Drive10.8.26Batko: Brian Batko on Colts Clash

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Good evening, Steelers Nation. How we doing? Well, that's good. Us too. It is hour number two of The Drive here on this Thursday, and we are going to the phone lines to talk to a familiar voice, a familiar name, Brian Bacco. of course, of Steelers.com. And you can hear him on this audio network with our buddy, Ed Troop, of course, doing great work in a lot of different facets.

Mr.

Backo, thank you for taking the time. Let's jump right into it here with you. Doesn't sound like great news on the Michael Pittman Jr. foot injury front. Um, fair to expect this to be a longer absence. Is there maybe even any thought process that he could still be placed on IR?

Yeah, it sounded like that's what Mike McCarthy was getting at today. Um, before practice west when he starts saying multiple week injury and i don't think this is a mccarthy thing necessarily i think it's just translating any football coach at the college or uh or pro level it's like if a guy is uh maybe going to be ready to go there's a good chance he could miss a couple games if a guy is uh dealing with a potential multi-week injury uh feels like that could be like a month you know in coach speak so he mentioned that his roster status was being talked about they've got a lot of things to talk about right now between all members of the organization who deal with such roster machinations because you've got the uh the pitman injury

you know dowdle and dean you've got two new guys on the 53 you've got practice squad candidates to come up so uh there's probably still a lot of hay left to get in the barn before sunday at 11 32.

A.m so operating pitman's not gonna play Bernard is much more Pittman-like than Wilson is, but I think it's safe to say Wilson's ahead of Bernard on the depth chart. Do you think two receiver sets will be Metcalf and Wilson exclusively or almost exclusively?

I don't think so, Matt, because I think they've already shown kind of an inclination to rotate a decent amount and get some different packages and personnel groupings in there even when all four guys are healthy.

And then I'd say.

You can never really underestimate a portion of the game plan, including Ben Skoranek and his dirty work, too, especially if, and McCarthy mentioned this as sort of an under-the-radar, oh-by-the-way thing, they're accounting for weather, too.

On Sunday. Yeah, we even brought that up. It's supposed to be pretty bad, yeah. Yeah, it sounds like it's going to be a pretty rainy one.

And, I mean, these things can change because oftentimes if defensive guys can't find their footing, oh, whoops, now there's a 60-yard bomb downfield, even through the rain. But most of the time, I think conventional wisdom is, hey, it's going to be a muck and grind game, play between the tackles in the phone booth, as McCarthy likes to say.

So maybe it doesn't matter so much if you're going to have your full complement of pass catchers. But, yeah, I think– having these two tight ends playing the way they are right now, Pat Friermuth and Darnell Washington. I almost don't care who the de facto number two receiver is. As long as both those guys, 80 and 88 are.

Out there a lot.

Backo sticking with some of that weather stuff and the phone booth and the muck and grind and the old school football. I think we've all loved what we've seen from Jalen war in the last two weeks, but he has certainly, uh, you know, carried the vast load of, uh, of the, the, you know, backfield production and targets and, and, and share, uh, there at the right.

Literally he quite sure is wrapped up every week. Now there you go.

Um, and I think, listen, Matt and I have been screaming about this. Heck Matt's been yelling for five years that he's like one of the most underrated players and running backs in the NFL.

And he's been like their best offensive player since he's got here.

Their best offensive player for a long time. And I think we all want him to be the clear cut feature back. But with that being said, this seems like it would be a good week to get Rico Dowdle back in the mix too. Do you think he's on track to do so?

I don't know that I'd use the word on track.

I feel like as we sit here right now, um, maybe better to say there's a chance because you know it seems like he's moving okay in practice like the the warm-up stuff the individual drills that we get to see but you don't know how that's affecting somebody you know after practice if it's adrenaline I mean it could be something where you feel like okay I can go out and and do some basic running back fundamentals but is it a good use of a roster spot if I'm active on game day and you know you can't cut and and.

Move at your best.

I tend to think when a guy doesn't go on IR immediately, he's probably not going to miss four games. Otherwise, you kind of cost yourself a roster spot. So I'd say maybe one more that Dowdell misses, but I won't.

Rule him out returning in some capacity this week.

So Coach McCarthy said something along the lines of in his press conference that this extra long week is get the house in order, et cetera, et cetera. What do you think they're going to concentrate on?

Well, he said a very similar thing after the Patriots game, but nobody really took that and ran with it the same way. So that's just kind of maybe the vibe of the team or perception of the team and where they are after losing again in Cleveland on a Thursday night. But as far as where they're going to take that, I think that always DK is going to be a focal point.

McCarthy said that yesterday, too.

Now, you know, you've got Sauce Gardner on one side and Travarius Ward on the other side, but that's nothing new for Metcalf. I mean, he's been seeing Christian Gonzalez, DJ Turner, and then, you know, Denzel Ward in back-to-back-to-back weeks. So I think there's more on the plate, though, for DK. Try to build off what was working at the end of that Browns game, and I know that there were some one-on-one opportunities there that allowed them to hit on those throws and completions, but Maybe it speaks to just trying to scheme it up a little bit more, too, to get the ball in DK's hands. Because we're all kind of talking, myself included, are talking about the way he finished that game. But very early in that game,

they schemed one up for him. And, you know, he turned up field very quickly. And we haven't seen a ton of that from Metcalf yet this season.

I'd like to see more starting Sunday.

