I Am All In…Again: The Sky is Opening Up for Luke and Lorelai (Season 4 E21 “Last Week Fights, This Week Tights”)

I am all in.

Again! More, more, more. I want to kiss you more. More, more, more.

I want to kiss you more. I Am All In, again, with Scott Patterson and iHeartRadio Podcast. Hey, everybody. Scott Patterson, iAmAllIn Podcast, one of our productions, iHeartRadio Media, iHeartRadio. podcast, a company so great it needs three introductions. We are going to recap season four, episode 21. Last week, fights.

This week, tights. The very special guest host, Julie Dolan. You may know her as the actress who portrayed one of Liz's friends, Anna, and played other roles for five episodes of Gilmore Girls. She's been in several other shows like Dexter Without a Trace, the voice of Princess Leia and Star Wars video games. Welcome to the show, Julie.

Hi, thank you for having me.

It is our pleasure. Julie, I heard you were watching season four to catch up on your episode. Thoughts on watching it back?

Yeah, so my confession is I've never seen all of season four. So I thought, well, I'm just going to watch episode 21 for sure. And then I went, you know, I think I'm going to go back and start watching from the beginning. And I got hooked. so much happened in season four. It was jam-packed with Rory going to college, Lorelai opening the inn, Lorelai dating Jason, breaking up with Jason, Jess leaving and coming back and then leaving again, you getting married, divorced, married, divorced, Richard and Emily separating, you finally, you know, kissing Lorelai, and Rory and Dean. I mean, I have not watched... Gilmore Girls from the very beginning.

So I don't know if every season is like that, where so much happens, or if that was something that just, season four, it just lent itself to all of these events happening.

Well, I think like a great symphony, you know, there's a crescendo, and then there's a breakdown, and then they build it back up again. You know, it's like a great piece of music. Right. Isn't it? And now we're hitting that. All these storylines are converging and those four seasons are paying off now. All those, you know, all those seeds planted earlier now really maturing. And it's pretty, pretty great to watch. Airdate May 11th, 2004. Yeah. Director Chris Long, writer Dan Palladino. Sorry, didn't mean to interrupt you.

What were you going to say?

I was going to say, I did start watching a little bit of season three, just a couple of episodes to kind of acclimate me to it. And I, you know, I, I did notice a lot of like Luke is, he's an angry guy walking around. He's just an angry guy. Every, everybody pisses him off. Except when I noticed when Laurel, I would walk in, there's something about you that's softened.

And I thought, huh? Okay, well maybe that's just because he knows her so well. And then things started to escalate. And I wondered, was that planned from season one? Like did Dan and Amy go, okay, we're gonna get these two together eventually. Or did they see through the seasons, wow, these two have chemistry, let's get them together. You know, I always wonder if it's, when there's so many seasons of a series, if all of that stuff is planned from the beginning, cause you don't know if you're going to get picked up or not.

Well, okay. So the pilot episode for me was pretty much the, the, the final audition for me because that was the heat check, right? That was to determine because I never read with Lauren. It was just a guest star in the pilot. So, you know, they weren't going to make a deal with the Luke character until they knew. Right.

And so, so, so I had one audition, went to Toronto, filmed for, I don't know, 10, I was only there for about 10 days, did a, did a couple of scenes in the diner and that was that. Wow. Yeah. So then they came back and, and I'm sure fans of this podcast and the show have heard this story before, but I'll tell you again, They came back and they offered two episodes. We turned it down to my chagrin.

They came back and they offered four episodes to my chagrin. And my manager just told Gavin Pallone to go to Warner Brothers, get the money, get him a deal. You know you want him. The chemistry's there. You know it. Let's go. And he did. So really, maybe that was my second audition with the pilot. The third audition was going to be the two-episode arc. Right. See if see if they really wanted to commit. And then it was like, damn, it's hard to get a regular job. Right. So but my manager at the time, a woman named Audrey Khan, you know, just cut through all of that BS, all of their hesitation, all of their fear and just said, just do it. and leave us alone with this stuff, you know? And, and Gavin Pallone is no wallflower. I mean, he's, he's,

he is a, a tough, smart producer. And he, you know, at that time had a reputation and it was like, you don't want to mess with Gavin Pallone because he knows his stuff. And, you know, when he, when, but, but, you know, she, she just had a way with people, you know, she, my manager, my old manager had a way with people.

