Episode 5: People & Performance at CPVO

Welcome to Seeds of Tomorrow, the Next chapter, the podcast where we explore the people, ideas and innovation shaping the community Plant for IT office. Today we focus on what makes CPVO truly thrive, Its people. How does an EU agency attract and grow talent? How does it prepare for the future of work while staying true to its mission of enabling plant breeding innovation across Europe?

To find out, I'm joined today by Tiago Souza, HR Team Leader at CPVO, and Anna Maria Sidri, Head of People and Resources Unit. Tiago, let's begin with you. You've been part of CPV OS HR transformation for several years now. Could you tell us a bit about your own journey, what brought you to CPVO and what inspires you in your role today?

Hi Daydream, First of all, the thanks for inviting us to this podcast. I think it's great to kind of show the other side of CPVO to our followers. And your question is quite interesting because indeed half of my career was in the private sector and I was very lucky to be flagged to start my career in the Commission.

So yeah, I started as contract agent in 2017, always in the learning and development. I started an executive agency where already there we had a very big project. It was related to competency maps because at the time the agency wanted to further develop their staff members and training is important of course, but they wanted to match it with the competencies of the future. So already in 2017 we were speaking about the future. What will be the future competencies required for a demanding environment as we lived there then and today is even more important.

Then a couple of years later, I was very lucky because I had a new coordinator in my team where she brought a different perspective about learning and development. So not only the formal aspects of training, for example, but also the importance of emotional, emotional intelligence, coaching, career guidance.

And around 2018-2019, we completely changed the way we worked at the time in the learning and development team. Then, as you know, 2020, the COVID hit. It was a demanding period for who was working in a European agency because nobody expected to work from home during two years, if I'm not wrong. And essentially we were a team of two people only myself and my coordinator at the time.

And it was a great experience and helped us to not only be more resilient, but also to see how we can put in place actions that help our our colleagues. During the same periods, we welcomed or on boarded more than 150 people from one agency to our agency, from AYAZ and to Cinema. And imagine two people team dealing with that.

In the 2022, my coordinator, she left to another EU agency and that gave me the opportunity to apply for the coordinator role. And thanks to the experience I acquired during those 2-3 years, I believed I was ready, so I stayed nine months as coordinator. Already during that period, we implemented innovative projects, for example, a new learning and development path, a career page. Also in You learn that is the platform we use a dynamic way for college to identify courses for themselves and but to make it shorter a little bit.

Nine months later, I quit my job. Why? Because I joined the CPVO and I joined the CPVO because at the moment of my I didn't, I was not sure if I should accept the offer or not. But my head of units and Maria, she told me, look, HR will be your baby. You will be able to do something from scratch because we want to modernise the HCPVO and HR is key in that aspect. So I think those words were essential for me to accept this challenge and that's essentially how I joined the CPVO in 2020 to September.

But I think later we will explain a little bit more about the challenges, the reasons and what we wanted to to do here and I believe we are doing. Well, thank you very much, Tiago for that. That's a very interesting career path. And now let's go to Anna Maria. You led the broader People and Resources unit.

From your vantage point, what does professionalism and excellence mean for an EU agency like CPVO in 2025? South First of all, thank you Dedra for having invited me today. It's a pleasure to share my thoughts with you in this podcast. I joined the CPVO in September 2021, first as head of HR, and then I became head of Unity in June 2022.

And indeed, the first step was to see together with the HR team what we could improve together. We did a lot of brainstorm, but basically I LED the, let's say the HR through an important process of modernization that was to become HR business partner. So we started from an administrative HR role. But when I arrive and I have to admit I have a very warm welcome and I was very happy that the HR team was waiting for me for for new challenges.

We sat together to see what we could improve and we had the several brainstorming session with the whole agency. The way they we invited them external stakeholders from the Commission to help us. We use participatory leadership technique and the outcome was a modern HR. So professionalism was there, but what in my opinion was missing is modernization, because indeed being decentralized agency is not so easy to be up to date and not so easy to go to Brussels. So we needed to be strong together and see to say, OK, let's see what we can do better and let's see how can we can be stronger together.

So basically the HR team started to anticipate the need of staff and management alike. And this was very important because administration is there. We are a new agency, we cannot get rid of the administration. But the role was completely different and also how the staff and management started to see HR was completely different from the past.

So namely, HR was there to help, to support, to anticipate a bit, to, to propose a new dynamics, new initiatives and stuff. Was very surprised when, for example, we, we asked them to participate in this away day for brainstorming, for defining the new HR strategy. It's a participatory process. It was not just OK, we decide on the HR strategy and the C, no, you are CPVO, we are CPVO and we build together the new strategy.

And this to me was the first milestone of building a new vision and to continue being professional, but with, let's say, a view on the future. Thank you very much, Anna Maria. So now let's talk about strategy. CPVO has been refining its HR vision in recent years, connecting people development with innovation.

Tiago, what were the key priorities when you set out to implement Cpvos HR strategy? So I think what Anna Maria said is kind of the backgrounds that I received or the legacy I received and when I arrived, because they had already prepared huge you, the agency prepared a lot of work before that culminated in the CPVO Strategic Plan 2326.

