not be watching gossip girl. [SPEAKER_05]: And I was like, well, I didn't know she was watching gossip girl.

30:00 [SPEAKER_05]: And so this is how I get outed. [SPEAKER_05]: And my mom was like, listen, your baby sitter said it's not appropriate, and that you shouldn't be watching it until you're like later in high school. [SPEAKER_05]: So you can't watch it. [SPEAKER_05]: Then we I'm the trail the betrayer. [SPEAKER_02]: No Not as having the exact right.

30:15 [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, I've never be able to trust anybody ever again. [SPEAKER_05]: No, I know like am I still harboring a grudge? [SPEAKER_05]: Of course a little bit We go to Hollywood California like a month later for a wedding and we're driving down the road And there are these huge billboards for like gossip girls amazing marketing campaign and it was like your mother's worst nightmare [SPEAKER_05]: and it's like a picture of Serena on the bar after the shepherd wedding.

30:39 [SPEAKER_05]: And my mom is like, see, like, I knew you shouldn't be watching it. [SPEAKER_05]: And like that, just it was just further. [SPEAKER_05]: It's a little fun for you. [SPEAKER_05]: That like, she made the right choice as a mother. [SPEAKER_05]: So obviously, when you have a moment like that, you're going to become obsessed, like completely obsessed with the show.

30:52 [SPEAKER_05]: And yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: So I don't remember when I fully got to watch it, but I do remember I got all of the DVDs like the box set and I want to say from like sophomore year of high school on, I would just keep it running on a loop, watch it nonstop. [SPEAKER_05]: I remember getting foot surgery and I was in the basement, told up with with all the gossip girl seasons and just kept them going because I couldn't walk and it was that was the best thing to do.

31:18 [SPEAKER_05]: So I [SPEAKER_05]: That was really like how I got started and who knows if it hadn't been such a, such a tumultuous, you know, origin story between me and the show, who knows if I'd be here today. [SPEAKER_05]: But I just love it. [SPEAKER_05]: And then this is actually, I actually didn't know if I was going to say this because it is Loki so embarrassing.

31:36 [SPEAKER_05]: That's okay. [SPEAKER_05]: So what I was going to hide school. [SPEAKER_05]: I have to tell you. [SPEAKER_05]: I kind of, and I feel like you really got this just like being the eldest daughter and like all that comes with that natural born leader vibes, you know. [SPEAKER_05]: Um, I really was like, take it with Blair Waldorf.

31:52 [SPEAKER_05]: Like I was like, I am Blair Blair as me. [SPEAKER_05]: This is whatever. [SPEAKER_05]: We are like a group of friends that I really want to say that I'm not the one who started it, but like, [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know. [SPEAKER_05]: They would call themselves my minions and like they would like, I would be Blair Waldorf and their phone and it was like, and it's like that's what I'm saying.

32:13 [SPEAKER_05]: Embarrassing I was a senior high school and like in some of my, and but I'm still best friends with my main minion and, uh, [SPEAKER_05]: She'd be happy to tell you all about it, but yeah, so like long, long, long history with it But it is just like the past year on the podcast is like yeah, welcome to the stage My name is Kelly my main menu.

32:31 [SPEAKER_05]: I just like I can't stay one how mortifying is that like, but why was that a thing? [SPEAKER_05]: Wait, we're like, who are you? [SPEAKER_05]: We were the past X. [SPEAKER_05]: You know what I mean? [SPEAKER_02]: Like they would do that exactly or whatever We were so emotionally underdeveloped and [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, no completely and also like television was our world layers.

32:49 [SPEAKER_05]: Yes, I was like, oh, we're supposed to have relationship with strangers. [SPEAKER_05]: We're supposed to be more we're supposed to be dressing like this. [SPEAKER_02]: We're supposed to be printing pretending like we're dead and not returning for five seasons. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes. [SPEAKER_05]: We're like that's what we're supposed to be doing.

33:03 [SPEAKER_02]: So anyone else say that gossip girl and shows like that like I wasn't allowed to watch gossip girl. [SPEAKER_02]: I wasn't allowed to watch the OC one tree hill all of those shows. [SPEAKER_01]: Yes. [SPEAKER_02]: I [SPEAKER_02]: understand now as a grown woman. [SPEAKER_02]: Why my mom was like, hey, maybe we don't want to do.

33:20 [SPEAKER_02]: I wish I could have absolutely, but they were doing a lot of very adult things in the school. [SPEAKER_02]: That like, I was not doing. [SPEAKER_02]: And so totally, it's going to inspire you to like, [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know play Jason D'Aurolo behind everything you do. [SPEAKER_02]: Exactly.

33:35 [SPEAKER_02]: Like they were having sex and they were drinking and they were doing all of these things which Yes, yes you have to explore those things on your own. [SPEAKER_02]: But when you're ready and I'm sure parents were like, hey, maybe we're not ready for that. [SPEAKER_02]: When you're in eighth grade.

33:48 [SPEAKER_02]: We're not ready for you to be inspired by that. [SPEAKER_05]: Anthony and I just we finished gossip early and never seen it. [SPEAKER_05]: He loved it and then when we finished here like, why don't we do the OC now? [SPEAKER_04]: Because I never seen it. [SPEAKER_05]: And we started it and like I know people feel and frankly it's it's the same creator so it should you know it's as gossip girl.

34:08 [SPEAKER_05]: But gossip girl came after so I must feel like he like learned a little bit from what work on the OC and like sort of took it to this the east coast sort of story but [SPEAKER_05]: And the first episode, they're all doing cocaine at a party and I'm like, wait, we're 15. [SPEAKER_05]: Like, what do you mean there's cocaine on the table here?

34:23 [SPEAKER_05]: That's what it's all like, that, that even felt, well, like, I don't know. [SPEAKER_02]: I at least had gone the whole week, but agree. [SPEAKER_02]: No, 100%. [SPEAKER_02]: But it's just like, you know, you're going to the club. [SPEAKER_02]: Like, one of the first episodes, Chuck, like, [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my god, Jenny, it's like, there's a lot of really intense themes in this show that I just, they're very adult themes and I think that that's the intention is to kind of express that these children are, you know, much more mature and exposed to a lot more adult themed things because they're raised in like societies upper crust.

35:06 [SPEAKER_05]: I'm sure there are people who are teens who experience life like this in cities like New York, you know, like, I'm sure, but for a little old me in the summer, I was like, why am I not drinking a dirty martini with lunch? [SPEAKER_05]: You know what I mean? [SPEAKER_02]: That's 100%. [SPEAKER_05]: So.

35:22 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, and I didn't start watching these shows until I was in college because I was never going to be able to watch them in my household. [SPEAKER_02]: And even in high school. [SPEAKER_02]: There was no way to understand that. [SPEAKER_02]: Like definitely no way. [SPEAKER_02]: No. [SPEAKER_02]: So then when I started watching them in college, I was like, oh my god, these people are so cool.

35:39 [SPEAKER_02]: And I aspire to be them. [SPEAKER_02]: Maybe at a, I guess, a more age-appropriate time in my life. [SPEAKER_02]: But if I had inspired to be that way in high school, I would have been a fucking monster. [SPEAKER_02]: And I was already a fucking monster. [SPEAKER_02]: So no. [SPEAKER_05]: We can take on a personality like literally we know how to like a diver take on a personality Absolutely 100%.

36:02 [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, so obviously with that in mind Gilmore girls is a very very different show [SPEAKER_02]: Because part of the reason it's so comfortable is that Amy Sherman Paladino who created the show made a lot of the big small and the small big, which I think is not necessarily the case in Gossip Girl, everything is big.

36:29 [SPEAKER_02]: Everything is huge. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes. [SPEAKER_02]: or like the biggest like things we should make a big deal about um like for example free yeah for example Chuck and Jeff Humphrey I don't know selling drugs is like made so small they're like and whatever about that literally you know what you're grounded [SPEAKER_02]: You're going to.

36:48 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, exactly. [SPEAKER_02]: For two episodes, but with with Gilmore girls, it is so laser focused on small town vibes, worry is so the opposite of these people, because despite the fact that these are two very different shows, Gilmore girls and gossip girl have this like weird little venn diagram in the center where they mean, and that's kind of what we're going to [SPEAKER_02]: discussed today, but I feel like gossip girl is like what we would have gotten if we had a scene the other side of race life at Chilton with all of these like, you know, high society Connecticut folks.

37:23 [SPEAKER_02]: But it's really like if we explored more like Christopher's time together when they were younger, but set in 2007 with like the relationship that we're rooting for being like a [SPEAKER_05]: being like a little toxic. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.

37:36 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: You know, like the upper society and how they operate and like seeing the underbelly of that we got the small town. [SPEAKER_02]: We got more of the small town like we're going more lower like Dan Humphrey. [SPEAKER_05]: Yes, totally. [SPEAKER_05]: And it's like it's almost like, you know, I got ahead of myself, but I feel like.

37:54 [SPEAKER_05]: there's a part of Rufus that, you know, because he experienced it, he dated Lily Vanderwoodson, you know, before she was Lily Vanderwood. [SPEAKER_05]: She was always Lily Vanderwood. [SPEAKER_05]: You know what, any before she really wrote it? [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, she did Lily Vanderwood.

37:59 [SPEAKER_05]: And like, I almost feel like he was so aware of that that, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know, you know [SPEAKER_05]: There's a part of him that's like, I can keep my kids away from this and I can shield them from this because I don't want them to grow up this way where Laura like sort of does the same for Rory like, and I want to keep you here away from the way I grew up because I don't think it's the move, but no matter what like

38:26 [SPEAKER_05]: It's almost like keeping them from it, just like our parents kept us from these shows, it makes them want to find it more, they're going to find it. [SPEAKER_02]: One hundred percent, oh my god, that's so real. [SPEAKER_02]: Wow. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, I can't wait to get into it. [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.

38:38 [SPEAKER_02]: So before we dive into like the that little event diagram, like we were talking about and the character comparisons, relationship comparisons, and kind of episodic storyline comparisons. [SPEAKER_02]: I want to just share some production behind the scenes with you and with our audience.

38:56 [SPEAKER_02]: For anybody who doesn't know the show, which I imagine, if you're listening to this episode, you've, you're at least a little familiar with gossip girl, gossip girl aired from 2007, 2012, I believe. [SPEAKER_02]: So this was after Gilmore Girls. [SPEAKER_02]: Like, I almost feel like Gilmore Girls aired until 2007, then gossip girl kind of picked up the book to carry it forward.

39:13 [SPEAKER_02]: If you want to think of it that way. [SPEAKER_02]: So they aired a two very different times, but they did have some crossover as far as producers and writers, which I found really interesting [SPEAKER_02]: How much of this was maybe a fragment of a cycle? [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, exactly. [SPEAKER_02]: So John Stevens, which is a big name in the Gilmore Girls universe, because he was a writer and a co-producer on Gilmore Girls from 2004, and an executive producer on Gossip Girl from 2008 to 2010, and he wrote four episodes and directed three.

39:45 [SPEAKER_02]: He's also the only acting credit he's ever had is in Gilmore Girls. [SPEAKER_02]: So like the Gilmore Girls fandom, [SPEAKER_02]: Big John Stevens fans or at least very familiar with John Stevens suits so to see his name every time that I watch the show I'm just like wow There he is So funny.

40:02 [SPEAKER_02]: I just I crazy idea. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I know. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, him being an executive producer on gossip girl having going [SPEAKER_05]: Okay, makes a lot of sense, and it is so entered, it's like, well, it's just so funny to me, too, because it feels like, and maybe there's a part of them, that's like, all right, we've been in this like cozy, snugly sort of world of Gilmore girls, and now I'm ready to break into this more like, refer on the edges, sort of.

40:26 [SPEAKER_05]: vibe but like still finding those moments like because that's what he's great at, you know, like finding producing moments like that and creating them and putting them in the show because 100%. [SPEAKER_05]: Even the people who love gossip are like you still need, you can't all be edge.

40:41 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know. [SPEAKER_02]: No, you still need the heart of the show. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: And both shows are kind of like aspirational in different ways, where it's like, Gilmore girls, that's aspirational in terms of like, I want to curate my cozy fall in my cozy life and whatever.

40:57 [SPEAKER_05]: And then in the small town vibes and all that. [SPEAKER_05]: And then there's like the aspiration of, I want to move to the city and I want to like, a dressing Chanel and I want to do all these things. [SPEAKER_05]: So it's interesting. [SPEAKER_05]: Anyway, sorry. [SPEAKER_02]: No, I totally agree with it.

41:09 [SPEAKER_02]: No, no, no. [SPEAKER_02]: This is why we have these conversations because I agree they're aspirational in two very very different ways. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, and it is [SPEAKER_02]: It makes city life feel like small town life. [SPEAKER_02]: Everybody knows each other, everybody's all up and everybody's business.

