The Recommendation Economy Comes to Restaurants — Pat Venn, PRIMA

Jeremy Julian: Today's episode is brought to you by Restaurant Technologies Incorporated. They are the leading automation for cooking oil system out there in the market. If you're not familiar with them, they've been on the show a few times to share some of the unique and cool things they continue to do with oil management. I recently had their newly appointed CEO on the show, and they built an end-to-end closed loop automated oil management system that delivers, monitors, filters, collects. And recycles your cooking oil. It sounds like they do a ton, but it really is a cool system that I think everybody should be considering looking at. They clean up one of the dirtiest and dangerous jobs in your kitchen. So if you haven't heard of them, I would encourage you to check them out. rti-inc.com, or you can call them at 888-779-5314. They've helped over. 50,000 customers of the United States with their cooking oil. So clearly they are doing something right. And now back to the episode. Welcome back to the Restaurant Technology Guys Podcast. I thank everyone out there for joining us, as I like to say. I know you guys have got lots of choices out on the internet to spend your time. So thanks for hanging with us this week. But Pat, before we jump into kind of kind of where you're at now with Prima. Why don't you give our our listeners a little bit of background? Where did you come up through the hospitality industry? And then kind of what was your latest, latest role right before you jumped on the on the prima board?

Pat Venn: Yeah, well appreciate. Thank you for having me on, Jeremy. yeah, so I I came in through hospitality on the on the tech side. voluntary good I I did consulting sales for for quite some time and it was as as boring as it sounds. And so I was at kind of a crossroads and and asked myself, you know, what actually interests me and and in my entire life hospitality has been a big part of it. you know, I've I've kind of grown up in hospitality, I love going out to eat. you know all that kind stuff. So just looked at the kind of the space and and heard a podcast that Nick Oconis, the founder of Talk, did found it to be an incredible idea. So I reached out, was lucky enough to get a job there and was at talk for a number of years. So my my role was was really on on more of the sales side and and growing all of our major markets. and then through that we ended up selling to Squarespace right during or after COVID, because talk did, you know, quite well during that time with the pivot we had. and then found our way into American Express through another acquisition. And then once I was there, I led the enterprise team. So led all the big restaurant groups, hotel groups for for talk and then, you know, Amex Global Diving more.

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Pat Venn: Yeah, so talk is very interesting in that it was the platform that that kind of zigged when everyone was was zagging. And and I say that because Nick Oconis, who was the founder, had had owned the Alinea Group and and and you know, kind of built talk for his own restaurants because back then things like no shows were a major problem, but also the the inability to showcase the restaurant, the experiences and events. that they have was was fairly limiting. And so he had built talk kind of as as a solution to his own problem and in in creating and in building talk, built a solution that eliminated no shows, but also did a very good job at kind of showcasing everything a restaurant has to offer. And so I think, you know, especially in today's day and age, what's what's quite interesting is like this plan experience. And I know experience is like a huge buzzword. Everyone's probably tired of hearing of it, but everyone is kind of searching for that thing to do. It's why, you know, influencers I think are as as successful as they are. And so, you know, the the general premise is people can't buy what they can't see, you can't attend what you're not aware of. And so what talk did a really exceptional job of was creating a virtual storefront for the restaurants that showed a cool chef's table or a prefix meal or a wine dinner that was upcoming. And then had payment tools that eliminated no shows because turns out when you do something like put a deposit down or for force you know full payment up front, no shows are much less likely to happen. whereas something like a credit card hold you know does not do the trick and is actually not very hospitable because people get you know fees or dings after they don't show up. So it was a very, you know, fun, innovative company to work for. it was very product focused, which I always appreciated. and we were quite successful in the fine dining, Michelin, and winery space. and and it's because we solved kind of the big problems that they all have.

Jeremy Julian: Yep. Well, and I think part of what I appreciate you sharing, because when I saw the methodology, I'm not gonna lie, I was like, is that really gonna work? But the thing I loved about your guys's worldview, and and I guess I'd love for for you to confirm this, is it felt like it was much more restaurant focused, whereas the competitors in the space, the open tables of the world were much more much more diner focused and could I don't want to say c care less, but didn't care nearly as much about the brand as they did about the diner. And so talk felt like it was. for the restaurants to be able to to protect their asset of the reservation that might be there. Cause I and I guess I I'd love a little bit of a little bit of opinion on that before I jump into kind of what you guys are building at Prima.