So when I arrived, essentially my first priority was to listen to stuff. I arrived in September 22 and from September to November, more or less, I had individual meetings with the management team, I had individual meetings with coordinators, heads of sector. We organised focus groups where I'm happy to say that we involved all staff members in this focus group.

We essentially my first priority was to understand the context because Anna Maria just mentioned the fact that we are far from Brussels, not only geographically but in terms of mindset and context as well. Because in Brussels it's very much Commission oriented. So which we follow the same rules of course, but we also need to understand that the centralised agencies, they enjoy more flexibility in some aspects, they can be a little bit more innovative.

On the other hand, and also something else is typically in the centralised agencies, the turnover is much lower in comparison to Brussels. So why I wanted to listen to stuff is to understand why our colleagues stay here for 10/15/2020, five years or 30 years. We still have our colleague Sergio who just celebrated 30 years a few weeks ago. And I couldn't come here and say, well, we do this in Brussels, let's do the same.

So that was the first priority. Then speaking to the management team and the President at the time was we were waiting still for the vice president. So the president was the one giving us the division for the future, was the fact that we wanted to prepare CPVO for the future. This may sound a little bit the buzzwords or just, I don't know, a trendy thing to say, but that was really the reality and to prepare the CPVO for the future. I, I can I repeat Ana Maria, but you will do it with your people. It's not with new tools, it's not with new computer or whatever AI etcetera.

It's with your people. So we essentially focus on three main priorities was the first one related to the fact we wanted to increase and upgrade our, the knowledge of our colleagues. So regardless the seniority, regardless their position, we wanted to map the competencies. That's why we put everyone together, understand what are which competencies we are already good and which ones we still have room for improvement thinking already ahead.

And just to give a little bit of context, because probably we will speak about that later, but in 2022, we didn't speak about AI yet. However, already in the competency map, we put as one of the biggest competencies digital, digital literacy. So already at that moment, we knew that technology is key to help us to do a better job.

So learning and development, improving competencies was one of the priorities. Second one was against central preparing the replacement of colleagues, leaving just an information that is in our public reports until by 20-30 up to 30 percent, 40% of CPV staff members may be eligible for retirement. Of course, some of these colleagues, it's their choice to to live in early retirement or not. But the fact is in the last three years only one person reached the pensionable age.

So the maximum wage that the person can work, all the others they choose to go in early retirement. So which means that our assessment was correct, is correct still in the sense that we need to prepare the agency to allow colleagues to leave their legacy in house. So the next colleagues, the next generation coming, they know what we've been doing and how we can do better for the future.

So the second pillar of strategy was preparing the future workforce of the CPPO. The third one, and that's why I say that when I arrived, part of the job or the journey had already started, was to focus on the professionalization of HR. So we know that a strong agency, strong institution, public or private needs a strong HR team. And we in these last three years since we implemented the HR strategy, we focus for example in reviewing the HR practices, HR processes.

We are trying to work on automation, We are trying to work on simplification of processes because if we want to have a team that is ready to adopt this customer oriented mindset, as Anna Maria was saying, that is important. Our HR team needs to have time for that. We will not ask people to work 60 hours per week.

We have only 40 and that is the same for everyone. So how do we do to allow them to have more time for that is essentially trying to reduce bureaucratic work through simplification but also more recently through automation. I believe that in 2026, it will be a strong year for that. We will continue that and because also Queen Sidis, 26, the end of the first HR strategy we have in place.

So just to conclude, we wanted to focus on learning and development. We wanted to focus on the future succession planning and finally HR professionalization to ensure that our team helps staff members but also the management team in achieving our strategic goals. Thank you very much, Diego. Anna Maria Taking a step back, how does this HR approach connect to CPVOS wider mission of supporting innovation and plant variety protection?

First of all, I think that we have to be visible because if our staff, our people keep on doing the same things they've been doing for the last 30 years, it's a kind of being surrounded by an invisible fog. What I mean is we, we need first to start the change from inside in order to be visible in the outside world and in order to offer more, let's say, services not just to our staff, but to be more present, for example, in job fair, to be more present in big and major events with also HR people. So it's not because we are not technical experts that we cannot attend important fairs with the colleagues of the technical unit.

So what I mean is we had to be more visible outside to make people understand we were changing our culture. And changing the culture is it means to be more appealing also for the external world and for the external world. For me, the stakeholders are not just the Breeders but is our students, for example, our colleagues from other institution, our citizens and citizens.

For example. Most of the work we have done is the work of representation. We went out to talk with to the town hall representatives for education, for crash. We went out and simply say do some, I would say diplomatic action to make our visible and say, ah, you know, we are here and what are you doing? Are you in a ground?

And it's no, I'm the head of HR. I'm the head of unit. Interesting. Where do you come from? So sometimes this little chitchat also helped us in getting notice. But I come back to what I just said is first of all, we started to be more dynamics ourselves and to be inclusive and to bring on in our activities, all stuff.

And this took time. But as I said, room, I mean wasn't built in a day. So we started from this in order to achieve better result beyond CPV wars. And this to me, Anna Maria, is how we became visible and how we started to have an impact in the outside world. Why I said we started because it's a process, it's ongoing.

