Avatar Aang: Series Finale

0:00 Water, earth, fire, air. This is what we This is Yuppie. Hooray! It's our podcast.

0:19 I think you have a pillow to sit down on. I'm trying.

0:21 Are you talking to me? Talking to her.

0:23 No, she's sitting. I'm talking to you.

0:25 I need a pillow to sit on?

0:27 Well, I'm we're standing, but I now feel like sitting.

0:32 Okay.

0:32 And a pillow is your solution?

0:34 Yeah, one pillow. We're gonna sit on the floor. We're in Morocco. How's that mushroom, Jessica? So it's like oozing. I know. Oh, an oozing mushroom.

0:44 Why we're watching you eat it. Hey, yeah.

0:46 Oh. And it's on her thumb. Oh, there's this big piece on her thumb. Are you gonna lick that off?

0:53 We don't need a play-by-play.

0:55 Jessica, will you tell me some things? I know your mouth is full. Do you need a napkin? Hey. Hey.

1:00 Hey, gross mouth noises.

1:02 We're gonna do some uh yeah, do some uh sound checks here.

1:05 I wanna be breathing heavy. I feel like it. I feel like I'm like, what's that?

1:08 Like um just ran a mile. The ASMR, is that what it is? Like asthma or whatever.

1:16 Top their piece.

1:18unknown I love to. Today on my makeup tutorial.

1:21 I don't think I'm doing it.

1:22 I don't want to get an ASMR voice. Oh my god. I don't even know what we're talking about.

1:27 There's a lot about like tap the brushes. That's like really big in ASMR where they're like tap a tap tapa tap.

1:32 Wait, like on a podcast?

1:33 No, like people watch it on like YouTube, it'll be like a makeup tutorial, but it's like ASMR because she'll be like, and I'll just tap my brush and just lightly tap it, and she has like a makeup and like people who like get tingly in their brain, I guess, when they hear certain things. That's what ASMR is.

1:50 And they just like watch these videos all day. Or I don't know if all day. Tingle in my brain.

1:54 They're vegetables, then they're just hooked up watching these YouTube videos.

1:57 Yeah, I mean, okay.

1:59 Everybody, welcome to the Yep, yep, hooray, an Avatar Podcast Christmas special. It's me, Santa Jordan.

2:06 I was gonna make that joke also. That it's the Christmas special? Yeah. But I think we should say the holiday special.

2:13 It's the uh holiday special. Well, it's Hanukkah right now, so it's the Hanukkah special.

2:18 Unless you're listening to this later, then it's just special.

2:25 I'm Katie Claus.

2:28 I'm Jingle Jessica.

2:29 Jingle Jessica. Well, see, I mine was like not illiterate and it was not good. Yep, but we're moving on. Well, that's great. Things have come full circle, kind of. We are in a different location than when we started the podcast, but we were just Yeah.

2:45 I was just gonna say, like, we are distanced. Jessica is way across the room. So far away.

2:52 I know she has a very long USB cord, and um I could not hit her with something if I threw it. So that's how far away she is.

3:00 Or how poor your aim is. I think that's more what it is.

3:04 That's ridiculous. You know my aim is fantastic.

3:06 Moving on.

3:09 We've come so far since that first that first fateful episode, sitting on a bed.

3:14 Not even a year. Almost.

3:16 I don't really really bookended this year with some avatar, which is phenomenal for me.

3:21 Jessica, what do you remember about the beginning?

3:23 I remember being in a bedroom. I remember using a laundry crate. I remember talking about my orange couch going up, the SNCC couch, and you guys not knowing what I was talking about. Exactly. Did you guys look it up later? No.

3:37 Well, not your couch, but I know the couch of which you speak. I imagine the one that you owned was Shag.

3:44 No, it was like a velvet.

3:46 Which that's disgusting.

3:47 Yeah, for some reason that's Jordan's like kryptonite. No. Velvet.

3:51 It's not velvet. I enjoy it. Valure is my kryptonite. If you were to rub me with velour, it would burn and I would lose that limb within 48 hours.

4:00 That's fresh stuff.

4:02 How did we ask you to do this podcast? I mean, I'm sure it was very cash.

4:06 Yeah, I feel like it was a text message, maybe.

4:09 You don't think I got on one knee and was like probably a year ago, right? Popped open a DVD case and was like, Jessica, we're not.

4:15 Even though you have proposed to me before, you did not propose a podcast to me.

4:18 And Jessica denied me.

4:19 So um Right, so that's how I got in.