Yeah. Yeah. That's great.

And forced his hand, like, you know, you're going to lose them. I don't know. I don't know exactly. I wasn't there for the phone call, but I know that, that she was a wizard on the phone.

So what happened when, when they finally pulled the trigger and said you were the one, did they, they gave you a deal for the whole season?

Six seasons.

Not knowing if it was going to go six seasons, but that was the deal. Six seasons.

We kind of knew it would go.

Yeah.

The writing was too good. The cast was too good.

Yeah.

And it had to. I mean, they were going to let it go at least a couple, three seasons because it was just so darn good. Even if it didn't get, you know, it was the kind of thing that you read it. And if you had any kind of business acumen, entertainment business acumen, you knew that advertisers were going to swarm the show because it's so family friendly and nothing really bad happens. And it's what they call a female forward show. So that just checks every single box corporate America has. I mean, they just... I mean, the pressure they put on the studio to bring it back after season seven was enormous. I mean, it was just like, listen. And, you know, they were probably poised to make a multi-year

offers to the main cast to come back for two, three seasons, you know, because that's the kind of, Equity, the show, had built up with corporate America. Everybody wanted to advertise on this show. But it was not to be. Yeah, so we knew. Anyway, let's get to the show, the wedding. Patty and Chrissy are practicing the dance with Kirk. And Kirk is upset. Lorelei walks through the Times Square and spots Jess. And guess who's in this episode? My then girlfriend, now wife, mother to my child.

Who?

She was Chrissy, Miss Patty's dance assistant, dancing teacher. Because my wife is a former ballerina.

Oh, yeah.

Oh, that's great. Yeah, yeah. So I met her when I was teaching acting before I even got the show. I was an unemployed actor. I was very busy with my acting teaching job. responsibilities. My days were full. And I think it's probably one of the main reasons I got to show is because I didn't really need it anymore.

I didn't need acting anymore to support me. I had a regular job, which was teaching. And it was a pretty good living. It was a ton of work, just like, you know, being in this business is a ton of work on the show. Right. But I was like, You know, the attitude was like, can we just get through this? I got another audition. I got an acting class. I got to teach. And I'm like, I'm out of here.

You know, I don't have time for the BS now. So that helped. Yeah, that's that's Chris. So, no, I met her when I was teaching. She was in another class. She was in another class down the hall.

Oh, she was teaching?

No, she was a student. But she wasn't my student.

Right, okay, okay, gotcha. I know you want to get on with the show, but I have a little juicy behind the scenes as well.

Yes, we like that. Early 2003, now we shot this season in 2003. My first episode was.

Uh, episode 13 with, with the, um, when you, we, we were in the square, we were, the four girls were drunk and we, Liz was there. Liz came, um, that was in December of 2003. So early 2003, I auditioned for a short film starring Sean Gunn and it was written by Lee Kirk. I don't know if you know Lee Kirk. Um, the three of them met in Chicago. Lee, Lee's a writer. Um, So they wrote this film and I auditioned for it. I didn't know these guys and I booked it. So I worked with Sean on this film and I had known Mara Casey, the casting director and Jamie Rudofsky from previous auditions and from casting director workshops.

So Mara came to the screening and came up to me afterwards and said, Oh my God, I've got to hire you in something. And she was casting her and Jamie were casting, uh, Gilmore girls at the time. So, uh, Later on that year, I get a call to audition for Gilmore Girls and I hadn't been watching it. So it was back in the day where you didn't have streaming.

You couldn't just go to Hulu and watch the show to see the genre, to see the style. You know, you had to wait for Tuesday night to come around and watch the show. And so I go into read and I get a call back. Now, Dan Palladino and I went to high school together. I was his first girlfriend when we were 15 years old. He says hello, by the way. I told him I was doing this and he said hello.

Oh, okay.

So I go into the callback and I actually saw Mackenzie Phillips in the callback. And I go into the callback and I'm standing in the room with Dan and Amy. And Dan says, well, I got the bookends of my relationship in this room. I got my first girlfriend and I got my wife. And I thought, I'm either going to book this or I'm going.

