229: We Changed One Thing About the Lore...

[SPEAKER_09]: I'm Commander Shepherd, and this is my favorite lorecast on the Citadel. [SPEAKER_14]: Welcome to the Mass Effect lorecast. [SPEAKER_14]: I'm in seven the legend. [SPEAKER_13]: And I'm Genesis. [SPEAKER_13]: Join us. [SPEAKER_14]: As we explore along tides of light. [SPEAKER_14]: And through sholes of dust.

[SPEAKER_14]: To see where this lore began. [SPEAKER_13]: And consider where it may go. [SPEAKER_14]: Specters, welcome to the final Mass Effect Lorcaz episode of 2025. [SPEAKER_14]: And joining me as always is my wonderful co-host Genesis. [SPEAKER_14]: Genesis, how has your year been? [SPEAKER_13]: How has my year been?

[SPEAKER_13]: Honestly, I have had worse years in the past. [SPEAKER_13]: And so 2025 had some really big ups for me. [SPEAKER_13]: So I'll take it. [SPEAKER_13]: It's been a good year. [SPEAKER_14]: I think I can, I can get behind that. [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, it's been, uh, while it's been the year that my son was born.

[SPEAKER_14]: So in that respect, it's been the best year of my life. [SPEAKER_14]: Uh, it's also been one of the hardest years of my life, not because of my son, but because of work. [SPEAKER_14]: Um, [SPEAKER_14]: But yeah, we don't need to get into that because joining us today are our patrons and this is the final patron chat of the year.

[SPEAKER_14]: So we've decided that we're going to talk about what if scenarios and what are favorite what if scenarios might be for changing tweaking something here or there. [SPEAKER_14]: anything about the series. [SPEAKER_14]: So we'll just go around the horn real quick in the order that I see it and our patrons can say hello.

[SPEAKER_14]: First up big bills, how's your year been? [SPEAKER_15]: Wild. [SPEAKER_15]: It's probably pretty accurate with calm and then the last sense of temper has been insane and it's quite a continue for a few more months. [SPEAKER_15]: It's great. [SPEAKER_14]: Yep. [SPEAKER_14]: I feel that. [SPEAKER_14]: There's a part of me that cannot wait until the holidays are over because of the chaos of that.

[SPEAKER_14]: Retrobot. [SPEAKER_14]: How has your year been? [SPEAKER_06]: It's been good. [SPEAKER_06]: I was in Texas and I'm not in Texas. [SPEAKER_14]: and that's something positive and joining us on the patron chat for the first time is day zero day. [SPEAKER_14]: How are you doing and how has your year been?

[SPEAKER_04]: I know it's been somehow the best year and probably in some senses the worst past year I think [SPEAKER_14]: We've got a Charles Dickens in here now. [SPEAKER_14]: Nice little Christmas car. [SPEAKER_14]: I was just thinking that. [SPEAKER_14]: Reference. [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, tell us his cities.

[SPEAKER_14]: All right. [SPEAKER_14]: And Magister, how are you doing? [SPEAKER_14]: How is your year been? [SPEAKER_10]: Bonjour, everyone, I'm all right. [SPEAKER_10]: Here has been not pretty mild for the most part. [SPEAKER_10]: Got back into theater again, so that's a pleasant thing. [SPEAKER_10]: What?

[SPEAKER_10]: So that's that? [SPEAKER_10]: Can't complain. [SPEAKER_14]: That's awesome, involved in any productions over the past holiday season. [SPEAKER_11]: Three of the Dickens got a little Christmas carol action last month. [SPEAKER_14]: Nice. [SPEAKER_14]: Were you playing a role on stage or helping an offstage?

[SPEAKER_02]: uh... i was one of the people that brought scourge toward the end when he's like who's body is this with my bed amazing incredible uh... in super fly for forty how are you doing and how is your year been uh... doing okay kind of had an up and down year both literally pickeredably but uh... he has been it's been one of those days for me is also just [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, I think we all can get behind that.

[SPEAKER_14]: But let's dive into today's topic about what we would change if anything. [SPEAKER_14]: about the lore so this can be like you know you want to add something you can take something out it's it's anything that you can can imagine about the lore and changing it what if blank were different now i'm gonna go clockwise in the order from my camera set up and so big bills will start with you if if you're ready to give your what if about mass [SPEAKER_15]: Um, I'm not ready because my currently little violent.

[SPEAKER_15]: So let's get me for now. [SPEAKER_15]: Come back with me. [SPEAKER_14]: He's not ready to order yet. [SPEAKER_14]: He'll take a look at the menu and we'll come back in about five minutes. [SPEAKER_14]: Yep. [SPEAKER_14]: All right. [SPEAKER_14]: I'll just open it up. [SPEAKER_14]: Is anyone dying to give us their what if?

[SPEAKER_14]: And you can just go ahead and jump in right away. [SPEAKER_14]: I can give you mine. [SPEAKER_14]: All right, Magister, what are you thinking about the Mass Effect lore? [SPEAKER_11]: What if the council had accepted the gas when they were built against the Corrients? [SPEAKER_14]: Ooh, like gave them full diplomatic privileges?

[SPEAKER_11]: Yes. [SPEAKER_11]: Either by the gas reaching out to the council [SPEAKER_11]: or by an opportune council member seeing the situation and taking steps to make a power play. [SPEAKER_14]: Oh, okay. [SPEAKER_14]: So in this scenario, would the GFB give in an embassy on the Citadel right away?

[SPEAKER_14]: Yes. [SPEAKER_11]: All right. [SPEAKER_11]: I'm just like my way right away, but it would move in that direction. [SPEAKER_14]: Okay, so, but by the time we start at Mass Effect 1, they would already have an embassy. [SPEAKER_14]: They would have been there. [SPEAKER_14]: Right. [SPEAKER_14]: Wow.

[SPEAKER_14]: So significant political power for the GIF, instead of, like, space org pariah status. [SPEAKER_14]: All right. [SPEAKER_14]: That's a really interesting concept. [SPEAKER_14]: I had never even considered this. [SPEAKER_14]: I want to open this up for discussion, Genesis first, I want to go over to you.

[SPEAKER_14]: What do you think in terms of, you know, GIF with political power? [SPEAKER_13]: I think that'd be very interesting for sure because there's such a tension, you know, we believe that right in the beginning of the first game that the Geth are the enemy, they're the whole cause of this. [SPEAKER_13]: Who knows if that really is a Geth drug not in the sky.

[SPEAKER_13]: And if we had [SPEAKER_13]: political liaison that we could go to and ask these questions. [SPEAKER_13]: Why are these get outside of the veil? [SPEAKER_13]: What are what were they doing on this planet? [SPEAKER_13]: And then we could learn about heritage death earlier. [SPEAKER_13]: We could learn about the reapers earlier and have not only [SPEAKER_13]: the humans stating that there are the reapers invading but having another council race, such as the geth backing that statement means that we could have started the crucible product a lot earlier.

[SPEAKER_14]: Maybe in a best case scenario, I think, because in a worst case one, the reapers would see a death ambassador as a particularly vulnerable unit to common deer or corrupt, right? [SPEAKER_14]: A particularly useful heretic to make it live. [SPEAKER_15]: Yeah, like what if that guess was already a hair like part of the heritage group.

[SPEAKER_15]: So like you're having a guess there could be it could be a a heretic or could be the other group. [SPEAKER_15]: It was a heretic group. [SPEAKER_15]: Mass Effect doesn't even happen as a game because then it's just wiped out immediately. [SPEAKER_14]: That's true because if we're assuming that the heretics are stillating Seren and Mass Effect 1 or even before Mass Effect 1, they don't really need to go through a lot of hoops to rectify the problems with the keepers that would keep sovereign and the reapers out.

