Congresswoman Pramila Jayapal

0:00 Welcome to It's Open. I am so excited for you to hear today's conversation with Congresswoman Pramila Jayapal. She is really a hero and a patriot and one of the leading progressive fighters in government right now at the national level. So Congresswoman Jayapal is a Congresswoman from the state of Washington since 2017.

0:24 She is OG Squad. This is a woman who is, you'll hear in the episode, she's the head of the committees to protect immigrants and the Epstein-File survivors. And she is just a genius, man. Oh man, she gave me hope and direction and motivation today to love this country and make it the country that the majority of Americans deserve.

0:48 So come on in. This conversation was so joyful and um energizing and really excited for you to hear it. Thank you so much.

1:06 You called me. Yeah, you're you're a big deal in our office, and I think your voice is really important. So I'm so glad this worked out.

1:14 I'm so, I'm so grateful that you did. Because like you're a big deal in my private world. You know, I think the way that you speak makes sense as a working person. You sound normal to working that.

1:26 That is the best compliment any member of Congress can have. Honestly, they need us to think that Democrats in particular are disconnected from the issues of working people. And we've got plenty of Democrats who are. It's you know, but I also think that they um it is really important for them to make sure that we stay uneducated, that we stay, you know, uh untethered to um to real news, to real information, because that's the way they're gonna achieve what they want to achieve, which is taking all of us for everything we've got, leading us dryer.

2:02 And I really I think that's a big part of the whole project.

2:06 Right. We're uh recording this episode just a couple weeks out from the midterms. How are you feeling about them?

2:13 I mean, I feel really good about the house. I I know we're gonna take back the house. I think we're gonna we're gonna gain at least 20 seats and maybe you heard it here first. God, oh my god. Maybe 30, 32, but somewhere between there. And so I think we're gonna have a decent majority, uh, more the better, um, in my view.

2:33 But I feel good about that. I feel uh better about the Senate um than I certainly did six months ago. I mean, I feel like we have a real shot at the Senate, and we have the most amazing candidates who are running. I mean, uh, you know, both for the Senate seats, Abdul, Peggy Flanagan, Angie Nixon. I mean, we have really good candidates who are running.

2:55 And so I think that there's a real possibility for us to potentially have both chambers, and then there's a lot we can do. We can put a lot of stuff in front of Trump and make him sign it or not sign it. But it will be very clear. Right. If it isn't already, and I think it's pretty clear to most people whose side he's on, which is his own and his billionaire buddies.

3:16 Um, but I think we'll be able to make that contrast really clear and hopefully get a bunch of stuff done. You know what, Congresswoman?

3:21 Like, I feel like I saw Mayor Mamdani go on Theo Vaughn, a conservatives podcast, and Theo Vaughn's like, what's what is socialism? And then Mayor Mamdani is like explaining it with a smile simply. And to be honest, I think the left needs some basic understanding. So can you tell me, like, we would win the Senate if the Republicans and the technocrat billionaires behind them weren't cheating?

3:50 Correct. To me, cheating is paying for your way in life, which they all a lot of them have since they're born. And now they're paying for uh the way that um the Tesla Tesla guy really did pay for this presidency, right? $300 million, whatever. And the way the California billionaires are paying to trick Californians out of voting yes on Prop 40, which would set a precedent for taxing billionaires fairly.

4:19 But can you like explain in a simple way to this working person, to this comedian who like does makes jokes in basements? I need it said simply. Um can you explain to me the cheating, the the campaign finance reform, the need for it, citizens united? Can you explain some of this in a basic way for me?

4:40 Okay, so the premise is that we have a democracy and every vote counts equally, right? That's the premise. And that when you have a democracy, everyone is voting, and my vote counts just as much as your vote. And together, whatever the people want, where the power lies, is with the people. That's the premise.

4:59 It is so far from that for a bunch of reasons. I mean, the electoral college, we we won't get into all the structural ways that the electoral college and um other parts of our democracy don't work. I'll go straight to the corruption, which is none of that works if you have corporations and giant, you know, billionaires, millionaires, ultra-millionaires able to buy their way into those votes.

5:24 And so Citizens United is the court decision that said, the Supreme Court decision that said that corporations have the same rights as individuals, and that corporations can put tons of money into elections, and they their voice counts the same as yours or mine, except that it counts much more because they have a lot more money.