41:24 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, like that, that part of it still exists. [SPEAKER_02]: Even if we're not in a small town. [SPEAKER_02]: You literally all think a small town in gossip. [SPEAKER_05]: Right. [SPEAKER_05]: And adding in the gossip girl, you know, character, like sort of connect everything. [SPEAKER_05]: It keeps it feeling so small.

41:38 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, everyone knows everything about everyone. [SPEAKER_02]: Exactly. [SPEAKER_02]: Jessica Queller, who I imagine is the namesake of headmistress Queller. [SPEAKER_02]: I was gonna say that. [SPEAKER_02]: I was gonna say that. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, exactly. [SPEAKER_02]: Jessica Queller was a co-producer and writer and season five of Gilmore Girls.

41:54 [SPEAKER_02]: So after John Stevens was no longer with the show, Jessica Queller was on the show. [SPEAKER_02]: for one season season five. [SPEAKER_02]: And then she was a co executive producer and writer on gossip girl from 2007 to 2012 seasons one two four and six. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, so whenever I see her name pop up, I'm like headmistress Queller.

42:11 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, really. [SPEAKER_05]: I'm just callers really only in the first few seat, you know, before they graduate. [SPEAKER_05]: So that would be great. [SPEAKER_05]: So much, since I also, I was, oh, and I'm going to botch it and maybe you're going to mention something about this, but there's the Austroff Center.

42:23 [SPEAKER_05]: Yes, it was about to say that very much. [SPEAKER_05]: Okay, go ahead, go ahead. [SPEAKER_02]: Guys, no, what I was going to say is that, like, speaking of namesakes, I was looking up, you know, later we'll talk about the back door pilot that Gossip Girl had. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes. [SPEAKER_02]: And I was looking at it just to see, you know, why it didn't get picked up and why it fell through.

42:39 [SPEAKER_02]: And it was like, you know, the president of the CW, so-and-so, Austroff, and I was like, [SPEAKER_05]: You know it was like okay, I know I literally just learned that today. [SPEAKER_05]: I was like is that a compliment or no? [SPEAKER_05]: You know what I mean right? [SPEAKER_05]: Oh my God.

42:55 [SPEAKER_05]: Do you want the Ostreff center named after you if you are a psych ward? [SPEAKER_01]: Huh? [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah I want that [SPEAKER_02]: Lee Schallett Schemell, who was an executive producer, a co-executive producer on Gilmore Girls, directed a handful of episodes of Gossip Girl, and then Jamie Babbit, who we love Jamie Babbit in this house.

43:14 [SPEAKER_02]: She was director on several episodes of Gilmore Girls, like too many to name, and also Martin Wilson's as maizeal, I think, Bun has as well. [SPEAKER_02]: Amy really has big love for Jamie Babbit. [SPEAKER_02]: She directed an episode of Gossip Girl, [SPEAKER_02]: and an episode of Pretty Little Iars.

43:29 [SPEAKER_02]: No way! [SPEAKER_02]: Do you know what's up? [SPEAKER_02]: No, I mean, I've watched them a lot. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm putting them right in now. [SPEAKER_02]: And then same with Michael Grossman. [SPEAKER_02]: He did the same. [SPEAKER_02]: He directed an episode of Gilmore Girls an episode of Gossip Girl and seven episodes of Pretty Little Iars.

43:41 [SPEAKER_05]: Wait, that's wild. [SPEAKER_05]: I need to talk about the pop culture at that time. [SPEAKER_05]: not even necessarily every time I was like mentioned in the episode, which is sort of like what was going on in the world, that could have shaped it, but then also our references, our music, things like that.

44:07 [SPEAKER_05]: But this is the type of stuff too that I just am like excited to dive into and maybe we'll have to figure out which episodes are and sort of like do some comparing, because I wonder if we would notice like a similar lens from a directorial standpoint, you know what I mean? [SPEAKER_05]: Like between some of the episodes, like are they better suited to direct certain plot lines or things like that?

44:26 [SPEAKER_05]: It would just be interesting to [SPEAKER_05]: Dive and chew. [SPEAKER_05]: So, and that is learning some fun. [SPEAKER_02]: Drid, because like I almost wanted to if I had because I had written it down when I would see their next come up on like on my rewatch. [SPEAKER_02]: I was like, oh my god, like there's any rabbit, there's you know John Stevens and I was like, if I really had the time, I would go back and individually watch to pick up on some of those things that maybe were similar maybe a joke that was made.

44:51 [SPEAKER_02]: You know, so I think you should kind of like, [SPEAKER_02]: Keep your ears open. [SPEAKER_05]: Chris, it's my spray. [SPEAKER_05]: Chris is break. [SPEAKER_05]: I will see you. [SPEAKER_05]: We've got plans. [SPEAKER_05]: Yes, this is what I will be doing. [UNKNOWN]: Love. [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, so moving out of production, gossip girl, like I mentioned, just like Gilmore Girls had an attempted back door pilot in the pen ultimate episode of season two for gossip girl in season three for Gilmore Girls.

45:12 [SPEAKER_02]: I think that that's usually what people do when they're trying to deliver some sort of back door pilot is it's usually in the second to last episode of a season. [SPEAKER_02]: I could be wrong. [SPEAKER_02]: Or like he's like crying around the time of a season break. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm dumb.

45:24 [SPEAKER_05]: I'm dumb. [SPEAKER_05]: What is a back door? [SPEAKER_05]: I'm like, yeah, yeah, yeah. [SPEAKER_01]: You know what is that? [SPEAKER_01]: What are you talking about? [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, so back in Brooklyn. [SPEAKER_02]: I was okay. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, so a back door pilot is like golden girls had.

45:41 [SPEAKER_02]: This so many shows have had this. [SPEAKER_02]: The office, golden girls, gossip girl and go more girls. [SPEAKER_02]: they have episodes that are embedded within the season that are meant to serve as a jumping off point for another series. [SPEAKER_02]: So the flashback episode in season two of Gossip Girl we're Brittany Snow plays a young Lily with a little what's in and Kristen.

46:01 [SPEAKER_02]: Wait, Ritter plays. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, her sister. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, her sister. [SPEAKER_02]: That was the episode was called Valley Girls and the show was supposed to be called. [SPEAKER_05]: that like okay this is ringing bells because I remember I remember hearing maybe I've heard pretty close everywhere right now which oh my god she's literally everywhere after hunting why we want all these things in production at the same time because she's in the Murdoch thing she's in the Boston me and hunting like it's crazy but anyway I love her I've always loved her [SPEAKER_05]: Do you want American dreams or no?

46:33 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, great show. [SPEAKER_02]: Great show. [SPEAKER_02]: It's pretty good. [SPEAKER_02]: That was how I was introduced her 2002 to 2004, I think it was. [SPEAKER_02]: It was a show that takes place in the 1960s, like American bandstand years and she's a dancer on American bandstand. [SPEAKER_02]: It's got about just, I know.

46:47 [SPEAKER_02]: She's like all American family, it deals with race issues, but my love and family isn't it? [SPEAKER_02]: And he plays her love interest at one point. [SPEAKER_01]: Yes. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my god. [SPEAKER_02]: Great. [SPEAKER_02]: George. [SPEAKER_02]: We okay. [SPEAKER_02]: You got a lot to chat with my household.

46:59 [SPEAKER_02]: I was a little sad when I ended. [SPEAKER_05]: Okay. [SPEAKER_05]: I'm going to just end this because I was like pretty snow hairspray, pitch perm hairspray was 100%. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: And it was like, okay, she shaped me. [SPEAKER_05]: She literally. [SPEAKER_02]: No 100%.

47:11 [SPEAKER_02]: I wanted you to be pretty snow. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes. [SPEAKER_02]: American dream. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, oh my god. [SPEAKER_02]: Don't talk or must die. [SPEAKER_02]: She's amazing. [SPEAKER_02]: I love Britney snow forever. [SPEAKER_02]: So rubber number number that now. [SPEAKER_05]: I remember hearing that there was a pilot in the works and okay.

47:28 [SPEAKER_05]: That makes a mission. [SPEAKER_05]: Because you know what there must also be one. [SPEAKER_05]: Well, I don't know if it's a pilot, but a back door pilot, but I'm pretty little liars are Ravens would. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it's Ravens would. [SPEAKER_02]: They had a back door fight. [SPEAKER_02]: You're so.

47:38 [SPEAKER_02]: That's how we made it. [SPEAKER_02]: Okay. [SPEAKER_02]: Make the entire grand bigger. [SPEAKER_02]: Like. [SPEAKER_05]: Yes, it's the Ravens. [SPEAKER_02]: What episode was back door pilot? [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, and that one actually came to fruition both gossip girl and Gilmour Girls had failed back door pilots because the episode where Jessica will fall for now to find a staff Okay, oh yeah, that's about the pilot for a show that they were gonna have to go called win-world win-world circle and what I love is that both of these are [SPEAKER_02]: like they they center the gossip girl and Gilmore girls one center on a 17 year old who's a main character in the show obviously for gossip girls a flashback and they're getting they've gotten kicked out of school and they're seeking refuge in an estranged relative after not having support from their parental figures it's super jazz it's the same for Lily and two very different ways Lily has a lot of privilege um i could compare her to another character which i will later and she is kind of like running away from it in a lot of ways

48:31 [SPEAKER_02]: and so I feel like they just like they run they have a lot of different parallels which is cool. [SPEAKER_02]: I personally I've always said that we did not need the Jess Marianna spin off and I have so many questions for Amy Sherman Paladino. [SPEAKER_02]: If we were going to chance to talk to her like really not with her and talk to her, we must because I have so many questions about what this backdoor pilot was going to bring.

48:52 [SPEAKER_02]: What the story could have brought if we didn't have the [SPEAKER_02]: I really wish we got this pilot personally. [SPEAKER_02]: I wish we got this series, rather, because I would have loved to see the star. [SPEAKER_02]: And I think that this is what they would have to deliver to us. [SPEAKER_02]: They wanted to show us the start of like Lily's journey and I would have loved to have her meet Rufus.

49:16 [SPEAKER_05]: I would love to see that too. [SPEAKER_05]: And I think like, she, I mean, I'm assuming, and you know what I say about God, but I'm assuming you're going to be comparing [SPEAKER_05]: Yes. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, it's okay. [SPEAKER_05]: Okay. [SPEAKER_05]: I don't want to jump ahead, but like I would love to get that.

49:34 [SPEAKER_05]: of Loreline Emily. [SPEAKER_05]: I think of Loreline Emily. [SPEAKER_05]: I'm totally with you. [SPEAKER_05]: 100% 100% percent. [SPEAKER_05]: Lily is Lorelei. [SPEAKER_05]: If Lorelei had followed. [SPEAKER_05]: Yes. [SPEAKER_05]: Yes. [SPEAKER_05]: Exactly. [SPEAKER_05]: I'm so with you because even, I mean, the moment you bring what's your name, CC, I think, the moment you bring Lily's mother in there.

49:57 [SPEAKER_05]: It's like 100% like they are [SPEAKER_05]: a little nasty to each other. [SPEAKER_05]: They're so much love there. [SPEAKER_05]: Like, it's good. [SPEAKER_05]: It's just immediately. [SPEAKER_05]: It's like Lily reverts to to young Lily. [SPEAKER_05]: What her mom is around and it's almost like she's like a little girl walking around in her mom's heels being like, no, no, like I have got this mother.

50:18 [SPEAKER_05]: Like, don't, you know, stay out of this and it's like 100% not that the mother's always helpful. [SPEAKER_05]: But I totally am with you on that. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes. [SPEAKER_02]: She's such a combo of Laura Lye and Emily. [SPEAKER_02]: And the Emily comparison is also really rooted in her relationship with Serena.

50:33 [SPEAKER_02]: But the other fun fact about the gossip girl, Gilmore Girlsman Diagram, is that in Season 3 Episode 5 of gossip girl, when plot... [SPEAKER_02]: Spoilers, Rufus and Lily get married, Sonic Youth performs at their reception, and they also perform in Gilmore Girls in the Season 6 finale. [SPEAKER_02]: So, Amy and Dan's last episode, they had a bunch of musicians come and play as like the troubadores.

51:02 [SPEAKER_02]: Do you remember that? [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, I do. [SPEAKER_02]: I do. [SPEAKER_02]: So, Sonic Youth perform. [SPEAKER_02]: So, when I saw them in Rufus' loft, I was like, wait, [SPEAKER_02]: amazing. [SPEAKER_05]: Wait, that's that's so interesting because it's also like you know they're just, I mean, music is such a huge massive part of gossip girl too, but it's just like, I know, you know, it's connections, like, oh, we already use them.