So it's not finished and I hope it will not be finished yet. Thank you very much for that. We've also seen some concrete initiatives. CPVO launched its competency matrix to map skills and guide staff development, and hosted AI summer courses to give employees hands on exposure to emerging technologies. Could you both share how these initiatives reflect your approach to continuous learning and professional growth? So I will start at Diego.

Well, first of all, I have to admit that I applied something that one of my first director told me. I was very young, I will not say how much, but pretty young. And he told me, if you want to have a career in the institution, you have to be surrounded by people, by staff who are better than you. And I said, what do you mean?

You have to be surrounded by smart people, you know, and not to be #1 but to be surrounded by several, number one. And at the time, I have to admit I didn't grasp a really the concept. But now that I'm a bit more or less a mature in my professional path experience, seasoned, I applied it. But basically I recruited to to experts that are Tiago and Christophe that are helping me a lot in this process with automation, AI modernization.

And they have to admit that thanks to them, I started using AI not just because it, it is part of the managerial path. Our president is. Is very, let's say clear on that and is right, we need to use a new tools to be more efficient, to be more modern. But thanks to these resources, I think that I started to say play with the eye and see the the outcomes. Then of course they are in my uni. So I I cannot say much in the sense that there are other champions in the agency, not just in my unit. But this open paved the way to a new way I could lead the the unit.

Is that OK? I trust you. Show me what you can do. Show me what I can do thanks to the new tools and show the colleagues what they can do with the new tools. And I was amazed to see incredible as a developments, incredible to me. And then to see that colleagues were very negative about it, just suddenly became very positive.

But then I will let you explain how. So I, I do think, think that first of all, being surrounded by the right resources and the, let's say, unveil their talents, The first was the first key to me to be successful. And this again is an ongoing process, you know, something with the start and end. No, I see it still ongoing.

So I can only compliment what Animaria said and supports by the way, because essentially the AI we have the top management supporting starting with the president. So he, Francisco, he really want us to embrace new technologies and in from an HR perspective, what we noticed is people were getting a little bit anxious maybe in relation to AI because it's normal. If you go to LinkedIn, you can find 100 people saying that all of us from top management CEOs to the secretary will lose their jobs because of AI.

So it's normal that first of all, I believe we will not get there, not now, not in the future. I think AI will stay but will help us to do a better job. But anyway, this is my vision. What we understood, that's what I wanted to say is people were becoming a little bit anxious because of AI. But I mean, we are invited to use, but how, when, in which context, etcetera.

So essentially how we came up with the idea of the AI somewhere. And this is really an invitation for listeners when we say that CPVO is a place where people are welcome to innovate, to be creative is really true because this example is perfect. Essentially is HR. We and Maria, myself and other colleagues noticed this anxiety from colleagues about AI. And before summer break, I sent an e-mail to Anna Marie and Francisco saying, look, I'm learning about AI generative AII think I reached a level that I I'm willing to share my knowledge with other colleagues.

What do you think? If during summer, because I will be working in August, what do you think if we organize this AI summer course? The reply from both of them was immediately. Yes. Not any reply like, ah, be careful. I don't know. Are you sure? No, it was Yeah, go ahead. It's an it's a pilot. Actually, I think we call it even a pilot.

And I was a bit surprised because it it was August where normally people try to clean their emails, prepare for the entry, things like that. And we had 18 people enrolling in the AI summer course was impressive and more impressive as well was, and this is not a judgement, this is really, I want to see it in a positive way.

We had colleagues coming without laptop. So imagine coming to an AI course without laptop. So it was surprising for to me to understand what do these colleagues expect from the course. So this course essentially was four sessions. It was a very honest and transparent course. And I'm happy to say that the all all of them after the feedback we got, the official feedback from a survey was they would recommend the course to other colleagues.

They, the course corresponded to their expectations and eventually all colleagues at the end they brought their laptops. So they were testing because it was a very, very practical and hands on exercise. And when I say it was a honest approach was for example, we dis mystified a little bit the power of AI. So it's a powerful tool indeed.

But there are hallucinations, there are mistakes. So I didn't hide that from colleagues. I showed them and on purpose there are there were exercises about hallucinations to show them that OK, you will be needed. Our brains will be needed. It's not the AI who will do our job. And actually the AI act is very clear.

The decision process is still and I believe it will continue being like that made by a human, not the machine. I cannot do a mistake and send an e-mail to Anna Maria with big mistake and say, ah, sorry, I don't blame me. It was AI because I'm the one using AI, right? So what I want to say is that we wanted to take the lead as HR on this process. I'm happy to say that we, it was supposed to be one shot AI course and eventually we would hire an external company. We are already in the 3rd edition of the AI course because colleagues started speaking to each other, asking me to deliver another session and another session. So in January, colleagues from CPU who are listening, who will listen to this podcast, we will

organise a third edition. And this shows the commitment of all colleagues to embrace and be ready for the future. Because we are speaking about colleagues that literally they could already be planning the last stage of their career, like, OK, AI will be for my, I don't know, grandsons. But no, all colleagues are attending courses on AI, are learning about AI and they are really willing to, to, to use it. And I think that should make us all proud. And that's why, or the key aspect of why we are doing this is really to reassure colleagues because we also want to take care of them in terms of well-being, for example, and AII believe can help them in their well-being. Because if I have less routine

work or less bureaucratic work, I will have time for other things and hopefully it will also have a positive impact in well-being, for example. Thank you very much, Tiago. I was one of those who followed the summer course and it was indeed very interesting. Thank. You thank you for the feedback. Every organization faces HR challenges, and CPVO is no exception.