Brian, is this kind of, you know, everyone uses the term mini-bye, but, you know, these extra few days to rest. Yeah, it's always miserable, and we know the win percentages are minuscule when you have to go on the road on a Thursday, especially to a divisional foe. The other side of that, though, we know the Steelers have a later bye week this year. It's week nine. New coaching staff, a lot of new faces. Is this a good time for them? You know, when Mike McCarthy talks about cleaning house, did this kind of extra few days to prepare come at the right time for this team? I know we don't have quarter polls anymore in the NFL with the 17th game, but we're kind of at that quarter point in the season. You don't have to travel at all.

You're back home. a couple extra days to look at the offense, what's good, what's bad, the defense, what are we doing well, where do we need to improve? You kind of get that sense around the facility and around practice this week that it was a good time for them to have an extra couple of days to pause, evaluate, clean some things up, and get ready to attack the Colts on Sunday.

Yeah, I think so.

I think I feel that vibe, Wes, from an intangible standpoint. But even from a tangible standpoint, it's probably good to have this extra time because of the new faces that are cycling through here and how you might have to tweak and adjust the game plan because you're missing some guys who have been primary contributors for you over the first four games of the season. It's kind of better to integrate some new faces now than if you were on a three or four day turnaround like they were from Cincy to Cleveland granted, obviously things didn't go their way anyway, but yeah, I mean, I think this is a pretty solid time for it.

And, you know, you look at the Steeler schedule, zoom out.

You know, there there's some stuff that doesn't fall their way. You know, you're going to be getting arrested Tampa Bay team on the back end of this thing. And you've got to go from Paris to facing the Browns again, and that international turnaround, but you know, they get this mini buy and then they'll get the real buy and, Then you'll have the sort of mini-bye after Black Friday, too.

So it's kind of segmented somewhat.

Nicely for a chance to get your head above water and take a breather. But yeah, being in the locker room these last couple days, I think one of the good things is you're always trying to walk that line of you're ticked off about the loss and you want to correct things, but you can't dwell on it. You need to turn the page and move on. And I do feel like guys aren't really still stewing and simmering over what happened. I think it, things feel pretty light and guys seem pretty confident.

So a lot of talk today about the Dean injury, the Pittman injury is Rico going to play, but let's not forget that, you know, Derek Harmon's on IR. I mean, he's not coming back for at least four weeks. How do you think they allocate the resources that he provided?

Well, I talked to Gabriel Rubio today in the locker room and, You know, he doesn't want to spill any beans, of course, especially as a rookie. But it sure sounded like he's going to get that opportunity that he's been waiting for.

You know, he's inactive.

Seems like the logical game.

Right, right.

Yeah, he brings more to the table in run defense than probably Kevin Jobity Jr. And whether it's Jonathan Taylor or the weather or both, you know, I think this is going to be a game that you need that run defense.

To be right.

So, you know, Rubio was telling me, you know, he sits right next to Cam Hayward in the locker room.

That's been invaluable. I mean, they are literally right.

He's like, we're knee to knee sometimes when we're both at our locker. And that's two pretty large bodies that result in that alignment. And maybe those two bodies will be lining up. next to each other at times because Rubio's built somewhat like Harmon in a way, maybe even a little bit thicker.

Now he doesn't necessarily have the quick feet.

But they brought him in here because of that wide body and how he can help against the run. And it seems like a long time ago now, but he sure did flash at times in training camp and in those preseason games.

Staying with that, Brian, you know, we know that historically there's been some great matchups for Cam Hayward and for Colts, Studgard, Quinton Nelson. Cam's just been able to win the vast majority of those. I think it's been a real issue for Indianapolis. Matt and I were kind of talking about that early in the week. There's always those interesting quirks in sports where just one guy has another guy's number, whether it's a style of play or whatever the case may be. When you consider the absence of Derek Harmon, when you consider a couple absences and injuries in the secondary and Steelers linebacker play that has been up and down this season, how important do you think it is for cam Hayward to, um, you know, to win that

battle on the interior of the defensive line again on Sunday?

That's a five-star matchup of two probably future Hall of Famers going at it. And yes, it's one of the great feathers in Cam's cap probably that so often over the years in this one-on-one, he's gotten more wins than losses. But the other one too is, you know, you talk about a team having a guy's number and this isn't, we're not talking about John Elway or Joe Montana here, but the Steelers have had Daniel Jones's number. You know, I know that he's had some success against the teams and he's gone through stretches where he plays pretty good football.

Not so much this year so far, but even when he was going through those stretches, such as last year, the Steelers just always seemed to get home against him.

I don't know if Danny Dimes doesn't.

Like the black and gold or white and gold, depending on where the game is being played. But even when he was with the Giants, you know, Cam Hayward picked him off.

I believe he is one of two.

Career interceptions for Clamps Hayward. That was that 2020 week one COVID year season opener up there at MetLife Stadium. So, you know, I bring it all back around to say Cam getting some quick wins against Nelson, getting more interior pressure than they generated against the Browns. I love that recipe against Daniel Jones, even if it's flushing him out and letting TJ Water, Alex Highsmith do the rest.

Hopefully I'm wrong, but it seems as though Jamil Dean's real unlikely to play in this game. Obviously Porter's out of the equation. Does that mean Everett and Samuel are your starting outside corners?

Yeah, I think so.

I think Everett officially had baptism by fire time with Everett. But, you know, Brandon Echols, like, he's been a forgotten man so far this year.

Yeah, but he's capable.

