Dissecting Persuasion: How a Black Jazz Musician Got Hundreds of KKK Members to Give Up Their Robes

Hundreds of Ku Klux Klan members have handed their robes to Daryl Davis, a Black jazz musician who won them over by listening instead of arguing. His opening question: How can you hate me if you don't even know me?
Howie Chan sits down with Joshua Bandoch, former academic, speechwriter, and author of How to Get What You Want, to unpack why that approach works and why most persuasion fails before it starts. Josh defines persuasion as shared action, not winning, and makes the case that leading with logic is itself illogical, because every human being is wired to feel first and reason second.
You'll learn the four questions that get people to yes without a pitch, why asking how someone feels opens doors that asking what they think keeps shut, how moral foundations theory helps you persuade people who don't share your values, and why the most persuasive leaders of the last century were all for something rather than against someone.

Chapters:
00:00:00 The Daryl Davis KKK Story
00:05:20 Biggest Persuasion Misconception
00:08:04 Persuasion as Shared Action
00:12:24 Why We're Wired to Talk About Ourselves
00:15:46 Questions That Reveal What People Want
00:17:43 Leading with Emotion Versus Logic
00:24:57 How to Read an Audience You Can't Talk To
00:27:07 Appealing to Values Without Pandering
00:36:26 Be For Something
00:42:18 The 4 Questions That Get People to Yes
00:50:18 Why Experts Struggle to Lead With Feelings
00:58:05 Stories That Move People to Act
01:00:56 Crashing Through Glass Ceilings

From Joshua Bandoch:
Website (joshuabandoch.com)
LinkedIn (linkedin.com/in/joshua-bandoch-02211b167)
Book (joshuabandoch.com/book)

Mentioned in this episode:
Mark Victor Hansen’s episode: How to Ask for What You Want: The Skill Mark V Hansen Used to Sell 500M Books (after 144 rejections) (howiechan.com/podcast) (Aug 18)

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