AEW DYNAMITE POST-SHOW (10/6): Zilem & JB talk Grand Slam France including Ospreay vs. Okada, Darby vs. Fletcher, Samoa Joe returns, more

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1:36 Now, PW Torch and Spreaker bring you the Wade.

1:39 Keller Pro Wrestling Post Show.

1:41 It's time to talk this week's AEW Dynamite.

1:48 JB, we just wrapped up the main event of a really, really quality paper flip new type show, uh, that AEW gave us on a free TV tonight. Uh, we'll all spray Okada for the men's AEW world championship, uh, went under 20 minutes and I thought the match was excellent.

2:09 Uh, what are your thoughts? Yeah, no, same here. Uh, I think I saw someone mentioned in the chat, but yeah, I think you could definitely argue it might be Okada's best match in, in AEW overall. Um, I know he said some pay-per-view moments and things of that nature. But yeah, and really, I liked the fact that it stayed under 20 minutes, actually. I thought they got a lot done in that time.

2:29 It was efficient.

2:30 And it really showed what Okada could do. Obviously, he has a bit of history with Ospreay. And I would venture to say I have some chemistry with Ospreay as well. And I think what I also kind of enjoyed within the match is that the history between Ospreay and Okada, Okada's head, quite a bit more success than Ospreay during the rivalry. So I think that played into the idea that, the idea of narrative that, you know, Ospreay is now on a new level, pun intended, since winning the title at All In and then, you know, being under the tutelage of Moxley. So I think that is kind of part of the story as well. So I thought that worked for this championship match tonight.

3:10 Yeah. And I feel like on a short notice, they did a good job kind of building up Okada's domination of the series overall between the two. And just, you know, it's always going to be forever an AEW kind of problem, right? A crux, like a pay-per-view. And just the show in a nutshell kind of proves, JB, I really wish they would tweak like the pay-per-view format just a little bit because they always have the ceiling of having great shows, but you can go from great to awesome. If you just tweak the format of the match times just a little bit, just, you know, The show flew by, and the main event was just like under 20 minutes. It was fantastic, and Okada had his working boots on. That's always kind of like the agenda with Okada. Is he

4:01 going to be 70? I would say 70% Okada is obviously still really, really good, but you can always tell he's in the mood if he's hitting the dropkicks. And then if he's grabbing risk control, then he means business at that point.

4:18 Yeah.

4:22 And yeah, like the, the, the dual Rainmaker spot between Okada and Osprey would have preferred that maybe Osprey didn't kick out at one. And the, I think it was, no, Okada didn't kick out at one, Osprey, Rainmaker, but you know, that's a small, just a small quibble in the grand scheme of things. But yeah, definitely, you know, I'm of the opinion that I think it actually made sense to spend a good portion.

4:44 I think someone mentioned earlier that he's been in AW for 20 months.

4:47 Now, Okada, and But to establish this character first, because the rest of the credentials kind of preceded themselves.

4:52 Granted, I know not everyone's watched. I wasn't a regular watcher of New Japan.

4:55 I mean, I've seen clips over the years and I've seen, you know, shows here and there, but I'm not watching, you know, consistently every show.

5:01 But it's good.

5:02 I think that they established kind of a, for, for a weekly episodic show, it's important to establish a character and, you know, they've slowly done that over time. And I think the bill has been good to that. And obviously now he's picking it up a little bit in the ring for important matches. And I think he said, you said he feels more invested now. And I think that that's a good thing for AEW. And now he's feeling a little bit more top tier and a little bit more main event level, which is good for future shows and future pay-per-views potential.

5:27 So. Yeah. And, you know, obviously I think like you said, him establishing his character the past, you know, few months since he's been with AEW, I think that's been the proper call. I think his English has gotten so much better. That's like kudos to him. I know Wade and I had a conversation a couple of weeks ago about Andre, not Andrade, I'm sorry, improving his English and it's part of the gig, but I mean, still he has to go out there and do it. He's out there on live television. Yeah. He's got kind of like the silly catchphrase, but like, He is kind of understanding just the facials, finding the hard cam, doing the face. And, you know, at some point we're going to get that baby face Okada run. And it's, you know, it's going to be great.

6:11 And I think a lot of fans are kind of strapping in and waiting for it, whether it's, you know, six months to a year from now, who knows. But I think it'll come sooner than later.

6:20 Yeah, absolutely. I mean, at this point, he's got to have a face run. It's probably like you said, it's probably going to be sooner rather than later. I mean, I think it worked for tonight and I liked when he did his pre-recorded promo with kind of like the Eiffel Tower behind him, kind of, you know, ripping on.

6:33 That was great. Yeah.

6:34 Making sure that he's going to be the firmly established heel in the matchup. Obviously, you know, he'll get some cheers. It's going to happen, but Ospreay is going to be the clear favorite as he should be, particularly in Europe. So, um, yeah, I thought that worked out and was a smart thing to do before the main event. And they, you know, it was built into the main event, which they don't always do.

6:49 So.

6:50 Yeah.

6:50 Like on, you should always take advantage of like your scenery, especially if you're a completely different country. They were, uh, by the art. So why not take advantage of that? And, uh, Okada speaking French, very, you know, obviously I recently traveled over in Paris. Uh, I can't say I've picked up much. So, uh, a lot of his French and Queen Amanata's French, uh, flew over my head, unfortunately. So I couldn't, uh, be, uh, the translator this evening. So, uh, but I mean, still, still very well, but I mean, companies should always take advantage of like kind of like unique setup because you're like, It's different. You're not backstage. It's not you're not in the doldrums of just like the gorilla position. So I'm

7:33 always in favor of just taking advantage of like your surrounding area, especially if it's somewhere they don't travel that much to. Yeah.

7:39 And, you know, just speaking to that a little bit, you know, specifically the arena itself in the crowd. I like the staging and entrance ramp set up tonight.

7:46 Yes.

7:47 And, you know, unsurprisingly, the French crowd was pretty much red hot all night. And, you know, they got into it with their own chants and things of that nature. I actually thought it was a little bit more tempered than like a WWE style international crowd, which I actually liked because sometimes that crowd annoys me a little bit too much.

8:00 It's like just nonstop chants and things of that nature.

8:03 They did it tonight, but it was spaced out. It felt a little bit more well-paced. So I enjoyed that aspect.

8:08 You know, it's funny, JB. I hear like the, I hear that. kind of observation kind of more from like the uk crowds where they're kind of just do it to the point where they'll get themselves over rather than actually kind of doing it towards the show i think that happens more in a wwe atmosphere for whatever reason i'm not sure why i don't know if because people are just going for the vibes and kind of party atmosphere which I would say that would completely made sense to Ross. I've attended the last couple of years. Um, but yeah, no, I'm, I'm for you. They were pretty, I mean, they were great all throughout, but obviously they were, they, they, they pretty much saved like the, they were electrified. I

8:51 would say for the main event, I know it took me more to get there. They just like cranked it up another level where, uh, it was completely earned and appropriate. It didn't feel, uh, you know, like, uh, They were just doing it just because.

9:03 Yeah, they definitely culminated at the main event, which is what you want. They peaked at the right moment. Because sometimes, you know, it happens two or three, and they're kind of burnt out later in the night. But they structured the show really well tonight to build to the biggest moment.

9:14 Yeah.

9:16 And, you know, just going over the match again, I mean, that second half of the match, I mean, good Lord.

9:23 Yeah.

9:24 I thought one of the better shots of the night was Ospreay, uh, hitting the drop kick out and over. That was fantastic. Very no notes there. Um, like you had mentioned, I understand that people have kind of like quarrels over the Alcada kicking out at one. I will say Ospreay is not like a big guy though. And he didn't get a lot of the Larry because the theme through all the night, uh, JB, like I don't know if people were still kind of working through their feelings over the last uh, you know, uh, few days, uh, you know, trying to still kind of, um, emotionally, emotionally still trying to like process, uh, the passing of Ben Saturday.

10:07 I just felt like everybody was kind of everybody's emotional support. Like, like, wrestling dummy tonight and i'm going to just lariat the absolute hack out of you tonight so i can kind of actually understand okada doesn't have a lot you know it's not like you know will's in a shaped guy but he's not like a jack guy it's not like he's uh you know mark davis throwing a big nasty king kong lariat or anything like that so to that part i do kind of believe uh a little bit okada could actually get kicked out and be really annoyed that this like guy would try to still beat him with his own.

10:42 Move that's fair yeah that's fair and You know, I give AW a little bit of grace because it's kind of baked into the product at this point. And I definitely get, like I said, the qualms if that's not your type of thing. It's not 100% my thing either. I think they do it a little bit too much. But for a Will Ospreay match in particular, I mean, that's just kind of what it is. And I think it works with him just because he's such a different wrestler.

11:03 I wish they would do it less all around the board, but I'm much more forgiving in an Ospreay type match. Yeah.

11:08 Yeah, and also if you can kind of just make it make– if you can make the kickout make sense, if you were just so annoyed where you can kind of just like that's the one time it happens all throughout the night in the match, okay, perfectly fine. Less is always more, but it's probably going to potentially happen more in the Osprey match or in a Mega match than most, but I would say I give complete grace with that fully. But on that note, JB, I'm ready.

11:38 Let's go ahead and dive in and introduce the show. As you can tell, Wade Keller is not hosting tonight. He's not feeling well. So JB and I wanted to kind of give him some grace and rest up. I mean, Wade's always busting his butt every day. You know, he's done some great work. You know, the newsletter last week just kind of go over and pack and everything was, you know, fantastic. And all the stuff the site split out on Ben Satterley, it's been great. So appreciate everybody's support with that. But yeah, I am Brian Zolm. I write the weekly hits and misses for AEW Collision. And I might sneak in some other blurbs, interviews, notes from the AEW press conferences here and there. And I'm happy to be a contributor on the site and joined this

12:29 evening with JB. Now, JB, you do the hits and misses weekly for TNA, is that correct? Correct.

12:34 Yeah, I do the weekly hits and misses for TNA, usually drops Friday or Saturday, dropped a little bit later this week because I had some things going on. But I also do the A to B with pay-per-view primers.

12:45 I'll do one next week for WrestleDream, probably around this time.

12:48 And then I also do a weekly podcast and daily cast with Zach Clark called Destination Impact for TNA as well.

12:56 And next Monday.

12:58 We'll do a show for this weekend is Bound for Glory. So it's arguably TNA's biggest pay-per-view of the year. So we'll do a show covering that, possibly in a roundtable format, also with Darren Lilly. That's not confirmed yet, but we might do that next week.

13:10 Yeah, if I saw that correctly, we had some breaking TNA news. They changed the start timer of the pay-per-view, didn't they?

13:20 Oh, well, I actually missed that. It was afternoon.

13:23 When I saw.

13:24 Yeah, I think they bumped it to an afternoon show, I believe, if I saw that correctly.

13:28 I don't know.

13:29 It's kind of odd because it's like they're not running against anything big, I don't think, because money in the.

13:33 Bank is on Saturday.

13:34 Right.

13:35 It's a little weird, but maybe they thought they could get more people. I'm not sure.

13:39 Yeah. I mean, it's something to discuss. Yeah. But for our audio listeners, we are live on YouTube. If you'd like to get involved in the show, the link, you know, just for our YouTube listeners is available. Just, you know, reach out if you want to get on stage. We guys, you know, we're happy to. get you on stage and involved in the show. Uh, we really appreciate it. Um, we'd also really appreciate it if you haven't already considered, uh, you know, uh, consider going VIP. If you haven't already done that, uh, describe to, uh, PW torch VIP and gain access to Wade's full RDO, uh, start to finish of the, uh, you know, show with, uh, his, uh, insight with each segment breakdown analysis, uh, specifically from Wade Keller. Um,

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15:25 And now we'll go ahead and get caught up on the comments appreciate everybody joining us on this odd tuesday uh tuesday night war i guess uh i i yeah um i haven't really seen much of uh any blurbs of nxt i've been i avoided um socials to make sure i wasn't seeing spoilers tonight jb so Yeah.

15:46 I don't really watch NXT. I mean, I stopped. I used to.

15:50 Black and Gold NXT was probably my favorite wrestling in the last 20 years, but I kind of stopped watching a couple years back now, so it wasn't really an issue for me. But I saw in the chat there is, I don't know if it's really, I wouldn't say it's a spoiler, but there might be a small spoiler in the chat, but nothing big.

16:05 Okay, gotcha, gotcha.

16:07 All right.

16:07 Got Derek Mitchell in the chat. Hello, Derek. Always good to see you. Rude Dog, good to see you. Rude Dog says, best Okada match in AEW in my opinion. Hmm. I mean, for me, I'm a little partial to Bayley and Okada at Double or Nothing last year. That's just me because I was there and I really felt like that was for me like the full, I think that was honestly the first time I saw Okada live, JB.

16:36 And that was my first Mike Bayley experience as well. So that, that to me, that always hits a pedestal. I was at, I saw Omega and Okada in Dallas and, you know, it just unfortunately didn't hit. Um, I mean, obviously Okada, Okada and the trios, uh, are the three way, uh, at all in was great. Um, but yeah, I would still say, um, Okada Bailey, that's been my favorite, uh, AW so far. I also like really weird, um, i really like the okay there was this random you know as you watch collision jb as you know you'll see random collision as matches uh okada just wrestled a commander one time and i really enjoyed that and i was like i really like that it just like you know okada just i felt like okada helped him out a

17:27 lot and i don't know i'll always kind of just as you watch these random shows you'll have like Memories of just things no one will ever bring up in casual conversation or recaps. But I'll remember Okada and Okada Commander a lot. I really enjoyed that.

17:43 Yeah, I think you could make the argument.

17:46 I mean, like I said, there's several of them, but I can definitely see this, you know, depending on your taste, this being your favorite Okada match in AW. Actually, King of the North just said mine, but yeah, I think it was Okada Takashita from Double or Nothing for me.

17:59 Oh, yeah, also.

18:00 My favorite.

18:01 Yeah, excellent.

18:03 But yeah, we're kind of splitting hairs here because they're all very good matches. And yeah, let's say definitively this is Okada's best match in AW TV proper.

