Gilmore to Consider: When Did Rory Gilmore Hit Rock Bottom?

0:00 [SPEAKER_01]: Five, six, seven, eight, May. [SPEAKER_00]: It's gonna be May. [SPEAKER_01]: It's not gonna be all ready, May. [SPEAKER_01]: It's all ready, May. [SPEAKER_01]: All right, here we go. [SPEAKER_01]: Hi, everybody. [SPEAKER_01]: Welcome back to Gilmore to Consider with Tara and Haley. [SPEAKER_01]: I'm Tara.

0:23 [SPEAKER_01]: This is Haley. [SPEAKER_01]: Hi, Haley. [SPEAKER_01]: Hi. [SPEAKER_01]: I'm glad to be here with you. [SPEAKER_02]: It's our first day in May. [SPEAKER_01]: It has. [SPEAKER_01]: It's the end of May. [SPEAKER_01]: But can't believe it. [SPEAKER_02]: Christina Aguilera, Justin Timberlake, mash up vocals of it all.

0:38 [SPEAKER_01]: It's like a little bit of Brittany in there. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: Little Brittany. [SPEAKER_02]: You know, let really early 2000s vibes. [SPEAKER_02]: I love that. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: Which is just fitting. [SPEAKER_02]: Is it not? [SPEAKER_02]: So fitting. [SPEAKER_02]: So fitting.

0:49 [SPEAKER_02]: So fun. [SPEAKER_01]: What a may. [SPEAKER_01]: what am I actually today the day that we're recording this so we can advance is the closing day of the leecho with Stephen Colbert. [SPEAKER_01]: So that's why I'm going off after this is to bid farewell to an icon, a legend as we'll let you know.

1:05 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, what what a loss. [SPEAKER_01]: It doesn't feel real, you know? [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think it feels real for Brett either. [SPEAKER_01]: Like, I know. [SPEAKER_01]: I'm like, how are you doing? [SPEAKER_01]: How are you feeling? [SPEAKER_02]: And he's like, for any of you who don't remember, Brett, Terrace Fiancey, works on Colbert.

1:18 [SPEAKER_02]: So like, that is the connection. [SPEAKER_02]: Terrace not just like a massive, Steven Colbert fan. [SPEAKER_02]: I am a big Steven Colbert fan. [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, to be fair though, I am a big fan as well. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: What a delightful man. [SPEAKER_02]: Big fan.

1:29 [SPEAKER_02]: Of the late shows, like of the late night talk shows. [SPEAKER_02]: He's my favorite. [SPEAKER_02]: He's just such a class act really wonderful. [SPEAKER_01]: His wife is wonderful. [SPEAKER_01]: Everybody there is wonderful. [SPEAKER_01]: It's a bummer But as we know personally Yes, but yeah, it's crazy to think that like end of May is here Brought and I are about to celebrate our engagement to Versary and do the son-off for Colbert and there's just a lot happening It's not such a dream.

1:54 [SPEAKER_02]: I can't believe this flower may bring my flowers may flowers bring [SPEAKER_02]: Pilgrims. [SPEAKER_02]: Well, do you remember when you didn't know that? [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, yes vividly. [SPEAKER_02]: I think about it all the time. [SPEAKER_02]: One sedara wake up first thoughts in the wake up.

2:09 [SPEAKER_02]: Second thought is hi. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: But change may father's can bring change. [SPEAKER_02]: How about that? [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, they're definitely going to bring change. [SPEAKER_02]: Not for the podcast. [SPEAKER_01]: of the podcast. [SPEAKER_01]: No.

2:21 [SPEAKER_01]: We're here to talk about our main roundup. [SPEAKER_01]: I'm speaking of my engagement to Versary on Tuesday, we did the Sadie Sadie. [SPEAKER_01]: I'm just going to listen to it. [SPEAKER_01]: And I actually wanted to start this episode off by answering a question that one of our besties asked that I was like, I don't really know.

2:33 [SPEAKER_01]: And I think it was something like, what have you always seen at your wedding that you will have? [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, you always envisioned. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and I always envision having a non-traditional cake and we are going to have kind of a non-traditional version of cake. [SPEAKER_01]: We might have like a little cake, we don't have anything because we want to do the ceremonial ceremonial cutting of the cake.

2:52 [SPEAKER_01]: It's like ceremonial. [SPEAKER_01]: I can't listen to the word ceremonial. [SPEAKER_01]: I think ceremonial. [SPEAKER_02]: There's just some things from this show that are like absolute nonsense like we talk about actually in next week's episode Yeah, that just are like vocal stems Sarah.

3:06 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, rent free in this and I say it like anytime a man or a woman brings a plate to my table and says it's a hot plate I always turn to the person next to me and say called me hot plates And I once sold it to me a name said that's from Gilmour calls and she said I know you say it on your podcast You say it all of the time [SPEAKER_02]: And I just feel like that's all of us.