4:22 But we were kids, you know, it was kindergarten and it was one of those. It was a worm. I proposed to her with a worm that was in the shape of a ring.

4:29 Going back to a year ago, it's crazy because Avatar wasn't even on Netflix then, and we didn't even know that it was gonna be That's true.

4:37 We had to watch it on the DVDs, and it was like I had requested them from the library.

4:41 Yeah, you uh in the Support Your Local Library. Our first episode, you had this whole pitch of for uh support your local libraries and uh check out check out Avatar.

4:49 Although right now I can't get anything from the library, it makes me sad.

4:51 Oh man, we have Curbside Pickup here.

4:53 We have Curbside, but right now they're not doing it because of the, you know, COVID.

4:58 Because you know the uh that thing.

5:00 It's getting worse, newsflash.

5:02 Yeah, so um, if you're listening to this, uh don't just go into a closet, don't be near anybody else, and that's what we're gonna do.

5:10 No, I think we're encouraging people to come out of the closet, but moving on.

5:13 Sorry, thank you. Things have ended. The show has come to a close for all of us.

5:19 Jessica just finished watching it. I can't believe it's over.

5:23 I know we really like artificially prolonged that for you.

5:27 Well, just like young Jordan.

5:30 Thank you. Thank you so much for you know, we really build empathy here with this podcast. That's what we're going for. Is this the longest like you like intentionally like prevented yourself from like binging a show?

5:41 Well, I watch one episode of Star Trek the Next Generation a week because I listen to a two Star Trek the Next Generation podcasts. Yes, and now I'm like full on trekky. I love it, you guys. If you haven't watched it, it's great.

5:54 T Real Grimm.

5:55 And I like watching it once a week because you get like your fill, and then like I like watch it on Sunday nights, and then I'm like, it's like my show, and I'm like, ooh, let's watch. And then I had to like stop myself. And when it's like a two-parter, it's like exciting to be like, ooh, I can't wait till next week to see the second half of this two-parter.

6:09 Wait, you watched Star Trek and Bake Off on Sunday nights?

6:14 Yeah.

6:16 A Sunday night girl.

6:17 Yeah, it's a Sunday night. That's my thing. Bake Off and Star Trek the Next Generation. Um, yeah, it's Star Trek's like 45 minutes, I think. Anyway, I'm on the final season of Star Trek right now, too, so it's coming to an end. But luckily, I have DS DS9 is the Korra of Star Trek the Next Generation.

6:32 But you don't you haven't seen Korra. Or you just mean like as in it's controversial?

6:36 As in it's in the same universe and property, like it takes place in a different place. It's not on the Enterprise. Further in the floor. It's closer in time, it's not in the future. I guess that would be Voyager, I think takes place in the future. I don't know. There's lots of Star Trek ahead of me.

6:51 Okay. This isn't a plug for that. This is a plug for whatever the heck we called.

6:57 I enjoy artificially delaying watching it. Because sometimes when you just binge everything, it's good, but then like a month later you're like, what happened?

7:05 And I feel empty inside somehow. I had an ex-girlfriend, it's neither of you. Um and we went to like her parents' house, and it was a I think it was a Sunday, and we binge watched like nine episodes of True Blood, which, if you've ever seen True Blood, terrible idea. And I it was like the worst experience of my life.

7:23 And then I stopped wanting to ever binge anything ever. So now I have a two episode limit.

7:28 But didn't you also binge like Game of Thrones or something?

7:31 Also, another awful decision. Stop binging people, have some self-control. Darn it.

7:36 Jessica talking to you. Yeah, totally. They just announced that they were rebooting True Blood, and I was like, wasn't True Blood on TV like five years ago?

7:44 Just finished that. Why? I mean, we we could reboot Game of Thrones and be fine.

7:50 Yeah, like just a year later. It's a whole new cast, same exact storylines.

7:53 That's what we're gonna do with this podcast, actually. We told Troy we're actually gonna start from the beginning, same crew, and we're just gonna re-watch it all and then get your your take again.

8:02 There are podcasts, I don't listen to them, where they recap their own podcast.

8:08 Oof.

8:08 It's very meta. It doesn't sound great.

8:11 Jessica, overall, let's talk about the beginning of your avatar experience to the end. Like, at what point were you like, I'm not just watching this for them, I'm watching it for me.

8:22 I think early on, like midway probably through the first season, I would have continued watching it to the end. Not like super stoked about it, but like, oh, this is a good show to like watch. And I definitely think the second season is when it like clicked in, and I was like, ooh, what's gonna happen next?