To be told to get No, no, no, no, no.

So I ended up booking it and they've also hired me for Maisel too. And Amy directed it.

So that's great.

So that, that happened. And then Dan brought me in for, you know, four or there are more episodes, just random little parts as Anna.

Nice.

Yeah.

Nice.

So there you go.

Very nice. All right. Continue. Thank you. Um, no, great story. Um, All right, Luke is prepping the turkey legs while Liz and her friends are laughing it up. TJ and Liz are getting married, by the way. They meet Jess, then a stripper shows up with a package at Luke's. They go crazy for him.

That stripper reminded me of Christopher Adkins. He did a movie, One Night in Heaven or something, where he played a stripper. And this guy looked just like him.

Oh, yeah. Yeah. Luke, TJ, and Jess are getting ready for the wedding. TJ loves his tights and borrows Luke's deodorant. Luke and Lorelai meet up and he tells her she looks beautiful. Julie, that was a fun scene. Yeah. That Luke's with a stripper. What do you remember about shooting that scene other than he looked like Christopher Atkins?

Well, it was fun to be with the girls again because we had done the first episode. And Dan directed this one. So it was interesting for me to be directed by Dan.

Right, right, right.

It was just a very free-flowing, almost ad-lib. We did a lot of ad-libs. I mean, we kept stuck to the lines, but there was a lot of room for ad-lib in this.

Really?

And it was having a lot of... Well, it had to be like this. It had to be fast.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

But when I re-watched it, I noticed some of the... We were talking... Between each other. Just little comments that weren't written down.

Right. Okay. Well, the wedding was hilarious. Sweet, but hilarious. Yeah.

Why wasn't I invited to the wedding?

I was not. Listen, you're going to have to ask your buddy, Dan. You know.

Yeah.

I could have gotten another day out of it. Maybe Amy was like seething in the background going, she will not.

Be at the wedding.

She You know? Yeah. You just never know. We get an iconic, the iconic dance scene between Luke and Lorelei. Sam Phillips reflecting light. What are your thoughts on Luke and Lorelei's date? It was actually, that scene was pretty much their wedding, too, because it was better than the wedding scene in the Netflix episodes, don't you think?

Oh, was it? I haven't seen that one yet.

Oh, wait till you see that.

Well, I know you had just finished reading that love book and listening to the tapes. And for me to see you flip from angry guy wants to be alone, leave me alone to all of a sudden you were going for it. It was almost like, hold on, hold on. I'm not ready for this. And then, you know, when you asked her to the, the wedding and, And she was like, yeah, sure, we'll go together. We're buddies. I'll be your fake date. And you could tell, just the way you looked at her, you were moving in. And I was not ready for that yet. Maybe because I hadn't watched it from season one, I was like, come on.

I know a lot of fans I've seen written going, it's about time, come on. They were waiting for it. When I found myself realizing that you realized it was, it was after you read, it might've been the end of season three. You read the book and they asked the pot, the tape asked you the question, when you want to be comforted, do you see her face? When you want to tell somebody something exciting, do you see her face? And you went, whoa, that's when I went, holy shit. Okay. I had no idea it was going to happen. So you asking her to the dance, I mean, it was great. It was, I wasn't ready for it, but watching you together, it was like, oh, this just, it just melted into each other. It just, yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. I, that's why the, the angry guy works. Ah. Can you, okay. So, so, okay. Here's another interpretation of the character, right? You play it like that. You play it like the reflecting light dance scene where he's happy all the time and he's Mr. Nice Guy to everybody. Then where's the impact on this?

Yeah, where does he have to go? Yeah.

There's nowhere to go. So imagine Luke in the reflecting light dance scene being grumpy and annoyed and grouchy. Yeah. These people are looking at us. You're too close. Get away from me. What are you grabbing me for? Yeah.

But like I said, I did notice in season three, there was a softness about you with her. It was very subtle, but I saw it.

Well, you know, he'd made a decision, hadn't he? Right? He got over his fear. Yeah. He got over his, you know, his constant justifications for not going for it. And now it was like the sky is opening up.

But also realizing.

You know what that feels like. Remember when you and Dan were deeply in love and the sky was opening up? Yes. Remember that?

