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The Fourth Curtain

von Alexander Seropian & Aaron Marroquin

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A GUIDED TOUR OF VIDEOGAME MAKERY! Hosts Alex Seropian (founder Bungie, Wideload, Industrial Toys) and Aaron Marroquin (Art Director, Game Designer, part time magician) take you on a tour of the minds that create our favorite video games. We may also wander around in our own heads too. We aim to inspire, educate and entertain you about the games you love, the people that make them and hey, if you're not a gamer we know you know one. This will help you connect with them too.

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  1. The Wizard of Wizardry Brenda Romero

    The great Brenda Romero is our guest. CEO and co-founder Romero Games, she’s made both commercial hits like Jagged Alliance, and true art games like Train. BAFTA winner and author of Sex in Video Games, she still has time to 100% Balatro. W

  2. Octodad's Philip Tibitoski Grows with His Gamers

    Founder and CEO of Young Horses Phil Tibitoski joined us to explain how you can succeed without greenlights! Their student project Octodad went on to IGF fame and solid sales, followed by the charming Bug Snax. We talk knowing when to ship

  3. The Spiky Strategies of StarCraft's Rob Pardo

    Our guest was chief creative officer at Blizzard and helped drive some of the biggest videogames ever, like StarCraft and World of Warcraft. Now CEO of Bonfire Studios, he's making a new title, Arkheron. We discuss smurfing, game seeds and

  4. You Don't Know Jack's Mike Bilder Laughs Out Loud

    If your hilarious party game is laced with snark you know the work of this week's guest, Jackbox CEO Mike Bilder. One of the legion of the Midway diaspora, he saw the transition from coin-op to console. We discuss drive vs crunch, streaming

  5. It's Raining Technology with Nexon's Owen Mahoney

    We have an insight-packed and hopeful discussion with Owen Mahoney, CEO of Maplestory's Nexon. This Choplifter fan went on to acquire JAMDAT and DICE for EA, then saw the future with Embark. We discuss forever games, where stories come from

  6. The Guts of Indie with Animal Well's Billy Basso

    We're hyped to talk secrets with Billy Basso, creator of the award-winning smash Animal Well. Beginning with educational and medical games he went on to solo develop Animal Well, which delivers a huge game in less than 40 MB. Surgery, celeb

  7. Patrick Söderlund and the Raiders of the Arc

    We kick off Season 4 with Patrick Söderlund, CEO/founder of Embark Studios and maker of the hit Arc Raiders. Former head of DICE and Battlefield at EA, he found faster ways to build. We discuss owing the community, AI, and incredible value

  8. We Open the Curtain on Season Fourth

    Our intrepid hosts provide a prologue to the fourth season of the podcast with a wide-ranging conversation on the state of the videogame industry. With appreciation for GDC, Resident Evil 9 and Phil Spencer, they also talk (of course) AI an

  9. Grade Expectations 2025

    For our end of year episode Aaron and Alex reflect on the year and a raft of topics in videogame dev: Steam Deck vs Switch, understanding how AI will work for dev, Netflix's place and "successful to nice" ratios! Devils and Dungeonauts with

  10. Live Long and Prosper with Amazon's Christoph Hartmann

    VP of Amazon Games Christoph Hartmann is our guest. At BMG he helped launch GTA and went on to co-found 2K Games and publish NBA 2K, Civilization, Bioshock and Borderlands. We discuss the upcoming King of Meat, a very fresh take on how AI c

  11. Trip Hawkins, the Electronic Artist

    We're thrilled to speak with Trip Hawkins, founder and CEO EA, 3DO, Digital Chocolate and more. From childhood football strategy, to WWIII Sims, he grew to make a company of electronic artists who made legendary games. Calming Steve Jobs, h

  12. Ghost of Yotei's Mud Blood and Steel, with Sucker Punch

    It's a one-two move with Sucker Punch's Chris Zimmerman and Brian Fleming. Now shipping Ghost of Yotei, they tell us about leaving Microsoft for Sony and becoming a gamedev powerhouse. Tales of exact pitches and being great instead of good

  13. The Origin Stories of Elder Scrolls' Paul Sage

    We get an inside look this week from Paul Sage, founder and CEO of Ruckus Games. Inspired by Ultima 3, he worked his way up to lead designer of Ultima Online, to Borderlands 3 and more. Now working on a new project at Ruckus, we talk LEDs t

  14. How to Make an Atari Sandwich, with David Gardner

    David Gardner joins us this week with tales of the early days of videogames. A teenage tech prodigy, he was employee #11 at EA, ran Atari and is now a games VC. We talk Hawkins distortion fields, Atari sandwiches and when EA was hip - this