And he was one of the first guys, if you go back to, like, I can't remember if it was OTAs or maybe even earlier than that. I know it was on the south side, so it was before training camp. Patrick Graham was asked about someone who's like really stood out to him or opened his eyes or surprised him or whatever the phrasing was. And he went right to Brandon Echols as someone who, let's be honest, he probably wasn't super on Graham's radar. You know, he was a journeyman for a few years, a workman like back up there for a few years with the Jets. And then he came over here and made some plays. But I wonder when he's going to get more in the mix.

It might be that time by necessity. But you've got Ramsey at that nickel position, too. And we know they want to have him on the field.

Yeah, just to kind of piggyback off that, I think Echols gets forgotten a little bit because I'm not saying he's Rod Woodson or Mel Blunt, but that is a resource they haven't had to tap into a heck of a lot. They also did pick up two corners off other teams' practice squads. Could they get in the mix too?

I mean, there's a little more options here than just it's Samuel and Everett, you know?

Yeah, McCarthy was asked about Sean Murphy bunting and Terrell Smith And he kind of just lumped them both together and said at that point it had been one day of practice. So I imagine behind closed doors, the coaches are working with those guys in various spots to try to evaluate, all right, who has a better chance maybe of helping us Sunday if he gets pressed into duty.

I'll say this much, though, and Ed Troop and I are going to talk about this more tomorrow on the Steelers report, two to four. this reminds me of not just last year against the Colts. When, if you remember Kyle Duggar came in, you know, fresh off the trade from new England started at safety, Jalen Ramsey moved to safety.

You wouldn't have known it the.

Way they played, but if you go back to 2022, you remember that game against Tom Brady and the bucks where they were running out guys, whose names we, we didn't know at the time and never will remember again. And somehow they found a way to cobble together a win. It's a whole new coaching staff and a lot of new faces, but, The Steelers have some history.

With, wait, who's in the secondary? Oh, and they still go out and get it done.

And these are professional football players that have changed teams before and maybe have gone up against, you know, Josh Downs in their career or whatever.

For sure.

Yeah, you can never underestimate the guys who've made it to this level. And, I mean, more specifically, Murphy, Bunting, and Smith, they're not like a couple random undrafted– you know, scrappers who've pulled themselves up by their bootstraps. I mean, they were, I think like mid round picks basically.

Right.

So there's some pedigree there in addition to the experience.

Brian back. Oh, before we let you go, one of the things Matt and I talked about earlier in the week was the 25th anniversary of now Accresure stadium, originally Heinz field. and what opened with a 16-7 victory over the Bengals. I know you've got a pretty cool perspective. This is something we talked to you about, actually, when you officially joined the team back over the summer, and you wrote a really cool article for Steelers.com about growing up the game, Section 509, going with your family, going with your grandparents. I know you were young, and it was a long time ago. Heck, we would have only been, what, 10 years old, I think, when Hines Field, when Accresure Stadium opened. What do you remember about going there for

the first time, that first game, against the bangles the kind of opening of that new football fortress as you call it on the north.

Shore yeah and i think jim wexell talked about this in his piece too i mean just the views were uh not what we were used to from three river stadium you know you were liable to those.

Multi those multi-purpose stadiums with baseball dirt still on the field.

Well not like i'm just talking about even in the seats liable to look to your left or your right and there's a you know, an old man in a tassel cap chanting defense, but he's pressed against a pole or something. So, and hopefully you can see past the pole with the balls over at the goal line. But yeah, I mean, that was my every Sunday ritual for the most part, section 509 row N to be exact, I think seats 15 and 16. So saw a lot of great performances over the years. And a lot of them just carried over from that first game where Jerome Bettis joined the 10,000 yard club and Hines Ward went off.

I mean, those were the two pillars of the Steelers offense when that stadium first opened. And it almost doesn't even really matter who the first pillars were on the Steelers defense because it has just simply been passed down from era to era, generation to generation. I mean, there aren't many degrees of separation between, you know, the 1970s Hall of Famers who played at Three Rivers, and Cam Hayward, who's still on the team today. So, yeah, really cool to get a chance to write that about 25 years at the place where they used to have ketchup bottles pouring into the scoreboard in.

The red zone. I guess they still do. It's just a little bit different.

Yeah, it's outside of Gate C now, I believe it is, right? Right across there from the T on the North Shore. Brian Bacco, make sure you're checking out all his work, all his coverage, Steelers.com, and listening to him and Ed Troop, the Steelers report from 2 to 4, on the Steelers audio network. Great stuff as always, buddy. Thanks for taking the time and we will see you on Sunday.

Thank you boys.

Later. There he goes. Brian back. Oh, one of our own. He's one of our own. Brian back. Oh, he's one of our own. That's like a chant that they do in English, English soccer.

Okay.

If you, um, well, I was about to say, Joe, Christian Koontz. All right.

I think I heard that on Ted Lasso now I think about it.

Like if it was the same type of, you know, they have that chanting atmosphere when they sing songs and all that. You'd be like, he's one of our own. He's one of our own. Christian Koontz, he's one of our own because he grew up here.

Because he grew up here.

Okay.

Brian Bacco, he's one of our own. He grew up here and he has now obviously been part of the team for a few months now and doing great work on the dot com and on the radio side. of things more Steelers more Colts when we come back we've got a hit on a bunch of questions comments and concerns and reactions that we've been trying to get to this week with a little extra time in the long week plenty of ground to cover as we roll along here in our number two Euler and Williamson it's the drive Steelers Nation Radio on the Steelers Audio Network.