18:12 So yeah no i i feel like that's fair i was trying to even think of anything else there there's been like kind of hits and misses i mean even him and danielson was i haven't gone back and look at it i'm sure it was good but i know it wasn't like it i i know it wasn't good as this okada swerve i remember not that not gelling at all i'm trying to think if there was any other okada random dynamite c2 matches that i can I think there might be, you know, the chat on our YouTube side. Feel free to hit us up. Got Derek Mitchell back in the chat, hitting up Rude Dog. Didn't follow Okada closely in New Japan. Knew he had great matches that solidified his legacy, but after signing 20 months later, he's hitting his stride. Yeah, no, I really agree. I

19:03 would say, you know, for anybody who hasn't, our audio listeners and obviously our folks watching on YouTube, um the okada jay white wrestle kingdom fantastic like absolutely love that and i was a guy i didn't really uh i was a not believer in jay white and then i finally a year into watching jay white and the feud that was built with okada i finally kind of fell in love with jay white and the match he had with jay white and wrestle kingdom that was fantastic.

19:34 Yeah absolutely it's unfortunately looks like jay white's kind of hurt again for a couple months god bless it man yeah So you got to understand why Tony Khan maybe hasn't put the rocket to him. It's just because you got to trust that he's going to be able to stay healthy before you can, push him too hard, unfortunately.

19:49 No, and it's unfortunate, Jay, because I feel like in his last stint, he cut one of the best promos since he's been on AEW television.

19:59 It was great.

20:00 And, you know, it just– i and i i honestly i don't know if he was necessarily 100 jb i i don't know i'm just i was kind of all i can do uh wade obviously talks to people so he he would know i just i have to go by my eyeballs and i just something just fell off where he just didn't feel like a hundred percent you know maybe he was still trying to get back in the stride he just looked i don't know he didn't have that like snap like like the switchblade you're waiting for it he just He didn't really look like it in the matches he was in. I mean, I don't ever want to go back and watch that double chain match ever again. I don't ever want to watch that again. Yeah, that was no bueno. But maybe that's why he was

20:43 kind of set up in matches like that, just because he wasn't all the way back yet. But I hope he gets there because I really still feel like there's something to be had with Jay White at some point. All right. Power driver Pete. I'm a creature of habit. I watched NXT. LOL. I forgot about AEW being on tonight and was surprised not to see Kelly and Nate. Yep.

21:05 Sorry to disappoint you.

21:06 Yeah, sorry. This is not NXT. We got Derek Mitchell back in the chat. I thought Okada versus Will. Match was fantastic. Although the excessive spamming of signatures is a personal peeve of mine. Yeah. I would say completely understand Derek. I would say based on this atmosphere on the occasion, if you wanted to go all killer, no filler, perfectly fine tonight because the fans ate it up. You had to keep everything on time. I, you probably obviously could have told that maybe more insightful story. If you had another, maybe 10 minutes, but again, based on kind of like the format timing overseas, you were probably not going to be able to do that. Um, but, There are occasions where you kind of just want that adrenaline rush. And

21:53 I would say, again, based on how the match ended and was formatted and it still told the story where, like you said at the top of the show, JB, well, Ospreay is on another level. So I'm completely fine on how it's set up.

22:07 Yeah, I mean, in a vacuum tonight was actually fine. It was perfect.

22:10 I do see in the greater picture, I see the argument that AEW does it too much.

22:15 It's kind of like WWE.

22:16 In a vacuum in many situations, you could justify the interference finishes, but when it just happens every episode or across the board, yeah, then it brings down, you know, it takes away from your investment overall. So I do get Derek's point as well, even though tonight I thought it worked fine. Yeah.

22:34 King of the North in the chat. Wade Keller, give Brian Zilma a raise. Appreciate that. Hey, I mean, we got to give JB a raise if anything.

22:41 You can take that for my paycheck, actually.

22:43 Hey. I mean, hey, JB, if you, you know, people want to... give me uh feel bad for me i'm uh you know covering collision i i would say uh covering tna weekly that's probably more of a chore yeah for sure you should get the raise.

23:00 It'd be completely transparent don't know if i'd be watching weekly if i wasn't covering it for the torch so.

23:04 I completely understand it just i i kind of see i casually read some of your stuff but it just seems like the matt and jeff variety hour for the most part i just I don't know what that show is at this point.

23:18 Yeah, I don't think they'd know what they are either, if I'm being perfectly honest.

23:22 And that's not to say there's not some good stuff.

23:23 I mean, there is some good stuff, but there's just a lot of crazy stuff too, in my opinion. But, you know, that's a conversation for another day.

23:31 Yes. Brian Olson in the chat. Hello, Brian and JB. Have a great show. Brian originally from Detroit.

23:38 That's that's my gimmick yeah brian's been around for a long time uh he's a forget me probably like a 30 something year subscriber now or something like that.

23:47 That's fantastic glad to have you brian all right standard deviation i'm glad wade reminded me the last night or i would have missed tonight um you know i it's hard because i i feel like on collision they hammered that home and i feel like they mentioned it here and there last week but obviously due to the circumstances i know they weren't kind of like beat you over the head with it um you know i mean obviously they could have since they've already kind of had them i feel like they mentioned it on the collision go home show before the previous pay-per-view because they kind of obviously set up uh jericho and nick wayne because that was like one of the first matches they put on the card so i feel like they didn't mention that

24:28 but i mean obviously they were gonna hammer it home last week.

24:32 Yeah no and yeah and they've actually mentioned it was a Tuesday since they announced like Grand Slam Paris. So it's not like it's completely new. However, you know, people have very busy schedules, very busy lives. So it's easy to forget things like that. So, and I get it. It was just weird circumstance with obviously the Pack Tribute Show being last week.

24:47 So that's not the best timing in that regard. But yeah, I think they were, they were moved.

24:51 Because of baseball playoffs on TNT and TBS. So that's the reason for it being on tonight.

24:56 Yeah, I'm sure that's, I'd had to go back and look at their schedule. I think you're going to have wacky, Tuesdays and probably wherever they want to fill in collision soon with all the parameters of sports. You've got not only baseball, you've got hockey starting up, you've got college football, and then you've got the Skydance change, which Tony Khan officially said this was his first day working at Skydance, which is still very notable as far as the merger being complete. So, you know, hope all goes well there.

25:29 Back to our YouTube chat for our audio listeners, Derek Mitchell back in the chat. It's a The same enter setup WWE has used in the past.

25:35 Yeah.

25:36 Derek's referencing something JB mentioned on the setup, which, yeah. I mean, I didn't mind that at all just because, again, get as many people in there. You don't need the. The pompous and the omniance of like the WrestleMania field. Cause that's what all out are, you know, uh, all ends for sorry, WrestleMania. Like, cause I think that building you probably, I think you can have about 8,000 or something or another or something. So it's not like this huge, huge building. So like I'm completely get as many people in there as you can. And, um, I did see one spoiler JB apparently, uh, uh this really cool clip of the crowd getting involved in a match at some point which looked really fun i don't know if it

26:24 was in a match or like post-match but maybe we'll see it on.

26:27 Collision but it looked really cool yeah no yeah like i said like crowd gets into it like you said i mean yeah it makes sense the configure i don't know if the video ran the same building i'm sure they ran a bigger one when they were in they.

26:39 Had to be at a bigger one right because i imagine uh yeah because because i think of the money in the bank show and i feel like the the building they were in was like enormous and.

26:49 Granted that's money in the bank versus random dynamite but right yeah so All right, back to our YouTube chat for our audio listing.

26:57 Standard deviation back in the chat said the difference between the crowd reactions and one ring kickout versus the ringmaker kickout tonight is evidence of how important it is to regularly condition the audience to what something means. Yeah, no, for sure. I mean, obviously, you know, a clothesline is not necessarily like the most devastating move in all of professional wrestling or sports entertainment. Completely understand that. Uh, you know, although I'm sure there's, you know, several people that have kicked out of the people's elbow. So, I mean, yeah, you, you probably, you probably want to protect it a little bit.

27:31 Um, it's like, you know, one wing angels, you're very much protected.

27:35 I would say for sure. So. Yeah. No, and I do enjoy how Ospreay's got this other, you know, various arsenals. Now, I would like it for, I think he's done it recently, but I wouldn't hate the idea of Ospreay winning more with Styles Clashes. That's just me. Like, win more with a Styles Clash. Like, not all the time, but just, like, you know, sprinkle it in so that way everybody's on the hook. Kind of like with Sami Zayn and the Blue Thunder Bomb. That's just me.

28:04 Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

28:05 It's good.

28:05 Like you said, Vosprey has quite an arsenal. I mean, we all know that, but yeah, the Hidden Blade too.

28:10 Stormbreaker.

28:10 Yeah, Stormbreaker. What's the one that he was, that Tiger Driver.

28:16 Yeah, Triver Tiger.

28:17 Yeah, so.

28:20 Let's see. AI viewers, it's twitchstar.com. I think that might be spam.

28:28 Yeah, I was thinking earlier.

28:29 Sorry, oops.

28:29 Makes sense, yeah.

28:30 Sorry, guys. King of the North. These guys kicking out of each other's big moves makes perfect sense. Faction mates in Japan way back. Yeah, absolutely.

28:39 Yeah, maybe more sense tonight for sure, just because of the long history together.

28:43 Yeah, great reminder, King of the North. I mean, I've forgotten that, honestly, as well, that they were obviously stable mates. And Chaos, if I remember correctly. King of the North back in the YouTube chats, or for audio listeners, they were still strangers. It'd be all over the criticism. Let's see, Rude Dog back in the chat. Good job, bro. Wade needs a break every now and then. Yeah, absolutely. Wade works really hard, and he's got to ease in. He's got a lot of stuff coming up. Hockey season just tipped off. He's got basketball in. He's got a pay-per-view to potentially attend. We'll have to ask Wade, JB, if he's actually going to attend.

29:26 Yeah, Wade's in Minneapolis, I think.

29:29 Yes, it is.

29:31 How very convenient Wade gets to attend potentially two major events from WWE and AEW all in the same year.

29:40 Yeah that's uh it's.

29:41 Nice yeah no i've never been um i don't know if december is potentially the best time to go to minneapolis but um yeah i'd.

29:51 Like to go if i could i've been for a lions vikings game um a couple years back but um Yeah, so actually really beautiful cities in St.

30:00 Paul and Minneapolis, the Twin Cities.

30:02 And it was a colder weather month as well, but it was still really nice. It was actually cool, a lot of walkways between the buildings and stuff like that as well, where you stayed indoors. So it wasn't as bad having to be out cold in the streets. But I'm from the Detroit area, which also gets pretty cold through the winter, so I'm kind of used to it.

30:19 Yeah, I am a Wyoming-ing, how do you say? I'm I'm, I was born in Wyoming. I don't know where, what the proper, uh, vernacular is there. So I've got, I've cold blooded, but, uh, I don't, I don't complain about the heat anymore, JB. Uh, I don't remember like two or three years ago. Do you remember when Texas like had a snowstorm and just the state kind of fell apart? Yeah.

30:46 That was not fun. Um, going about three days without power and a week without hot water. Um, We've got tankless water heaters outside. One of them busted and was flaking through the stove.

31:01 So that was fun.

31:03 So I've decided I would never complain about a summer again because I was like, the cold, this sucks. I will never ever want to move somewhere where it's that cold. But again, Minnesota, Detroit... are prepared for that uh texas is obviously not.

31:21 Yeah i gotta say this is like my favorite time of the year because our weather's like 70 degrees during the days and it's been sunny the last couple of days so it's pretty not too hot not too cold you can wear your sweatshirt at night um but obviously we're a couple months away from getting really cold but our summers are real nice as well so i can't complain you.

31:36 Know it's i want to knock on something jb uh during The early parts of the morning were getting like a brisk 64. I actually had to throw on a little vest to walk the dog this morning. Now, mind you, it was still 88 today. So I think we're out of like the horrific parts of the hot summer. So yeah, that's our fall. It'll be 80s. And this might be kind of a year where Texas is probably, you know, we could potentially go swimming on Christmas. That's... It has that vibe to it.

32:12 It happens.

32:14 On Tuesday nights, the conversation doesn't stop when NXT ends. It's just getting started. I'm Nate Lindberg, and alongside my co-host Kelly Wells, we bring you PWT Talks NXT. We go live on the PWTorch YouTube channel about 15 minutes after the show to break down matches, storylines, and surprises. And we take your questions and comments from the live chat.

32:31 Miss us live, but you still want to be part of the show? Send your thoughts to PWTorchNXT at gmail.com and catch the replay on YouTube or on the PWTorch Daily Cast feed. Just search PWTorch on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen. And of course, you can always stream the latest shows at pwtorch.com.

32:48 Back to our youtube chat i know everybody's over the weather channel at this point standard deviation back in the chat says kicking out early is good concept that can make sense in a few different ways so it continues to be done appropriately i think it'll become accepted and stable uh main event wrestling.

33:04 Yeah, there's places for it, absolutely. I think you have to pick your places, but absolutely. I mean, I think, like I said, it can work in a situation like this.

33:11 It works perfect.

33:12 Yeah.

33:12 There's other situations where I think NAW has done it where I'm like, eh, did that really deserve kind of a, like I say, a spam finisher scenario? I'm like, eh, I think you'd say that better pick your battles for that. But, you know, those are things we talk about in different episodes.

33:27 Yeah, so we'll go ahead and touch on the TNT title match next, JB. Any other final thoughts from the main event?

33:35 No, the one aspect I'll add is that Speedball potentially being involved in the Clockwork Carnage match, I'm assuming he wins this Saturday to qualify, is kind of an interesting wrinkle now that he's obviously part of Ospreay's United Empire. So really would like to see how they interact during that type of match. I think obviously they'll interact well because they're so early on. But I want to know if they'll kind of team up or what have you, or if that becomes part of the storyline.

34:03 So, yes.

34:05 Yeah, Kyle Fletcher, Darby Allin, exactly what I thought it was going to be. I thought there was maybe a chance that they were going to switch a title because all these title matches, I thought maybe there was going to be a slim title change tonight. I was like, God, could Kofi win the Ring of Honor title? I thought maybe there was a chance, but these two absolutely did unspeakable things to their bodies. Of course, Darby somehow is able to do these feats of just splatting himself into Lillian JB. It's incredible. Somehow he did a reverse monkey flip into the French announced table as Kyle Fletcher flipped him like a pancake. Incredible. The dive from Darby on top of the ring post killing Darby. fletcher into the

35:00 barricade that was fantastic and uh i thought fletcher overall did a great job selling his knee um you know darby bleeding buckets of blood like a runny sink it was it was it was great and um you know darby uh hit uh he had kyle on the scorpion death lock worked over the knee hit two coffin drops and uh retained i believe it went under.

