ACOTAR: High Lords Deep Dive - Powers, Heirs, & Missing High Ladies

0:00 You know it's funny, I actually wrote in my notes I for one think it would be Baller if Baron died and the Lady of the Autumn Court ruled instead none of her sons seems super worthy. I kind of think that the lady of the Autumn Court is the line. Like I think she's the one. All right, guys, we just watched a YouTube video how to pronounce all these names.

0:31 I hope you're happy. OK, guys, hold on, contacts, This is our High Lords episode. We're going to be talking about the High Lords and the title of the episode. You're right. You're right. You're right. You're right. Yeah. Ronnie and I were like, let's watch a video to see how these fucking names are pronounced and we're about to riot. I'm going to tell you right now.

0:49 Calius. Calius. Are you joking? Are you joking with 2L's? This makes no sense to me. This is Riorson all over again. Riorson, Rierson all over again. Yeah, I'm still not with you on that one, but. I know you're not. Nope. Can I tell you I posted? Go ahead. No, you go. I posted a story on Instagram a couple weeks ago about this giant spider web that was found underground that was absolutely fucking vile. But I posted, I said oh.

1:21 Too far situation. The Karen queer I pronounce this word Karen Kuy, the Karen Kuyer at it again and so many audio book listeners DM me and said Oh my God I had no idea that was how you spelled that word. OK, so like, we're suffering here, guys. OK, these words don't, they're not spelled how they sound. Anyway, we've watched the video, so now we'll say Callias because apparently that's how you say that word. Yeah, we love you.

1:49 And I will say, I just got off a Reddit post that was debating Thesen versus Thesa. So we're going to go with Thesen. Yeah, I don't think we're. Going to get a right? There's an N in that. Word. I know somebody was complaining about how apparently audio bookers have a hard time with like written content because they're like.

2:08 I'm so confused. Yeah, I would understand. I would understand. We got it. Audio book listeners. We love you. We support you. We're with you. We're sorry. We're doing the best we can. Yeah. We just watched a video. OK, We watched. A video. We're taking your feedback seriously. We are. But this bone you have to pick is not with us, it is with Sarah J Maas.

2:30 I want to be so clear on the way that she smells me. Yeah, and there are authors who know that they do this and they'll publish, like Kelly Hart front of her books pronunciation guide whenever there's a shadow of doubt. Now I'm getting picky here, but have you noticed that she doesn't specify the vowel pronunciation for the purpose that. Yeah.

2:52 And I'm still not clear. I appreciate the intent, but I still don't know where the emphasis is. And I don't know whether this is a hard day or a soft day. Like, yeah, like Dania is not helpful if you just say Dan. Hyphen. Yeah, Like, yeah, just the word split by a hyphen. In my mind, Danya. Is it Danya? Sure it's is it Danya you need to give me the AH or the just a a like I need the phonetic pronunciation. So we did find a Throne of Glass pronunciation guide and I know I had a fit about something and I can't remember what it was. Was it Ivelia or sorry, not Ivelia, Irelia. No, it wasn't.

3:34 Was it Irelia? Maybe it? Wasn't. I think it was Irelia. Yeah, cuz it was like irelia. I think that word Irelia with AY, it was ERELYAH and I'm like, I'm definitely going to say the I will say irelia. I know I used to say it Irelia. Thank you everyone for pointing out how wrong I was about that. I'm willing to concede Irelia, but I cannot say irelia because there was something else. You pointed this out in some other word in this series, it's ends with an IA and you say the IA. It was like Caltane Rompier or something rompier. So that is we have Caltane, rompier, rompier and we have and dovier or in Dovier.

4:13 And Dovie. And Dovie and Calteon Rompier. And I was like, these two things are spelled anyway, and yet you expect me to pronounce them differently? Like, are we in France or are we in America? Choose. And I mean, I guess it's fair. Maybe Calton or maybe and Dovier is of French descent, who the fuck knows? I don't know.

4:31 I understand. We're doing the best we can, guys. That's all we're saying. We're watching videos for you. We're trying and we're getting very angry about it inside, but we love. You and you know what? At the end of the day, this is not our fucking world. So we can be wrong. Like, like people can. You know, ultimately, if Sarah J Maas looks me in the eye and is like, you're wrong on this, I'm like, you're right. Like you're right.

4:51 This is your fucking world and your world. Yes, I agree. Yeah. Yeah, I guess that's all we'll say about that. Well, hi, I'm Ronnie. I'm. Abby. And this is Dragons in the Details, where we kick apart our favorite fantasy series over the course of an undetermined number of episodes. We are covering A Court of Thorns and Roses, the series also known as ACOTAR by Sarah J Mass Disclaimer These episodes will contain spoilers. Spoiler alert for the entire ACOTAR series. We will announce any other mass for spoilers ahead of time and we will keep them to the end.

5:27 So if you are new here, the first part of our podcast is about actor only spoilers. All actor spoilers all 5 published books. Then we announced a certain point mass for spoilers every everybody who hasn't read the rest of the math 1st please drop off or you will be spoiled. If you're not new here, you know the drill.

5:42 Disclaimer, this podcast is rated R. We do not advise that you listen to it with your children. Do not listen to it with your children. In case that was unclear. We curse and these books are adult books. Each week we dive into a specific topic in depth. This week we are focused on the High Lords and Ladies. I left out Ladies, but like mostly Lords of Prythian, mostly Helium.

6:07 Tarquin. Calius, Calius, Calius. I don't see how that word could possibly be Calius. I'm sorry guys, In my head it's Calius, but I get those Calius. I get those, Calius, Baron and Thiessen. There needs to be a little. Recent This is fucking bullshit. OK, maybe a little recent. Of Tamlin too, basically all the high Lords that we haven't talked about and just high Lords in general. Like the concept of high Lords is what we are talking about today.

6:35 Of course, Reese and Tamlin have already had their own episodes and so they're not going to, we're not going to cover Reese and Tamlin as characters in this in this deep dive. We're talking about high Lords. We come with receipts. We have quotes to back up any theories so you can follow along if you're skeptical. Abby Announcements.

6:53 Deep Dive music's brought to you by Schwidley, as always. They are a real person. He is a real person. I guess I should say. Check them out on Spotify. I. Didn't know whether we were like concealing his gender identity or anything. He's my boyfriend, he's a real person. They've seen him at this point. I keeps I accidentally say he and then I'm like shit they OK, but yeah.

7:16 Yeah, but then one day he's going to listen to this and he's like, why are He's going to be like, why are? Why are you ever think my pronouns? Are they them? Which? They're not. Yeah, so deep. Deep Dive Music brought to you by Schwedley. That's it, that's all. That's all I have for announce announcements. All right, that's it.

7:35 Corrections, omissions, social media shout outs. Also known as Cosms. Abby, do you have any to share with the class? Nope, I have one that's more funny. I guess I'm just doing funny cosms for at Guitar Social. Media shout outs. All of the well also all of the theory ones are I'm so sorry guys for the mass first section. This is our mass first plug.

8:00 Read the Mass. Read the mass first. Come back later. Listen to this after. Honestly, at some point I'm going to try and just make you know how. Have you ever seen those like comedic summaries of books? Like for a guitar, It's like, I don't know, like a literate girl shoots a wolf is made like queen or something. Like I want to write those for Crescent City and Throat of Glass so that people read them on this podcast. OK guys, read.

8:29 Them they're good, they're good. I promise. Anyways, my cosm is a shout out from I don't actually know what platform is from. Sorry. I think it's YouTube. I think it's YouTube. But in our Reese episode, we talked about how it must have been weird when Reese half shifted and how we like picture that is kind of like a strange moment.

8:46 He like half shifts. He doesn't have his full shifting abilities when they're under the mountain and Amaranth is still has kind of a hold on all of their powers. And Brittany Harper 3572 commented When he partially shifts, I always picture Howl when he's half shifted. Do you know Howl? No, I haven't seen it.

9:02 Howl's Moving Castle. This is important. This is important. A Canon event is happening. OK, well, there's. Should I Google it? Yeah. Maybe it'd be easier if you Googled it. It's basically, I mean, Howl's Moving Castle is a Japanese animated film. And the character Howl, I don't know, he looks like it would be.

9:22 It's funny. Shout out is funny. I thought it was. Funny, Brittany, does he have a beast on Abby? All right, I see he's a little emo sad boy with an earring. All right, and here he's being a shadow daddy. I see it. I see he's wrapping her in his wings. Okay, I see it. I see it. Is he a bird? He he can shift into like a bird like creature yes, so they were just commenting that when when he half shifts, they picture how and we actually got that comment from another person on another platform as well.

9:51 So I guess you guys all really picture how when Reese half shifts. I've heard there's a lot of like overlap, like some people said that how inspired Reese but then that was debunked or something. I don't know the timelines on all of this either. Yeah, let's, let's see. The Cow's Moving Castle was 2004.

10:10 Oh yeah, guitar was way later because we just had the 10 year. Guitar Book 1 was released in 2015. Yep, could have been inspired. Well, I've been meaning to watch that movie for 21 years at this point. Maybe watch Hal's Moving Castle maybe before. No, we have two. I'm sorry I've got. I personally have too much content to rewatch Hal's Moving Castle right? Now there's a lot going on right now. I can't keep busy time, busy time. Busy time, busy busy time.

10:37 All right, our fun question this week. I I'm curious what you're going to pick, but I'm also, I also feel like we kind of have a limited set of answers. So let's see our fun question for this week is you have to be have to be hi lady, to one of these courts and the night court is not an option. Which court are you picking and why? Summer.

11:05 Interesting. Tell me what I love The ocean. I'm at the ocean right now. Yeah, I'm a big. It's the oceanic imagery for you. Adriata. Adriata. Sorry, guys. Whatever. The city seems very lovely by the sea. Tarquin seems like a very nice man. He's got this cool cousin. Cressida seems very lovely.

11:23 Yeah. It's going to be summer for me. I get to hang out with Ameren, who you know. We don't know. Yeah. But yeah, summer, I mean, dawn seems lovely too, but Thiessen's clearly not interested in women. So yeah, you would you would have to find other ways to entertain yourself romantically. That would be very much it. Just for just for platonic fun, sort of high ladyship. Yeah, but no, I would go with summer. Summer.

11:50 OK, Yeah. What about you? OK, cool, I said. So my response was winter. But can we keep Vivian? Yeah. Like I mean, I could have guessed you picking winter. Like can I could like, could we maybe just keep like keep Vivian and and not? Maybe get rid of Cali? Calius, Calius, can you have like if high Lord power could pass to Vivian, I would vote let's let Vivian stay and then Calius maybe doesn't have to but but I don't want to dis unseat Vivian if that's what's happening here.

12:27 And I also am not sure that I would fit into winter courts aesthetics. I think they're all like, aren't they like white haired and like very blonde? So like winter court is what I would choose for what it is and like where I would want to spend time. I think they all seem very cozy and there's like a lot of there's like ice and it seems like it would be very beautiful, but I'm not sure that I would fit in there aesthetic.

12:51 And so if that's not the case, I would say with the stipulation that Baron is out and Heiress is in, then Autumn. Autumn seems lovely. And I would like a great place to and like the Forest House. I want to live in the forest. House. I know. Yeah, me too. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But we got to get Baron. We got to be gone.