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Louis, Missouri.

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And after what went down in the.

First round, still getting video calls from my best friend, rubbing it in that he called all the picks.

I told you they were building their own line.

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Matt, I referenced on the show, I actually think I just did with Brian Bacco, how you can't really break the NFL up into quarter polls anymore because there's 17 games.

It's pretty close.

But it's big. We're basically at the quarter poll. This week or next week, however you want to do it.

I think coaches still view it that way.

I think so too. And then you kind of get the bonus 17th game at the end. With that, I thought we should just kick around some kind of way too early quarter season NFL awards candidates and who's in line to potentially get themselves some individual hardware. Let's start with the rookies of the year. Defensive rookie of the year.

Arvel Reese?

A name that... people need to be aware of defensively is, uh, the, the linebacker from Miami.

Jacob Rodriguez, Texas tech mustache guy.

Yeah.

I mean, they're on the field a ton and tackles can be a real gray stat. I mean, give him another tackle, give him another tackle, but that guy makes like every tackle on a bad day. I mean, I think he's in the mix for sure. I think Reese is definitely in the mix. He's very impressive.

Um, The other one I see listed a lot is Masses, the corner from the Raiders.

He's got a couple picks already. Yeah, he's kind of a mid-round pick that wasn't a claim. Yeah, and wasn't a super well-known prospect coming out. But he's getting his hands on the football, and it's just kind of more proof that that's a really well-oiled machine in Vegas now where it wasn't before. That's a good one.

It really is. I think those are probably the three big ones. Jacob Rodriguez though. You're right, man. He just, he was so much fun to watch in college at Texas tech. I remember talking a lot about that. He had that one game in Morgantown where he like had an interception, a forced fumble, a sack scored, a touchdown or scored a two point conversion for the offense. Like, and he threw an interception.

Wow.

They were really trying to get him to the highs. It was the end of the season last year. And they were really trying to get him to New York.

Yeah.

And so they brought him in on offense for a couple of plays and, And he caught a two-point conversion at one point in that game. But then they tried to do it again, and he threw an interception.

That's crazy.

He was all over the place in college.

It's like Lemieux scoring a goal five different ways or whatever.

Exactly right.

We missed that earlier in the week, by the way. Happy birthday. Happy birthday to Mario Lemieux. Shame on us for six weeks. Swiss on Swiss there. He's not quite 66, but I think he's getting close.

Probably pretty close, yeah.

Offensive Rookie of the Year, Matt. I think Denzel Boston has to be in this conversation at this point.

I think he edges out Concepcion there. Boston's coming on strong.

The longer we go, obviously without seeing Ty Simpson, but also Fernando Mendoza.

No rookie quarterbacks playing at all. Aller and Beck were the next guys.

Makes it a lot more fun, I think, for this type of conversation when you don't have a proverbial rookie quarterback that quite often wins this award.

Jeremiah Love was the leader in the clubhouse, but he's not out of the mix, but he may not even play this week, and he's in and out of the lineup. Price is the other first-round running back. He's on IR. Who are we missing here? I mean, it's definitely not.

Denzel Boston.

Yeah.

I think Kenyon Sadiq might be working his way.

Into the conversation.

Coming in strong.

Tate's starting to give a little bit of steam.

Tate, a little bit of steam.

Yeah.

And what about the Benson, the tackle from the Chiefs I see on a lot of these lists, too? Oh, wow.

I mean, he's at least playing a lot. It's not a very good rookie class. We said this in our draft coverage. Oh, I heard a crazy stat on the way home yesterday. I almost texted you guys. Jeremiah Smith. Remember you said how Jeremiah Smith is like out producing.

Like a lot of the top 20 offenses in college football. Yes.

His numbers right now are almost identical to Tate's last season. who was the fifth pick in the draft. He had a really good year.

That's nuts.

It's almost identical.

They're five games into the 12-game regular season.

Yes.

I think you and I would be shocked if Ohio State didn't play 14 or 15 games because they're probably going to play for a Big Ten championship and then into the playoff.

He's produced like what Tate did in his last season at Ohio State before going really early in the draft.

It's wild.

Offensive Rookie of the Year, though, is not a great spot. No one's like, whoa, that's really impressive.

Denzel Boston might be the leader in the clubhouse. And don't get me wrong, he's had a good start to his season, but it's not like, holy cow, look at this guy.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

It's not like when Randy Moss showed up or whatever.

Right.

Not when Megatron or Larry Fitzgerald was a rookie out there. Coach of the year, Matt? I mean, it's got to be Clint Kubiak at this point, right? There's a lot of deserving candidates, but we know how this works. It's who can exceed expectations. Like, I think Kyle Shanahan should probably be mentioned. Ben Johnson should definitely be mentioned.

I would say the Bears are doing stuff with backup quarterbacks. That always checks a few boxes. But I've got to think.

It's the Raiders. If the Raiders win nine games.

They had the first pick in the draft last year.

If they go from first pick in the draft to a winning record, I think it would be hard to deny Kubiak.

Yeah, I think he has to be the leader.

But Ben Johnson definitely deserves a shout.

I mean.

Which Shanahan does, too. I feel like he's in that point now where people just expect it.

And that's a problem for him in terms of getting votes.

It's been impressive. What he's done.

I think who else?

Browns?

Browns, yeah.

I think a winning record.

Kevin O'Connell, Minnesota.

Yeah, I mean, they're 4-0, right?

4-0.

Right, it's pretty good.

It is pretty good.