35:27 17 minutes Yeah, no, it was obviously a great match. Darby's, you know, probably the best bump taker in the business. And Fletcher, you know, definitely justified those bumps tonight with his offense, which is always still crisp.

35:39 And, you know, it was pretty hard hitting tonight. Yeah, so good match overall.

35:44 I think this was obviously, you know, Darby and Fletcher have a pretty good rivalry going back now.

35:48 And I think this match was kind of.

35:50 To further what I think had to be an audible that was called, obviously, after the Stephen Borden injury.

35:55 Yes. I think.

35:57 Darby and Borden were actually supposed to win that match and become the number one contenders for the tag titles.

36:00 I believe so.

36:01 But obviously they had to call that match just a precaution, which was the right thing to do. But I actually think that the match change in and of itself is a happy coincidence. because I like the idea of having the Young Bucks versus Knight and Fletcher for the tag titles, because more because it's a pure face versus heel tag team dynamic, as opposed to a little bit of the nebulous would have been Darby and Borden would also be faces versus the Bucks who are, you know, also ostensibly faces.

36:27 So it actually kind of worked out a little bit in that regard. Curious to see what they do with Darby now, obviously still the TNT champion, you know, Borden's probably gonna be out just a few weeks, but seeing, you know, if they continue with that pairing or if they take things a little bit slower with Borden or if they just move forward with Darby's as a single guy for right now. So just really kind of curious about how they, how they structure that moving forward.

36:46 Yeah. You know, super important. Best wishes to Steven. That was obviously like a scary situation. AEW handled that, you know, the best way possible as far as stopping the match. Uh, yeah, no, I'm super intrigued to see like how the, the tag title scene plays out. It was just like, just an interesting wrinkle because it, you know, they, sometimes AEW does like to throw you off at the scent. It's like, wait, why would you do this? So I know obviously it's kind of complicated things. Um, but the injection of still kind of keeping Fletcher and night relevant on TV, uh, as you know two the guys who arguably could be world champions at some point is still really relevant kyle has gotten behind working with knight even though there's still

37:36 like the attention they can circle back to uh with okada and uh no i'm really looking forward to that match against the bucks at wrestle dreams i think the chemistry should be great thinking uh you know you had to ask you know what's next for darby i i immediately thought this um when they did the all out kind of, you know, tease of Wardlow, I thought immediately going to Wardlow, they were going to try it one more time. And if you're going to go, if you're going to try to get this guy over Darby's the guy that's who you, and I would say Darby and Darby's Teflon, he can take, any loss at this point and be completely fine. Look at the year this guy has had. He's, I don't want to, I mean, is it hyperbolic to say he's a made guy where it's like,

38:29 if he loses, I don't think it's kind of like, there's going to be this, ah, outrage. Why did you beat Darby Allen? I think if you're gonna rehab Wardlow in any way, I think you just have Wardlow just like throw around Darby and beat him for the TNT title or WrestleDream.

38:45 Why not?

38:46 Yeah.

38:47 No, absolutely.

38:47 I'd be perfectly open to that. I mean, uh, like you said, um, yeah, I think, I'm sure Darby and Wardlow have wrestled in the past. Have they feuded for the TNT title in the past? Cause I know Wardlow's had it in time.

38:57 So has Darby. They might've.

38:59 See, I'm trying to, I'm trying to remember cause I know Wardlow did wrestle Orange Cassidy in kind of like his, uh, brain, brain that did not end well. Uh, that was like the Samoa Joe, uh, uh, powerhouse Hobbs. And the, I think that's when you lost the powerhouse Hobbs, Viva QT, Marshall, not necessarily great, uh, chat. I mean, if you want to help us out, I can't really recall off the top of my head.

39:24 I'm sure they've at least had a match, but they may have even feuded for a period of time. But yeah, no, I mean, I think that really works. Like you said, Darby's a bump machine and Wardlow's kind of a big powerhouse guy. It's a little bit easier for him to kind of just throw Darby around as opposed to have to move around and Darby can create that movement, which is, you know, important for Wardlow who came out with like two knee braces, I think like an arm brace last week.

39:44 So like, he's looking like the, the million dollar man or we can rebuild him.

39:50 Kind of deal.

39:51 But yeah, which I guess is a slight Steve Austin.

39:55 Yeah, a little bit.

39:57 I mean, God bless him.

39:58 Ties into our show. So we've come full circle.

40:01 Yeah. And I mean, you think of you know, the aftermath, I'm kind of already thinking, okay, if you built up Wardlow, you know, who could, I look at a guy like Speedball, that would be a perfect guy to be Slay the Beast and have him like have a big singles title kind of moment.

40:19 That'd be great.

40:20 Yeah.

40:20 Well, Speedball Wardlow would also be great. Like similar situation with Darby, he can create the movement. You know, he, I don't think he's had a single, he hasn't had a singles title at AEW to this point, which obviously there's quite a few of those. But yeah, to have him as kind of the plucky underdog that would end up ultimately defeating Wardlow, now obviously we're talking a little bit down the road here, but that's something that I can certainly see happening potentially.

40:40 Absolutely. And our audio listeners, going back to our YouTube chat here, Kingdom North says his favorite match with Okada in AEW. Okada to Tasha from Double or Nothing for me. And I completely forgot.

40:51 I referred to that earlier too. Yeah, I mean, I agree with that.

40:53 Yeah. Yeah, King of the North reminding us again. Thank you, King of the North. Takesha Master of Dorada. That was three-way. That was great, too. I completely forgot about that. King of the North just hitting us up. Okada Takesha versus Young Bucks. That was also great, too. I completely forgot about that. I'm sorry, guys. I should have had more.

41:15 I appreciate the chat kind of reminding us. Okada has a great shit. Eden Grin. Yes, he certainly does. Standard Deviation. Appreciate that. Uh, King of the North responds. The Denzel TV match wasn't great.

41:28 Yeah.

41:29 I don't remember it being that great. I just, you know, not that I recall. Oh, I, God bless it. Uh, JB, I forgot about this one. This was honestly, I should have thought about this one. Standard deviation, Okada versus Pac. That was, yeah, that was great. I, um, completely forgot about that one.

41:48 Yeah.

41:49 Yeah, no, absolutely.

41:51 I mean, all those, like I said, Okada's never, I don't think I saw a match where Okada was like, oh, that was a bad match. Maybe it underperformed the expectation, but I think they're all at least quality matches at a minimum, just relative to expectation with Okada at this point.

42:05 Yeah. Center deviation, I think the opener to, I think... I think the opener to a pay-per-view, I think it felt like an opener, I believe. Correct me if I'm wrong, standard deviation. Let's see. We've got standard deviation back in our YouTube chat. This didn't feel like a final match between them. Let's put it that way. Yeah, yeah, no, for sure. They could easily pick.

42:32 That up at any point in time. Yeah, you're referring to Osprey Okada, correct?

42:36 Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, I mean, they have such a history.

42:38 I think they might have a 13, well, I think tonight would be like their 14th match against each other.

42:42 So, yeah, I mean, that certainly can be revisited.

42:45 Yep.

42:46 In the history, I think, including New Japan, obviously. Absolutely.

42:49 Derek Mitchell back in our YouTube chat. I wish I spent more time watching Okada in his prime, but there is only 24 hours in a day. Absolutely understand, Derek. He's among the greatest Japanese wrestler, along with Mishawa, Muda, Liger, Tanahashi, to just name a few. Absolutely.

43:06 Absolutely.

43:08 Yeah, no, agreed. Obviously, I think that's pretty indisputable. So, yeah, legendary background. You can't take that away from him already, so he's just continuing that and hopefully builds it a little further in AEW. His character work, he's established his character work in AEW, which is actually impressive because he didn't necessarily have to do that as much in New Japan, and he's kind of proving his chops now.

43:30 Yeah, for our audio listeners, Rudog did ask in the chat, what is Skydance? And Derek Mitchell... does provide a visual in our YouTube chat. And I'll kind of reiterate that in our, for our audio listeners, Skydance is a media production company, which owns Paramount and owns the world funded by David Ellison. Yeah, pretty much. I mean, Rude Dog, it's pretty much, you know, Paramount and, you know, Warner Brothers Discovery combined.

44:01 So, yeah.

44:02 Yeah, there was obviously some moves made with the personnel. Obviously, like as you do mergers, there's going to be shuffling of media. It's hard to kind of say how ultimately that's going to affect wrestling. We don't know. I would say for anybody already kind of having fears or dreads, Tony Khan has a very good relationship with David Ellison.

44:24 So I would say based on everything that AEW is doing, pay-per-view wise, monthly, And numbers that we don't see from Max, I think they're fine. I think they're absolutely fine.

44:38 Yeah, I don't foresee anything changing in the immediate future, at least.

44:44 Let's see. Center Deviation back in our YouTube chat here. AW has been poor, getting over the Rainmaker as a serious finisher. non-reaction tonight from the hot crowd as evidence yeah.

44:56 I'll just be maybe this is this is a hot take on my part but oh it's the most isn't the most aesthetically pleasing uh finisher and i get that they got the lore over in new japan to to a great extent and that's that's impressive but i think it's a different audience it's just a reality it's a different audience and i don't think it's as easy to get over in north america just based on history wrestling now they could have done a But they didn't because that's not where Okada was when he first came into the company. So I think that had an effect on the overall expectation of what the Rainmaker is and how people view it as a finishing move.

45:31 Yeah, and I feel like obviously they framed it better in New Japan, honestly, as well, JB. Especially, like, you don't really understand the. I guess the lore and impact of the move, unless Okada's got wrist control, he's not really doing that as a heel. Now, potentially he could do that more as a baby face and they can kind of do the pose, you know, the whole shebang of Okada that I think there's potential there to kind of reframe, you know, how they film him production wise. I would, I would like to see it over, you know, cause when I see a clothesline now, I mean, obviously, you know, the, The running lariat from Pac was great. Gunther, he's obviously got a devastating clothesline. Let's see. I mean, obviously, the clothesline

46:18 from Hell, from JBL, God bless it. I felt like he was going to take his... rotator cuff off every time he landed that thing well he.

46:25 Probably actually really landed legitimately landed some of the time too yeah and it just like uh if anybody sees them i would every now and again jb i don't know i'll see it on the timeline the montage of uh the clothesline.

46:37 From hells from jbl and i always think of uh god he he literally killed like five foot raven mysterio like every time and it was like oh my god this like poor guy.

46:48 Obviously one that's that's relevant to to aw the uh the buckshot lariat by hangman pages oh yeah cool looking uh finisher as well so.

46:58 And fantastic i was trying to think who else has got a mean mean clothesline way back in the day stan hansen i think was dan hansen yeah yeah that's a good one um billy gunn surprisingly he he would take a hell he he would take a rock like stunner bump for the clothesline from hell he'd always turn like inside out um every time and uh it just It was always kind of amazing because, you know, Billy Gunn, even though back then he– not a small man to do that bump. So kudos to him. I'm trying to think here. Who else had a mean, mean clothesline that just– oh, I think of– do you remember Vader and Shamrock?

47:36 Vader just like– Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. That was pretty early on in my fandom. So, I mean, I do remember, but yes. Yeah, Vader just absolutely kills Shamrock because he just like– actually like wouldn't hold up and he just like boom it just oh man vader was great.

47:54 Did you know that you can enjoy commercial free versions of all of your favorite wade keller podcasts and pw torch daily casts on spotify just go to patreon.com search pw torch and subscribe to a vip membership tier you get a seven day free trial by the way to kick the tires a bit and see if you like the service And then sync it with Spotify, and you can listen to commercial-free versions of our free shows, like the Wade Keller Post Shows, the Wade Keller Podcast Flagship, our Flashbacks, and also the PWTorch Daily Cast lineup. Again, all commercial-free, a nice streamlined listening experience. But with third-tier membership, you can also unlock all the VIP podcasts, including Everything with Rich and Wade, The Fix with Todd Martin that

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48:56 Derek Mitchell, actually, great question in the chat, JB. Derek Mitchell asked for our audio listeners, do you ever see Stephen Borden turning heel on Darby? Which brings out his dad to have a similar Dominic element saying his dad... was never around when he grew up. Excellent question. um you know i thought they were planting some seeds potentially because obviously like you know next month uh steven borden was actually supposed to team with his brother garrett at a uh you know an independent show here in austin that i was going to attend uh you know we'll see how that plays out i'm not sure what happens with that i i wonder as a potential make good if uh aw will maybe kind of lend um derby

49:45 yeah that's what i was thinking because you know it is for dustin's school specifically so it just i can see tony khan doing that and um because it was a big reaction because garrett and steven had never wrestled before because i was the show uh garrett wrestled his second match And, you know, his brother made a save and I was like, oh, OK, I'll be going to this anniversary show. And, you know, I bought the tickets and unfortunately everything happened in all out. So we'll see if he's cleared by then. You never know with, you know, questions and everything like that. You want to be super duper careful with that. So, yeah, I imagine if he can't pop up uh i wonder if darby kind of just makes a cameo that seems.

50:32 Like something logical and something that wouldn't be too difficult to do and something very tony cotton like so i could definitely see that happening.

50:38 Yeah uh you know seeing darby at a indie show that's a not not a bad way to spend a sunday for me jb that i'm completely completely down with that and sure it's.

50:48 More affordable than uh seeing him in a real show as well so.

50:52 Yeah have you seen garrett borden uh Yeah, have you seen any clips of him wrestle? He's only wrestled, obviously, in the two matches.

50:58 You know what, I may have seen some clips, I guess, but I've never seen, like, a full match at this point. I know there's probably not many of them anyway.

51:04 Yes, two.

51:05 And obviously nothing live, but, you know, I'm intrigued to see, relative to Steven, how far he's progressed. I'm sure Steven's probably a little further progressed, obviously, because they're giving Steven the shot first. But, you know, they both seem like they're pretty good athletes, so I'm sure, you know, they can make it work in some capacity, so... Yeah.