[SPEAKER_14]: Right? [SPEAKER_14]: Or maybe like Genesis suggested incorporating the Geth much earlier into the galactic space would have provided some kind of an occupation to the problems that we see developing with Geth attacking colonies, attacking anyone who tries to enter the Perseus veil. [SPEAKER_14]: What do you guys think?

[SPEAKER_02]: Um, a little bit off, uh, not really answering your question, but kind of sprintboarding off of that. [SPEAKER_02]: What does that, what does that put the Koreans and all this, if they get their part of the galactic society or the Koreans still, the, um, the vagabonds or the outcasts that they retreated in, because they created it, but the gas are not part of the society, just, they're going to be included in everything as well.

[SPEAKER_14]: That's a good question. [SPEAKER_14]: Because if I was a Korean, I'd be pretty pissed, right? [SPEAKER_14]: Not only did 99% of my species get annihilated, but now the machines responsible are given more political power than us. [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, wow. [SPEAKER_14]: that's a good question.

[SPEAKER_14]: I would posit that maybe we would see some kind of fringe groups gain more political power in the fleet because they would already be more ostracized and at the hands of their creations that killed them. [SPEAKER_14]: basically. [SPEAKER_14]: So I would I would suggest that maybe we would see some extremist groups rise in popularity among the Koreans.

[SPEAKER_11]: Or the Koreans who clopted by the sovereign instead. [SPEAKER_14]: True. [SPEAKER_14]: The reapers could exploit that anger. [SPEAKER_02]: So are you suggesting that the Koreans are replacing the [SPEAKER_11]: Is that what you're kind of getting that register potentially that I mean that could be a triple triple down effect of The Because I can imagine them going sort of gorilla fighters in their anger They don't have a home planet they're out there traveling who knows they might find an abandoned reaper body and then Things go the how they go And they are techies so [SPEAKER_14]: Um, Retrobot or day, uh, what do you guys think about, you know, this whole idea that the GIF gain some kind of political legitimacy instead of the, uh, coriens later in the series or really ever.

[SPEAKER_04]: I think I'm going to go full conspiracy theorist on this. [SPEAKER_04]: Uh, it's definitely an inside job. [SPEAKER_04]: Okay. [SPEAKER_04]: I have a direct line of communication into the student don't know. [SPEAKER_14]: you're right. [SPEAKER_14]: That would be pretty pretty convenient for the reapers.

[SPEAKER_14]: I mean, talk about getting all of the intel they could possibly want. [SPEAKER_14]: So when you say inside job, do you mean that whoever it was that was on the council that pushed for GIF political legitimacy is probably also indoctrinated? [SPEAKER_04]: They don't have to be. [SPEAKER_04]: I can see a reality where they were like actually good face about this, but putting guests on the anonymacy, just to have them close by, but there's also a possibility of, yeah, they were also in on it.

[SPEAKER_04]: This is Reaper, Reaper tech lying out out there just out there in the open. [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, yeah, no kidding. [SPEAKER_14]: And the Citadel being centralized repository of galactic knowledge and pretty much the status of all sentient raises that would be extremely valuable for the reapers.

[SPEAKER_14]: Retrobot, what do you think? [SPEAKER_03]: I think it'd be interesting. [SPEAKER_03]: If you had a mission like early on in Mass Effect One, where you [SPEAKER_03]: You decide if you want to try to broker peace with the gap to get in the line of the alliance and then like serencing this entire time That he's got like someone on the inside So you're always like looking at the other ambassadors and it turns out you get to like one of those final confrontations He's like the gap have been on my side this entire time.

[SPEAKER_03]: So by you Broquin peace, which seems like it'd be the good decision the game. [SPEAKER_03]: You in fact end up getting the like [SPEAKER_03]: because you let all these people just all the get in. [SPEAKER_14]: Holy crap, that talk about subverting expectations. [SPEAKER_14]: That would, I think that would piss off a lot of people, you know, because they think that they're doing the paragon thing.

[SPEAKER_14]: They think that they're negotiating peace. [SPEAKER_14]: And then the narrative just says, well, you're wrong. [SPEAKER_14]: And fuck you, I think it was not the correct option in this path. [SPEAKER_14]: So, but let's toss it back over to Magistar and this, what if scenario, how do you envision this changing the events of Mass Effect 2 and 3?

[SPEAKER_11]: I think if it was a more of a good phase situation where the guests themselves weren't [SPEAKER_11]: like a mass specter where you go into the hub and everything like that there could be chances where they have a hub in Citadel space that has no um not been touched by any reaper or indoctrination or anything else.

[SPEAKER_11]: And so having a actual AI where in there's probably also also different AI's that are running around because the only reason why to console a lot of AI was because of the fact that what happened was the Koreans and the in the get so there could be other alternate versions of death or different races and species of AI running around and what's them being able to use their high computing power.

[SPEAKER_11]: we might, as someone else might have noticed, the Reaper invasion coming before it even got there. [SPEAKER_11]: I mean, I think that they AI can help significantly, [SPEAKER_11]: speed up time when it comes to tech and other factors as well. [SPEAKER_11]: So while Shepard is running around me like, hey, there's something going on here.

[SPEAKER_11]: There might have been a guess ambassador or a counselor who's on a council. [SPEAKER_11]: I mean, like, I'm noticing a pattern here, correlating it with the data that we have from our architects. [SPEAKER_11]: There's something going on here. [SPEAKER_11]: It could end up blowing up the whole situation before it even gets some aspect three.

[SPEAKER_11]: built-based building and working on countermeasures before we even get to that point. [SPEAKER_14]: That's really fascinating. [SPEAKER_14]: In terms of MassFick 3 specifically, in the Ranic arc that takes up a large part of the game, how do you imagine the whole struggle for regaining the Korean homeworld would go with the GFB more or less likely to invite them back to Ranic?

[SPEAKER_11]: And I feel like it depends on how the quarry and has been behaving in this whole time frame. [SPEAKER_11]: If there has been peace talks and reaching out to them. [SPEAKER_11]: Because I didn't say the quarry, the guests didn't really want to go to war with the quarries. [SPEAKER_11]: They kind of pushed their hand.

[SPEAKER_11]: So dealing with other organic species and seeing how things go, I could see them try to reach back out to their creators and ask, [SPEAKER_11]: And it would depend on how done, oh, and gunshot the Koreans would be and it took a lot of work and effort to make them be willing to work with the gas so they might just go.

[SPEAKER_14]: down was a ship to be sure so yeah maybe so well this is what a fascinating topic thanks for bringing this up Magister I want to jump over to whoever is ready to share there what if scenario next I want to make sure we can dive into each of these in pretty good depth any show of hands who'd like to okay retrobot what's your what if scenario for [SPEAKER_14]: never had Rolex syndrome like what he's what he even be on the Normandy would see him walking around the Normandy that's what but like what he's been able to save the curve from the collectors and like massive that too I see where you're saying yeah what would he have achieved the same things as a pilot without that handicap motivating him yeah

[SPEAKER_13]: know because it's like a physical handicapped can either hinder you or push you to strive to prove yourself and that's the way that Joker has handled it in this situation where he does have a disability that makes it so that way his body is not as physically capable as another standard soldier in the alliance.

[SPEAKER_13]: and he used that to hardening and specify his talents and abilities to one special thing. [SPEAKER_13]: I believe that, you know, if Joker wanted to be a pilot regardless of the situation, he still would have become a damn good pilot, but he probably wouldn't have gotten the moniker of Joker because [SPEAKER_13]: Is disability made it so that way he was so focused to prove himself and without having that, you know, without having so many people looking down upon him thinking that he'll never be able to achieve this thing, he wouldn't have had that same level of drive.