8:40 Like, what is the end game for this? And I gotta say, Azula, I think, really changed the whole game for me. And I don't know why. And I feel like she was Rob Spoiler in the finale. I feel like they did Azula Dirty, and I don't appreciate that.

8:54 Let's talk, let's talk about that. Uh why did they do Azula Dirty?

8:59 Okay, so her dad leaves her back, and I'm like, why? He's not protecting her, she could have become the Fire Lord like the day after the comic came. There was no reason for her to stay back, so I think he was just being a dick to her.

9:14 Just showing true colors, which we all know, Father of the Year.

9:17 And I don't feel like they built it up enough that she would all of a sudden crack and go crazy. Because it was like literally everything she did after that didn't make sense to Azula to me. It's like, yes, her friends betrayed her, and I could see that impacting her a little bit, but not like causing her to because she wasn't even like killing people, she was banishing them, which is like, why would you banish the Dali?

9:41 Then they could just come back and like attack you. It didn't make any sense.

9:45 No, the Daly just got on a boat and they went back to the.

9:47 Yeah, there's gonna be like peace, we're going to the Earth King. Like, it does like if you're afraid they're gonna turn on you, like releasing them to the wild is not a better plan.

9:55 Hey, she was going crazy. Did you see that haircut she gave herself?

9:58 I know. I was like, oh girl, but the banks didn't look that bad. I think that's okay.

10:03 Yeah, no, I was like, oh yeah, these are kind of cute. Yeah.

10:05 No, like even under the crazy, she's like, okay. And then when she's fighting Zuko and Mara, she goes even like crazier and like really, I feel like seeing Zuka would like kind of recenter her almost, but I guess it just broke her more. I don't know. I just feel like her change to like absolute crazy pants can't control herself was too quick.

10:28 I feel like in there should have been something between like because like what the last time we saw her, like her friends had just betrayed her, but in that moment she had like there was no like glimpse into this affecting her.

10:40 Right, because May and Tylie betray her. The next episode, she's like on a warship trying to murder Zuko, and then with like Gusto, and then Gusto, but I don't feel like she's like I feel like it was like in her normal level of gusto.

10:54 Right. And it was just like I don't need Zuko anymore, he's not helpful to me anymore.

10:59 Right. You know, she's gonna be an only child, and then we think Azula's going down, but then she uses blue blast off power. Well, and like her hair pieces, right? To like stop herself on the yeah, yeah.

11:11 Resourceful. Right, but it like is it is the idea like Azula was put under so much pressure and she like could we agree that maybe it was part of it was a facade, and then she just broke? Because we never really get inside Azula. The only time we do is in the beach episode where she's like, Oh, even my own mother thinks I'm a monster.

11:29 She was right, of course. Also, doesn't Azula sound slightly British when she speaks? Like, there's a little English twang there. Just a little. That's right. She's a little posh.

11:39 She is. She's a princess. Right.

11:42 Uh, was the does was the pressure and ultimately the the betrayal of Ozai what made her?

11:48 Yeah, I think it was definitely like put all her eggs in one basket. Betray her. No. He promoted her. But he let her down, where she was like, no, we're doing this together. And right, it was like you can't treat me like Zuko or like these other people. Like, I'm not that.

12:03 And Well, Azula wanted to help Ozai commit genocide on the Earth Kingdom.

12:07 Okay, yes. I was like, oh, we're sure to talk about a second genocide right now. And I was like, what are you gonna do with this Earth Kingdom when there's no people there?

12:14 You just yeah, you know, it's like you uh the soil will create like a nice lush environment and they'll uh repopulate over the course of it.

12:22 Right. Like the fire nation will just keep it.

12:25 I do have a question about diverting a little bit from the Azula thing, I am curious, like, why the other nations let themselves be subjugated to the fire nation. And I think part of it is this idea that the comet came, maybe the rest of the world didn't quite know, like, what the fire nation did or was capable of to like eradicate the fire nomad or the the air nomads, but they just know that they eradicated all of the air nomads.

12:50 Maybe the rest of the world didn't know that it was because of this once-in-a-century comet that let them do that, and so the rest of the world was just like scared AF of the Fire Nation, and so they're like, oh no, we're you can colonize us, we're cool.

13:03 And then Well, I don't think they wasn't it pretty forceful, like they sent troops in. I'm sure they like killed some people, and then the people were like, Okay, I guess we're being subjugated. I mean, I think it was like just like colonization in our world, where like people aren't like, hey, it's cool, they're just like, oh shoot, I'm either gonna die, try to fight this person, or try to live under tyranny, and I guess I choose living under tyranny.