I got to say Raiders, then Bears, though.

Raiders, then Bears. I think right now I would also say Kubiak and Ben Johnson are the top two.

I know I'm jumping ahead, but I think Purdy's first in terms of odds for MVP right now. Okay. Which is kind of a reflection on Shanahan and what the Niners are doing, you know.

I think we all saw Brock Purdy being an MVP candidate when he was Mr. Irrelevant a few years ago.

He drafted the MVP at the last pick in the draft.

Matt, comeback player of the year, which I normally think is not much fun to discuss. The parameters around it are so wild. But there's actually some fun candidates this year. Patrick Mahomes, Kittle. Fred Warner.

Yeah.

And I think all those guys are true. Come back in the sense.

Of overcame a big injury.

Yeah.

Not you stunk up the joint and then you got really good. Not that you had some like DeMar Hamlin, life threatening, scary stuff happened to you on a football field.

Not to make light of it, but that shouldn't have won you.

And I actually don't think he did that year now that I'm recalling it, but I think he maybe came second in the voting.

He came second to Flacco who came like off the couch and saved the season.

Yes.

And so it's always been hard to pin this down of what exactly is an injury related. Is it coming off the couch? Is it a health scare? Is it, you know, the Alex Smith leg stuff?

Yeah.

I think, I think there's some real actual, just kind of deserving candidates in the sense of guys who are bouncing back from injuries last year. If the chiefs continue to do what they're doing, it's going to be, it's going to be moms.

And, It wouldn't break my heart if that award went away. Yeah.

Does, like, hockey have one? I don't think so.

I don't think so. I don't know if the other.

Leagues have it. I don't think they do now that you mention it. Yeah.

I'm not sure of the other three if they do, but I knew you'd know.

If hockey had one. Yeah, no, hockey has some weird ones. Like, they have the Selkie Award, which is given to the best defensive offenseman.

Don't they also have like the gentlemen of the year or something?

They do.

They do. Ted Lindsay, I think that is, which is like a sportsman of the year. Yeah.

Yeah.

To go with, you know, scoring champion and MVP and all that. Coach of the year and all that kind.

Of traditional stuff. They don't call him that.

They call it the Art Ross or whatever. Norris Trophy is the defenseman of the year, but yeah.

I've said I wouldn't mind if the NFL did it sort of like college football, like have a Nagurski award.

Like a positional award.

Yeah.

The Dermotty Dawson award for the best center or Mike, you know, Webster award or whatever, you know?

The Reed and Paul Malou Memorial Trophy for best safety in the league. Protector of the year, Matt.

Who?

Trent Williams, again, is going to be in this conversation.

Yeah, Niners deserve a lot of credit.

Quinn Miners, I think.

Yeah, the offense isn't great, but he's great.

Hey, Mims could end up finding himself in this conversation.

I don't know if there's a standout to blow your door off.

I'll tell you this, though, for sure. It ain't going to be Lane Johnson.

It ain't going to be Lane Johnson. And I thought he may end up getting it, you know, like as a going out of, you know, a lifetime achievement type guy.

The Kobe Bryant MVP that you and I discussed back when we were predicting all this stuff.

Trent Williams, I bet, is who gets it.

If it keeps up.

Because I don't think he's got one yet.

Either, right? Because it's only a year or two old, the award.

Right.

Oh, there's only been one.

So it's like, yeah, you should give it to Trent on his way out. It's not that he wouldn't even be a deserving candidate, but.

Especially if they're the best offense in the league still.

That would make a lot of sense.

Yeah, I could buy that.

Defensive player of the year, Matt.

There's a standout that no one's talking about.

Is it Will Anderson Jr.? That's what I was going to say to you, but how bad can his team be and him still win an individual award? We also know that that plays into this too. If the Texans end up going 5-12.

That doesn't help.

6-11.

And they're like the 20th best scoring defense.

Right.

I mean, it's certainly not his fault.

No, and I think he is– if it's you and I do this sometimes, if it's a Madden style, every fantasy football draft style, every player in the league is in a pool and you can pick the first defensive guy to build your team around. It would probably be him at this point. There'd be some other deserving candidates, but.

I still think miles Garrett's probably the best defensive player.

Sure.

But I'm talking if you're just can't win it. Yeah. If you're picking a guy to, to start a defense with right now, age and contract and everything included in there, it would probably be will Anderson. I think Greg Russo's had a really quiet, you know, strong start. Oh yeah.

Yeah.

He's definitely breaking out in a big way.

I mean, Hey, TJ should be in this conversation.

Yeah, he's got a lot of splash.

Dexter Lawrence, maybe.

When the Steelers played the Bengals, I said Lawrence would have been my pick.

You said those two, I think.

Yeah, those were my top two.

And this, I think, becomes a lot more interesting because Miles Garrett, we've barely seen him. Michael Parsons, we haven't seen him. Two guys that would be kind of proverbial names to discuss in here.

Fred Warner, we mentioned for comeback player of the year, but he's a dominant off the ball linebacker as well.

Great call.

I think I mentioned this here, but I posted a chart that I got from Sam Hoppen where he just, you know, my graphs, you know, one of the, one of the, one of the axis was your pass rush acumen. And the other one was your run stuffing acumen. And you want to be in the top, right. And Will Anderson is in the absolute corner top, right.

Yep.

And then there's no one around him, you know, Herbig's actually a lot closer than you think, by the way.

He has.

I wanted to mention that at some point. I know that the box score numbers for Herbig haven't been great.