51:24 And it was interesting because I, I, um, you know, it happened during all in, uh, JB, it was like, I almost wanted to just, I almost wanted to yell because everybody kept on talking about Steven, Steven, Steven. And I wanted to say, staying has another son. His name is Garrett. He's actually wrestling in a couple of weeks. Um, but I thought they were actually doing that on purpose, uh, just because I don't know if they didn't want to necessarily reference him that much because, you know, I, I, from what i understand he's still got a you know shoot full-time job so i don't know like what his schedule is and how much willing he's able to commit to it um but obviously you know steven's obviously really

52:06 into it because he's sleeping on darby's lawn so you know he's super into it and um get you know garrett garrett's an interesting build um jb he's kind of built like uh you know a refrigerator he's got like uh i've seen.

52:21 Because garrett was at steve's retire i mean i've seen garrett steve's retirement um so yeah i mean definitely yeah like i said different build to a certain extent but.

52:28 Yeah farm strong i would say mr garrett uh not about uh you know his first match went a little bit longer his second match was only a squash but uh he uh he can sell not like for somebody like his size and strength that would be easy just to no sell everything but uh you know not not awkward at all trying to sell so he um dustin and anybody else he's trained with and work with has obviously been super helpful in his kind of like early stages of development i mean obviously uh his dad is staying so i'm sure he's gonna get like all the help he can get but uh not like i i felt like you know he's can sell um and uh you know i feel like he every time i see him he's getting in better shape um you know shocker

53:14 but uh i i don't know we'll see uh i'm crossing my fingers that i'll be able to see that show live and give uh you know some reporting live for the torch because it's been kind of cool because you know to see like the son of sting wrestle a couple matches and then potentially wrestle with his brother it's you know generations of sting that's you know it's a cool thing that's why i always uh i always try to say jb should always uh support going to indie shows like yeah you know you.

53:40 Always see cool stuff yeah absolutely um yeah sons of thing could be a tag team name actually but uh yeah yeah you know you know being an attack team they don't necessarily have to be like elite individual wrestlers either because they can cover for a lot of deficiencies kind of working as a team so that might be the best fit for them moving forward also yeah i agree.

53:58 Yeah i don't know if garrett's like a uh that's going to strike fear into a, uh, catchy, uh, chant. Steve, Steve is obviously catching on because, you know, uh, you know, everybody's chance, Steve, Steve, Steven, you know, uh, if you didn't know JB, he's a, he's a heartthrob. Apparently this, uh, Steven Borden, he's, uh, all, all the rage amongst the, uh, the tick tockers and everybody young. Uh, he's, uh, he's, he's even caught my, uh, you know, different algorithms of my friends. And I've been asked, who's this guy? I was like, well, you know, He's like his next big thing is Stephen Ford.

54:33 So I could see it. I could see it for sure.

54:36 So yeah. Redog back in our YouTube chat here says, I believe Darby Allen has been the most over wrestler that he's ever been and pushed in a W meaning he does everything he needs to do. And he does over, he overdoes it. Yeah, no, I would agree. I mean, Darby said he's, you know, he's got, he's going to do this until the wheels come off to, you know, the use of CM punkism.

55:01 So, Yeah, no, I mean, he's, he's done it all. You know, he's been pushed deep at the world title level and, you know, kind of, that was the story of his run is that, that he was going to do it till he burned out and he burned out very quickly because, you know, he wasn't afraid to take on all coming challenges and multiple weekly shows. So the, you know, that was the story that was told there.

55:20 And then he's been done everything in between. He's, done a retirement match with sting. He's been tag team champion. He's been TNT champion. Uh, I'm sure he's been other champions as well, but champion chose other championships as well that I don't recall. He's been in pretty much every gimmick match you could probably think of. So, um, he's pretty much done it all in AW, uh, at this point.

55:38 At this point. So yeah.

55:39 Coffin match King. That's his, uh, um, I mean, putting Kevin Knight on the map, I would say that's, that's still an unbelievable feat. I mean, he had a, excellent excellent world champion title run i mean the uh tv match he had with champa was out of this world like i was i mean i don't i don't want to speak for champa but i don't i feel like that might have been one of the best matches he's had in his entire career like and you know he's just still going.

56:12 Yeah i'd say probably one of his matches with gargano probably maybe exceeded that.

56:15 Just in just Based on the story, too.

56:17 Right.

56:18 But, you know, that's, you know, like I said, there's a million matches out there, but that's definitely probably up there for Champa.

56:22 Probably he would say that as well.

56:26 Derek Mitchell back in our YouTube chat. Stan Hanschen's lyric became famous because he broke up. Bruno Martino's neck in Madison Square Garden and added his lore.

56:36 I mean, we talked about JBL like probably laying in, you know, actually laying in the real clotheslines and actually making contact and hurting people. I mean, back in the day, I'm sure that was.

56:45 Much more common.

56:46 Like it's legitimate people, you know, going rogue and actually kind of getting into more physical brawls.

56:51 And, you know, laying it in real time.

56:55 Yes.

56:56 Real time in wrestler's court, maybe. Yeah.

56:59 Yeah, absolutely. I mean, it was a different time for sure. Yes, different time.

57:05 Yeah, well, next topic, I guess, JB. We had the return of Samoa Joe. Yeah.

57:12 Yeah, absolutely. Definitely glad to see Joe back. Always glad to see Joe.

57:16 I didn't catch Foley collision last Saturday, but I did see the promo, which I thought was very well done. And then he kind of kept it simple tonight as well. But obviously, you know, very, very much over with the crowd. which, you know, I don't think that's necessarily a surprise. I am kind of actually surprised, though, that Samoa Joe beat Perry tonight to qualify for the Clockwork Carnage match. You know, with all the recent promos from Perry about wanting and needing to beat former champions, I thought that, you know, now was the time that he was kind of in line for a larger push than he's received prior. You know, granted, obviously, Samoa Joe is pretty much over in France like he is in most places.

57:53 And, you know, I'm definitely okay with the result.

57:56 I think it did surprise me a little bit because I thought they would put Perry in this match and then maybe that would be part of the start of his elevation. I did also in this match just really enjoy the contrasting styles and then the underdog story that was told. Obviously, Perry being the underdog but getting his fight back spots in. I thought that worked to tell the story tonight. The crowd was real hot for this match.

58:18 I really enjoyed it. Obviously, I really enjoyed Joe. I think he made Perry look pretty good in defeat. And I'm interested to see what his part is in the Clockwork Carnage match at WrestleDream.

58:30 Yeah, Joe actually in the Clockwork Carnage match itself, JB, made total sense because I feel like he's that kind of like potential guy who could throw everything. You fear that Joe could actually win because he's just in that match and he could just like, steal a choke out from somebody, steal a pin. You want to obviously have him in that second phase of the match. So I completely make sense. And then Jack Perry losing, honestly, too, JB, that makes sense to me because I think from the story they're telling, he's going to lose to every world champion.

59:09 And I don't know if it's going to be the last champion he faces whether that be jericho or um uh hangman he's gonna he's he might be the last person he faces or he might lose to everybody but i at some point you know he he reassigned with the company he's done this kind of like I'm going to be world champion that one day. And I'm just like, Jack, I don't, I mean, I don't know about that, but I mean, there's so many people, no offense. I'd have over you at Kevin Knight, Kyle Fletcher, Jay.

59:38 White.

59:39 If he ever got together, who else am I missing here? Okada. If he ever turns baby face to Kesha, I mean like swerve again, you know, just to name a, just to name.

59:55 A few, yeah yeah mjf that's another one hangman probably eventually um again too i mean granted technically he's not allowed to but we know that's probably not going to last forever right um yeah i mean definitely i agree i just think it was a weird way to frame perry you know after we were signed with the company then because it makes him then kind of look a little bit like like a dork if he just loses to everyone and then i don't know how much you could actually get out of him after that maybe you put him back in the tag team with luchasaurus but i mean that's somewhat, you know.

1:00:23 Kind of run its course.

1:00:25 So it's just, you know, I'm not saying they had to have him in the match or anything, but just a weird way to frame him. If he's going to lose to everyone and look like a complete dweeb in the process. It's like, I feel like there's a little bit more you can get out of them than that, but you know, who's to say, maybe there's a story to be told in that.

1:00:38 But I guess we'll see.

1:00:39 Yeah.

1:00:40 Definitely.

1:00:41 Also, I'm definitely okay with having Joe in the clockwork match. You know, obviously matching him up against Perry, you didn't necessarily have to do that if you also wanted to have Perry in the match.

1:00:48 Right. But obviously that wasn't the prerogative.

1:00:50 No, I kind of feel like, remember in the C2, they were telling the story on Garcia losing every match and finally won the last match and then they didn't really follow up with it much because obviously I think there was still that period of contract stuff. I really enjoyed the heck out of that, JB, and they just didn't do anything with it. I think they're telling this losing streak story where he's going to go back to that pure, lovable... babyface and I think him losing all the time as crazy as it sounds is eventually going to endear him to the fans and get him over obviously you know he's got you know the theme that's always going to be there you know obviously him going back to wrestling with Luchasaurus once he's like if he's

1:01:35 healthy that's always an option but I think there's an opportunity to make him this like the lovable loser that like he's like man this guy tries so hard like I think he's like where fans it'll be a very slow burn and I think as the, he kind of pills away from this like bounty hunter character. I I've actually joined it. I enjoyed his promos a lot more where he's kind of doing like the paint stuff with Joe.

1:01:58 I thought that was actually very creative, kind of like Darby Allen esque in a way. So I don't know, like ultimately I think this is probably the best version of Jack Barry. You kind of want him to be that underneath baby face. Cause I think about the match he had with Omega and the pandemic, which was fantastic. And, you know, he's had these moments with like MJF, um, that I can recall. I mean, obviously like he had the world title match, but, uh, you know, Danielson, uh, which, you know, people kind of rolled their eyes on, you know, it was still good. And I still think about the, uh, bump.

1:02:35 Perry took taking the bicycle knee. It's probably like one of my favorite bumps in quite some time, but I think this is the right pathway. It's just like, you have to continue to tell this story and just, and present him. And, and, He also has, like I said, if he just, I don't want to say he just go back to like, you know, Luke Perry's kid and just how he kind of came into the company, but just like show that maturity as like a, you know, a man he's been with the company seven years and just kind of go back to the basics a little bit where, you know, be kind of like a, you know, a heartthrob. He's like one of my wife's favorites, if that makes a difference to me. Yeah.

1:03:14 Yeah, no, I mean, if there's a story in mind, absolutely. Tell the story.

1:03:17 I just hope it's well thought out and, you know, it's intended to get Perry over it. It's effective because they've had some misses in the past with Perry. Granted, you know, some of it's been on him.

1:03:27 Some of it's been on the booking. So, you know, there's blame to go around.

1:03:30 But, yeah, tell the story that you think is best.

1:03:34 You know, there's definitely more than one way to skin a cat here.

1:03:37 Yep.

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1:04:13 Derek Mitchell back in our YouTube chat is, Ooh, he says, Steven Borden is Bronny James with Garrett Borden might be Bryce James.

1:04:19 Oh man.

1:04:21 It's the worst thing in the world, I guess.

1:04:24 So, um, I mean, there's been, uh, you know, offsprings of famous wrestlers have definitely not worked out. So.

1:04:32 Yeah. I don't think the expectations for the, for the boards are necessarily super high either. I mean, if they're just a kind of a functioning kind of cool tag team, that's, you know, connected to sting and darby that's that's fine that there can be a place for that so.

1:04:45 Yeah and i think i even mentioned it on one of the last shows i did with wade jb like i don't mind i don't really mind aw just trying it like obviously like it's you know you have to have the discussion is is what their commitment to spend like all this television time on it but like you know he's 34 years old like you want it the aw doesn't really have a traditional like you know uh development system so why you know try it like you never know like sometimes you gotta throw like throw folks out there and see what happens and what can like kind of relate um you know wade and i always talk about you know last couple years jb how it's been so important for the development of like the men's division and you know you know obviously want to see

1:05:33 a little bit more from the women's side but like having these guys like kevin knight kyle fletcher osprey you know, be kind of like the younger faces of like your company, because, you know, God bless it, you know, 40 to 45 is the new 25. And you want to have these faces of your company, especially as you're moving into a new TV deal. I think that's so important to have, like, not that Omega, Jericho and Page and others in the box are aren't important to have on like, kind of like your forefront posters for like, the upcoming like, you know, big showcases uh skydance does and everything like that jb but like if you're going to continue to grow your product you gotta have these younger guys coming up and

1:06:20 that's why you know i'm such a believer in kevin knight and uh you know fletcher's right there giving australia the scrap now it's he makes total sense and then again nick wayne i That's another guy. Good shout.

1:06:34 He's got a ways to go, but he's only 20.

1:06:36 Oh, for sure.

1:06:37 He's got plenty of time.

1:06:38 He's a baby. And then you still have MJF who is still in his prime and can still be that great foil to whoever else they want to build up next. I think it's so important that you continue to develop these guys just because you don't want to– rely on these guys that are 45 50 almost damn near and they're just kind of just gradually breaking down and they you know it's um obviously the lore and uh folks being not everybody is gonna have like the uh the lore and pop of like a samoa joe and cope that stuff doesn't grow on trees.

1:07:15 Yeah, absolutely.

1:07:16 And that's, you know, after the results of a legendary career kind of coming to its culmination at this point as well. So obviously that doesn't happen overnight. That happens after a multi-decade career typically. So, yeah, and that, you know, that pays off in its own right.

1:07:29 But yeah, absolutely.

1:07:30 It's important to build up the young, you know, make investments in the young people. Like they're not all going to be hits. I don't think Hook was, and I don't think I'll ever get to that point, for example, even though he was a bit of a flash in the pan. You can blame that on AEW, but I also think he's just kind of missing a lot of intangibles himself. So, you know, that's just one example of a miss. But they also didn't go full bore on him either.

1:07:53 The entrance, the different kind of theme song that he had wasn't a fan. I don't think that.

1:08:01 Yeah, it didn't fit his character.

1:08:03 It was kind of weird.

1:08:04 I like the hook signal. I think there was something there. Hook and Samoa Joe, I... I love that match.