13:13 If Baron's not gone, then I am unseating Vivian. Even if that's the only option. Yeah. And I'm brunette, so yeah. They're just going to have to deal. You got to do what you got to do. Yeah. Stuff. Stuff. OK, cool. It's fun, all right. Shall we deep dive? All right Ronnie, what is the source of the High Lords power? This one took me for a fucking ride, I'm not going to lie. A ride that I'm not sure I ever got off of because I'm not sure there's a place to get off, to be honest with you. And the place that I never got off on was Callum My. But let's start from the beginning. Okay, so we first learn about the true nature and power of high Lords from our Prithee and gossip bestie, the surreal in Akatar Chapter 14.

14:08 The surreal settled on the ground. Spring, summer, autumn, winter, dawn, day and night. It mused as if I hadn't even answered. The seven courts of Prythian, each ruled by a high Lord, all of them deadly in their own way. They are not merely powerful, they are power. They are power with a capital P.

14:27 So the cereal, if you just take what the cereal is saying at face value, which we have and it's served as well for the majority of the series, the cereal is basically saying the high Lords are power, like they are power, seem to be a source of power in their own right. But then we get a sense of the nature of their power and the cycle that it goes through and we learn about Kalanim. And so Kalanim we learn about originally from I guess Tamlin, and he's shares that as a High Lord he has to partake in the great right.

15:02 Calami is synonymous in the Spring court with Fire Night, and in a guitar chapter 21 we learn that Fire Night signals the official start of spring in Prythian as well as the in the mortal world. Lucian said. While his words were calm, they trembled slightly. I leaned against the wall of the hallway, forcing myself into a casualness I didn't feel. Here.

15:22 Our crops depend on the magic we regenerate on Calamine tonight. Then in the passage later, we do this this by conducting the Great Right. Each of the seven High Lords of Prythian performs this every year. Since their magic comes from the earth and returns to it at the end. It's a give and take. So we just learned from the surreal that the High Lords are power, but now we're learning from Lucian that we have this great right. Every High Lord performs the Great Right and magic comes from the earth and returns to it the end. So the High Lords are basically cycling this power from themselves back to the earth.

15:57 It's a give and take. And so he then says. Tonight Tam will allow great and terrible magic to enter his body, so seemingly not there currently. The magic will seize control of his mind, his body, his soul, and turn him into the hunter. It will fill him with his sole purpose to find the maiden. From their coupling, magic will be released and spread to the earth where or generate life for the year to come. Tonight Tam won't be the fairy you know. He won't even know his name.

16:24 The magic will consume everything in him but that one basic command and need no one knows until it's time. After Tam hunts down the white stag and kills it for the sacrificial offering, he'll make his way to that sacred cave where he'll find the path lined with fairy females waiting to be chosen as his mate for tonight. And then Lucian also shares that Tamlin is not the only one who performs the right right.

16:48 He makes his choice. Tam chooses the maiden, the High Lord chooses the maiden, and then everybody else also participates in this like basically orgy like, what else are we going to call it? It's not it, she says, Lucian says it's not the great right, but their own dalliances tonight will help the land too. So this fire night in spring specifically beats, I'm assuming, and it's admittedly assume an assumption, but because this is the official start of spring and it's in the spring court is the night that the great right takes place for the High Lord of Spring.

17:21 He partakes in this great right, regenerates the magic in the land, and it's just like give and take process. And so his magic is kind of one with the magic of the land. So according to this, the High Lord's power comes from the earth and returns to the earth. This also means that every High Lord is supposed to perform a great right annually to regenerate this magic. And we don't know much about all the courts, but this doesn't really seem to happen in the night, and I can't imagine it happened in any court except for spring for 49 years. So exactly.

17:55 I'm not sure, like, whether this is a hole. Like, it could be a plot hole. It totally could. But the only two courts that we know have a great right that we've actually heard about our spring, obviously because of Kalani. And I think we also know about autumn in some regard because of Gwen's birthright, because Gwen was born of the great right and the great right was she was born of the great right in which an autumn court male participated.

18:22 Could that autumn court male have been at Kalani and participating in that great right? Totally possible. That is totally possible because on Kalani, everybody's free to roam. We know that because Reese and was there and says that like everyone's just out to wander. So definitely spring has done the great right. Probably autumn has done the great right. We don't know whether it's happening in any other court. And we think we I feel pretty good about the fact that it probably didn't happen for 49 years when everybody was with Amarantha under the mountain.

18:53 Maybe that works because she basically had everybody's power. But I do think it's a little bit confusing and kind of inconclusive as far as like how they're how that part of the story works, works that like all 7 high Lords have to partake in this great right annually. But we've seemingly never heard about it in the in the night court.

19:13 Winter solstice is a big deal in the night court and like that's celebrated, but there's no like great right sexual thing that goes on. So I don't know, it feels a little bit inconsistent, but it does seem like despite all that, it seems like they are one with the land, and the land kind of reflects their power in that the High Lord's power is very much reflective of the land, and the land emanates the power of that court, if that makes sense. So like that all seems very ticked and tied together. The thing that I think is interesting about that is when Baron talks about expansion of territory, how is that going to work?

19:48 Like if if the Autumn court expands territory, like does the autumn court magic that impacts that land also expand like does his magic? Right, I don't know. Expand with it. Does he get spring magic as a result? I don't know how that part of it works. Yeah. I also wrote I I got into the same thoughts and I have here in general ACOTAR magic seems to be genetic even though we're not told this genetic but like we have a lot of evidence that is genetic solution has flames because his mother has flames right the summer court everyone seems to have some kind of affinity for water right so that would seem to be genetic but then we have as is shadows and where those came from is a mystery and with the high Lords with Tamlin specifically yes he

20:38 has earth magic. We see him grow vines, we see him grow thorns, but he has all these other powers too, right? He has the wind, he has the shifting, right? At the very least, we know he has those powers. And like, where do those powers come from? Or is like is where? What is the source of that magic? Is that because he is the High Lord of Spring? Or is that because he has Tamlin? And then the elemental magic that he has is because he is the High Lord of Spring?

21:04 Yeah, I don't really, I don't really know until it kind of works, until you kind of actually like think about it and you're like, wait, does this make sense? And yeah, I think the Baron question is totally the right question. What happens when you invade another court's land? Like, does that power go away?

21:21 Like would no one have that that vine growing power anymore, which to be fair is barely used? Or would Baron get that power and like, how would that work? Yeah, we know there was a time in Corinthian before courts, right. We get, we get that mentioned a lot. And what did everyone's power look like then?

21:37 If you were from the area of autumn, you typically wielded fire because that's what the magic in the land in that part of the world was. Or was it just like everyone was intermingled and then as these courts became divided, the magic came cut, became kind of separated? I don't really know. Yeah.

21:53 Yeah, it's very, that's quite confusing. And I tried to, I tried to figure out whether like somehow Reese, like was accidentally partaking in the great right or whether somebody could have been like, covering for him. In Volaris and then like by the time, by the time they were back in Volaris, were he and Farrah hooking up, but they weren't.

22:16 By Starfall, they weren't. And I think it's interesting too, because we already have been told that there is a tradition in the Supreme Court that Farrah thinks all course do and is mandatory that we later find out isn't right. And that's the tie. So is Kalanmay also kind of a lie? Is this just an orgy because Tamlin wants to have an orgy? Or like, is like, you know, I don't know. Or it's just something she wrote in the first book and she thought it sounded.

22:42 Fun. And we never really come out of it. It could very well just be yeah, it could just be something she changed her mind on, which is totally fair. I had one more thing to add to this. Did you have anything just the family part and how we're how it's like passed down, But I think you you basically hit on that, right?

22:59 Yeah. I mean, the the crux of the matter is like we're kind of told that lineage doesn't really matter, but it seems to it seems like it's all familial in some regard. It doesn't necessarily need to be the oldest son. It's the power chooses who the power is going to choose, but it seems to keep to families.

23:18 And then if a family, an entire family is killed, like in the case of of Tarquin, Tarquin, it chooses like a next of kin, like a cousin or something like that. But the power does choose. So the power could have chosen Varian, but it chose Tarquin. Yeah, for whatever reason. And I do think we'll get into that in our next question too. Yeah, I had one more thing to add for this one. I agree.

23:46 Like yes, the power comes from the land, right? Like the Prythian seems to be the source of power. We get a lot of imagery of Prythian like breathing, like Nesta feels Ramiel breathing. There's a lot of imagery of castles looking like creatures sprung from the land. Like there's this definitely this idea that Prythian is alive, which I don't think we'll get into in this episode, but it's really interesting. But then there's also this idea to that Prythian is maybe not as it once was, right?

24:14 So we get this from Lanthus in the prison. Lanthus tells NASA that if they kind of unite, if they have a child, basically magic could flow untethered again. So the quote for that is, we shall rebuild to what we were before the golden legions of the Fae cast off their chains and overthrew us. We shall resurrect the Wild Hunt and ride rampant through the night.

24:35 We shall build palaces of ice and flame, palaces of darkness and Starlight. Magic shall flow untethered again. So what's tethering magic now, right? If magic used to flow untethered before the Fey overthrew whatever this is. And then the next one we have a couple, we have kind of two examples. I think that Prythian is not what it once was. So the first one is actually Starfall, right? So we know that fewer spirits are coming through through on Starfall every year.

25:03 The quote for that is there must be hundreds of them. I managed to say, dragging my stair back to the stars whizzing past thousands. He said they'll keep coming until dawn, or I hope they will. They were less and less of them the last time I witnessed Starfall. So we're getting less and less spirits with Starfall.

25:18 And then the other thing we have are these winged horses. So in Silver Flames, Helion shows up on a winged horse and Cassian kinds of kind of gives us this history. The winged horses were rare, so rare that it was said that Helion 7 breeding pairs of flying horses were the only ones left. Lore held that there had once been far more of them before recorded history, and that most of just vanish as if they've been devoured by the sky itself.

25:41 Their population had dwindled further in the last 1000 years for reasons no one could explain. Right. So it seems we have this pattern of things becoming on prissy and like, things are becoming less, things are becoming weaker, things are dying out and we don't really know why. And I don't know why either.

25:55 But if the High Lord's power is coming from the land and the land is dying for whatever reason, are the high Lord's becoming weaker? Are they weaker than they used to be? Like at what point does this become a a problem, you know? Yeah. And I don't know what's causing that magic to wither. I don't know what it is, but I think it's a pattern.

26:13 Yeah. And it's interesting that the like that there's the land getting weaker and also this like growing, seemingly growing disparity between the other High Lords and Reese. Yeah, so maybe Reese's power does not come from the land. I mean, maybe Reese's power doesn't. Yeah, it doesn't come from the land alone. Like there's, there didn't seem to be much talk, unless I'm forgetting something about Reese's father being so much more powerful and everybody else just Reese. And in that High Lords meeting, I didn't take these notes down. I didn't prep this part.

26:45 But in that High Lords meeting, it was like everybody was making nice. And then all of a sudden Reese just decided to remind everybody like, hey, I could actually, I could literally RIP into all of your minds right now and make you do this, but I'm not. So can you just please fucking be nice? And it's it becomes very apparent that he is so much more powerful than all of them.