Tiago, what are some of the biggest HR challenges you see right now, particularly when it comes to recruiting in such a specialized field as plant variety protection? Yes, we cannot deny that is a big challenge. And on the other hand, we well, since we are in the plant fields, let's say we are collecting already the the fruits of what we've been planting in the last years.

Indeed we work in a niche for the technical aspect, but also for the intellectual property aspect. So there are not a lot 1,000,000 experts in this field that we could go outside and simply try to get them. Now it's a niche. It's also the fact that we are in Onge, it's not a capital and all other agencies placed not outside the capital. They also face some challenges in recruiting talent. However, we are trying to have a positive mindset and try to learn what we do well, what we could have done better and how we can improve.

So, for example, since 2023, we asked candidates why did you apply to CPVO? So we sent in a survey for more than 100 people and more than 60% of former candidates, not current candidates, it was candidates from the past, they replied. But we understood that we have here a diamonds literally because CPVO is a small agency and people believe that they can see the impact of their work when they join a smaller institution because they are not lost in 1000 staff members or 500.

So they can really make a difference. We are open to innovation, creativity, to different opinions. We respect that. So what we tried to do specifically for technical experts and legal advisors in the intellectual property was to target these two functions. In particular. We contacted universities, as Anna Maria mentioned, we contacted embassies in the different member states, Representation of the European Union at the Administrative Council of the CPPO, asking them to work with us and to advertise the our post. I'm quite proud to say this was an effort that was quite horizontal because I needed to work with the communication, I needed to work with the legal unit, with the digital transformation unit, with the

presidency and overall only for these two posts, more technical as you asked, for example, it's a niche. We increase more than 30% the number of candidates applying to superior jobs, not only 30%, but we also are becoming, and Maria mentioned that earlier, much more attractive for other nationalities. We are reaching countries that all EU agencies really fight and compete for the best talents.

For example, candidates from Sweden, from Denmark, from the Netherlands, from Germany that typically in the past didn't apply or were very a minority, let's say in the pool of candidates today, they are increasing and increasing. This is a lot of work, but we want to see it in a positive light because again and I, we insist, insist on this, it's our legacy. We will not stay here forever.

I hope CPVO will celebrate soon or more 3030 years and more 30 years and so on. This is our legacy is ensuring the future of the CPVO, and that's why this work is hard, but it's rewarding in the end. Yes indeed, it looks as if your work has paid off. Yes. So, Anna Maria, how do you ensure that CPVO remains attractive not only for scientific and legal experts, but also for professionals in IT, communication and finance this. Is a big challenge.

Consider nowadays situation this scenario, it's not easy. What I try is indeed to lead by example and approve missions to other agencies and go myself to network, to talk to people, to see what I can do and what I can propose as a head of unit to potential candidates. But it's very limited because we have of course rules to be followed and of course strictly this rule has to be followed very strictly.

And the fact that, let's face it, profile are very well paid in the private sector. So despite we offer competitive packages, of course we have the stuff regulation that must be applied. So I cannot skip it. So I, I try as much as possible to be visible again in order to, let's say, tackle a potential niche as Thiago was mentioned that we can attract. But still the main issue is to me the the stuff regulation framework because our selection procedure are still long despite we did an an amazing job in shorten them and really to run them smoothly.

But still on one side is very fair to the candidates and transparent, but on the other side, the process is cumbersome and we might lose the candidate because the process is still ongoing. So in a nutshell, I tried to stay visible with my unit, with my team visible and motivated, walk the talk. So also to show how motivated and committed we are, that we not only offer a competitive package, but also a set of ethics, a set of values, and this usually motivates as well people.

And how do you balance regularity compliance with the agility and innovation needed in a small but dynamic EU agency? This is an everyday struggle, but I have to admit that we win after the struggles of first of all, we relied a lot of automation and this process of automation, lean management helped us a lot. So in HR, in budget, accounting, internal control domains under my remit, we did an incredible work to be, let's say, more efficient to get rid of waste, to use the the lean vocabulary. And this helped a lot to be more creative, to bring on board new ideas to be implemented, which eventually we implemented. But again, it was a work that started from zero. So we had to invest a lot of

time in analysing how we could get rid or let's say of some of the red tape and how we can be creative and bring about a change. And it's a struggle because again, you come from the Commission environment and I'm commissioner say baby, because I started, I was 25. Last year. Last year and then on the other side, you want to be innovative, you want to be creative.