51:23 [SPEAKER_05]: Well, and so that we get you, you know, it's, it's interesting. [SPEAKER_02]: I know. [SPEAKER_02]: I know. [SPEAKER_02]: I know. [SPEAKER_02]: I know. [SPEAKER_02]: I know. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: I love it. [SPEAKER_02]: It's really cool. [SPEAKER_02]: And then the final thing, because there are other like episode in storyline comparisons that we can make that I'll talk about later.

51:36 [SPEAKER_02]: But Gilmore girls exists in the gossip world, which I love because in season two, I was so sick. [SPEAKER_02]: It's better for Yale than not roaring. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, Blair's up all night watching Gilmour Girls because for those of you who might not be familiar with like the inner workings of the show Blair Waldorf one of the main characters is like Absolutely obsessed with going to yell she is going to yell her like relatives went to yell she is a yell girl.

52:04 [SPEAKER_02]: Lee she wants to go so badly and so She hangs her hat on [SPEAKER_02]: the prospect of going there and it is an interesting ride which we'll talk about in a little bit by I love that her duroda was like her maid was like we all heard you up all night watching Gilmore does and I just love that Gilmore girls exists in the gossip girl world.

52:25 [SPEAKER_05]: I love it too and I love that Blair loves Gilmore girls. [SPEAKER_05]: I think that it's such an important like important [SPEAKER_05]: Fact about her, like, you know, here's the thing, like, we were just, I was just like watching some some videos researching for episode 1 is to get into some like, you know, background info and, and it's interesting the way that the characters were supposed to transpire like, [SPEAKER_05]: They said that Chuck was really not supposed to be one of the main cast.

52:54 [SPEAKER_05]: He was supposed to be like a full-on villain who never had a redemption arc. [SPEAKER_05]: Like he was just supposed to kind of be this person that like came in. [SPEAKER_05]: And so that's why in the pilot, he is so, so bad and you're so evil. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, but they fell in love with him.

53:09 [SPEAKER_05]: They loved him people like there was something about him and so that's why he ended up saying But at the same time Blair was really just supposed to be a villain in a mean girl They were like she was supposed to be like this evil mean girl and they said because of late and me stir We learned that's just not all Blair is like she [SPEAKER_05]: found these moments and Blair and the new ones and all these, you know, it's the way I talk about Ariana Grande is going to, but like she found all these little moments to sort of like bring out.

53:38 [SPEAKER_05]: And there were so many times during the pilot that I was just like, what I gifted actress, she is finding these little moments just to change her eyebrows at a certain line from somebody else that make me see Blair for who she is. [SPEAKER_05]: And like, I'm just, I'm such a Blair apologist to the day I die, but I feel like [SPEAKER_05]: It's like, I'm just like, I don't know.

54:00 [SPEAKER_05]: Do you know what I'm trying to say? [SPEAKER_05]: Like, it's for me to me. [SPEAKER_05]: It's like she needs the comfort. [SPEAKER_04]: She needs no comfort in her life. [SPEAKER_05]: You're going to be to her with a hundred percent. [SPEAKER_05]: And like, I feel like it's a show. [SPEAKER_05]: She's watched a zillion times and but I love her than that.

54:14 [SPEAKER_05]: Rory. [SPEAKER_05]: I love that. [SPEAKER_05]: And she says that that's right. [SPEAKER_05]: Rory. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes. [SPEAKER_02]: I love that they gift her a bulldog called Handsome Dan and she calls him Handsome. [SPEAKER_02]: She doesn't call him Dan. [SPEAKER_02]: She calls him Handsome.

54:24 [SPEAKER_05]: I just, it's so good, but like it's so good. [SPEAKER_05]: I love that you call that out. [SPEAKER_05]: I think it's such a crucial, like, I love these little bits and pieces that we get of Blair that like really show us who she is because she's not the easiest person in the world to love.

54:38 [SPEAKER_05]: So she is not. [SPEAKER_05]: But. [SPEAKER_02]: I have got, but yet we're obsessed with her and yet she's everything we want to be and with Chuck, I can't believe, I mean, I can't and I can't believe that they were meant to be these characters, both of them that were iridimable in a creative spies and they end up becoming my ticket characters in the entire story.

55:03 [SPEAKER_05]: And I actually was stressed out about this because I was like watching the pilot and I was like, oh my god, like [SPEAKER_05]: We're going to have to talk about this and these are some horrific things and it's like how do you come back from it like in later She's in town. [SPEAKER_05]: I suppose to root for him and Blair when like this is where he begins.

55:18 [SPEAKER_05]: You'll find a way. [SPEAKER_05]: You'll find a way. [SPEAKER_05]: He's a felt the same way Fuckin way and like all it's just like but that helped me like to hear that like there really was intentional He was supposed to be that bad and like and then he wasn't and it's so I just think it's [SPEAKER_05]: But there are two, and I don't even, I hesitate to say his misunderstood at this point in the show because like, you know, there's no misunderstanding what he tried to do here, but like, no, they are true people who are so tortured and like, and misunderstood in many, many ways, but they sort of like, [SPEAKER_05]: to understand each other and it's, oh, I just, I love it.

55:53 [SPEAKER_02]: I know. [SPEAKER_02]: That's what I have to sometimes pull myself out of the narrative. [SPEAKER_02]: And I, I'll get into the character comparison in a minute, but like with Chuck and Jess, like Jess is [SPEAKER_02]: arc in season three leads him down a path where he does also like lose himself in a moment and less intentionally force himself on worry at a party and it makes it really, really hard to then root for him in the eyes of the fandom that is like hey this character did something really, really horrible and that's when you kind of have to pull yourself out of the narrative a little bit or choose to and be like what were the writers intending to do with this character [SPEAKER_02]: And so with Chuck, I think we have to kind of do the same thing where the writers really wanted him to be Irritateemable and then changed their minds about him along the way and they do make him an incredibly redeemable character and I think the same with just the writers were setting him up to do something.

56:51 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't even know if they really viewed him doing this thing as that awful. [SPEAKER_02]: I don't think that was the intention. [SPEAKER_02]: Chuck's intentions were to be really evil and 100% and predatory, whereas I think with Jess, it's a little more nuanced even within the narrative, but with the writers, they were like, he's literally ruining everything in his life to serve the purpose of this back door pilot.

57:12 [SPEAKER_02]: Like he's been run away. [SPEAKER_02]: He's going to leave. [SPEAKER_02]: And I think that that's like [SPEAKER_02]: something we have to do sometimes with characters like this is, is take ourselves out of the narrative and put ourselves in the writer's shoes. [SPEAKER_05]: I'm with you 100% I love how you said that because it's something we really struggled with during pretty little layers, you know, like the Ezreal storyline.

57:31 [SPEAKER_05]: in the books they are not together like they have a little trist and then guess what as we're going to jail like you know and that's as he should have as he should like that's what should happen and like I mean I remember watching it as a kid being like yep we're supposed to fall in love with our English teachers like corrects to me you know it's finally was like all right cool here's the handbook guy school like got it but [SPEAKER_05]: It was tough because we're watching it and we're coming down so hard and Ezra and we're still having people who are like how dare you say anything negative about Ezra And I'm just like I want you to love yourself and realize like this is not a relationship to look up to but at the same point you have to get on board because if you don't get on board

58:10 [SPEAKER_05]: you're going to have a really unsatisfying watch of the show because you're going to hate the show. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: And it's like, of course, we all have a couple that we don't love and they end up together and whatever. [SPEAKER_05]: But for it to be one of these main couples with the show, I do think it's a really good point.

58:23 [SPEAKER_05]: Like you have to put yourself on the writer's shoes and realize that the writers, they couldn't possibly get rid of Ezra because people would have stopped watching the show, you know, and part of that is the chemistry between Ian Harding and Lucy and just who Ian Harding was. [SPEAKER_05]: all of these things, but they kind of had to roll with the punches and as an audience, you have to kind of, yeah, remove yourself, see what they were trying to do and decide if you're going to do it for the sake of the watch, you know, 100%.

58:50 [SPEAKER_02]: And it's tough because [SPEAKER_02]: as women were of course like okay yes we inherently know this is wrong and if we saw this happening in real life outside of the narrative of a TV show we would be like yeah absolutely fuck this person no way no how it's redeemable but it's so it's so different when you [SPEAKER_02]: put it within the scope of a narrative of a television show with writers who are purposefully and intentionally writing characters to do certain things and redeem themselves in certain ways.

59:20 [SPEAKER_05]: It's it's so nuanced and also then at the end of the day we have to remember it's a fictional world that we're talking about exactly exactly and like and at the end of the day a lot of these writers like I don't even believe that they really knew what was going to happen on a week to week basis.

59:33 [SPEAKER_05]: It's like [SPEAKER_05]: How is every, I mean, week two week is a little dramatic, but like how is everyone receiving the storyline and then that's really going to inform how we move forward and how do the actors handle the storyline and that's what it's like and so it's like, it's not all, I mean, I again, yeah, I think learning that Chuck was supposed to be fully bad.

59:50 [SPEAKER_05]: I was like, that's really good for me to hear because it makes me feel better about redeeming about later. [SPEAKER_05]: So yeah, because they need to do it and they they made that choice to and in a way they're saying it's okay We know he's all bad. [SPEAKER_05]: We know it's bad in this episode.

1:00:06 [SPEAKER_05]: You know it started very very half to we have to kind of move on from a 100% and in real life I'm so not that person. [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, but it's which is why it's same, you know, yeah That's why it's tough, but I am with you that like you at least for me. [SPEAKER_02]: I just fall so deeply in love with [SPEAKER_02]: Chuck and his love for Blair, the way I love there love and even though again, it's so toxic like it's I was gonna say even though I look at them sometimes.

1:00:34 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm like you guys. [SPEAKER_05]: Yes, well, it's so funny Like I'm watching it with Anthony and and he's like what the how do you mean you like them together? [SPEAKER_05]: Like blah, blah, blah, he actually was a major Dan and Blair chipper like he loved them together Because he I know I know I was like that's crazy.

1:00:52 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, Bret and I on the contrary Bret is watching and Bret comes in because he loves he loves gossip I don't know if I told you this but Bret and I were considering starting a gossip girl Oh my god, if you do like couples up and we need to have it on the day couples up and yeah You're so funny because Bret loves this show so so much and he's such a Chuck he's like Chuck bass [SPEAKER_02]: he's such a joke damn it.

1:01:17 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, then like you know, I got to the point where Dan and Blair like something is a brewing and he comes in and he's not watching it with me But he'll just like sit down sometimes and watch because he's seen the show so many times He comes in and just stairs with TV and goes this storyline was so fucking weird Why was such a weird choice and I was like they ran out of things to do [SPEAKER_05]: Literally, it's giving Spirana a couple of I hate it.

1:01:42 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, exactly. [SPEAKER_05]: Like I have to tell you a secret You like them. [SPEAKER_05]: I it's okay. [SPEAKER_02]: I loved that. [SPEAKER_02]: I loved that. [SPEAKER_02]: I was like, I was like, I was so shit. [SPEAKER_02]: That's But I think I can't I in Caleb forever. [SPEAKER_05]: I just always it's tough because I love Hannah and I love Spence at my first watch ever I was like Spencer's my favorite by far and [SPEAKER_05]: Watching it again as we said like when you watch it through a certain lens It really changes how you see the show and like you will dive in so deep and so I really Came out of it like such a Hannah stand so it was like anything that has done to hurt Hannah how dare you Yeah, but I feel like if I had been watching it in real time and gotten there with Spencer as my favorite couple Or as I favorite character in the beginning that I might have been like all because I love Spencer and I love Caleb and so like why would and I

1:02:33 [SPEAKER_05]: love them together, and it's interesting because it's one sort of Caleb sort of did something similar to Dan and Blair were like they peaked each other's academic parts of each other's brains and like the artistic parts of the, you know, like they stimulate the different part that was interesting to watch.

1:02:47 [SPEAKER_02]: Absolutely. [SPEAKER_02]: And I also feel like [SPEAKER_02]: Trion and what's he after who please Caleb what's Tyler Blackburn their chemistry was actually really great just like as people I'm like, you guys could probably both have chemistry with a tree What I'm saying like the two of them like put them with anyone like I was sunk for for any I mean really for as soon as Tyler Blackburn came on my screen.

1:03:14 [SPEAKER_05]: I was like [SPEAKER_05]: I know. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: And so I think they both were so, they're really great actors, like they really are. [SPEAKER_05]: And especially in a show where like everyone might not be as good as them when you put them together. [SPEAKER_05]: It's like, oh my god, how is the chemistry not gonna sell us, you know?

1:03:31 [SPEAKER_02]: Totally, absolutely. [SPEAKER_02]: And I was waiting for someone to meet. [SPEAKER_02]: Spencer at like her intellectual level. [SPEAKER_02]: And I love Spencer and Toby together. [SPEAKER_02]: So like once that was then, you know, what's the needle went back in that direction? [SPEAKER_02]: I was like, oh, okay.