27:04 And so all of the things that you just pointed out were things in other courts, right? Well, Star falls a night court. Yeah, star fall is a Night Court thing. Yeah, I don't know. OK, maybe the two aren't correlated at all. Maybe the land is just dying. And I do think it's a it's an interesting point, right?

27:19 We have, we have the land dying. We talked about this in our Reese Part 2 episode. We have this idea that Reese is maybe kind of losing some control on his power like we have. We have evidence, scant but evidence of something going on with the magic, and we just don't really know what what that is necessarily.

27:38 Yeah. OK, cool. Abby, who are the heirs to each court? We're going to speculate on who we think the heirs to each court are. Everyone, Abby. All right, so I have a couple preambles here before we get in. Sure. So we know that the magic chooses the air, not the birth order. Ronnie mentioned this, but just to read this full quote, Farah is trying to tell Reese she doesn't have any power.

28:01 She says I don't have any powers. It came out so fast that there was no chance of it sounding like anything but denial. Reese crossed his legs. Don't you The strength, the speed? If I didn't know better, I'd say you, when Tamler were doing a very good job, hub of pretending you're normal, that the powers you're displaying aren't usually the first indication among our kind that a high Lord's son might become his heir.

28:19 So any son, which I'm going to call bullshit on, but any son in theory could become a high Lord's heir. As we've talked about. We also have this quote in Silver Flames from Cassian. This is when Cassian finds out about Nick's Basically, he says it wasn't a guarantee that a High Lord's first born would be his heir.

28:38 The magic sometimes took a while to decide, and often jumped around the birth order completely. Sometimes it found a cousin instead. Sometimes it abandoned the bloodline entirely, or chose the air in that moment of birth and the echoes of a newborn's first cries. It wouldn't matter to Cassie and though if Reese's son inherited his world shaking power or barely a drop. So the magic chooses whoever the fuck it wants, basically. And we don't know what the qualifications are for that. We don't know if it's a worthiness, this thing. I don't understand how Baron could possibly be High Lord given.

29:08 These seeming qualifications, but we also haven't seen that actually happen yet. We also have not seen it one day. Well, that's not true. We saw it with Tarquin. Yeah, but his entire the entire family died, right? The entire family died. And so a cousin was chosen. We haven't seen it just say like actually nobody in this fucking bloodline is worthy except maybe Moore's bloodline. Maybe.

29:31 Maybe. But we don't know that for sure. We don't know for sure. What's interesting is also in Silver Flames, Eris says if there is no air, the land becomes divided. But we were also just told that there's basically always going to be an air, right? The magic will choose someone. What Eris says, And this is about Farah and Reese. This is about basically Cassian betraying Eris. He says then you would certainly have a war on your hands. My father would go straight to Brie Allen and Coach Ji Suppose and then go to the other disc content territories and you would be wiped off the proverbial map. Perhaps literally since the Night Court would be divvied up between the other territories if

30:07 Reese and and Farrah die without an air. Right? But like, that's not how this should work. Like there should always be an air even if they don't have a child. Yeah, like why we talked about Jump to more. Why wouldn't it jump to more? Why wouldn't it jump to Azer Cassian? Like, yeah, yeah, it doesn't seem to need to. Like, we've been told it can just switch the bloodlines. So all of that is to say, we're going to speculate right now and who might be everyone's there, but we don't necessarily have hard and fast answers.

30:33 But I think it's interesting to talk about. And also just as a reminder, the kind of signifiers of being an heir are just basically power. You're fast, you're strong. You seem to have more magic than everyone else. There's also like a physical like Reese and Tamlin always have a glamour on basically so that people can't like see their full power. So that's just kind of the physical, physical changes. So places where we seem to have heirs in night court, we have Knicks.

31:00 We don't know. We don't know if he's going to be there. Far too early to say, but seemingly we have Knicks. Let's say, let's say that he's there. You're looking like you don't necessarily. I think it's right. I think the thing that will be interesting in the Night Court, and it's actually completely moot, but it's interesting to think about. If this stupid fucking bargain didn't exist, it would be interesting to find out whether Reese could die and Pharaoh could just continue raining as soul high lady. Yeah, that would be interesting to find out. I agree.

31:29 Like that won't happen because this is a stupid fucking bargain. They're going to leave this world together. Right. Day Court Lucian. I think Lucian's the heir of Day. I don't know how he's going to find that out, but we know that he's super fast, right? He ran favor all the way back to the banner from the hills of Kalama. He's Helian's son.

31:47 He is seemingly Helian's only son. I think probably Helian's going to die. People are like, why, Eris? Why don't you care more about this right guy? And he's like. Right, people speculate that he might be the heir. He is an heir, but he's not an heir to Baron, he's an heir to Helian. So I think the safe bet Lucian is heir Autumn heirs. He certainly seems to think he is the heir. Listen to our heirs deep dive that we just did. If you want to know what he's I.

32:16 Hope so. I want to. Yeah, he certainly seems to think. You know, it's funny, I actually wrote in my notes here. I mean, he certainly seems to think he is. But I, for one think it would be baller if Baron died and the Lady of the Autumn Court ruled instead. None of her sons seems super worthy except Lucian.

32:33 I said if not Eris, maybe Lucian. Would that be wild? It's a good question. Kind of think that the lady of the Autumn Court is the line. Like I think she's the line. Baron is the outlier in this court. Like, do you think Baron somehow cheated it? Like it seems like, let's talk about this a little. It seems like the Autumn Court maybe has a way to cheat this magic, right?

32:53 Because Eris is sure that he's going to be heir and Baron is a shit high Lord. So like, do they know something? Have they done something to the magic to like, manipulate it? And yeah, they're not supposed to be in power. Like, at all. And like, why is she? I mean, this isn't that strange given the politics of Prithian, but she is more captive than other ladies of courts.

33:17 So like, why is it so imperative? Like, why has he not like, OK, she was caught cheating. Like, why is he not just kicked her to the curb? Like, yeah, it hurt his pride. Like, whatever. Like, why is she so crucial to keep around? Why is she protected and revered by all of her sons? Like, why don't we know her name?

33:36 Like I think she's, I think she's very important. Right. And if we're when we were first learning about high ladies from Tamlin, Farrah asks, isn't the high? Isn't, isn't Lucian's mom a high lady? Right. And Tamlin says no. And the fire, her firepower is incredibly powerful. And we don't know the extent of it, but yeah. And Lucian has it right.

33:56 Lucian has does that meaning from Baron. Well, have we actually ever seen Baron wield flame remuster? That's right. Yeah, I think at the High Lord meeting, he. He puts up Yeah, yeah, yeah. He puts up a shield of flame. You're right and he's throwing flames at like Azrael's Shields when he blocks Arison.

34:16 Right, right. OK, so there's something going on with Autumn Court. I know there's a line about the males of the Supreme Court being rotten, but like, genuinely the males of the Autumn Court, there's something wrong with them. We don't know their names and we don't care to. Meatheads Meatheads 123.

34:35 One through three since they're the only remaining ones. I guess we could know the two dead ones if we wanted. Yeah, for summer, I mean, I definitely think we have Varian or Cressida. If it's Varian, we are setting up for Amarin to be high Lady. Could have been intentional. Right, which would be. Interesting to you a sensitive there. Why not?

34:57 I had a Cressida who? Oh, Farrah. I've got Farrah on all these lists. I know you do, so I didn't want to. I know. I know your theory on it, so I didn't even include it. Yeah. So I think Varian or Cressida, Winter, Calius, Calius. Calius, Calius and Vivian are expecting a child. We find that out in Silver Flames.

35:18 They're at Starfall and Vivian is pregnant, so let's assume that child is the heir. Places where we do you want, do you want to add anything to those thus far? So like those are places we have potential errors and then we have two places where we don't. No, I'm good about everything. All right. We have two courts where there is no apparent error. The first one is Dawn, and Thiessen is mated to a male, so I don't know what's going to happen there, but let's assume he's got cousins or something.

35:46 I'm like, not going to be too worried about that. Yeah, I mean, Theessen's partner is a Peregrine male. My notes say are there surrogates in Prithee? Can they adopt? Do they have cousins? And then it's like, can Nuon? I don't know if that's how you say your name. Can Nuon be High Lord? I don't think she can. I don't know Who's gonna be the heir to Dawn. Yeah.

36:03 Yeah. I would tap Nuon. That sounds great. Make her. Hi, Lady. Yeah, I agree. Dawn is a big fat question mark. Yeah, right. Spring. So Tamlin has no family? No family. And there seems to be pretty much no one left in the Spring either. It seems like everyone has pretty much abandoned Spring and it's just Tamlin and this empty Manor.

36:24 We've talked about Lucian. Lucian did stand in for him on Clan My, but we are already pretty sure he's Heir of Day. Well, he's definitely heir of Day. Maybe heir of Autumn. It would be wild if Lucian ends up with three of these courts, but potentially what? What am I missing? I think that's realistic.

36:42 OK, one of us thinks it's wild. One of us thinks it's realistic. That'd be great for him. One interesting note here about, about Farrah, your, your favorite heir, Farrah. We have never seen Pharaoh wield Tamlin's earth magic, which in my mind is his High Lord magic, right? That's what, that's what his spring magic is.

37:00 We've never seen her wield it. I'm not sure she has it, even though she seemingly has all of Tamlin's other abilities. So I'm not sure that she would ever be. I like your theory that she is kind of heir to everything, but I'm not sure it works for Spring because she does not seem to have that specific spring earth wielding magic.

37:19 So I don't know. We it might be Lucian, we might be airless, which means if Tamlin dies, anarchy and chaos according to Eris, or we're going to get we're going to get a Tamlin redemption arc next story and he'll have a a baby. But I don't know. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, I'm, I'm pretty torn on spring.

37:42 I mean, to your point, Lucian is a shoo in for day, right? Because Helian likes to have his fun. I don't see him settling down anytime soon. And he's got a pretty powerful son who's already showing signs of being an heir. Lucian has already stood in for High Lord of Spring Court tasks. It's like, what do we do with that? I mean, again, Kalan might just be a fraud, I don't know. Allegedly mated to somebody who the Supreme Court is made for that person.

38:11 Yeah. But aside from that, there's like, really? Yeah, there's no one. There's really no one, Yeah, So I don't know. So. I guess my vote is Lucian in the absence of literally any other options, but. Maybe the magic will agree with you. I mean, this might all be a moot point. It might be that our high Lords don't die.

38:27 But. Yeah, I mean, Tamlin could, could have. I actually think that Tamlin, Tamlin has to have, I think, a redemption arc. It's just a question of whether that redemption arc involves him dying or not. Yeah. Yeah. No, I think that you definitely could, which would be, you know, a bummer or not a bummer depending on your feelings. About it and how you feel about Tamlin. So yeah, I'm not sure.

38:49 I would say probably, I don't know, probably Lucian, but I could also totally see, I could see like the state that the Supreme Court is in right now. It's basically the state it would be in if you just divided it up, right? Maybe you give it back to the humans, or maybe it gets divided up and then Baron tries to take it.

39:04 There's something about the magic though. Like you're like. I think it dies. Maybe, I don't know. I don't know. Maybe Sarah has these answers. Should we call her? Sarah, we have some questions for you. Can you jump on a quick zoom? All right. Well, in every court, I also logged if we knew who the last high Lord was to see if we could follow any sort of pattern.