Pat Venn: Yeah, I think that's right. I mean, I think the the the reservation platforms now are all becoming a bit more operator focused, which is great just more broadly speaking. But you know, tool wise, you know, the the platforms that existed at the time certainly didn't think about, you know, how do you actually have how do you make it so that you can build a platform where that restaurant can run its restaurant as a business, not as as a hobby, or or you

Jeremy Julian: Mm-hmm.

Pat Venn: know, the hospitality. you know, forward thing. And and I think at the end of the day, you know, no shows are the things that absolutely crush a restaurant, especially a busy one. and so if you're able to eliminate that, what is what is typically, you know, a fifteen, twenty percent no-show issue, if that goes to zero to one percent, that's a lot of revenue, that that you're actually then producing and and and keeping for the restaurant itself. So, you know, I I think it was again an innovative, fun company to work for and and I

Jeremy Julian: Yeah, no, and I I I love that you kind of went on that journey. So, and that's insane. I didn't know it was fifteen to twenty percent. And I and I guess I'd love for our listeners that are that are maybe in the restaurant space but don't run a fine dining establishment. We've all been there where we're like, well, but there's open tables. It's like, why can't I sit? And we've all struggled with that. We show up to a brand, we want to eat, they've got a table, but now they're waiting to see if the no-show shows up. They're texting, they're calling. It creates a lot of friction to your point. And so I love that I love that you guys were able to solve that. So I guess Now fast forward to today, Pat, you've you've left American Express, you know, dining and have jumped on the team with Prima. What is Prima and kind of what are you guys trying to solve for? Because it sounds like you're taking a lot of the experience that you had and I guess thinking about it differently. And so I'd love to love to to get, I guess, kind of a high level view and then we'll dig into to how you guys are going about it and what what you guys are looking to do and how you're looking to change things again.

Pat Venn: Yeah, I I think so, you know, one of the benefits that I had with with my job is I've had the fortune of talking to thousands of restaurants. and you know, what's interesting, you although every restaurant is very different and they're run very differently with different people and different personalities, you kind of hear the same themes time and time again. And two of those are, you know, how do I drive more business and how do I drive the right type of business? And and the problem, nobody knows how to solve that. Nobody knows What is actually effective at driving more customers, driving more butts and seats, and nobody knows how to target the right type of diner. You know, I think what's very interesting in in restaurants now, you look, you get you go to New York and you see the restaurant that, you know, you gotta book four weeks in advance to to even think about getting a spot. But the problem with that is that restaurant that's booking four weeks in advance, the type of diner that is gonna set their alarm clock and and you know, snag that reservation at midnight. Is not the one that's gonna come in and spend.

Jeremy Julian: Mm-hmm.

Pat Venn: you know, it's it's like it's the 20-something that wants to go in and post on you know Instagram and say, look where I'm at, and we'll get a salad at Diet Coke and they'll sit at the table for three hours. That actually hurts the restaurant. And so, you know, even the busy restaurants have this problem of finding the right customer. and so at the core, that that is what Prima aims to solve. our founder, Alex Daranofsky. back in the day, created the first affiliate marketplace. And all

Jeremy Julian: Okay.