1:03:44 [SPEAKER_02]: Fine. [SPEAKER_01]: Right. [SPEAKER_02]: Like yes, Angela belongs with Toby and Caleb and Anna belong together. [SPEAKER_02]: Okay. [SPEAKER_02]: But yeah, for that moment, I was like, oh, [SPEAKER_02]: about those. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm not about it totally. [SPEAKER_05]: I was going to get deeper, but I won't.

1:04:00 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't we could talk about this. [SPEAKER_02]: But with Dan and Blair, it's just like I agree with you that they could like scratch that intellectual edge, but it just didn't work. [SPEAKER_02]: And even as like on like a chemistry level, even though I think they're I think pen and late nerve both phenomenal actors fabulous feel the chemistry between them.

1:04:18 [SPEAKER_02]: at all. [SPEAKER_05]: I think it would just be it builds up way too much of this almost like sibling ish relationship between them, you know what I mean where it was like crossing over just felt really weird and like I don't know, like it just didn't work for me and also I think same with Caleb and Spencer, like [SPEAKER_05]: They're two really smart people.

1:04:39 [SPEAKER_05]: Dan and Blair are two really smart people. [SPEAKER_05]: And we kind of don't need to see them bring that out of each other. [SPEAKER_05]: Like having Blair with Chuck and having Hannah with Caleb. [SPEAKER_05]: It's like we like to see that Caleb appreciate Hannah and her intelligence and ways that aren't as obvious as Spencer's.

1:04:57 [SPEAKER_05]: And like we don't [SPEAKER_02]: They don't need to do that for each other, but it's like Caleb finds it in Hannah and I don't know if I'm making sense, but no, no, I'm so I'm so with you, but I just really deeply deeply [SPEAKER_02]: root for Chuck and Blair as individuals, but mostly together.

1:05:17 [SPEAKER_02]: And I know me too. [SPEAKER_02]: I like it's what drives the show forward for me because I think that I probably, I'm on season five right now in my rewatch and I think I would probably fall off if I didn't know where we were headed with the two of them because I'm just like, okay, I'm just kind of, yeah, it's Charlie, Charlie's here and you know Elizabeth Hurley's here and I'm like, what are you all doing here?

1:05:38 [SPEAKER_02]: Anyway, it's Dan. [SPEAKER_02]: Can't stand. [SPEAKER_02]: Kind of a weird season. [SPEAKER_02]: I kind of forgot a lot of things that happened. [SPEAKER_02]: I think because I blocked them out because I was like, I don't really care about this. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm waiting for us to get to season six.

1:05:47 [SPEAKER_02]: But anyway, [SPEAKER_02]: Moving out of the production crossover and getting into the character comparisons. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm really curious to see if ours align here because I know they do for Lily. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes. [SPEAKER_02]: Let's talk about all the other purposes of hand. [SPEAKER_02]: So starting with Serena Vanderwitzen because I do think that at the beginning she is kind of build as like the star of the show.

1:06:09 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: In a lot of ways when I think of gossip girl, I do think of like lively, but yes. [SPEAKER_02]: For me, Blair really is like me too. [SPEAKER_02]: The girl. [SPEAKER_02]: But starting with Serena. [SPEAKER_02]: I find her to be a crossover between Mooreland, Bury. [SPEAKER_05]: I'm totally with you.

1:06:24 [SPEAKER_05]: I feel the exact same. [SPEAKER_05]: I think that, and honestly, like, it's going to come from a place, and I know that you'll understand this, like, I do just love to roast Rory in the same way that I love to roast Rory in the same way that I love to roast Serenia. [SPEAKER_02]: Wait, say some energies, yeah.

1:06:42 [SPEAKER_05]: Yes, they have that, like, main character. [SPEAKER_05]: Kind of boring. [SPEAKER_05]: Also kind of like walking through the world with a little bit of disregard for like what how they hurt other people and way and so right somehow framing themselves as like [SPEAKER_05]: the protagonist, the good people, but it's like, I think of Serena as like the worst.

1:07:03 [SPEAKER_05]: Like, she is the last person I want as my best friend. [SPEAKER_05]: Like, I don't think she's a good friend. [SPEAKER_05]: And there are a lot of times that I'm like, Rory, like, the other thing is, they're not girl's girls. [SPEAKER_05]: And Blair, to me, girl's girl, you know? [SPEAKER_05]: And I just don't think Serena is.

1:07:19 [SPEAKER_05]: I don't really think Rory is. [SPEAKER_05]: And I don't think Rory is. [SPEAKER_05]: And not to bring her into the conversation, but you know what I'm saying? [SPEAKER_05]: It's a similar kind of trope, but it's also like, [SPEAKER_05]: What is it about those early 2000s that like those were the girls that we were like and this is the blueprint like 100% Feel this way about Rory, I would say the most like, you know, she also is the most forgivable.

1:07:40 [SPEAKER_02]: I agree, but I do think Rory has gotten more. [SPEAKER_02]: as social media has expanded and the conversation has kept going on. [SPEAKER_02]: She's become more of a villain. [SPEAKER_02]: People really agree with you. [SPEAKER_05]: And I think it does that go hand in hand with the evolution we're all having, we're realizing like okay it's actually we this pick me trope that was really popular back then it was like every girl sort of [SPEAKER_05]: like, there's something about being a middle school high school girl and thinking that the most important relationships in your life are not actually the ones of your girl bus friends or your sisters or whatever, and it's like correct.

1:08:16 [SPEAKER_05]: I feel like part of that is maturing in Gen Z and Gen X or at least the girls are ahead of us in that. [SPEAKER_05]: Like they they caught onto that quick. [SPEAKER_05]: So I feel like they are [SPEAKER_05]: Viewing this through this other lens that we didn't have at the time because we just weren't like As evolved in that way and now looking back we're like, oh, we totally see it But we have such a love for these characters.

1:08:39 [SPEAKER_05]: We're like people who are coming into it for the first time in 2025 Who are you know feminism isn't such a taboo word anymore? [SPEAKER_05]: So they are thinking with that lens of I want to see girls girls on my screen and if you're not a girls girl, you're maybe the villain and like I don't know [SPEAKER_05]: Maybe the perception of Rory has changed with the perception just of girlhood and yeah, I don't know I also think it's like it [SPEAKER_02]: I totally agree with you, and I think it's also, like, in addition to, like, pick me energy, which I don't necessarily think we're ahead.

1:09:17 [SPEAKER_02]: I think we're ahead, um, not like other girls energy. [SPEAKER_02]: And I think it's okay. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes. [SPEAKER_02]: That's very similar energy as it's Arya. [SPEAKER_02]: You know, it's like, I'm not like other girls. [SPEAKER_02]: Arya's fully pick me though. [SPEAKER_02]: And I will kiss.

1:09:31 [SPEAKER_02]: But yeah, you're right. [SPEAKER_02]: It's not like a girl the vibe of I'm not like other girls, and Yeah, arena vanderwoods in is not like other girls and I think the other reason why I put like a little mix of Laura light in there is because she is very effortlessly cool Yeah, you know, she does come from wealth.

1:09:49 [SPEAKER_02]: She has friction with her mom who wants to control her lifestyle [SPEAKER_02]: She's down to earth when she wants to be, but then uses her privilege when it benefits her, like once a day the guy her mother doesn't approve of, but like then like from a worries standpoint, like you said, isn't really a girl's girl, though she thinks she is.

1:10:07 [SPEAKER_02]: She really thinks she is. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes. [SPEAKER_02]: And as some way she can be, like sometimes in her friendship with Blair, I think she does put her needs first, but like she kind of wavers on that too. [SPEAKER_02]: And [SPEAKER_05]: Sorry, I'm just thinking like in the pilot like, okay, so we could look at it as like Serena's having girls girl moment in the pilot because with Jenny, you know, she is coming to Jenny's rescue and she is You know helping her figure out what color dressed to wear to the kiss from the lips party and all these things however [SPEAKER_05]: It's always always sort of like an ulterior motive like her helping Jenny out.

1:10:46 [SPEAKER_05]: She's on a date with her brother, you know, and she wants to seem like I'm not like these people at this party like we need to, you know, go to the she's doing the right thing, but it's not always like motivated by I wanted to do the right thing I think sometimes it's motivated by I want to piss my mom off or I want this guy to think I'm not like other girls or I want [SPEAKER_05]: You know, or even maybe it is that she just wants to be that person, but like she can't help but be who she is.

1:11:10 [SPEAKER_05]: And total I think you're so right with like Another thing they were saying about casting Serena, they're like she had to be an equal like she just had to have Something about her where you're like she walks in a room and everyone's like who is that and Laura like has that on [SPEAKER_05]: She 100% has the effortless, cool girl vibe.

1:11:28 [SPEAKER_05]: And then there's the same thing like, you know, I don't want to be like my mom and as a result, you end up acting a lot like you're revolting against that, the way that she was raised, especially with. [SPEAKER_05]: I think Serena and Laura like coming from similar like income, you know, structure is like bringing in.

1:11:49 [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_03]: Exactly. [SPEAKER_05]: It's like totally. [SPEAKER_05]: It's in their nature to sort of revolt from it. [SPEAKER_05]: And I do feel like there's something about their rich girl who doesn't want to be the rich girl that is cool. [SPEAKER_05]: You know, it just like 100%.

1:11:59 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: It works. [SPEAKER_02]: She works that. [SPEAKER_02]: in her personality when it best serves her like she wants to believe she's not privileged but she definitely is. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I do think that's a quality of Laura lie both Laura lie and worries. [SPEAKER_05]: Well, yeah, and I think it's really interesting to note for Laura lie too, because it's like, [SPEAKER_05]: There's this part of Laura lie that's like, yes, she rejects everything about how she was raised in her parents, all these things, but it's like, at the end of the day, you actually can't outrun your privilege, like you, you have it and it's in you and so even if we're just talking about the education you've had or we're just talking about the opportunities that you were afforded as a kid, like you can't get rid of that even if you wanted to and now that's part of you.

1:12:46 [SPEAKER_05]: And you're gonna benefit from that, and a lot of ways. [SPEAKER_05]: And also there's the part of it where it's like, you still know at the end of the day, you can go knock on your parents' door and do dinner with them and get the help that you need. [SPEAKER_05]: You know, you know that they're not, you don't have that at all.

1:13:00 [SPEAKER_05]: It's a lot different than somebody like Dan, Humphrey, for example, or Jenny who's like, well, I don't have that to, so I have to be a little scrappyer. [SPEAKER_05]: And 100%. [SPEAKER_05]: So like Serena and Laura, they can never fully be as scrappy as maybe they want to be. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, because they just inherently, you know, have the silver spoon disease.

1:13:20 [SPEAKER_05]: Like, and they can't help it. [SPEAKER_05]: They just can't help it. [SPEAKER_01]: They're worth it. [SPEAKER_05]: And also funny, how we get rory sort of like, you know, especially in the beginning, like, she's like, let's go. [SPEAKER_05]: I like my grandparents, you know, she's like kind of having a little bit, right?

1:13:35 [SPEAKER_05]: Like, do you feel like this at all? [SPEAKER_05]: Like, I feel like she's more forgiving of her grandparents than her mother, where Serena is the same. [SPEAKER_05]: yeah totally and it's like it just starts to affect her exactly and it's like it's it got to be so funny as the lore lie in the lilies of the world watching this being like okay well i did the exact same thing you're doing and like you yeah you wanting to be close with my mother is actually the antithesis of what you think you're doing you know correct yeah and it's interesting that to your point like when Lily slash lore lie into being right [SPEAKER_02]: are like, oh, yeah, you were totally right about this.

1:14:17 [SPEAKER_02]: And why didn't I listen? [SPEAKER_02]: And you know, it's again, it is like they are forgiving up until a certain point when it starts to really affect them. [SPEAKER_02]: And you see that in the debut time episode, it's season one when CC doesn't approve of Dan. [SPEAKER_02]: And you know, when Richard and Emily don't approve of Dean in season two.

1:14:38 [SPEAKER_02]: So it's like it's so fascinating to me how they can flip [SPEAKER_02]: And and Serena and Lily's relationship is very different from Roy's really with Thor light they are best friends. [SPEAKER_02]: You cannot compare the two perfectly at all because Loreline worry are. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

1:14:56 [SPEAKER_02]: And Enigma. [SPEAKER_02]: But the weaker parts of their relationship do kind of parallel. [SPEAKER_02]: I think. [SPEAKER_02]: Serena Lily. [SPEAKER_02]: Especially in season six when there's the rest. [SPEAKER_05]: Yes, yes, and like we get little moments with Serena and Lily where it's like yeah, that could have been possible It could have been like that, but it just Serena was just never Totally and Lily wasn't and Lily is too self-absorbed like, you know, she just Unfortunately like I do love Lily I do Yeah, like I can't help it, but like I know she's I also love her relationship with talk [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, oh, I love her relationship with Chuck.

