208: Kelly Chambers: Emotionally Intelligent?

[SPEAKER_05]: I'm Commander Shepherd, and this is my favorite lorecast on the Citadel. [SPEAKER_02]: Welcome to the Mass Effect lorecast. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm in seven the legend. [SPEAKER_04]: And I'm Genesis. [SPEAKER_04]: Join us. [SPEAKER_02]: As we explore a long tides of light through shows of dust.

[SPEAKER_02]: To see where this lore began. [SPEAKER_04]: And consider where it may go. [SPEAKER_02]: Specters, welcome back to another week of the Mass Effect Lorecast. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm your host in seven the legend and joining me as always is Genesis and Genesis. [SPEAKER_02]: It looks like you are in orbit right now.

[SPEAKER_04]: I am in orbit in super secret rejected location. [SPEAKER_04]: So my audio is a little bit wonky this week if this is the first time that you're tuning in. [SPEAKER_04]: It's normally not sounding like this. [SPEAKER_02]: That's okay. [SPEAKER_02]: We totally understand and then thank you everyone for your patience.

[SPEAKER_02]: The last week where we had to skip last week because I was right in the thick of an interview pack to week, looking for a new full-time job. [SPEAKER_02]: But it's good. [SPEAKER_02]: It's good news. [SPEAKER_02]: Anyway, speaking of jobs, we have a very corporate character to talk about today.

[SPEAKER_04]: Yes, yes, we do. [SPEAKER_04]: And I have a lot of thoughts on our character today. [SPEAKER_04]: Do you want me to fully introduce it? [SPEAKER_04]: Or do you want to? [SPEAKER_02]: Well, yeah, I think when we try and dance around it, people on Spotify already see the title and they're like, well, I already know who you're talking about.

[SPEAKER_02]: So why don't we talk about Kelly Chambers, huh? [SPEAKER_04]: Kelly Kelly Kelly. [SPEAKER_04]: Okay, so we're about to then I covered her on the girls and experience her full romance. [SPEAKER_04]: really changed the way that I think about her. [SPEAKER_04]: You know, it's she's very, very different than if you've just been like the stand-offish person to her the whole time.

[SPEAKER_04]: So I can't wait to really get into this. [SPEAKER_02]: What help if I unmute myself before researching for this episode, I thought that the romance culmination seen for her was the dinner. [UNKNOWN]: Oh. [SPEAKER_02]: And then I did a little bit of research and I quickly found out that no, I was very wrong.

[SPEAKER_02]: So apparently I have never fully romance Kelly. [SPEAKER_02]: I think because I just stopped trying after the dinner, I was like, OK, well, she's going to feed my fish. [SPEAKER_02]: So I can't get better than that. [SPEAKER_02]: But it does. [SPEAKER_02]: It does get better. [SPEAKER_02]: And we'll get into a little bit of that.

[SPEAKER_02]: But did you know that her voice actor was also in better call Saul? [SPEAKER_02]: She was page-novic for those of you who watched the show and my apologies if I mispronounced it. [SPEAKER_02]: Character's name because I don't. [SPEAKER_02]: But apparently she was in Better Call Saul. [SPEAKER_02]: But I think that we're gonna differ a lot on Kelly because I didn't really dislike Kelly until I got older.

[SPEAKER_02]: I felt neutral about her most of the time that I was a teenager playing this game. [SPEAKER_02]: And now I think [SPEAKER_02]: After being in the workforce for a certain amount of time, I have just simply had too many experiences with people just like her to want any more experiences with people who are just like Kelly.

[SPEAKER_04]: Oh no, I totally get it because in the beginning I thought that she was just annoying and there to be like the sexy secretary type, but you know, I actually learned that there was more to her. [SPEAKER_04]: And I get that. [SPEAKER_04]: I really, really do. [SPEAKER_04]: The type that things learning is a way to get in or the ones who will come and sit on your desk because they think it's cute.

[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_04]: But honestly, I was that girl for a while. [SPEAKER_04]: It's an easy stereotype to play into, but then life happens. [SPEAKER_04]: Things knock you down and then you have to either stay there or grow from it and become more than someone just looking to sleep their way to trophy wife status.

[SPEAKER_04]: Kelly kind of does. [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know where you're talking about. [SPEAKER_02]: Kelly is just a really empathetic soul. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_04]: I've never experienced any form of trauma and I'm here just to spread my love in any way possible. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_04]: That's Kelly, right?

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, there we go. [SPEAKER_02]: So you had to mention the ones that will come and sit on your desk thinking it's cute. [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, so if anyone else has ever worked with someone like this, then you know all of the aura that goes around with it, you know what I mean? [SPEAKER_02]: I once had a coworker who did this and would refer to me as her work husband, despite me asking her not to.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, that was uncomfortable. [SPEAKER_04]: I have only referred to somebody as a work husband once because he was like my counter part in a lot of ways and it was mutually agreed upon. [SPEAKER_04]: He then started calling me his work wife. [SPEAKER_04]: It wasn't weird or creepy. [SPEAKER_04]: I get the sense of this situation with you.

[SPEAKER_04]: It was not reciprocating. [SPEAKER_02]: No, it wasn't. [SPEAKER_02]: It wasn't anyway. [SPEAKER_02]: That's, you know, Kelly kind of nailed it with that. [SPEAKER_02]: Kelly does have this kind of vibe. [SPEAKER_02]: Maybe not so forward about it, but she's got the very, you know, I'm just, I'm just very, I'm here to be a listening crying shoulder for you if you need it, you know, that kind of thing.

[SPEAKER_02]: And I think a lot of people might ask what does Kelly even do aboard the Normandy besides tell you you've got mail [SPEAKER_04]: Well, okay, in Mass Effect One, we had Kate and Ashley there to let us know how the other crewmates were doing. [SPEAKER_04]: You could ask them how everyone was working together and who wanted to talk to you next.

[SPEAKER_04]: Kate and had all the dirt and Ashley had all of the drama. [SPEAKER_04]: But now that role is taken on by Kelly, but I think she can explain it better than I can. [SPEAKER_02]: Absolutely. [SPEAKER_02]: So, why don't we go ahead and jump over here to a clip. [SPEAKER_02]: This one uploaded to YouTube by A.M.

[SPEAKER_02]: Harbinger. [SPEAKER_02]: Thank you, A.M. [SPEAKER_02]: Harbinger. [SPEAKER_07]: I'm Yom and Kelly Chambers. [SPEAKER_07]: I've been assigned as your administrative assistant. [SPEAKER_07]: I'll manage your messages and help you monitor the crew. [SPEAKER_07]: And I must say it's such an honor to work under you Commander Shepherd.

[SPEAKER_05]: I'm glad to have you on the team, Miss Chambers. [SPEAKER_07]: Please, call me Kelly. [SPEAKER_05]: Okay, Kelly. [SPEAKER_07]: Anything else? [SPEAKER_05]: Do you have a moment to talk? [SPEAKER_07]: I always have time for you commander. [SPEAKER_05]: What are your responsibilities? [SPEAKER_07]: I'll keep you notified of any messages or appointments you might have.