3:28 [SPEAKER_02]: That's all of us besties. [SPEAKER_02]: We're just quoting Gilmour Girls all the time in every one of the times. [SPEAKER_02]: That's just a sentence. [SPEAKER_01]: That's just a sentence. [SPEAKER_01]: It is. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: But anyway, the ceremony will cutting up the cake.

3:38 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: Not sure to have no, definitely not. [SPEAKER_01]: But we're going to have some pedophores. [SPEAKER_01]: And we're going to have some other desserts there that we're both really excited about. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_01]: We want to incorporate Jeremy soon some way, because Jeremy Sue is what Brett will say when he misses me.

3:51 [SPEAKER_01]: He'll send me a little piece of Jeremy Sue. [SPEAKER_01]: And he started doing that for a day. [SPEAKER_02]: We were cheering for him. [SPEAKER_02]: Tara Misu, Tara, I miss you and I was like, that's really cute. [SPEAKER_01]: What can I eat? [SPEAKER_01]: We're going to make sure we have some non-dairy desserts there for a girl, Haley.

4:04 [SPEAKER_02]: And I was totally fine to just be like, nothing. [SPEAKER_01]: Sure, I know. [SPEAKER_01]: I'm sure that we'll have different, you know, different sets of desserts. [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know. [SPEAKER_01]: Until we get to our tasting, there's so many specifics that I don't know what they're doing.

4:15 [SPEAKER_02]: Which I came to say amount of time to attend, does everyone raise? [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, listen to that back and I was like, wow, I'm so really cut throat about that. [SPEAKER_01]: like you don't make my rules. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm also probably would be very fun for me. [SPEAKER_02]: I'd probably just watch you guys eat.

4:26 [SPEAKER_01]: That's true. [SPEAKER_01]: That's very true. [SPEAKER_01]: And he read me. [SPEAKER_01]: Any dairy that came out, which will probably be a good amount of things. [SPEAKER_01]: But no, they have a really wonderful array of options. [SPEAKER_01]: But I digress, I listened to that portion.

4:37 [SPEAKER_01]: And I was like, Oh, you know, when you listen back and you're like, Oh, this and this and this and this. [SPEAKER_01]: That is. [SPEAKER_02]: The core of being a part of Gilmour to say is you wasn't back in a like, wait, I have a rebuttal to myself. [SPEAKER_01]: Well, that's actually why we wanted to do the May Roundup is because we wanted to hear from you guys, but we also, I knew that throughout the month, especially in listening back to the podcast, I was going to be like, oh, there are certain things that I totally forgot, which leads me into my next segue, because of course we did a Mrs. Kim and Lorelei parallels episode for the month of May.

5:04 [SPEAKER_01]: And we kicked that off. [SPEAKER_01]: We forgot a major [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, the way that they teach their girls to wallow the ice cream versus the drink, and I love that that's so good And I know there aren't a ton that like I feel like a line in like a really sentimental way. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, that's like one of my favorite misses Kim late in moments.

5:27 [SPEAKER_02]: Me too [SPEAKER_02]: Which, like, for a second, I was like, wait, was her name? [SPEAKER_02]: Mrs. Kim, she isn't that her first name. [SPEAKER_02]: I was like, my brain has a... Mrs. Kim. [SPEAKER_02]: Mrs. Kim. [SPEAKER_02]: Mrs. and Lane's moment together, like, when she, like, basically, like sequester them in the shop, closes the windows, move things around, so that, like, they're just, like, completely alone and no one can see them do those.

5:48 [SPEAKER_01]: And following, it's cute. [SPEAKER_01]: I love that. [SPEAKER_02]: Did you think of that or did a bestie send that in? [SPEAKER_01]: I thought of it. [SPEAKER_02]: Love your mind. [SPEAKER_02]: Thank you. [SPEAKER_01]: Thank you. [SPEAKER_01]: I actually don't know if any of our besties mentioned it, but maybe they did, I'm sorry.

6:03 [SPEAKER_01]: I didn't see it, but yeah, I don't remember what made me think of that. [SPEAKER_01]: But I think because I was thinking of like bonding moments between the two of them and I was like, oh my god, this moment between the two of them was so poignant and also very similar to Lorelei and Rory and the Ice Cream.

6:19 [SPEAKER_01]: And yeah, not knowing how to wallow. [SPEAKER_02]: different in the sense that like Lean had been like, he was being a BRAT. [SPEAKER_02]: She was, yeah, she was. [SPEAKER_02]: And Mrs. Kim was like, no, we're going to feel your feelings. [SPEAKER_01]: We're going to have a drink. [SPEAKER_01]: And you're going to be done with this.