Pat Venn: that meant was you had all these websites with you know ad space, you had all these advertisers looking to get onto those websites on those websites. There was no way to actually talk to one another. And so he created the solution that just connected, you know, the these affiliates, these advertisers with the websites, right? And the entire premise of Prima is taking that model but putting it into the physical. And so what we've done is created this network of valuable diners, people that we can then give access to the restaurants where they number one, know who that customer is and where they came from, but number two, ensure that it's the right type of guest that they're looking for. How we do that is is what makes us, you know, very unique because you know, there's there's a lot of players that would take a membership approach or, you know, it's straight B2C and they'd go and find a bunch of people to sign on and You know, build a network in that way. We've taken a completely different approach and that it's all affiliate-based. And for those that aren't, you know, familiar with affiliates, all that means is we go to businesses that have a supply of diners or a supply of people that would be valuable to any type of business. And so that could be a four or five-star hotel, that could be a high-end residential building, that could be a concierge network, that could be loyalty-driven programs. There's many different corporations that fit that bill. We give them access to our platform, which has all the restaurants in our network. And by giving them that access, they then can promote Prima as an amenity or benefit because we've curated the best restaurants and experiences in that city while providing additional access, exclusive access, that they wouldn't be able to get publicly. And so we've really now created this model where through our affiliates, through our partners, we've grown this network of a lot of people that then drives Great diners into the restaurants.

Jeremy Julian: I love that. I guess I'd love to hear a little bit, Pat. So you alluded to it, and I think a lot of people go, I just need a loyalty program. And I actually did just a solo episode recently on just kind of not all loyalty programs are created equal and they're not really they don't fit for many brands, but people think, I'm just gonna launch a loyalty program and I'm gonna start collecting email addresses and start sending them to to people. It you you're for those that are watching on video, they see you shaking your head. Why does that not work? Or why is that not the it might be part of your arsenal. It might be an arrow in your quiver if you're the right brand and it makes sense, but it's not right for everyone. And a lot of these brands that you're talking about are certainly not the right kind of brands where you're those those high net worth individuals, those people that are sp, you know, have deep pockets that are looking to spend, they're looking for something extra. They're not looking for a free cup of coffee or a free chocolate lava cake at the end of their meal. They're looking for something else. And I'd love for you to talk through why just standard loyalty doesn't work and why Prima really sets itself apart in in a different way.

Pat Venn: Yeah, I mean I've a I've a lot of thoughts on loyalty generally speaking. I I think a lot of companies rush to loyalty because they look at their competitors and they're like we're not differentiating ourselves. And so they build these programs or things that they think the customer wants, but a lot of it just falls flat or it just looks the same as everything else. And so they're still in the same spot that they were before. you know, I think loyalty now, a lot of it what people are really looking for is access at the end of the day.

Jeremy Julian: Mm-hmm.

Pat Venn: Like they they want access, they wanna feel special and they wanna feel like, you know, whatever they're using or whatever, you know, they're they're putting into, they're getting a huge benefit out of it. It's very similar to airlines. I think airlines have actually done a very good job in the loyalty space because once you're you know, if you're on United and you're a one K member, you have a lot of access that you wouldn't have gotten if you were a silver or whatever platinum or whatever it might be. So, you know, I I I think loyalty itself, the the big problem Company to company is it does not travel with you. And one of the things that we're looking to solve with Prima itself is every customer or every person that we have, we can actually start to understand loyalty business to business, restaurant to restaurant. And when you start getting a lot more data points on who that customer is, how much do they spend? How well do they treat staff? How well do they tick? How often do they go out to eat? How often do they show up when they say they will? When you can get all that information, you can start to really profile people themselves and the type of diner they are. And when you can do that at scale, you've actually then created something for the restaurant in which they know who that customer is and where they are on that loyalty scale before actually coming in. And so to the guests, it's very you know, it's it's huge because they're incentivized to do the right things. You know,

Jeremy Julian: Mm-hmm.

Pat Venn: when they're at a restaurant to treat staff well, you know, to to not. Just no-show a restaurant, you know, give them a courtesy call. Into the restaurant, they're actually able to then understand how to fill their room or what how to perceive value for a specific guest, even if it's their first time in. And so, you know, that's kind of the bigger picture that that we're looking for. I think for us, the the high value, high net worth person is is where we've gotten our start. But That by no means is is where Prima wants to end. I you know, we want everyone to be a part of our ecosystem, but at the same point, there's a value that that is assigned to that person because if you're trustworthy and if you've if you've proven yourself time and time again, every restaurant in every city would take you last minute. and it's that lack of visibility and understanding and how loyalty is not actually transferring business to business that creates this friction right now that we're trying to fix.