[SPEAKER_07]: If any of the crew has important business to discuss, I'll make sure you know. [SPEAKER_05]: Isn't that the type of task better suited for a VI? [SPEAKER_07]: Yes, but being your young man is just my official role, unofficially I observe the crew. [SPEAKER_07]: Everyone knows how risky our mission is.

[SPEAKER_07]: Many of us may not be coming back. [SPEAKER_07]: That's a lot of pressure. [SPEAKER_07]: I have a degree in psychology. [SPEAKER_07]: I'm good at sensing when people are overly taxed. [SPEAKER_05]: You make sure the crew's mental health is sound? [SPEAKER_07]: Yes, I look for warning signs.

[SPEAKER_07]: I listen. [SPEAKER_07]: It's not a full-time job and it's most effective when done informal. [SPEAKER_05]: We're lucky to have someone with your skills, Kelly. [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, so she says, okay, I have a I have a degree in psychology. [SPEAKER_02]: I'd really like to know what degree that is because if it's an associates, if it's, you know, a doctorate that's a little bit different, right?

[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, I too would like to know what level of psychology and what her main focus was. [SPEAKER_04]: Cause yeah, I would just go for psychology too, but that doesn't actually mean anything. [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, so she's our human, but in the corporate world, we might call her our secretary, our executive assistant.

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, she does call herself your administrative assistant, but her duties extend to the whole crew, not just your office, unless you want her there. [SPEAKER_04]: There are definitely some scenarios in which you want Kelly in your office. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, because my fish will die otherwise.

[SPEAKER_04]: Oh. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, I don't know what I would really call her. [SPEAKER_04]: I think that she's a woman. [SPEAKER_04]: And that is a real actual terminology that the United States Navy uses. [SPEAKER_04]: So it at least has some basis in real world. [SPEAKER_02]: Right. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: So she essentially her job is to listen in to crewmates pick up on nuanced, perhaps non-verbal cues about their mental well-being to advise you about it, to advise you when they'd like to speak with you. [SPEAKER_02]: She manages essentially all incoming communications meant for the commander.

[SPEAKER_02]: So yes, in that way, she is a little bit like the commanding officer secretary, but let's talk about her ties to Cerberus, right? [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, she works for them, but is she as gung-ho about the pro-human thing? [SPEAKER_02]: Is she just kind of stuck on a job like the clinically depressed looks I get from some retail workers?

[SPEAKER_02]: I seriously, I think the answer here lies in whether you choose to actually get to know her. [SPEAKER_02]: Because if you don't, then you might think that she's just a corporate cheerleader. [SPEAKER_02]: But here's what she tells us when we first ask her. [SPEAKER_02]: When we first ask her about servers, here's what she says.

[SPEAKER_02]: Are you ready? [SPEAKER_05]: This organization has a dark reputation. [SPEAKER_05]: Do you have any concerns working for them? [SPEAKER_07]: Not at all. [SPEAKER_07]: Our methods can be harsh, but Cerberus has noble objectives. [SPEAKER_07]: We look out for human interests. [SPEAKER_07]: Advanced human technologies save human lives.

[SPEAKER_07]: They're good goals. [SPEAKER_05]: It sounds like Cerberus wants to dominate all aliens and put human kind on top. [SPEAKER_07]: The server looks out for humanity, but that doesn't mean we hate aliens. [SPEAKER_07]: My sister started a dog shelter, but she loved cats too. [SPEAKER_07]: I love humanity.

[SPEAKER_07]: I also love Asari, Korean, Tori, and Salarian, Hanar. [SPEAKER_07]: That isn't in conflict with serverous ideals. [SPEAKER_05]: That's a very positive attitude. [SPEAKER_07]: What can I say? [SPEAKER_07]: I'm a people person. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm a people person. [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, go, go have like lunch with the rest of your HR department.

[SPEAKER_02]: Kelly, oh my gosh. [SPEAKER_04]: Okay, but okay, yes, I also kind of like it though in the fact that she, this is the park of Cerberus that she believes in. [SPEAKER_04]: So she's telling you, like, just because I'm pro-human doesn't mean I'm anti-alien. [SPEAKER_04]: And so I kind of like that, I've done a shepherd run through at playing that same style.

[SPEAKER_02]: Okay, counterpoint, that sounds a lot like the All Lives Matter people. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm just going to suck all the air out of the room right away. [SPEAKER_02]: If you're listening to this on your morning commute to work, you're welcome. [SPEAKER_02]: Glad I woke you up. [SPEAKER_02]: But she's excusing some of service's reputation and actions as harsh but justified, right?

[SPEAKER_02]: That's what she's doing. [SPEAKER_02]: At the surface level, I'm going to play Devil's Advocate and I actually kind of argue for her now. [SPEAKER_02]: At the surface level, we might think that that that that is pretty extreme that she's just downplaying Cerberus as harsh. [SPEAKER_02]: However, it occurred to me that she likely doesn't know all of what Cerberus is doing because she's only in the Lazarus cell and we know that the cells are siloed and kept in the dark about each other.

[SPEAKER_04]: Oh yeah, absolutely. [SPEAKER_04]: Like nobody knows what any other serverist group is really doing, only the elusive man knows everything. [SPEAKER_04]: And Kelly is pretty, I'd say, low on the chain of command. [SPEAKER_04]: It's she's not at like more random level who's going to be in on so many of the secrets and ongoing, so other things that are going on.

[SPEAKER_04]: I really don't think Kelly knows a lot. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it kind of just seems like, you know, she is a little, she comes across as naive, perhaps that she read all of the corporate Ura Ra language believed in what they were espousing and hasn't seen behind the curtain yet. [SPEAKER_02]: I think is the best possible way to interpret that.

[SPEAKER_04]: Oh, you mean the same things that Joker and Chuck was said. [SPEAKER_02]: What did they say? [SPEAKER_04]: Well, that along those same lines, like, I don't really, you know, like, service has its upsides work. [SPEAKER_04]: I work here to work with them, not against them anymore. [SPEAKER_04]: Like, that's what Joker and Chapa said in the beginning.

[SPEAKER_02]: I didn't recall that specifically. [SPEAKER_02]: For some reason, I remember them saying something along the lines of service. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I don't really care like screw them, but I'm here for you, Commander. [SPEAKER_04]: I think Joker just liked having the chair. [SPEAKER_02]: I was just going to say Joker seems to really love his new ergonomic chair.

[SPEAKER_02]: And his new Robo girlfriend. [SPEAKER_02]: But Kelly was handpicked. [SPEAKER_02]: Handpicked according to her for the Normandy by none other than the elusive man. [SPEAKER_02]: That is like a very specific pipeline for scouting talent that he would hand pick her. [SPEAKER_02]: That's a big deal.

[SPEAKER_02]: The only other person I know that he hand picked or people I suppose was Miranda and Jacob. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, because he, what, told Brooks to find the rest of the people and to gather Intel on his own shepherds old crew. [SPEAKER_02]: That's right. [SPEAKER_02]: She was the one compiling the dossiers and then forwarding them to Miranda since Miranda was in charge of the Lazarus cell.

[SPEAKER_02]: But Kelly does also relay these psych reports back to the elusive man. [SPEAKER_02]: So it's not just like their internal and only meant for the commanders welfare. [SPEAKER_02]: So in some ways, I feel like players could feel like Kelly is acting as nothing more than the elusive man's on board spy.

