Game of Crimes: Mafia Hitman or Serial Killer

Title: Game of Crimes: Mafia Hitman or Serial Killer
Original Publication Date: 9/20/2023
Transcript URL: share.descript.com/view/ryW2CowG6ow
Description: Join Mustache Chris and Steve are joined today by veteran police officer and crime fiction author Frank (frankzafiro.com) to play the game: Mafia Hitman or Serial Killer. You can play at home and see if you can beat us! Send us your score and thoughts on the fuzzy line between two different kinds of mass murders.
#TrueCrime #MafiaMysteries #SerialKillers #CrimePsychology #CriminalProfiling
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Begin Transcript:
[00:00:00] Welcome back to a really special episode of Organized Crime and Punishment. This episode, we are going to wrap up Season 1 of Organized Crime and Punishment, where we really talked a lot about the murder involved with the Mafia. And the way we're going to wrap it up is with a little... We're going to play the in show style of Serial Killer or Mafia Member.
So we're joined by our crew member, Frank Scalise. I believe this is, we've recorded other episodes with Frank, but this is the first time you're actually meeting Frank. It's kind of weird the way that lined up. But this is our first introduction to Frank, you're going to learn a lot more about Frank in future series.
We are also joined by none other than our very own Mustache Chris. And Mustache Chris is going to take the hosting duties today, and he is going to be our host in our game show [00:01:00] of Mafia Member or Serial Killer. Yeah, we, we'd been, we thought about coming, we came up with this idea and we thought it'd be a little bit fun and then, uh, we got in touch with Frank and figured, you know, this would be a good episode to have Frank come on for, and this is one of those tougher questions when it comes to the mob, but I suppose, but I suppose crime in general, like the difference between, say, a mafia hitman and a serial killer can become pretty blurry.
Like, Many mob hitmen, uh, have a much higher body count than most serial killers, like, um, you know, mob hitmen also, like, are notorious for, like, cutting up the bodies after the fact to help. You know, with the help, uh, have them not get caught, obviously, right? You know, throwing the body parts in dumps and stuff like that.
Uh, but, uh, the truth of the matter is, uh, many of the mob hitmen, they enjoyed killing people. And some of them... Some of them it comes across like they just kind of saw it as a [00:02:00] job like, uh, you know, if you look at the likes of, say, Harry Strauss or Roy DeMaio, we were looking at, you know, body counts that go high above even the Green River Killer, who I believe still in American history is, has the highest, uh, body count.
You know, the typical argument that I, uh, find is people say, like, well, serial killers enjoy, like, sadistically killing their victims, whereas mob hitmen tend to just get the job done as quickly as possible. And I think, for the most part, that generalization is, uh, Is correct, but there there's examples where it doesn't entirely fit.
What do you guys think? Well, uh, this is Frank here, uh, saying hello to your audience for the 1st time. We'll chat some more in future episodes. And, uh, but for this 1, I, I think I would say that the difference between a serial killer and a mob hitman. Is a matter of compulsion. I think that most [00:03:00] people that and let me back up a step.
I think you could clearly label a mob hit man as a serial killer by the letter of the definition. I mean, they meet the criteria, but I think in popular parlance when we say serial killer. We're not talking about a mob hit man, you know, and so the difference to me is that compulsion, a serial killer kills from a very deep place that they're compelled to do so for sadistic and psychological, uh, reasons that are pretty terrible.
Um, and while I guess some hit hit men might enjoy their work, I think it's a job 1st and a hobby 2nd and it's, it's not that way for serial killer at all. And I should mention, uh, even though we will more properly introduce Frank in future episodes, Frank's not just shooting from the hip here, Frank was a 20 year career police officer and a crime fiction writer, so he definitely [00:04:00] comes to this with some cred.
Although I was never a homicide investigator, so I might just be full of crap, but I have to, I have to agree with frank on this is that I think it comes from a different place. Like you said, there's probably mafia hit man and people in that who enjoy. Killing, but it's not there. The killing for enjoyment, I think, comes secondary to the business aspect.
I mean, there's I had never I haven't seen many studies of this, but there are people who were in the military who kind of blurred the line. And I think in any business where killing is a part of the, uh, Is basically a job requirement. You're going to draw in some people who might not be there for the best of intentions, but it still is the secondary aspect of it.
Yeah, I also think, like, if you look at some examples of serial killers, they tend [00:05:00] to, like, inflict, like, extreme sadistic pain on their victims, or do, you know, entirely weird things with the bodies afterwards, or, like you say, you look at somebody like Jeffrey Dahmer, and Dahmer, his whole M. O. was, I wanted to get the killing is over.
As quickly as possible. He didn't like that part of it, but he would make works of art with the bodies. He would, uh, you know, eat them, right? And from all, from all I've read about the mob, I haven't come across a hitman that did. Stuff like that. But then we consider, say, somebody like David Berkowitz is considered a serial killer.
And what did he do? He just simply just walked up to people in cars or on the streets and shot them. And that's, you know, that's all he did. Um, But as serial killer go, serial killers go, he's kind of a little bit of an oddball. I mean, not all serial killers, um, for sure, but a lot of them have a sexual component to, to their killing, even if they're not.
Doing those acts, there's a [00:06:00] psychosexual component there. Um, yeah, kind of melded with the whole power dynamic and everything else. And so, you know, I, I, I, I hear the expert on the mob stuff, but I don't know if there's too many mob guys that even if they're enjoying the power of being a killer and taking a life, I don't know that they're getting a sexual thrill or satisfaction out of it.
Not, not too many. Like there, there's, We just finished a series on Murder, Inc., and one of the guys was, uh, he enjoyed it. I mean, there's no way to sugarcoat it. He was a sexual predator, right? And he enjoyed it, uh, um, I'm trying to think of, um, oh, his name is escaping me right now, but Pauly from, um, the movie Goodfellas, the actual character, Paul Vario, he was, uh, I believe he was convicted of rape twice, um, so he, there was no component there, but it's not something that, uh, I've come across a ton of, but there are examples of, uh, um, there are a few examples of, of it.
So, uh, are [00:07:00] you gonna, are, would you be willing to say that it's more of the outlier than the, the rule? Yeah, I would say, like, generally, like, the, the, I would say the rule is, like, as Frank pointed out, serial killers kind of have a …