I do.

Right. Young love. There's nothing quite like it.

Oh, there's nothing like it.

There's nothing like it. And so, you know, that's how I played it. Like this was the first time. Like this was young love. Like this was that. Like we're teenagers. This is what love does. It takes us back and heals the wounds, right? So that's what Lorelei, that's the effect she had on Luke.

Yeah.

She was it.

Wow.

That was it.

Yeah.

So, of course, he was in a bad mood most of the time because it wasn't that people were annoying him. He was annoying himself because he didn't have the courage to make a move. He didn't feel the confidence, right? He didn't feel, and she was always dating somebody else. She was going to marry Max. I mean, it was just like, of course the guy's in a bad mood.

He's not living his truth.

But you tried with other women too. You tried dating, you got married, hoping it would work.

Yeah.

You know.

Yeah, you can fool yourself into thinking that you love someone when you really, really don't when it's not that thing. Yeah. that you and Dan had.

Puppy love.

I'm going to needle you about this the whole episode. Yeah, oh great.

By the way, the episode right before this, after the bachelor party, when you came back and said, I haven't gotten in a fight since high school when Vince Williams called me a duty head. I watched that two days ago. I fell off my chair laughing because Dan and I went to school with a Vince Williams. He was one of Dan's buddies. So I called Dan and I said, did Vince really call you a duty head? Because Vince was kind of a duty head. He said, no, he never called me that. But he said, occasionally I'll grab names from high school and I'll throw them at the show.

And he said, I haven't gotten sued yet. So Vince Williams, I picture, as soon as you said that, I pictured his face and I started laughing.

Yeah. Well, what is especially satisfying is, um, you know, watching, uh, Lorelai's jaw drop when he, when, when Luke asked her out after the wedding.

Yeah.

And then Lorelai realizing, you know, and Amy Sugarman talks about face acting all the time. She's, she's our, she's our producer on this. She talks about face acting. It cracks me up. The face acting is amazing. You know, it's like not the body acting, but the face act. As Lorelai realizing that, that this is a big turning point in their relationship. These are big moments in this show.

Well, she has conversations with Rory and Suki going, this is what he said. What do you think? Are you sure? Is this real? And I can understand that because it took me for a loop when you were like, had a beeline on her And she was like, what is this? I mean, she felt the same way, obviously realizing she felt that way, but not wanting to assume in case you were just being a good buddy. She wasn't sure what was going on, which is, was, was, that's why she was so surprised.

When you said, you know, I, I, I think the fear on both their parts was, was that they had such a great flow as friends. And they were so comfortable being friends and good friends that adding that extra element is terrifying. Because it's not just the rejection, because I think if it hadn't worked out, they'd go back to being friends. It's just wanting to go to the next level and potentially losing the friendship, right? Because you don't know. You don't want to lose that friendship. No, you don't want to lose that friend because it's good enough. Right.

And you've convinced yourself that that's good enough for me, but it's really not.

Well, you know, when you're with somebody that you're attracted to, I married my best friend and he, we met at universal studios. We were both doing shows, live action shows at universal studios. And, uh, Every time he would come into the break room, my heart would just flutter. But we were good friends. He was married, in fact. And so I just stayed good friends with him. I house sat his dog. But I knew when I first he walked in the door of an acting class, I went, I'm gonna marry that guy. And then his finger and I went, oh, he's got a ring on. Maybe not.

Maybe we'll just be friends. So we did a lot of shows together and we loved hanging out together. And I loved flirting with him. to a point because I knew it was safe and I wasn't going to lose that friendship.

Right.

And then, I don't know, like 10 years later, eight years later, he ended up getting divorced and I was dating a sword fighter who, who choreographs sword fighting for TV. And as soon as he was available, I got tickets for a Rolling Stones concert. Who did I ask? I asked my husband at the time. I was like, you want to, I know I'm supposed to ask my boyfriend, but I want to go with you. That was October of 1995. We haven't been apart. No, I don't know why.

Look at you. Look at you with your own Luke storyline.

Yeah.

But the point of marrying your best friend or starting to date your best friend is scary because you turn that corner and that's what you guys did. Yeah. And there's no going back.