6:33 [SPEAKER_01]: She was acting the same way that worry was acting in PSI love at the end of the season, which is just being like sorely with everyone and then she was running away. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, um, Lean was being the same way. [SPEAKER_01]: Just yeah, very petulant, very like, you know, obviously she's grieving, she's hurt, but [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so I thought those were very cool parallel moments.

6:52 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I feel like lean is a lot of like crossed arms when she's annoyed. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, Poodie is brought the old say. [SPEAKER_01]: She's great. [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah, that's a perfect word. [SPEAKER_01]: We did get a what if from one of our pasties about lean Kim and Mrs. Kim in regards to some of the situations that we were paralleling against Laura Lyon, Bory, and it was the Henry situation.

7:12 [SPEAKER_01]: What if Mrs. Kim did call Henry's mom? [SPEAKER_01]: And then they ended up getting set up and went on an actual date. [SPEAKER_02]: May you narrate it. [SPEAKER_01]: She would hate it. [SPEAKER_01]: She'd be so miserable, but he then could have forced them to talk to each other because we never hear from Henry again.

7:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Not in worries world, not in Lane's world. [SPEAKER_01]: Like, I do kind of wonder what would have happened if, ooh, I have another what if. [SPEAKER_02]: That just popped into my hand. [SPEAKER_01]: He went up to the what if. [SPEAKER_01]: I'm what if, I'm what ifing the what if? [SPEAKER_01]: Doesn't call Henry's mom.

7:40 [SPEAKER_01]: Season three, Lane and Dave get together. [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, and instead of young chew, Mrs. Kim opens the door and it's Henry that she's setting her up with. [SPEAKER_01]: And she doesn't know that this was the boy from... [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, a bit of basketball. [SPEAKER_02]: And now only in his situation.

7:57 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, now Lane is in a situation where she's like, oh, like he will take you to the prom. [SPEAKER_01]: It is Henry. [SPEAKER_02]: Mm. [SPEAKER_01]: That's interesting. [SPEAKER_02]: I just finished watching off campus, the new Amazon series. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: And that's giving that.

8:11 [SPEAKER_02]: It's giving the door opens and you're like, [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, like it doesn't feel very Gilmore girls because it's like, oh my gosh, the tension that is going on here. [SPEAKER_01]: It feels like O.C. [SPEAKER_01]: one tree hill, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, like I really think you would like off campus.

8:24 [SPEAKER_01]: Like I was crying in my bed last night over the show, like emo crying or laughing. [SPEAKER_02]: No, emo crying. [SPEAKER_02]: No one warned me that this college hockey show was going to make me cry. [SPEAKER_02]: My eyes out at these friends, like there's also a Gilmore girls reference that you sent me.

8:38 [SPEAKER_02]: There is a Gilmore girls reference, but it took like our friend Hayley, Hayley Bell Mullins, [SPEAKER_02]: to point out to me that there is a Dean. [SPEAKER_02]: There's a Logan. [SPEAKER_02]: And Dean's last name is De Laurentis. [SPEAKER_01]: And I was like, oh, is this giving, are we getting, is this a little girl's super little liar?

8:56 [SPEAKER_01]: Are the lawyers crossing her? [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, because the book came out in 2015. [SPEAKER_02]: So it could be okay. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, okay. [SPEAKER_02]: But like that sort of tension of being like opening the door, it's Henry who she has like history with. [SPEAKER_02]: But Mrs. Kim doesn't know it and Dave doesn't know it.

9:11 [SPEAKER_02]: And not Lin is going to have to explain to Dave who Henry is and there's going to be like a new sort of tension. [SPEAKER_02]: I was like... [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, yeah, that's that's giving teen drama. [SPEAKER_02]: But it kind of would love a little teen drama in lanes, right? [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I just that was a what if that just came to me based on this bestie is what if and I think this came from our Instagram comments like what if [SPEAKER_01]: Mrs. Kim called Henry's mom, but maybe outside of the context of the bit of basket.

9:36 [SPEAKER_01]: What if they ended up like meeting each other and it's like, oh, I have a son. [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, I have a daughter like you want to do your doctor. [SPEAKER_01]: And Mrs. Kim's eyes go off like I guess you know like slot machine exactly like that's And lean is already entrenched in this new romance with Dave and gets set up with her ex.

9:57 [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, I love that, but I also love the idea of, okay, Dave's perfect. [SPEAKER_02]: Dave wins, you know, removing Henry from the situation. [SPEAKER_02]: It's Zach, and then Henry returns. [SPEAKER_02]: Henry's contract later, and Henry is the ultimate choice, perhaps. [SPEAKER_02]: Perhaps he has to atone for his teen mistakes in his early 20s.