Jeremy Julian: Yeah, I never even thought about the idea of of measuring the guests and how do the guest engage with the brand and being able to do the double-sided marketplace almost. The the restaurant now knows this person's not gonna be the one that's gonna get the HR complaints because he's hitting on the hitting on the cocktail waitresses or or he's a poor tipper

Pat Venn: What's a drug?

Jeremy Julian: or he constantly sends his food back and is complaining all the time, or the opposite, he's one of those people that always shows up on time for his reservation, always is in and out in the time that you need him to be. Cause those people are are A lot more valuable. Is that kind of what you guys are seeing through the data?

Pat Venn: Well, and think about this. How would a restaurant fill their room if they knew the value of the of the diner that was making the reservation? Right? It certainly wouldn't be released on your reservations four weeks out. they they'd rethink about how to attract the right people and make sure the right butts were at the right seats at the right time. Because at the end of the day, again, you know, like again, nobody the most embarrassing thing in the world is a bad Uber rating, right? And and that's Uber has done a very good job at at kind of assigning value to a customer and creating the right behavior so that that Uber rating goes up, not goes down, you know, it doesn't go the other way. And

Jeremy Julian: Mm-hmm.

Pat Venn: if if you can kind of apply that to the restaurant space and add loyalty behind it, where you know the the the better patron you are, again, it's not just about spending money. It's how well do you treat people? How are you trying to like you know, trust is a big part of it. There there's many different components that come into what makes somebody a quality diner one way or the other. But if the better you are, the better access you get, you can actually get to the point in which what people want out of loyalty, which is true benefit and access, the things they want to do.

Jeremy Julian: that Tom. one of the things that we talk about in our business on the on the SaaS side and and I'm certain in affiliate marketing is the whole idea of cost of customer acquisition. It sounds like you guys are figuring out how to solve that customer acquisition, you know, thread in an offline world, but kind of an online world. I'd love to to talk about what that looks like because to your point, all restaurants are looking to figure out how do I get the right butts in the seats and how do I get them to come in more frequently. And so with

Pat Venn: Yeah.

Jeremy Julian: that, Awareness is a big piece of it, letting them know you're there, letting them know that it's available, understanding what that looks like. But we all know, especially those most loyal guests, those best patrons, typically spend. And I I guess if you have any statistics pat to share with that, I heard from a recent podcast guest. He said that the what he calls the elites, which are those, those, those high they're nine to ten times more valuable than just even your regular. The people that are there once a week, and I I guess I'd love for you to talk a little bit more about that, because you can For those elites, those people that are coming in all the time. I I sit in a CEO group once a month and he's a f a capital girl guy and he gets treated like a king, a capital girl, because he's there every week. And he's like, dude,

Pat Venn: What?

Jeremy Julian: I spend so much money here, but he's bringing groups of ten or fifteen people in. And if they don't treat him like a king, him going away is a pretty big deal for capital. And and so I guess I'd love for you to talk and and work through a little bit of that with with me.

Pat Venn: Well so that's that's again like the age old question is is how do you actually identify that person, right? Like I what's interesting was that that that the king of Capitol Grill, if he goes to another steakhouse, he's

Jeremy Julian: Yeah, Flemings is right across the street and we've gone to Flemings once. And I'm certain they noticed it because it's every Friday the fourth Friday of every month. We're at that same Capitol Grill for lunch. It's eight to ten people, probably a thousand dollar check, even at lunch. So sorry, I'll let you keep going. But yeah, we've gone once to Flemings and I and I'm certain it impacted that week, that day's sales on on that one store.

Pat Venn: But Funmix had no idea before he walked in, right? And so how would that treatment have changed if they actually knew how that person came in? Exactly

Jeremy Julian: If they knew that they could potentially move him from one to the other. Absolutely.