39:26 But it really always is, except for in the case of summer, it was a father. So yeah, that's just what it is. So if it's if it's going to be anyone but a child is going to be kind of crazy. Yeah. Yeah. Either everyone's going to need to be dead, which is the case for Spring to be clear, or something terrible is going to have happened.

39:48 I could see Eris killing everyone else honestly. It was everyone else, every other High Lords. All of his other siblings. All of his brothers, yeah. And that's how he would ensure that the magic would pass to him. You're right. It's such a simple, obvious answer. Why didn't I think of it? Yeah, could be.

40:04 They are all terrible. But if he kills them, he's also terrible. Yeah, I mean, he already kind of did. They chose. They made choices that led to their deaths. Yeah, but he could easily orchestrate another situation. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's true. Like, I don't know, tempting them to come into Night Court territory and have a huge city RIP them into shreds. Yeah.

40:25 All right. Anything else on that one? All right, guys. Well, this is going to be a shorter a guitar only section, and we apologize for that, but this is another Mass verse plug. Read the Mass verse and we are going to move on to our Mass First section. So Mass first spoilers, spoilers for all of Crescent City and all of her own glass. If you have not read the entirety of either of those series, you will be spoiled.

40:48 So we would suggest leaving or preparing to be spoiled. Love you, bye. Love you, bye. All right, Mass first cosms. Have you any Mass first cosms? OK, I have a couple. All right, on one of our quote clips. This was a quote clip that said that Bryce pointed out that the hysteria must have left archives somewhere on Prythian and Cassian said this thing about the Ori and that nobody was talking about it basically was a point of clip. And we had two really great comments. One was actually thought provoking and 1 was just hilarious.

41:21 So I'm going to shout out both of them. One was from Dime, Dianosaurus Rex 123. That said, the comment said it's me, I'm here, I'll talk about it. And I had a photo of have you seen the Book of Mormon? Yeah, I had a photo of I'm going to pull it up for you. Please hold of Elder Price from the Book of Mormon holding the Book of Mormon like this but you zoom in and the instead of the Book of Mormon it just says Reese's Valg. My God.

41:48 I died laughing. And the other was kind of A tag team set of comments from Morgan AKA 3 Face Goddess AKA Podcast Auntie and then Kevlar basically commenting on how it's kind of bizarre that Cassian says that he instantly forgot stuff that Reese said about life beyond their world. Was he made to instantly forget stuff that they talked about about life beyond our world? I don't think we'd know anybody but Reese and Ameren who can make people forget things like that. So why would anyone do that to Cassian, and intentionally? I don't know, but I think it's an interesting point. Well.

42:26 This is interesting. So the Trove, they thought the Trove was glamour to make itself forget, right? Which would be what? To make people forget about it, which would be an Asteri power because the Asteri corrupted the Cauldron. So I think that's totally in place since the Asteri made the Illyrians and.

42:45 We talked about Illyrians were all like, like Illyrians were created to just immediately forget about world. Yeah, like don't worry about that. Don't worry about that. Obviously AS is interested in the oriree, but AS is different. AS seems to be AS also has something. Else right? Exactly Cassian we talked about this last episode did not know about Coach J even though he's made his life's work to hunt down monsters in Prithian and Eris did right?

43:09 So maybe someone is fucking with Cassian's memory or he's just a big dumb softie and we love him so much. Or he's just a jock. Or he's just a fucking jock. Either way, it's fine Either way. I thought those were two interesting comments of very different natures on one post, and we appreciate you for that.

43:28 We love you guys. All right, all right. I'm going to ask myself, Ronnie, what is the source of the High Lords Power Masters edition? OK, so I'll keep this short because I don't think it's a very long answer. It's just like, well, actually I'm scrolling. It's kind of, it's not that short. It's short, OK. I think we have things to talk.

43:43 About here, yeah, we have things to talk about, but I like don't have ants answers, I'll put it that way. So we talked about how the high Lords have this connection to the power of the land. Feel like you know where I'm going with this Vesperus and House of Flame and Shadow after she has her hissy fit about how she is.

44:01 The Evening Star says I drank from the Land's magic and the Land's magic drank from me, which sounds a heck of a lot like how the high Lord's magic is meant to work. So we've talked about this in the context of Tamlin and Reese, who were the only high Lords that we talked about in depth on this podcast so far. But does this mean that the High Lords all have some form of a steri power in them?

44:27 We knew, we thought that Reese did, but what does this mean for everybody else? There are some fun. I think they're fun parallels to be drawn between the powers of certain courts. So this is this is the line, right? I drank of the Land's magic and the Land's magic drink of me, right? Which implies that Vespers isn't viewing the land with her power.

44:47 Her power is the evening Star. And then that land becomes Dusk Court, right? Did she make it Dusk Court? Is it Dusk court because it is her power and all of the fae are now absorbing her power from the land basically like is that is that where we got each of these courts from? I don't know but. And like, did the power originate from an asteri or is there like, is there some sort of continuity of a steriness in Perthian that's keeping this land cycle going because she drank from the land as well?

45:21 She drank from the land as well, right? So is it? Is it she? Became driving the cycle that's happening still, right? Is it? She became the Evening Star because she drank from the land of Dust Court. Or is it the Dust Court became the Dust court because she was the evening Star and and therefore it became dust court, I think. OK, so I have a couple quotes about this. The idea that the fae magic, and I'm going to say Fae magic right now is, is tied to the land.

45:48 So after Dust court kicks out Vesperus, we have the quotes or I guess they kick out the Esteri, but Vesperus is still there. We have the quotes. The land strengthened. It returned to what it had been before the Daglins arrival millennia before. We return to what we've been before that time to creatures whose very magic was tied to this land.

46:07 Thus the Land's powers became. My mother's dusk twilight. That is what the island was in its long buried heart. What her power bloomed into the lands rising with it. It was as she said, as if the island had a soul that now blossomed under her care, nurtured by the court she built here. We know that the Daglin were basically like sucking the land dry, right?

46:26 Like that's essentially what was happening. And then when they stopped, the lands were able to bloom again, basically. And thus the Land's power became my mother's. I mean, so was Thea doing basically what the High Lords were doing too? And like somehow taking this power from the land? I don't know. This is another option instead of the genetic thing too, right? Like I'm, I'm pretty convinced that Reese is genetically an hysteria.

46:49 But this is the other option that the reason why Celine's son had the power of the Evening Star is because he was taking the power from the land, but he was a baby, like he was a baby when that happened. So I don't know if that's really the case. But like that, that is the second option, that it's not a genetic, but that is the asteri haven't viewed their land into the power and the high Lords take that land and therefore they have a steri, A steri power. But they're not all starborn, right? Or they don't seem to all be starborn. I mean, Helion certainly has those vibes. The solar courts.

47:21 The solar courts, I think certainly that power comes from a steri, right? I mean, and we will get into that later. But like, yeah, it isn't it fucking weird that we have below the middle, we have courts that are so like Faye, right? Like the idea that they're tied to the seasons. They have elemental magic.

47:37 But then in the north we have these solar courts that seem much more tied to like the cosmos and the stars and the osteria. Like that's that's where I think this is going. I'm not 100% sure. We have also this idea about the middle and I wrote the middle absolutely crumbles after fiance's death, right?

47:55 So the quote for that is petals began falling from the trees, leaves with them. Birds took flight as a sudden winter gripped the bog. As if the land had died with its king, right? Fion is high king of Prithean. He dies and the land dies. Basically the land in the middle dies. We don't know what powers Fionn had. We know the middle.

48:13 Actually, I don't think the middle was. We don't know how involved the Asteri were in the middle. We know that Amarantha made her palace under the mountain, but I don't know if that palace already existed or not. I thought the middle was like the Asteris like game hunting. You're right, it was their game, their game hunting grounds.

48:28 You're right. That's like where they had the wild hunt and just like, let me sluice for fun, right? So why did Fionn dying kill the land? You know, I, I don't know. Yeah. But there's some idea of this like the High Lord is linked to to the land itself. Yeah, I yeah, I have this here. Does this mean that all of the courts have an asteri as the source of their magic? Or at least the solar courts.

48:53 Yeah, I think that's, I mean that seems to be the question here. I don't and I don't know if you could really limit it. I don't know if it can really be true. Right, because because Prithian existed before before and we were told that the cauldron was a fae item and it so so all of this and all of the lands magic existed before the before the Daglin showed up.

49:19 So is this like, is it something where a certain like, yeah, like maybe just the night court, maybe just the night court and day court, maybe night, day, dawn, dusk were fed by like corrupted by the Daglin, which seems to be where their stronghold was anyways was night because of the Illyrians and the prison and all that stuff. And that's where a lot of this started. But yeah, I mean, I think that's the question like describing the High Lord magic process that we just learned about on Fire night.

49:54 Right, right. I mean, right. Exactly. What are you doing, Sarah? Yeah, my, my, my thinking. I get, I get wrapped up when I think about this, maybe intentionally, but like when the Celine is describing the other Faye that came with them, she said the fire wielders from the South, right, because Autumn Court didn't exist yet. So she did not say the Autumn Court because the courts don't happen until she gets back.

50:21 But there's still this idea that there are as a concentration of fire wielders in the South. Yeah, there's regional powers. Right. So is that so? Again, I mean, if it is hysteria, is that because like Mala was there, right, or whatever that this world's equivalent of Mala was right and she imbued the land with her, with her power? I don't know.

50:40 I don't think we have enough to know. For sure in this episode, but I think it's certainly a fair question to ask when there's there's like kind of glaring absence with like very with really just a bonus chapter mentioned. There's kind of a glaring absence in a guitar of gods in general. Like there's the cauldron and that's kind of it.

50:58 There's the mother, there's the cauldron, that's about it. Nyx is mentioned as an ancient goddess in in a bonus chapter, which is of course how Nyx got his name. But it is odd that these powers are not associated with any gods, whereas in every other book they. Yeah, well, I mean, I just honestly, maybe I just assumed this, but we have we have long forgotten Gods, yes, Yeah.

51:22 And I just assume they. Called him ancient and. Yeah, but they, but Pharaoh calls them, I think Pharaoh calls them long forgotten gods at one point. Like I think she says the Hewn City was like created by long forgotten gods or something. I always just assumed that that was the Daglin, honestly. Yeah, that they set themselves up as gods and then they left. But maybe we don't have enough textual evidence for that. I mean, that would certainly work with the theory of the throne of class Gods being a story. Right.

51:49 Yeah. Right. But there is clearly power here. It's like there was always magic in Prithean, right? Because that's why the Asteri came. They wanted, they said that the magic there, the light, there was so much pure. But then do the did the Asteri basically corrupt that first I guess is what it is that phaeolite that power into their own each individual powers. And that in that is why we don't. And we even have this in Throne of Glass, right? We have raw magic, but then we have people that wield specific things, right?

52:15 So it's like, was Prythian a core basically for raw magic? And then the Esteri, by imbuing their power into the land, created these individual types of metric that we're seeing. Yeah, yeah. And I think, I actually don't remember whether this was exactly the case, but it seems like Prythian would be the most compatible with the Steri as well. I think it was right.