10:20 [SPEAKER_01]: The thing is is that I really think the reason that they chose Zack was because they wanted Lane to end up with someone who is against the norm of what her mom wanted for her. [SPEAKER_01]: And so I think it was always going to be something like that. [SPEAKER_01]: But also the norm of what we wanted for her as well as it is.

10:38 [SPEAKER_02]: I know. [SPEAKER_02]: I personally will have loved. [SPEAKER_02]: it to be someone who misses Kim a proof of and like realizing that she has to like contend with like her own like hangups of like what she thinks love should be if it should be something that her mom wants for her but it's something that she wants for herself I really would have liked that self-structural with her with Lane you mean yeah yeah I get that kind of having to figure that out oh I can't like untether myself from the idea of the door opening [SPEAKER_02]: Honestly, you would love off campus.

11:12 [SPEAKER_02]: Hmm, I'm sure I would. [SPEAKER_02]: There's just like, if you, if you love that tension, but you did mention there was a Gilmore Girls reference. [SPEAKER_02]: The one of the characters is completely drunk and she's talking about she's got an agent and her boyfriend is like, not, like, not very interested in it and she was like, well, John Hamm was on Gilmore Girls and now he's the madman.

11:29 [SPEAKER_01]: When she called him the madman, I died. [SPEAKER_01]: She's like, you have John Hamm was in one scene of Gilmore Girls and now he's the madman. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm just like the mad man so funny like that show really did catch me by surprise because there are some lines that just like I'm going to have to play this one for you that feels so like something we would laugh about from Gilmore rolls It is like not the funny part of the scene, but it's like it's something that like I like zeroed in on and like had to pause because I was laughing so hard, but it also references a lot of like [SPEAKER_02]: romance movies, like romantic comedies, um, throughout it.

12:03 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, love. [SPEAKER_02]: Thank you, references. [SPEAKER_02]: It's also for us, I feel like the references are like, they're not dated, but like, I imagine to a teen audience who is watching this, it feels dated, like, the referencing, like, Footloose, the original one, not the one, which will enough.

12:16 [SPEAKER_02]: Thank you so much. [SPEAKER_02]: And so we're fine. [SPEAKER_02]: And the reference, um, dirty dancing. [SPEAKER_02]: And they're like talking about, like, a dated reference. [SPEAKER_02]: And I was like, wow, I guess that is a dated reference to someone who's in college right now. [SPEAKER_02]: Fair.

12:29 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, but who wrote it? [SPEAKER_01]: Who wrote off campus? [SPEAKER_02]: Off campus is actually a book adaptation. [SPEAKER_02]: It's a book by L. Kennedy, and I believe that it was adapted by T for TV. [SPEAKER_02]: I think her name is Louisa Levy, is who adapted it. [SPEAKER_02]: But I'll, I'm, I'm set for season two.

12:43 [SPEAKER_02]: If you want that, oh, door open, guy from past, you, you're, you're locked in. [SPEAKER_02]: You haven't even learned it. [SPEAKER_01]: You know, I didn't. [SPEAKER_02]: But it's also like, you know, the cliche, like, college romance, but it's also not, it's also quite heavy. [SPEAKER_02]: Like, there's like some of the topics that they're handling, quite heavy, which like shocked me and I was crying over these characters.

13:06 [SPEAKER_01]: All right, I'm excited. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm going to check it out. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: you should. [SPEAKER_01]: So moving on to the mom card, we had a lot of comments on our Instagrams. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, lots of thoughts, but one stuck out to us in particular from our friend, our bestie Caroline.

13:20 [SPEAKER_01]: On Instagram, she said, I recently realized that Roy went from never hearing the word no to hearing it twice. [SPEAKER_01]: First from Mitchum and then from Lauraly. [SPEAKER_01]: Lauraly saying Roy couldn't come home wasn't a bad approach per se, but really off-brand and one from a woman who was a best friend first and a mom second.

13:34 [SPEAKER_01]: That one really took me back because of course you think of that. [SPEAKER_02]: Well, most people think of that from like the fact that Boralai should have mom carded harder. [SPEAKER_02]: Like she should have like locked her up and thrown away the key sort of vibes in that situation. [SPEAKER_02]: Like she didn't mom card her hard enough.

13:50 [SPEAKER_02]: But like from the perspective that like she just got like a massive no from a girl who's never really been rejected in that way, especially academically from Mitchum. [SPEAKER_01]: And then to turn around and get it from her mom [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, that would break me. [SPEAKER_01]: It's tough.

14:07 [SPEAKER_01]: That's that's really tough my question for you Is do you think that worry hit rock bottom at the end of season four by sleeping with a married man? [SPEAKER_01]: Or do you think that she hit rock bottom at the end of season five getting arrested after hearing the word no from Mitch I'm five you think that's her rock bottom.

