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It Was What It Was : The Football History Podcast

von The Overlap

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Welcome to The Overlap's football history podcast, It Was What It Was.

Each week Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper will be talking about the key episodes in football history that have shaped the footballing world.

The show will be discussing the best stories from football's past, giving insights to the personalities involved. the tales from behind the scenes and the impact they left.

Join us at Football University!

If you enjoy the podcast please hit subscribe to never miss an episode.
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  1. Fanzines Part One: The Punk Spirit of Football's Alternative Press (with Daniel Gray)

    Rob and Jonathan begin a two-part series on football fanzines with Daniel Gray, editor of Nutmeg, host of the When Saturday Comes podcast and author of the new book Fanzine: The Story of Football's Alternative Press. They each share how the

  2. Arsène Wenger Part 4: Arsenal's 1998 Double, French Football’s Rise, and Changing English Football

    Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper conclude their series on Arsène Wenger’s arrival in English football by focusing on his first full season at Arsenal (1997-98), when early doubts, draws, and a UEFA Cup exit gave way to a transformative run to

  3. Arsène Wenger Part 3: Dein’s Dinner Party, Japan, and the ‘Arsène Who?’ Arrival

    Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper continue their Arsène Wenger series by tracing how David Dein first bonded with Wenger—via an improvised London dinner party and charades—before maintaining contact through Monaco, Antibes meetings, and mailed

  4. Arsène Wenger Part 2: Cannes, Nancy and Monaco; ‘Invisible Training’ and a Title

    Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper continue their Arsène Wenger series by tracing his leap from youth coaching at Strasbourg to assistant work under Jean-Marc Guillet at Cannes, where his scouting and relentless workload stood out, before takin

  5. Arsene Wenger Part 1: Alsace Roots, Obsession & The First Break

    Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper begin a four-part series marking 30 years since Arsène Wenger’s arrival at Arsenal, framing him—alongside David Dein—as a key catalyst for the Premier League’s shift toward foreign managers, multicultural squa

  6. Ghanaian's Football Golden Age: Part Two

    Rob Draper and Jonathan Wilson examine Kwame Nkrumah’s state-backed club Real Republicans and why it became widely unpopular despite winning trophies, after being created by taking top players from existing clubs without compensation and re

  7. Ghanaian's Football Golden Age: Part One

    Rob Draper and Jonathan Wilson discuss how Kwame Nkrumah used football to build Ghana’s national identity and promote Pan-African unity after independence (1957) and becoming a republic (1960). They trace Ghana’s colonial background as the

  8. Remembering Kevin Keegan: Part Three

    Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper conclude their three-part series on Kevin Keegan by tracing his managerial career and the idealism behind his “why not?” philosophy. They cover his post-playing retreat in Marbella, a 1991 roadside attack that

  9. Remembering Kevin Keegan: Part Two

    Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper continue their Kevin Keegan series, following his 1977 move from Liverpool to Hamburg for a far higher salary and the difficult start marked by teammate resentment, managerial upheaval, a humiliating Super Cup

  10. Remembering Kevin Keegan: Part One

    *The full three-part series is available on Patreon now* Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper pay tribute to Kevin Keegan, who died in July aged 75, reflecting on his rare charisma, self-awareness, and ability to connect with people, as well as h

  11. Total Football: Glory, Fracture and the 1974 World Cup | Part Four

    The fourth and final episode in Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper's Total Football series explores Ajax’s remarkable success under Stefan Kovacs and the Netherlands’ unforgettable 1974 World Cup campaign. Kovacs inherited Rinus Michels’ Europe

  12. Total Football: Cruyff, Ajax and the Golden Years | Part Three

    In part three of our Total Football series, Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper arrive at Ajax’s golden age. They explore Johan Cruyff’s development: the precocious teenager shaped by Ajax, Vic Buckingham and Rinus Michels; a player whose extrao

  13. Franco Baresi Tribute: Jamie Carragher on Milan's Maestro

    *You can listen to the full episode on our Patreon* Rob Draper hosts a bonus edition of It Was What It Was with Jamie Carragher stepping in to pay tribute to the late great Franco Baresi . Carragher explains why Baresi’s name is passed down

  14. Total Football: Ideas, Architecture and the Feyenoord Breakthrough | Part Two

    In part two of our Total Football series, Jonathan and Rob explore the ideas behind football’s great tactical revolution. From the structuralist architecture and social change of 1960s Amsterdam to Johan Cruyff’s place within a collective s