52:37 Yeah, they said that they've been. It was. Yeah, they say that it was great. Yeah, yeah. So other sources of High Lord's power. I mean, we're going to talk about dawn later, which I think is has like the most parallels. But you brought up Mala. Mala seems like she could be related to both autumn and day, right? Mala is the sun goddess, lady of light, learning and fire. I mean, light bringer, fire bringer, like that's obviously like Brandon's fire, Autumn court flames. I think that's an obvious, obvious link. But she's also got us of light, right? And so the light of the day court, like could that light, could that court specific power stem from Mala? And learning and Helion has all

53:22 those libraries. Yeah, and Helion is the source I. Really like. That goes to I really like whenever he needs to learn things he doesn't know. So I think Mala could link to both autumn and day. I know you said only solar quartz or links or you think only solar quartz are linked to to a steri power but. I think they're.

53:41 On it I think it's hard, like it would be hard to not at least tie like Brannon type fire to Autumn Court flames. Absolutely, but Autumn was the only one I could do it for. Yeah, yeah. I don't think we know enough about winter, spring, or even darkness, honestly. I mean darkness has to be held but and then summer I think is the only like the the nice the nicest link to mab.

54:06 Yeah, which is necessary. We haven't gotten, I know, I know Mab is not necessary, but like it was just a nice link to Mab that we haven't seen. I feel like we haven't gotten a great link to mab yet, probably because we haven't gotten like the water world back story, but Tarquin manipulates water.

54:23 It's got mab vibes. I don't know what it's very that. Mad mad vibes, Yeah. Don't know what to. Swear to God, if we find out that her name is Mob, I'm gonna riot. Is it mob? No, it's got to be Mab. Yeah, I'm going. With mab, I'm going with Mab, yeah. So it could be fun. The only thing that I had for I have nothing for winter or spring. I don't know.

54:47 Do you have anything for winter or spring where it could come from? No, this is This is why I said I think it's the solar quartz because there's no obvious comparison and the Esteri are All Stars and we've got day, night and dawn like all very star related. And dusk. Yeah, cool. Never mind, we can't go there right now.

55:05 I was about to ask, do you think that Mala is the Morning Star? And I was like, we can't do that. I can't do it. I can't do it. I can't do it. Derek's making the lasagna and it. Smells so good. It's like me so hungry. All right. OK, Abby. Why were Hi ladies once customary and now or not? So guys, I had to text Ronnie and be like, wait, we're high ladies customer because I forgot about this entirely. But they were they were.

55:30 So Celine tells us that they were once Hi ladies, and it was actually the norm. And the quote for that, and this is House of Flame and Shadow Chapter 21. I will spare you the details of how I came to wed a high Lord son of the years before and after he became the High Lord of night again, following that pattern.

55:46 It's the Suns and I his lady. He wanted me to be high lady as the other Lords mates were, but I refused. I had seen what power had done to my mother and I wanted none of it. So Reese also tells Farrah in Mist and Fury that there are such things as high lady. So this is another thing Tamlin has like seemingly lied about the high lady thing in the Tide. So the quote for that is, and this is Chapter 7. What if you could stand against us, hold your own a high lady. There are no high ladies.

56:14 His brow, his brow furrow, his brow furrowed, but he shook his head. We'll talk about that later too. But yes, Pharah, there can be high ladies. So again, we're kind of asking ourselves, how much does Reese know? He seems to know some things. He seems to not know other things. And some things did seem to be passed down.

56:29 What the fuck? Tamlin says there has never ever been a high lady. The quote for that is High Lords only take wives, consports and there has never been a high lady. This is either a lie or Tamlin doesn't know. I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. I think he doesn't know here. I think he doesn't know. Lucian's brothers also say there's no such thing as a high lady.

56:48 Oh, it seems insane to me that in the 15,000 years of the magic choosing a high Lords air and we've talked about how we can skip bloodlines blah blah blah, only males have been chosen. It just seems extremely unlikely to me. Right? So I'm so I'm thinking something's off here. Even with what Celine said here though, I'm not clear if a High Lady could be a high lady in her own right, or a high lady is always a wife of a high Lord, which is kind of shitty. Right.

57:16 And he very much describes it as mates of High Lords, right. So yeah, I think it's just mates of high Lords is what she's describing. Yeah, so. I was like OK what happened here? So option one, if we think someone is fucking with this magic, which I kind of do because again, a 15,000 years of only men when it's being chosen by magic just doesn't seem likely, especially in a book written by a woman.

57:42 So option one, did Celine ruin this for everyone basically, right? Did we know she glamored the minds for everyone in Valeris? Did her glamour include there not being high ladies anymore? Is that why Reese can remember because he's her descendant, right? But no one else can? Celine said she had to erase her mother's crimes, slash all of it from recent memory.

58:05 So the quote for that, we read this quote a lot. I carve these tunnels, but the paths here, sorry, I carve these tunnels, the paths here. So some record might exist of what we were, what we did, but first I had to erase all of it from recent memory. Again, we think she means this literally. She saw her mother become a corrupt tyrant, right with Celine basically.

58:24 Like women can't be trusted to rule. And she erased the idea of the high ladies from from the minds of everyone basically. And if so, what the actual fuck? That would be so fucking terrible. I hate that idea. But basically, did Celine do this? Like did Celine kind of fuck with this magic? We know she was incredibly powerful. Say hey, no more women ruling they can't be trusted. That's option one in my mind.

58:48 There might be many options here, but that's an option. The other option, I'm really starting to think this magic somehow corrupted. I feel like we've been talking about this the whole time, but like, Eris seems pretty confident that he's going to be high Lord. Maybe he's going to murder all his brothers, but maybe he has a way to control it. We talked about Baron.

59:05 This magic has never chosen a female. Like I'm just is something fucking with this magic? Like is, is this not as straightforward as we've been led to believe is my question. What do you think? I'm yeah, I mean, I had all the same things. It seems to be an Eve trope. He ate the apple, now she and everyone else are being punished for her crimes I guess.

59:26 I think the the question is, is it an Eve trope in symbol only meaning? Like, did Sarah J Maas just write a world where high Lords are men? Like men are the high Lords, which wouldn't blame her for It's not like an unusual patriarchy to write like maybe they're just are never high ladies in their own right.

59:47 Like maybe the power never chooses them alone. And Celine basically set off a chain reaction where she did not want to be tempted as her mother was. And so she said, I'm not going to be high lady. And then set off this like chain reaction of basically setting a precedent where a man could marry a woman and not make her.

1:00:10 By lady and then that became really fucking appealing because you just like anytime you can just not give your significant other like the same level of power. Like why would you not take that unless you're Reese? And so like, did she just kind of spoil this in a in a political way, not necessarily a magical way?

1:00:28 And I could see that, I could see that being true or like a more interesting and in my opinion, probably less plausible, but definitely more interesting direction. Could be like could maybe not, maybe not Celine, because I actually don't think Celine. I think that would be like very, I don't know that Celine's that powerful.

1:00:48 I don't know that I believe that Celine's that powerful. But we know that Saya had a lot of regret towards the end of her life and she did a lot, tried to repent a lot. And she was mates with Adis, who is very fucking powerful. And so could Adis have manipulated things at Thea's request? Thea who's mere Faye?

1:01:09 Like I mean powerful Faye but but Faye Adis has a lot more at his disposal and has very powerful brothers who are willing to help him and has a lot more weight in a situation like manipulating how magic is passed down. Thea wielded the trove. The whole trove, right? So she could have done it herself.

1:01:31 She would have had to do it before she left Perthian because she takes the horn and the harp with her but seemingly leaves the mask and the crown behind, which is fucking wild. We'll talk about that later. Yeah, I could have seen, I could see Thea doing it, honestly. So did Thea do it? I actually that is so interesting because there were no high Lords, right? There were no high Lords, and then the Esteri leave and now all of a sudden there are high Lords when this has never existed before and we're told the magic chooses them. Does that make any sense?

1:02:00 Wait, but I don't know whether that actually works. Maybe I'm walking it back because Thea wanted a realm for both of her daughters. Yeah. Yeah. Why would she then take away their power to rule? That doesn't make any sense. She did repent. She did like. Yeah, but she was already on Midgard when she was feeling sad. About things, yeah.

1:02:20 Yeah. So maybe Thea didn't. I don't know, but now you got me thinking that maybe this story ends with no high Lords anymore because it feels like they are somehow tied to the Asteri, right? Like this is still somehow an Asteri power structure that needs to be eradicated. Yeah, I mean, I definitely believe that something someones got on Make the Cauldron.

1:02:40 Who's going to do it? Right. And in doing so, do you on make these court specific powers and this high Lord structure hierarchy? Even Reese says he he kind of wants that, right. Like that was kind of a a main plot in the early. I mean, it's still kind of a main plot, right? He he doesn't want there to be high Faye anymore.

1:02:57 He thinks it's stupid. Yeah, yeah. OK. So maybe Celine did have to do it. Well, well, Celine could have wielded the trove too, right? But the trove was half gone. Well, the horn was gone, but Nestor was able to bring Nix and Farrah back to life with. Just three. So maybe it's OK, but how? Sorry, how are we commanding the entire power system of Pythian with the trove?

1:03:22 We don't know what the trove can do. I'm just throwing it out there as an as. Objects of immense magical power. Maybe she got the ability to raise high ladies. We're in pure speculation mode here. OK, all right. I'm just thinking how with Thea or Celine have done this right? Yeah. Like maybe through ATIS, but if they did it themselves, maybe wielding the trove? I think based on what Celine said about the precedent that she walked into where it was High Lords mates, I think the magic was not choosing women when Celine came into the situation.

1:03:55 Yeah. So I think. I think the magic is fucked anyway. I think if this, if this happened, it was predating Celine. Yeah. And the magic is sexist. Yeah. So I think it was more of a political move on Celine's part to not be high lady. I agree with you. Because none of these other avenues really work, and because Celine said other High Lords mates were High Ladies, implying that High Lords were the ones with the magic, unfortunately.

1:04:20 Bullshit, bullshit, bullshit. OK. Yeah, blame. All right, Ronnie, it's a fun one. What is the connection between Baron and the Autumn King, who we often refer to as Einer on this podcast because that's his name, but Baron and the Autumn King in Crescent City? No, I do always call him einer. I know I know who you're talking about, but.

1:04:46 I don't know. OK, so Einer is the Autumn King in Crescent City and Baron, you guys know Baron, he's the High Lord of the Autumn Court in Prythean. So well, let's talk a little bit about Einer first, because we talked a lot about Baron over the course of the last episode and a half. These two, these two people, Baron leads the Autumn Court in Prythian, which has a lot of similar coloring imagery powers to the Val Baron fae in Crescent City who are ruled by the Autumn King, also known as Einer Dannon. So Einer, the Autumn King is actually closer to Eris's age. He's nearly 500 years old and that quote is his father was nearing 500 years old.

1:05:27 This is Rune had worn the golden crown of the Autumn King for most of that time and had been an asshole for all of it. So Eris is of Reese's generation. He's in his mid 5 hundreds too. So comparing Einer to Baron only makes sense in terms of rank. I just want to clarify that like Baron could technically be Steiner's father and is much I think much older. So really the closest comp in age to Einer is Eris. Einer knows about other worlds, has an Ori, records everything he learns, how light moves through the world, etcetera. Everything he's learning in the old language. Old Fey, which we know from Bryce's time in Prythian, is the only common language between Midgard and Prytheum, and we know this from the quote.