14:27 [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, you think getting arrested is like worse than sleeping with a married man [SPEAKER_02]: No, no, no, no. [SPEAKER_02]: I don't think it's worse. [SPEAKER_02]: Well, one of them is against the law, but it's not that I'm at one of them is illegal and the other is just wrong. [SPEAKER_02]: Both of them are wrong, but one of them is illegal.

14:46 [SPEAKER_02]: It's not about it being like objectively like separate from worry. [SPEAKER_02]: One is worse than one is not. [SPEAKER_02]: It's that worry recovered really easily after the affair. [SPEAKER_02]: you know, it's like she's up with Dean. [SPEAKER_02]: She got to be with Dean. [SPEAKER_02]: She actually got to go to Europe first and her and her mom were kind of disconnected.

15:05 [SPEAKER_02]: But to fall out for a worry from that is kind of minimal. [SPEAKER_02]: You know, she goes into a relationship with this guy. [SPEAKER_02]: She breaks up with him. [SPEAKER_02]: It's quite easy. [SPEAKER_02]: She finds herself with a new 30 guy instantly. [SPEAKER_02]: So it's like the rock bottom, like it's kind of like [SPEAKER_02]: She had a breakdown, but I don't think she found rock bottom in that situation, but when it comes to the end of season five, also because I'm thinking of written in the stars, or maybe it's a later episode in season five, that Rory goes back to the paper, and she realized everyone had these really productive summers, and she wants to get to work, and she's really eager to find something and like really eager to get back out there and be a part of the paper and get into school,

15:44 [SPEAKER_02]: where is like she loses that. [SPEAKER_01]: So like not only does she lose her relationship with her mom, she loses her connection to like the core part of her, and like still has a boyfriend. [SPEAKER_02]: So I think that like with the end of four, she's not losing herself in the same way that she does at the end of five, which I think constitutes rock bottom for boring.

16:02 [SPEAKER_01]: It's more about the aftermath, less about action itself. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: Because like, I mean, for Anton's purposes, Roy came out of a fair, pretty, pretty fine, pretty fine. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, pretty fine. [SPEAKER_01]: But I also think that that was because of, of, Laura Lye.

16:17 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, well, her reaction to it afterwards is like, OK, I guess me and your ex-boyfriend who is now your new boyfriend, but he's still getting divorced, can go on a double date with Luke. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: Why? [SPEAKER_02]: I know. [SPEAKER_02]: Easy. [SPEAKER_01]: So, well, I have a voicemail that I'd like us to play from one of our besties I called in the kind of ghost hand in hand with us, and I'm curious about your opinions on her thoughts.

16:39 [SPEAKER_01]: So let's hear from that bestie. [SPEAKER_00]: hey besties, I listened to the mom card episode and I have a hot take that is interesting. [SPEAKER_00]: I don't necessarily think it's better, but it is interesting. [SPEAKER_00]: So I liked what Haley said about maybe Laura and I having a different reaction to Roy dropping out of Yale and I actually think that her sleeping with Dean is the greater offence out of the two between that and dropping out of Yale.

17:07 [SPEAKER_00]: So I'm wondering what [SPEAKER_00]: instead of a Lordly having the, you know, kind of not under my roof situation that we had when she dropped out of you, causing Rory to move and with a great parent, what a Lordly instead had had had that not under my roof reaction to Rory getting with Dean as a married man.

17:25 [SPEAKER_00]: And so Rory didn't feel like she could come home to Lordly's house while she was in her relationship with Dean, [SPEAKER_00]: So when she came home to first. [SPEAKER_00]: Hello, she had to say, at Dean's house. [SPEAKER_00]: So with Dean's family, we would have gotten like scenes with that family dynamic, and kind of seen a rory face out of the relationship that way.

17:50 [SPEAKER_00]: Again, I'm not saying that's better. [SPEAKER_00]: It kind of makes me want to claw my eyes out. [SPEAKER_00]: Sam, you should think about it, but it's certainly what have been interesting, and I'd love to hear your thoughts. [SPEAKER_02]: big. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm dead. [SPEAKER_02]: I love that they were like here's this full idea completely flushed out.

18:07 [SPEAKER_02]: It makes me want to claw my eyes out. [SPEAKER_01]: Let me know what you thought. [SPEAKER_01]: So let's go to some downs. [SPEAKER_02]: I do agree. [SPEAKER_02]: the idea that the affair is worse. [SPEAKER_02]: The affair is worse. [SPEAKER_01]: The affair is worse than saying I'm dropping out of yell.