[SPEAKER_13]: It's the same thing that actually goes through. [SPEAKER_13]: where she feels that there's so much pressure of like, oh, your grandfather did this. [SPEAKER_13]: He did this major fuck up back in the day. [SPEAKER_13]: And now she has to prove herself by being the best of the best soldier that she possibly can be.

[SPEAKER_13]: The same thing goes through Joker. [SPEAKER_13]: And so I think that he'd still be a damn good pilot, but maybe on the same level of Steve Cortez, but not the Joker that we know. [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, he would just be Jeff. [SPEAKER_15]: Yeah, he would, he wouldn't find as much humor. [SPEAKER_15]: I think he used humor as coping.

[SPEAKER_15]: And I guess this is a spoiler. [SPEAKER_15]: I guess in the, in the, to quote, fall out season two episode two, he wouldn't have fucked a robot. [SPEAKER_14]: man. [SPEAKER_14]: All right. [SPEAKER_14]: Well, I wish I could have not heard that. [SPEAKER_14]: But for those of you listening ahead of time, he did give a spoiler warning.

[SPEAKER_14]: So yeah, he wouldn't be, well, he wouldn't be the same Joker that we know would he be the Normandy's pilot? [SPEAKER_14]: I feel like maybe not. [SPEAKER_14]: how else would that have changed his career and by extension not having Joker as the Normandy's pilot, how would it have changed the events of the original trilogy?

[SPEAKER_14]: A retrobop brought up like what he have been there to save the crew in Mass Effect 2 and save the ship. [SPEAKER_14]: I don't know if he would have been there, if he had been there, he certainly could have evaded the collector force a little easier. [SPEAKER_14]: But what do you guys think, you know, if Joker wasn't there, if Joker wasn't the pilot on the Normandy in Mass Effect 2, what would have happened?

[SPEAKER_14]: I think also in Mass Effect 1, oh, Shepard might have lived, that's true, because one of the reasons Shepard died was because Joker was being stubborn and refused to leave wanted to go down with the ship. [SPEAKER_14]: Okay, yeah, well, and you know, I think we can probably back up to even Mass Effect 1.

[SPEAKER_14]: There were so many maneuvers that Joker pulled that no other pilot could do, and it was alluded to in the series like the tight window that they had to drop the make-o out in low orbit, or not even low orbit, like low atmosphere. [SPEAKER_14]: they had to swing by underneath the radar, drop the make-o in on ILO's, and then take off.

[SPEAKER_14]: And that was like just one of a few maneuvers that they had to, that Joker had to pull to make sure that they could get the mission done. [SPEAKER_14]: And then that kind of thing happens repeatedly in Mass Effect 3. [SPEAKER_14]: So, [SPEAKER_14]: Maybe the normity would have just blown up or not or Shepard would not have been able to accomplish the objectives that they needed to accomplish multiple times throughout the series if Joker had not been the pilot.

[SPEAKER_14]: I don't know, what do you guys think? [SPEAKER_14]: Do you think that the alliance would have just found another capable pilot or is Joker truly irreplaceable? [SPEAKER_13]: What are you going to say? [SPEAKER_04]: That's an e is irreplaceable, but I do think they would have found an adequate pilot in it would not have gone as great.

[SPEAKER_04]: Especially for maneuvers equals in the creation distance during the suicide run. [SPEAKER_15]: That's where they would have worked and gotten the what was a mission on Mass Effect 2 where they [SPEAKER_15]: Oh, it was overlapped. [SPEAKER_15]: Yeah, overlapped. [SPEAKER_15]: They just would overlapped the ship.

[SPEAKER_14]: And yes, the SR2, maybe, maybe would E.B. [SPEAKER_14]: have ever been unshackled. [SPEAKER_14]: I don't think so. [SPEAKER_14]: So, wow, that could have had huge ramifications from aspect 3 as well. [SPEAKER_14]: All right, well, that's it. [SPEAKER_14]: Any other thoughts before we move on?

[SPEAKER_11]: I think the, [SPEAKER_11]: Normally, we probably would have blew up all the back of Lyara's rescue in Lyara because that maneuver getting her offer that getting all them off the exploding planet basically, that an average pilot probably would have choked on that moment. [SPEAKER_13]: Dr. Chakwa probably wouldn't still be our doctor because she stuck around because Joker needed help with his Rolex syndrome.

[SPEAKER_14]: No, that's what she says. [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, I think she's a really interesting part of it. [SPEAKER_14]: Um, it is, but yeah, all right, well, that's another fascinating, what if we're on the surface, people might think that that has somewhat trivial consequences, but it could change everything about the original trilogy.

[SPEAKER_14]: So thank you, uh, a red drop from that fantastic idea. [SPEAKER_14]: All right, who's next? [SPEAKER_14]: Who would like to give us their what if scenario, the lore of Mass Effect? [SPEAKER_04]: I can go. [SPEAKER_14]: All right, day, what are you thinking? [SPEAKER_04]: What if we are had lost the body of Shepherd to the collectors?

[SPEAKER_14]: Shit, I misplaced it. [SPEAKER_14]: Where did that body go? [SPEAKER_14]: No, that would be huge. [SPEAKER_14]: Oh my gosh, so do you think the collectors would have made like like shepherds into like an anti-shepherds where all of a sudden there is a new huge antagonist and it was your protagonist from the first game That would be a pretty sick boss fight.

[SPEAKER_04]: I think at least, but I think [SPEAKER_04]: Oh, a lot of people would be coming in that. [SPEAKER_14]: I feel like you would, even in that kind of boss fight, you would need to have it almost like. [SPEAKER_14]: uh... like an anime trope where the boss is so much more powerful then the protagonist uh... you know what i mean in the house killing now exactly like is like oh my god she didn't want you're in a g-t yes like you'll you'll never defeat me give it up in like you know there's like two or three uh... encounters with evil shepherd evil collector shepherd uh... before you finally beat him [SPEAKER_04]: He's got the collector armor, but it's like super badass and evil.

[SPEAKER_14]: Right. [SPEAKER_14]: He looks like a squishy. [SPEAKER_14]: Looks like a badass turned this time. [SPEAKER_15]: Well, I guess to go with that, what if I guess you could split it and have you were playing shepherd. [SPEAKER_15]: You were playing a re-aminated shepherd, and then it was another re-animated anti-shepard that you didn't know kind of like doom ancient gods.

[SPEAKER_15]: Well, you're fighting you at the end. [SPEAKER_15]: If clones are using clones, yeah, yeah, but once that's a big protagonist or an antagonist of the entire game, and you don't realize it until the very very end and you have to rather head off essentially. [SPEAKER_14]: How would, I mean, they could write it in for sure, but how would if we are a lost the body before giving it back to Cerberus, how would Cerberus have made the clone to begin with?

[SPEAKER_15]: A foot? [SPEAKER_15]: I don't know. [SPEAKER_04]: Face that, come on. [SPEAKER_04]: They shouldn't have ran down the skin, so. [SPEAKER_15]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_15]: We had like, she had a friend of foot, and they just used genetic memory. [SPEAKER_15]: I don't know. [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, she had a lock as Shepherd's hair from Mass Effect One, don't ask why.

[SPEAKER_12]: I mean, there was some DNA on that ship. [SPEAKER_15]: Oh, no, so had the hair and then when they mine melted, she could have saved those memories and pushed it over. [SPEAKER_15]: There you go. [SPEAKER_14]: OK, there's something somewhat plausible. [SPEAKER_14]: If Lyra had lost Shepard's body to the collectors in any way, [SPEAKER_14]: like an uncurable level of guilt that she would never get over after that.

[SPEAKER_14]: And I don't think that she would ever become the shadowbrober. [SPEAKER_13]: Okay, I could see that. [SPEAKER_13]: I could also see the entirety of Mass Effect 2 changing to then be a Lyra game where a lot of the same things still happen. [SPEAKER_13]: She's still trying to find Shepherd's body is assembling a team of her former Normandy squadmates.

