4 Dimensions of Worship

Steve Zank: Hey, welcome back to the Lutheran Worship Podcast brought to you by the Center for Worship Leadership at Concordia University Irvine. My name is Steve Zank, joined always by the one, the only the one whose namesake my daughter is trying to name a bearded dragon at her school, Kit Fox.

Kip Fox: How's that going? How's the voting going on? The Bearded Dragon.

Steve Zank: my daughter told me that today there's over a hundred submissions for names of the spirited

Kip Fox: Wow.

Steve Zank: dragon. So Kip, I gotta tell you the the odds are you your name is amidst a large pool of names. So we'll see

Kip Fox: It's okay.

Steve Zank: if it becomes a kip. But anyway, here

Kip Fox: Mm-hmm.

Steve Zank: we are, Kip and I. if you don't know our podcast, you can go back. We a weekly podcast show. You can find episodes on all kinds of topics. We just finished a series on looking at the songs of the Always album produced by the Center for Worship Leadership, The Songwriter Initiative. And we met with some of the writers and had a great time. If I interest you, go back and do that. Today we're starting a brand new series that we're doing for a few weeks about worship planning. In particular, we're talking about the four dimensions of worship, of an experience of the ceremonies and rites and the rituals, the order of the divine service. And we're using the framework provided by Dr. Mashke from his textbook, Gathered Guests, a wonderful book. If you don't have one on your shelf and you're looking into questions of Lutheran worship, this is a great place to start the conversation. so The four dimensions we're talking about over the next few weeks are encounter, education, evangelism, and expression. What are the categories you use when you think about your planning? This is a big question. You know, I think sometimes for people, the categories might just be like, I need an opening song. Have you ever been there, Kip, when you're playing your worship planning life? I just need an opening song this Sunday. I don't know. Something familiar. Some people will sing.

Kip Fox: Yeah, absolutely. Yes.

Steve Zank: sometimes you sing a closing song and you're just thinking about plugging songs in. And that's where you get really tired.

Kip Fox: Right.

Steve Zank: And you're like, I just need to get it done. maybe it's a really busy season of the church year just trying to get the services planned. We understand that.

Kip Fox: Something that the people know that's the right feel and the right tempo, but we didn't

Steve Zank: Yeah yes.

Kip Fox: just do last week, but it's not t too new. You

Steve Zank: Yeah.

Kip Fox: know, those things.

Steve Zank: And so those are all practical things. They're important. We're gonna give you some some new lenses though. four new ways of thinking about your planning and selection in the liturgy and in the songs that you you use for a divine service. and the four of them kind of work together to shape an entire experience. And so over the next few weeks, we're gonna talk about each of these four categories. But today is kind of the primer, talk about how they work together and what we mean by them. And at the end of the day, really the big takeaway is when you plan the divine service. You think about liturgy, think about songs. You're not just thinking about what song is a great beginning. You're thinking about how is this song help people encounter God and his word? How does this song gonna teach people, educate them? How is this song gonna bring about the gospel, evangelism? And lastly, how is this gonna bring about the proper expression of God's people? And so you want to do all four of those in our design of the divine service. Sunday to Sunday. Can't any thoughts on that?

Kip Fox: No, well, yes, lots of thoughts on it. but we're gonna share those. I don't wanna give it away.

Steve Zank: Yeah. Okay. let me tell a story then about some some of my experiences about this. I think one of the key takeaways for today's episode will be talking about keeping these in in balance. And when you think about balance, what I mean is if you overemphasize one, it often is at the detriment of others. So let's talk about, for example, the one that comes to my mind quickly is education. So if you overemphasize education in a service, what can end up is you can actually make it feel like a classroom where like during the sermon I should take up my my notes and I've got to take a bunch of notes. And taking notes is fine. I'm not saying that. But if it feels like a classroom and I my my job there is to be a learner and and take notes and make sure I learn a lot of things. it could be to the detriment of the other dimensions. So maybe the encounter with God is thought of less 'cause you're really thinking about how you got to learn something new. I was in the context with the church, and there's a young child there during the sermon, and I I remember a moment where the young child looked like kind of around the room, looked to his dad and loudly said, and those of us with young children can understand this, that the the child loudly said, you know, is is the sermon over yet? You know, in the mid in the middle of the sermon, clearly not over. Just started like the third point. And sometimes if you overemphasize education, whether it be the sermon or in the songs we select, it can make s the service feel like it's just something that we go to to learn something from.