18:23 [SPEAKER_01]: But is the affair worse than then stealing a yacht? [SPEAKER_01]: I think they're kind of on par with each other, like her getting arrested stealing a yacht, like both are really bad. [SPEAKER_02]: And as we determine, one of them is legal, but I think that [SPEAKER_02]: the affair is worse because of the amount of people that it impacts and like the choice that you're making to for sure kind of ruin a bunch of people's lives recklessly with the y'all you didn't hurt us but yes and you're really only hurting you and someone else is property which is not great but I would like value the relationship more than someone's by personally [SPEAKER_01]: No, yeah, property versus a relationship.

19:04 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, very different. [SPEAKER_01]: And do you have a yacht like, sorry, you've got insurance, you're fine. [SPEAKER_01]: I think that that is what people, at least I also like I'm included in this. [SPEAKER_01]: I forget about when it comes to the end of season five. [SPEAKER_01]: We think about the fact that worry is dropping out of Yale.

19:20 [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think about the fact that she just got arrested or released. [SPEAKER_01]: I don't. [SPEAKER_01]: They really liked to manage that. [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, they really did. [SPEAKER_02]: That season six is like about her doing her immunity service. [SPEAKER_02]: But it never really think about the fact that like she was arrested.

19:34 [SPEAKER_01]: But she was arrested for stealing a boat. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_01]: Grandically voting, grand theft voting. [SPEAKER_01]: That's I love that. [SPEAKER_01]: I want to play that video game. [SPEAKER_01]: Same. [SPEAKER_01]: But I think that I really love this bestie's take in the sense that she's like what if Laura like had had kind of more of a knot under my roof out of two towards Rory and Dean.

19:54 [SPEAKER_01]: But I kind of think she did. [SPEAKER_01]: Did she not? [SPEAKER_01]: Well, she did a little bit a little bit, like sending her off to Europe. [SPEAKER_02]: In a sense, was kind of like a, not an or my roof baby, a little bit a little bit because they, they needed a cooling off period, like a European cooling off period, which maybe that's what they needed at the end of season five, maybe if Emily would have taken her to Europe and she would have come back and come to her senses, who knows, maybe she could leave the country because she'd just been recently arrested.

20:24 [SPEAKER_02]: I'm not sure, but I think that when it gets to the double day like she's making an effort to be okay with it and that's like the difference is like she's like not under my roof for now and now it's okay because I want to be your friend. [SPEAKER_01]: Do you think that that olive branch is a little bit the same?

20:42 [SPEAKER_01]: Like, could we equate that to her showing up to her birthday party? [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, a little bit. [SPEAKER_02]: But I think that too much has happened at that point to, like, yeah, for sure. [SPEAKER_02]: For it to, like, mean the same thing. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: I just, like, literally was taken a back by the idea of this bestie's thought process of voicing it deans place.

21:01 [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, we see it. [SPEAKER_02]: We see it in place. [SPEAKER_01]: Diabolical. [SPEAKER_01]: Oh my god, I like all, especially given the one time we see his mom's and tracked, she leaves the door with his mom's interaction with with Rory and Dean. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, Claire and the door next room.

21:16 [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my gosh, Claire is the least of our worries. [SPEAKER_02]: She's going to give us the T and all of this and he can play her download up. [SPEAKER_02]: Like famously, my dad is up to the wall. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, well, I'm really good at colors. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, she's going to have to turn down the arrow looking to get the T.

21:29 [SPEAKER_02]: but like the whole thing about his parents and like the alarm system chirping in their room like roaring sleeping in the basement like this is not this is not going well nothing feels right about this but she also can't stay at lanes yet because lane is still at her mom's so it's like true is she oh no no sorry I was thinking at the beginning I was thinking of season four in [SPEAKER_01]: Exactly, she's there for two days and Zach is and he's documenting his mom or her cause.

22:04 [SPEAKER_02]: Like, Zach's wanting to charge her for like dish soap that she didn't for like cereal there, yeah, absolutely. [SPEAKER_02]: So that would be positively insane. [SPEAKER_02]: But I do love the idea of her running into the real eye at places around town. [SPEAKER_02]: And like there are loops or you know, they go to the movies.

22:23 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know, but I think that the reason that like our best to use this makes me recall my eyes out is in part because of the circumstances that we would end up with though they would be so fascinating to watch. [SPEAKER_02]: Is that it becomes about a boy and like their differences in opinion on a boy versus at the end of five?

22:43 [SPEAKER_02]: It's kind of more about Rory and their differences in opinions on like her making choices for herself Right and less about like you're with this guy by and that I like that it when it's more like an internal struggle between them And I mean to be fair, Mitchem [SPEAKER_02]: What a boy to have like such a terrible opinion that caused this downfall for E or the downward spiral.

23:09 [SPEAKER_02]: I don't really like the downfall of Ego more conversation. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I don't really like the conversation surrounding that. [SPEAKER_02]: So it's more like her downward spiral started with Nitchham. [SPEAKER_02]: But it's still between them. [SPEAKER_02]: It's between choices where E is making for herself, for her future.