[SPEAKER_13]: getting them all together and adding a few people that she has gained contact through silos and through the shadow broker because she was still in the search for Shepherd's body, still trying to find them. [SPEAKER_13]: And so would have gotten in contact with Cerberus, would have possibly gone the same route, you know, trying to get Shepherd's body back.

[SPEAKER_13]: or they could the elusive man could have made a deal with the collectors to get shepherd's body back because if both the collectors and the elusive man are working for the reapers then it could he could have made a case to say why shepherd's body was better with him rather than with the collectors.

[SPEAKER_14]: that's fascinating. [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_14]: Um, yeah, because they're kind of, they have the same boss ultimately, but the elucimen doesn't know it. [SPEAKER_14]: Not really. [SPEAKER_14]: Um, so, all right. [SPEAKER_14]: So that, that former one with Lyra, uh, being the main protagonist, then a Mass Effect 2, where the game then kind of focuses on, uh, getting Shepherd's body back.

[SPEAKER_14]: feels a little bit like Cortana and Master Chief a little bit doesn't it? [SPEAKER_14]: Like, yeah, I maybe that maybe that maybe they tried to stay away from kind of a lot of those halo tropes because around that time, 2007 to 2012, prime time halo days, right? [SPEAKER_12]: And so, very much so it's why I didn't say Master Victim when it first came out.

[SPEAKER_12]: I thought it was another halo game. [SPEAKER_14]: uh... okay so let's let's kind of run with that if if Lyra had lost shepherds body i think that is probably the most plausible scenario that Lyra then becomes a protagonist a massfic to and then do we still get branching possibilities at the end of massfic to like there's their possibility you fail and shepherds body just doesn't come back [SPEAKER_14]: anyone can chime in here by the way.

[SPEAKER_02]: Well, I mean, I was thinking what if instead of the R of being the protagonist, it's the Vermeer survivor, if Shepherd's gone, and then the Vermeer survivor becomes a specter in two, you play as a specter in two, you can recruit, like maybe one of the admissions is recruit, Lord of the R of the Pine Shepherd's body.

[SPEAKER_02]: as well as fight the collectors so that's where my mind was going to put this what if was what if it's a vermars fiber [SPEAKER_14]: Hmm, yeah, that could be really cool. [SPEAKER_14]: Kind of trying to save their mentor in a way, like Ashlee or Caden, that'd be really cool. [SPEAKER_14]: Also possible that I guess if you failed, Shepard could ultimately be reattained by Cerberus and then become Kiling, like the Kiling standin for the elusive man's top henchman.

[SPEAKER_14]: which that would be pretty tough to face shepherd, right? [SPEAKER_14]: When you're just trying to complete their original mission. [SPEAKER_13]: Oh, man, that would be very rough. [SPEAKER_13]: I don't know. [SPEAKER_13]: That would be a very hard fight emotionally to have to fight my own player's character.

[SPEAKER_10]: Have you seen some Mitch? [SPEAKER_10]: Go ahead, they go. [SPEAKER_15]: I was like, do we still get a stab in the state? [SPEAKER_15]: This is for the ain't you son of a bitch? [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, but it's like a little sad. [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, but there's tears in your eyes. [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_14]: It's that singular tier. [SPEAKER_14]: Exactly. [SPEAKER_14]: It's that gift of, I think it's, is it? [SPEAKER_14]: Who is it? [SPEAKER_14]: It was holding up the pistol and he's crying, right? [SPEAKER_14]: It's like the whisteless night. [SPEAKER_14]: He restlessly snives. [SPEAKER_14]: Okay, yeah.

[SPEAKER_14]: He's holding up the, he's holding up the revolver. [SPEAKER_14]: He's crying. [SPEAKER_14]: He's, don't make me shoot. [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, that, it would kind of feel like that. [SPEAKER_14]: Magister, what were you going to say? [SPEAKER_11]: Oh, let's say like I've seen so many fan art of like Lyra like holding up a gun crying and being like don't make me do this and shut in and it cuts the shepherd like indoctrinationized like did you imagine like whether it be Lyra or Remar's person or whatever else you get to the end of aspect too and then it's like almost like a dark soul ask red line comes up on a top and you see [SPEAKER_11]: or the whole boss right.

[SPEAKER_14]: Oh man, okay. [SPEAKER_14]: So as someone who really enjoyed Star Wars Jedi Fallen Order and then Survivor only to get to the end of Survivor, Spoiler Alert, [SPEAKER_14]: And then you have that final fight where you're cow and you can resist embracing the dark side, but you die and that's game over.

[SPEAKER_14]: And so it forces you to embrace the dark side. [SPEAKER_14]: Having that experience, I can tell you that I was not happy. [SPEAKER_14]: I was very unfulfilled like that. [SPEAKER_14]: So if I played [SPEAKER_14]: through Mass Effect 1, possibly Mass Effect 2, even without it, and my player character was like rail-rooted through the narrative to be forcibly indoctrinated right at the end of Mass Effect 3, I would have been so pissed.

[SPEAKER_14]: Like, people had such ownership over their own shepherd, you know what I mean? [SPEAKER_15]: Here you go, it's tragic and I think would have been great and horrible at the same time. [SPEAKER_15]: You had a romance of the Vermeer survivor. [SPEAKER_15]: You play as the Vermeer survivor and Amy too, trying to find Shepherd's body.

[SPEAKER_15]: Well, it's you don't find Shepherd's body, so Shepherd becomes the Kiling stand-in. [SPEAKER_15]: you have to kill Shepard, even though that's your romance partner, after you stab Shepard, Shepard then reverts to O-Crap, what have I done, but then it has a bomb inside of him, and the Vermirer survivor dies.

[SPEAKER_15]: Okay, with Shepard, and every player runs, and it's death, and then Lee, Lee, already comes from Fagnes, and you have to defeat the repers until you are of minus Shepard and the Vermirer survivor. [SPEAKER_14]: congrats. [SPEAKER_14]: I didn't think that we could get worse, but we got worse.

[SPEAKER_14]: So thanks. [SPEAKER_14]: That would that would be worse. [SPEAKER_14]: Superfly 440. [SPEAKER_14]: I'd see that you got something to say. [SPEAKER_02]: I was going to say big big ball strikes again. [SPEAKER_02]: No, I kind of like that idea of Shepherd's body's not recovered. [SPEAKER_02]: Do you [SPEAKER_02]: In the third one, he ends up coming back as the server is bad.

[SPEAKER_02]: That you have to fight kill towards the end of the game. [SPEAKER_02]: I think the kind of, kind of, [SPEAKER_02]: darkly poetic. [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, never meet your heroes, right? [SPEAKER_14]: Right. [SPEAKER_14]: So yeah. [SPEAKER_14]: All right. [SPEAKER_14]: Awesome. [SPEAKER_14]: Awesome idea day.

[SPEAKER_14]: That would really, really change the entire narrative arc of the trilogy. [SPEAKER_14]: But with that, I think we got to help over to the mid break. [SPEAKER_14]: And when we come back, I'd love to hear big bills and [SPEAKER_00]: We have beef, bacon, we have beer, the foods of my people.

[SPEAKER_14]: All right, here we are in the middle of the show. [SPEAKER_14]: This is the part where we read out your five star reviews. [SPEAKER_14]: If you've left them on Apple Podcasts, we also can read out your comments on the most recent episode of our Spotify series or our series on Spotify, rather.

[SPEAKER_14]: And I see that there are two new comments on our most recent episode on Spotify. [SPEAKER_14]: That's in a key accord or one, uh, Genesis, and there is a comment from someone named definitely not reddrobot. [SPEAKER_14]: And I don't know if I trust this, but it says 20 out of 10 best lore cast out there.