Pat Venn: right. And and I think like there's you know, with with prima more broadly, at at the end of the day, You mentioned like cost of acquisition to a customer. restaurants just don't know what where their marketing spend is going and what's working. You know, you have influencers. How much does an influencer bring in? Nobody knows. Google ads, social ads. There are so many different things that a restaurant does to try to attract a customer, and yet they have no real idea what is actually working. And by and large, the biggest of of any pie is always recommendations, right? Like if I'm going to a city. And I have a friend that says you gotta go to this restaurant, I'm much more likely to go to that restaurant than I am pulling up, you know, an open table or resident or any of the sites and just deciding where to go at that moment. And again, you cannot attribute that recommendation. And so you know, when when when we're talking about freedom and why I bring up affiliate marketing and and kind of attribution and you know, at the core of what we're really trying to do, it's bringing visibility to understand. where that customer came from. So if I'm staying at a five-star hotel, you know, if I'm staying at the Waldorf Astoria in New York and I go to a restaurant, you know, if I go to American Bar, what's cool, Primo, is, you know, if I go to Waldorf and I book through Waldorf Astoria to American Bar, American Bar knows that came from Waldorf Astoria. They know exactly where that business came from and the value that business then has to that restaurant. The same thing can be applied on the influencer side or just people themselves, right? If an influencer posts, hey, go to this restaurant, but there is no link or action or you know, storefront on their own social that that drives that customer to that restaurant, there's no attribution. So again,

Jeremy Julian: Mm-hmm.

Pat Venn: like we are really just creating the rails of attribution where that influencer could, you know, on their on their Instagram or their Link tree, have a prima storefront that has their favorite restaurants in the city, and anything that then books through that link. The influencer gets attributed to and earns. So, like, I I think at the end of the day, you know, when it when it when it comes to like acquire a customer, I just don't think restaurants really understand at all where their customers are coming from or how what that dollar value even looks like. And it's because at like the actual attribution of things has been impossible to do in the physical world. you know, things like recommendations or I say at this hotel and the concierge says go here. No no that's tracked right now and and that's what we're we're really fixing.

Jeremy Julian: Yeah. I got two real quick side stories, Pat, before we keep going. The first of which is I was at a at a business dinner a couple of months ago and the guy that was the host, and it was probably a dozen of us, said, you know, everybody stop, pull out your phone, give me your Uber rating, read it out loud. And I don't know if you played that game, but it was kind of funny. And it was like,

Pat Venn: Yeah.

Jeremy Julian: what are you what are he, you and and he happened to have the worst rating of anybody. And so it was kind of cool just because we're sitting talking and it was like He had the worst rating and I'm like, Why do you have the worst rating? And he's like, I got drunk and I you know, I di I did something

Pat Venn: Yeah.

Jeremy Julian: stupid and it it turned into a fun story. But from a business setting

Pat Venn: Yeah.

Jeremy Julian: I thought it was a really cool game. And have you ever played that? I I saw you kinda chuckle a little bit about it, but

Pat Venn: I have I have played it. my Uber rating wasn't great at one point 'cause I was young in my twenties. but I it is now at a point where I'm I'm proud to show it and and and aren't aren't so scared to to play that game.

Jeremy Julian: Good, good. The other one was funny enough, I was in Cabo about a year ago, Cabo San Lucas, down in Mexico, and I'd gotten off kind of the the tour bus. I was there with a with a customer and I don't know, it's 40 of us that went into the downtown area. And to your point on recommendations, we asked the bus driver, what's the best place to get tacos? He gave us a place. Then we asked somebody in in town, they they we'll walk you there. And they walked us there and and the the guy that I was with, He's like, well, why did why did they go to such lengths? I'm like, because he got paid by that restaurant to bring us to the best tacos in this freaking downtown area, because he knew that if you brought us there, one, it would drive the business up for that guy. And so you talk about that in the physical world, but that doesn't happen. That was in Cabo, that just happened to be in a in a in a guy that was, you know, these are this is where you find the, you know, because we'd specifically asked for the place that the bus driver had told us to go to. And

Pat Venn: Yeah. Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Julian: he's like, No, no, no, no, no. You don't want to go to that place. That place is for the tourist. I'm gonna take you to the real place that's the best tacos in Cabo. And he took us to a place maybe a block away. And my buddy who I was with is like, how did that just happen? And I'm like, dude, because he got paid. Not only is he expecting us to buy him tacos, but he also is getting paid from the restaurant owner to do that. And so to to to kind of what you guys are building, I know that's kind of a silly story, but it feels like you guys are doing both sides of that equation. Is that kind of a fair analogy, even though it's pretty r rudimentary?