You have a lot of ideas to be implementing that. You want to go fast, you want to be visible, you want to, you want, you want to want. But then at the end of the day, my keyword is balanced. So we need to find as a team the right balance for us, the right balance for the agency. And those are the right balance not to run into burnout because we are only 15th agency doing the same work as bigger agencies. And this is important to underline that it also requires a lot of flexibility, adaptability. And I had to meet a lot of our, that we work. And that's why it's also my role to balance and to ensure that my staff is well, my my staff is happy and has the time to rest because without rest there is no

creativity. Indeed, the way we work has changed dramatically in the past few years. Hybrid models, Digital tools, Virtual collaboration. Tiago How has CPVO adapted to hybrid and digital work while maintaining a strong sense of teamwork and professionalism? Yes, that's a great question. And I believe that as we've been speaking, the work is never done in the sense that we need to continuously adapt new tools. Five years ago, nobody spoke about AI. Today everybody speaks about AI.

So essentially we try to to have the IT tools that help us to make the most out of the of the of what they offer in the sense that we use, for example, different channels for keeping communication. We have themes as everybody has, where we have a social corner. Colleagues, for example, is very active. Every week someone publishes something informing about events in Onger, for example.

On the other hand, we have launched 2 years ago, two months ago the CPVO newsletter that was kind of the continuation of the HRCPVOHR flash news. So the HR Flash news I think and Maria brought it in 2021, I arrived and we made it monthly HR flash news and the feedback was great. So the vice president, she asked why not having the CPVO of Flash news. So I must say, and this is apprentices, the HR Flash news was so good that people keep calling it HR Flash News despite the fact that this CPVO now.

So this is an internal newsletter that is growing more and more because units they want to communicate more with the rest of the stuff. Again, one of the things that we need to realise that the size of our agency doesn't doesn't measure the work we do in the sense that it's not because we are less people in comparison to a big DG or a big agency that our work is less relevant. So internally we need to take care of our colleagues and this CPV on newsletter is a great example because we have colleagues speaking about their missions, legal cases, for example, that the legal units shares with the rest of the staff.

The communication team also shares new tools or new innovative ways to communicate the LinkedIn guide they published, for example, for internal use. So we have these formal aspects. However, we we try to learn with the experience and improve and one particular case that we believe is very successful is the onboarding of news colleagues. So Onge where we live is a beautiful city is not me saying, but in the last five years, three times was considered the best city to live in France.

But we need to acknowledge that if a candidate doesn't speak French. It can be a limitation. So for one year we tried to use an external provider to help these onboarding of future colleagues and it didn't work. It didn't work because it was a local company. They were used to French clients. We gave them a second chance. They tried to be as professional as possible, but it didn't really fly.

So what we did was let's use our internal knowledge and the internal resources to help colleagues coming. So the onboarding before the someone arrives at the CPO starts one or two months before as from the moment they signed the contract, we launched immediately the pre onboarding and that starts with online meetings.

So maybe in the past, I don't know, I was not here. But before pandemic, let's say, we normally would expect the person or wait the person arrives to explain them everything the person can do or is entitled to or sending emails. And we make the most of these tools. We invite the person 123 times if needed to help them in the integration.

We created Newcomers Guide with the contribution from the whole agency to to build these guides and is very welcomed by newcomers because we speak not only about regulatory issues like salaries, allowances, training, but we also speak about CPVO. So where you can find a doctor or if you want to find a house, some companies that are known here in Onger but in France more generally speaking.

So just to conclude, we really try to make a huge investment in communication since this year internal communication was also under the remit of HR team. But as we repeat all the time, it's not a one team job. And that's why we have an internal group where we have representatives from the different units that eventually they, they give the inputs and the HR, the CPVO, sorry, you see the HR flash news, the CPVO Flash news is a contribution from everyone.

So we are trying to to work in that domain and ensure that we have appropriate communication channels and the healthy work environment. Thank you very much, Tiago, Anna Maria. And beyond flexibility, CPVO also invests in continuous learning and excellence. What does what does that look like today?

How do you measure progress in people management? But apart from classical KPI, but I don't think it would be a podcast on the key performance indicators be quite boring. I would like to share the fact that I have a personal approach on that, mainly because I'm a performance coach. So in 2020, I took this certification from the Coaching Academy of London. And I do believe in the people potential, even when the potential is not seen.

So it means that when I run my dialogue, annual dialogue with my stuff, I say, OK, I think that this objective for this year's is yours. I say you are completely crazy. I never done that. I don't know how to do. I will never achieve that. You know, let's make a bet. I always make a bet to €50 and I always win, but never ask the money. So why I say that?

Because when I say that, OK, I bet on you, it's a mind challenge. I mean, it's the mind changer. And I see that sometimes the challenge is accepted, but the person in himself herself does not believe that. Like I will show you that I'm I'm right and you are wrong. But finally people come to me and say, you know what, you're right. How did you know that?

Because I invest in people, I believe in people and I love really to unveil the potential and how do I measure that? But simply, when a a task that was not really not even sorry thought about is accomplished by the same person who come to me and say, I will show you that you're wrong. And then after a couple of months comes to me, You know what? You were right.

And I even had that in the Cdr in in the written report. I want to thank my head of unit because she she challenged me and she was right. And I'm grateful because I learned. So the keyword is learning. So what did you learn? What is the outcome of this? And I do not expect the reply as I imagine it, but I open I, I leave it an open question. And the answer I have are are very interesting and often is I learned something about myself I didn't know. I know that I can be creative or I didn't know that I could do that.