1:08:13 I think they should have probably just done more than that rather than the ops. I think they probably just stuck to that tag team. Honestly, that would have done wonders in getting, I mean, Hook and Samoito tag team. I think they should have just stuck with that for a while. Yeah, but Hook and Joe match, that did pretty good ratings if I recall correctly as well.

1:08:27 So, yeah.

1:08:29 Let's see. Back to our YouTube chats. RooDog says, Steve is hot. Deal with it. Responding to Derek Mitchell.

1:08:36 I guess I didn't know that RooDog's friends called him Steve.

1:08:38 Steve.

1:08:39 They must be buddies.

1:08:40 Steve. Derek Mitchell says, I thought the Derby World title run, in my opinion, was one of the highlights of AEW this year. Yeah, I mean, as. People were kind of like, Oh my God, uh, concerned about this, the not hoppity but like, you know, kind of like the short title reign Darby had, um, I think it was, it went as great as it could have been, especially if you think about like how well the hair match stipulation went over, like, uh, you know, I, I was honestly surprised on how well that was built and how, how people were so into that. And, yeah but you go through all the derby match i'm gonna i'm trying to think of all the title matches i mean obviously like one that immediately sticks out with me

1:09:27 is uh you know rustin power uh packet the uh golf collision golf collision.

1:09:33 Jb they mentioned that last week actually you know derby told that story kind of um in his uh in his interview so that was cool and they showed it in the uh the video the remembrance committee package at the end as well which is just cool Right.

1:09:44 Yeah.

1:09:45 So that there was obviously, we talked about Champa.

1:09:46 Yeah. I'm trying to think there's, there's several along the way. Can't even think of them all right now, but there was obviously quite a, quite a few. So.

1:09:56 Yeah. I was trying to, did he have a, no, he recently wrestled Mark Davis. Oh God. I'm trying to even think.

1:10:02 People from the callous family or something, but yeah.

1:10:06 Yeah. I was like, no, he didn't wrestle Roosh. Cause he wrestled Roosh before. He was world champion. I'm trying to even think. Sammy. Oh, Sammy Guevara.

1:10:13 Yeah, that was kind of random.

1:10:17 Yeah, over delivery. Over delivery. I didn't mind that at all. I'm trying to think of how there have been other people. Oh, God. Did he wrestle? I can't even remember if he wrestled Andrade for the title.

1:10:31 Don't think he did, but it's possible.

1:10:33 Yeah, there's just, you know, because a lot of people are like on both Dynamite and Collision back to back.

1:10:38 So it's hard to just keep track of them all in that short of a period of time.

1:10:40 Right. Let's see. Derek Mitchell back in our YouTube chat responding to Rude Dog. Steven is a good looking guy in a different era. He would have been approached by a female wrestler. But since a Me Too movement, not many male and female be attracted to each other.

1:10:59 Yeah, I just think in general he's probably just attractive.

1:11:01 I mean, I don't think he's hurting for attention just in the general sense of people he meets.

1:11:07 In day-to-day life. I would say the fact that AEW is potentially getting a wrestler that's going viral, I would say that's probably not necessarily a bad thing for them.

1:11:20 Yeah. And it's not the first time it's happened, but it's never a bad thing. Like Wade says, you don't want to base your entire promotion on the adrenaline rush or the– he calls it the ephemeral rush of social media likes. But if it happens, by chance it happens too.

1:11:37 It's not a bad thing.

1:11:38 Yeah. They obviously chose to lean into it. Rudog mentioned bring back Marco Stunt in the YouTube chat. You know, I mean I like them as a group, so– If he ever wants to have a one-off.

1:11:53 He has a problem with Marco Stunt.

1:11:54 I mean, he's a bit of a, I guess you'd say of a side act, definitely a lower card.

1:11:57 Guy, but I mean, there's a, there was a place for him, you know, they could definitely find a place for him if they decided to do so.

1:12:03 Hey, the, when he came back for the cameo at collision against Jack barriers, when he was TNT champion, that was, that's good stuff. I like that in a lot. I always remember Marco Stunt getting tossed like a football and, by lance archer in the pandemic that's great yeah.

1:12:22 No obviously that's i mean that's what he's going to be used for is taking those you know you know we talk about barbie derby bumps but he's even smaller than dark piece so thus he will go farther than derby when yeah when tossed outside the rain.

1:12:33 Yes uh derek mitchell back in our chat let me be clear it's not meant to as a bad thing it's more difference between steven and garrett i've been watching wrestling for almost 40 years and uh there are more misses than hits.

1:12:45 Yeah.

1:12:45 Yeah, absolutely. Uh, Derek and like, obviously like, that's why I like to go to these shows. Like I, just because like, I feel like you can kind of see different things. Like when you're watching live that maybe you could just not see on a YouTube. I like to watch like people's like footwork facials, like Like, sometimes, you know, if you're watching, like, on a stream on somebody's platform, it can be laggy a little bit. Like, I don't want to say, like, you know, it's kind of form of, like, you're almost kind of scouting in a sense. You're actually seeing these guys live. And also, it's kind of, you know, for me, it's always been fun to kind of seeing these guys and gals, like, from the ground up. JB,

1:13:30 I think it's a... share this with folks, like go to indie shows, because I think it's so cool that I've, I've gotten to see people like my world high on Kevin Knight at these indie shows in Austin, Texas. And now they're like wrestling professionally, like weekly on AEW. I think that's so cool, um, to do, but yeah, I just, I, I like kind of going to shows and, Really trying to analyze and give feedback to you guys that may not have time. Because like you said, Derek, there's only 24 hours a day. And if I could provide some type of observation that KH Mats isn't going to offer by someone's improvement on how they sell, how a punch looks, I'm always for that. Yeah.

1:14:16 And, you know, like Wade says this all the time, you know, I think one of the most enjoyable parts of wrestling is being part of a wrestler's journey. Whether you start in the independent scenes or you start with the wrestler when they start on the national scenes where you're paying more attention. I mean, the journey is what really kind of hooks a lot of people in. And, you know, you get a joy in kind of being a part of that journey, that process. I mean, that's, you know, in wrestling, but in life in general. no, you're not compared to go sing like an indie band.

1:14:39 Not all of them are going to make it to the mainstream main stage, but sometimes you get one or two that do. And you can say you were there and like the small, you know, bingo hall where they were playing or what have you.

1:14:47 So, yeah.

1:14:48 Mostly outside for, for my, uh, uh, appearances. Oh, Derek Mitchell and our YouTube chat for our audio list is helping us out.

1:14:56 JB.

1:14:58 I'm so like MJF to cash to Sammy Guevara, Mike Bailey, uh, uh pack r.i.p you know rest in power kevin knight brody king brody king was a.

1:15:07 Good one i almost like kevin knight too i was pretty sure it was was kevin knight but yeah.

1:15:11 Uh to catch that oh my god that was oh there was a trying to think of the crazy spot it was like an avalanche brain buster so it was it was something just nutty um that that was a good call but yeah no gavara at the time that was that was an over delivery that was a fun plunder match on collision and obviously like because you don't necessarily get a lot of world title matches on collision anyway jb so i was like very yeah.

1:15:40 I think pack was on collision as well if i were.

1:15:42 Yeah pack was on collision as well uh golf man uh did you watch that show in full like i think.

1:15:48 That's i watched i watched that whole episode.

1:15:49 Aesthetically that i think it's going to be my favorite show of the year.

1:15:54 Yeah.

1:15:54 So cool.

1:15:55 I love new venues. I also really liked the beach break they did this year.

1:15:58 I thought it was, Oh yeah, that was excellent as well. But I like different doing different types of venues. That's awesome.

1:16:03 Oh, speaking of that, did you see they're doing a Jericho cruise for collision?

1:16:07 Yeah.

1:16:08 December, one of the weekends in December. So yeah, I enjoyed it when they did it the first time.

1:16:13 It was awesome.

1:16:14 It was great.

1:16:15 Yeah.

1:16:15 You had kind of like the, you know, the Britt Baker kind of like, start to her hero uh heel run you've got like the gif of tony shivani in the wind like with his uh hawaiian shirts uh you've got uh eyepatch moxley running around uh that's when people started really saying seeing in judas for the first time yeah that was uh from what i gather jb the reason they've not gone back to it because i think i think From what I think production-wise, it was such a huge pain in the butt. I'm not an engineer or production person, but from everybody I talked to, I think that was such an undertaking. They never want to do it again.

1:17:00 I imagine Collision is going to be pre-taped for that case, though. So maybe they'll have a couple of days to kind of work on that, too. It doesn't have to be live.

1:17:08 Well, right. And I think from what I understand, they're going to film it once they dock.

1:17:14 That makes sense like they'll be essentially be they'll be on the boat but they'll be you know easily lands easily accessible right.

1:17:21 Yeah because like once they did the jericho cruise i was like hey maybe this would actually be kind of cool to go to yeah never consider it yeah for sure i have you ever been i've been on a cruise i've not.

1:17:34 Done i've actually never been on a cruise no i mean i've been to like resorts and seen a lot of cruises like come and dock and stuff like that but i've never been i'm not a big like I feel like I get pretty seasick. I have to put like those things under my ears if I did that. But yeah, I've seen a lot of cruises in person, like traveling on vacations and stuff like that, but I've never been on one myself.

1:17:53 So yeah.

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1:18:48 Let's see. Let's go through. the show here. Deathriders versus Davison Doyle. The rare, well, I would say, rare sub-11-minute match from Moxley. You know, him and Gabe... I was still very weird to see Gabe Cater as a baby face that I know this is going to be a weird kind of thing, uh, ever. And I guess we're kind of in this portion of the show, JB. Um, what, what do you, what do you do with the death riders at this point? I really don't know. Um, obviously like there was, it seemed like on the surface they were doing them versus, um, ospreys group for uh blood guts but uh obviously can't really i you can't really.

1:19:37 Do that now um yeah that's i mean that's what i was thinking of but that's what i actually put in my notes because i was just thinking like where you kind of go from here but yeah so like you just mentioned i thought they were gonna go with with the ospreys united empire and the death riders at blood and guts but now i wonder obviously i think they're just gonna go full blow baby face full blown baby face with the death riders now where it's it's not even ambiguous it's pretty clear I think Tony Khan is going to pivot to pure babyface Death Riders versus the Don Callis family, kind of after what we saw tonight at Blood & Guts, and that's going to be the Blood & Guts matchup.

1:20:09 Yeah. I heard a– I'm a listener of the What Culture podcast, and they had suggested rather than kind of doing like the goobers in the Don Callis family group, You do like a team of all the heavies, which would be a good kind of like balance.

1:20:32 They kind of did it on last week's Memorial episode. It was all the heavy hitters in the main event.

1:20:37 Right.

1:20:38 So you could have the Deathriders still have the disadvantage of like being smaller and still win because you list all the heavies. Okay, so you go Cage, you go Archer. uh you go davis and doyle wardlow like yeah there's your five versus the death riders i mean particularly if they aren't going to you know uh from what i have heard jb i think they're going to only do one i don't think they're doing two this year which i don't need the traditional like I'm all for equality, but I don't.

1:21:11 I'm also okay if they do it separate times. It doesn't have to be done all in the same episode.

1:21:14 Yeah. I understand. It's like one of their biggest draws of the year. And with the Nielsen's writing, how up is down, left is right. Blue is red. Green is purple. Sometimes like, I understand that's like their biggest draw of the year traditionally, but like, you don't have to just do it because it's hell, hell in the cell season.

1:21:32 I mean, if you wanted to kind of split it up a little bit, that's fine. I mean, If, uh, you know, booking permits, I would love the women to main event blood and guts on a pay-per-view. I think that'd be great, but I, I just, I don't, if you're going to do it, I think you just do the death riders for some cows family. And then I think it would be, uh, you know, perfectly fine just to do it if you're going to just do it. And, um, you know, I know a lot of people give Don Callis family like grief, but I mean, I'm, I think this is why you have, like, I mean, obviously you don't have factions of 24 people at a time, but I think in this state, based on kind of like where the company's at and how they've been able to

1:22:13 kind of fill this role of just, you know, there's not really like a good direction for some groups right now. Like, can we just fight like the, the traditional heels where you don't have to force the fake heat? Yeah. And you don't like, you don't even, and Kyle and our, Kyle Fletcher and Kevin Knight are doing their own thing.

1:22:32 Okada has been doing his own thing. So they can be completely separate from that, which is complete. I don't want Okada and blood and guts again, honestly. So I'm okay with that as well. I, that's probably the best combination of that. And you could just have Moxley just, you know, uh, lead this group. I would love if there was maybe a chance to flip a big for, I don't know what woman could have Don Fallis, Don Callis family add with, that could go against Marina. Give me a word.

1:23:02 So this is not a woman that's currently on the roster, but it's all, but could be confirmed that Mara Sade, who's been in NXT, she's actually dated, currently dating Kevin. And they don't have to make that part of the story, but they could add her into the family with, you know, obviously because her.

1:23:17 Night would have this certain amount of people chemistry. So I could see that working.

1:23:22 Could I just say Megan Bain because she's a boss?

1:23:25 Yeah, absolutely.

1:23:26 We're sticking with boss concept, boss woman and boss man.

1:23:30 And I think, you know, the Biden dominion has kind of run its course now. So both those acts are going to go singles. I think they can both be successful singles acts. So I think that could work as well.

1:23:38 Yeah.

1:23:39 I like that.

1:23:39 And yeah, I mean, it's tough. You know, you heard the reaction Moxley got tonight. He, he's going to just get those reactions everywhere, man. And, you know, I, I, I've, yearn for this i thought as of last year when you won the continental title jb we were finally getting the moxley baby face just because i just everybody wants it and obviously with the circumstance it just makes the most sense and he's got he's got to just lean into it i know he's been doing this we we have the death i personally and wayne have kind of poked fun at the death rider stuff how convoluted it's been sometimes moxley's just like you know it's era he wants to work all the time which is great but it's just like you know a lot of people have

1:24:25 had kind of like death rider fatigue for a very long time but i just think a lot of people are going to give this group and like everything has been going on grace pretty much like for a while and it just it just makes sense because everybody loves john mox i love john moxley he's one of my favorites like i just i want to cheer for the guy there's so much Absolutely.