Kip Fox: Yeah, no, I I can think of several instances where yeah, it it feels like maybe it's maybe it's within the message itself or it's the service as a whole where you just feel like what else is happening here other than I'm s supposed to maybe be writing these things down to take with me? You know, and so like you said, encounter can be can be seemingly missing. an opportunity to express my faith is can be missing. and certainly sometimes the gospel itself can be missing.

Steve Zank: Can be. Yeah. And I and I think it's interesting to note that I I believe it was Leia, Wilhelm Leia it was, who thought that Luther's Deutsche Mess was over didactic, that it was like it was too concerned with teaching and

Kip Fox: Mm.

Steve Zank: some of the the ways in which the service is just beautiful on its own, or an experience of beauty and reverence. Leia thought that Luther kind of missed the the vote on that and he overemphasized education. Up for debate. But there's other things too. So then if we have too little education or too little thought about the way we do education, that could be harmful. You know, if if you're not thinking about the you know, how are the kids learning about Jesus through this sermon? how are people being formed here in the faith through these r rites and rituals? What do they become to believe about God, about themselves? Like those questions are cr still critical. We can't underemphasize though those experiences either. let's kind of get our bearings again. The four dimensions of worship we're talking about that are relevant to planning are the encounter, education, evangelism, and expression, according to Mashkey. So we explored education a little bit. what about I think encounter is an interesting one. Encounter. So when we come for the divine service, of course we're going expecting To have an encounter with God. if God's not gonna meet me there at the divine service, I don't know what we're doing there. So that is an incredibly important dimension, is the encounter. And I see actually the way I talk about this sometimes is a different approaches that people have to encountering God. That can actually lead to some problems here in this category.

Kip Fox: Yeah, I think encounter is an interesting one. you know, I don't think folks realize necessarily at most of our folks coming into our services understand that the encounter is initiated by God. And even though we're the ones showing up, he's the one that invites us and gathers us. And so there's a perspective there of encounter where we may our our people or even as leaders, we might be convinced that we are somehow delivering this encounter and as agents of of of God as his people we certainly are preaching his word and administering his sacraments but God initiates that encounter and we respond to it and so that's a really I think it's an interesting thing to remember. and then on on the other side of an encounter there there can be that risk of of having an expectation of folks you know, we often leave our worship services talking about sometimes measuring the the intensity of our encounter as if

Steve Zank: Yeah. Yeah.

Kip Fox: worship is good or not based on that experience.

Steve Zank: Yeah. And if we didn't feel the encounter based upon our senses, in a very strong way that the service kind of fell flat or something like that. if you're looking at the congregation and you're thinking, Man, like not everyone has their hands raised or something like this, or you know, the whatever the the verbal version of that is, the singing version, like with gusto,

Kip Fox: Mm.

Steve Zank: then something's really wrong with this gathering. And I think that's that is exactly I think one of the big problems with overemphasizing encounter. Is that begin to look for God in all the wrong places. And I think that's

Kip Fox: Yeah.

Steve Zank: kind of key is is we look for him in places he hasn't promised to be in necessarily. So I'm gonna look for God in my emotional response to the song. Well, that God didn't promise to meet you in in your emotional response to the song. Not that you can't feel that or, you know, God might work something through the song itself. That's also thinking God can do. But I think what's really important in the encounter category, we'll get to this later, we do the whole episode on encounter, is this idea that, you know, for Lutherans in our theological perspective, is that when we gather, we look for God in the places He's promised to meet us. And for us, that is first and foremost his word in oral written and sacramental forms. So his word spoken by the pastor or by the people sung. His word written in the scriptures and read. And and then lastly in the Lord's table, that his word, in the words of institution and what is promised to deliver us in the bread and the wine, that is his true body and blood for the forgiveness of sins, that that's something that we we gather on the table expecting an encounter. and by that It's a eye through the eyes of faith. We're that God is giving us his true body and his true blood for the forgiveness of sins and for the his church to be one around his table. That he's making that happen. That is a Lutheran approach to encounter. And I think, yeah, I think sometimes we can overemphasize encounter by looking for him in the wrong places. That's kind of one of the

Kip Fox: Hmm.

Steve Zank: dangers, I think, there. But also underemphasize it when we treat the word as if it's just something to learn from. You know what I mean?

Kip Fox: Yeah.

Steve Zank: Like here's a sermon, we're just gonna again this that's the education side of getting too big.

Kip Fox: Right. When you think about these four E's, education and encounter are kind of the two two sides of of the fence, right? And so now they all

Steve Zank: Yeah, it could be thought that way maybe.