[SPEAKER_02]: Or is that too reductive? [SPEAKER_04]: I, well, okay, so she is the onboard spy. [SPEAKER_04]: But that's not what she believes she is doing. [SPEAKER_04]: You know, this is the elusive man's operation and he's overseeing the whole crew with Shepherd and Miranda being the onboard commanders.

[SPEAKER_04]: So she relates her findings back to both Shepherd and Timmy. [SPEAKER_04]: You know, her background is, quote, in psychology, and I believe that she genuinely wants to help the crew with their mental health during one or some extremely mentally taxing times. [SPEAKER_04]: And then she's simply reporting back to her boss.

[SPEAKER_04]: It's what she's supposed to be doing. [SPEAKER_04]: I don't think she has a hidden agenda of being a spy for Tim. [SPEAKER_02]: wouldn't she have learned in the course of her psychology degree that there are certain aspects of mental health between a counselor or a confidant and the patient or client that you do not disclose outside of that relationship?

[SPEAKER_04]: No, because I believe that there are like in the military, if you see a military psychiatrist, they report back to your commanding officer on some things. [SPEAKER_04]: If [SPEAKER_04]: Right. [SPEAKER_02]: Sure. [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, services in the military, but it's a military operation.

[SPEAKER_02]: You could say, so this is an interesting topic. [SPEAKER_02]: I guess maybe she would report some details. [SPEAKER_02]: Maybe if she felt that the mental status of said crew member was jeopardizing the mission or the safety of others. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_04]: That's, so I think that's what she's doing.

[SPEAKER_04]: You know, we don't get to actually see the reports that she's sending back to the elusive man. [SPEAKER_04]: It could be along the same lines of what she tells us each time somebody knew joins the ship. [SPEAKER_04]: Like I remember specifically when Gareth joins, he talks, she says, you know, he seems so sad.

[SPEAKER_04]: I wish I could just go give him a hug and [SPEAKER_04]: You know, it's like if that's what she's reporting back to the elusive man. [SPEAKER_04]: Gary's for Carrie and seems a little depressed. [SPEAKER_04]: It's not like she's being a very good spy then. [SPEAKER_02]: No, however the other possibility is that the elusive man placed her there and gave her this mission specifically because there are so many aliens aboard a service vessel.

[SPEAKER_02]: And he doesn't trust aliens. [SPEAKER_02]: So. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: So maybe he just basically needed someone who was not shepherd and was not Miranda so that she could be on on board the ship the whole time and kind of have eyes on these suspicious aliens that delusament thought about.

[SPEAKER_02]: I don't know. [SPEAKER_02]: I'll come back to the server's thing in a bit when we talk about her in Mass Effect Three. [SPEAKER_02]: But I find it interesting that she's basically feeling out mental health aboard the Nordie. [SPEAKER_02]: Most of her dialogue in Mass Effect Two is basically comments about the crewmates or showering shepherd with praise and affection if you take it there.

[SPEAKER_02]: That said, after the Horizon mission specifically, she asks about the Vermeyer survivor and I find it interesting if you romance to either Caden or Ashley. [SPEAKER_02]: So take a listen to this dialogue right here. [SPEAKER_02]: Let me bring it up. [SPEAKER_07]: I saw the reports on Horizon Commander.

[SPEAKER_07]: Why you did was amazing. [SPEAKER_07]: The report mentioned that Ashley Williams was there. [SPEAKER_07]: How did that go? [SPEAKER_05]: It was good to see you here. [SPEAKER_07]: Do you have strong feelings for her? [SPEAKER_05]: What we had together is in the past now. [SPEAKER_07]: I'm sorry, parting ways with someone so close is never easy.

[SPEAKER_05]: I appreciate that, but I'll be okay. [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, so for me as someone who, of course, romance dashally, when Kelly probed about this, my first thought was, ah, aren't you particularly interested in my previous relationship and how that reunion went with my ex? [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, I also went along the same line.

[SPEAKER_04]: So why are you asking me about this? [SPEAKER_04]: Cause that was a really hard moment with Caden turning his back on me and walking away. [SPEAKER_04]: So I was kind of mad at him in the moment. [SPEAKER_04]: And now Kelly's asking about him. [SPEAKER_04]: And I'm like, I don't want to talk to you about it.

[SPEAKER_04]: Not right now. [SPEAKER_02]: I just got back on the ship, geez. [SPEAKER_02]: The other thing is, even if she's not taking a personal interest, she's definitely psychoanalyzing shepherd in this moment. [SPEAKER_02]: And Shepherd is just shutting it down. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, thanks. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm okay.

[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, but I mean, it is nice if you actually tell her what your two feelings are for for my or survivor in that moment because it's like, you're like, yeah, I still have a lot of feelings for them. [SPEAKER_04]: She's consoling you about the fact that you guys can't be together or if you're like, no, forget them.

[SPEAKER_04]: She's like, okay, you might need to sit and think on this for a minute because you have a lot of emotions running through you right now. [SPEAKER_02]: I kind of like the whole shutting it down like thanks, but I'm okay, because for me, my role play is Commander Shipper doesn't trust Cerberus at all.

[SPEAKER_02]: And knows that every single thing he or she says to Kelly is going right back to Cerberus. [SPEAKER_02]: So it's like, thanks, I'm gonna handle my own personal problems. [SPEAKER_02]: We're gonna keep this relationship strictly business. [SPEAKER_02]: Anyway, do I have a new email, Kelly?

[SPEAKER_04]: I love how opposite we play this game. [SPEAKER_04]: I totally just like, yeah, I love being opened and honest with people. [SPEAKER_04]: If you ask me a question, I'm going to tell you how I feel. [SPEAKER_02]: Look, I love being open and honest too, but I have been bit too many times and now I'm a little jaded, so I'm like, okay, maybe I shouldn't be open and honest with.

[SPEAKER_02]: as a default, because these motherfuckers are scheming. [SPEAKER_02]: But anyway, that takes us to the infamous crew abduction, and Kelly is one of those named crew members who can die if you don't choose to save them. [SPEAKER_02]: Now, an interesting note here that I found on an old blog post, I had to put it into the way back machine and resurrect it.

[SPEAKER_02]: It was written by the writer who created Kelly's character, Dusty Everman. [SPEAKER_02]: He writes, from a development point of view, the real purpose for those light characters was to give meaning to the choice of going through the Omega-four relay early or waiting. [SPEAKER_02]: It was supposed to be something like the Ashley Kate and choice in Mass Effect One.

[SPEAKER_02]: Do you save your Normandy crew, but risk your squad mates and the entire mission? [SPEAKER_02]: Or do you prepare more, but potentially sacrifice the crew? [SPEAKER_02]: So what he's saying here is that it was supposed to be something where you couldn't save everybody. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, I think there wasn't enough weight in this decision for me because I have never immediately gone to save them.

[SPEAKER_04]: I've always been more worried about the people who are my squadmates, the ones that I go out with that I can have as party members. [SPEAKER_04]: And I think that's just because it's like, you know, this side characters are important. [SPEAKER_04]: They are, they're there to move the story forward.