1:24:47 You know, I was ready for the Death Riders to kind of break up and disband after all in 2025, actually, after Hangman beat Mox. But I'm ultimately glad they actually ended up staying together in the sense that, and I know some people actually disagree about this, but I thought it really added to the Osprey story going into Wembley and that culminating this year, which was a big moment for Osprey. Arguably, AW's biggest show of all times. Well, it was, I think, in terms of pay-per-view buys, not necessarily in attendance, but, you know, that's up for debate.

1:25:14 But it's certainly one of their biggest shows of all time.

1:25:17 So I thought it really added to that story.

1:25:19 I'm glad they stayed together and now they're going to actually get a proper, proper baby face run.

1:25:23 So I think there's, you know.

1:25:25 Sometimes like I talk about happy accidents, these are things that maybe shouldn't have happened, but that happened. And then things happen along the way that, that, you know, ultimately create what it, what, what, you know, what.

1:25:34 They're going to be.

1:25:35 And I think there's going to be some value in the death riders getting a pure baby face run as we move forward.

1:25:39 So, yeah, I agree. And maybe there's this potential of maybe the Don Callis family, uh, take out a member of the death riders and then maybe we get a, uh, debuting, uh, uh, former Seamus or, or, uh, Dragunov is the other.

1:25:58 I actually think you're right. It's probably gonna be more likely Seamus just because he's connected obviously with Claudio, um, from the WWE days as the bar.

1:26:04 And I actually think Dragunov fits better in the United empire. So I think same.

1:26:08 Yeah, absolutely. I think that would be, uh, that, that, that's, uh, I had Dragunov kind of earmarked for Darby as well. If you were going to just strap up a guy day one, him and Darby would be incredible.

1:26:23 Yeah, and Dragunov doesn't necessarily have to be in a stable either. He could just start just by himself. Him versus Darby could definitely work also.

1:26:30 I kind of just want to see what he looks like. I mean, JB, I've seen the guy. He did so much with Trick Williams.

1:26:39 I was at.

1:26:41 The match he had at great American bash with trick Williams and like, God, the guy is so good. And they kind of just let him. And, you know, he, he kind of kept smack down a float when they were kind of just drifting in that three hour muck. So like, I want to see what this guy has because you don't really see him talk that much. I wonder if the stigma with Ricochet, what was the biggest thing?

1:27:10 People were like, oh, what a goober. He can't talk. He doesn't know how to cut a promo. My God, this guy has been such a good talker. I think he's a very good promo. We just didn't hear him talk at all. So I wonder if dragon offices introduced to this new ecosystem. I don't, I want to see like, obviously, you know, if he's going to be an ass kicker, that's great. Like we already know that, but like, I, not everybody needs to be the hard, tough, like everybody can add, like automatically be that right. Especially if you're a new guy coming into the company, you've got to be like, like, you know, people are going to protect you, you want to be over, blah, blah, blah. But, like, I want to see depth to what this Ilya Dragunov

1:27:56 character could be like. Yeah.

1:28:00 No, I mean, Dragunov, obviously, against opposite, you know, Walter Gunter is one of my favorite matches in recent years, for sure.

1:28:06 Yes, same.

1:28:07 Yeah.

1:28:08 And that story was told throughout NXT, NXT UK, NXT, and to a certain extent, I think even the WWE main roster.

1:28:16 But I was kind of out of it.

1:28:17 I was out of watching regularly.

1:28:19 By that point. But yeah, I definitely enjoy his style.

1:28:21 I think it's actually a good contrast to a typical AEW style in the sense that he can move well, but he's not a high flyer. He's definitely a hard hitter. He can be technical too. So I think that that fits.

1:28:33 But he also, yeah, he is unique.

1:28:34 He's a little weird I don't want to describe him as technical because I feel like he's a little bit more serious, but he's definitely unique in the way he speaks.

1:28:41 Yeah.

1:28:43 Sometimes different is good.

1:28:44 Yeah, for sure.

1:28:46 It definitely gets your attention, but it's not like goofy either.

1:28:50 There's an earnestness about it.

1:28:53 Absolutely. I just think there's so much potential. Like what does him and Orange Cassidy look like?

1:28:58 Yeah.

1:28:59 Him and Samoa Joe. Him and Ospreay would obviously be electric.

1:29:04 I can see him and Samoa Joe being like him versus Gunter or Walter.

1:29:07 Oh, my God. Yes, that sounds great. Him and Swerve. Like, just him and Hangman? Oh, my God. Just, like, give me all the match graphics for that. That sounds great. But, yeah, obviously, like, the story of the match, they just– and Gabe and Moxley just beat the hell out of each other. It was kind of just almost kind of like a lampshade, uh, you know, on a fixture. This was obviously like, uh, you know, a plot point just to basically just build the match between Moxley and Davis, uh, for Russell dream, which is fine because like, you know, Russell dream, like, I don't think that I, I don't know. Like nobody's going to really give grief for Russell dream as like a whole, like it, it's probably not going to do

1:29:52 necessarily well, but like, I mean, at this point, who really cares just with everything going on as you know, it, so I think it's fine. I think actually Mark Moxley and Davis on the night that that will rock. That's kind of more my jam. I think they would just beat the hell out of each other for 15 minutes and it'll be great. Yeah.

1:30:08 Davis has gained a lot of credibility in this room with the Dallas family. So, you know, I think make the matches Moxley makes sense. I don't expect him to win, but I do expect it to be obviously a hard hitting match. So that's, you know, it's definitely a different style too, which is good for AEW type pay-per-views. And yeah, obviously I like Davidson Doyle as a team. I think they have potential as well.

1:30:29 I wouldn't, I wouldn't. I could see the belts being on them at some point, honestly.

1:30:34 I think there, there was a push. You know, I was at the dynamite Doyle, like Torres bicep. It was just like, God, man, because they were building these guys up. And I think them and FDR were, they were cooking something. And unfortunately, you know, doro got hurt which is super unfortunate um i hope they can go back to that uh joseph you know um i wasn't you know as the the tna guy of this uh you know recording jb i wasn't like obviously i saw bits and pieces of jake something i was not like uh you know a a daily viewer but people spoke highly of him and he's obviously like a big guy and you know uh i i think there's potential you you see what like a guy like Davis is, you know, being rewarded for, yeah.

1:31:23 I mean, it's not necessarily fun getting pinned a lot, but if you're consistently, uh, you know, doing what you're supposed to, Tony Khan is the guy who's like, Hey, you've been busting your ass last couple of months. We're going to feature you and make you a singles champion, put you all in these, uh, you know, featured matches and main events and stuff like that. So there's potential for Doyle to kind of follow that pathway. Yeah.

1:31:46 Yeah, no, for sure. Yeah, I think they have good chemistry together. They have a good look and they kind of look similar-ish, but not exactly the same. You can tell the difference. But yeah, I think they should be a good tag team. You know, they tried to with the Callis family, they tried to do that with the Burger Hawk machines or whatever with Brian Cage and Lance Archer too. So they've tried the Haas tag team in the Callis family a few times now. So hopefully this iteration will, you know, we'll get some good matches out of it.

1:32:14 I hope so.

1:32:16 Derek Mitchell back in our YouTube chat for audio listeners. Uh, I think going forward with the sentiment pack, uh, passing, it's hard to see that, uh, them as heels, which Derek is referencing as a death riders. Absolutely agree. Uh, let's see. Derek Mitchell back in our chat. Uh, this isn't the same thing pack pass, but, uh, Derek Mitchell references, uh, Magnum TA had his car accident. Uh, Nikita Kloff, uh, turned baby face teaming with dusty roads and honors, uh, great opponent uh magnum so uh tdr will be faces um yeah yep yep the death riders yeah absolutely horse jay in the chat uh says megan main rules yeah megan main does roll uh i think she's very very good um Derek Mitchell back in our YouTube chat says,

1:33:04 Davis and Doyle, a great physical tag team. Would have felt right at home during the Bill Watts Mid-South early 1990s All-Japan Wrestling Days.

1:33:11 Yeah, absolutely. I think they fit in any era, too. Oh, yeah.

1:33:15 Davis and Doyle. Kind of feels like a law firm, right? Yeah. It does. It does.

1:33:20 It's got a ring to it, for sure.

1:33:21 Yes. D & D.

1:33:24 I'm Chris Maitland.

1:33:25 I'm Justin McClellan.

1:33:27 We host Wrestling Coast to Coast, a podcast of independent wrestling.

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1:33:36 Learn about the hot underground stars and the future main eventers before anyone else. You can reach us at TorchCoastToCoast at gmail.com and me on Blue Sky at Mind of Maitland.

1:33:46 You can reach me at Blue Sky at Justin McClelland.

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1:34:02 Um, let's see what else. Oh yeah. Uh, I think, Oh, a couple more matches to touch base on. And we kind of just, uh, talk a little bit on Russell dream JB and get out of here for the night. Uh, Kofi and, uh, Bandito. This was a Tony Khan match graphic special. Uh, I want to, I want you to think I should have, this should have been the question of the show. And I feel so silly thinking about it now, guys, uh, in our YouTube chat and audio listeners, uh, This is one of the most random match graphics I can think of in a long time, JB. One that will always stick out to me. Tony Khan will drop those random match graphics on a Tuesday. It's like, huh?

1:34:47 He's wrestling him? She's wrestling her? I think about CM Punk versus Penta. The most random match I could ever think of, JB. But Kofi versus Bandito... Not in a million years would I have had that on a prediction list for 2026.

1:35:02 Yeah, no, that makes sense. Like you said, just kind of living in different parts of wrestling for such a long time.

1:35:10 Yeah, and just, you know, I.

1:35:12 Would say somewhat similar styles to a certain extent. And, you know, it was obviously a very good match tonight as well. But yeah, no, it's really cool to see these types of matchups. And it makes sense, obviously, with the trio teams feeding against each other.

1:35:27 Very cool. For sure. Yeah.

1:35:29 No, I enjoyed the match.

1:35:30 One aspect is I'm not a big fan of the ROH title being defended on AEW television, but at this point there's so many titles.

1:35:36 I feel as though, you know, I can't.

1:35:38 Pick my battles because, you know, this match made sense to have just because, you know, based on the feud between the teams. And I was surprised that they were actually continuing on with the Swerve new level and Hangman Bernita feud until I saw later in the night that they made a two out of three falls match for the trio's title at WrestleDream. So, you know, I guess that made sense. But I do expect that they will pivot to swerve a new level versus the elite after WrestleDream sooner rather than later as well.

1:36:04 I agree.

1:36:06 Yeah, I think the first few years, Tony Khan has kind of learned, you know, things happen. People get mad and don't want to work at places sometimes. Sometimes injuries happen. These dream matches, you can't sit on them forever. So you got to deliver them sooner than later. Um, and I, I didn't mention this in my review, uh, of collision this past week when I watched a Kofi, Lima, or Doherty, um, JB, I think the, the thing that's gotten, I've enjoyed mostly from this new level kind of debut is they are not just sitting on their laurels just because I think there's been so many guys kind of roll in. I mean, at the pile on, I mean, you look at a guy like Bruce who's just like, didn't really want to

1:36:53 are malachi black you know guys who didn't really want to lose get over these guys man um they've got their working boots on because uh you go back and i think i believe this was the first time kofi had wrestled a singles match in almost like a year um when he wrestled uh lee moriarty last saturday jb i think his last match singles match for his you know, a year or something like that, I'd had to go back and actually look, I shouldn't know off the top of my head. I wrote about it probably, but it was something just wild. And, you know, the, these matches Woods are, I'm sorry, Austin Creed and Kofi have been in, I've just been, you know, like I had, like, I had a feeling this was going to go over good,

1:37:38 especially when you, you do the rollout and all in, they've got the new level song and, which completely makes sense on the night. I mean, obviously the crowd went crazy. You know, everybody's just buzzing. Like I, you know, in kind of like the media space, JB for the press conference, I don't think, I mean, obviously people were supposed to like be professional, but I just, I don't think I've ever seen like guys feel energy in a room like these two have. And I just think, not only for morale, people adeer Kofi so much and Creed for what they've done, but they are guys that want to work. They're going to do the indies. And I know people might be like, why would Kofi want to wrestle for the Ring of

1:38:29 Honor world title? i say why not like it's kind of weird but like could you imagine if kofi had won the world title like he he would have been i think i heard a stat it's like him and jericho uh it's like jericho and joe and maybe one other person i've like they would have been the only people to win like world titles and ROH and like WWE at the same time, it was something, it was something to that extent. So I just admire them. Just not just like, uh, leaning into their cache and understanding like, Hey, we're actually going to as corn balls. It sounds we're the best wrestle. We have to deliver, um, at a certain level or it's just not going to work. And, you know, Not that, you know, five-star ratings mean anything anymore, Jay,

1:39:19 because usually, you know, it's like Oprah says, sometimes everybody gets a five-star rating, but like, you know, Dave Meltzer gave them a five-star rating at the Trios match, and I think that was one of the better Trios matches AEW has ever done. They continued Heat and Space, Swerve and Hangman still have. Like that reaction tonight when they interacted and Hangman, you know, Swerve walked down and then hangman walked down it was like holy crap like we've really got something here um and i do want to acknowledge the standing one-legged stomp from kofi kind of made me say uh I don't know if you audibly make noises if you're making– or just like, holy– you do like, holy crap, what did he do as you're making notes, JB?

1:40:05 But that honestly took me– I was giving Kofi compliments for just randomly doing a second rope moonsault on Saturday. When I was seeing him do this, I was like, holy crap, where did that come from?

1:40:16 Yeah, no, absolutely.

1:40:18 But he's still got– the new level in general still have it. You know, the pairing with Swerve has been interesting, but it's worked, I think, which I wasn't 100% sure that was the best way to bring them about, but I'm a lot more confident in that now. And, you know, part of that kind of just adding on is that, you know, I'm kind of curious to see now where we end up with Swerve and Hangman, with that rivalry.

1:40:40 You know, I'd imagine another singles match has to be somewhere on the horizon with them.

1:40:43 I'm just kind of curious.

1:40:45 You know, when Swerve and the new level kind of runs its course, because I imagine, you know, new level kind of run around virtually becoming more just a tag team division. And then kind of when we get Swerve and Hangman and how that will look, how they'll set that up, you know, the next couple of months. Yeah.