5:47 But the other way that it does enrich members of Congress personal wealth is members of Congress have stock portfolios. I have the bill to ban stock trading for members of Congress because I think if you want to trade stocks, you should go to Wall Street. If you work, if you work in Congress, you should be fighting for your people, for your constituents that you represent, not to put money in your pocket.

6:10 And so there is a lot of personal enriching that happens with members of Congress, unfortunately, on both sides. On both sides. On both sides of the aisle. We've had this stock trading bill. I introduced mine with Elizabeth Warren and Republican co-sponsors in 2019. And we've had control of the House uh and the Senate since that time, and we haven't brought it to the floor.

6:34 Um I do believe that when we take control of the House, we will bring it to the floor. I do believe that. And so I think we're finally going to do that. But it's become such a big thing because people don't trust government for very good reasons. But that's also part of their project. It is really important to the right wing, to the fascists, and all the people who want to control this country and the billionaires, that people don't trust government.

7:01 Because back to the idea of socialism, the idea for people who are democratic socialists who believe in uh socialism, the concept is that government provides, it's government is the great equalizer of opportunity. That's how I think about it. It's the biggest entity out there that can make sure that you have basic needs provided for.

7:25 And that idea is very dangerous to people who want just a few very wealthy people to control everything, right? And so the more they can undermine our faith in government, the more they can say government is corrupt, government is this, government is that, it's inefficient, it's et cetera, et cetera, um, the more effective they can be in having people not trust government.

7:46 And I think if you go to a lot of um uh countries around the world and Europe and other places, people trust government. That's been eroded over time, but those are socialist countries, they are democratic socialist countries, and and in many of those places, there's so much more trust in government because government has provided a lot of the fundamentals for a long time.

8:10 That's being eroded in part because of the role of the United States, frankly.

8:15 How does it feel? You know, we were laughing about getting propped up for this on having little cushions on our seats to be propped up to an eye like a footstool because my feet can't always touch the ground. Yeah. Um, how does it feel to be a petite woman in the halls of Congress today with these people?

8:32 I I really I I my central nervous system, I have to calm it down. Yeah, I'm hours away from DC. Honestly, this is there is so much violence against children, sexual violence against children and women loudly being uh applauded from the halls of Congress, from the White House, from the Senate. How does it feel to walk through the halls every day being you?

8:58 You just have to steal yourself, but it's not easy. You know, I have to do a lot of calming myself down too. And sometimes I'm not successful, but maybe that's good too, because I think if you try to act like everything's normal, that's not that's not helpful either. And I think for a lot of my constituents and people across the country that we're in touch with, they want to see the anger, they want to see the vulnerability, they want to see that, you know what, we're just human beings.

9:27 I mean, we we have emotions and feelings just like everybody else does. And I think this idea of like a sanitized politician who doesn't share what they really think and is dispassionate. I think the times are done for that. You know, this is too extraordinary. And um, for me, it was hardest after January 6th because I was in the Capitol, I was trapped in the Capitol.

9:50 I was one of just a few dozen members of Congress who was sitting in the gallery, and everyone else down below had been taken out, and they couldn't get us out because we were on the upper floor. And um, and so we were trapped there, and I did not think I would make it out. There was a banging on the door from the insurrectionists that I still remember to this day.

10:14 And then we got put into a, you know, into a um a safe room with all the Republicans who refused to wear masks, and it was the beginning of COVID. And I remember saying, I'm gonna get COVID from this, and I did get COVID from that, literally that night, um, from people refusing to wear masks. And and so, you know, I never thought that signing up for this job would mean that I wasn't gonna make it out of the Capitol alive.

10:42 Um, but I think it was like a big wake-up moment. And I think Trump won and more recently, Trump two has been such a big wake-up moment because we never held the guy accountable. We did in the House, we impeached him twice, but the Senate refused to. And so what happens to a bully if you don't hold a bully accountable?

10:58 They keep bullying and they get worse, right? Because so now he can go cut down trees on a golf course, he can destroy the White House, he can build arches, he can kidnap people and deport people in the streets, he can kill U.S. citizens. There's no accountability. That's what you teach if you don't hold somebody accountable.

11:16 And I think that's why, you know, when we take back the house, yes, we have to reverse some of the worst things, we have to pass things that really help people's lives get better, but we also have to hold these people accountable for everything they've done. You know.