[SPEAKER_04]: But your squad mates are there to actually build the story. [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I get it. [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I love Chuck West, right? [SPEAKER_02]: But like, Gabby and Ken, and like, Sergeant Gardner, the Mess Sergeant, you know, it's just, it sucks that they got abducted. [SPEAKER_02]: But I got to go to Talie's loyalty mission.

[SPEAKER_02]: And then, and then I'll go through the relay, right? [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I always, and I'm also a completionist. [SPEAKER_02]: So, I did not like the feeling of feeling like I had to leave some mission behind. [SPEAKER_02]: Now, if they had reworked this, where you literally had to choose one or the other, where you couldn't have your cake and eat it too, that if you waited even one mission, they would die.

[SPEAKER_02]: That would have been insane. [SPEAKER_02]: I think I might have liked that, actually. [SPEAKER_04]: I do too, and I think that, you know, with the Kaden Ashley decision in one, it was very clear. [SPEAKER_04]: Save Ashley, save Kaden, make your one and only choice right now. [SPEAKER_04]: To me, it wasn't that clear that, you know, going to do the Reaper IFS mission meant that a countdown was going to start, which meant that I had to do things in this order in order to save everybody.

[SPEAKER_04]: And I guess I kind of, I do like that. [SPEAKER_04]: because you have to face your consequences for doing things however you want to do them, not in a specific order. [SPEAKER_04]: But I guess it could have also been made a little bit more clear that this was the decision that I would be making.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_02]: Dusty everyone continues in saying reflecting on that choice saying that we kind of failed at this goal on two accounts. [SPEAKER_02]: One, that decision wasn't clear. [SPEAKER_02]: Like you just said, that decision wasn't clear. [SPEAKER_02]: And two, we gave the ability to save everyone if you did the mission order just right.

[SPEAKER_02]: but the light crew members were there in an attempt to give you someone to care about. [SPEAKER_02]: If you don't like the flirty optimistic yeoman, hopefully you like your old doctor friend, or the joking engineers, or the brash cook. [SPEAKER_02]: Hopefully there is at least one of those you care about to make the choice to go through the Omega Relay early a compelling one.

[SPEAKER_02]: It wasn't compelling for me. [SPEAKER_02]: But it's not because I didn't care about those people. [SPEAKER_02]: It's just that I care more about the squadmates. [SPEAKER_04]: Exactly. [SPEAKER_04]: I cared more about the squadmates, but then honestly, I was really sad when I did a playthrough where I just jumped into Emmy three and did the Genesis comics to start them and all those people were gone because the comic book makes you make the choice.

[SPEAKER_04]: Do the loyalty missions or save your crew. [SPEAKER_02]: That's tough. [SPEAKER_02]: So I've never actually done the Genesis comics, I think. [SPEAKER_02]: The only time I did them was when I did the Mass Effect randomizer playthrough because there was no randomizer mod from Mass Effect one.

[SPEAKER_02]: So, and that nothing would have played through another at all. [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know, I'd love to hear from other people who willfully went through the Omega-four relay early because you didn't want to lose the other crew members besides your squadmates, or maybe you thought the squadmates were included on that, although like YouTube's in chat here says, the abducted crew missed out on seeing Chef successfully stuffing a codiac with all of their squadmates.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, there is a lot of people in there. [SPEAKER_02]: I usually take in four tops and then it's twelve. [SPEAKER_02]: Woof. [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, so obviously if you don't save Kelly, she gets turned into goo for the human reaper, the collectors are building. [SPEAKER_02]: But if you do, if you save her just in time, then she survives with some serious PTSD.

[SPEAKER_02]: And here she is talking about it directly after the fact in Mass Effect, too. [SPEAKER_02]: Give this a listen. [SPEAKER_07]: You came for us. [SPEAKER_07]: I knew you were. [SPEAKER_07]: Thank you. [SPEAKER_07]: A thousand times. [SPEAKER_07]: Thank you. [SPEAKER_05]: How are you doing, Kelly?

[SPEAKER_07]: I'm holding up. [SPEAKER_07]: Just can't get the memories out of my head. [SPEAKER_07]: Trapped, suffocating. [SPEAKER_07]: It's oozing into every core. [SPEAKER_07]: Fate, sobs, echoing the confined space. [SPEAKER_07]: But I can't dwell on it. [SPEAKER_07]: I'm okay now, I'm alive. [SPEAKER_07]: Back to the old Kelly.

[SPEAKER_02]: oof okay back to the old kelly she says uh... that's really hard to hear back to the old kelly because it's like this will full choice this effort made in vain to hold the styrofoam underwater like everything's okay uh... and the delivery of that line is really great as well because you can tell she's fighting with it because she's like okay [SPEAKER_02]: We've got a mission to do.

[SPEAKER_02]: Back to the old Kelly. [SPEAKER_02]: I can't focus on this right now, and yet this is the psychologist needs help. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, and I think that that line definitely needed to be there. [SPEAKER_04]: There is so much trauma that all of our grizzled warrior types don't talk about.

[SPEAKER_04]: Kelly does. [SPEAKER_04]: Chuck was does. [SPEAKER_04]: The non-combatants that you save are all hurting because of what happened to them. [SPEAKER_04]: Kelly is really the only one to talk about how she felt and how it continues to feel. [SPEAKER_04]: This conversation doesn't stop in ME two.

[SPEAKER_04]: It continues into ME three. [SPEAKER_04]: And honestly, I feel like she's one of the most emotionally aware people on the Normandy. [SPEAKER_04]: Does everyone else bottles it up? [SPEAKER_04]: They ignore it. [SPEAKER_04]: They laugh off the pain or just tell it to fuck off like Jack. [SPEAKER_04]: But with some in their romance dialogues, you get peeks at it.

[SPEAKER_04]: Little glimpses about what they are feeling. [SPEAKER_04]: But in reality, they're there to help you. [SPEAKER_04]: They're there to help shepherd, not for shepherd to help them with their current trauma. [SPEAKER_04]: You do their loyalty missions to heal a part of their past, but you don't help them heal right now in the moment.

[SPEAKER_04]: And I'm sorry. [SPEAKER_04]: Did I mention that I have a lot of thoughts on Kelly? [SPEAKER_02]: I can tell. [SPEAKER_02]: You're a little bashful, but go on. [SPEAKER_04]: Okay, I mean, I could talk more about how the fact that I actually think that she's one of the most emotionally intelligent people on this ship.

[SPEAKER_04]: Because nobody else really asks you how are you doing Shepard and truly listens and uses that as feedback in order to adjust the way that she's talking to you. [SPEAKER_04]: But you know, because who else is going to have the three different relationships statuses with you? [SPEAKER_04]: And she does that because of the way that you interact with her.

[SPEAKER_04]: But okay. [SPEAKER_04]: Anyways, I can move on. [SPEAKER_04]: If you say her and have dinner with her as either a friend or as a lover, she comes back in Mass Effect Three. [SPEAKER_02]: See, I didn't know that the dinner was necessary for her to come back. [SPEAKER_02]: And that would probably explain why I don't find her sometimes at that refugee camp on the Citadel.

[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, you have to either be friendly or flirtatious with her in order to get that dinner and a lot of people who just don't like her persona at the gate, just completely ignore her and never even get her to like friendship status. [SPEAKER_02]: I might be guilty of that one. [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, the other thing was, you have to understand that I was operating under the assumption that the dinner was the romance scene.