Oh, no. No, the friendship, even if it doesn't work out, the friendship is altered. It's just uncomfortable.

Yeah, and you don't want to lose that because there's so much fun with you and Lorelai flirting in the diner, but it's up to a point. And it's exciting. And she loved coming into the diner every day, knowing she was going to see you. And who knows if she really knew how she felt. It was just, it made her feel good to go in there. It was, you know, both of you, when she came in, you were excited about it. But that was enough for that.

She's just using me for the free coffee.

And the free Danish. I noticed she never did pay for anything.

Never, ever, ever, ever. But that's Luke. He's just going to pay the price and he doesn't care. All right, let's talk about Lane and Mrs. Kim. I would say mother and daughter of the year, every year.

Well, Emily and Lorelai, that's pretty much a tumultuous relationship. I was surprised how the relationship between them, I had to Google, why are they at odds with each other all the time? And I, you know, found out why. Yeah. So I didn't know that. So yeah, there's a lot of tumultuous relationships between you and Jess, man, the scenes are intense. And there's a scene where you go visit Jess's father who comes to a star's home just for a secret visit. That scene between you and him in his hotel or Airbnb, whatever he had, whatever he was staying in. My God, what a great scene. I watched that with my jaw dropped open and it was like I was watching a really good... Really good soap opera.

I mean, it was heavy.

Thanks a lot.

No, I mean, good. You know what I mean? Or like a crime drama series.

Really good soap opera.

Really good. I mean, the intensity. I'm saying it was great. It was one of the best scenes I've ever seen. Oh, thanks.

Yeah. Yeah, I really hate, I loathe fathers who abandon their children. Just it's.

You personally have always felt that way.

Yeah. I just want to grab them and throw them back in and say, get to work.

Yeah.

You know, I, I hate it. It ruins kids. It's just, I just hate it.

Yeah.

Yeah. That was an easy scene for me.

Oh, good. Yeah. Yeah.

That was real.

Yeah.

That wasn't Rob Estes that I was acting with. That was somebody else.

Well, it showed. Oh, okay. It showed. But between Lane and Mrs. Kim, yeah, I guess it's the tradition.

I think it's incredibly, it's almost cruel that she has this border in her house and she's treating her like her own daughter. It just shows me how nutty Mrs. Kim is. I mean, how needy. She is right. She's alone. She feels alone. She feels the loss of lane. So she, she rents out her room, but why does she rent out her room? She doesn't need the money. Right.

Well, she got the foreign exchange student and she got a foreign exchange student and that's, you know, to have somebody's.

I really felt bad. I felt so bad for lane. I really, it's just what a, what a thing to do to your own daughter. Yeah. Again, My love for Mrs. Kim went way down when she tossed her daughter. I just, wow. Oh, yeah.

But you got to look at the tradition.

Ah, that's your kid.

Well, I mean, if you look at Emily, how she brought up Lorelai, and Lorelai got pregnant at 16, and she didn't throw her out of the house, but look at their relationship from then on.

I think Mrs. Kim and Emily, you know, you got to put them in the same category. They're just a couple of lunatics. Yeah. Yeah. All right. Aunt June goes to Lane's and drops off the mail and proposes tea time with Mrs. Kim. Mrs. Kim comes over with Zach and Brian in a tie. She's surprised she lives with boys.

Yes. Kind of in a rundown place. I mean, the place is kind of rundown, you know.

Yeah, it wasn't fun being in that place, was it? That was a depressing space.

Yeah, yeah.

And she runs out and into Lorelai at the wedding and is freaking out. She calms her down and tells her to think of Zach and Brian as girls.

Think of them as girls. They're just her best friends.

Which isn't much of a stretch, really. Mrs. Kim comes back to demand to fix the window and light And she has to. All right. So she's coming around. She's accepting this a little bit, isn't she? Mrs. Kemp.

Yeah. Yes. Well, doesn't her aunt show up?

Yeah.

The aunt comes in and says, this is your mail from, yeah, from your mom. And Lane says, do you want to come in? No. Turns around and goes away. And then Mrs. Kim comes back and softens a little bit. Yeah.