[SPEAKER_14]: The Patron Shats are definitely a must see, especially this guy Red T. Robot, or whatever his name is. [SPEAKER_14]: He has some hot takes that hit just right in his thesis, Cori, and Toes, and Battalion butts has a must read of the new year. [SPEAKER_13]: Oh, again, I love it. [SPEAKER_13]: I love it.

[SPEAKER_13]: Obviously retrobought you a huge fan out there. [SPEAKER_13]: A huge huge fan. [SPEAKER_13]: You should look into this not definitely not net retrobought guy. [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, I would also be careful because sometimes people online can be a bit creepy. [SPEAKER_14]: Anyway, um, there's also a brand new comment for hours ago from Oscar who says, oh, hey, that was my what if comment feeling cooler than ice right now.

[SPEAKER_14]: I would be so honored if you included in another what if episode. [SPEAKER_14]: PS Apologies and hindsight are an order from my name spelling. [SPEAKER_14]: It's just Oscar and English though I have to say that was the funniest way of pronouncing it wrong. [SPEAKER_14]: I have ever heard.

[SPEAKER_14]: All right. [SPEAKER_14]: Well, I am sorry Oscar. [SPEAKER_14]: Love you guys from Hungary. [SPEAKER_14]: Well, we love you right back and that's all the new comments that we have From Spotify for now, but as a reminder if you want to get your comments right out on the show You can comment on our most recent episode on Spotify or leave us a five star review on Apple podcasts now.

[SPEAKER_14]: We also have new patron [SPEAKER_14]: since last week to shout out and be here with us now, day. [SPEAKER_14]: Thank you for signing up and becoming our newest tier 5 patron, the shepherd tier, along with butts, butts, butts, red robot, superfly, full 40, Ed boy, here a seed, lieutenant to Sino and big bills.

[SPEAKER_14]: So, I think that about covers that, let's get back with the rest of the show. [SPEAKER_08]: After time, a drift among open stars, a long tides of light and through shows of dust, I will return to where I began. [SPEAKER_07]: Celery and reproduction different, very little sex drive. [SPEAKER_07]: If intended to try human, would try you.

[SPEAKER_07]: Ow, my bakeries. [SPEAKER_14]: Day, you said in the twitch chat here, you were supposed to end the dark side, not join it. [SPEAKER_14]: long. [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, that that would you're absolutely right that that that harkens Anakin pretty heavily. [SPEAKER_14]: And if you're talking by the way, day, we can't hear you because you are muted out there you go.

[SPEAKER_04]: Shout out technical difficulties. [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, that's just like it's either super serious. [SPEAKER_04]: or like super cheesy, you can't do it like halfway. [SPEAKER_04]: You have to either go so hard in the paint on this is a sad moment. [SPEAKER_04]: You have to feel sad here or isn't this ridiculous?

[SPEAKER_14]: Knowing what we know from some of the cinematic designers at least who worked on the original trilogy, if they wanted to go that form around of making it a sad moment, sticking the knife in and twisting it, they would have found a way. [SPEAKER_14]: Because, [SPEAKER_14]: Man, they were so amazing at their jobs.

[SPEAKER_14]: I think they would have found a way to make that not cheesy, but you're right. [SPEAKER_14]: I think the propensity for that to be really, really cheesy if I have the high ground shepherd would be pretty bad. [SPEAKER_14]: That said, we still got big bills and super fly. [SPEAKER_14]: One of your both of your, what is, but one of you want to rock paper scissors to see who goes first or is one of you more eager.

[SPEAKER_15]: All right. [SPEAKER_15]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_15]: I guess I'll go. [SPEAKER_14]: All right. [SPEAKER_14]: He's ready to order. [SPEAKER_14]: Will it be the super the salad sir. [SPEAKER_15]: Be the the blood. [SPEAKER_15]: Oh, sorry. [SPEAKER_15]: Um, so one one that I had to for go is Odina should be displayed.

[SPEAKER_15]: Put in half after mass effect one. [SPEAKER_15]: and the attack just because I don't like him, and he's a piece of shit. [SPEAKER_15]: But we're gonna ignore that one because that's too easy. [SPEAKER_15]: Ryan, I think all right. [SPEAKER_14]: Probably rephrase that Udena gets and pailed on a guess dragon tooth.

[SPEAKER_15]: Yeah, yeah, well, I would say crucify be better, but hey, we'll go with a dragon tooth. [SPEAKER_15]: No, uh, that the elusive man, they might want to, which could actually be real, but the elusive man funded the Andromeda initiative and planning core harbour. [SPEAKER_14]: Okay, long. [SPEAKER_14]: That would be a huge twist.

[SPEAKER_14]: It's something that, you know, a lot of people have talked about online for years. [SPEAKER_14]: Do you think then that that would probably like provide some kind of incentive to loop in the Andromeda story arc into the next Mass Effect game? [SPEAKER_15]: It would, I mean, I think they're, they're, they've hinted that they're planning on it.

[SPEAKER_15]: Um, like, I would just say that it would make sense because the amount of money that was needed. [SPEAKER_15]: They don't know where all the money came from. [SPEAKER_15]: It just showed up and there's a Harper, but I just would have liked it to have shown up in the end dramatist. [SPEAKER_15]: Like, one game we got, I would have like, horror, horror, horror, and turned, like, Euromancer, and then she's like, oh, by the way, ha ha ha step.

[SPEAKER_14]: Haha, I know you're another human, but fuck you anyway, yeah, you know what though, I would even if Korra was a serverist agent, even like I know that there's some serverist characters in and drama, right, but [SPEAKER_14]: isn't necessarily like evil just that the elusive man funded the indromeda initiative because it ultimately was a pretty good backup plan in case the reapers did annihilate everyone in everything that's why the core in arcs gone and that's why he could have planned to have the all the alien arcs be mmm you had to go find you know you had to go find the arcs [SPEAKER_14]: Okay, that's that's really fascinating.

[SPEAKER_14]: I want to open this one up to the rest of you, anyone can jump in with their thoughts about what if Cerberus and the Allusaman truly did fund the Andromeda initiative and the plan was to basically eliminate all of the alien arcs on their way or in the new system, leaving only humanity. [SPEAKER_13]: I think it's possible, like everybody is tried to figure out who the mysterious benefactor is other than the mysterious benefactor we've had on this show before, but it's it's really interesting to try and think about, you know, why would the elusive man and how would he have had so much money to be funding both major projects at the same time.

[SPEAKER_13]: you know, he is talked about how resources did get stretched thin while paying for the Lazarus project and during the same time frame that the Andromeda initiative was also sparking up and heading out. [SPEAKER_13]: So I don't know if service has that much money, but also [SPEAKER_13]: having Kora Harper there is something, whether they wanted it to be a major plot point that yes, that is, you know, a niece, a secret daughter, a, you know, for all we know, Timmy voice sister, her, his much younger sister.

[SPEAKER_13]: I mean, my youngest sister is 11 years younger than me, so age gaps are [SPEAKER_13]: So it's very interesting to think about how all of that could play out. [SPEAKER_13]: And it's just, I think that Kora Harper being there means something, but I don't know if the elusive man is the benefactor.

[SPEAKER_14]: If he was, I can totally see them writing in some kind of explanation that Alec Ryder has a deep history with the elusive man. [SPEAKER_14]: And that is why Alec was chosen as the Pathfinder for Humanity. [SPEAKER_14]: But that's also why a lot of plans didn't come to fruition because Alec died right away.

[SPEAKER_13]: And also, why Cora was second in command, why she was supposed to be the backup pathfinder. [SPEAKER_13]: Maybe Alec wasn't in on it, and that Cora was supposed to immediately take over, but unfortunately her plans got thwarted because Alec gave over the next pathfinder ship to the kid.