[SPEAKER_02]: And thereby, if you do the dinner, you are romance in her. [SPEAKER_02]: And so a lot of playthroughs, I just wanted to be faithful to Ashley. [SPEAKER_02]: So I've romance to Ashley, Mass Effect One, purposefully didn't romance anyone in Mass Effect Two, and then rekindler with Ash and Mass Effect Three.

[SPEAKER_02]: So I always kind of head canon that like, [SPEAKER_02]: The dinner was like something physical happened. [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know what base they got to, but like, come on. [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know. [SPEAKER_02]: And I read a comment from the writer on the blog that says, look, that one was purposefully left open to interpretation.

[SPEAKER_02]: If you imagined it as just a friendly dinner, then it was a friendly dinner. [SPEAKER_02]: If you imagined it as something physical, then it was something physical. [SPEAKER_02]: So I don't know. [SPEAKER_02]: The fact that they apparently stayed up all night in the captain's private quarters, [SPEAKER_02]: Hmm, do you think they're playing chess?

[SPEAKER_04]: I mean, so it depends on which play they're going through right now. [SPEAKER_04]: And if I'm fully Robinson or just like flirting with her, but uh, yeah, I definitely think two friends can sit up talking all night long playing video games and chatting and not have it be anything more than that.

[SPEAKER_02]: okay but that's not okay he met her like what two months before that and it's not like they have a lot of friendly banter it's just like a lot of like praise and all they're there from Kelly you know what I mean so I don't know it was oddly flirtatious leading up to the dinner I am hard pressably that it was strictly stake [SPEAKER_02]: I think something else was on the menu.

[SPEAKER_02]: But regardless, if even if you've keeper as a friend and you have dinner, you run into her again in Mass Effect Three, here's a little bit of what that reunion looks like. [SPEAKER_07]: I've been so worried. [SPEAKER_07]: Without my Cerberus contacts, I had no way of knowing if you'd survive the invasion.

[SPEAKER_05]: You're not with Cerberus anymore? [SPEAKER_07]: Working with you opened my eyes, got me thinking. [SPEAKER_07]: I looked closely what Cerberus had done. [SPEAKER_07]: In good conscience, I couldn't stay with them. [SPEAKER_07]: You inspired me to leave. [SPEAKER_05]: It looks like there are a lot of people here who could use your help.

[SPEAKER_07]: There is. [SPEAKER_07]: I feel I'm making a real difference. [SPEAKER_07]: If there was ever a reason I studied psychology, it was to help people at a time like this. [SPEAKER_05]: Didn't think Cerberus liked people going AWOL. [SPEAKER_07]: They don't. [SPEAKER_07]: But Cerberus has more important things to worry about than me.

[SPEAKER_05]: Don't take chances with Cerberus. [SPEAKER_05]: Change your look. [SPEAKER_05]: Change your name. [SPEAKER_05]: Get into identification. [SPEAKER_07]: That takes time. [SPEAKER_07]: And the people here need my help. [SPEAKER_05]: Do it, Kelly. [SPEAKER_07]: OK, I will. [SPEAKER_07]: If you think I should.

[SPEAKER_02]: OK, so she says that she's going to change her identity. [SPEAKER_02]: But more importantly, she does leave Cerberus. [SPEAKER_02]: And if you, like me, thought that the dinner meant a romance thing and just were like, oh, I don't really want to do that. [SPEAKER_02]: I'll just keep you as a friends.

[SPEAKER_02]: I don't do the dinner. [SPEAKER_02]: Then you never find her in Mass Effect Three. [SPEAKER_02]: This might be why. [SPEAKER_02]: And you would also never get to see. [SPEAKER_02]: If you don't see her in Mass Effect Three, you never get to see that she leaves Cerberus. [SPEAKER_02]: And this is yet another character's redemption arc shaped by Shepherd.

[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, so I think it's the fact that she leaves service. [SPEAKER_04]: She was obviously paying attention to everything else that was going on. [SPEAKER_04]: She was learning that there was more to service and the parts she originally saw, the parts that she signed up for. [SPEAKER_04]: And the fact that she couldn't go on, she could not be on the Normandy anymore.

[SPEAKER_04]: Okay, I am not going to get emotional on this one. [SPEAKER_04]: I did the first time and I'm not doing it again. [SPEAKER_04]: She has some trauma still that she's working through and I understand her choices. [SPEAKER_02]: Absolutely. [SPEAKER_02]: The desire for her to just stay there and help those people in the refugee camp is truly altruistic.

[SPEAKER_02]: So I find I take issue with the fact that it is a renegade choice to tell her to protect herself, to change her identification because that's crucial. [SPEAKER_02]: When Cerberus invades the Citadel, they go looking for her and they will kill her if she does not go in Cognito. [SPEAKER_02]: This is something that I learned about while researching for this week.

[SPEAKER_02]: I always go paragon, so I think like the one or two times she was alive in Mass Effect three for me. [SPEAKER_02]: I always just tell her to take care of the refugees instead because I think that that's paragon. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm like, yeah, that's altruistic. [SPEAKER_02]: Just take care of the refugees.

[SPEAKER_02]: You know, maybe that'll have some impact later where some of the refugees will become more assets. [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know. [SPEAKER_02]: And then after the coup, if you told her to change her name in appearance, you can find her again in that camp. [SPEAKER_02]: And she will tell you how the server's troopers rated.

[SPEAKER_02]: They lined up people and they asked for her by name. [SPEAKER_02]: They were ready to shoot, but they didn't recognize her. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, and that's when you can actually continue the romance or continue on with the friendship and she'll give you your fish back and all those things.

[SPEAKER_04]: You know, it's just, it's, it's very interesting that it does, it's a brand-engaged choice to do that, but I guess Renegade is a little bit more self-perseverance. [SPEAKER_04]: No, that's a wrong word. [SPEAKER_04]: But yes, preservation, thank you. [SPEAKER_04]: So, but I think Kelly needs to hear from Shepherd that it's okay for her to think about herself.

[SPEAKER_04]: because she spent her entire time on the Normandy thinking about the mental health of everyone else and she needs somebody to tell her it's okay to work on herself. [SPEAKER_02]: Well, check that out. [SPEAKER_02]: This psychologist needs help. [SPEAKER_02]: That's not a cliche at all. [SPEAKER_02]: Anyway, I found this interesting bit of cut content that puts Kelly's character in an entirely different light for me.

[SPEAKER_02]: Did you ever wonder how it was that Kelly and the elusive man met or why it seemed that she was so fond of him at least at the beginning in Mass Effect II? [SPEAKER_02]: So check this out. [SPEAKER_02]: This was either supposed to be dialogue or an email that you get from her in Mass Effect Three.

[SPEAKER_02]: She says, well, I've been questioning myself. [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know if I want to read the whole thing like that. [SPEAKER_02]: I owe Cerberus a great deal. [SPEAKER_02]: Was it right for me to leave them? [SPEAKER_02]: It's a long story. [SPEAKER_02]: Did you know I actually met the elusive man face-to-face once?