1:41:01 Cause obviously like, again, I'm still really surprised. Like I think that Trios matches, that Trios match, like reignited the heat between them both. And it's like, now it's like oh my god these fans are gonna just be on the hook for the next few months because especially if you're going to do swerve uh and the new level versus the elite and then you can still kind of involve hangman uh you know because obviously getting involved with the elite and then maybe somehow hangman costs the uh you know the elite the mat or you know potential titles Um, and then obviously you get involved with, uh, Kofi and Austin Creed versus the Bucks for the tag titles at some point, uh, that's an opportunity. So, um, yeah, no, I'm,

1:41:49 I'm really looking forward to it. I think the rollout has been great. Um, and I think, you know, moving forward, AEW should still like, like sign still, I'm open to the idea of like, I would say the last few signings that I was like, man, do you really need this person? Like I, it's kind of worked out immediately.

1:42:10 And I think that's like one of my favorite things when I, I kind of just like, eh, I don't know. And then like that person like shuts me up immediately. I'm just like, Oh, I'm an idiot. I don't know what I'm talking about. Like, um, I'm not back there. I don't know. Um, like I was very skeptical of the rascal signing. They've been in great addition. Um, you know, uh, I'm trying to think of recent ones that I were just like, Oh, okay. That they've actually worked out really great. Um, trying to think, sorry guys it's been late at night i'm trying to think but like the rascals are obviously like you know doro uh there's another one like i would say very very functional like you know he's not hurting anything he's been a functional piece um you know

1:42:51 the the the war dog the dogs and tbd the dogs i i feel like there's.

1:42:58 I don't like that's sort of the way they've been booked either um yeah perfectly honest and i think uh it's stymied them a little bit granted there's still quite a bit of time and such a loaded roster that it's hard to find a place for everyone but you know, I'm not giving up on them yet, but yeah, it hasn't.

1:43:10 Been the greatest start for them.

1:43:12 Yeah.

1:43:12 And I agree.

1:43:13 I see a lot in the rascals. I hope they get a push in the future. I know that they've taken a lot of losses, which is kind of something to be expected just because the tag team division is so loaded, but I hope they get their chance at some of the veteran teams to establish themselves in the future as well.

1:43:26 Yeah. Yeah. I agree. Marlon Reed. I've got a very high Marlon Reed. Yeah.

1:43:33 I can see him as a singles act at some point for sure.

1:43:36 Yeah. See, and that was another TNA guy. didn't i wasn't familiar with his game he's great he's like a guy he's kind of like a sneaky c2 person yeah.

1:43:46 You know trey mcgill was actually the you know kind of essentially the leader of the rascals but i always saw more in my regret oh yeah i'm being honest so.

1:43:56 Derek mitchell back in our youtube chat i was interested to see a first match between kofi and bandito kofi earned uh rh world titles uh simply by beating lee moriarty i'd prefer them being part uh uh of qualifying for the wrestle dream i mean i think for what the story they're telling derrick uh i think it makes sense for now but.

1:44:15 I don't think you're not going to have kofi in that match because the trios match right right that night so i mean you would already kind of know i guess you could have not announced that before the match but um you know kind of tip your hand and then it'd have to be bandito and i don't think he'd really fit in this this match either so i just don't think it would really really worked but great i guess you could argue they could have had this match at some point later after wrestle dream But I think it kind of worked for tonight.

1:44:39 Yeah. Derek Mitchell back in our YouTube chat. The new level formally in a new day has given so much of the business for the last 15 years, so it's great to see them enjoy themselves in AEW. They feel fresh and rejuvenated. Yep. Yep. 100%. Boris J. asks, how can Swerve and Hangman top what they've done previously or murder match? Good question. I don't know.

1:44:59 Murderhawk monster match. Yes, pretty much.

1:45:03 Derek Mitchell asking the right questions in the YouTube chat. Motorcycling machine guns made a few comparisons and hopefully they will get back on track. Odd. I don't know where they're at. They had the cameo and collision. And I, again, usually when things like that happen, you don't want to speculate.

1:45:22 I would just say, I hope everything's well with them both. Like physically, no one's ill or, you know, physically, everybody's physically fit. You don't know. You wouldn't think they were just, they were in that big, huge angle at all in.

1:45:34 Yeah, I heard a rumor that they had actually requested to start after September, but because of the Detroit event that Tony kind of overruled that and wanted them to at least come out of it. And then, obviously, they just kind of wanted that moment, I think, at Wembley with all the teams kind of lined up and facing each other. So I think they're definitely going to get it sooner rather than later, but I think they had things they kind of.

1:45:54 Wanted to finish up until after September.

1:45:56 I don't know.

1:45:58 I just saw that somewhere.

1:45:59 Interesting.

1:46:00 Okay, good. That makes a lot more sense because it's like, that's a big huge plot hole that they dropped from all in um you know i uh you know i i haven't been really a big motor city machine guns guy jb i'll be honest i mean you probably have seen more than them in tna um i you know they had kind of like the the rollout and smackdown they were the champs and existed that was pretty much it um you know i I think there's something there.

1:46:31 I mean, obviously they had a good rollout in Detroit. I enjoyed their kind of like debut show. I want, I, you know, I want to see a little bit more of what, what do you, what do you got character wise? Yeah. Yeah.

1:46:41 I like, I like machine guns.

1:46:44 Yeah.

1:46:45 I mean, I think there's a ceiling to them for sure. And they're kind of at the latter stages of the career. I think they can have some.

1:46:48 Great matches with some of these veteran teams. I think that's probably what they're here for.

1:46:53 You know, I don't think, I don't think they're going to, you know, here for, for the longterm per se, I mean, that's relative, but you know, they're on the older side to a certain extent.

1:47:01 Yeah.

1:47:02 I actually used to see Alex, Alex Shelley at a gym I used to go to, he used to go to the same gym every now and then.

1:47:07 Yeah.

1:47:08 Pretty quiet dude, but you know, she's like, seems like a nice guy. So yeah, no, I like the team. You know, we'll see how they go, you know, not the most dynamic personality or the mic necessarily, but you know, where they get it over is typically in the ring. And I can see them gelling really well with the other teams in the division. So I'm excited about that.

1:47:26 Obviously a little biased too, just because.

1:47:29 The whole Detroit thing. Yeah.

1:47:31 Yeah.

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1:48:18 Last but not least, and we'll run down a little bit of WrestleDream and call it a night, JB, Queen Amanata versus Mercedes Monet. Obviously, they've been building up Queen the last few weeks when he matches on Collision, and they set up the match, you know, obviously last Saturday, and... uminata getting kind of like the hometown run of rub so to speak uh you know obviously going to school and uh you know the the area uh you know match when it kind of ended abruptly it's like you know mercedes gave her a ton like i would say mercedes gave her kind of like the 90 of the match you probably wanted maybe like the finish to kind of feel a um don't get me wrong i thought mercedes bumped like a mad woman with a broken nose

1:49:14 like absolutely got like splatted several times by queen amanada just like knocked her head off so kudos to her um the i like how amanada is kind of adapting as her spot jb where she like had does like the drop kick from the chair that's a good you know um good spot like it's kind of weird amanada is kind of like in the uh chris statlander zone right now like can you uh like i i really like queen a lot jb i think i she she's stiff like i i think she's got like a unique background uh she's different like off with your head is a kick butt move i i really really hope they don't just like put her in the away zone now that she's lost the uh you know match with mercedes I, you know, there's, there's stuff there. I mean, I, I just,

1:50:11 you know, how much can a woman get over when there's only like X amount of time and, you know, they're not really doing a lot of promo stuff. Uh, you know, you want, you did when somebody, how is somebody only supposed to get over JB? If like they're occasionally on collision, a squash match or, you know, it's hard. It's, it's very hard. So I hope we get to see more, uh, Amanata going forward. Cause I thought she did great tonight.

1:50:38 Yeah, absolutely.

1:50:38 I mean, I think there's a lot of potential in her, as you mentioned. She's definitely a unique, unique background. It's something I always point to.

1:50:44 You know, I hope that they give the match to her tonight, likely because of her connection with France.

1:50:47 Yeah, absolutely.

1:50:48 It made sense, obviously, but I hope that's not the only reason. I don't think it is. I mean, they do see something in her.

1:50:53 At least it's got to give her a little bit more reps, just in matches in general, but also on the mic for sure. But like I said, she's a project for sure, but I do see potential in her. We talked about some of the earlier, some of the younger talent in the company. And definitely Mercedes was very giving to her tonight. So it seems like they have a probably a pretty good relationship behind the scenes as well.

1:51:12 Yes.

1:51:13 And I said, you kind of mentioned it, but I liked that Shivani, you know, mentioned that I'm not as one three straight AEW matches and 20 straight ROH matches.

1:51:19 Yes.

1:51:19 That was kind of the justification for her earning a title match. I think they should be both. I think both WWE and AEW should be more strict about what constitutes deserving a qualifying match.

1:51:29 Like WWE is kind of doing now with, with Money in the Bank. I think kind of having a.

1:51:34 Triple threat for every match is, I don't know, I'm not the biggest fan of that. But, you know, it's kind of beside the point. And I also think that, you know, I think obviously Mercedes is going to retain against Tecla at WrestleDream, but I'm also not certain of that. So I think, you know, because that's the case, it makes the match much more intriguing to me. I'm also very curious where they're going after because the AW Women's Division is so top-heavy right now with obviously Tecla, Mercedes, Willow.

1:51:58 And then obviously you got to imagine a, relatively shortly returning tony storm i would imagine by maybe like early 2020 obviously it's hard to speculate but 2027 ish or in that range then when she gets back in the scene you know it's a pretty top heavy division which is you know it's a good problem to have.

1:52:16 Yeah i mean honestly i i would say all things considered i think it's it's a story in itself that the women's divisions managed just kind of like fried the way without tony storm because like my god like it's just showing how important and vital she is not only to the company but the division as a whole uh i'm really looking forward to the match with the mercedes and tecla uh as we kind of segue to russell dream jb i mean i it's not but like honestly in a perfect world it's the match that has the most heat like i you know it's probably not good just to put the women on the main event just to say that did it but like why i mean why not just that that's probably that's the match that's got the most heat technically and.

1:53:09 It the clockwork carnage matches would be kind of weird.

1:53:13 I feel like to have.

1:53:14 For a main event, it's not a.

1:53:15 You know, a pure championship match.

1:53:17 Like, like we've traditionally seen granted they've had the steel multi, like the multi-man six cage man, six cage, you know, title qualifying matches, the main event this year as well with I think it was Briscoe's team, I think.

1:53:28 Right.

1:53:30 So that happened this year already.

1:53:32 So they, and they did that as a main event, but yeah, this doesn't feel like, you know, I'm looking forward to the match, but it seems like a match almost you'd have like on, on a, aw tv episode right it's like a special like a special episode but um and then anything else on the card i mean the bucks knight and kevin knight and uh pletra will be fun but it just it's not doesn't have the gravitas of like you obviously bucks versus cope and cage um and then yeah some of the other matches i mean yeah they're fun matches but i don't see any true main event match on the card which is like i do think mercedes tecla probably has like you said the the most momentum behind it right now um from a storytelling perspective as well Yeah.

1:54:09 I mean, obviously like people are going to roll their eyes and like, Brian, they're not going to put the women on the main event, but like, did they already say the, the, the carnage match is the main event of this show?

1:54:18 I don't, I haven't heard them specifically say grant.

1:54:21 Yeah.

1:54:21 Possibly could have missed it at some point, but.

1:54:23 I mean, obviously, you know, it's world champion and, you know, Tony is a traditionalist, but I mean, I just, as weird as the, the show, it feels like just vibe wise. Like, like you said, I wonder if almost that is better to kind of start the show. And I say this, like, let's think worst case scenario. If it's worst case scenario, it's kind of clunky. It's the start of the show.

1:54:47 And then everybody else can kind of build up from that.

1:54:51 It's like, yeah, no, I definitely think that makes the carnage match almost makes sense.

1:54:54 To open the show with in this case. Granted.

1:54:59 Yeah.

1:54:59 Like you risk a little bit because you take a lot, a lot of the higher level men's title challengers out of the rest of the show.

1:55:04 Right.

1:55:05 And there's a certain amount of risk in that, but. let's be honest, this is like probably one of the lower, going to be one of the lower tier pay-per-views of the year as far as how they're treated. It's all coming off a three-week build, which is coming off of a four-week build. So there wasn't a lot of time for it, which is fine. You're going to have those pay-per-views and you expand to the schedule that Tony Khan's not running. But yeah, I mean, I just think, like you said, it is justified by, and I don't want to say by default because it deserves more than that, but there just isn't anything super hot for the card.

1:55:32 Yeah, I mean, I think if you get Mercedes and Tecla together, and kind of a face-to-face next week uh you know i see them obviously you can't just base it on the paris reaction but i think like the biggest kind of like people were afraid of like oh my god who are we going to root for i think in the in this scenario tecla's.

1:55:55 Clearly the baby face clearly clearly tecla will get a majority they'll be treated in a pretty clear face a face heel alignment in this particular match just because i think tecla's gotten so over and They're willing to treat Mercedes like a heel when it matters.

1:56:09 So, yeah, I think it will be in alignment.

1:56:11 Yeah, and then, you know, you've got a five-match card. Like, you know, we've mentioned Mercedes-Tecla. You've got the Clark or Carnage match, which I guess we haven't really discussed. But, like, to me, it– Okay, like I really– I roll when people say this is confusing. Why would AEW do this? To me, like this is like their version of Iron Survivor to me except like they don't have the penalty box.

1:56:38 I also really like that they took the time to do that video package with kind of breaking down the rules as a concept. I think this is something they don't often do. And the fact that they explained it as a casino gauntlet kind of meets an Ironman match, I mean, I think that's a good explanation.

1:56:52 They broke it down kind of step by step. It's really, I don't know. I mean, if you can't understand that, I think that's a little bit disingenuous.

1:56:58 Now, granted, if they just kind of said this is Clockwork Carnage and then briefly mentioned it kind of in passing once, okay, that's not doing enough justice. But they've definitely broken it down, explaining it a couple times already, and I'm sure they'll do more legwork next week for that.