1:06:11 Another click of the device. Another jotted note in an ancient rigid hand, which I found interesting because Einer is described as very youthful looking, but it's called an ancient rigid hand, the old language of the Fae. His father recorded everything in the half forgotten language their people had used when they had first come to Midgard through the Northern Rift. And we know now, not at this time, but we know they came through the northern rift from the line of the Autumn Court. I mean my hot take I think we've already talked about is the line of the Autumn Court runs more true And the lady of the Autumn Court, not Baron.

1:06:44 Baron looks nothing like them. He has brown hair and brown eyes. Einer does. Einer has amber hair or amber eyes and red hair. So are they related? Probably, yeah. We know that the Faye and Prythian went over to Midgard a long time ago, so they are probably distant cousins from whatever Autumn Court nobility went over to Midgard.

1:07:03 As far as whether they've had connection, I don't have a clear answer, but I have some thoughts. So Einar tries to arrange a marriage between Brune and the Queen of the Witches. So if they aren't already in communication or have a method like maybe he's trying to find one through these witches. Einar also says he's been trying to find Corinthian for a long time, so he that is implying that he's never been there. You've brought this up, We've talked about this. He says.

1:07:28 If I were to guess, you managed to reach a place I have long desired to go. And he says this to Bryce when she returns from Prithian. So I've long desired to go, probably hasn't been there, but Einer and Morvin. Morvin is the king of the Eval and Faye are real buddies. And we know that the caves under a Volen are made entirely of black salt, which is very helpful for summoning beings from other worlds. And again, I want to come back to who really is in communication with Einer slash Morven, if anyone from Prythian. So those caves under a volen, just as a reminder, are made of black Obsidian salt.

1:08:02 We know that Einer and Morven both know where they are. Obviously, they've been physically in them together when Bryce and Hunt and all of them are down there with the murder twins in that hole, Tiasco, and they find out that there's salt down there. The caves under a Volin are nearly identical to the caves under the Court of Nightmares, who is fighting very hard for an alliance with that court.

1:08:27 Eris. Eris, whether he's doing it on behalf of Baron or of his own accord like or whatever, he's like doing a lot of it. And so are these tunnels. These tunnels are quote nearly identical to the tunnels under a ballin. Are they also made of salt? Can you also like a ballin? Is a thin place like can you speak to each other in these caves under a ballin and under the night court? But do you remember what the Black salt specifically summons? How hell?

1:08:59 Yeah, yeah, but Bryce tries to go to hell and she ends up in Prithean, so no. This is my back to my heiress is a Prince of hell. Like I love this. I think you're I would fucking love this if this is what was happening that Einer and Mormon have been secretly trying to communicate and ended up talking to Prithean.

1:09:16 But it would still fit with Eris being a Prince of hell because they are summoning a Prince of hell just in Prithean because the black salt summons demons and hell like specifically. Yeah, so. Yeah. So Einer and Morven are using the caves in Evol and the black Obsidian salt in Evol and to speak with Eris.

1:09:36 I don't know if Kira's is involved. Thanatos, probably. Thanatos. In the caves under the Cord of Nightmares, which are nearly identical and also probably made of black Obsidian salt because they're nearly identical. And Thanatos. Maybe Eris? I mean, Thanatos is certainly there. Like I said, Thanatos, maybe Eris. I'm affirming.

1:09:55 You know, yeah, I'm. I'm affirming as well. Yeah. Because I'm excited, because I love this theory. Also hell adjacent. Yeah. So I like to answer how they are connected. I don't know how much Baron has to do with any of this honestly, but I do think it's ignorant to assume that he has nothing to do with it, given they first started working on this alliance when Eris was a child.

1:10:19 So Baron probably does know. Like this Lin, this information was probably passed down through his line, and Baron probably does know. Hey, we need to get to the caves under the Court of Nightmares of all. And is a thin place. The Court of Nightmares probably also a thin place. Like we need to talk to the people on Midgard, the fae on Midgard.

1:10:38 Yeah, and I mean, Einer says the Autumn King says he knows everything he knows about Medgar because of the archives in Avalon, Right? And those archives in Avalon basically LED Bryce and everyone to the to The Cave of Princess, right? So if if Einer was looking at the same material, that is where he would end up to.

1:10:56 So it makes sense. And yeah, maybe it was a twist, like when when Bryce wanted to go to hell, she ended up in Prytheon. Maybe the Einer actually wanted to talk to hell. Well, no, he wanted to talk to Prytheon. I don't know. I don't know how you direct this. But I do think it's. Fury. I love it, love it. I honestly I'm kind of mad at myself for not thinking about why the Court of Nightmares.

1:11:20 Like why the fuck do we care about the Court of Nightmares? The tunnels under the Court of Nightmares is why we care about the Court of Nightmares, because it's the same as of all. As of all, yeah. So how do you say? Of all and are we going to get torn apart for? This. No, I say it the way you said it. All right, guys.

1:11:35 Well, let us know, I guess. I can't trust anything anymore, it turns. Out but yeah, so we know like we know that Einar has a really close alliance with Morban and Avalon. He's been reading in the Avalon archives. We learned about that in House of Sky and Breath. Their their bloodlines crossed a while ago. This is kind of like a knit, but the autumn king wears quote an Onyx crown, quote an ancient stone, like a piece of night, even in the light of the morning. So I think, I think autumn and night are more closely allied on the Midgard side than we could have anticipated. And so our recent Heiress Park, getting back to our last episode actually paralleling that more than we thought. And Autumn and Knight need to

1:12:24 work together for some reason that has not yet been revealed. Basically. Well, and I'm just thinking about. Right. So basically 500 years ago when Einer was born, if we are assuming these timelines are parallel, which we can't necessarily, but like that is around on that point that time passes. The time passes around the same way. Yeah.

1:12:45 OK. So, yeah. So 500 years ago is around the time when Eris and Moore's betrothal fell through, when Eris said there are forces at work you could never understand, right. This would fit with that. Having an interdimensional connection to another world filled with Faye that he could chat with if he was married to the Princess of the Hewn City whenever he wanted, would be another force at work.

1:13:07 But why he would walk away from that then I have no idea. Well, or was that what Baron wanted and that was Eris's sign of rebellion? And now something, the thing has happened since then. And Heiress is like, hey, I recognize this need and I need to like, I need to do this or I need to insert myself so that Baron doesn't do a really bad thing and so that I can do the right.

1:13:28 Thing Yeah, yeah OK, I like it I like it no, no, it's love it love it I would love. It did you have this question? Nothing like nothing. You wrote it I think. I think it was one that had been there already. Bullshit, I have bullshit. Yours is way better. I truly have nothing to add, I love this theory.

1:13:46 OK, you heard it here first. The identical Caves of salt. Or why Eris wants the alliance with the Court of Nightmares. Know that they're caves of salt necessarily because Bryce doesn't say that, but it doesn't matter. It's not like hell is made of salt, right? Like basically Morvin has a cell phone to anywhere he wants with.

1:14:08 Well, of all of the made of salt. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. No, that's what I'm saying. But it's like the other end of the connection. Doesn't have to be salt. Yeah, yeah. Fuck, I love it. OK. All right, Abby, why is Helium so affected by the mask? All right, so when Helion comes into contact with the mask after Nuster retrieves it, he says truly wore this and lived.

1:14:32 It wasn't a question meant to be answered. Cover it again, please. I can't stand it. Reese tucked in his wings. It affects you that much, doesn't it? Rake it's cold claws down your senses? Helion asked. Perhaps an ancestor of mine once used it, and the warning of its cost is imprinted upon my blood. We are kind of mysteriously missing a lot of the masks history, so I'm just going to talk about what we do know about it.

1:14:55 The Astari created it, but they almost never used it because they squabbled amongst themselves. The quote we have for that is the Daglin Celine went on always quarreled about who should control the trove. So more of so more often than not, the trove went unused. It was their downfall. That's in Flaming shadow chapter 19. The only Fey, a female person really that we know that used it before Nesta was Thea.

1:15:19 The quote for that we see we first see this in the carvings on the way to the prison in those tunnels we were just talking about. The quote for that is showing a masked queen a crown upon her head, bearing instruments in her hand and standing before an adoring crowd. Celine later confirms that Thea stole the mask and other items from the trove. The quote for that is Bryce could only watch as the vision showed Thea's hands snatching the objects from black pedestals.

1:15:42 I'm literally just imagining like a montage spiriting them away from the subterranean mountain holds where they were kept, using cave arch ways to move Swissly across the lands. And then the last one. Thea sat and thrown the harp and horn beside her, the mask in her lap and the crown atop her head.

1:15:57 Right, So like the only person before Nessa that we know for sure wore this mask was Thea. It's somehow ends up at the bottom of the bog of Orid, but we don't have any connection of Thea doing that. We know that Thea killed Theon in the bog of Orid, but it does not say that she brought the crown with her or anything. We know that Thea brought the horn and the harp with her to Midgard, but there's no mention of what she did with the mask in the crown.

1:16:22 I don't think she brought them with her to Midgard because otherwise Celine would have brought them home, right? Basically. And she doesn't say that she brought them home. There's a quote for that, but I don't really feel like, yeah. So basically, we don't know. We don't know what happened between the time that Thea left Prithian and Nesta finds the mask at the Bog of Ored again.

1:16:41 Seems kind of wild to me that Thea would just leave the mask in the crown behind. But I guess she was planning on this being a temporary trip, quick trip. She just she just wanted to conquer a world for Celine. You know Helena was going to get Prithian and Celine. Daughter, a quick gift. And there's a different planet.

1:16:57 So I looked at this with how Bryce, who we know is Thea's descendant, reacts when she comes into contact with the mask. So the quote for that is this is Nesta talking. You detected a sentience in the mask? Bryce nodded. It didn't like talk to me or anything, I could just sense it. What did it feel like? Nest asked quietly.

1:17:17 Like death. Bryce breathes like death Incarnate. So we have cold claws. What is it? Hold on cold claws raking down your senses, which is obviously so very Maeve and Reese coated. Also like so fucking Maeve coated. But I can't break my brain thinking about how Maeve could possibly involve with the mass. So let's just put that aside for now. And then it feels like death Incarnate, right? So like is Helion a descendant of Thea and also starborn Like it's so possible.

1:17:49 It's so fucking possible, right? He has the light like he literally has the light. So even Feyre, I'll just this quick quote, like, he has 2 powers, right? He has spell cleaving and the light, but even Pharaoh recognizes that they're different powers. Quote for that is even more. And Vivian, probably Vivian for all I know, halted their reunion as Helion stopped a wise distance away. It was his power that had gotten my friend out of Highburn, his power that made me glow whenever Reese and I were tangled in each other and every heartbeat ached with mirth, right. So she's glowing, but she's not cleaving any spells, right? So it's a separate power.

1:18:21 Yeah, it's. Yeah. I mean, it makes sense. Him and Reese also have very similar beast forms, right? We get some quotes about this. So if Reese was a flying terror crafted from shadows and cold moonlight, Helion was his daytime equivalent. Gold feathers and shredding claws and feathered wings Together, my mate and the High Lord of Day unleashed themselves upon Highburn. That's an Aqua war.