Right, right, right. Well, you know, her mother's coming around a little bit. New chapter here. With Lane and Mrs. Kent, what do you think? This is the beginning of their new understanding.

I think so.

Finding respect. for her daughter a little bit yeah.

Mrs kim is starting to accept maybe you know the contemporary situation that her daughter is in and and that it's she she's going to be fine you know yeah i think uh uh hopefully she'll come around. Maybe it shows in the next season, their new relationship. I have to watch it.

Right, right, right. All right. Now we're going to get into Rory's love life. Um, And it's really a place that I don't belong. So if you just want to take over here. No, I'm just kidding. It's the end of the school year.

The guideline.

And Rory's moving out of her dorm room. And the roommates point out that Rory has had a dry spell with boyfriends.

Well, she hasn't really. But during college, within the college, she has.

Right, right, right. So at Friday night dinner, Emily asked Rory, about her love life, and Lorelai points out that she is playing different music and Richard is out of town. She's trying to get Emily to fess up about the separation.

You know, that's one thing I didn't get. Before, we learned that Emily went to a hotel, we think. That's where she was staying. And then Friday night dinner, she's there and Richard's gone. So I was like, wait a minute, I thought she was gone. And then Lorelai starts asking her about trying to drop some hints, like find out what's going on and says things like, well, dad doesn't like chicken Kiev and dad doesn't like raspberry souffle. What, what is she trying to find out? I wasn't clear on, I mean, I know she's trying to find out if they separated, but how, how are those questions related to that?

Because she's, because she's eating food. He clearly doesn't like, and that she does. And that now that he's staying somewhere else, because that's her house, right?

Okay. Yeah.

I think they must have had such a horrible fight that she walked out and got a hotel. Because why wouldn't he? It's, you know, that's on the guy.

Yeah. Yeah.

In those situations. Yeah. She.

She walked out when she found out he was suing Jason.

Yeah.

She said, you don't have to do that. And he said, yes, I do. And she said, fine. And she turned and left. And the next thing you see her is when her car's in the driveway and her car's never normally in the driveway.

But I don't think it's that. I think that's the straw that broke the camel's back. I think it's Pendle and Lott and his secret lunches with her over a 30-year span. Right. And Emily just feeling like, do I really know this guy?

Yeah.

You know? There's a side to him that she needed to get away from for a little while.

True, true.

And try to figure it out.

That was a little deceiving, the Penn and Lott lunches.

I was surprised. Oh, that hit hard. That's a big deal. Yeah. Wow. Wow, wow, wow. Can you blame him?

Can you blame him, though? I mean, it was just friends.

I mean, yeah, but still.

It's like me and Dan having lunch, you know?

I don't know about that one I think going behind her back for 30 years like that having private conversations keeping that flame alive a little bit they're not business partners they're not discussing business why are they together why are they having lunch why It's not related to his business. It's just completely emotional. Yeah.

So back to Rory's.

But I understand it because Emily's, you know, she's not easy to live with, is she? No. I mean, I know what Lorelai went through. Imagine what Richard went through. Yeah. But then again, you know, there's Trixie and what poor Emily had to go through with her. Anyway. All right. So Emily surprises Rory. with Graham Sullivan, a friend from the alumni committees. He's a friend, alumni committee son. And he invites her out at the bar. Rory says, one of the funniest dates, Rory's sitting there alone with Graham.

And Graham's with his friends talking about sports. He tells her he's got to light. She's got to lighten up. She wants to leave, but realize she doesn't have a cab. money, so she calls someone. Dean shows up. Dean shows up.

Of course.

Orders on Graham's tab. You gotta love that. Dean.

They left their card at the bar. That's right. From the minute he walked into Rory's dorm room, Emily introduced them, and I thought, I can just tell by the way this guy combs his hair.

Right, right, right.

Yeah.

That is a good application of that word. Yes, for sure. It is reserved for just such characters.

And the fact that at the bar, there was a drunk guy and Roy said, is he the designated driver? And he goes, oh yeah, but he can drive drunk or something. Yeah, I'm good.

And there was no.

Uber back then. It's not like she could call an Uber.

Nope. Not that you'd even want to. All right, so Dean gets a tour of the campus. Rory gives him a tour of the campus. Yeah. And while Dean is saying goodbye to Rory, she asks if Lindsay knows where he is. Right.