11:31 I'm so um the description of January 6th, it's like there has been so much, and I, you know, I say this as a uh white person, a white Ashkenazi Jewish American in the United States, where I have to, I I want to set the disclaimer that like fascism and democracy are in a spectrum, and fascism is what black Americans, Native Americans, immigrants, but really pointedly black Americans have been experiencing since the founding of this country.

12:00 So white people's waking up is different than other people's waking up. You know, I I just as the whatever, just as a disclaimer and setting the table for saying that the abuse, the abuse, the loud, blaring siren of abuse for the past 10 years, it's just been such an onslaught, so overwhelming, that I not that I forgot about January 6th, but I haven't sat with it in a moment.

12:25 So to hear about the an insurrection that you were there at and you thought you were gonna be killed because there was a police officer who was killed. Yeah, I mean, uh that that is so abusive. I I can't uh I I I'm I'm really I'm just taking an extra second to process it because that's that's unbelievable.

12:45 And speaking of abusing I mean, it was the worst assault on the United States Capitol since the War of 1812. So we've never seen anything like that. And that the display of those days are so etched in my mind, you know, with the Nazi flags, with the KKK fully, you know, all the paraphernalia of white supremacy in this country.

13:11 Um it was it was stunning. And then the pounding on the doors and the and the battering of the Capitol, like the physical damage to people, to property, law enforcement, you know, and these Republicans who say that they're all about law enforcement and public safety, the hypocrisy of what they did to even our Capitol police officers, they wouldn't put up a plaque honoring the law enforcement officers who died that day.

13:37 And when they finally, we had to pass a bill to get them to do that. When they finally did it, I think it was last year, um, or maybe earlier this year, they finally put it up. They put it up in a never-to-be seen spot in the Capitol, in like a basement somewhere, in the booth in the corner in the dark in the back.

13:59 You know what I mean? Like this um there's so much hypocrisy and lying in what they say they're for and what they're actually for. And I think it's it's just been really damaging because nobody knows what to believe. So you're not working from, and it's why your voice is really important, because you're not working from the same set of facts, even, you know, and there's no emphasis on truth.

14:24 In fact, it's the opposite. Right. And that's what authoritarians rely on. You know, I also think for a lot of people, me included, um, there's this idea that you have checks and balances built into the United States. I I feel like I fell for that, you know. I kind of believe that. Me too. And I think a lot of people did, and that was a lot of the anger that people had early on in the Trump, you know, in Trump too, certainly, um, is wait a second, you all, and some of it was directed at Congress, you know, some for good reason, some some less so, but it was like, wait, you all are supposed to be able to stop this.

14:58 And what we had to explain, and we did, I did this on the campaign side, I do something called Resistance Lab, where we train people. We have a virtual training, we've trained over 32,000 people in all 50 states on how authoritarians and dictators work and what does nonviolent resistance look like? Because we haven't really had to do that until, you know, since the civil rights movement, really, in a in a real way.

15:23 And um, but that's one of the things that we talk about a lot is that the founders were smart, but they weren't all knowing. They they sort of assumed that if they gave powers to one branch of government, that that branch of government would want those powers and would actually use those powers regardless of who's in the in the other branch.

15:44 But when you have a cult party like the Republican Party is today, um that and they don't want those powers, and they're like, no, you can go bomb Iran, you can go, you know, tear down the White House, we're not gonna hold you accountable for anything, then that branch doesn't have power. And the Supreme Court is the Supreme Court.

16:05 It's a mega extremist right-wing Supreme Court. And so that branch isn't holding him accountable either. And so that's when it really comes to people to stand up and say, no, we're not gonna accept it. Um and that's what happened with the Epstein files, also.

16:21 Yeah, I mean, like the the Trump II whole administration ran on exposing the Epstein files, and then the Epstein files get exposed, and he says, Who? I don't know him.

16:31 Yeah.

16:32 Crazy. So how did you um try to bring justice and truth to the situation when it comes to the five?

16:38 I mean, one of the most incredible things has been working with the survivors. I'm really close with the Epstein survivors, and um and we've just done a ton of work with them to help them expose this, and they have just been so they could have made so many different choices on what to do, and they've taken the courageous route despite everything that they've had to face.

17:01 Um, but probably the biggest moment around the Epstein Files was when we had Pam Bondi testifying before us. And um Jamie Raskin, who's the ranking member of the Democratic side on judiciary, asked me to start because he knew all the work that I've done around domestic violence long before coming to Congress and uh sexual assault, and he knew the work I was doing with the survivors.