[SPEAKER_02]: Few have. [SPEAKER_02]: Okay. [SPEAKER_02]: Before Cerberus, I was a waitress and a luxury liner with a very exclusive clientele. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm not sure if the elusive man was there for business or pleasure. [SPEAKER_02]: I just kept his drinks coming, bourbon, three fingers, neat. [SPEAKER_02]: He had his pick of any working girl, but he took an interest in me.

[SPEAKER_02]: I suspect precisely because I wasn't for sale. [SPEAKER_02]: We spoke for hours. [SPEAKER_02]: It was obvious he wanted more than just good conversation. [SPEAKER_02]: And I can't say I didn't want the same. [SPEAKER_02]: He can be very seductive. [SPEAKER_02]: I knew if I slept with him, I'd lose all his respect.

[SPEAKER_02]: I didn't want that to happen. [SPEAKER_02]: I never saw him again after that night, at least not in person. [SPEAKER_02]: The management of the liner changed some time later. [SPEAKER_02]: Baterians took over. [SPEAKER_02]: Things got really bad. [SPEAKER_02]: Some of the staff were beaten, others just disappeared.

[SPEAKER_02]: None of us could leave. [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know exactly why, but one day Surper is boarded and cleaned the ship out, killed every Baterian. [SPEAKER_02]: but they took care of the entertainers, made sure we were all safe, set us up with lodging until we got on our feet. [SPEAKER_02]: I got a message from the elusive man.

[SPEAKER_02]: He'd pay for my college and if I did well, I'd have a job waiting for me. [SPEAKER_02]: So you see, I owe him my life in more ways than one. [SPEAKER_02]: Long story short, the elusive man got me out of a bad situation. [SPEAKER_02]: Give me an education and a job. [SPEAKER_02]: He gave me a future.

[SPEAKER_04]: Well done. [SPEAKER_02]: That's a horrible horrible Kelly impression. [SPEAKER_02]: And you can grant to everyone who's stuck it out and listened to that old thing. [SPEAKER_04]: Okay, thoughts and feels on the letter on this letter itself. [SPEAKER_04]: I I wish it was actually in game canon not deleted because they sort of brought a lot more.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know why this was cut. [SPEAKER_02]: It could have been an email, you know what I mean? [SPEAKER_02]: This could have been an email Kelly. [SPEAKER_04]: It could have, it could have for sure. [SPEAKER_04]: But maybe that would just make us, well, but if we're supposed to want to trust the elusive man in the beginning, you know, that, oh, it's three.

[SPEAKER_04]: Okay. [SPEAKER_02]: That's the part that I find interesting. [SPEAKER_02]: You think that maybe this would be pillow talk if you romance her, you know? [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, I could have been. [SPEAKER_02]: And I know it's got content, but I am just gonna head cannon that it is cannon. [SPEAKER_02]: Because if it was intended to be in the game and then it was cut maybe for budgetary reasons, maybe they couldn't secure the budget to get more lines out of that voice actor.

[SPEAKER_02]: I don't know. [SPEAKER_02]: But [SPEAKER_02]: Clearly, it was written with the intention of including it at some point and there's no supplementary explanation. [SPEAKER_02]: That kind of like goes in this void. [SPEAKER_02]: But it makes sense why do you lose some hand picture then? [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, because she wouldn't put out which that makes me very happy.

[SPEAKER_04]: Go Kelly, stick by your morals on that one. [SPEAKER_04]: Also, another trope of, oh my gosh, she won't give me what she wants. [SPEAKER_04]: I must be following and love with her. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, there's another trope to play into. [SPEAKER_02]: That's also a quite the cyberpunk type story, isn't it?

[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, I'm going to, okay, I'm going to uplift you pay for your college, pay for your education, pay for everything. [SPEAKER_04]: Right. [SPEAKER_04]: Because wow, some woman actually had the audacity to say no to me. [SPEAKER_04]: You are intriguing. [SPEAKER_04]: I'm going to follow the rest of your life and pay for everything because then maybe you'll say yes to me.

[SPEAKER_02]: That kind of person freaks me out. [SPEAKER_02]: Anyway, we have to go to bed break, but when we get back, Jen, I think you've got the steamy details about romance and Kelly. [SPEAKER_02]: All right, here we go. [SPEAKER_02]: We're going over the bed break. [SPEAKER_03]: We have beef, bacon, we have beer, the foods of my people.

[SPEAKER_00]: Young men have funny ideas of what a story are like. [SPEAKER_00]: I blame the extra net and computer games. [SPEAKER_05]: Rex, shepherd, grunt, shepherd, Rex. [SPEAKER_02]: All right, and here we are in the middle of the show, and we have a new review from minutes and tangent on Apple, who leaves five stars and says, my favorite lore cast on the Citadel finally managed to binge my way to the most recent episode.

[SPEAKER_02]: And I gotta say, this is the perfect podcast to deep dive the Mass Effect lore with. [SPEAKER_02]: As me thinking, it's time to replay the original trilogy again with an emphasis on paying a little closer attention [SPEAKER_02]: to some of the details of what's going on that I may not have noticed before.

[SPEAKER_02]: Well, Pinnoncint, thank you so much for that kind of review. [SPEAKER_02]: I think that that is exactly our goal. [SPEAKER_02]: With this lorecast is not to replace the games, but to just kind of add some supplementary details that make playthroughs a little bit more fun. [SPEAKER_02]: So thank you for listening.

[SPEAKER_02]: And we have a planet card. [SPEAKER_02]: I think, do we, Genesis? [SPEAKER_04]: We do. [SPEAKER_04]: I couldn't think of a planet card that fit for Kelly. [SPEAKER_04]: So I went with Katie, a planet that starts with the letter K, and it sounds like Katie, Katie, Kelly along the same lines.

[SPEAKER_04]: And the planet spelled K-A-D-D-I. [SPEAKER_04]: It is out in the Perseus veil in the tech cone system. [SPEAKER_04]: A Katie has low gravity for a planet of its size, which proved a significant boon to early quarry and explorers. [SPEAKER_04]: Even before the discovery of mass effect technology, it was easy to extract Katie's resources.

[SPEAKER_04]: When the quarrons first made contact with the Citadel species and gained access to Ezo, profits rose and the orbital stations became a beehive of activity. [SPEAKER_04]: Today, Katie's LaGrange brought points are littered with space junk, including pieces of geth orbital station that must have massed at least half a billion tons.

[SPEAKER_04]: Such a station could have generated impressive kinetic barriers, but these appear to have been insufficient against the Korean attacks. [SPEAKER_02]: Alright, give it up for Katie! [SPEAKER_02]: Alright, thank you, Genesis. [SPEAKER_02]: So that was the planet Katie. [SPEAKER_02]: And some more news, we are Twitch affiliates, everybody.

[SPEAKER_02]: So QV Candle laughter, which I don't have on my soundboard anymore. [SPEAKER_02]: I need to do it anyway. [SPEAKER_02]: Let's hear from Ariah. [SPEAKER_01]: Don't fuck with Ariah. [SPEAKER_02]: Thank you, Ariah. [SPEAKER_02]: So, that means that we are assuming direct control of your mind, and you will come hang out with us on Twitch.