13:28 Well, I do think like the Earth Kingdom kind of like levels the playing field a little bit when you have like these two elements that you're able to use. And so I think the Earth Kingdom probably could have put up a better fight, personally.

13:40 Right, but the Earth King wasn't aware that any of that was happening. So it's everything happening outside of Bong Siuse Sei. So then it's just little villages with no army to protect them.

13:49 Well, that's true. I mean, they could create militias. I mean, you had some of that.

13:52 And it was a hundred years later. So you don't know what it was like early on.

13:56 I do know what it was like. I was there with Boomy by his side.

14:00 And we all saw what happened to Boomy.

14:01 I know, it went just bananas. Okay, so back to Azula. She was done dirty. Um, what did you were you surprised when she fights Zuko and the score changes to this like a beautiful, like haunting string score?

14:17 I guess I wasn't because I don't remember that. No, it's Jordan's favorite. Sometimes he'll just play it and we'll just listen to it. Yeah, that's like your favorite song from the whole Avatar tech catalog.

14:28 That like Leaves from the Vine. I mean, they're they're up there. Like, it's called Final Agni Kai. So, like, they go to fight and then it's like they shoot the fire, and it's like all the sound cuts out, and you just hear like the fire like over the strings, and it's beautiful and haunting. And it's this two siblings put on a path to fight each other.

14:52 Poor Azula. Do you think Azula should have had a redemption storyline in the finale?

14:59 No, I think that would have been even more out of character in like the same episode where she goes crazy that she's suddenly like, actually, team up her, you're okay. Like, like Zuko didn't flip in one episode. Like, Azula needs time.

15:10 She can't do it all in one three, four episodes. Zuko took two and a half seasons.

15:16 Exactly. Like, and like we know, like I feel like Azula could eventually like not get on their side and that think that, like, oh, I want to be on the side of good, but like be on their side because they're the people in power, and she can like, you know, use her wiles to like further a certain type of agenda.

15:34 I think she'll always be Azula. I think eventually she could get more on the right side of history.

15:39 Do you think it would have been more satisfying if the finale played out? Her, like, with all of her faculties in place.

15:45 Wait, we have to take a pause. When you were rubbing your eye, you look like Leslie. And I've never thought that ever. But it was like, I was like, whoa. Leslie with the tan. Okay. I'm sure the podcast listeners love this. Okay. Yeah.

15:59 Just so you know, Jessica, you look like your sister right now.

16:02 Yeah, because Jessica, yeah. Does anybody ever tell you you look like Leslie? Yeah. What? You don't think I sound like her, like exactly like her.

16:09 I disagree with that. Unbelievable. I've heard both of your voices. They're different.

16:12 Yeah. Okay, moving on. Sorry. Back it up.

16:15 Do uh do Azula in the fight?

16:20 Yeah, I think it would have been more satisfying if Azula was at the height of her powers, and uh Zuko put up a good fight against her, and then maybe with the help of Katara, they were able to overcome Azula. I just feel like they made such a strong, powerful uh foil for Team Avatar. Because again, like Fire Lord Ozai is this like non-entity because we never see him or thing.

16:46 But we like know Azula to a certain point. We've seen her hang out with her friends, we've seen her do a fake confession at the beach bonfire. We like know what her relationship is, and then just for her to like crack and go crazy, and then like Zuko like defeats her. And again, like obviously it doesn't all go smile and roses for Zuko Kentaro, but like, like, why like it's like oh, but I don't know.

17:09 To me, it almost is like, oh, but she's a girl, so she go cracks under the pressure and she goes crazy, and then of course, like she loses. Like, I don't know. I don't know if I would have felt the same if she was a male character.

17:19 Hmm. It is fair that they maybe the problem in the writer's room was like, well, we know if Azula and Zuko fight, like Azula's significantly more talented, and like with the power of the comet, like she will win. And so they had to like give her some sort of handicap, I think.

17:34 Well, I feel like maybe they should have to overcome that, they could have used the dragon teachings that Zuko just learned. Azula hasn't learned from the dragons, she doesn't know. And like, and he saw all the- I wanted like all the colors of the fire to like I wanted like Zuko to have like more colors in his fight against the blue lightning, and then overcome her through that and through his like dance fighting via dragons.

17:57 That would have been what I wanted.