[SPEAKER_14]: I'd like to be proven wrong about some of my presumptions here. [SPEAKER_14]: What do you guys think the rest of you in terms of what we've been talking about with the elusive man being the benefactor, Alec Korra? [SPEAKER_02]: So I love where this discussion's going. [SPEAKER_02]: Alec, because I think a drama that gets way too much fly for what it is.

[SPEAKER_02]: But. [SPEAKER_02]: There's one big hole with this theory. [SPEAKER_02]: Why on earth would the elusive man, a very pro-human anti-alien person want to fund alien arcs? [SPEAKER_02]: Why would he do that in the first place? [SPEAKER_02]: That just isn't a huge waste of funds and resources that he could have spent otherwise on the humans.

[SPEAKER_14]: I see what you're saying. [SPEAKER_14]: It's like a long walk for a short drink of water. [SPEAKER_15]: You need a support. [SPEAKER_15]: Like if they found out that you were doing that, you'd have to assume that they would have espionade agents and spy agents and places. [SPEAKER_15]: They would find out about it.

[SPEAKER_15]: You'd have to assume that they would be pissed if you were doing that and not including them. [SPEAKER_15]: Like you [SPEAKER_15]: You couldn't just do it without the council getting involved. [SPEAKER_15]: And everyone else getting involved if you kept it human only. [SPEAKER_02]: When they though, since it's a privately funded initiative, like there is no one nation or group of people that is funding it's, it's a, like a, like a, like a benefit.

[SPEAKER_15]: It's an individual who would have the strong experience made sense. [SPEAKER_14]: I think I can see what big bills is getting at here. [SPEAKER_14]: Genesis, what are you thinking? [SPEAKER_13]: Well, okay, so I'm just going to take this stance here of being pro something, it doesn't mean that you're anti the other thing.

[SPEAKER_13]: You know, I am pro peanut butter. [SPEAKER_13]: It doesn't mean that I'm anti-nutella, okay? [SPEAKER_13]: So in the case of this, just because service is a prohumanity, humanity, first situation, corporation, company, whatever you want to call it, [SPEAKER_13]: It doesn't necessarily mean that they're always anti alien, anti alien species.

[SPEAKER_13]: So, and we see that the elusive man is willing to work with aliens because we have an entire Normandy SR2 crew full of aliens. [SPEAKER_13]: And that's not just for Shepherds benefit. [SPEAKER_13]: Oh, let me throw you a token turn in here because [SPEAKER_13]: you want to see him again, you know, I think that the elusive man is willing to work with aliens if it means that it will better and further his human agenda.

[SPEAKER_13]: And, you know, landing on that many planets, you need that many people, that many bodies, and however many alien species are willing to sign up for a potential death mission. [SPEAKER_13]: Okay, let's shuttle them out to the other side of the galaxy. [SPEAKER_11]: and to add on to that.

[SPEAKER_11]: Yes, at the end of the day, we use some man knows that. [SPEAKER_11]: those other alien races have resources and technology that can end up benefiting the Abramada initiative going forward. [SPEAKER_11]: I mean, the normity itself is the innovation of what happens when you incorporate multiple technologies and put them together.

[SPEAKER_11]: Shepherd's crew is a show of what can happen if you have multiple different races on the ship. [SPEAKER_11]: do what you need to do. [SPEAKER_11]: Now I could easily see him doing the sabotage or have agents set up to sabotage stuff after they get there because humanity first. [SPEAKER_11]: But I could definitely see him working with other races as a anonymous tip in order to get them over to there after bringing all he can use out of them and then leaving them in the dust at the end.

[SPEAKER_14]: Alright, well, Genesis, look like you had some choice words. [SPEAKER_13]: down this is really choice words more like okay the mysterious benefactor doesn't necessarily need to be one person maybe the elusive man was the benefactor for the human arc and there are other alien species who then supported and paid for their species arc so it would still very much fit into his linemen of i'm going to make sure that my [SPEAKER_13]: family member Kora is on the human arc and I'm going to pay for the best way that they can, but not necessarily paying support for the other arcs.

[SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, okay. [SPEAKER_14]: That's a fascinating idea too. [SPEAKER_14]: That it's not just singular, singular benefactor, but that the Lucie van is involved. [SPEAKER_14]: All right. [SPEAKER_14]: Well, we're running at a time so I do want to jump over to Superfly so we can talk about your what if scenario on Mass Effect lore.

[SPEAKER_02]: All right, so I didn't have a lot of time to think about it. [SPEAKER_02]: So I didn't really prepare anything that I feel is up to my standards. [SPEAKER_02]: But the one, what if that I could come up with that my generate at least some conversation would be what if we are a doesn't have the plot armor that she does and can die in M.E.1 or M.E.2 for that matter?

[SPEAKER_14]: Hmm, okay, so, and then we're talking about Mass Effect 2 or Mass Effect 3 without Lyara. [SPEAKER_14]: Uh, if she dies in Mass Effect 1, then clearly she can't become the Shadowbroker. [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, she dies back. [SPEAKER_02]: Once she can't recover Shepard's body. [SPEAKER_02]: Hmm, which then creates a whole cascading effect of who's there to save his body, who's there to save the galaxy that.

[SPEAKER_14]: thing Miranda might be a possible person at the elucimant task so that the elucimant I guess could also task Kylang with that. [SPEAKER_13]: Oh and that would make it so so interesting having Kylang save our body and then meeting him again in three as an adversary when he was once a friend who saved us that would be interesting and make him a more dynamic character.

[SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, yeah, friend of me's Friend of me's with my leg Stappard could become the shadow broker [SPEAKER_14]: There's an idea. [SPEAKER_14]: Shepherd says, if you'd a service and the alliance and just goes to work as their own version of Mr. House, that'd be interesting, that's like, okay, well, and that's an area.

[SPEAKER_14]: I don't know if I actually want Shepherd to have wielding the power of the Crucible and Mass Effect 3. [SPEAKER_02]: Well, with the crucible, even the discovered, if it's not Lyra as a shadow broker, because she's the protein expert and all that. [SPEAKER_02]: So shepherd have the expertise to be able to figure out what the crystal is and.

[SPEAKER_02]: how to disseminate that information. [SPEAKER_14]: I think the plans would have been found anyway because if I remember right off the top of my head, Hackett is actually the one who refers Lyara to Mars to trying to code some plans and data files that they had found. [SPEAKER_14]: So I think that the plans would have been found anyway.

[SPEAKER_14]: But maybe not in the same amount of time, maybe not to the same extent that Lyra was able to decode them and also not as effectively as Lyra could procure resources for the project afterward. [SPEAKER_13]: Right, because didn't Eva Corey also have that information. [SPEAKER_14]: Right, that it well, the robot, Eva Corey, not the real Eva who died much before that, but yes.

[SPEAKER_14]: Yes. [SPEAKER_11]: Also, depending on how soon the plot armor is taken, if she dies that when you rescue her, there's no one there to synthesize Sheppard's memories. [SPEAKER_11]: So, we might not have two and three, [SPEAKER_11]: get to the center though. [SPEAKER_14]: Okay. [SPEAKER_14]: All right.

[SPEAKER_14]: So let's, let's think about what if, okay, what if we are, did survive Mass Effect 1 does all the things between Mass Effect 1 and 2 that are in Mass Effect Redemption and then she dies during Mass Effect 2, perhaps trying to save shepherd or the crew of the Normandy from a collector hit.

[SPEAKER_13]: We lose the shadow broker resources. [SPEAKER_13]: We lose potentially a lot of the backing force of getting everybody aligned and combined. [SPEAKER_13]: Because that's what she used her resources to do was say, this group of scientists should be working on this. [SPEAKER_13]: I have, I know that these people would be good in this point.