I never thought about that. And this is, for me, the most rewarding answer I could get. Honestly, It's amazing. Amazing. Thank you very much. CPVO is active within UNUAN, the European Union agencies network, where agencies collaborate on HR communication and innovation. Anna Maria, could you explain Cpvo's role there and why this cooperation matters? Well, the CPV always been part of the network, but for the last two years we are part of the steering board representing small agencies and it was our initiative that was warmly welcomed from the agency.

So it was a nice surprise when the agencies approved, let's say our request and basically is again to be more visible and to create synergies. The first time I participated to the network, it was in Barcelona and I ran a presentation on sharing the reserve list. And this was the the beginning of a new year, I would say, because it provoked a lot of reactions, positive and negative.

But we started to cooperate with the agency, not only to to share reserve list, but on new projects. So I invited colleagues from other agency to come here, not just from Brussels, but from other decentralized agency to talk, to share the expertise. We went there. One of the achievement is, for example, we run the Administrative Council Council in 2022 in Amsterdam, we were kindly hosted by EMA, the European Medicine Agency, and they offered us their meeting room, an amazing modern meeting room. And this was we call a gentleman agreement, but I was made this agreement again because we were visible, we were networking, we were talking to people, we were sharing our new ideas. And then we when Thiago arrived

is as well. He continued this present presenting provoking as well a little bit is also this our rule to to say, OK, you've done this, but what about we do something different. What do you think and I can assure you that in the room is not only smiles like OK, who is this lady or this man again, the CPVO bringing about a new ideas.

But what I can say the last meeting I attended them, we attended them. There are three days we concerted with days at three different levels. I share the fact that thanks to automation, Lynn and yeah, the accounting team is now very efficient. And from 15 people in the past, now there are three.

And people say, how did you do that? How did you do that? Say abracadabra, they have a secret. Formula the secret. Maybe, you know, as I look, because we work on that as a team. So we start to understand how can we be faster, how can we be lean, how can we use automation, how can you use AI? And how can we connect with other agencies and see how they do better than us.

And this is an outcome of the process that lasted years. It's not just one 2-3 and it's ongoing because we have great ideas, ideas for the future, but again is a way of being visible and say we are there, we want to support you and we ask you to support us is, you know, is two ways a change. And this works as as worked very well.

And I can see when the few times I intervened during this meeting of the young intervene is always a lot of interest that I see in participants. And I have to be proud when sometimes I go to other events, people come to me. Hey, you know what? Thiago's presentation rocked. Really, it was amazing. And this made me very proud of of the work we have done and we are doing honestly.

People will not see that I'm blushing with such compliments. But I I can only confirm what Emily is saying that I think we we don't let again, our size intervene in what we can contribute in this network and definitely in these meetings. They know now. CPVO, yes, I'm confident. Andy Rock Let's look ahead because the future of work is evolving fast. Tiago, From your day-to-day experience, what HR priorities do you see in the next three to five years in recruitment, development and engagement?

Well, I think that question really captures the the priorities that we have because it's true that speaking about 3-5 years may sound a bit too long because things change so fast that it's hard to imagine how we will work in five years time. Nevertheless, starting with the recruitment we 2023 we started analysing the future needs and also the risk for business continuity of some colleagues leaving due to department, the retirements.

So for that aspect we already identified the key functions and we started working on that. So we have an established reserve list for technical experts. We have established reserve list for legal advisors in the field of intellectual property. We will also very soon establish reserve list for IT profiles because as we mentioned earlier, we are competing with the private sector for IT.

And believe me, when we we are competitive, I believe at some functions the the private sector can offer twice of what we can offer under the staff regulation, especially if you want an AI expert. We are speaking about very high and demanding profiles and we will try again compete with our values and context mission to track those.

So recruitment is definitely something that we will try to attract more. We have already in place the recruitment page, but for the next HR strategy, we want to improve it even further. It was amazing that we already included testimonials from current staff members in this page, which we asked candidates if those testimonials were important. They replied, yes, definitely because it's not just institutional voice from the president, vice president or head of unit, head of HR, but real staff saying, yeah, come because this is great.

And by the way, colleagues volunteered to be on the video, so we didn't force anyone. That is one part. The engagement is also quite important for one simple reason. For the first time ever, here at the CPVO and everywhere, we have three, maybe 4 generations working together. And the generations, because of the technological impact, they have different views about how we work.

What do people expect from work, for example, unfortunately or not, I don't know, because some turnover is also healthy. But the generation that is now ending their career and they stayed here for 20 years, I'm afraid that that will not happen again. So the new recruitments we have, I'm speaking about people in their 20s, thirties, it's very likely that at some point it's not because of our size or because of the city, it's because they will want something new. So we need to take care of the engagement that is taking care of current staff.

So acknowledging their legacy and their importance to welcome new colleagues, but we also need to understand that CPVO need to match the expectations of newcomers. Another achievement. And of course, there are lessons and maybe we can have another podcast to speak about what we the lessons learned. But to have a positive tone here, I'm proud to say that the newcomers integrate very well.