17:23 And I had been meeting with them over time and just to understand like what would justice look like to them. And so we agreed that I would ask her to turn around and acknowledge them and apologize to them for what the Department of Justice had done. They had just released some of the Epstein files, but in those files, the survivors' names were not, were not um, you know, blacked out, redacted.

17:51 And they uh redacted some of the predators and pedophiles' names. And it was just it was abuse on top of abuse on top of abuse. And that moment started the Judiciary Committee hearing because we talked about what would happen if Bondi had turned around and apologized to them. It could have gone a very different way, but I had a feeling she wouldn't.

18:15 And I had them all stand. And I had I asked her to turn around and apologize, and she refused to do that. And and that was several people came over and said that was the end of the hearing at that point. And there were very other powerful testimonies and and members questioning of her, but she was gone two weeks later.

18:35 And and then she was also spying on me because I had I was one of the first members to go and look at the files, and this is like January 6th for me, like reading those files for the first time and the second time and the third time. Um I I knew all of that intellectually, I knew it was all there, but to see the callousness and the and the disgusting nature of the conversations that were happening between these pedophiles and predators and everyone that was in their circle, including some women in there was so horrific because it brought to the surface how natural this kind of language and treatment and abuse of behavior and belief that you can do whatever you want to a woman whenever you want

19:31 that, and the pressure that had been put on, you know, many of them were immigrants. I mean, many of the survivors had immigration cases, and so there was a lot of like, you know, I'm I'm I want to be able to stay here, I want to be able to look after my family. So on every level, it was, I couldn't sleep, you know, during those first months when I was reading those files because it was just like so laid bare, so laid bare what the culture is, not just those people, but everything that supports that that environment.

20:04 Yeah, it's it's it's unbelievable. I thank you so much for doing this work. You know, people, I I I the what I love about finding progressive fighters like you is I'm like, thanks for doing the thing I never want to do. That is so Well, you're doing it too. I'm I'm platforming you, but I don't want to read the Epstein files because that is so damaging.

20:30 Like you're taking a hit in a way that's staying with you. Yeah. You know, like you are sacrificing parts of yourself to move this in the right direction. And even if it didn't move in the right direction um at this point yet, on the books, like culturally, you letting that pass through your body and and steal your sleep and steal your peace.

20:53 I mean, yeah, you're gonna live with those words, that black on that white paper, you know?

20:58 Yeah.

20:59 And and I think that there must be healing work in working with the survivors for you, all healing together. There is. But I'm just like, thank you. I I'm interested in this because I'm like so grateful to you for doing the work that I I can't.

21:11 I mean, I think that's one of the hardest parts of the job. Even just, you know, I'm the top Democrat on the immigration subcommittee too, and I'm an immigrant myself. And going into the detention centers um and meeting with the families, and you know, and hearing and and just seeing, you know, 23-year-old man, young man from Yemen who's just sobbing because he was trying to escape the war and he's been in detention for two years and they pulled his tooth instead of giving him treatment, and so there's blood pooling in his mouth.

21:44 I mean, like, you know, talking with Renee Good's family, seeing the people who have testified before us at our shadow hearings that I hold. I think sometimes like the violence to them is the worst thing, the violence to Our country, you know, along with that. And then the part about finding a container to put all of that pain in.

22:09 Right, right. But not let yourself be inured to it. Because if you are, I think it's it makes you, in my view, it makes you less effective. Like you to be immune to it, you see. Yeah, because because you know how they say politicians, you should develop a thick skin. I've always thought I don't want a thick skin.

22:25 I really want to feel stuff from people because I think it it pushes us to do more, you know. It pushes, but but yes, you've got to take care of yourself at the same time.

22:34 Yeah. And just as you're speaking about this country and thinking about you, Jan 6th and Epstein, and and I feel like, you know, there, there, we can make meaning of this moment if we choose to. We can make meaning of this moment. And you led this progressive fighter wave. You're I talked to your staffer just to like check in and prep.

22:57 Um he was so proud to say that she was actually um uh elected, she was actually elected before AOC. He wasn't comparing or being competitive, but he was saying she was elected before AOC and this big wave, you know, came in. And you've been really leading this progressive fight. And for you to be elected the same night Trump is elected in 2016.

23:15 I mean, are you feeling are you feeling hopeful in this moment that there's this progressive, democratic, socially responsible version of this country up ahead?