[SPEAKER_02]: We also have some new patrons to thank Hannah L and Tim B, our tier five patrons, do get a shout out every week. [SPEAKER_02]: Thank you to Ed Boy, Kira C, Lieutenant to Sino, Reddrobot, Superfly, for Forty, unfortunate benefactor, and William. [SPEAKER_02]: All right, and with that, let's get back to the rest of the show.

[SPEAKER_06]: After time, a drift among open stars, a long tide of light, and through shows of dust, I will return to where I began. [SPEAKER_01]: Celery and reproduction, different, very little sex drive. [SPEAKER_01]: If intended to try human, would try you. [SPEAKER_01]: Ow, my Patrease. [SPEAKER_02]: Alright, Genesis, clue us in on this Kelly romance.

[SPEAKER_04]: So, ends of it, you have said that we save the plugging for the end. [SPEAKER_02]: But... I have said that, yeah, on this show. [SPEAKER_04]: But I'll just let you all know that if you want more details about the Kelly romance and analysis of her character through the lens of the romance specifically, check out episodes twenty-five and seventy-eight of the two girls' one-ship podcast.

[SPEAKER_04]: Twenty-five we did Mass Effect two, seventy-eight we were in Mass Effect three. [SPEAKER_04]: Um, we are on episode one, eighty. [SPEAKER_04]: Uh, so you've got to scroll back pretty far. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh my god. [SPEAKER_02]: I can't believe it's been that long. [SPEAKER_02]: Okay. [SPEAKER_02]: So for those of us who have not listened to those episodes, um, what is the deal with romance and Kelly versus not romance and Kelly?

[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, so like I said, there are three levels to status with Kelly. [SPEAKER_04]: There's professional, friendly, and flirty. [SPEAKER_04]: Professional is you have been shutting down all of her advances and you told her to stay professional only. [SPEAKER_04]: You will not get her fish food or her dinner date and she won't show up in Mass Effect Three.

[SPEAKER_04]: Now, friendly is talking with her as a friend, politely saying no, but being open with her and actually talking to her, not ignoring her just to go run to whoever you wanted to talk to. [SPEAKER_04]: And Flirty, where you not only get the dinner, but to extra interactions afterwards. [SPEAKER_04]: Now to unlock these romance scenes, you must talk to Kelly immediately after she returns from the collector base.

[SPEAKER_04]: And you ask her how she was doing. [SPEAKER_04]: And that's when you get her first PSPTSD moment, like that we talked about. [SPEAKER_04]: The other one happens in Mass Effect Three. [SPEAKER_04]: And after she tells you what it was like being on the base, you can use the inner comb in your cabin to call her up.

[SPEAKER_02]: Okay, that's literally a booty call. [SPEAKER_04]: Yes, yes it is. [SPEAKER_04]: And I did not give this romance a high rating because I did not like the way that it plays out at all because it does. [SPEAKER_04]: It feels like a literal booty call. [SPEAKER_02]: Why not just pick up a bell that you have in your desk and ring it.

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, Kelly. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, buzz buzz, Kelly to my chambers. [SPEAKER_04]: Kelly chambers to my chambers, please. [SPEAKER_04]: It feels like. [SPEAKER_02]: It's a mess of fact, we're a sitcom. [SPEAKER_02]: That would totally be shepherd announcing that over the PA. [SPEAKER_04]: And I mean, it does feel also a little bit weird when a Mass Effect three, when you have to call trainer to call your lover up to your room.

[SPEAKER_04]: I don't like that either. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, whatever. [SPEAKER_02]: Anyway, dance from me. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, that's what you ask. [SPEAKER_04]: You ask Kelly to come up to your room and then you tell her to dance for you. [SPEAKER_00]: Okay. [SPEAKER_04]: Now, hmm, yes. [SPEAKER_04]: Do I like seeing the woman that I've been flirting with in the chorus-dend stripper outfit?

[SPEAKER_04]: Yes. [SPEAKER_04]: Do I like the fact that this is the dance they pulled from Mass Effect II and put into Mass Effect III as the wall dancer in purgatory? [SPEAKER_04]: Yes. [SPEAKER_04]: Is there a video of me doing the Wild Dance karaoke? [SPEAKER_04]: Probably. [SPEAKER_04]: Is it headcan and worthy fantasy playing out that you will be able to touch this stripper when the song is over?

[SPEAKER_04]: Also probably yes. [SPEAKER_04]: But what I don't understand about this romance is that it is also the same body language from Shepard that we had from those strippers at Corizden. [SPEAKER_02]: Lean forward. [SPEAKER_02]: Tip. [SPEAKER_04]: It is. [SPEAKER_04]: It is elbows on these leaning forward or hands on thighs leaning back.

[SPEAKER_04]: I was expecting my Omni to hold up up so I could tiffer. [SPEAKER_04]: Okay. [SPEAKER_04]: So I dug into this seat more and I read more about it. [SPEAKER_02]: And tell me, does she want more than that tip? [SPEAKER_04]: I think she wants to hold on saying. [SPEAKER_04]: But we didn't get the whole damn thing because these scenes were added after all the voice acting was done.

[SPEAKER_04]: So there is nothing romantic or sexy that they are saying to each other. [SPEAKER_04]: It's just the music, something in the background. [SPEAKER_04]: And you're watching her do the wall dance. [SPEAKER_04]: Is it hypnotic? [SPEAKER_04]: And I've watched it on a five minute loop before.

[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, sue me, but you know what? [SPEAKER_04]: That's what it's there for. [SPEAKER_04]: It's eye candy, but it's not an actual romance. [SPEAKER_04]: I wish that the scene didn't end because you picked the option to stop, but I would have been happy if we saw her walking towards Shepherd after like fifteen seconds to show that this was her version of forplay, and it means that this dance was more than just transactional.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, so okay. [SPEAKER_02]: So there is a little bit of, there's a little bit of a fourth wall breaking explanation there and it came from her creator and narrative designer Dusty Everman. [SPEAKER_02]: I'm sure you read that as well that [SPEAKER_02]: This particular sequence in her romance was actually produced after the voice acting was all done.

[SPEAKER_02]: So they couldn't give it any voice acting. [SPEAKER_02]: And in fact, the scene almost never happened. [SPEAKER_02]: So the fact that we even got it, they said was because some very passionate cinematic designers stayed after hours to make it happen. [SPEAKER_02]: And like they literally worked for free to do that.

[SPEAKER_04]: the after hours for the after hours scenes. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, appreciate. [SPEAKER_04]: I do appreciate the fact that they put all of them in there because the second type interaction is the same that you get within your other romances, where you can sit holding each other on the couch.

[SPEAKER_04]: You can lay fully closed on top of the bed. [SPEAKER_04]: You know, those are the interactions that you get in Mass Effect to after the Omega Four Relay missions. [SPEAKER_04]: If you continue to play the game, you can call any of your romance options up to the cabin and have these interactions.

[SPEAKER_04]: Kelly just gets the added feature of the dance. [SPEAKER_02]: So imagine if you will there is a man who now in his thirties but was a teenager when he first started playing this game series and only learned recently while he was doing a podcast about this very series that Kelly ever wears a stripper outfit let alone that that is the romance culmination scene where as he previously thought it was the dinner.