You're worried about Herbig. Is Herbig not worth the money?

But the underlying analytics are saying it's coming.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I have zero worries about that guy.

Same here. Same here.

You're going to love the contract.

You need to get him going and being more productive, but I'm not worried about that.

He's still as good a football player as he is.

Long-term, without a doubt. Offensive player of the year, Matt? I mean, it's Bijan Robinson at this point, right? I would think. But Kenneth Walker, holy cow. Jason, holy cow. But I think it's Bijan.

I guess those are three really good candidates.

Jameer Gibbs should probably be mentioned in there, too.

I mean, he's not slowing down at all. Just considering expectations of the team and how much you've elevated things, I think it's Bajon.

I think so, too. Hey, I tell you what, though.

Walker's been a revelation.

That's what I was going to say. You know a lot of this, as much as these are individual awards like we just discussed with Will Anderson, a lot of this depends on your team and your notoriety and all that, too. If Kenneth Walker keeps doing what he's doing.

And they win the division in 13 games or whatever.

And they go 13-4 or whatever. 12 and five. I mean, and they're like, wow, look at how that guy brought the chiefs right back to life from where they were at last year.

He's strong case. He needs to stay healthy. I, of course they all do.

But I don't know. And Matt, I'm sure it hasn't been that long ago, but remembering a year where we had three running backs in Bijon and and kenneth walker and then jameer gibbs who are doing like those three guys that are all doing it at such a high level yeah we've had years where it was like saquon and derrick henry but to have three guys that are you can make a lot of their game make a legit argument that all three of them are the best running back in the nfl right now i remember i don't i don't know when the last time it was kind of that good of a of a really strong at the group of at the top of running backs those three are all just absolutely elite.

Tight ends never win this award i don't think they ever have and But, and I know Bowers missed a little bit of time, but let's say they win 10 games and he continues the pace he's on since he's been back. He'll get in the conversation if those things happen.

It's a great call.

I'm glad you mentioned it.

Which is really hard to do. I heard this the other day, and I can't confirm it, but it does add up. Fantasy points per game, Brock Bowers would be wide receiver one.

Wow.

Yeah.

That's like Kelsey stuff from back in his prime.

That's how you win your league. You know what I mean? You talk about having a massive advantage.

That guy had a couple in round two or three.

There's an argument if we redrafted Fantasy, he should be 1-1.

He should be top five.

Yeah, right, right. There's a lot of good candidates for that one, though.

Plenty of good candidates for that one. Finally, Matt, MVP. You mentioned Brock Purdy, without a doubt.

Yeah.

I think Trevor Lawrence, without a doubt.

I think Lawrence is really putting his hat in the ring.

Without a doubt.

I would have thought Allen was starting to run away with it, but that's cooled down a little bit.

Could I throw Bryce Young into that conversation at this point?

If they win division, I don't think that's crazy. This injury is not going to help Lamar, but he's been playing as well as he had in his MVP years.

Dak?

Dak, they need to win.

They need to start winning some games.

He's certainly not the problem. It's a good one.

Maybe that'll start tonight. But, yeah, how many of us had Brock Purdy leading the MVP odds at the quarter point of the season?

He's second in fantasy scoring for quarterbacks and doesn't run a ton.

He's having a great year.

It's unreal.

The Niners offense has been just lighting it up, lighting it up to this point here. One more segment to go. On the other side, we'll give a prediction for Thursday night football. We'll get to your questions, comments, concerns, and reactions, all that good stuff. To close this thing down, it's The Drive, Steelers Nation Radio on the Steelers Audio Network.

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Final segment here of The Drive on this Thursday. We will give a quick prediction for Thursday night football before we get out of here, but let's hit on some of your questions, comments, concerns, and reactions before we go. In that last break there, we were just talking some college football and some, you know, started with talking about the best receiver tandems in college football history, and then that rolled into that just insanely loaded 2019 LSU team that beat, you know, that beat, like, Two was Alabama and Kyler Murray's Oklahoma and Trevor Lawrence's Clemson on the.

Way to a national quarterbacks are drafted three first overall. And then the guy in the top five.

And with that, Matt, that lends to this question from seven who asks us, Hey, Wes question for you and Matt. I just watched the game of South Carolina and Kentucky from this past weekend. I thought sellers played well, even though they lost. I know you guys are a little down on him and arch, but, But if these freak QBs play well all year and they go hop, these freak QBs play well all year, they're going to go top five in the draft. So shouldn't we hope that they have an up and down year at a chance to get them maybe in the, you know, nine to early teens range?

I think that's a good way of looking at it.

It's a double-edged sword. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Like, don't be too good, but still be as talented as you always were.

Because you would love a chance to draft an arch or a Dante Moore or Lenora sellers or a drew mess to maker. It's that balance of you want them to have great years because that means that they're kind of living up to the development and all that.

Yeah.

But at the same time, if they go one, two, three and six in the draft, you might not be able to get there.

Yeah.

Sellers.

I think it's the best example. Like I can't imagine arch. Not last, I mean, just the pedigree and all that. And if he has a bad year, he'll just go back.

And he's not having a bad year. He's just not lighting it up like many.

First overall slam dunk type dude. But I can't imagine there's any scenario that he's not a top 10 pick. Just the way the world works and the draft works. Doesn't mean you couldn't get him. Sellers, to me, I wonder if Dane were to do a mock right now, would Sellers even be in the first round? I bet the answer's no.

I bet not.

Yeah, I mean, because he had concerns.