1:15:37 [SPEAKER_05]: I love it. [SPEAKER_05]: It makes him so much more likable to me. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: And but it is like, if I really want to take a step out of it, too, I'm like, Lily. [SPEAKER_05]: This is this, I know she doesn't know it, but it's like this is a scary like did try to assault your daughter in episode one and now like if I'm Serena I'm like what the fuck is that you know a little bit about it That's what I mean about making the big small in the show.

1:16:01 [SPEAKER_02]: Is that like something like that. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, it's like Serena. [SPEAKER_02]: Hello 100% 100% I'm with you anyway moving into Blair Blair Waldorf [SPEAKER_02]: I would love to hear your thoughts first. [SPEAKER_05]: Okay, for me, and I feel like this is like, in my mind, this is like the obvious one, so maybe it's not the right one, but for me, it's Paris, like it's, I don't do it on a great.

1:16:33 [SPEAKER_02]: I said that she is the perfect hybrid of Emily Gilmore and Paris Miller. [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, that is so good Tara. [SPEAKER_05]: Yes, she's the perfect hybrid 100% that's because I kept being like it's not a perfect comparison No, but it has to be but like no, there are a lot of things about Paris that I wouldn't Ascribe to Blair but no [SPEAKER_05]: I the I love Paris and I feel like if you were Paris, you love Blair, you know what I mean?

1:16:58 [SPEAKER_02]: Like will be because to your point with you know, it just from a casting standpoint and a character standpoint from the writers angle, you said that like they intended for her to be just this like villain with the no game of qualities. [SPEAKER_02]: And with lies a wild auditioning for the role of Paris.

1:17:13 [SPEAKER_02]: She wasn't necessarily supposed to be a series regular on the show. [SPEAKER_02]: They wrote the character for her because she wasn't ready to be an emesis to be an emesis Like one of the characters the people people love Paris love her and she's got like it's also like the way she's written like the one liners But it also it's not just the lines.

1:17:33 [SPEAKER_05]: It's the delivery like it's from an acting standpoint both of these women just [SPEAKER_05]: found what they needed to find. [SPEAKER_05]: And it is like, I know that you know this. [SPEAKER_05]: Like, and I talk about this a lot of times with Phoebe who does not have an acting background, but I'm like from an acting perspective, I've played a lot of mean girls and played a lot of villains.

1:17:50 [SPEAKER_05]: And they all, you know, you can't think you're a villain. [SPEAKER_05]: You have to find the good. [SPEAKER_05]: You have to find the motivation that doesn't like crazy. [SPEAKER_05]: People don't think they're crazy villains. [SPEAKER_05]: I don't think they're villains. [SPEAKER_05]: And [SPEAKER_05]: So I just think they're so gifted and finding that, like, both in and Blair and Paris, because they could have been so one-dimensional mean girl.

1:18:10 [SPEAKER_05]: But instead it's like, I feel for Paris. [SPEAKER_05]: And like, especially the Paris-Rory Blair Serena trope, where it's like, God, everything is so easy for you. [SPEAKER_05]: You know, it's this idea that like Paris and Blair tries so hard [SPEAKER_05]: Never enough, you know, and and Blair and Serena and Rory just kind of waltz through life not that they're not that Rory, you know, isn't like working hard and certainly it's like, no, but a lot of things feel like they get handed to them and things work out for them and they're just like, well, yeah, and then you go through it's like, what they're like, what they're like, what they're like, what they're like, what they're like, what they're like, what they're like, what they're like, what they're like, what they're like, what they're like, what they're like, what they're like, what they're like, what they're like, what they're like, what they're like, what they're like, what they're like, what they're like, what they're like, what they're like, what they're like, what they're like, what they're like, what they're like, what they're like, what they're

1:18:48 [SPEAKER_02]: book, especially when it comes to the college comparison. [SPEAKER_02]: Absolutely. [SPEAKER_02]: Because as we know, like Paris is just like Harvard, Harvard, Harvard, and it's funny that they both end up going to Yale because Blair is Yale, Yale, Yale, Yale, one, Serena, Vanderwitz. [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, and we all have that friendship too, and I think that's what a group person it's it's killer and it's like it's so it's so I love that part of the show it's one of my favorite storylines it's also there are a few moments for Blair that are really hard for me to watch and that would be one of them at the party but at the same time I'm like [SPEAKER_05]: Serena does her shit, you know, when when Blair when Serena takes Blair's answer, and at the at the Yale party, and it's just like Blair acts crazy and yeah, what how to put that.

1:19:43 [SPEAKER_05]: But she's also she's acting like it's her inner child. [SPEAKER_05]: You know, it's like I just see it so differently, but like it's it's a very similar thing with Paris, and I think Rory and Serena are also always given the benefit of the doubt. [SPEAKER_05]: Whereas Paris and Blair, I think most people's first impression of them because they've learned to be so guarded and have this heart exterior.

1:20:04 [SPEAKER_05]: They're like automatically thought of as mean girls. [SPEAKER_05]: So they automatically have to work a little bit harder to witness people over. [SPEAKER_05]: Whereas Rory and Serena are kind of like whatever. [SPEAKER_05]: And so people just automatically like, well, look at these pretty nice girls.

1:20:18 [SPEAKER_05]: They must be good. [SPEAKER_05]: You know, and they must deserve all these things. [SPEAKER_02]: They're definitely less threatening. [SPEAKER_02]: And I think that [SPEAKER_02]: Blair and Paris both come in with a very abrasive Yes, energy very much another character that comes in with a very abrasive energy Is no more yes, and but she is also a character that like seems not necessarily iridemeable from the beginning But seems very like oh, she's just like the bitchy mom who's daughter ran away and she's now like the rich [SPEAKER_05]: like snob and then you realize that there's so much more to her so much hurt too like it's like you realize like there's a lot of pain there there's a lot of pain and and there's a lot of like not wanting to be rejected and not wanting to like like I see so much of the dynamic between Emily and Laura lie it's just like

1:21:10 [SPEAKER_05]: both of them, but more so Emily trying to protect herself from getting hurt by her daughter again, you know, and it's like, well, if I just keep you here and I just, oh, you're always like, I know, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah

1:21:35 [SPEAKER_05]: thing for but I think also being raised in high society to like Emily and Blair, they have been raised to look for old tear your motives to protect themselves. [SPEAKER_05]: They've been raised in this like cut throat kind of world that Laura Leigh has protected Rory from and in a lot of ways, I don't know that Lily has protected Serena at all, but like it's Laura Leigh's created this world that Rory doesn't have to [SPEAKER_05]: feel that as much and yeah.

1:22:05 [SPEAKER_05]: And that's a luxury that Emily and Blair do not have. [SPEAKER_05]: And so they are a result of that. [SPEAKER_05]: And it's like they had to do what they have to do to survive. [SPEAKER_05]: And I don't blame them. [SPEAKER_02]: No, I nor do I, but that's what makes them so interesting.

1:22:18 [SPEAKER_05]: Yes. [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, they're so layered like they're so good. [SPEAKER_05]: to be a fly on the wall. [SPEAKER_05]: I just want Paris and Emily to just like go out for drinks together, just them to and Blair actually throw all three of them together. [SPEAKER_05]: Oh my god, could you imagine the bar would catch on fire.

1:22:32 [SPEAKER_02]: I know the bar would literally be lit on fire, but they would take over the world. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, they like the bar. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, 100%. [SPEAKER_02]: And the thing is, is that, like, we don't really know a lot about Emily, and like her past, I mean, so I think it would be really easy.

1:22:50 [SPEAKER_02]: We talk often about the prequel series that makes this between Emily and Richard in the Gilmore Girls universe. [SPEAKER_02]: And I feel like Blair Waldorf would be the type for young people. [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, [SPEAKER_02]: her ambition, her kind of cutthroat mentality, her style, her style.

1:23:12 [SPEAKER_05]: That's sort of like old money class sophisticated. [SPEAKER_05]: Yes, exactly. [SPEAKER_02]: The other fun fact was just so niche is that I believe it's season one, Richard makes a comment about how Emily was like a fierce field hockey player on the field hockey team and like took out all the girls.

1:23:32 [SPEAKER_02]: And we get, we get Blair's sport when she's a gym and she, she's not absolutely annihilated Serena and I was like, that is so Emily Gilmore quoted. [SPEAKER_05]: Yes, she's just dressed out. [SPEAKER_05]: Yes, it's like that stressed out misunderstood girl to athletics superhuman pipeline is as well Virginia George is there.

1:23:54 [SPEAKER_05]: Virginia George exactly. [SPEAKER_05]: I have a little anger. [SPEAKER_02]: I got to have a little little fire in you that [SPEAKER_02]: Exactly. [SPEAKER_02]: And like that's their competitive side. [SPEAKER_02]: And I can just see, you know, Emily and Richard being what Blair and Chuck become.

1:24:09 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, I love that. [SPEAKER_02]: It's, I do think that Blair has a lot more drive to be like, Emily Gilmore is fine with her identity being Richard Gilmore's voice. [SPEAKER_02]: Claire doesn't want that for her son. [SPEAKER_02]: No, in that of her. [SPEAKER_02]: She's much more Paris. [SPEAKER_02]: She's like, no, I'm going to be a doctor.

1:24:29 [SPEAKER_02]: Exactly. [SPEAKER_05]: That's why neither can be perfect. [SPEAKER_05]: Like she has to. [SPEAKER_05]: It is really a hybrid. [SPEAKER_02]: Really is the hybrid. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, but I totally like. [SPEAKER_02]: the love and the relationship in general between Emily and Richard being somewhat of a variation.

1:24:44 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, Blair and chocolate. [SPEAKER_05]: I totally, you know, totally see that and like I could just see, I would just love to get also some content of Blair and Chuck, like as parents and and moving on and just kind of seeing how they, because I do, I think you're right and it's like, we don't get that for Emily, like the [SPEAKER_05]: story, but we don't have the post show story for Blair, and I bet there would be a lot of over that.

1:25:15 [SPEAKER_05]: It's hard. [SPEAKER_05]: It's a little hard for me to see for Chuck, just because right now I mind he's he's villainous because I just wanted to tell him. [SPEAKER_05]: But like, and I don't [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know, do you think Rich like, well, I got, but there's also an aspect where it's like when you're raised in this world, I think it was different and I think that a lot of people made a lot of mistakes and then you don't, they don't get that vibe as full-grown adults.

1:25:39 [SPEAKER_02]: So you wouldn't have to say so. [SPEAKER_02]: Well, let's talk about Chuck because I think that his character comparisons like I kind of want to take a little bit from like more than two characters and put them into Chuck because he is like you said like so different at the beginning because at the beginning I put like okay he's kind of like a Tristan Logan combo He is you know like wealthy bad boy with daddy issues who seemingly a bachelor until he only has eyes and softness for one girl Yes, you know like Logan and Tristan [SPEAKER_02]: and like Logan is down bad for where we go more, like Chuck is for Blair.

1:26:13 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: But... [SPEAKER_02]: Also has the redemption arc of a Jasperiano and that's the thing is like eruding for him because even though he seems like he's kind of irredeemable in moments For chocolates at the beginning and for chess it's sort of towards the middle of history, right?

1:26:29 [SPEAKER_02]: The redemption arc is what makes you fall in love with him. [SPEAKER_05]: Right, it's so true, and I think in group for him When I was thinking of like who I would compare Chuck to, I was like coming up blank Like I was like, I don't [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know that I see him really, and at first, my first instinct was just that.

1:26:47 [SPEAKER_05]: And I was like, is it just because I like just the most, and I'm like, Chuck and Blair. [SPEAKER_05]: And I think it's just a little bit of that like bad boy vibe where it's like, [SPEAKER_05]: Everyone's a little wary, everyone's like, I don't know about this and not sort of the energy towards pursuing any like romance with these characters and then they can sort of like turn out to be what you thought they might be and you feel stupid like it's that moment of like God, I really should have kind of pegged this from the get go everyone set it in my dump, you know, like about like when Chuck trades Blair for the the hotel it's like [SPEAKER_05]: It's like Blair feels so fucking stupid, like the writing was on the wall, you know, and it's not that I think the writing is on the wall for Jess, but I just think just coming in as sort of bad boy Jess, like that is sort of the the energy and

1:27:38 [SPEAKER_05]: But I also see a lot of the Logan and sort of just the smurmy smoothness of Logan. [SPEAKER_05]: I'm Chuck Bass kind of thing, you know? [SPEAKER_02]: And his future in a lot of ways is a lot is really laid out for him and the same way that Logan is and that he has this very, very volatile relationship with his father that is like he [SPEAKER_02]: Once his approval so badly in some ways, I think Chuck wanted the approval from his father more so, especially in like a post-mortem kind of way.