  15. Indie Megabooth's Digital Nomad Kelly Wallick

    This week we talk with the founder of the Indie Megabooth and games VC Kelly Wallick. Through her indie beginnings to her investing portfolio, community has always been the core. We discuss the Indie Game Festival, spotting hits and making

  16. Fallout's Feargus Urquhart Stares into the Abyss

    Our guest is Feargus Urquhart, founder and CEO of Obsidian, the premier maker of videogame RPGs. Having mastered 27 second pizzas he moved to testing and production of huge titles like KOTOR, Baldur's Gate and Fallout. We discuss snatching

  17. Making Myst a World with Rand and Robyn Miller

    Our guests are Rand and Robyn Miller, founders of Cyan (World) and creators of the smash game Myst. From humble beginnings in Hypercard kids' games, they made the 3D puzzle experience Myst which changed the world of adventure games. We disc

  18. World of Warcraft's Seth Sivak Tips the Dealer

    Our guest this week is Seth Sivak, VP Development for World of Warcraft at Blizzard. From early years at Zynga he became Founder and CEO of Proletariat, shipping big games like Spellbreak. We discuss being an Imagineer, the three components

  19. Night Street's Mac Reynolds Captures the Last Flag

    Our guest this week is Mac Reynolds, CEO and co-founder of Night Street Games, making the PvP shooter Last Flag. As manager of the band, Imagine Dragons, he learned how to find magic from the grind and now applies that to a videogame. We di

  20. Oregon Trail's Phillip Bouchard Blazes Deadly Paths

    Our guest this week is the poster boy for educational software going massively mainstream, Phillip Bouchard. Starting in the world of mainframes he created a worldwide hit on Apple II and beyond. We talk Apple getting kickstarted and scienc

  21. Killer Instinct's Adam Boyes Tears Down the Walls

    Our guest this week is Adam Boyes, longtime co-CEO of Iron Galaxy and now founder of Vivrato. From Killer Instinct to The Last of Us Part I, he’s helped bring major games to life and now supports devs launching their own. We discuss putting

  22. Dead by Daylight’s Rémi Racine Bets on Himself

    Our guest Rémi Racine is the founder & CEO of Behaviour Interactive—the studio behind Dead by Daylight and dozens of other titles. A veteran of the games industry for over 25 years, Rémi has helped shape not just iconic games but also the e

  23. Uncharted's Nolan North's Weird Ability to Yell

    Our guest Nolan North has brought to life your favorite videogame characters with his voice! From Uncharted's Nathan Drake and Assassin's Creed's Desmond Miles, to scores of others, he is a top talent in the industry. We discuss the freedom

  24. Hogwarts Legacy's John Blackburn is Cool in the Arcade

    Our guest John Blackburn is a founder and CEO of Avalanche Software, makers of hundreds of games for dozens of platforms, such as Hogwarts Legacy and Disney Infinity. He has tales of when games paid royalties and having to take a chance. We

  25. What Have You Got to Lose with Blizzard's Michael Morhaime

    Our guest Michael Morhaime was President and CEO of Blizzard during its glory years, shipping Warcraft, Starcraft, World of Warcraft, Diablo and more! Now Founder and CEO Dreamhaven he's won an Emmy and is in the AIAS Hall of Fame. We discu

  26. The Sims' Bing Gordon is Specifically Right

    Our guest Bing Gordon has had a long successful run in videogames and tech. From marketing lead to Chief Creative Officer at EA, he helped shaped NASCAR, The Sims and other huge titles. We discuss pitching, two beer strategies and Speilberg

  27. Portal's Kim Swift's Cake is Not a Lie

    Our guest Kim Swift turned a student demo into the mega-hit Portal. Previously the Head of Creative for Xbox Games Publishing, she also did level design on Left 4 Dead and was Design Director for Star Wars: Battlefront II. We discuss how to

  28. The Blinding Flame of Red Dead's Christian Cantamessa

    Our guest Christian Cantamessa began in point and click adventures before becoming lead designer and writer for Red Dead Redemption. Now CEO of Day 4 Night Studios Inc., he is also the writer and director of the film, Air. We discuss concer

  29. Command and Conquer's Louis Castle's Triple Threat

    Our guest Louis Castle helped invent real-time strategy games with Command and Conquer and has a BAFTA for Boom Blox. Now leading Childlike Wonder Games, we discuss casino ethics, switching to real-time and building toys - this week! Top 8

  30. Tencent's Amir Satvat Flexes the Data Muscle for Good

    Our guest Amir Satvat wants to get you a job in games. A business development executive at Tencent, he won the Game Changer award for the incredible community he built which has helped over 3k gamedevs find their next role with mentorship,

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