Kip Fox: work together, they're all balanced, but then in the same way that evangelism and expression, you could kind of see maybe it's a four a four way fence that we're falling off of, but I certainly see how education and encounter

Steve Zank: Totally. Yeah.

Kip Fox: can kind of have a direct

Steve Zank: Yeah. When you overemphasize education, you might underemphasize encounter. And vice versa.

Kip Fox: Mm-hmm.

Steve Zank: Like there's a like a bit of polarity going on there. yeah, and and then I think about evangelism, which is critical. I mean, if we're not evangelizing the divine service, I don't know you know, what we're doing, 'cause the gospel's gotta be center and what's being done. And so actually it's Hermann Sassa has a great quote where he says that the service of the word is the greatest chance of evangelism that the church has. The service of

Kip Fox: Mm mm.

Steve Zank: the word. So this experience that we have to gather around God's word and to hear the gospel really is a is one of the very critical key things that happen in the divine service is the we're being gospeled, that we're hearing the good news, that we're being forgiven, that we're we're living a life of repentance where we're returning again as sinners, eager to receive from the what the Lord has to give us as a community. So I think that's a really big part of the service. If if there's no evangelism happening Then and I think you got a big issue on your hands with your divine service.

Kip Fox: Yeah, it can be and well it can be a pretty it can happen, especially if you're if you're creatively planning outside of divine service or even within it when when a preacher preaches and and only kills with the law or and doesn't bring back to life with the gospel or doesn't kill or bring back to life and just sort of misses the point entirely. You can certainly develop a habit or have services that that do not evangelize.

Steve Zank: Yeah. Yep.

Kip Fox: and then on the same at the same token, if if there isn't a chance then to respond, to express thanksgiving and praise for that, then we're not giving that last E, the expression part, its its place in a service.

Steve Zank: Yeah, and I think the the greatest temptation I've seen in in the church today, pardon me, regard to evangelism is to remake the entire service in the image of evangelism. And

Kip Fox: Mm. Mm-hmm.

Steve Zank: by that I think about images like, have you ever sold a home, Kip, that you lived in?

Kip Fox: Uh-huh.

Steve Zank: It's like that. I mean, you you

Kip Fox: Yeah.

Steve Zank: the relator is calling and saying, Hey, we got someone who's coming who might buy your house.

Kip Fox: Yeah.

Steve Zank: And then so your mom or your dad, or if you're an adult, you're like, okay, we gotta clean everything up. Like everything that's out of place, everything that's a little bit unique or a little weird, that's like part

Kip Fox: Right.

Steve Zank: of us living our lives together as as foxes in your case, you know. We we gotta hide all that. And so when they come, they see sort of this really clean version that makes sense and and there's not a lot of things to deter, kind of quote unquote deter people.

Kip Fox: let's talk about expression, Steve. What what comes to mind for you when we talk about Mash Keats gathered guests and his thoughts

Steve Zank: For expression.

Kip Fox: on expression?

Steve Zank: Yeah, I think when we overemphasize expression, it actually begins to undermine the value of gathering for the divine service anyway, in the first place. Because

Kip Fox: Hm, yeah.

Steve Zank: if gathering is all about me expressing my faith, I might as well go to the beach and do that. You know, where I can I could

Kip Fox: Yeah.

Steve Zank: do it my way. But I I gotta gather at this whole this this whole community of people who have different different opinions about things than me and different approaches than me. And I've gotta like sacrifice so we have a mutual life together. and they sacrifice for me, you know, vice versa. Like that's a bit of a pain in terms of expression, you know? And these these fights have have been present in our church. You know, some people love to express themselves in more modern aesthetic songs, and some people don't. And it gets kind of difficult. And the church

Kip Fox: Yeah.

Steve Zank: needs to wrestle with itself, make room for each other, and you know, sh shave off the the edges of that. Maybe the drums were too loud. You know, that could be possible actually.

Kip Fox: Yeah.

Steve Zank: When someone older comes and says the drums are too loud, it's possible they're right. You know, it's not

Kip Fox: Yeah.

Steve Zank: it's not just like, we're different expressions. but so I think there's something there that that if it was just about expression, you just might as well go to the beach and have a good time with your journal and express your faith in God. it's a component, but it can't be all the whole deal, you know.

Kip Fox: Yeah.

Steve Zank: What do you have you seen things that that you come to mind about it being out of balance?

Kip Fox: Well, I'm trying to think about the other the other side of things on the the uniformity side of things or even just as a congregation as we talk about sort of insider sort of things, perhaps not adjusting to or being aware of opportunities for expression from all different generational and and economical and cultural backgrounds, you know.