1:28:12 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: But Logan is constantly, I don't think seeking the validation from his father in such an intense way, but like knows that he has something he has to live up to and therefore like that kind of... [SPEAKER_02]: Crete's tension between him and his dad.

1:28:31 [SPEAKER_02]: So that's the other parallel I draw there is not just in his relationship with worry or romanticly, it's just more over like his familial expectations that are placed on him. [SPEAKER_05]: It's almost like they want the approval of their dad so bad. [SPEAKER_05]: They fear they're never going to get it.

1:28:49 [SPEAKER_05]: So that they create this like rift or this whatever this wall up or it's like if I don't want it that bad never getting it can't hurt me kind of a thing and it's so they sort of like shield themselves a little bit with all of this tumultuous sniss and their relationships with their with their fathers like working for it but also kind of like sticking it to their dad in a way too or trying to prove also a like I don't [SPEAKER_05]: You know, I don't know.

1:29:20 [SPEAKER_05]: It's like he'll do it. [SPEAKER_05]: It's so complicated. [SPEAKER_05]: And it's like the daddy issue aspect that makes them also a lot more vulnerable and gives them a lot of their vulnerability gives them a lot of their. [SPEAKER_05]: like a ability a little bit too where it's like, oh, I can relate to that.

1:29:36 [SPEAKER_05]: You know, there's not a lot about you. [SPEAKER_05]: I can relate to, but I can relate to that. [SPEAKER_05]: And that totally. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, no totally. [SPEAKER_05]: I'm with you. [SPEAKER_02]: That's why he's a little bit like a culmination of a few different characters because like you could take the daddy issues from Logan and maybe even Justin.

1:29:51 [SPEAKER_02]: Tristan is really smart me like at the beginning. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, he's more smart me than Logan especially. [SPEAKER_02]: Tristan's in high school and Logan we meet in college. [SPEAKER_02]: He's a little bit, I mean, he still has some maturity, but he's a lot more I think we're meeting Logan at a time that we would be meeting Chuck and like see yeah you know.

1:30:09 [SPEAKER_05]: I think I'm really with you on the trust and thing and I kind of didn't even like think about him when I was thinking about Chuck and like I know I think you're so [SPEAKER_05]: Right. [SPEAKER_05]: Like, I think you're so it's really, really a call. [SPEAKER_05]: Like, and I would put the, the Logan and the Trist, like I feel like, like, they are kind of one.

1:30:30 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: And then you got to get over here. [SPEAKER_02]: And then like you also have like a little bit of Richard, because like to your point earlier about like us not really knowing much about Emily and Richard, but seeing maybe some of their future or seeing some of the house of Chuck and Blair and seeing some of [SPEAKER_02]: Like, based on what Richard is described as in the show, I don't think he's as like, I hate to keep using this word, but as smart me as Chuck is, especially at the beginning, and the ways he's introduced to us.

1:31:01 [SPEAKER_02]: But he is maybe, like he is described as a quote, a quote, Lothario. [SPEAKER_02]: Like he is meant to be a little bit paralleled up against Logan. [SPEAKER_02]: That like, great college. [SPEAKER_02]: He was just kind of like a man trying to have a good time. [SPEAKER_02]: And so when we could kind of put that up, [SPEAKER_02]: You know, alongside Chuck, I don't know.

1:31:19 [SPEAKER_02]: Right. [SPEAKER_05]: And also I think that the way it's like this imperfect, first of all, imperfect partner who their willing, like, like just seeing that Emily in Richard and it's like Chuck and Blair, the way that they're willing to really work through adversity and kind of like they don't write each other off for the misapps that happened.

1:31:42 [SPEAKER_05]: And they're really shit, but it's like, [SPEAKER_05]: Although, again, like Emily being comfortable just being like Richard's wife, I don't see that as much for a player, but the power couple dynamic, where it's like we're gonna be these really wealthy powerful, sophisticated people. [SPEAKER_05]: And we're not gonna let the crack show to the public and we're gonna, you know, but it's also gonna be a good one.

1:32:03 [SPEAKER_05]: As a united front, but it's also exactly. [SPEAKER_04]: Like, yes, totally. [SPEAKER_02]: Totally. [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, so moving into Nate, [SPEAKER_02]: Yes. [SPEAKER_02]: Who we haven't really talked a lot about. [SPEAKER_02]: Mostly because bless is hard. [SPEAKER_02]: He's super forgettable.

1:32:18 [SPEAKER_02]: And for those reasons, I have him as like a dean for Logan. [SPEAKER_02]: kind of crossover, yes, because I feel like the expectations that are put on him for like his future are very kind of Logan coded, but you could also put that in the same category as Christopher. [SPEAKER_02]: It's like seeing about the expectations that his family puts on him, but also like a little boring, like Dean, like a little kind of like [SPEAKER_02]: forgettable no offense.

1:32:54 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, but we'll never quit the girl they fell in love with the high school and exactly that's. [SPEAKER_05]: Yes, I was just going to say that I think there's like that piece of Dean or that piece of Nate that's very Dean asked is like his moral compass goes out the window when it comes to Serena.

1:33:10 [SPEAKER_05]: Like Karate has blinders on to everything else when she walks in the room and that feels very Dean and Rory like and what's interesting [SPEAKER_05]: Why does Nate feel so much more redeemable to me than Dean? [SPEAKER_05]: You know what I mean? [SPEAKER_05]: Like, I know, I just like, good guy Nate, even though like, I mean, he did cheat on Blair with her best for like, it's like, [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know if you've been ever talking about this or like who are we more mad at for for that you know like and in a way for me I'm like I'm really pissed with Serena for getting on a train and leaving the next day and like Running away from this and being the best friend and like you kind of expect should he behave you're from men more than you want to expect it from like your sister Like men coming go, but like your you know your best friend is forever, but

1:34:00 [SPEAKER_05]: It's like that kind of a moment with Nate and also just his judgment just is not always strong like as much as he's like got a hard goal and I believe that about Nate think he can very easily be swayed by the people around him and by his heart and so sometimes he's just not thinking what this had he's not the smartest dude like and And that's kind of sometimes what I think about Dean and what I think about Christopher I don't feel that way about Logan [SPEAKER_02]: So that's why I'm like later and it's kind of like coming in as like a touch at the end, but it's mostly Dean at Christopher like Logan feels like who Nate could have been like if Nate Yeah, you know what I mean like totally kind of like 100% yeah, but the other thing is that like that is very Christopher coded

1:34:45 [SPEAKER_02]: And what also I think makes him Christopher coated is that I feel like the relationship between Blair and Nate is very lower like Christopher. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it's not a good point. [SPEAKER_02]: These are the two that our parents like we loved each other. [SPEAKER_02]: We wanted to first love like, [SPEAKER_02]: But they were always rooting for the two of us to be together and like, you know, conversations about it.

1:35:08 [SPEAKER_02]: And I think that they are what lureline Christopher would have been, you know, hard plan, not gotten pregnant. [SPEAKER_02]: They were the plan. [SPEAKER_02]: Right, they were the guys to plan one hundred person totally with you. [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, we just just being together forever, and it's like I totally see if Blair got knocked up from Nate because I they a hundred percent would have gotten married and that would have just been that like herbal you know [SPEAKER_05]: probably wouldn't have been that.

1:35:34 [SPEAKER_05]: They probably would have been a similar story like later, Lorelie and Christopher, but it's like, they, their parents would have just been like, well, okay, that's, you know, what was your, you're supposed to be together. [SPEAKER_05]: So you're going to just make this work. [SPEAKER_05]: And it's going to, whatever.

1:35:49 [SPEAKER_05]: And you might be miserable, but, but it's what's at least you're together. [SPEAKER_02]: Exactly. [SPEAKER_02]: Exactly. [SPEAKER_02]: But on that note, you could also make the same comparison about Serena and Nate. [SPEAKER_02]: being. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, totally. [SPEAKER_02]: For her because like Nate is always going to carry a torch for Serena for whatever we just absolutely.

1:36:06 [SPEAKER_02]: I actually feel that way about Logan and Roy. [SPEAKER_05]: Logan was always going to carry a torch for them answering the phone with his with his wife and butt, you know, like exactly like it's literally so that. [SPEAKER_05]: It's so that we're like, we're when Serena walks into the party and we hear Eleanor say Blair Serena's here, and it's like Like Blair's about literally a personality and he's like he's on top of him and he's literally Serena It's just like it's like the cartoon where the bunny or whatever is like just sniffing floating through the air following the smell like that's [SPEAKER_05]: We think the bunny.

1:36:46 [SPEAKER_05]: Okay. [SPEAKER_04]: The bunny. [SPEAKER_04]: The bunny. [SPEAKER_04]: The bunny. [SPEAKER_04]: All in my small man. [SPEAKER_05]: Oh my god. [SPEAKER_05]: The bunny come up bugs. [SPEAKER_05]: But yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: Like Nate. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: He's just he's kind of like a little bit of a loser.

1:36:58 [SPEAKER_02]: Kind of like Dean. [SPEAKER_02]: Sorry, yes. [SPEAKER_05]: No totally totally. [SPEAKER_05]: I think Dean's a total freaking loser. [SPEAKER_05]: And I just like Nate a little bit more because also I think we have to put into perspective the context with which these characters exist. [SPEAKER_05]: So like Nate is truly existing in a world of degenerates and these people who are genuinely bad.

1:37:19 [SPEAKER_05]: So it's like he seems like the best guy whereas like Dean is kind of in this world [SPEAKER_05]: It's a it's a little bit brighter in shinier and cozier and so when he does the really bad thing it's like who it feels a little bit different like it feels a little bit less forgetable to me.

1:37:36 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I'm just I guess I'm just more willing to overlook some stuff for Nate because it's like if I don't like him who kind of like like who is there to root for us a man [SPEAKER_02]: They do really like instantly redeem him whereas I feel like Dean is not very redeemable. [SPEAKER_02]: No, no, his his golden boy really.

1:37:56 [SPEAKER_02]: I mean golden boy talk about the exact glass of Crawford's like golden boy is so true. [SPEAKER_02]: But it really starts to take like, it goes downhill for Dean, whereas we're kind of strong from the bottom of the thing. [SPEAKER_02]: And he's redeemed a little bit. [SPEAKER_02]: We also see him in different relationships.

1:38:10 [SPEAKER_02]: We don't ever relate. [SPEAKER_02]: We see Dean with Lindsey, but he also fucks that up. [SPEAKER_02]: So, you know, we see Nate really step in as a friend for Chuck. [SPEAKER_02]: We see him step in as a friend for Blair when they're no longer, you know, a thing. [SPEAKER_02]: But yeah, the [SPEAKER_02]: kind of, uh, or the Blair and Nate comparison to Loreline Christopher can also, I think, show through the way that he does show up for Blair during the times when, um, like, neither of them have anything going on, he's just familiar, like, he's just kind of like slow right now, you're a familiar face, you know?

1:38:51 [SPEAKER_05]: You can always call me kind of a thing like I'm always going to pick up the foam for you and like we have so much history and there's so much there that at the end of the day like I'm always going to root for you. [SPEAKER_05]: I will show up for you. [SPEAKER_05]: We might always have a what if kind of a moment, but at the end of the day like it's it's not the fit even though I think yeah now I'm I'm totally I think that's a great great.

1:39:22 [SPEAKER_02]: just for me. [SPEAKER_02]: Really? [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, yeah, but who is it for you? [SPEAKER_02]: I think Dan Humphrey is very Gilmore and Marty. [SPEAKER_05]: Oh my god, wait, okay, not me being so locked into gender norms that I didn't even go there. [SPEAKER_05]: Oh my god, shame on me.

1:39:41 [SPEAKER_05]: Okay, okay, okay, well yes, because I was like, it's not perfect with jazz. [SPEAKER_05]: That's so not a perfect, but I just didn't know why her [SPEAKER_05]: I'm on the wrong side of the track. [SPEAKER_05]: I'm like, you know what I mean? [SPEAKER_05]: Like, there's a little bit of like the, not even the dance got a bad boy vibe to him, but a little bit of the, I'm not who you're supposed to be with.

1:40:05 [SPEAKER_05]: And like, you know what I mean? [SPEAKER_03]: Okay. [SPEAKER_05]: And also, we're adding in the Luke relationship. [SPEAKER_05]: It makes me think of the roofess, slilly thing, like, of course, you know. [SPEAKER_05]: And I think the, a lot of why Rory's into it is like, [SPEAKER_05]: similar reasons twice to renaissance a day and at first like I don't know but I don't obviously like it's not a perfect comparison it just was who I immediately was like I just must be just but now obviously when you say rory like yeah wait I want to hear you talk more about this okay I so am with you but I just hadn't even explored it and I know you have.

1:40:45 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, of course. [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, so he has like the small town boy charm that like at first I was like, oh, Dean, but I was like, well, no, it's Rory. [SPEAKER_02]: Like Rory is going to this elite prep school that she otherwise would not be able to get him to if it wasn't for her grades and her grandparents, but like Dan is there on a scholarship.