23:27 Yes. I mean, I feel like this is the most hopeful I've felt in a while because I feel like people's eyes are opened, you know, and I kind of felt like before people were just walking through, we're just so overwhelmed with everything. People have to work multiple jobs, they've got to take care of kids, childcare is too expensive, we don't have universal health care.

23:47 Like there's so many things that stop people from being engaged, which again is part of the project, right? Like that is part of their project, is to make sure people are so overwhelmed that they can't engage, they can't do anything about the onslaught of stuff that's coming at us. And I feel like we finally have, partly because of cruelty, it's gotten so bad.

24:08 Um, it's so bad in Gaza, it's so bad in the streets for immigrants, it's so bad for women, sexual assault. It's so, it's so bad that people are like, okay, I can't tolerate this anymore. And we have a new wave of people who are saying, wait a second, everything we've been fed is a lie. And actually, the things that we call crazy, radical, are they're just what every other wealthy country in the world has.

24:36 It's why I love talking to the Nordic ambassadors. We just did a thing with the uh a Nordic summit with all the Nordic countries, came to Seattle because we have a big Nordic population. I said, I love having dinner with the Nordic ambassadors because they're like, Congresswoman, you would be center right in our country.

24:52 Like everything you're fighting for is stuff that we have, you know, universal health care, universal child care, paid leave, all of these things, minimum wage, um, investment in unions. I mean, these are all things that working people should have. And so I feel like now we have a new group of people who are waking up to that and saying, wait a second, the stuff that we're told we can't have is just bullshit.

25:19 It's not true. We can have all those things. And the only thing that's stopping us is this tiny group of people who are controlling our politics, who are controlling our democracy, who are controlling um how much wealth they get and how much wealth we get, which is nothing on the bottom, and they get everything.

25:38 And so I feel like that is supremely hopeful for me, that there's a different sense of what is possible. And um, as an organizer, that's what you always hope for. And and you know, and I think that in organizing, strength emerges in the times of worst crisis. Like that is what pushes us to look deeply at what matters to us and who matters to us.

26:06 And it changes how we think about our responsibility to the world. And so I feel like this is one of those moments, and that makes me super hopeful.

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26:53 Yeah. I mean can can you and it I mean it's uh absolutely remarkable that you're a congresswoman and leading, leading this movement of progress for human rights, for a basic standard of human rights in this country. Remarkable.

27:11 No, I feel really, I mean, in some weird way, you know, my husband is is born and bred in Pittsburgh and like you know, I love Pittsburgh. Yeah, and just a very working. Yes, exactly. And he's a union guy. Yes. And um, and he always says, like, I'm in some ways, I'm like so much more patriotic because I came from all the way.

27:33 Yes, he says that all the time because you know, I don't mind standing up and singing the, I mean, you know, I probably shouldn't say this as a progressive, but I like singing the anthem every time I sing it. Yeah, I'm like, hell yeah, I'm crying because when I got my citizenship, it took me 17 years to get my citizenship.

27:50 I had to sacrifice living on the same continent as my parents, because by the time I could bring them here, they were too old to move. So I've never lived on the same continent as my parents. So it's like a massive sacrifice to come here. And it was because I felt like the United States was so special, you know.

28:05 And I think you appreciate that in some ways when you're coming, as imperfect as it is. Like I study the civil rights movement, I'm a I'm a Mahatma Gandhi acolyte, you know, I'm a I'm a Martin Luther King acolyte. Like this is this is the world I was brought into. And so it's not with eyes closed, but it's the prospect of building a more perfect union that has been so important.

28:30 I mean, let's uh it's funny, the patriotism thing people say about uh people who convert to Judaism, they're like more loudly Jewish than born Jews. Like the it is so it is so uh uh you know strategic that the um fascist movement took the branding of patriotism. Yes. But you know, patriotism to me means that you as an I as an American want every American to have really easy access to very affordable healthcare, very affordable housing, clothes, the clothes they want to wear, good healthy food, good safe schools, and to rest and go out and see a movie, go to dinner, hang out at the park, feeling safe and not the threat of gun violence.

29:16 I really want that for every American. I want it for the whole world, but here I am in America. I yeah, I want this for every person in the United States who is in some process, you know, immigrants too, who are who are in the process of getting their citizenship. If you are here contributing to America, paying your taxes, I want that for Americans.