Superview. So the play on boarding help us as well to understand a little bit the expectations. We have the 90 days on boarding plan for everyone including heads of unit. So in during the first 20-3 months, 90 days, we have individual career guidance meetings with the newcomer. We have the midterm review with the between the head of unit and the newcomer.

We try to within the first months to define the objectives and job description of the person. So that is part of the engagement because we know when this proven by now that when we go to a new, new workplace, first impressions matters. So if someone arrives at the CPVL and they are disappointed, the likelihood of theirs, they start looking for something else.

It can be high. And I, I'm happy to say that most colleagues, they are really very well welcomed. When we ask them for feedback, they say we and believe me, we have colleagues coming from European Central Bank, European Banking Authority, Court of Justice and they say they've never had no boarding as CPVO offers.

So we really try to catch their motivation, engagement, satisfaction since they won until hopefully a very long career and successful here. Then the learning and development aspect, part of the new HR strategy that we will start planning in next year will be the version two of the competency map. So we have today 12 competencies in this CPVO competency map, but we want to incorporate AI.

So very specifically on that, we want also to move to a higher level where not only we have the CPVO core competencies, but we have competencies pair job profile. Because what we typically say to newcomers is we don't know if people will stay with us six months, one year, 10 years, 20 years, their entire career. What we want is that they stay with us happy. And one of the things that we clearly see people stay longer is when we offer them learning opportunities. So the competency map in that aspect is probably playing a key role to to keep people in house satisfied and doing what they love and giving great value for us. Thank you very much, Tiago and Anna Maria. At the strategic level, how do

you see CPV OS workforce adapting to external changes from AI and new technologies to evolving EU policies and sustainability goals? Well, it's quite complex in a way and easy on on the other hand. Let me explain. So it's complex because on one side we have, as Tiago mentioned, a workforce that is here for 30 years, 20 years. So it's difficult to adjust.

And I do understand completely because it's a it's a requirement. But then, you know, it's like choose a metaphor. You have your garden that is always well maintained at at Christmas, you always have, I don't know, the Christmas tree, your Christmas decoration and all of a sudden you have no garden at all.

So it's a bit, let's say, awkward at the beginning and it's a challenge because what is in there for you? This is a bit the question to be to be answered. So I try indeed to see the competency and skills and talents of our stuff, to understand how we can work Better Together really to unveil this potential.

I unveil this, the new dynamics. But the other side is also the fact people are aging. I'm aging myself. The energy is different. So it's not that people do not want, but you have also to take this into consideration. And again, the balance you need to adjust, you be to be creative, you need to be smart. So.

It's it's an ongoing process that to me, Anna Maria requires a lot of patience, adaptability and creativity to find the right solution because it's more A11 solution. It's not a solution to all. And then there is the more disruptive part that is part of my job. For example, in management meetings when my colleagues are discussing or putting on the table the need for new recruitment. My question is often, do you really need a new post that say, oh, how come?

But it's not questioning the needs of the colleague is what are you doing with the current staff to energize them, let's say, to, to employ their talents. So have you explored other ways of doing things? And again, I go back to automation to Yaya, have you explore the opportunities first? Because a workload analysis, especially nowadays, is essential to evaluate where we are, where do you want to go and how you want to go to, to, to reach new objectives. And I'm not saying that we don't need new, new stuff. On the contrary, we need to fill the post in the establishment plan.

But we need new talents, we need new competencies. And before looking in the external world, we should focus more in the internal world and run strategic conversation with our staff. And this takes time, this takes energy and this takes again, patience and creativity because myself, I don't have all the answer.

So I need really to be in this coaching listening mode. That is not easy because we all have nights in which you don't sleep, a baby doesn't sleep or you know, it's, it's an effort also from from managers, but it's essential to understand how we see our current workforce, how we do imagine our future workforce and how we want to be happy all together.

And again, keyword happy because we have to be happy with the change we we take on board and we need to ensure that our staff follows up. That's the most important thing to be. Did many EU agencies face similar transitions? Digitalization. New skill demands generational change. Tiago, what advice would you give to other HR professionals working in scientific or EU agencies?

Well, again, another great question and very difficult or at least to make us think at the beginning of this podcast and Maria mentioned something that if you speak with HR professionals, heads of resources, presidents, the most of them, they say the same. That is OK, I would like to do that. But, and what follows the but is stuff regulation. And what we try to do here is OK, we have the stuff regulation.

We cannot deny. And so we are the first ones to we don't want litigation, we don't want to go to court. We don't want conflicts, of course. So we are the first ones to set that boundary in the sense we must apply the rules, whatever it takes, we will apply. On the other hand, instead of saying OK, but we try to say, OK, we have this and we have these resources.

Be creative. The other day I read an interview or an article at Amazon that in many domains related to HR they are not the best reference. Whoever the CEO or the Chairman, he sent a letter to all staff members or employees saying we need to go back to our our origin. As a start up. We need to think as if we were 10 people in an office without desks because we are too comfortable.