Pat Venn: Well that's the point is like that recommender, if if he's recommending or she's recommending things that aren't good, guess who is not going to trust that recommender or or recommendy, right? So like at the end of the day, you know, with with Prima itself and and you know, to we're talking about the wider vision, our our wedge to start is is certainly just connecting great diners to great restaurants and and make sure that there's attribution to that. particular diner where they came from so that the restaurant understands. But the rails of what we're actually building here is the ability to attribute the physical world through recommendations or things of that nature. You know, we we call it the the recommendation economy. And all that means is any person that recommends anything should have attribution. And and restaurants again will pay for that attribution in the same way that they pay for Google ads. There's no difference. except they know exactly where the customer came from and how valuable that specific channel is. and and so it most of it's just visibility. And you know, to to create that visibility, you just need to build the rails beneath it in which you have this, you know, this these demand, you know, partner silos, whatever you call it, these pockets of of places in which people are looking or booking. If you just add a rail underneath that. that then directly attributes where that person came from and the place that they actually went to, everyone wins. and so that's exactly, you know, the point is is we're building both sides.

Jeremy Julian: Well, talk to me a little real quick, Pat, about how do I keep it open and honest? In a Google world, like we know that we get ads and you know, it's like the you know, three-point font that sends us an ad and you may or may not know. And and, you know, and and again, I'm I'm saying this out loud to our listeners. They're like, So you're gonna pay to have these people come in and say the right things about my food or whatever else. And and so I guess I'd love for you to help overcome. the opposite side of that that says it's slop, it's crap that, you know, people are doing this, or you're just paying for them to say good things about you. But it's not necessarily where you want it to be, I guess on both sides of that equation. Cause I I'm certain I can hear people saying, this is never going to work. People aren't going to really do that.

Pat Venn: Well, it in the same way that people want their Uber rating to be high because, you know, they they they don't want to look like bad, you know, bad patrons. In the same way that we're on the on the the restaurant side, you'd want your your you know, your premium score to be as high as possible because that gets you access to things or builds loyalty. On the recommender side, it's the exact same thing, right? Like, you know, you would know you know, it it's all comes in the the the actual experience that that person has, right? So

Jeremy Julian: Mm-hmm.

Pat Venn: I think the problem now, we'll use influencers as a really good example. There's no more toxic relationship than influencers in restaurants right now. Because the influencer comes in and they say, Give me a free lunch or give me a thousand dollars. And the restaurant's like, for what? And the influencer's like, Well, I'm gonna promote your restaurant and you know, like you should pay me because I'm gonna drive you business. And the restaurant goes, How do I know? Right? And and that's such a problem. And in in the reality, and the funny thing is influencers are driving business, but they can't track it. There's no way to attribute that booking. And so I think a lot of people understand, you know, in the same way that you know, Like to Know It and Shop My Exist, you know, those are affiliate marketplaces for influencers. And when you go to a Like to Know It page and you go on and you go to an influencer and you see that they're they're selling some spray tan, not that I'm a spray tan guy, but you you purchase that link, you know the influencer gets a kickback. Like and but if

Jeremy Julian: Mm-hmm.

Pat Venn: people are willing to do that. And book that page because they trust that influencer. If you just, if if it's built on the trust element and people that you actually, you know, trust their recommendations and who they are and what they would actually send your way, you have no issue giving them that kickback as the consumer. and so I think it all stems to like that trust factor and and and making sure that the right people are getting served the right recommendations. by people that are actually, you know, in their trust.

Jeremy Julian: Love it. thank you for for overcoming that because I just I could see people saying that and I it's amazing how many people I hear that even have found out about products like you guys are building or whatever else from the podcast. And because I built, you know, 300 plus episodes talking about things that they go, that really helped me when I when I checked it out. They they

Pat Venn: Yeah.