1:41:07 [SPEAKER_02]: Right. [SPEAKER_02]: And it's because he's smart and he worked his ass off to get into school that like his [SPEAKER_02]: Dad who like we could make a lot of lower-like comparisons to we did sort of at the beginning of this episode like [SPEAKER_02]: wants to kind of shield him from this world.

1:41:24 [SPEAKER_02]: And I think that that's the same thing, totally. [SPEAKER_02]: But Dan, like, especially once where he goes to college and she starts dating Logan, I feel like Laura Lye is like, oh, fuck. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, I didn't totally part of this world. [SPEAKER_05]: I don't want her in this world and [SPEAKER_02]: and seeing with Rufus Rufus, I mean, his connection is to Lily, who is showing his mom.

1:41:47 [SPEAKER_02]: So it's a lot more of like a love rhombus. [SPEAKER_02]: But it's like, [SPEAKER_02]: Dan and Serena dating for Rufus is like, oh fuck. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: I don't want him to be immersed in this world. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, I want him to get a good education. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, I want him to go to college.

1:42:04 [SPEAKER_02]: I want all of these things for him. [SPEAKER_02]: And Dan has this dream of going to Dartmouth. [SPEAKER_02]: Right. [SPEAKER_02]: Really wanting like that is what he is constantly working towards He's a writer. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: You know, like he's very interested in those things.

1:42:17 [SPEAKER_02]: But I also drew the Marty comparison because Marty is [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, I'm the small town boy kind of energy. [SPEAKER_02]: I came here on a scholarship. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm really smart. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm really nerdy. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: Nice guys always finish last. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm like, I want to be with Serena, but Serena is like this on attainable thing and she's always going to go for the rich guy.

1:42:41 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: It feels [SPEAKER_05]: kind of like that when it's smarty like oh I have to work a job I can't just like skate by I see the Marty a lot I think I might there's a part of me too and maybe it's a trip on my shoulder with Rory but I in my mind I'm like there's a piece of Dan to me that is like [SPEAKER_05]: he is going to have to work as hard as he possibly can for all of these opportunities.

1:43:11 [SPEAKER_05]: And although it might seem that warriors, I still feel at the end of the day, had she failed at something like really failed, like not just gotten into a different ivy. [SPEAKER_05]: There would have been that kind of like wind beneath her wings, that would have picked her up and saved her.

1:43:28 [SPEAKER_05]: And I feel like Dan had to create that a little bit more for himself. [SPEAKER_05]: And maybe I get a chance as more sinister, because. [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, for sure. [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, for sure. [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, it's not. [SPEAKER_02]: Worries not sure not us. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, like, and so I think in my mind, I'm late.

1:43:44 [SPEAKER_02]: But she is writing articles right about them. [SPEAKER_05]: No, you're right. [SPEAKER_05]: You're right. [SPEAKER_05]: You're right. [SPEAKER_05]: You know, so right. [SPEAKER_05]: So it's like, I can find something. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm so alert. [SPEAKER_05]: By the way, he is going to eat those.

1:43:57 [SPEAKER_05]: That's nice. [SPEAKER_02]: That's nice. [SPEAKER_05]: And I really, yeah, thought of that. [SPEAKER_05]: Like, [SPEAKER_05]: It's trending. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, it's so easy to compare like gender to gender, and I was just like, I do feel like Dan Humphrey in some ways is kind of an outsider.

1:44:11 [SPEAKER_02]: Even though they speak about him. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, yeah. [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: Like Paris speaks about Rory and being from a small town is the way that the like Blair Waldorf speaks about Dan being from Brooklyn. [SPEAKER_02]: Right. [SPEAKER_02]: It's like you really live in Brooklyn.

1:44:24 [SPEAKER_02]: Totally. [SPEAKER_02]: Exactly. [SPEAKER_02]: But that might as well be like make a left at the cow like that is at the the rooster statue is voices and it's like that's kind of how Blair talks about yeah Dan Humphrey and her disability for him is also kind of similar to how Paris feels more.

1:44:44 [SPEAKER_05]: Yes, yeah totally with you and it's like this there's this like pull between them that they like [SPEAKER_05]: more so I feel for for the Paris and for the Blair, where it's like, oh, there's something about you, like, oh, I hate you, Humphrey, you know, whatever it is, but but we're gonna like you.

1:45:03 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, and like we're gonna see each other in a way that we're not seen by other people that feels really good once we let it and there's there's a part of it too that's like we're gonna peak the academic intellectual part of each other's brains in a [SPEAKER_05]: And other people can't understand us.

1:45:25 [SPEAKER_02]: So my friends, Madeleine and Louise from Paris, can't understand you the way we're going to get more done. [SPEAKER_02]: Right. [SPEAKER_05]: Right. [SPEAKER_05]: Exactly. [SPEAKER_05]: And you have feels. [SPEAKER_05]: It feels so good like to be seen that way and it's like, you almost will do anything to sort of like keep it which brings me to like Dan and Blair kind of being together.

1:45:42 [SPEAKER_05]: It's like, well, this feels really good to be in this kind of relationship. [SPEAKER_05]: Like, why don't we just really see where it goes with the end of the day. [SPEAKER_05]: It's just not a romantic fit because it's a friendship that and that's totally what we see with. [SPEAKER_05]: Paris and Murray obviously.

1:45:56 [SPEAKER_05]: It's like, totally. [SPEAKER_05]: But I definitely see the Marty as well because I think Dan like just you know if you gun and Phoebe and I have decided that we're going into the show like we went into pretty little layers spoiler free because I had not seen it. [SPEAKER_05]: We've both in gossip girl.

1:46:15 [SPEAKER_05]: So, yeah, there's no need to be an spoiler for you. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, and like I know we have a lot of people who like, we're with us through pretty little liars who are now coming with us to Gossip Girl, who haven't seen it and are watching it for the first time. [SPEAKER_05]: And so it's like this tough thing, but Anthony had it ruined for him because, uh, is it pin-baglier pin-baggly?

1:46:35 [SPEAKER_05]: Badgly. [SPEAKER_05]: I always say badgly. [SPEAKER_05]: Okay, okay. [SPEAKER_05]: I hear some people say bad-baggly, sometimes that I'm like, oh, no. [SPEAKER_05]: Why are you? [SPEAKER_05]: They're wrong. [SPEAKER_05]: Okay, sorry. [SPEAKER_05]: No, I know, I mean, it's written as badly.

1:46:45 [SPEAKER_05]: Okay. [SPEAKER_05]: So I think that you're human on call her daddy and Anthony actually saw a clip that like spoiled it. [SPEAKER_05]: And it's like at the end of the day, the show has been out for a million years. [SPEAKER_02]: No, literally. [SPEAKER_05]: You know, it's like people saying that there were wicked spoilers for act to him.

1:46:58 [SPEAKER_05]: Like, okay. [SPEAKER_05]: So the musical has been out since 2003, like there's no, there's a spoiler. [SPEAKER_05]: You know, but yeah, like I think that it's we're going into it acknowledging who [SPEAKER_02]: Dan is and that he is a girl and which is bright night talking about this all the time.

1:47:15 [SPEAKER_02]: We're like, what? [SPEAKER_02]: It makes sense. [SPEAKER_02]: It makes sense. [SPEAKER_02]: It makes sense. [SPEAKER_02]: Literally no sense. [SPEAKER_02]: Okay. [SPEAKER_05]: Yes, and we do think we're going to have like some fun with it. [SPEAKER_05]: Like I think we were like he's got to have interns and there've got to be people because there's like Dan is never sending and some of these things about his sister.

1:47:30 [SPEAKER_05]: I'm sorry now about himself and so I think that [SPEAKER_05]: In our minds we're like okay there are interns who like go rogue sometimes and dance like have a child with them about blah blah and your damage. [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah for sure. [SPEAKER_05]: But at the end of the day, we're going into it with the knowledge that he is gossip girl and so sort of looking at from that standpoint of like, if we know he's gossip girl, how does that change the story so much because no one knew he was going to be gossip like it wasn't.

1:47:56 [SPEAKER_05]: I really just feel like it was one of those moments where, like, let's pull an aim out of a hat and, like, everybody is like, like, like, so who's it going to be? [SPEAKER_02]: Exactly. [SPEAKER_02]: Exactly. [SPEAKER_05]: Similar to the A reveal at the end. [SPEAKER_02]: It's like, literally, you know, what I love about, like, the transition from pretty little virus across the girl is that it's still very, like, so ridiculous.

1:48:14 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it's the same that it's like, who is this person, this mysterious person, who's like torturing us? [SPEAKER_05]: Who's torturing everybody? [SPEAKER_05]: It's just on a different, yeah, it's interesting how similar [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, so like, for Dan, we're looking at it from that standpoint, and I see him as such a well if I can't, you know, join the A-listers, I'm going to just make their lives taller.

1:48:36 [SPEAKER_05]: I'm just going to have this trip on my shoulder about it, and like, I'm going to be the nice guy's finish last, I'm going to be all these things, and like, Dan just could have ended up, if he hadn't gone on that day of a serena, he really could have ended up like a bad dude, okay, like, in cell vibes, you know what I mean?

1:48:51 [SPEAKER_02]: But like, like, but like, he could have ended up, [SPEAKER_05]: Joe and you. [SPEAKER_05]: Oh my god. [SPEAKER_05]: Yes, 100% we talked about that too. [SPEAKER_05]: We're like, that's just like is who Dan is if he didn't end up with Serena. [SPEAKER_05]: That's who Kirby comes. [SPEAKER_05]: But yes.

1:49:07 [SPEAKER_05]: And it is funny that he plays that role. [SPEAKER_05]: Like it's hilarious, uh, parallel there and Penn Banzo is film history, but anyway, um, yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: And with you, I, but I see the Marty thing, especially like the beginning and a little bit of that that like chip on your shoulder kind of vibe that [SPEAKER_05]: I subscribe so much to Dan right now.

1:49:26 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I don't I agree with you that I don't really see that and we're go more. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, the big chip on your shoulder. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I do see it in the sense that like she is a little bit of an outsider. [SPEAKER_02]: I think she leans into a part of what she wants to be part of that world and she's intrigued by it.

1:49:40 [SPEAKER_02]: But like Dan desperately wants to be a part of that world. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes. [SPEAKER_02]: And that's with Marty, you don't really find out if he wants to be right. [SPEAKER_02]: He has to stay in for it, but you don't find out if he wants to be a part of that right.

1:49:52 [SPEAKER_02]: I think he has a lot of opinions about the people who are a part of it in the sense of love of like Logan calm and thin and all of those guys. [SPEAKER_02]: I really hate those guys. [SPEAKER_02]: And I think that he would feel the same way about like Chuck and Nate totally with friends with them.

1:50:07 [SPEAKER_02]: But you know, yeah, it just takes a different turn. [SPEAKER_02]: But yeah, I really attribute a lot of his outside orness and kind of some of the things that he does throughout the series to a worry go more. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, and especially in that in the beginning, like I just think [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, no, I'm really with you there.

1:50:25 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: So we already talked about her a little bit, but Lily is very much like a Laurel I Emily crossover. [SPEAKER_02]: I, you know, we already talked about it so we don't need to rehash it, but I do think that she Um, similarly to Emily like really prioritizes wealth and societal standing and I think had Laurel I followed that path of prioritizing that as well.

1:50:47 [SPEAKER_02]: She, that, that would be Lily Vanderwood 100% would be her 100% yes. [SPEAKER_02]: But moving into Rufus, I also love kind of the lore like comparison when it comes to him, but that's not who I put down. [SPEAKER_02]: Who did you put down? [SPEAKER_05]: I feel like it's like the obvious one, and I feel like it's going to be, well, it's obvious to me that you might have a similarity action of it.

1:51:10 [SPEAKER_05]: I think it's Luke. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, I put Luke meets Christopher. [SPEAKER_02]: Okay. [SPEAKER_02]: Now I'm totally with you on that. [SPEAKER_02]: You know, like because of the comparison of less Lily and Rufus being Should the lower line, Christopher 100% So the lower line Christopher, like they were young love, but it would almost be as if like a young, lower line a young Luke met.

1:51:33 [SPEAKER_02]: And Emily didn't approach and was like, I think that when CC goes to Rufus and is like don't be with my daughter, like that is very Emily. [SPEAKER_02]: A hundred percent. [SPEAKER_05]: I totally agree. [SPEAKER_05]: And I think to the way that like [SPEAKER_05]: just kind of rufus and lily's back and forth also really reminds me of Lorelie and Luke like we were just talking about it in this first episode and we were wondering so there's a moment where like lily's first line of the episode of this show is her talking about a random painting that was recommended to her and it doesn't go with her furniture.