23:25 [SPEAKER_02]: Not the Dean's not, but it just feels like, oh, this is a, this is about a boy. [SPEAKER_02]: you know, and I don't like that. [SPEAKER_02]: I like it when it's between the two of them. [SPEAKER_02]: Interesting take though. [SPEAKER_02]: Interesting take. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm just still obsessed with this bestie being like okay girls.

23:38 [SPEAKER_02]: Here's the setup. [SPEAKER_02]: Here's the thought I had. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm not saying it's better. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm actually saying I'm going to claw my eyes out at this. [SPEAKER_02]: Uh, let me know. [SPEAKER_02]: Let me know. [SPEAKER_01]: Let me know. [SPEAKER_01]: Love you. [SPEAKER_01]: Bye.

23:46 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_01]: So funny. [SPEAKER_01]: No, I really loved this. [SPEAKER_01]: So thank you for letting it in at this point. [SPEAKER_02]: I also such a weird thing. [SPEAKER_02]: I loved this bestie's voice. [SPEAKER_02]: Like a me. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I was like, I would not know.

23:56 [SPEAKER_02]: I was like, oh, I'm sure you. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I'm from. [SPEAKER_01]: Immediately sooothed. [SPEAKER_01]: But I'm really curious to hear from you guys like, do you think the greater offence, as this bestie kind of proposes, was sleeping with Dean or getting arrested and dropping out of yell?

24:10 [SPEAKER_01]: I think I'm going to potentially lean on the ladder. [SPEAKER_01]: We have to put this on Instagram. [SPEAKER_02]: Stack post conversation, like, what's the greatest fence? [SPEAKER_01]: What's worse? [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: Well, one of them is an offense. [SPEAKER_02]: You know, yeah, one of them because they'll order a offense.

24:26 [SPEAKER_02]: Both offensive ones are literal offense. [SPEAKER_01]: But I had a really wonderful time talking about all these things, but you had a really fun may. [SPEAKER_01]: I know what a fun little conversation about the girllies about the max proposal. [SPEAKER_02]: On the subject of the max proposal, someone left, they left kind of like a long comment.

24:47 [SPEAKER_02]: But the line in the middle of this comment that really got me was, I can read a little bit of it. [SPEAKER_02]: Is 100% always considered this proposal to be a bit of a throw away, as I never thought the writers' intention was for them to get married. [SPEAKER_02]: That being said, I think it was incredibly lazy and truly void of his own original thought.

25:06 [SPEAKER_02]: I think it was a textbook response for someone with a bland personality. [SPEAKER_01]: Ooh. [SPEAKER_01]: And I was like, my team does have a bland personality. [SPEAKER_02]: But, well, this is, this is hard-killing back to episodes and episodes and episodes ago from years ago. [SPEAKER_02]: Ike Max of like, if Max gives you the Ike, right?

25:25 [SPEAKER_02]: And that has always been the case for me. [SPEAKER_02]: So when Brittany, this commenter, said, it was a textbook response for someone with a bland personality. [SPEAKER_01]: Mm. [SPEAKER_01]: Listen, that kind of goes hand in hand, Austin said, I think the proposal is a perfect example of a good on paper, which fully sums up Max as a character in my mind.

25:44 [SPEAKER_01]: On paper, he listened to what she said and did something to make a gesture, but there's so much missing under the service that would have had us more convinced that he truly knew and loved. [SPEAKER_01]: lore lie. [SPEAKER_01]: Loved lore lie. [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, totally agree. [SPEAKER_02]: A lot of the sentiment in the YouTube comments, which like there were so many people commenting about this.

26:02 [SPEAKER_02]: Of course, because we were having a giveaway with this one, which we will mention the winner in just a moment. [SPEAKER_02]: But that we were giving Max too much credit. [SPEAKER_02]: And I was like, in reading them, I was like, you guys aren't wrong. [SPEAKER_02]: Because this proposal for contents and purposes is [SPEAKER_02]: that that guy is not someone she was saying.

26:25 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: And he doesn't believe her. [SPEAKER_02]: And so he starts off with like, uh, I saw other people too in the soul train kind of way like, uh, Max. [SPEAKER_01]: And now I want you to be my wife. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_01]: And it's just like, uh, yeah. [SPEAKER_01]: One of our listeners also said, I always interpreted though we can't keep getting this close, just to have someone something completely derelis.

26:46 [SPEAKER_01]: To mean this close actually being a thing. [SPEAKER_01]: Like at this point, they've still never really been in a relationship. [SPEAKER_01]: They dated for two months and Laura liked it. [SPEAKER_01]: The cha cha cha. [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, trademarked. [SPEAKER_02]: The DM symbol. [SPEAKER_01]: Cha cha cha.