29:37 And this to me is patriotism. And and to it is so perverted and and directly correlated to the real perversions of their violence that they would take patriotism. When you you are, I mean, you with the the sacrifices you have made are so patriotic. A hero. You're an American hero. I'll accept that badge.

30:01 Thank you.

30:01 Thank you. Thank you for your path. No, I mean, like, I think that that's the thing. We have to take some of these things back, right? We are the part, we are the party of faith, family, and freedom. Like they've taken those words from us, but what does faith mean? It means you can respect any faith or no faith.

30:18 Faith is in the project of the American democracy, right? To me, that's what faith means. And it means that you have equality no matter what what you think or what you believe. Family, we are about keeping families together and respecting every kind of family. And freedom, we believe in real freedom and opportunity for the masses, not for a tiny wealthy few that can afford yachts and, you know, and and uh giant mansions.

30:45 But no, I think that we have to take some of those words back. And I think sometimes on the left we're afraid to say those words, you know, you heard me say, oh, you know, my husband says I'm patriotic. And there are words I don't love in the national anthem when we're talking about the bombs bursting in air, you know.

30:59 I've I've fought against I've fought against our military spending and all of that. Right. But the idea of a country that was born out of leaving the monarchy, you know, and and and the idea that everyone could have certain rights. And yes, it's not, we're not there, you know. But that's it's patriotic to me to stand up for the core values of what American democracy is about.

31:25 And that means criticizing us when we're not doing well. It means standing up for something better, it means believing that something else is possible. This was never supposed to be a stagnant project. Like the founders didn't say, okay, we got the perfect union, here we are, you know. They said no towards building a more perfect union.

31:46 And so every generation has had something to contribute to that. Sometimes we go backwards, but then hopefully we go forward much more than we went back.

31:58 I'm feeling hopeful too.

32:00 Yeah, and I feel like, you know, Abdullah has a saying like life shouldn't be this hard. You know, that's his he says that on the campaign trail all the time. And um, and I walk around, I talk to people, and they're like, Yeah, I can't afford my healthcare. I, you know, I'm paying $20,000 for a private insurance premium, and that's if I'm well.

32:22 That's just for the premium. Right, right. And that's if I'm well. Like I pay $20,000 just to stay healthy. If I get sick in any way, I pay more. If I get cancer, I go bankrupt. We are, we have the distinct, horrible distinction of being the only country in the world where if you get cancer, you can go bankrupt.

32:43 You know, cancer rates spiked in a study when people reached 65. And the researchers out of Stanford were like, why is that? Well, it's because that's when you get Medicare. So all these people who didn't have health care finally get on Medicare, they go to the doctor, they're diagnosed with cancer, but it's too late for many of them.

33:04 So, you know, I lead the Medicare for All bill in the House, and we have to get this done. Like, healthcare has collapsed in this country. And we don't have a healthcare system, we have a sick care system, and we expect people to be emotionally healthy, physically healthy, but you can't be if you can't actually get care.

33:24 And there was a study recently out of Yale that said we would save 117,000 lives a year if we had Medicare for all. I think that is a way understatement. I mean, that's a huge number, first of all. And I think we have no idea in America what it means to have preventive care, like to never get to the place where you need curative care, but to actually be healthy.

33:47 Right. But I just want to stay on affordability for one second. Could we just talk about the price of groceries? Yes. Insane. It's insane. I go to the grocery store, I get the groceries I need, and then I see the total, and I'm like, oh my God. Why I I can't put anything back. This is the stuff I need.

34:04 The stuff you actually need.

34:05 It's unbelievable. And like, is this because of the war in Iran? What is happening? I mean, I know gas prices are up because of our war in Iran.

34:16 No, for sure. I mean, because all the groceries, how do they get to the store, right? I mean, they have to be transported there, so people have got to use gas. Right, right. So that's definitely a huge piece of it. The other part of it is, you know, all the all the consolidation in the food industry.

34:30 We did a huge, um, I started something called the Monopoly Busters Caucus, and we take on consolidation in every industry. Like these giant corporations have kicked out the family farms. You know, here in New York, you still have your bodegas, you still have your, you know, a lot of corner stores, but across the country in most places, that doesn't really exist anymore.

34:48 And so the more consolidated an industry is, the more they can charge for that thing. So you can see this in beef in particular, um, you know, in the in in chicken, in poultry. Like a lot of those things have become so consolidated. So that's a piece of it. A few families own everything. Um, and it's actually a few corporate giant corporations own everything.