Jeremy Julian: will end up buying and it's good for good for everybody. So I guess you've talked a lot about kind of where you guys are at today, Pat, where the vision is at. Talk to me a little bit about what engagement looks like. I'm a brand. I've got, you know, I'm the Alinea group and I want to figure out Prima. I'm I'm, you know, Thomas Keller and I want to figure out Prima. I'm, you know, even a a a lesser, you know, both of those are super high end. Even a lesser brand that that's kind of a casual dining brand. Where do what does it look like? How do they engage? Where are you guys at geographically? we're recording this kind of in in late July of of twenty twenty six. So You know, if somebody's listening to this six months from now, chances are you guys have grown beyond that. But but you know, kinda w what's the engagement look like and what can they expect the experience to look like from your team?

Pat Venn: Well, so our our goal is to be in you know the hundred biggest markets across the globe, hundred and fifty markets. right now we are live in New York, Miami, London, Paris, Abiza, as well as soon to launch Barcelona, Madrid, Philly, Boston, DC, Chicago. so we're we're growing quickly. the you know, the challenge Prima certainly is that it's market to market, but The the our our ability to stand up that market is is relatively quick because to the restaurant, we are not adding new tech. We are not asking them to rip anything out. We live on top of the system in which they use, and they only pay when there's performance. So there is no, you know, subscription model, anything of that nature. It's true affiliate marketing in the sense that if business is driven their way and it's quality business, that's when payment occurs. And the kickback. happens in that you know obviously we take a cut of of that payment but we also then kick back to whoever drove that business right in true affiliate marketing fashion so again the the markets rely right now Miami New York London Paris on the restaurant side it's again it's a it's about a 10-minute call and it's just plugging into our network it's really that simple so we just take their basic hours of operation We ask them, all right, well, when you see you're sold out, how many additional covers or diners can we can we sell at XYZ slot, whatever that looks like, and they're set up and they're live. On the affiliate side, and this is where you know, whether you're a four or five-star hotel, you're a concierge network, you're a travel advisor, you are a loyalty program, right? You are a corporation that is big T and E spend. Can look all different types of ways or things. But in that case, you're actually then able to leverage Prima in our inventory by promoting us as an amenity or benefit to your guests, tenants, diner, or you know, whoever might be a part of your overall program. that's set up again, very quick still. but the the cool piece is, you know, if you're again that five-star hotel, what better amenity than providing your guests a digital link or an email or text that says, because you're staying at this property. You know, have access to the best restaurants and experiences in town. and and the you know, the kicker being that they're still making a kickback when that app is or you know, when the link is actually being utilized by the guests. So it's a win-win because again, the guest like, my God, I'm saying at this hotel, like into this restaurant that I could never get into, into the hotel, they're still actually able to earn on the demand that they're driving for the first time. Because, you know, again, a hotel specifically, they spend so much money getting people to the hotel. But the second

Jeremy Julian: Mm-hmm.

Pat Venn: that person leaves those four walls, their earning potential goes away. We fixed that.

Jeremy Julian: I love that. I love that thought. real quick, so as a guest, I guess, how do I know what brands are available? Do you guys have that kind of publicly on on where things are at? or does it have to come through an affiliate? And, you know, how do I kind of learn, hey, I'm going to New York next month, I'm I'm listening to the show, I'm going to New York next month. How do I go experience this as a diner?

Pat Venn: Yeah, so I mean go to our website, cramapp.com. generally speaking, it does have to come through an affiliate to get that level of access. But again, you can go to our website and and you know, if you're a user or diner and you want access to it, you can always do an inquiry and you know, we're happy to accommodate and and and give access. I think, you know, when when it comes down to the value to the diner, like obviously number one. We're kind of curating all the best restaurants and experiences in town, but then there's the access on top. so you know, I guess the one thing I, you know, haven't kind of mentioned on the whole earning piece is is, you know, the ability for that hotel. I, you know, I did mention how they, you know, they leave, go beyond the four walls, they can finally earn. The cool thing about how our model built is built though is anyone that brings people into our ecosystem and on our rails makes an earning off that person for the lifetime that they're using the platform.

Jeremy Julian: wow.