26:58 [SPEAKER_01]: trademarked. [SPEAKER_01]: And then in their 2.0 attempt, they talked on the phone for a few weeks and now he's picking her up for a day as they transition beyond phone calls. [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think that they ever got beyond the what if Halo effect of the situation ship. [SPEAKER_02]: And I think that that's so, so real.

27:13 [SPEAKER_01]: That is like honeymoon phase, what if situation ship, and this was kind of what I was talking about in the analysis episode, that I feel like Max thought a lot about this. [SPEAKER_01]: He really, really considered [SPEAKER_01]: And I do think that Laura life felt that way. [SPEAKER_01]: Ish about Max.

27:31 [SPEAKER_01]: We don't really see it as verbalized as clearly as Max does. [SPEAKER_01]: Because she even says to him when they were unite in the Brick of Part 2, like, I haven't thought about this at all. [SPEAKER_01]: Like, if I think about you too hard, then I'm going to miss you, and then I'm going to what if and whatever.

27:46 [SPEAKER_01]: And I think that Max, what if? [SPEAKER_02]: I think he what if to lie and like it's actually that fantasy, he what if to close to the sun that man. [SPEAKER_02]: But he really was the fantasy of being with war lie and not necessarily the idea. [SPEAKER_02]: Or it was the idea, but not really like the reality of it, especially when he comes in later asking for the key for the printer, do you think about anyone other than yourself?

28:07 [SPEAKER_01]: Wow. [SPEAKER_01]: I know. [SPEAKER_01]: I still will echo what I said in the analysis episode last week that I think this proposal was meant to be cinematically stunning and beautiful and take us by surprise and also take the character by surprise but these two were never supposed to end up together like this was never supposed to be [SPEAKER_01]: right.

28:24 [SPEAKER_01]: And so I think that Amy Sherman Paladino gave us just enough to make this like a whimsical, magical splashy as my friend, Haley McAdash likes to say something splashy. [SPEAKER_01]: Like it's supposed to be romantic, but it's not from the right person. [SPEAKER_01]: Like you can have all the romance and the words and like, God, you talk so good.

28:43 [SPEAKER_01]: It doesn't mean it doesn't make it right. [SPEAKER_01]: And I think that like when I was a teenager in one of our besties also set this in the YouTube comments like as a young teenager, I loved it as someone in a years long healthy relationship where was he and that's where I'm at is like now being a 34 year old woman.

28:58 [SPEAKER_01]: I'm like, where the hell were you when you rep proposed over that phone. [SPEAKER_01]: No way hard pass. [SPEAKER_02]: One of my favorite things is like that someone commented was about the fact that he proposed of the phone and she answered over the phone and she's like, this isn't a long-distance relationship.

29:13 [SPEAKER_02]: They live in the same town or he was in the same town as her when she called him and speaking of Austin, [SPEAKER_01]: That's our YouTube winner for great, big, big, big, big, beautiful giveaway. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, you'll be getting two packages, so message us with your address, and because your great, big, beautiful life paperback copy will be coming straight from Berkeley and your DZT will be coming from us.

29:37 [SPEAKER_02]: So excited. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_01]: And if you guys haven't gotten it yet, please visit us at www.gillmordesayat.com slash shop and you can see our new Daisy's collection, which people are loving so far and I'm so glad because it's a chef's kiss one of my faves we've done no while.

29:54 [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: She's a QD1, and I'm also excited for June. [SPEAKER_02]: June has fun things come on. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, June does have some fun things coming. [SPEAKER_01]: Aren't June episode for next week is so silly. [SPEAKER_01]: It's so good. [SPEAKER_01]: We had so much fun recording it.

30:08 [SPEAKER_02]: It's a silly goofy time. [SPEAKER_02]: Do I remember everything going into the episode? [SPEAKER_02]: Like was I perfectly prepared? [SPEAKER_02]: Because I feel like I forgot half of the show going into it. [SPEAKER_02]: Yes. [SPEAKER_02]: Do I remember most of it as I'm going on? [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I do, but yeah, what a silly, goofy time that we had.

30:25 [SPEAKER_02]: Also, for God in that episode, because of course, we recorded it before June 2nd. [SPEAKER_02]: That the next day was June 3rd. [SPEAKER_02]: Have a good day. [SPEAKER_02]: And I can't if day. [SPEAKER_01]: But our episode, I think the reason we forgot is because our episode has nothing to do with June 3rd.

30:39 [SPEAKER_01]: And I think often times we'll do like a June 3rd, Luke and Laura Li or Laura Li episode, we actually decided to do a townies episode. [SPEAKER_01]: And we are going to talk about the greatest hits and greatest lines of the townies of Stars Hollow. [SPEAKER_02]: And we'll have more to say on that in the next episode.