He said he's working.

So maybe Rory's turning, it's like a junior member of the Pendle and Lott Society. Then Jess shows up and Rory asks to leave.

Boy, that was an uncomfortable scene. Really uncomfortable. I mean, because she hasn't seen Jess in so long. She's got this weird thing going on with Dean. She's being respectful of the marriage as up to this point. And now she's got both of them there. How uncomfortable. But she tells Dean to leave. And eventually she tells Jess to leave.

But Dean's like, oh, I get it. You're choosing him. I just told my wife I was working and you're choosing him.

Fine.

I'm out of here.

What an upstanding guy. I just lied to my wife to be here. How dare you? Yeah. Oh my God.

I have to say I did. When Jess told her in the season before the final episode of season three, he came back and said, I love you. I thought that was, finally him opening up and now he's reading the book. So he's finally able to express his feelings. I mean, he's been repressed for his whole life because of the way he was, you know, his father and mother, Liz, being a pretty girl. So I liked the fact that he was like, come away with me, this and that.

But it was like, hold on. I'm going to school. I'm not leaving Stars Hollow. But I did find the opening of him sort of, uh, I mean, I liked, I, I, it made me feel for him.

Yeah.

He just needs to be saved.

So you did do a little bit of a good job. You finally, at the end there, you, you, you brought him around.

Yeah. But he's, he's so off his rocker still, you know? Yeah. It's just, it's just all about him, him, him, what he needs, what he needs, what he needs. He's, He's not in a position to give to anybody. He's a, he's a taker right now. He's just a taker. Yeah. Cause I mean, asking her to leave school and come, come with me. It's like, what are you, Jess, what are you doing? Yeah. What are you doing?

I just think that was his way of letting her know how he feels. Let's move away together and go, we'll go to New York. We'll go here. Let her know. I want to be with you. That's basically what he was saying is I want to be with you.

Everybody else in the world is my enemy, except you. And I want to be with you, but I, we need to take, we need, you need to drop out of Yale. Yeah. To do it. Yeah. No, thanks. No, thanks.

I have to tell you, I don't even know who she ends up with in the coming seasons. So don't spoil it for me.

Cause I'm going to, I won't. I won't. All right. Let me ask you this, Julie. Do you think because Roy was being told she's had a dry spell year when it comes to boyfriends, that she is thinking back to Dean was, calling him at the bar, just an excuse.

I don't think that had anything to do with the dry spell. Uh, uh, somebody saying that to her, I think she was just desperate and didn't know who to call.

Right. Like, cause Dean's firmly in the friend zone now. Right.

And she had just saw him recently. So there, there, I think she felt comfortable enough to call a friend to come and pick her up. Not, not anything to do with, uh, a love interest, even though she has feelings for him. I think she's respecting the marriage it's just.

Right and I don't think we need to answer the question as to why we think she firmly said no to Jess I mean it was obvious he's not thinking clearly.

Well she doesn't trust him after doing what he did right.

And he's in desperation mode. So it's like, yeah, she's not, you know, he's not, she's not feeling particularly safe at this moment.

It came out of nowhere.

Yeah.

His request.

Yeah. You don't want to do that.

No.

All right. So poor Jess, right. He tried to follow the book, the workbook, but it backfired.

Don't blame the book.

Do you think he's changed or do you think he's just going to revert back to his old ways?

I think he's changing. I think that book is helping him.

Yeah?

Yes.

Yeah, books do help.

Yeah, books and tapes do help.

It's got to be a combination. All right, overall, pretty great episode, don't you think?

A lot of stuff happened in that episode, yes.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. A lot of stuff. Yeah.

And, you know, Liz and I, Kathleen, we became friends afterwards. And we hung out and walked our dogs together. And we both lived in Sherman Oaks for years.

Oh, cool.

I've moved to the East Coast.

Oh, have you really? Yeah. Where are you? What part?

Atlanta.

Atlanta?

So I can work in New York. I can work in the whole Southeast. I can work in LA. So, yeah.

Wow. Great city.

Yeah, I was born and raised in the Valley and went to Catholic school for 12 years in the Valley. And I was there until a couple of years ago and then up and moved here and hit the ground running.