So what we try to do here at the CPVO is to do things that are within the strict rules we have, but we kind of think out-of-the-box. 1 of the things I can share is, for example, my legacy program. My legacy program was a program created by us. Essentially, we upgraded the handover. So in practical terms, what we want ultimately is that the person leaving will leave their handover. But we didn't just want a form completed by that person. We wanted really first to make the person feel they built a legacy and that legacy will continue. So this is just an example that other agencies are contacting us to know more about this program, for example. But this is just an example of, and my advice to other agencies is indeed think outside of the

box. Think that what if you were creating an agency from scratch? Decide that, for example, I, I great, I, I love fresh beginnings or fresh starts. Why not saying in 2026 we will start a new project and what can we do? What do we want to achieve? Where do you want to go? And don't mention the rules.

Don't mention implementing rules or staff regulation. Try to have the ideas and then think about how you can implement it. Be innovative. I think staff members, as Anna Maria said, deserve that because in the end of the day, we spend more time at work than we to our partners or families. So it's better we feel happy and motivated when we come to to to work.

I do relate indeed with something Tiago said. Because in my unit, while the great gift is the unit challenged me a lot. And at the beginning I was a bit suspicious because I OK, but still I'm the head of union. But then with text to the challenges, I grew a lot. I grew a lot and also we have this interactive conversation that are always brainstorming in a way meetings and because of the fact that they challenge me and I challenge them.

We grow together and I think this is is a very healthy environment we created that I use we because it's not just me. It's a a very productive process in which we do allow to challenge ourselves to get something better. So for me to get out my comfort zone, I would say mostly in a daily basis, it's a gift because at the beginning I was not so sure about it. But now it's like, OK, I have to see things from a different perspective and from a different perspective. I find new opportunities and they found new opportunities And I really do think that is vital to get out the comfort zone, maybe not daily for someone.

But what I mean is, is necessary for growth and is what is growth is our driver and will be our driver. And from a leadership perspective, what would you say are the essential ingredients for a motivated, high performing workforce? I do believe in leading by example. Since the very beginning of my career, I led by example, even if it was difficult, even if it was painful, even if I did not believe it in 100%.

And I was very lucky because I had the supervisor, director of people who believed in me and my potential, who coached me. And I did not have always the nice coaching I have. I had sometimes a hard coaching like, OK, you don't want to listen is your problem, not mine. But this helped me a lot because I did understand that if I want to have a performing team, I have to be performer.

I have to listen, I have to be patient and I need to believe. I need trust, so micromanaging does not work. At one point you need to let it go and say, OK, now it's your turn. Show me what you can do. I can do this is OK, let's do how you're going to do that. You have a deadline and we meet up and for me, this is a very as a powerful element of leadership is like I believe in you.

I trust you and I let it go. And when you let it go, then you know, results are flourishing. And to me, Anna Maria is also a beautiful thing. I see a lot of respect towards me. I see a lot of trust. I see a lot of recognition. And then at the end of the day, you know, of course we work, we have a salary.

That of course is important, but this nothing can pay that. The fact that my people respect me and in general I would say agency staff respect me because they trust my leadership and this is the outcome of years of work and still I'm in the middle of my path. So there is still a lot to go. Indeed, before we wrap up in one sentence, how would you describe what makes CPVOA great place to work?

It's dynamic. I think dynamics, we are very dynamic and it changes every time and this is motivating to me. On my side, I think it's transformation is the the word that comes to my mind that is more or less linked to to what Emily said. Because it's a positive transformation, it's not always easy. However, for new people that hopefully they will listen to this podcast and they are interested in our jobs, if they really are willing to embrace change, help in transforming and preparing an EU agency for a brighter future and modern future, I definitely believe this is the right place to come. And finally, what message would you like to share with future colleagues about the role of HR

in CPV OS mission? Not to be afraid of keeping evolving, to trust themselves. I think we reach ready a good level of transformation. So we said the basis of a potential brilliant future. So not to be afraid of AI, not to be afraid of exploring new things, not to be free of being themselves. I think that's what Anna Maria said. I think we can say the name of people in HR today is Lajon, Serial, Valerie.

I think they proved that they can also embrace new challenges. They, for example, when anime arrived, they were not HR professionals. They were coming from assistant of the vice president, accountants, assistant of the president. And they're they are a perfect example of someone who can change jobs, embrace a new function. Because HR is very specific is something that I sincerely believe.

It's about mindset. So I can only wish that they continue embracing the future change and with the positive attitudes and not being afraid. Yes, I totally relate with what Anna Maria said. Tiago, Anna Maria, thank you so much for sharing your insights today, and congratulations for all the remarkable work you've done in HO.

Thank you. Thank you later. At CPVO, people aren't just part of the system, they're at the centre of innovation, excellence and the agency's future. And to our listeners, thank you for tuning into Seeds of Tomorrow, the next chapter. In our next episode, we will continue exploring how CPVOS internal ecosystem works, this time looking at how people and finance connect.

We'll welcome Anna Maria Sidery once again alongside Christoph Yakovlev, CPVOS Chief Accountant, to discuss how resource planning and financial strategy turn vision into measurable impact. Stay with us and see how excellence grows, one seed and one person at a time.

Episode 5: People & Performance at CPVO

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