Pat Venn: So, you know, the entire idea here is it builds and builds and builds and that work compounds and compounds and compounds because anyone that brings people in or recommends a restaurant or whatever it might be, then earns in the same way on a tail of however often that consumer is using the

Jeremy Julian: That's awesome. do you have any success stories, Pat? Like, is there a restaurant that comes to mind as you're thinking about somebody that's like, hey, they got on and this is what it looks like for them? You know, you talked about kind of some of the early success of talk and just kind of dropping from twenty percent. Where are you guys at on kind of that journey? I know you guys are kind of early in in your your growth, but talk to me a little bit about what can people expect if if they hit a home run, you know, related to things.

Pat Venn: Well, yeah, my my favorite is is Mila in in Miami, which is you know the highest grossing restaurant in in the country. when we started with them, you know, it was very like, you know, we'll start off small, yada yada. Now they take just about every reservation we send their way because the guests that we're sending them are coming from the Faina, the W, the One, the Ritz, the Edition, you know, all of these incredible hotels across Miami. And so, you know, we we for them have created this VIP channel of sorts in which they know people coming from our network are ones that are worth kind of taking in the sense of making room for and that are to come in and spend and have a great time. And so they've been an a know exceptional partner to us. we're certainly in the network formation stage still and and what I mean by that is Miami's where we got our start and it's kind of where we call home, although I'm in Chicago. you know, New York and London and Paris are kind of in the the early formation of of really getting going. But you know, the beauty of of again how how every network works is it it compounds more the more people that come on because the more people that come on, the more people that refer, the more people that are a part of this like recommendation economy, the more it grows.

Jeremy Julian: Love it. where's it going? Where's it going? You talk about kind of the vision for where it's at. I'd love for you to kind of just you know, get, you know, get close to wrapping up with where's it going? You know, three years from now, when when you jump on the podcast and talk about all of the incredible success, where do you see that vision for the group and for what it is that you guys are building?

Pat Venn: Yeah, I think there is definitely a fine line between staying focused but also, you know, marching towards the North Star. you know, when we're talking about five years from now kind of alludes to what I was really getting out of of the recommendation economy. And, you know, we want as many users on the platform as possible. And it's it's not just restaurants, right? It's experiences, it's events, it's ticketing, it's anything that anyone wants to experience, should be an offer that they can book. Through Prima itself. you know, as it grows and grows and grows, and again, like this is where, you know, I I we we definitely want to stay focused, but what we're building the rails to do, any really vertical could be a part of a recommendation economy. If you're a plumber, you're a technician, or you know, you're any service provider, it works in the exact same way. You know, when when I when I need a electrician, God knows I am not just like Googling. Best electrician, I'm asking my my most recent friend who I know had an electrical problem. I'm asking, you know, like, was that electrician any good? And if the answer is no, then let's, you know, on to the next one. So, you know, there's there's no reason that same premise can't apply. I know that seems out of scope, but our goal for the you know foreseeable future is kind of nail the hospitality space, get as many users on the platform through our incredible affiliates, start to understand the score of those particular people and categorize. the value that they would bring to any hospitality business so that you know we kind of fix this problem where loyalty doesn't travel restaurant to restaurant and and instead you know it it does follow with you

Jeremy Julian: Love that, Tom. you said it earlier, but where where do people go to learn more and kind of, you know, how do what does the engagement look like for a restaurant? Because again, most of our listeners are probably restaurant people out there. So I'm a restaurant. I just heard this. How do I get on the wait list? How do I know that you're coming to my city next? You know, whatever that looks like.

Pat Venn: Yeah, so just go to premaapp.com. and on there there there's a a way for you know you to just identify that at your restaurant. obviously we will answer any inquiry immediately. So happy to, you know, if anyone wants to reach out personally as well, you can find me on LinkedIn or email me, Patrick at primavip.co. but premaapp.com is a great place to start.

Jeremy Julian: I love it. Pat, thank you for doing what you guys do. I love I love these these stories of people that are looking at a problem and saying, Hey, let me go, let me go build something to solve a problem that restaurants have struggled with forever. and the fact that you guys are doing it in such a unique way is really, really cool. To our listeners, guys, I know I said it at the onset. Thank guys for hanging out with us this week. If you haven't already subscribed to the show, please do so and make it a great day.

Pat Venn: Awesome. Thanks, Jeremy.