And Chad Reuter that we went through yesterday had him as a day two pick.

Not a tier one guy.

Yes, he had him as a day two pick.

But we also know how the draft works, that when coaches get involved, right now it's scouts only because coaches are coaching how to beat the Colts.

Yes.

When coaches get involved, particularly McCarthy, who looks at sellers and be like, I'll work with that. I'll work with that. Give me those tools. I can fix that thing and that thing in the first month I have them, and then the other things we can work on. And he kills the combine and kills the senior bowl and goes in interviews with 15 teams in person for 30 visits.

And he's a wonderful young man, and he's great on the board.

Starts rising up boards.

Then every mock he's in the top 20.

Everyone was doing that with Ty Simpson last year. There's only going to be one first-round quarterback taken, Ty Simpson.

His last eight games were terrible. I don't want that guy.

And then he ends up going 13th overall.

Yeah, exactly. I mean, no one thought Knicks or Pennix was going as high as they did, and it happens every year.

No one really thought, you know, I shouldn't say no one, but I think a lot of people didn't think Kenny Pickett was going to go in the first round. Right, right, right. I think a lot of people thought he might go early to Carolina, and if he doesn't, he'll be hanging around. Then there's always those surprise guys that go up and down and whatever the case may be.

Yeah, but I do think this is an interesting way to look at it. You know, like, if Sellers crushes it, he's not getting out of the top five. I mean, if he was living up to all of his expectations. But a wart or two on draft day, there's many examples of why did this guy fall.

Josh Allen, Patrick Mahomes.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Mar jackson tons of them why would that guy possibly fall well they were concerned you.

Know speaking of which dante moore ruled out for this weekend against ucla still they have a buy after or something i believe i believe they do kind of.

Heard somebody saying that and rayola's played well.

I was gonna say the other side of that though is we'll see another another uh data point of dylan rayola McShane. Wouldn't it be so wild if Riola ended up coming out and being a first round pick and Moore goes back for another year?

I was listening to McShane.

He just turned 21. He's still so young.

They threw that out in their podcast, which I usually listen to on Sunday, you know, because I don't need the NFL stuff because they're playing as we speak or whatever. But what if Moore and Riola came out? They could.

They absolutely could.

Right.

And they both could be high picks. He's going to put a lot on film.

Wouldn't that be a feather in the cap of Oregon and their recruiting? Hey, we just had two quarterbacks picked in the first round.

And we lost in the first round of the playoffs. And we didn't have a good year.

Who's been on this show before saying that he thinks Cignetti and Dan Lanning are the two best coaches in college football? What dingus has said that before? Well, for one of them, it's still working out really well. Let's see here. John tweets and says, do you guys think they put Pittman on IR to make room for Elliott this weekend?

We kind of brought that up earlier. It sounds like Elliott's probably a week away.

I still think Elliott's a little ways away.

Or he probably would have practiced Wednesday. But I don't think it's a 0% chance.

I don't think it's a 0% chance. I also think, though, the Steelers have kept six wide receivers active.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Two of them do non-wide receiver stuff.

I think, though, that they would be all right with going into this game with five. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Because you can put Skronic out there.

They'll use Skronic when they need to.

Yeah, they play a lot more 12 personnel with Skronic out there. We even brought this up, but the Colts are another team that wants to live in nickel. You might want to play heavier personnel and keep them in nickel and bully them a little bit.

Mr. Norris, I should have said this one next to kind of follow up on that quarterback question there from Seven. But Mr. Norris says, how many first-round picks would you be willing to give up to trade and get Drew Mestemaker? At this point, I fear it may take three. So, again, that's tough to answer now. That's pretty rare. Because I need to see how these last. There's still seven games left in the college football season, plus conference championships, plus playoffs.

There's a lot more data points.

Of course.

And Senior Bowl and Combine and all that stuff.

But right now, there's a couple quarterbacks that I would say I would absolutely take the chance of. I'd give you the Steelers' first-round pick this year and next year.

And you don't even know where the Steelers are picking. It's so funny to me. Everyone just assumes they'll be 20th.

They could be 27. They could be seven.

They could be seven.

Yeah.

Right.

14. Yeah. 11 could be a lot of different things.

I mean, 2021 means you made the playoffs and lost the first round, but I know that's been common here, but that's, do we know that's going to happen? Of course not.

And I have been out. I've said this a million times. I don't want next year's quarterback to be Baker Mayfield or Kirk cousins or as much as I love them. And I would love it and change my tune.

Yeah.

You know, Smith, I don't, I, here's what I want the Steelers to do. I continue to say it is to step back into that matters box and swing for the fences and draft the quarterback. I've said this a million times. I'm, I don't want to keep taking veterans or retreads and trying to hit doubles into the gap.

There are, I could probably count them on one hand, but quarterbacks right now that I would give up two first round picks and okay. If I have to throw in a fourth or whatever, something like that.

Yeah.

And Mestemaker would be one of Yeah.

That's what I was going to ask you. And you've watched them more than me, but I've still seen enough of them that I'm really, really intrigued and read about.

And like, I'm not sitting here pounding the table that Mesta maker or arch or Dante Moore or Lenora sellers or CJ car is the next 20 year future hall of fame franchise quarterback. But I am also the fact that it might be, I've, I've, I've seen, I've seen enough from those guys that again, it's always a risk.

Everyone thought Trevor Lawrence was going to be God. The moment that he stepped into the league, it's taken him a lot of time that, He.