35:09 It's it's wow, wow. And so that's a piece of it. But yes, the Iran war has dramatically driven up the price of gas is the most obvious one, but of groceries, of everything that you buy. I mean, school supplies. Like when school started, um, a bunch of my constituents were like, I can't afford stuff for my kid, you know, for so we did like backpacks for for families that couldn't afford things.

35:32 Food banks, like during COVID, the lines were around the block. But that is now we're back to that situation where we have super long lines, and part of that is SNAP, like the cuts to the supplemental nutrition assistance program, which is to feed the hungry. Like it is it's six bucks a day that we pay for people to be able to be fed.

35:59 And the numbers of people that have been kicked off of SNAP, I think it's five million people that have fallen off of SNAP, and two and a half million of those are kids. So, you know, families can't afford groceries, right? So we've got a lot more people now that are have dropped back into um hunger, like pure unadulterated hunger, where they can't get enough food.

36:21 And the cuts to SNAP, the nutritional uh program to feed hungry Americans, and you're saying five million have have felt five.

36:31 That's just because of the I call it the big bad betrayal bill, the Republicans' bill that they passed last year that was all about giving four and a half trillion dollars in tax breaks to the wealthiest few. And to do that, they cut Medicaid and they cut SNAP as two of their big ways in which they got the money to pay for those tax breaks.

36:54 And so that Snap cut alone meant that five million people um have been kicked off since that passed last summer. So and we're gonna see more. And you know, and that falls to the states, right? Because this is also a state-funded program, and so states are trying, states, blue states like mine are trying to address it, but our state budgets are are hurting because all of the money's been cut from the federal government.

37:21 And thank you so much for standing up for the lives of people in Gaza and Palestine. I know that as a non-white woman, you get the you get threats for speaking up for Palestinians' lives and Gazans.

37:36 Yeah, well, thank you for doing it as well. I mean, I just think it's so important that we have Jewish Americans who are saying this is not what our values are, because I think, you know, when when I do it, I'm not Jewish and I get called anti-Semitic. Um, APAC has tried to take me out every single cycle for the last several cycles.

37:54 They've tried to find somebody to run against me. They can't. And so they they put six million dollars into beating my sister when she ran for Congress in Portland. And um, you know, and I think it's just been so awful to just constantly have to deal with people who deny that the genocide has happened and is happening still.

38:18 And I think it is really, I think if people understood how much money we give taxpayer dollars, American taxpayer dollars to finance Israel's war on Gaza and in the West Bank, I think people would be horrified. And I feel like finally that is happening and there will be a change in policy now. But for all, you know, APAC has for so long put so much money into these races, into members of Congress.

38:44 And the fact that we finally got over a hundred Democrats to stand up and say no more aid to Israel, that was like a big step. That's never happened before. Um, it's still only half of the Democratic caucus. So, you know, we've got a ways to go. But I think the movement of people who have been saying this is about human rights, this is about Jewish values, Jewish Americans in particular, saying, wait, we said this was never going to happen again.

39:09 How could we be in this position? A vast majority of people, I believe, do see it as a genocide and agree with the human rights organizations around it. But we should see all of this as movement building, as progress, as organizing, as the as the potential of people's power to make things happen and to change the way things are, because nothing is set stagnant.

39:30 And we can change things. We absolutely can. And you see it on Gaza, you know.

39:36 You know, for somebody who is uh, let's say, you know, working, has a family or you know, or doesn't, but is feeling overwhelmed by the onslaught of the horrors, of the headlines and the really all the question marks around AI and the the doomerism that's coming up from this, what would you say is one thing someone can do who is not really politically engaged but wants to do something?

40:04 Well, the one thing right now that's top of mind is vote, you know. I mean, I just think that um it is part of their I keep calling it their project, but it's part of their plan to make sure people don't vote, that they feel hopeless and powerless. And voting in my mind is actually the most democratic form of nonviolent resistance, right?

40:27 And so that is really, really important. And educate yourself about the vote, you know, so that you, you know, find trusted sources. And um that's I think one important thing. I think the second is to refuse to be hopeless because hopelessness and powerlessness are tools of the oppressor. And so they want you to feel hopeless and powerless.