1:57:11 Yeah, and then they've got Collision this Saturday, which I'm sure they're going to hammer it home again. So you've got plenty of time to, you know, explain. I just like, yeah, to me, I that like I, you know, I will say I'll throw my hands up. I kind of like roll my eyes when they rolled out NXT, rolled out the Iron Survivor Challenge. And, you know, yearly now it's like the hottest match that they build. And usually it's build like, you know, great success stories. You look at someone like Kendall Gray. I mean, Trick Williams, just the name of, you know, a few people in the match. And, you know, it seems silly, but like it it. does really well on the night. And, you know, Osprey did this, um,

1:57:49 at the indie show, this is obviously his baby, his creation. So like, they're not going to go in this half ass. So, you know, there's going to be a lot of planning. I mean, you could do some great stories. Osprey could get pins a couple of times and that you've got, so you've got some TV challengers off the bat right there that you can say Osprey versus Samoa Joe, uh, Osprey versus, uh, takesha or you know however you want to go i think that's an easy kind of like platform to kind of say i mean you could even a rock a debut you could do a dragon off in this scenario if you really wanted to uh mjf could return and lose in the first section as a heel and in character and I think that's completely fine. Yeah.

1:58:31 No, cool.

1:58:32 Like you said, you could set up, you could tell a lot of stories within the match as well. That'll set up things as we go forward towards the end of the year into, into early 2027. So, you know, I think it presents that and, you know, instead of coming off a three week build and the Okada at, at, you know, Grand Slam France, it's just, you can't really build up a proper challenger, but you also want to have the champion.

1:58:50 In the show. This kind of works. I mean, this just works.

1:58:53 And granted, it's not going to be the best-selling pay-per-view of the year. It could arguably not be one of the worst-selling pay-per-views of the year. But you have to have one or two of those. It's just the reality of things when you do an expanded pay-per-view schedule.

1:59:04 Yeah. I mean, especially with the quick turnaround and circumstances.

1:59:08 Yeah, absolutely.

1:59:09 And then you've got the tag team match, Bucks versus Knight and Fletcher.

1:59:14 Yeah.

1:59:15 Moxley davis and then uh the trios match so right now you've got a five.

1:59:18 Card i'm sure the matches added for sure.

1:59:21 Yeah i mean yeah they're they've got the number one contenders for the the women's tag that they'll probably add so most i want to say most likely it'll probably end up actually being um i better uh it'll be stat and harley cameron verse uh the brawling birds only just because it seems like they're building something with the uh uh sky blue and uh julia hard versus uh divine dominion so that's fine yeah so uh are they going to add the tbs title for i don't.

1:59:56 I mean again i always i think i did think though i kind of would have rather had it kind of reversed because they're doing heel heel and face face with the tag so why wouldn't you've just done you know sky blue and julia heart versus the brawling birds and then reversed it and put uh statlander and uh cameron against a divine dominion Yeah.

2:00:13 I mean, I would have rather that, but, like, I think for the story they were telling, I mean, the, you know, Sisters of Sin could easily lose again for the tag titles. Like, I just, like, I don't, I mean, I think they've improved actually quite a bit the past few months. I just, like, I mean, if you're going to just do that for dynamic, it'll be fine, you know.

2:00:33 But I just think for, I can see, like.

2:00:36 Sorry, don't mean to interrupt, but Darius Mitchell just said in the chat, it's actually, it looks like a triple threat, Divine Dominion, Sisters of Sin versus Dallander and Cameron.

2:00:44 Okay, yeah. So then, hmm.

2:00:48 That's a little better in the sense that you have two heels versus a face tag team.

2:00:53 Right, yeah, yeah, yeah. No, no, no. But I was still suggesting Staten, Cameron are the winners just because, like, I think they're doing, like, a story with the Sisters of Sin and Divine.

2:01:02 Oh, is that a number one contenders match?

2:01:04 Yeah.

2:01:05 Okay.

2:01:06 That's what I'm saying. So I just feel like.

2:01:08 Yeah, I almost think Sisters of Sin will probably win that match, but I guess they should.

2:01:12 Yeah, I mean, they lose all the time. I mean, that. I, like I was saying, I always appreciate Tony Khan wanting to showcase people, but, like... not everybody needs, I'm sorry, not everybody needs to be on this card. Like, especially since this is not going to be like a great card anyway.

2:01:30 This is where I have a problem if you have an over four hour card. Yes. And you're just, that's, gets boring i mean that's literally you're having like regular dynamic.

2:01:40 Collision matches on the card yeah i.

2:01:43 Would prefer five max six matches i mean anything more than that and i'm like i might start glizzing over a little bit it's like okay we don't need this every three to four weeks i mean that's.

2:01:52 Right it's a lot no i i agree uh so you're you're probably gonna at least get two more women one to two more women's matches whether that be on the main or pre-show i mean i don't know what they're doing with the tbs idol um currently uh i would love for them to maybe just put some meat if you're gonna just give me a random match like i don't respectfully if you're i i don't need another champion on on the show give me marina severe versus somebody i don't care like have her start winning stuff because jb i'm i'm telling you i I really, really, really, really think, and as hard as it is as a woman to get over in this company, I think there's something there with Marina Shafir. I know she's not like this.

2:02:39 I don't think she's, she's obviously not at, she's not as, she's not Mercedes Monet, right? She's the ace of the, you know, she's not, I don't, she's not on Tony Storm's level. That's also fine. But I really think it's that like from a, like, like, having that connection with the crowd is so hard especially if you are a woman in wrestling jb i really think there is something there with marina like go with her like just.

2:03:06 Go and it's not all about being a great wrestler it's about like you said having the connection having a certain element of charisma she's also a certified just certified badass yes absolutely so and obviously she's an easy baby face now uh she had a great reaction last week for obvious reasons But I think that's easily transferable to the future. So I'm definitely a hundred percent behind pushing, pushing Marina. Definitely even to the point of getting a title shot within, you know, let's say six month period.

2:03:32 Hey, it's really achievable.

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2:04:37 Yeah, I mean, like, why not in, like, two or three months? Give her a run at the TPS title.

2:04:42 Why not?

2:04:43 Like you said, you've got to have these people win matches. And then you can easily have– I'm trying to think of somebody that Marina could wrestle on the pay-per-view. Let's say– oh, I don't know. She does it. cheetah yeah cheetah that you know or like even you know what even if it's a squash on a pay-per-view why why the.

2:05:10 Hell not it's a starting point and also we don't need longer matches so yes it's kind of okay.

2:05:16 If marina if marina is they're hip tossing people and just.

2:05:20 Like creating arm bars yeah arm bars brutalizers like.

2:05:25 Uh just start doing that give her the workload treatment and just re-establish her as a killer i kind of feel like they've they bastardize that a little bit too much all throughout the year. But I mean, God, man, like give her, give her a run.

2:05:38 Like why, why not?

2:05:39 Cause it's so like, you know, it's so hard for to get that organic connection. And I just feel like there, there's not going to be a time where, you know, this is the most, she's probably going to be over with the fans. So just go like the, and just let people work.

2:05:59 I actually expect them to do so just because.

2:06:01 I hope so.

2:06:02 Not just because of circumstances.

2:06:03 She's also gotten herself over, but, I mean, sometimes circumstances can also put a little more fuel behind the fire as well.

2:06:08 Right. I honestly would hope, JB, I was thinking about this, like, as her persona grows, I wish, like, my hope for her is, like, people, I know she's the problem, but I hope, like, eventually it's given... with the permission or grace that she's announced as she's the bastard. Like I, I would love that for her.

2:06:32 It was a really cool moment too, is, you know, in the, in the video promo, Marina did like a speech from, I think they was this event she was at when she found out, she brought out the inner bastard in me.

2:06:41 I mean, that'd be really cool. You know, like, like story.

2:06:44 Absolutely. Like she, that's like Justin Roberts announces her as she's the bastard. And I think especially with her, Not that Mother's Milk is, you know, it's a fine submission, but I think her adapting, you know, the Brutalizer is an excellent touch. And, you know, I hope the best. And how refreshing would it be just to have a squash match on a pay-per-view?

2:07:07 You don't see that too often.

2:07:09 No, absolutely.

2:07:10 Even if it's on the pre-show, I mean, that's okay.

2:07:15 No, no, no. Give her a pay-per-view moment, though. That's what I'm saying. It would be so refreshing because it would be so different. Like, even if the entrance is longer than the match, who cares? Like, it's something, it's completely something different, like you said, on the, like, I want Tony just to be weird on the format on this card because it's like, yeah, like, because obviously the main event's probably going to, you know, it's going to go.

2:07:39 Derek kind of made a good point in the chat. He goes, with the 203 Falls match and the Clockwork Cards match, I mean, those two matches themselves are going to eat up a lot of time in their own right, so.

2:07:48 Yeah, okay. I see that. Yeah, I think two out of three falls as well. Yeah, that's going to eat up a lot of time. So, you know, if I know Tony Khan, he's got to– there's potentially at least three to four matches. I don't want them to add Nick Wayne and Jericho on this card.

2:08:04 No. Do it in France. I mean, it's fine.

2:08:07 Yes. Not everything needs– like you have to earn the spot. I want Tony just to be a little bit more– what's the word? Yeah. Not stingy, but judicious.

2:08:19 Yes.

2:08:20 Yes. Just like I mean that I would be almost open more, JB, like if there were like those ongoing feuds and programs on collision. It's like specifically like.

2:08:32 Sometimes I will say in a weekly TV, it's like you wish there was a little bit more power punch behind some of the matches. And there's a lot of matches you could have those pay-per-views that you could distribute better throughout.

2:08:40 Dynamite and collision in my opinion.

2:08:42 I'm telling you like it some of these matches that you kind of like you said you roll your eyes and you just like oh my god like what's what's happening i.

2:08:49 Mean more so collision but it does occasionally happen in dynamite as well so.

2:08:54 Right it just it would translate so much better if it was like actually on collision because like the the the 10th match where you like you mentioned earlier your eyes are crazed over it's like oh my god it's like i that would do fantastic on the main event.

2:09:08 For collision exactly but yeah it's like you said people like only have so much time to dedicate on a weekend in particular i mean there's like like i would say it's a lot better for people sunset but also a lot of people are doing things on saturday night as well i mean either throughout the day or things at night it's like they they you know they don't want the entire day to be consumed you know and then a sunday night people you generally have to either work up for work or school in the morning so.

2:09:29 Right All right. Well, JB, we went about two hours on the show.

2:09:37 Just one more real quick thing. Yeah, go for it.

2:09:39 We already touched on it to a certain extent, but Nick Wayne did the pre-tape promo. I like that he demanded Jericho sees him as a multi-time champion in the future and that he also respects Jericho, but that only means it'll prove that Wayne was better than he was now and he's better than he will be in the future.

2:09:55 It's just the perfect cocky punchable heel. But he also didn't come across as cartoonish as he sometimes does tonight. So I think he's getting better at that, which is a positive thing.

2:10:05 Yeah, I mean, Wade and I really liked the match they had a couple weeks ago, JB.

2:10:10 Yeah, me too.

2:10:11 It was a good story. I mean, obviously, like, the necklace thing, kind of goofy at the start, but then Nick Wayne did go back and explain it wasn't about the necklace.

2:10:19 Thank God, because we don't need more necklace or charm lore in wrestling. I mentioned this in the last show with Wade, too. It was the two-hour and then down by the one-hour collision because of the pay-per-view that Saturday. But, yeah, like, I mean, it's no different than the CM Punk, you know, McIntyre friendship bracelet thing that they made. That was a main event feud they did for months. So, I mean, if you're going to... criticize one they're you know it's a much different level feud as well right and he explained it so i'm perfectly fine with that yeah absolutely.

2:10:49 All right well uh we'll go ahead and get out uh jb you have any uh other final parting thoughts before we head.

2:10:54 Out no yeah absolutely um you know good show tonight i thought they they stacked this this france card it was it was a stronger than normal dynamite which is a good thing i think for the international crowd i was happy to do that obviously on a unique night or different night being on tuesday like to, you know, obviously see how it does against, you know, baseball playoffs and, and, um, and NXT, but, um, yeah, the rest of the schedule next week. And, you know, I'm looking forward to, to wrestle dream. Like it'd be, it should be easy, more easily digestible. So that's, that's not always a bad thing.

2:11:21 Yeah, no, absolutely. Uh, appreciate everybody hanging out with us in the chat on our YouTube listeners. Thanks so much again for audio listeners. Uh, it's been Brian Zilm, uh, JB from Detroit, happy to fill in with our leader, Wade Keller. Wade, get some rest. Hope we did the show well, followed the format. Tried to stay on point tonight, Wade.

2:11:43 Really did. You know, we had some weather talk here and there, but, you know, I thought we did a good job. It was a fun show.

2:11:49 We didn't bring up enough Minnesota sports, Twin City sports teams, though.

2:11:53 No, I mean, I guess I need to ask you about Jalen Duren, JB. I got to ask you about Jalen Duren. What's going on?

2:12:01 You know, I mean, there's a between a rock and a hard place situation. You know, he's obviously, I think I heard his reputation here a little bit, just to smell the way it was handled, but you also can't let him walk for zero value either. So it was a tough, you don't want to sign him from the max, but they did send him to a relatively large contract, but on the positive side, it looks like, I mean, it's one preseason game.

2:12:22 It looks like Austin Thompson's kind of developing a mid range shot.

2:12:24 So if one of those two can become an offensive threat, then you can afford to have a.

2:12:28 Less of a threat in one aspect as well.

2:12:31 So you just got to hope that, that all seer progresses and is worth the contract that we just signed him to as well. And if he does, I'm optimistic about more optimistic about the.

2:12:38 Season as far as they can play.

2:12:40 So.

2:12:41 Love it.

2:12:41 We'll have this, uh, exchange, uh, uh, interaction, certainly season between you, I, and, uh, Wade.

2:12:50 We can do the forum. Yeah.

2:12:51 I was going to.

2:12:53 Go to the performance on Sunday. I decided to put on the Pistons hat.

2:12:56 So there we go.

2:12:57 I respect that.

2:12:58 Yeah. Um, But I appreciate it again, everybody hanging out with us.

2:13:01 This is Brian Zolm, JB from Detroit, and we will see you next time. Have a great week, everyone.

2:13:07 Thanks.

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