Steve Zank: Yeah. Yeah. Genuine expressions of faith for people. Yeah.

Kip Fox: And it's hard. It's hard as a worship leader, as a as a music director, a worship planner to be well, especially when it comes to the music, about finding a balance and helping a large group of people confess their faith in a way that is meaningful to them. So it's r it's really hard work. It's not just a s I I find a lot of times, again, falling on both sides, you've got I see a lot of churches thinking that they are doing maybe doing things from the radio because that's what the people want when they show up. And

Steve Zank: Yeah.

Kip Fox: and so many times I think I don't know that that's r really the case. it it is for some, for sure, it is for a percentage, but again, when we just if again, just strictly speaking of musical expression for folks it should be really a balanced approach and a constant connection with your culture and your community a as to what

Steve Zank: Yeah.

Kip Fox: is the heart language and the musical language of your people. It's not

Steve Zank: Yeah.

Kip Fox: just one or the other. and it doesn't have to be perfectly blended either. It can it can be one or the other, but we just have to do a really just I think a better job. always with maybe saying a better job is a little bit law oriented. I think we

Steve Zank: That's okay.

Kip Fox: we owe it to our our people to be in tune with just the best possible musical expression, each and every service

Steve Zank: Yeah.

Kip Fox: in each every song.

Steve Zank: this one as specifically kit be a fun one to talk about, I think, because I think about this just now from what you said. I think a lot of times people think that if you're gonna do quote unquote contemporary music, and

Kip Fox: Mm.

Steve Zank: by that I don't mean you know, I'm not saying what kind of songs, I'm saying the instrumentation.

Kip Fox: Yeah.

Steve Zank: For a lot of people it comes out of the desire to evangelize. And then

Kip Fox: Right.

Steve Zank: it's criticized 'cause that, like, well, gosh, like why are we making all these changes for evangelism. But to your point, for c certain communities that are doing this really well, you know, they're th they're realizing actually there's a big part of this that's for the sake of expression.

Kip Fox: Yeah.

Steve Zank: We're not making these additions of s of a new style that isn't quote unquote new to the church. But it's been around for a long time now. It's been around for two generations now, probably, right? It's not

Kip Fox: Yeah, yeah.

Steve Zank: new anymore. But a certain style of music What if it comes out of expression, a genuine expression of God's people of God's people in a community in their faith, and they sing a song that has a guitar and a djembe or even a drum set and a bass and all those approaches, if it's genuinely coming out of a area of expression, that's different than if you're changing everything for the sake of evangelism. And so These lenses we're talking about today, then, really the big takeaway we're hoping that you see in this conversation is that when you're making plans, when you got your planning center open or your hymnal open, you're like picking songs and and maybe picking some liturgical elements, think about your work more broadly than I need a song. Think about how is this song going to affect the way that I am planning for an encounter with God? The way I'm planning for education, the way I'm planning for the gospel to be proclaimed in evangelism, and the way I'm planning for these people to have a chance to express their faith and the fullness of their faith, right? Not just one part of it, but the entirety of what it means to be a Christian today, in the world, but not of it. And what that whole experience looks like. And so, Kip, I think we've done a good job at this point of covering the four E's. If we keep going, we might s we might

Kip Fox: Yeah, it's tempting not to get

Steve Zank: Yeah.

Kip Fox: get too deep into

Steve Zank: We may you may take away from our ability to talk about later. yeah, so so let's consider that together. That these this four dimensions of worship, of the the ceremonies and the rites and rituals and the music we pick, that those selections are affecting these four categories and our experience of them. And that's actually really quite important to think So Kip, I I feel good about that. Anything you want to add to it?

Kip Fox: Well, as always, don't forget about weaveworship dot com where you can read

Steve Zank: Okay.

Kip Fox: about all these different many different songs that can be selected. you can look up doctrinal terminology and understand all sorts of things about your planning. So don't forget about weaveworship dot com, Steve, if you don't know about it already. We've got a lot of new songs on there. We just had the

Steve Zank: Yeah. Yep.

Kip Fox: Always album come out. He comes to dwell, our Advent single. We've got a nine track album for Advent coming soon. soon and you can already listen to it if you go to weaveworship dot com and start planning your advent.

Steve Zank: yeah, thanks for that, Kib. That's that's a great resource. and we're proud to produce that and to sustain that and hope it's helpful for you in your work. All right. thanks for joining us today for this episode of the Lutheran Worship Podcast. And we'll see you next time.