40:50 And so help a neighbor, you know, buy some groceries for somebody who has something less than you, share some food, make something and give it to someone who has less. I mean, ways to help us understand that we are part of a humanity that requires us to be connected. We are connected. And I think the more we can do to foster those connections, just at a very personal level with our neighbors and with our family, the better off we'll be.

41:18 What are a handful of races that you're most excited about?

41:21 Oh, there's so many. Um, so on the house side, because I'm the co-chair of the CPC PAC, the Progressive Caucus PAC, and I have my own Medicare for All PAC. We have a ton of great candidates. So Randy Viegas in California. This is a flippable district. Randy is son of farm workers. He's worked in the fields himself.

41:39 He's just an awesome candidate. Um, running on so many important affordability issues, Medicare for All, all of those things against corruption. Randy's fabulous. We have um uh a whole Aisha Wahhab, who we finally got into Congress also in California, against just a huge amount of APEC money. Wow. Um, but now she has to run for the permanent seat.

42:04 So that's another California seat, and she's still being in Vegas. Vegas, Vegas, yep, in in Orange County. Um uh that's in the California side. Connie Chan is really great as well. Love Connie, yep, San Francisco, not mayor, Congress. Yeah, congressional. That's a demon dem race, but she's fantastic.

42:26 Um, love her. First generation immigrant came to this country when she was 14, so um with her family, but she she is just a fit phenomenal voice. On the East Coast, we've got um Matt Little in Minnesota, is fantastic. Will Lawrence in Michigan, um Bob Brooks, uh Poindexter. There's a whole bunch of wonderful House candidates that I'm very excited about.

42:49 And on the Senate side, um, my top three are Abdul, who I've worked with for many, many years and done a ton of stuff with and for, um, Peggy Flanagan, who I absolutely adore. We were organ young organizers together 20 years ago when she worked for Wellstone and I was starting my immigrant rights organization.

43:08 Um, and she would be the first Native American woman in the Senate, which is phenomenal. Um, Angie Nixon in Florida, I'm super excited about. Um, I forgot to mention Justin Pearson in Tennessee. Love Justin, tough district, but fantastic. Shamari Figgers, who's an incumbent in Alabama, um, got on Medicare for All and is just a phenomenal fighter.

43:29 Very tough district, was redrawn for Trump for Republicans, um, but he's within striking distance. Um just a really great crop of people. And when I'm on the ground and I'm just about to go to Minnesota and Michigan again, um, it makes me so hopeful because these are the people who are saying, nope, we're not gonna accept the way things are.

43:54 We are not gonna be hopeless, we're not gonna let anyone oppress us, we are gonna fight for the things that are our right as working people to have a family, to have one job that pays you enough, to retire with dignity, to send our kids to college or trade school or whatever higher education they want, um, to be a part of a union and organize against these big corporations.

44:13 I mean, I just think that there's um the the real commitment to a different kind of world is really exciting right now. It's tense, it's nerve-wracking. Oh my god. I I'm not gonna lie, I'm gonna be happy when the election day, when election day comes, but um, but it is exciting to see people with values stand up and decide to do this thing called elected office, which is, you know, it's it's there's a lot of problems with with people who run for elected office and then just want to promote themselves.

44:49 That's not the crop of candidates we have.

44:53 Oh my god. Congresswoman for Village I apologize. I it is my honor to interview you today. Thanks so much for all the work you do for real, normal, working people, Americans who just want to wanna live a peaceful, dignified life. Thank you so much. I really appreciate you.

45:12 Thank you for having me. It's really a joy.

45:17 Thank you, Congresswoman Primage Ayapal, and your whole team for making that happen. Wow. Thank you. You're incredible. Um, so this has been a Starr Picks production. StarPix productions are exclusively human-made. I want to thank my truly deeply handsome uh creative producer, David Rooklin. I want to thank our uh another our other producer, Amanda Jane Stern, and our editor, Tova Leibowitz.

45:45 I want to thank the people who made this set look and sound so beautiful. That's Kevin Deming, Nicole Maupin, and Lexa Krebs. I want to thank Raimo Ventura for the opening musical sting and cool graphics, dude, as well as Don Hur, the band who made this musical outro sting. If you like It's Open with Alana Glazer, please like and subscribe on YouTube and wherever you listen to podcasts so that we can keep bringing this show to you.

46:10 I want to thank Deanna Spinali who helps bring us, help us, helps us bring this show to you by uh being our ad sales partner. Thanks so much and really looking forward to the next time. Bye.