[SPEAKER_13]: She played a lot of the logistics aspect of it of who should be doing what for the project. [SPEAKER_13]: So we would need somebody else who had that level of analytical mind that could put the right people in the right place to build this project. [SPEAKER_14]: Do you think Farron would have stepped in as as Shadowbroker because I cannot imagine that Farron would actually want that responsibility?

[SPEAKER_13]: Farron, remember Farron was just a mercenary? [SPEAKER_14]: right yeah um so i'm not sure that wetwork was fair and specialty not not sitting behind 18 screens um interesting way i i actually thought about david archer who might be a very good shadow broker yes all right he survives [SPEAKER_14]: True, if he survives, or Miranda, Miranda would also be an effective shadow broker, would she have then had to defect from Cerberus a little earlier?

[SPEAKER_13]: I think so, yeah. [SPEAKER_14]: And then what would have been the catalyst to that? [SPEAKER_15]: Finding a killing her father? [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, maybe she exact revenge a little earlier. [SPEAKER_14]: Maybe her father goes off the deep end a little earlier with Oriana. [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, well, that's a really fascinating idea as well.

[SPEAKER_14]: All right, I want to open this up for, you know, general thoughts on the topic. [SPEAKER_14]: Day, Redrabot, what do you guys think of? [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, so I had like crazy thoughts. [SPEAKER_03]: So like, if this goes down, [SPEAKER_03]: What I said was we could have a credential where we have three different shepherds.

[SPEAKER_03]: For the collectors get shepherds body. [SPEAKER_03]: So shepherds ends up becoming the human reaper in Mass Effect 2. [SPEAKER_03]: And that's why they're building an even reaper because they're trying to recreate someone who was like the only frets them. [SPEAKER_03]: Legion being the fanboy is they create a GIF AI version of Shepherd comes back.

[SPEAKER_03]: then service, having access to like DNA records, because if the alliance military is anything like the current modern US military, then his DNA is on file to basically identify his corpse. [SPEAKER_03]: So then they clone shepherd, then Kylang would be a clone of shepherd. [SPEAKER_03]: So you had to have the clone, you'd have a reaper shepherd, then you'd have the AI shepherd, [SPEAKER_14]: Man, can you imagine like AI Shepard is uploaded into the crucible and virtually kicks that start child's ass.

[SPEAKER_14]: just see hologram projection of shepherd beating the living crab out of the star child which they can more like yeah what's that one meme of like venom dunking on someone yeah i think that that would be cathartic honestly that we just wouldn't we could buy past all of that here's your ultimatum at the end of the massfic three but yeah having three separate [SPEAKER_14]: shepherds, where none of them are really the shepherd that we came to know, would we even feel as attached if after Mass Effect 1 is shepherds went into any of those rules?

[SPEAKER_13]: I don't think so. [SPEAKER_13]: I wouldn't be as attached. [SPEAKER_13]: I would feel more attachment to whoever the protagonist and enemy to is, you know, having, especially if they were a romance option, somebody who fell in love with shepherd is now having to fight against three separate versions of them, oh, that would just break my heart for the person I'm playing as I wouldn't be as connected to shepherd anymore.

[SPEAKER_14]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_14]: All right. [SPEAKER_14]: Any other final thoughts on this topic for anybody? [SPEAKER_14]: Okay. [SPEAKER_14]: Hearing no objection, Genesis, I think that you had one of what if that you wanted to talk about specifically with prior comments that you'd made on the Lordcast.

[SPEAKER_13]: No, okay, my secret shame, I guess, yes, I can talk about it. [SPEAKER_13]: I'm just, you know, it's my final comment for the year that I will say on it. [SPEAKER_13]: Back when I first joined into this lorecast as a Patreon, as a Patreon, I did not know how to do proper research. [SPEAKER_13]: I do not know how to look into actual lore websites and paying attention to which links I was clicking on.

[SPEAKER_13]: So my what if is what if that fanfic I found was actually canon and titsized does equal biotic ability. [SPEAKER_13]: So there we go. [SPEAKER_13]: I am fessing up to it. [SPEAKER_13]: This is my shame, the fact that I passed off on at least for different episodes of this lower cast throughout the years, that the Asari chest size had some direct correlation to her biotic ability.

[SPEAKER_13]: That is not a fact. [SPEAKER_13]: It is pure fanfiction and I apologize if that has affected you in any way shape or form. [SPEAKER_14]: Well, let's run with that for a second because if that were the case, and I think Jack would have a very sore back. [SPEAKER_13]: Well, it was according to a sorry only not.

[SPEAKER_15]: All right. [SPEAKER_15]: So do they have to be natural or can they be silicone? [SPEAKER_13]: You know, I don't know. [SPEAKER_14]: I would, I would probably say the former, but so Samara would probably need to loosen her outfit a little bit. [SPEAKER_14]: It's like a double-eighth. [SPEAKER_14]: Who are the most powerful biotics that we meet in the series?

[SPEAKER_14]: I mean, there's Samara. [SPEAKER_13]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_13]: Vanessa. [SPEAKER_13]: Oliara. [SPEAKER_13]: Because Lyra can weave, Samara can weave, and that's the qualifier is to be able to weave is one of the most powerful biotic abilities that you can do. [SPEAKER_13]: And so if you can achieve that, then you are considered one of the highest echelon that is, as far as I know, can and lower question myself all the fucking time now.

[SPEAKER_14]: So if you combine those two details, then by Mass Effect 3 after Caden recovers, [SPEAKER_14]: after Kane returns from the bridal attack, then we have Kaden's big naturals. [SPEAKER_13]: You know what, Kaden says it's a little bit of a bigger chest size, but again, this was a sorry-based only, not human.

[SPEAKER_14]: I don't know, I kind of like running with this with all species. [SPEAKER_14]: Okay fine. [SPEAKER_02]: What if in badic males is their testicles that grow with biotic cells? [SPEAKER_14]: There we go, they just drag on the ground. [SPEAKER_14]: Alright, how's that for the end of the year?

[SPEAKER_14]: Alright, well, I was thinking in more serious terms in that, and we don't really need to expand upon it, but just something that people can mall on their own time is what if Mass Effect had a red wedding moment, like Game of Thrones had? [SPEAKER_14]: where there, you thought that you knew where the arc was going and so many major characters died in one catastrophic scene.

[SPEAKER_14]: That blindsided the hell out of you. [SPEAKER_14]: Maybe probably either toward the end of Mass Effect One or like a third of the way through Mass Effect Two. [SPEAKER_12]: So like what if you completely failed the suicide mission and everybody dies? [SPEAKER_02]: That's what I was going to say.

[SPEAKER_15]: Well, every time I suggest Matt's murder, you guys just chastise me. [SPEAKER_14]: So I would say not not really the same. [SPEAKER_14]: What I was thinking with the suicide mission, because you kind of expect deaths. [SPEAKER_14]: Like everyone's talking it up the whole time suicide mission.

[SPEAKER_14]: You're expecting deaths, but with the red wedding, that no one expected that, right? [SPEAKER_14]: Like that was just kind of out of nowhere. [SPEAKER_14]: So, what if there was some innocuous scene where they think they're safe on the Normandy, maybe they're playing cards in the break room, and then all of a sudden dead killed?

[SPEAKER_11]: I mean, technically, at the beginning of Mass Effect, too, was that it was exactly a complete surprise of [SPEAKER_11]: I remember playing that game for the first time when it first came out. [SPEAKER_11]: And I was just like, y'all just killed Shepherd. [SPEAKER_11]: Like, what's the point of that?

[SPEAKER_11]: And then go to the moon and see all the people who have that memorial memorial while people who died. [SPEAKER_14]: Right. [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_14]: We feel very bad for Presley and every one of those other names that no one else knows. [SPEAKER_12]: So we still collect all their dog tags each and every time completionists.