1:18:43 And then Helion has the winged horses that came from Duscourt, right. I already read that quote, so I don't think we need to read it again. But we are told specifically that the winged horses come from Duscourt and and Helion shows up in Night Court riding a winged horse and we know he has seven pairs of winged horses for breeding. So it's totally possible in my mind that Helion is starborn and Helion is descended from Thea, which means Lucian is also starborn, right, In theory.

1:19:10 So that's just fun to think about. Sure. If do you have anything else that you want to talk about there? Because then I get into like, Helion has light and Reese has darkness, but they're in theory both descended from Thea, and we have this power being split. And I don't really know how to wrap my hand, my head around it. I had everything you had in terms of Thea being the last person to wear it.

1:19:30 Sarah kind of just like, punted that one over to us. Perhaps an ancestor of mine once you. Like perhaps? Perhaps they did. Yeah. OK. Warning of its cost. Got it, Thea. Roger. The the only like thought that I had if we weren't to take that hint as the absolute fact that it is, which we probably just should.

1:19:50 Going back to the possibility that day quartz gifts are somehow derived from Mala. The last person to wear that mask was Nesta, who we believe has the silver flames of Deanna. And Mala was quote sister and eternal rival to Deanna. So could his power have been recognizing like, its rival power, like a seriously threatening power that he should be very worried about? Like, would Lucian feel the same thing? I don't know.

1:20:18 Probably nothing. No, I think that's fair. I went. So I said, I think there's one of two things that could be happening here, right? Either Reese and Helian are both descendants of Thea, and at some point this power split into night and day. I don't I think it's possible. We know it's possible to split the power with the harp, right? That is exactly what Thea did.

1:20:37 Sorry. She split the light. Bryce starts out with only light and then when she absorbs so Celine's third of Thea's power, she has darker light. And then when she gets Helena, she has like the full spectrum, right? So that could be what happened here and it would be that Reese got the darkness part and that's why he has night and Helian got the light part and that's why he has light but seemingly only light right?

1:21:00 Like how Bryce starts. But could he potentially be a descendant of a different Asteri? I think Mala is a good guess. I so Helion's crown is a radiant crown of golden spikes. The rays of the sun typically with vest versus line, which we think is Thea's line. What we see is a crown of stars. We see this on vespers herself.

1:21:18 We see this on Reese. We see that this on Bryce. So like could it be a different Asteri? Mala would be an obvious choice here. If we think that the throne of throne of glass gods are Asteri. I'm also going to and we see this actually one more in another place, which I think is really interesting and probably confirms it's a different asteri theory.

1:21:36 But Celine had carved a setting or rising sun into the tunnels, implying this power is more than just Starlight. The quote for that is to the right, around the natural archway, an array of stars and planets had been carved, crown at it at its apex by a large setting or rising sun. Bryce's star glowed brighter as she faced it, guiding her there.

1:21:55 So we have this sun imagery in the tunnels as well. But we have vespers saying I am the evening star, right? Could be Mala. I threw Ridgilis in there as well because he is the bright hand. We don't know much about it. We know he has the light. We know he was on Prithean, right? That's one thing we know for sure about Ridgilis is that he was on Prithean. So I think it could.

1:22:14 Could be either one of them. He's not really associated with the Sun, though, so I like Mala a lot more. If we're assuming Throne of Glass gods are a star. Yeah. I think there's also, I mean, Celine married an existing High Lord of Night. So like, there was probably already a High Lord of Day, like it existed somewhere. But to your point on the Starboard line, like it had to, yeah, it had to come from, it had to come from somewhere. Yeah, I don't know.

1:22:39 I'm getting like the idea I'm, I'm like, definitely sold that Reese's Starborn, but his power is night and even Bryce's power is night, right? So like, where does that like Bryce summons night when in House of Claim and Shadow? We've we've talked about it, right. So like, how does that tie into the idea of Starborn light power and being able to summon a certain time of day basically, right. Like how are those connected?

1:23:05 I haven't gone back to see if we ever see the Esteri do anything like that. Yeah, I don't know. My head's going in circles. Sometimes, yeah. I mean, I don't think night is is an antithesis to being starborn by any means. Stars come. Out. No, no, certainly not. Yep. Cool, cool. All right, this is I really love this question.

1:23:25 Are we good on that one? All right, Ronnie, what is the connection between Dawn's healing power and the other healing powers we've seen in the Mass first? OK, my favorite thing about what Sarah J Maas did in the series is that some might describe Dawn, his first light. I love that she did that. Yeah.

1:23:45 So Dawn Court has the power of healing and a court of mist and fury. We learned this in chapter 50. Of course, we talked about this quite a bit at this point. When Pharah goes to capture the cereal to try and figure out how to heal Reese after he gets shot through with ash arrows, she asks the cereal, what is the cure in the cereal?

1:24:04 Says your blood. Give him your blood. It is rich with the healing gift of the High Lord of Dawn. It shall spare him from the blood banes wrath. So we learn that Dawn's power is healing. We see healing in like several different capacities across the mass verse and I focused on a couple, but we could talk about all of them. And I think we we see healing across like a spectrum from like very just rudimentary, like I'll call it Fae healing where they can just do like kind of battle stitching. I know it's not only Fae.

1:24:36 I know like the the malachim can also do like battlefield stitching, but I'll just call it like secondary power healing all the way through very, very powerful healing where people study and focus on their primary power being healing and can do like miraculous things healing powers, the most miraculous healing power I think we see in the universe.

1:24:59 There were really two. The first one is the first light healing in mass at the end of House of Earth and Blood when Bryce makes the drop to generate first light to heal a huge square footage square mileage. Really. Yeah. People including Hunt, who is basically at at that doorstep. Have you ever seen My Big Fat Greek Wedding? Yeah, of course.

1:25:21 You know, you know how they always say put some Windex on it? That's kind of how I think of first light, or like how I think that people think of first light. Like first light seems to do everything. They're like just throw some first light at it. Yeah, it's really confusing. It's really, it's really confusing.

1:25:37 We should. Probably do a first light episode in our Christmas city. Yeah, but not yeah. Not this season. Yeah, what the fuck is it? But we do know that first light heals, and Dawn is first light. So in House of Earth and Blood Chapter 91, we have Bryce saying the first light I'll generate by making the drop will spread from this gate to the others. It'll light up everything, send those demons racing away. It'll heal everything it touches, everyone it touches. And I, She took a deep breath.

1:26:01 I am Starborn Faye, and I bear Luna's horn in my body with the power of the first light. I can, I generate. I can shut the portals to hell. I did it here. I can do it everywhere else. And then she talks about all the other stuff. Yeah, she can also shut portals with first light. And she can. I completely forgot that the horn was Luna's horn.

1:26:18 They weren't going to have to talk about that at some point. Yeah, Luna slash Deanna. Yeah. So, so then she makes the drop, she generates a huge amount of First Light and basically anything that's not dead is healed, including including Hunt, which is kind of the the focus or the thing that really drove her to to go make it.

1:26:39 So First Light has immense healing power. We also have in Throne of Glass, specifically in Tower of Dawn is really the big focus Tower of Dawn. Dawn Tower of Dawn, Tower of Dawn. The focus is the healers, and Kale has this huge arc where he has this really severe injury to his lower spine that renders him unable to walk. And he goes to Irene.

1:27:04 Irene. Irene. Yeah, it's Irene. Guys, we can't do this. We can't do it every time for normal names. Makes the journey to the Torre. Chesme. Torre definitely means tower. I could not find a translation for Chesme. Does it mean dawn? I have no idea, but it's Tower of Dawn. It's. Definitely. It has to mean Dawn, which is the home and the training ground of all of the best healers. So it's the Tower of Dawn.

1:27:30 It's the training ground of all the best healers. He goes and he and Irene have this huge journey of both mental and physical healing and her powers are also first light, Ask So Dawn in general. Dawn is thematic across all three series and also has healing powers associated with it across all three series. Would you like to go into more?

1:27:51 I did so. So there's a really interesting thing that happens at the end of House of Flame of Shadow, just to go back to Crescent City. Totally matches what you had. Rune after he takes the antidote has immense healing powers, right? So he's he is Star War Faye. He has what we think is the Esteri power.

1:28:09 So that would be the first light basically, right? Like the consumption of the first light and he can heal, right. So I think that's more argument here, but I don't know if Bryce can. That's the thing, like Bryce doesn't seem to be able to, but like Rune's power seems to be exactly what Irene's power is.

1:28:24 He is using light and he is healing people. So I think that's more evidence that what Irene is doing is, is Starborn power. Girines also starborn, so like, we'll do that later I guess. Well, I'm going to get into it a bit here, like a little bit. So the origins of the healing magic and Tower of Dawn, what we learn is Irene and Kayol have gone into the desert for her birthday and found ruins of an ancient fae civilization that were gifted healers.

1:28:49 So what we learn is that this healing magic originated in fae line the lines and that they intentionally bred that into the humans, right? So again we have this idea of Starborn fae and then they are breeding that starborn healing power into the humans. The quote for that is fae magic is passed down through their bloodlines.

1:29:07 OK proof it is genetic. Fae magic is passed down through their bloodlines, it doesn't appear at random. You don't need to be coy. About it. Perhaps these people came here and then we're forgotten by the world forces, good and evil. Perhaps they knew this place was far away enough to remain untouched, that wars would be waged elsewhere by them. He jerked his chin to a carving of a Valg soldier. While the southern continent remained mostly mortal held, while the seeds planted here by the Fae were bred into human bloodlines and grew into a people gifted and prone to healing magic.

1:29:39 So we have this idea that the Fae, who I'm just, we're going to call them Star Worm because I think that's what they are. But basically the Star War Faye came to the southern continent and spread that into the humans. Now, obviously this is interesting because we think Mala is an Asteri, right? So we think that Alan is also kind of Starborn in the sense that she is descended from an Asteri, but she does not seem to have these healing powers. So I think we're getting back to the idea of, again, like the original Asteri, that was your source of power if you are a steri descended influences like the kind of power you had basically, right?

1:30:13 So like Mala does not have healing powers, but perhaps there is a Steri out there that does. We're going to get into that when Irene is telling Hafiza about visa. I think, I don't know. I think that's how you say. I think it's right. Yeah. About what her and Kale found in the desert. She confirms the story but adds in something else. The Faye actually stole that knowledge, stole that power right?

1:30:35 So what she says is Afiza has been talking about how she got one of her old instructors drunk and the instructor told her that all of Antica, which is where they are, used to be faith civilization, and that they had left their healing knowledge for the humans to find. She rambled how they had left their knowledge of healing for us to find, that they had stolen it from elsewhere and that their teachings form the basis of the torch. So this also in my mind points to the idea that this power, which I think was read into the faith by the Asteria, I guess knowledge of it came from somewhere else, right? And then we have what I have is when Brune takes the antidote to remove the parasite at the end

1:31:09 of flame and shadow. He says, warm, bright magic, answered, healing magic rising to the surface as as if it had been dormant in his blood. He had no idea how to use it, how to do anything other than with it, than with simple healing. Save him, he said an answer. Light poured from his hands, and he could feel Therion's flesh and bone knitting back together beneath his fingers, mending healing. It's, it's definitely Irene's power, right? It's got to be the same power.