  15. Total Football: Where Did The Revolution Really Begin? | Part One

    In the first episode of a new four-part series, Jonathan and Rob examine the origins of Total Football - and why it is far more than simply slick passing or players swapping positions. They explore the overlooked influence of English coach

  16. Jordi Cruyff on Father Johan, Total Football and his Lasting Legacy

    Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper are joined by special guest Jordi Cruyff for the first episode in a new series on Total Football: its origins, its legacy, and one of its key architects, Johan Cruyff. Who better than Jordi to reflect on his f

  17. 1930 - 2022: The Best Ever World Cup Finals

    In World Cup final week, we just had to ask Jonathan and Rob to decide on the best World Cup finals of all time - and they certainly delivered. From Uruguay in 1930 to Qatar in 2022, there's no better way to whet your appetite for Sunday ev

  18. Eusébio, Messi and the Best Ever World Cup Quarter-Finals

    Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper pick their favourite World Cup quarterfinals while previewing the upcoming last-eight: Portugal’s 5–3 comeback against North Korea at Goodison Park in 1966, highlighting Eusébio’s peak display, disputed refere

  19. World Cup Mailbag | Patreon Sneak Peek

    Throughout the World Cup Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper are recording weekly live Q&As, exclusively for our Patreon subscribers. This week, all eyes were on England's win over DR Congo, sparking a debate on their reliance on Harry Kane. A w

  20. Football's Coming Home: How England Won The 1966 World Cup | Part Four

    To listen to the full four-part series instantly, subscribe to our Patreon where listeners can enjoy ad-free listening, our World Cup Wednesdays, bonus editions and live Q&A episodes. Rob Draper and Jonathan Wilson conclude their four-part

  21. Football's Coming Home: How England Won The 1966 World Cup | Part Three

    To listen to the full four-part series instantly, subscribe to our Patreon where listeners can enjoy ad-free listening, our World Cup Wednesdays, bonus editions and live Q&A episodes. Rob Draper and Jonathan Wilson continue their series on

  22. Football's Coming Home: How England Won The 1966 World Cup | Part Two

    To listen to the full four-part series instantly, subscribe to our Patreon where listeners can enjoy ad-free listening, our World Cup Wednesdays, bonus editions and live Q&A episodes. Rob Draper and Jonathan Wilson continue their four-part

  23. Football's Coming Home: How England Won The 1966 World Cup | Part One

    To listen to the full four-part series instantly, subscribe to our Patreon where listeners can enjoy ad-free listening, our World Cup Wednesdays, bonus editions and live Q&A episodes. Rob Draper and Jonathan Wilson begin a four-part series

  24. Brazil at the World Cup with Tim Vickery: Pelé, Maracanazo and Ancelotti's New Era

    Welcome back to It Was What It Was, the football history podcast. In this week's episode, co-hosts Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper are joined by Tim Vickery to discuss the extraordinary story of Brazil at the World Cup. From the ultra-nation

  25. The Greatest Champions League Finals of All Time

    Welcome back to It Was What It Was, the football history podcast. In this week's episode, co-hosts Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper pick their six greatest European Cup and Champions League finals of all time. From the 127,000 who stayed to a

  26. Patreon Bonus Sneak Peek | Inside England: Southgate’s Culture Reset, EPPP and the Tuchel Gamble

    Listen to the Full Episode on the IWWIW Patreon here... (https://www.patreon.com/posts/world-cup-1998-158330256?utm_medium=clipboard_copy&utm_source=copyLink&utm_campaign=postshare_fan&utm_content=web_share) In this Patreon special of It Wa

  27. Breaking the Old Firm: Fergie's Aberdeen Revolution

    Welcome back to It Was What It Was, the football history podcast. In this week's episode, co-hosts Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper are joined by Michael Grant, Scottish football correspondent for The Times and author of Fergie Rises, to tell

  28. The FA Cup & The Broken Neck | Bert Trautmann The Nazi POW & Man City Legend

    Welcome back to It Was What It Was, the football history podcast. In this week's episode, co-hosts Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper tell the remarkable story of Bert Trautmann — the former Nazi paratrooper who became Manchester City's beloved

  29. "Can't Win Anything With Kids" Manchester United's 1996 Triumph

    Welcome back to It Was What It Was, the football history podcast. In this week's episode, co-hosts Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper revisit the 1995-96 Premier League season. 30 years on from one of the great title races. They trace Mancheste

  30. The Impossible Dream: Leicester City’s Premier League Win

    Welcome back to It Was What It Was, the football history podcast. In this week’s episode, co-hosts Jonthan Wilson and Rob Draper are joined by Sports Journalist and author Jonathan Northcroft to take a look 10 years on from that extraordina

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