May not even win the starting job over Aller or Howard.

Baker Mayfield was the first overall pick in his class. And there's three quarterbacks in his group that have been better than him, you know, that were drafted behind him. Nothing is guaranteed, but I want to take a bite of the apple, but you have to, you have to take a swing and you might strike out, but you might hit a grand slam. You might hit a home run.

I would, I would, I'm not giving up three first round.

I'm not giving up three first round picks today for any of these guys, but I would give up two for probably four or five of them today. And, and Mesta maker would be.

Not even knowing where I picked.

Right.

Yeah, for sure.

That's, that's the nature of this business.

And you had two seconds for the, the year after small.

You're going to miss small, you know, if you, if you aim big, you can hit big. And, and, and that's where I'm at. I was just watching the Patriot the other day and Mel Gibson tells his son when they're, when they're rescuing Heath ledger, I haven't seen it. Mel Gibson tells his little boys, he's got like his young sons with him, that he sits up in a little crow's nest and just tells them to shoot officers. And he's like, what do I always tell you? And the little boy who's like 11 and is like terrified is like, aim small, miss small. I'm tired of aiming small. I want to, I want to shoot big for quarterbacks in this upcoming draft.

No, and Mestermaker is a big hit. And I'm sure no matter what happens the rest of the year with his college career, if he declares, everyone's going to be like, maybe he should sit a year. You know, he doesn't have a lot of experience, blah, blah, blah, blah. whatever i don't care about that we'll cross that bridge yeah we'll figure it out.

Ted says when considering the draft capital price for the raven ravens obtaining cam jurgens and thinking it is a little bit high is there.

Value it's exactly the same a porter deal.

Is there value in his contract and cap space that makes that more reasonable for the ravens to take him on long term good question.

A little he's cost controlled i mean the eagles paid his signing bonus so yes i think it's a A win-now move. I mean, I think that they were going to play Vega at center. So they win two spots. Juergens goes back to center where he's been playing guard, and he's definitely a better center. He's been playing guard poorly. Vega, you're kind of stunting his growth, making him play center.

So you get better at two spots, put both guys where they're supposed to be, You don't have to pay a signing bonus. So you're just paying salary at this point with Juergens, which is useful from a cap perspective where this came from. And how often do we see a starting offensive lineman get traded? Rarely. I mean, you might see the Broderick Joneses of the world or a project or someone that's not fitting in or new staff, blah, blah, blah.

But starting O-linemen don't get traded very much. Thus, you kind of had to overpay for them. You know, like, I don't know what the Eagles said. We have to get rid of this guy. I think they just said, if you give us enough, you can have them. And they finally gave them enough.

I think that's a good way to frame it.

The Ravens are like, we're not going to care that this is a second-round pick if we hoisted the Lombardi trophy at the end of the year.

Sure.

Right.

Last one of the day goes to Smooth Dave. Where should the Steelers be on the spectrum of trades? for the future versus trying to win this season in these four different tiers. Number one, the Rams all in on right now. Number two, the Cowboys using draft picks to trade for younger pieces. Number three, the Eagles selling veteran pieces for a retool or number four, fire sale, everything for the future.

Two or three.

That's where I'm at right now. Right now. But I would also say, ask me that question cousin. When we get back from Paris.

Yeah.

Like I wouldn't be trade deadline is right before the Steelers by week. Yeah. Yeah. So it's like, I think it's like in between week eight and week nine there. So the Steelers will have that game against the Browns when they come back from Paris at home and then the by week. And that's when the trade deadline falls.

If you drop it to the Colts and box, like, Oh man, it might be time to see if there's, you know, Ramsey or somebody that's older.

If you go three and oh, or two and one in your next three games, giddy up.

Yeah.

Yeah. You know? But if, if, if you have a losing record or, there's another substantial injury or two that could also, so smooth Dave, I would say right now, I would say Cowboys or Eagles two or three range on that spectrum.

To be determined.

But I would say really ask me when we get back from Paris or after that Browns game.

I mean, if you're oh, and three of those games, that's pretty telling or three and up.

Yeah.

The kind of deal that doesn't really interest me is they gave a fifth round pick for Mike Williams. And I know there's some Monday morning quarterbacking here. But you knew his contract was up at the end of the year, and you knew he was a very much declining player at the time. If you're going to give a pick for Brian Thomas Jr., not that I'm going to trade him because they're really good right now. I mean, someone that could be part of the long-term and short-term answer.

Which is kind of what the Cowboys have been.

Trying to do.

Yeah, exactly, exactly. I mean, that makes more sense to me than just an old Band-Aid that you flush a fifth-round pick for. Seventh-round pick, that's different, but you know.

Good stuff on the questions and comments and concerns and reactions today. We will do some more of those tomorrow, and we'll all obviously be fully focused on Steelers and Colts on Sunday. We'll have five-star Friday. We'll make all of our picks. We'll talk to Missy Matthews, all that fun stuff that we do on a Friday show. But that will do it for us today on this Thursday.

A big thank you to Brian Bacco for joining us earlier. As always, a shout-out to intrepid video producer Mr. TV, Tyler V, for keeping us nice and handsome and crisp on the YouTube side of things. For Matt Williamson, I'm Wes Shuler. Take care, everybody. We'll talk to you tomorrow. As always, you know where to find us. It's on your 24-7 home of the black and gold. Steelers Nation Radio on the Steelers Audio Network.

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Uh, what if we just got out of here and grabbed some Bud Lights? But man, we're on air for four more hours.

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