1:31:32 So again, we're getting this healing, we're getting this light. Thiessen does not have light as far as we know, but he does seem to have this healing power, which again, kind of mirrors Reese, right? We know that Reese has like elements of what seems to be star war power, but no light itself. There isn't a steri named Eosphorus.

1:31:50 I'm going to say Eosphorus. I hope that's how you pronounce it. The Eosphorus is known as the Morningstar slash dawn bringer, right? So it would see, it would seem to me that if there isn't a steri associated with the dawn and this, I think this might be in mythology, Morningstar slash dawn bringer.

1:32:06 I would bet that this is the Steri that is the source of this power and perhaps the source of the Dawn court, if we think that Vesperus is the source of night slash, Dusk Mala is the source of day, and Theosaurus is the source of Dawn. Yeah. Where this doesn't totally work is with Rune, right? Because I just said Rune has this healing power, which would seem to come from Dawn, but we don't have any traces of Rune. Back to Dawn Corp.

1:32:29 But I don't know. But it's even like the names like Thesin and Theospheros, they both have those ESS in there. I don't know, I thought they sounded kind of similar, but maybe that's a stretch. I mean, thesin just means Dawn. Like, yeah, yeah. So they both just have names that mean things about Dawn.

1:32:47 Yeah. But yes, Don, in this world is healing first for certain, for sure. Yeah. OK, so in conclusion, we think that all the healing powers basically are traced back to some kind of star born lineage in theory. And you know what? No, I'm not going to say it. I'm not going to say that. It just it does make sense.

1:33:04 It does make sense. Well, maybe that maybe Thiessen isn't actually like a Seri descended, but he, he takes the magic from the land. And if the Osteros was the Asteria that I mean, that's actually what I think is the case with all of the High Lords except for maybe Reese and Helian, because we have such obvious connections here, right?

1:33:21 It's not that they're descended, but that they are taking that magic that is imbued from the Asteria. And I think I already said this, so we don't need to talk about it. Well, I think it yeah. But to to put like a literal comparison to it, like Thea stores her power and Bryce takes it. And so to make it literal, if the power was in the land, like say in theory, it was imbued by an Asteri and a high Lord like started engaging in this cycle. And all that needs to happen is when the high Lord dies, whoever is the next high Lord is who the power moves to. Like the power is a physical thing that moves. And we've already seen that asteri power is a physical thing that can sit somewhere and move

1:34:05 into another person. Right. And there's still a first like core underneath the prison. Yeah, like that is still there. We're just like pretending that it doesn't exist for whatever reason. Yeah, yeah. OK, cool. Fun, yeah. OK, cool. All right, pre card corner. Abby, what's your pre card corner theory? OK, so I hinted at this last episode and this isn't really that crazy, but you've made me think of some crazy things while we've been talking about it.

1:34:28 And again, this precog, this is out there, we have not really talked about Nick's, but Nick's Bears discussion, right, Since we've been talking about the high Lords. So Nyx has in theory, we just read that Faye, what is it, Faye? Magic. Magic is passed down through their bloodline. OK, so Nyx in theory has the power of every single high Lord currently in existence. And whatever the fuck is going on with Reese, which we think might be a combination of Valg and Esteri and a certainly Illyrian, he he potentially has the he is potentially like insanely powerful.

1:35:01 Like we have no idea what he could do. Yeah, I know there's been speculation on this, but there's been nothing like solid in Greek mythology. You already said this. Nyx is a goddess and is a personification of night. In Roman mythology, Nyx is called Knox. And we have a character named Knox in throne, right? He is described as having black hair and Gray eyes. However, he's just if he is Nyx, which is the theory, his description wouldn't matter because Nyx can shift his appearance because he has talent shifting power from Pharaoh, right?

1:35:33 So like in theory, if Nix is actually this powerful, and again, this is pre cog, like this is super out there, but like will Nix become kind of a world Walker and maybe be also be able to fuck with the timeline somehow? We don't know how the traveling through time works, right? But like will Nix become a world Walker?

1:35:49 And is Nix kind of already embedded into all of these stories in different places? Like is Nix Knox? Is Nix some other character? Like kind of what I was saying with Heiress in the last episode, but what you triggered for me, which I think is crazy, is you said that Eric's is the son of Nix in mythology, right? What if Eris is actually just Nix's son and that's why he seems so similar to Reese?

1:36:10 Because Reese is his grandfather and they're both doing this crazy world walking shit to like, set events up in a way that needs to be set up for whatever's coming. I'm not sure I would like that. Yeah, the heart. Yeah, I've been worried about time travel in this book. I've I've actually like lost sleep over time travel in this universe and like if she starts introducing pureplay time travel. Well, I think she's going to the last string is time. I know, but like time and world, I can do pure time. I don't know.

1:36:39 I don't know if I can do that. I know that's really we've talked about how these books are actually sci-fi and not. Fantasy. Yeah, it's true. Yeah. So. Basically, this theory is Nix is insanely powerful, Eris is potentially his son. I don't know about that, but if you're following the mythology, Eric Eris is his son and Nix brings them back in time to make sure everything goes the way it's supposed to go. Do I like it?

1:37:04 No, not really. I do think Nicks is going to be insanely powerful. I mean either way if anyone's going to be high king of Brythian, it's going to be Nicks. All 7 courts plus whatever Reese's. Yeah, like, get out of town. Like that's going to be a problem, Wings. Yeah. Goodness, are things like dropping an Illyrian war camp, Like what are the other Illyrians going to do? He's going to be the baby from The Incredibles. Jack, Jack.

1:37:30 You can't put siphons on that thing. I don't know. It won't work, yeah. No, no, no. That's yours. Mine's kind of a nothing. I had two for Eris and none for this. So mine is leftover from Harris, but it's like not fun anymore because we've talked about so many more interesting things about Eris.

1:37:49 Eris appears from a RIP in the world and is wearing a red Cape and has a really good sense of smell and seems to know things that he's not supposed to know. And we know that I need to make sure I'm pronouncing this correctly. Just do it. It's rocking Kraken. Yeah. Kraken. Kraken. Kraken witches have more males.

1:38:12 Yeah, than iron teeth. Like they're male. Male Kraken witches. Don't know whether we still call them witches. Don't know what what a male witch is called. I guess just a male witch. I don't know. The non father was, I don't know but he's wearing red all the time. Is Eris. A world walking crock and crock and male witch. Crock and male witch that why he knows all these things? Is that why he wants to be with with the mirrors in Cure's court?

1:38:41 Yeah, maybe. And is that just to be clear? We know that krakens have more males because of the quote. The krakens had always given birth to more males than the iron team and had adoption, the Fay habit of selecting mates, if not a true mating bond, then in spirit. So basically they're kind of like Faye.

1:38:58 They're kind of just like Faye dudes, and that's what Mom's father was, and that's how she was both a Crockin and an Iron Teeth. Looks like a fae, talks like a fae. Yeah. I mean, there's definitely the idea that Eris is not. I definitely kind of of be in mind that Eris is not actually fae. Obviously I think he's a Prince of hell, but yeah, could be. Which would be one step closer to hell. That's for sure.

1:39:19 That's true. That's true, yeah. I mean, he could be a witch and talking to Morvin and Einer, which would be fucking awesome. Yeah. I really. I really would love if they were chatting in the tunnels in The Cave, but not the murdered twins. Well, I was thinking about this because I was like, wait, but didn't you need to be a Damati to talk to, to use the communication system?

1:39:43 Because that's when Bryce says the Star worm were Damati. But then I'm like, no, because Bryce and Hunt aren't Damati and they were able to use it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yep. OK, all right. Well, that was fun, but what are you reading? I'm reading Alchemist, it is so good. It's. So is it stand alone?

1:40:04 Yes. OK, maybe I can handle. It, Oh my God, my God, it's the best book I've read this year, hands down. Honestly, I'm in, I'm in Part 2. I'm not done with it. I'm about halfway through a bit. It it does drag a little bit, like I am kind of like, all right, let's get to the point. And it is 1000 pages long but my God it is an amazing, amazing book as far as I'm concerned.

1:40:27 I feel like I should warn you, it's incredibly visceral. I am deeply uncomfortable reading it at least Part 1. Like I literally like my stomach was like turning nature of visceral. It's like body horror basically. It's not gore's. It's kind of like needles. Like there's a lot of needles involved.

1:40:45 It's not like there's some gore, but I don't even find the gore to be that big a problem. I don't think this is a spoiler. There is a concept in this book of people who can never die, right? So there's like kind of ideas about how far can you push a body if it can't die, right? Like how far can you take? That is explored a lot and it's mind. It's deeply unsettling, but it is absolutely worth reading. Everything I feel about Brimstone, I feel the opposite about Alchemize, which is similar because they're actually kind of similar magic systems.

1:41:15 Like they're like metal and resonance is like a big part of Alchemize. But I'm like, I know as soon as I finish this book, I'm going to want to reread it. I know that I'm missing things like I know that you'd like, It's not like I'm like, oh, where are these clues? I'm like, there's so much being thrown at me, I can't possibly absorb it all. But I will happily reread it.

1:41:33 I think only halfway through. I will, like, happily reread it as soon as I'm done with it. I think it is just. I think it's fucking brilliant. I don't know how much more praise I can get this book, but like, Oh my God, it is so, yeah, interesting. I mean, I definitely will read it. Yeah. Maybe I'll put it to a vote. OK, guys.

1:41:49 Should I DNF Kiss of the Basilisk to go read out guys? Because remember I'm still in the middle. I stopped it to read Brimstone and now I'm rereading Brimstone to attempts to make sense of it. So do I not go back to Kiss of the Basilisk until after I read Alchemist? I actually think that would be good because I think this book will destroy me, and I think it would destroy you too.

1:42:12 Like I'm. Fully expecting that at the end of this and Kiss the Basilisk will just be like a fun nothing book to read after like it's it's fun and that I just can't read the sequel. Kiss of the Basilisk is what you're. There's no point in reading the sequel. There's no point. God, this is fucking. Depressing, we all read.

1:42:30 I've been looking at from. What is it? Called Blood and Ash. Yeah, from blood and Ash. I've heard of that one. I need like, I'm not quite at the level of of like Zodiac Academy, but I need something almost, almost there, you know? Like, I mean, I haven't read fantasy. Yeah, I haven't read Zodiac Academy, but my impression. Is it's Gossip Girl romantic?

1:42:53 See basically. Like I don't know if. That's true. But like, same vibes. Yeah, same vibes. All right, I'm rereading Brimstone. But now, as you all know, I'm debating whether to go back to Kiss of the Basilisk or jump to Alchemist. I read. Two chapters of Quicksilver and I was like, I don't really know if I want to reread all this I. Just reread it and then I read the first chapter of Alchemist and I was like, I'm done.

1:43:20 This is it for me. I'm, I'm reading Alchemist. This is what I'm doing now for the next two weeks. Like happy for you. Yeah, all right. We are on social media, TikTok, Instagram, YouTube, Dragons in the. Details pod we have a discord. Dragons in the details is our server name. We have a website dragonsinthedetails.com and you can contact us via e-mail Dragons in the details pod@gmail.com Reach out to us, follow us, like subscribe.

1:43:48 It really helps us out and also makes us happy forms our days. If you care about our happiness, will be nice. And yeah, thanks for listening. Have a wonderful. Monday love you. Bye. Happy Monday. Love you. Bye.