1:52:10 [SPEAKER_05]: and later on she pays a visit to rufus at the art gallery and he's like oh are you here to tell me that like the art doesn't go with your furniture or something so I'm like oh was she already buying the art from rufus like how in contact are they really but the way that they just she walks in rufus why is my daughter you know like they just have this little thing where they pretend to not like each other they pretend to hate each other a little bit [SPEAKER_05]: through gritted teeth, they just cannot not love each other.

1:52:43 [SPEAKER_05]: Like they're a little smirk in the glimmer in their eye. [SPEAKER_05]: And it's like, it makes me wish that Rufus and really ended up together because I'm like, [SPEAKER_05]: Makes me feel like they're meant to be like a little bit more. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm sorry, you know, Serena should not have No, you should have been endgame for life.

1:53:00 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm gonna be so upset when I get to the point where they're no longer together Oh, I know because my heart because like it just doesn't it works. [SPEAKER_05]: It doesn't make sense They get there like it feels like [SPEAKER_05]: And it also was like then what was it all for what was all the shit you to put everyone else through what was that all for What was that all for we don't get no, I'm sorry.

1:53:18 [SPEAKER_05]: Oh Oh, she got there. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, but it's like it should have been Blair and Chuck and Rufus and Lily those were the two [SPEAKER_02]: relationships that we've been rooting for us on the beginning. [SPEAKER_05]: 100% I'm like everyone. [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, Nate didn't end up paired up.

1:53:31 [SPEAKER_05]: Everyone didn't have to even end up paired up. [SPEAKER_05]: You know, we didn't have to but everyone it's that same thing with like the Ezra and Ariya thing we're just like people. [SPEAKER_05]: I think got really obsessed with the Dan and Serena trope and yeah, I guess. [SPEAKER_02]: I liked them like when I first rewatched the show after not having watched it for a while.

1:53:50 [SPEAKER_02]: I did this at the beginning of 2023. [SPEAKER_02]: I loved swimming in Dan like at the beginning. [SPEAKER_02]: I was like, Oh, God, I forgot how much I love them. [SPEAKER_02]: I think they bring out the best in each other. [SPEAKER_02]: And then by the end, watching it, I was like, what the fuck are these two together?

1:54:02 [SPEAKER_02]: They just together. [SPEAKER_05]: But I'm also low-key, like, aren't you deserve each other? [SPEAKER_05]: Because in my mind, I'm like Serena signing off on the hell that Dan has created and all of your lives forever. [SPEAKER_05]: If I'm Blair, I'm like, hey, [SPEAKER_05]: because he looked at what he did to all these people his own family and it's like Serena's like, well, you know, what are you gonna do?

1:54:26 [SPEAKER_04]: What are you gonna do? [SPEAKER_04]: What are you gonna do? [SPEAKER_05]: And it's like, yeah, exactly exactly. [SPEAKER_05]: And I'm like, I don't know. [SPEAKER_04]: I don't know. [SPEAKER_05]: Put it up. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: So for me, I'm just like, it says a lot to me about Serena that she like, [SPEAKER_05]: stands by her man in that moment because they I don't even they weren't even like together I think when it's actually revealed because it's like a flash for it, right?

1:54:45 [SPEAKER_02]: Like I know yeah, I don't know because like these these last two seasons that I'm on. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I'm like I'm very intrigued to get into because like there's so many things that I forget and I admittedly once season five kind of season four and five gossip girls take off like that's where the Gilmore girls compare.

1:55:00 [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, it's really come to us preaching. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm like, the things that are happening, like, the, the, uh, scheming that's happening. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm like, different kind of word, we're, yes, exactly left, stars have left the station. [SPEAKER_02]: Exactly, we're just, we're so far away at this point.

1:55:17 [SPEAKER_02]: You can't even see the train. [SPEAKER_02]: No, so far gone, but I'm like, [SPEAKER_02]: I'm like kind of remembering what happened like as I'm watching it again. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm like, oh, right. [SPEAKER_02]: So I can't really, I just know what happens in the final because I think it was like a surprise.

1:55:30 [SPEAKER_05]: Like people were like, oh my god, are they going to be together? [SPEAKER_05]: We weren't sure. [SPEAKER_05]: And then it's a flash together and then we get a flash forward and like they're letting and Blair and talk out of a kid. [SPEAKER_05]: So it's like years later. [SPEAKER_05]: So I think that we, they're not together before that.

1:55:42 [SPEAKER_05]: But I'm just like, how do you reconcile after that? [SPEAKER_05]: Like, I totally agree. [SPEAKER_02]: But I will say it is giving like the Luke and Laura lie being Rufus and Lily, if that's the comparison we want to and like the Jess and Lori being the Dan and Sabrina, one of them had to end up together.

1:56:00 [SPEAKER_02]: And in Gilmore girls, it's Luke and Laura lie because otherwise then it's kind of like a kiss. [SPEAKER_05]: What's the point of all that, you know, from episode 1, what is the point of all that if they are not together and imagine if they had ended up together? [SPEAKER_04]: the revolution that would have taken place right in the streets like it would have been they still be out there.

1:56:19 [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, I'll hear them. [SPEAKER_02]: No, be out. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, exactly. [SPEAKER_02]: But yeah, so from the weekend in Serena. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it's like, okay, they're the ones that ended up together. [SPEAKER_02]: I don't agree with it, but [SPEAKER_02]: They couldn't both end up together.

1:56:32 [SPEAKER_02]: So if you really had to pick one and you wanted to pick these two, fine, but I think that Lily and Rufus were end game, I'm really upset. [SPEAKER_02]: They didn't end up together. [SPEAKER_02]: But what are you going to do? [SPEAKER_02]: Moving into Janney. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I'm free.

1:56:47 [SPEAKER_05]: I got to be honest with you. [SPEAKER_05]: I feel like Jenny based on her different air. [SPEAKER_05]: Like I could put a line through where little Jenny starts and little Jay starts, you know what I mean? [SPEAKER_02]: And like this is also a situation where it's like writers. [SPEAKER_02]: Really.

1:57:10 [SPEAKER_02]: The reigns and how to turn the wheel because she wanted out Taylor mom since she wanted out. [SPEAKER_02]: And I haven't listened to her call her daddy episode yet. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, it's a bummer because I feel like a lot of these people, except for like maybe, like, lively, the way they talk about the show, it's not super fun, but like, honestly, and a bond of it.

1:57:31 [SPEAKER_05]: No, and it makes me sad because like, [SPEAKER_05]: First of all, we can throw any hope of like them ever trying to do. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I guess I'm never going to happen, but and I get it, but I just it's it's interesting because it seems like time would heal that like even with the pretty little layers girls like there was definitely tension in the cast, especially if you're ready to be done with it, but now like.

1:57:56 [SPEAKER_05]: 15 years later, I think they all look at it like, oh, we're so grateful for that time in our lives. [SPEAKER_05]: It really was a happy time. [SPEAKER_05]: We can look past about the gossip broadcast is not seem to be able to do it in the same way, except like Chase Crawford and like lively like they and maybe Ed Weswick.

1:58:13 [SPEAKER_05]: But certainly not late [SPEAKER_05]: God also imagine the conversations that late in Mr. Adam Brody have being on my social media show. [SPEAKER_05]: We're created by the same people like literally, you know. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: So for those of you who might have, I mean, I feel like everybody knows.

1:58:35 [SPEAKER_02]: Like Mr. [SPEAKER_02]: Please bear Blair Waldorf and Adam Brody who played David Gowski on Gilmore Girls. [SPEAKER_02]: Mary. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: Love that they're Mary to each other. [SPEAKER_02]: And I have no watch. [SPEAKER_02]: Nobody wants this, but I've heard you have it.

1:58:47 [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, Tara, you're good. [SPEAKER_05]: I love it. [SPEAKER_05]: I will say this in one. [SPEAKER_05]: I think so. [SPEAKER_05]: I mean, I was like, I love it so much because season one I like to better But I was like, I love it so much because I have a podcast with my sister and wow to see that dynamic on screen.

1:59:03 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, it felt so real. [SPEAKER_05]: I wonder if watching it. [SPEAKER_05]: You will feel similarly. [SPEAKER_05]: I'm sure you have like a sisterly relationship with Haley, but like, [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah totally because you're not sisters. [SPEAKER_05]: I wonder if you'll have to let me know like if you if you feel that because I'm like oh my god.

1:59:17 [SPEAKER_05]: In episode in season two there's a moment where the two sisters have like this blowout fight but I still have to sit down and record and it's like [SPEAKER_05]: been there, so when you fuck her, it's literally like, and the way that they just get each other's goats on air and like they'll fight on air and that's what people love about the show and like that's a big thing.

1:59:36 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, Phoebe and I relate to, but um season one had a lot more podcast storyline then season two and I think [SPEAKER_05]: season, I don't know. [SPEAKER_05]: You got to watch it. [SPEAKER_04]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_04]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_05]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_05]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_05]: Oh my God.

1:59:48 [SPEAKER_05]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_05]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God.

1:59:57 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_00]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_00]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_00]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_00]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_00]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God.

2:00:01 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God.

2:00:04 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my God. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my [SPEAKER_02]: I'm like you were going to have a look at exactly. [SPEAKER_05]: I love that.

2:00:11 [SPEAKER_05]: Like and and she her cameo episode and season two is fabulous. [SPEAKER_05]: Layton, Mr. Tritle. [SPEAKER_05]: Like but I would say she's really only in one episode, which I think is kind of nice to that. [SPEAKER_05]: Like she lets it be his show and whatever. [SPEAKER_02]: I love it anyway.

2:00:30 [SPEAKER_02]: With Jenny, I agree with you that it's really hard to put one character on her because of the way they split it up. [SPEAKER_02]: Taylor Momsin really wanted to find an identity for her music that a lot of the character Jenny Humphrey. [SPEAKER_02]: She was like, I don't want to be one thing on screen and another thing off screen.

2:00:46 [SPEAKER_02]: I want these two to meld. [SPEAKER_02]: So if you watch the show, you'll see Jenny go from this. [SPEAKER_02]: We'll see you. [SPEAKER_02]: We'll see you. [SPEAKER_02]: We'll see you. [SPEAKER_02]: We'll see you. [SPEAKER_02]: We'll see you. [SPEAKER_02]: We'll see you. [SPEAKER_02]: but it's a giant change.

2:01:02 [SPEAKER_05]: Platinum Lana was like, whoa, every choice she makes sucks. [SPEAKER_05]: Like every thing she does, and you're like, you're too angry. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm just like, it's gone off the rails and her. [SPEAKER_02]: I know. [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, it's only me too. [SPEAKER_02]: She was so endearing and so sweet.

2:01:16 [SPEAKER_02]: And so like, there's a part of me that wants to compare her to Paris because she has like, I'm the dictive side. [SPEAKER_05]: But I do think that she's kind of like a lane can't I was gonna say that I was gonna say in the beginning I think she's got lane and do I keep bringing up my husband like how how male center can I be?

2:01:32 [SPEAKER_05]: But I have to tell you we've we took the like which Gilmore girls character. [SPEAKER_05]: Are you quick? [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, and you probably guess who I got I got Paris and he got a lane and he was like this can't be right He took it like six times you got lane every [SPEAKER_05]: I'm so pissed about anybody to be Luke yeah, and he got laying every time he was so mad But that's so funny.

2:01:56 [SPEAKER_02]: I love that he was like this thing must be perfect. [SPEAKER_05]: He was like this can't be right I was like, well, it kind of nailed me so like I'm not gonna lie. [SPEAKER_05]: I think [SPEAKER_05]: That's fine. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, I think it's pretty out there. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I think it's something.

2:02:06 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_05]: But I think in the beginning, she's got that and she's also like, although she doesn't have like a strict parent in the beginning, so to say, she kind of is like, I don't know how much I want my dad to know. [SPEAKER_05]: I'm part of this world vibe that Lane, I could compare it to her, eating like change when she gets to school kind of a thing where like totally, you know, Jenny, I think she knows that her dad isn't like, [SPEAKER_05]: Super proud of her wanting to be part of this world so bad.

2:02:32 [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, and [SPEAKER_05]: I don't know. [SPEAKER_05]: So like, I could see that. [SPEAKER_05]: But then once she goes bad, I'm like, I don't fucking know if there's a comparable character in my mind. [SPEAKER_02]: Maybe Francy, Francy, maybe like a very, you know, conniving. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

2:02:46 [SPEAKER_02]: Like power hungry kind of person. [SPEAKER_02]: I also kind of compared her to Jess. [SPEAKER_02]: Defiant. [SPEAKER_05]: Okay. [SPEAKER_02]: Doesn't want to go to school wants to follow her passion instead. [SPEAKER_02]: I feel like Rufus and Jenny are giving Luke and Jess files. [SPEAKER_05]: Oh my God, [SPEAKER_02]: You know, yes, that comparison is really when she's like, I'm not going to school.