[SPEAKER_02]: I was very shocked to see those YouTube videos. [SPEAKER_02]: I was like, wow, I think sixteen year old me really missed out, then anyway. [SPEAKER_04]: Oh, that's where the wall dance came from, and I'm happy for it. [SPEAKER_04]: But we can quickly go through what happens in her Mass Effect three romance because this is where I fully realize her level of maturity.

[SPEAKER_04]: Like we said earlier, Shepard finds her in the cargo bay with the refugees. [SPEAKER_04]: And if you ask her to come back with you, most of the clips that you find online are all about like how are you doing Kelly? [SPEAKER_04]: You should stay here. [SPEAKER_04]: What's going on? [SPEAKER_04]: And she tells you all of the nightmares she has been going through.

[SPEAKER_04]: in details, in full vivid pictures about why she can never step back onto the Normandy. [SPEAKER_04]: It is a full minute of dialogue beginning between her and Shepard and the way that she describes [SPEAKER_04]: lives through the first time I heard it, I cried. [SPEAKER_04]: So I know that we can't play it now, but if you want to know more, please go find it.

[SPEAKER_04]: A lot of her romance videos are the ones that will actually show it. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, so she has maturity that some of our other romance options haven't displayed. [SPEAKER_04]: If you are romanceing someone else in Mass Effect Three, [SPEAKER_04]: She holds no grudge. [SPEAKER_04]: She has no ill will.

[SPEAKER_04]: She encourages you to find new love because she knows that she cannot follow you on the path that you are on right now because she cannot get back on the ship. [SPEAKER_04]: Now you can of course continue the relationship with her and that will lead to another in my opinion, disappointing romance scene.

[SPEAKER_04]: The fact that she is one of the most overtly flirtatious out there people and then you get the disappointing no action love scenes is just [SPEAKER_04]: Oh, I feel so, I feel so off about it because you go into the storage container that she has both been living and working out of and have an open door wiki.

[SPEAKER_04]: I'm sorry, but no, at least let me close the door or better yet. [SPEAKER_04]: Let me go anywhere else but in the middle of a fricking refugee camp. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, what is this a barn? [SPEAKER_02]: Come on. [SPEAKER_04]: I don't know. [SPEAKER_04]: I don't know. [SPEAKER_04]: And I don't like it because I would romance Kelly.

[SPEAKER_04]: I would because of the conversations that we've had. [SPEAKER_04]: Look, I don't fully understand of those of you who choose Kelly as your main romance option, but I get it. [SPEAKER_04]: I see the potential that it had and the head cannons that you can add to make this a full romance. [SPEAKER_02]: This, she certainly has one of the more fleshed out character stories of any of the minor Normandy crew members, I think, which is so unbelievable because can you believe Kelly as a character was almost cut from the games entirely?

[SPEAKER_02]: like entirely. [SPEAKER_02]: Here's a little bit more from that narrative designer Dusty Everman. [SPEAKER_02]: He says, Mass Effect II was a very large scale project. [SPEAKER_02]: Every department was heavily tasked to get a polished product out the door. [SPEAKER_02]: And due to its nature, the Normandy came in a bit later than other levels.

[SPEAKER_02]: When it came time to flush out the Normandy's light characters and plots, the writers and cinematic designers were fully tasked. [SPEAKER_02]: There were discussions where Kelly, at least the part beyond you have email or such in such wants to speak with you. [SPEAKER_02]: Dr. Chakwis, engineer, Donnelly, and Daniels, and Mess Sergeant Gardner were all on the chopping block.

[SPEAKER_02]: And there were other characters that did get cut. [SPEAKER_02]: In the end, a level designer did the writing for those characters, not a writer. [SPEAKER_02]: And most of the cinematic design work for those characters was done after hours by passionate, Senate designers. [SPEAKER_02]: They were pretty much created after work hours as a labor of love by all involved.

[SPEAKER_04]: And that's why I can't complain about it too too much because I would rather have what we have than rather not have any of it at all. [SPEAKER_04]: But I'm also greedy ten years later to where I just want more because I want more. [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I don't know. [SPEAKER_02]: It's frankly amazing, like all of the things the team was able to like pull out and just like McGyver into Masswick II and Masswick III, both of them on such a tight schedule.

[SPEAKER_02]: And you look back at stories like Kelly's and you're like, whoa, hold on a second. [SPEAKER_02]: You're telling me that her writer was done by a level designer. [SPEAKER_02]: and that all of the cinematic work was done after hours for her, that is insane. [SPEAKER_02]: That this was like a passion project that technically didn't get paid for.

[SPEAKER_02]: Anyway, that's crazy to me. [SPEAKER_02]: And it's also crazy to me that Kelly's character was just almost cut entirely. [SPEAKER_02]: You know, along with Chuck Westonley, Daniels and Gardner. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, that's, that's a lot of people that I feel, I feel like Normandy would have been at more empty if they were all gone.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it would have felt empty. [SPEAKER_02]: It would have felt very empty. [SPEAKER_02]: In fact, I feel like it really added to the world building, having them there, that without them, I'm not sure that I would have felt immersed in mass effects, like hardly at all. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, because what, then it's only squadmates that you go talking to.

[SPEAKER_02]: Plus Joker, maybe. [SPEAKER_02]: yeah well well um this has been a heck of an episode on Kelly uh i think that's all we got for her if you like this episode you should go and have a romance play through for with Kelly uh go use a save editor and save yourself a little time if you can on pc [SPEAKER_02]: But that's all we got for this week.

[SPEAKER_02]: Next week we are having our patron chat where I can't wait to speak to our patrons. [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know what they're going to choose to talk about. [SPEAKER_02]: It's the going to be the end of July. [SPEAKER_02]: If you can believe it, we're almost an August. [SPEAKER_02]: So until then, Genesis, what do you got going on?

[SPEAKER_02]: How can people get ahold of it? [SPEAKER_04]: Oh, I've plugged the girls enough tonight. [SPEAKER_04]: So I will just say come and join me on the cyberpunk lorecast as well. [SPEAKER_02]: All right. [SPEAKER_02]: Well, I don't have anything to plug. [SPEAKER_02]: I am streaming when I can.

[SPEAKER_02]: I am managing as best as I can with a four month old child now. [SPEAKER_02]: But if people want to get a hold of me, you can add me on Steam, Xbox, any social media that I have, all of it's going to be at in seven the legend. [SPEAKER_02]: And if you do add me, just let me know, you know, hey, you know, I listen to the podcast.

[SPEAKER_02]: That way, I don't, I know that you're not just a bot. [SPEAKER_02]: Anyway, I will see you all next week's specters. [SPEAKER_02]: And until then, be compassionate people and empathetic because you never know what people are truly going through like Kelly. [SPEAKER_02]: And I possibly misjudged sure.

[SPEAKER_02]: Anyway, take care of specters, we should go. [SPEAKER_02]: Thanks for listening to the Mass Effect War text. [SPEAKER_02]: Reach out to us on Blue Sky, Twitter, Discord, Patreon, or email us at Mass EffectLortast at gmail.com. [SPEAKER_04]: Join us next week for more and more. [SPEAKER_04]: Same space, same time.

[SPEAKER_04]: Or check out our live streams at twitch.tv slash Mass Effect Forecast.

208: Kelly Chambers: Emotionally Intelligent?

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