I surprisingly had some of the best sushi I have ever had in Atlanta.

Really?

Yeah, there's a place outside the city. And, you know, trying to get there in a cab on a Saturday night was impossible to get out of. you know, center city. And so I just got out and started walking, but it was a couple of miles out. I got another cab, but it was like, you can't get out of, you can't get out of the city.

Traffic here is worse than LA.

Oh, much worse.

I had no idea.

Oh my goodness. My goodness. But what a great town other than that.

Yeah.

If you have a skateboard or a bicycle, you'd be better off.

They have golf carts. Oh, there's golf carts paths in this town next to me and nobody drives a car. It's all golf carts going through the forest where you see deers and bunny rabbits and foxes. And then you end up at target, but you're in, in the, uh, in your golf cart in the forest.

Oh, that's great.

It's really cool.

That's really great.

Yeah.

I have, I have, uh, I grew up with, uh, these, these, these guys, uh, cross street from us and, and, One of them is in that area, I think, that you're talking about.

Yeah.

We won't say where it is, but I think I know what you're talking about. Anyway. All right. So, Julie, great having you on. Please come back.

I want to tell you something real quick. You know when you were talking about the fact that you were teaching your acting and you just kind of gave up on everything else because it was just frustrating and then you booked Gilmore Girls?

Yeah.

I was in the same boat. In 2003, after I did the movie with Sean... I couldn't get a job. I didn't have auditions. And I went after I was a child actor. I started at nine after I finally said, okay, I'm done.

I'm done.

And I let it go. And I'm a keyboard player. So I started a rock band. I started an all female eighties cover band. And I focused on that. And as soon as I started booking gigs, I started getting auditions and I booked Gilmore girls and we had booked a gig the night we were shooting that night scene and And I thought, my world's collided.

What do I do?

And I thought, well, of course, I'm going to choose my acting. That's been my passion since I was a kid. So I canceled the gig. The band broke up.

Right, right.

But I've been doing music since 2003. I've been in tribute and cover bands all over LA. And now here in Atlanta.

That's fun.

I know you're a musician as well.

Oh, yeah, yeah. You know, the same thing happened to me. I was teaching at that time. I was super busy, but I was also pursuing, I was doing a lot of open mic nights in LA and playing my original songs. And sometimes they were well-received and sometimes they were not. And so I was, I finally started booking some paying gigs, you know, and like, coffee shops or cafes or whatever it was. And I couldn't believe it. And I thought, yeah, things are really happening now. And that's when Gilmore Girls came along. That's when the audition came along. Well, it was pilot season. But a lot of auditions started happening at that time. And I had to cancel gigs to go.

Can you imagine my little tiny gigs, right? That were going to pay me 50 bucks or whatever that I was going to, that I was going to go to Toronto and shoot the Gilmore pilot. And I like, I was like, I was like weighing it. Should I do the job or should I keep the gigs? And it's like, idiot, you know, come on.

See, that's a lesson right there. You let go of something that you're squeezing onto and you go, screw you. I'm going over in this direction. And then it's like, When your career goes, hold on, come back. We're not done with you yet.

So what do you, do you, do you sing in the band? Are you the lead singer? No, no, no, no.

I'm a keyboard player and I do backup vocals in some leads songs, but yeah, that's great. Yeah.

Yeah. I, uh, I just finished a tour, uh, with my band.

Yeah.

We did a nice little tour.

Let me know when you come to Atlanta.

Yeah. You know, we didn't go to the South. It was California and then the Northeast. A little bit Midwest, yeah. But we didn't hit the South. So we're talking about another go at it.

There's a lot of music venues here.

I know, I know, I know. Yeah. Anyway, all right. Thanks, Julie. All the best. We'll see you next time. And remember, best fans on the planet, keep those cards and letters coming. We read every single letter, sentence, comma of every single one of them. Love you guys. And remember where you lead, we will follow. Stay safe, everyone. Everybody, don't forget, follow us on Instagram at I Am All In Podcast and email us at gilmore at iheartradio.com.

I Am All In…Again: The Sky is Opening Up for Luke and Lorelai (Season 4 E21 “Last Week Fights, This Week Tights”)

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