[SPEAKER_14]: Yeah. [SPEAKER_14]: So basically, what if I guess what if that collector attack had actually killed more squadmates, more crewmates that we knew? [SPEAKER_14]: You know, what if it wasn't, what if Joker had died, what if, uh, engineer Adams had died, what if, um, Tally had died, what if, you know, well, I guess Tally wouldn't have been there, would she?

[SPEAKER_14]: Uh, what if, um, [SPEAKER_14]: Whoever the Vermeyer survivor was and our love interest in the Bayley Mass Effect 2 had died. [SPEAKER_15]: All that all the aliens die and pressly and Ashley lives sounds a great. [SPEAKER_14]: Oh my god. [SPEAKER_14]: All right. [SPEAKER_14]: Well, you can send your hate mail to bigbillsathotmail.com.

[SPEAKER_14]: I'm just kidding. [SPEAKER_14]: I don't think he has a hot mail. [SPEAKER_14]: But that pretty much wraps it up for this week and this year of the Mass Effect Lorcaest, we will be coming back. [SPEAKER_14]: in 2026, much to our haters, Shigrin, but Genesis, you got any final thoughts before we wrap up the year.

[SPEAKER_13]: You know, this was my first year of being full-time co-host of the Mass Effect Law Cast. [SPEAKER_13]: And I have had an absolutely amazing time. [SPEAKER_13]: I can, I'm going to continue on throughout 2026. [SPEAKER_13]: And I can't see, I can't wait to see where this show goes. [SPEAKER_13]: We've had some really great discussions finding out about lore that I had no idea even existed.

[SPEAKER_13]: doing character deep dios and really getting to know the characters that we already know and love. [SPEAKER_13]: But seeing even more layers that I didn't know was there. [SPEAKER_13]: And all of the laughter that you and I have shared over this year. [SPEAKER_13]: And then the laughter that we've had with our patrons every single month, because I don't think that a single episode has ever passed by where we don't laugh our asses off at least once.

[SPEAKER_13]: There's also been episodes that have pulled on our heartstrings and have really made me like had to sit there with my own emotions for a minute, especially when we were talking about, you know, like Gillian and the whole, the, the books and everything like that and I really cannot wait until we, [SPEAKER_13]: dive back into those things, the balancing the heavier topics that make Mass Effect rooted in our hearts because of the emotions that go with it right alongside, you know, maybe a deep dive into Blasto as a character, because the lightheartedness is also what makes [SPEAKER_13]: So thank you guys so much for accepting me as the co-host for the Mass Effect Lorca has, filling Tom Shoes has been a very big job and being, I'm one of the fans, I really am, I'm a fan of the listeners, I'm a fan of the show and I mean thank you guys for the support that you've shown this year.

[SPEAKER_14]: 9 out of 10 listeners accepts you as their co-host. [SPEAKER_14]: The last one is on my list. [SPEAKER_14]: That's a too parry reference. [SPEAKER_14]: But yeah, right on second to every thing you said, Genesis, you've been a wonderful co-host and I can't wait to take on more episodes in 2026 with you.

[SPEAKER_14]: Let's go around the horn here and just give our final thoughts for the year. [SPEAKER_14]: We'll start with [SPEAKER_14]: talk. [SPEAKER_15]: It's been a, it's been a fun year. [SPEAKER_15]: So it's been good all the driving that I've been done listening to podcasts. [SPEAKER_15]: You usually just catch up in one drive at a time.

[SPEAKER_15]: One seven hour drive, a catch up on like four five episodes. [SPEAKER_15]: Great. [SPEAKER_15]: But now you can reach out to me on the discord. [SPEAKER_15]: Big Bills 63. [SPEAKER_15]: More of a lurker from not on it all the time, but if you at least like mention me, I'll see it for sure.

[SPEAKER_14]: Cool beans day. [SPEAKER_14]: What do you got going on? [SPEAKER_14]: How can people get a hold in any final thoughts on the topics? [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, day on the discord day zero just about everywhere else mainly the loose guy Working on my own series of novels right now It's been on the back burner because of stuff that's been happening this year, but I'm hopefully get to that soon And this is a pretty good first episode.

[SPEAKER_04]: I'm happy to be here [SPEAKER_14]: awesome and we're so happy to have you here too and yeah I can't wait to check out some of those novels when you're done with them. [SPEAKER_14]: Magister, any final thoughts for the year and how can people get a hold of you? [SPEAKER_11]: Um, always a pleasure being with the Master of the Lordcasts, [SPEAKER_11]: glad to be able to be on here with everyone and you Sam and you Genesis, awesome community and awesome place to be.

[SPEAKER_11]: As far as anything going on, I plan to, I've been playing with the group when it comes to table talks for like nine plus years as a player. [SPEAKER_11]: And I'm thinking of finally taking the dive into GMing for a particular with a world of darkness vampire the masquerade so if anyone has any particular tips for so when starting off in that kind of How be your fashion please do feel free to let me know I am master to be in the discord.

[SPEAKER_14]: Awesome. [SPEAKER_14]: Well, Genesis might have some tips for you. [SPEAKER_14]: Genesis is a long background with D&D. [SPEAKER_14]: So, all right, red robot. [SPEAKER_14]: Any final thoughts for the year? [SPEAKER_14]: And how can people get a hold of you? [SPEAKER_03]: Uh, I'm red robot on this chord.

[SPEAKER_03]: Occasionally, I'll have a tism flare up and put something weird up there. [SPEAKER_03]: Either the biology, some weird biology facts or [SPEAKER_03]: just a whole analysis of the chain of command and rank system. [SPEAKER_03]: So if anyone wants to talk about that, I get really into some of those more fine details.

[SPEAKER_03]: But yeah, I'm just on the discord. [SPEAKER_14]: Well, that's why we're here at seeing analyze the minutia of this game series. [SPEAKER_14]: So we appreciate you. [SPEAKER_14]: Super fly. [SPEAKER_14]: What are your final thoughts for the year and how can people get a hold of you? [SPEAKER_02]: be grateful to have this show to listen to it on a weekly basis.

[SPEAKER_02]: Really glad I've been able to go on this nice little run out of joining, so I can't always do it to my job and the home life and stuff like that just kind of gets in the way things with kids and all, but I'm glad I've been able to join these last couple of times and [SPEAKER_02]: Uh, actually it's been a great time every time of this, but not to eat a much more eat.

[SPEAKER_02]: I tend to lurk on this court on the day and it'll super 544 so. [SPEAKER_14]: All right, and thank you again, because I know now with a kid how hectic schedules can become. [SPEAKER_14]: So if you got multiple, oh my gosh, so yeah, thank you so much for carving time out if you're scheduled to be here.

[SPEAKER_14]: And me, I am trying to stream when I can. [SPEAKER_14]: Streaming tainted grail fall of avalan. [SPEAKER_14]: I love that game, Genesis. [SPEAKER_14]: You just started that game recently. [SPEAKER_14]: You're enjoying it as well. [SPEAKER_14]: So yeah, I'm streaming that game. [SPEAKER_14]: We'll get back to streaming Sharon Shepherd when things I think settled down a little bit after the holidays.

[SPEAKER_14]: And you can find me on Twitch at in seven legend. [SPEAKER_14]: Otherwise, [SPEAKER_14]: I'll just be doing the show. [SPEAKER_14]: You can find me on the Discord any social media I have going to be at in seven legends. [SPEAKER_14]: And until next year, inspectors, we should go take care.

[SPEAKER_14]: Thanks for listening to the Mass Effect War text. [SPEAKER_14]: Reach out to us on Blue Sky, Twitter, Discord, Patreon, or email us at Mass EffectLorecast at gmail.com. [SPEAKER_13]: Join us next week for more lore, same space, same time. [SPEAKER_13]: Or check out our live streams at twitch.tv slash Mass Effect Warcast.

229: We Changed One Thing About the Lore...

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