17:59 But something that does happen is this happens throughout the series, is that the way Zuko ultimately defeats Azula is with uh the technique that Iroh teaches him in episode three, which is to break your roots, and it's this like breakdance move that he does. He does it for the first time against Zhao, and he does it throughout the series, and so it's a really quick blink and you miss it moment.

18:20 But yeah, he does like his little breakdance move and creates like a fireball, and Azula gets kind of guard. Were you surprised that he taunted her into using lightning and then was surprised when she was like, Oh, actually, I'm going for Katara, sucker?

18:34 Well, right. Well, I mean, I was kind of like, because I felt like not bad for Azula, but it just like bad for her, how her character is being treated, or like how the writers wrote her to be weaker. And so then I was like, Yes, of course she's going for Katara. And then I was like, of course Zuko doesn't think about this because this is Zuko we're talking about.

18:51 I was kind of upset that uh Katara wasn't like you know, kind of like ready to defend herself. Like, there's a fight going on, like just because you don't are tapped in yet, you should be prepared for you to get some like flack.

19:04 Yeah, no, I thought that was out of character too, because it was like, one, why are you standing right there? Two, we know Crazy Girl shoots lightning. I mean, this all sorts of stuff.

19:14 Again, she shouldn't have been dependent on Zuko to save her. Right.

19:17 And like Katara's like a waterbending master. Like, right, there's no way that she'd be like, oh god. It's like, so what's happening?

19:25 No, she was respecting the rules of the Agni Kai. It was just a one-on-one duel.

19:30 She's not whatever.

19:31 She had no respect for it.

19:32 She's not saying she needed to jump in without but like you can be on game, like watching and like prepared without getting involved.

19:40 Maybe she was so disturbed with how Azula hit her descent into madness. She like couldn't, she was just immobilized.

19:47 I don't know. I mean, I've said it once. No, I've said it more than once. I've said it many times. Avatar is not perfect. There is definitely a lot of room for improvement.

19:56 But it's pretty damn close.

19:58 Well, also I mean I enjoyed the episode.

20:01 I'm just saying.

20:02 Maybe Katara was contemplating her feelings in the Zutara. She was like, hmm, Zuko. Maybe she was just distracted with how hunky and charming he is. And she was considered, she was like weighing her options, like, well, hangs into me. Zuko, that's a question mark. And then she was surprised.

20:20 I mean, we look pretty good together.

20:22 So that's what was on her mind, obviously. Thinking about boys. See, he gets into trouble all the time. Me? I'm like directing traffic, thinking about boys, and all of a sudden, like, oh no, this car's coming for me. It's rough. What did you think about what did you think about the Aang Ozai fight in the end?

20:41 I mean, I guess. I mean, it was good. I enjoyed it. Like, we knew that Aang was gonna win, right? And then I ultimately knew he wasn't gonna kill Ozai. Although they really tried to make you, like, all the avatars telling him, like, basically, like, straight up, you need to kill that guy.

20:57 Yeah, I mean, were you surprised that he uh chatted with so many past lives and that they all doled out like the same advice?

21:04 Yeah, I like wrote down their advice. Roku, you must be decisive. As someone who's very indecisive, someone just telling me to be decisive is not gonna make me decisive. Worst advice.

21:12 Amen.

21:13 Kyoshi. Only justice will bring peace. Okay, solid advice. We all know Kyoshi, a solid avatar.

21:18 That's one's good.

21:19 And then when he was like, I shouldn't have asked Kyoshi, and I was like, whatever, Kyoshi's the best. And then, oh, I don't know. What's the name of the water bender, Surfer Avatar?

21:27 Kurik. The surfer avatar. Bro.

21:30 He can't even like talk like a surfer bro. He was like, Hey man. Peace of good.

21:35 Canonically, so uh Kurik in the Kyoshi novels, we find out he died when he was like 33, but he appears way older as the spirit. So either uh he just aged really poorly, or the writers were like, Uh oops. He seemed like really old in the spirit.

21:52 Well, I mean, it's stressful to be the avatar.

21:55 It's true. Look at Aang.

21:56 I mean, he just made me think of Finding Nemo, and that's I I guess that sea turtle's really old, but he acts like he's 30, so they were like the same to me. I was like, I could see that sea turtle being an avatar.

22:08 Yeah, but Kurek was apparently like a really selfish avatar. You didn't really give a darn. Just kind of cared about number one.

22:14 And surfing.

22:15 Surfing.

22:15 It's more about Patrick Swayze and Point Break. Everyone cares. Even if they can't express it, show it. But he said actively shape destiny, which I feel like was like better than saying you must be decisive. It was just like you need to take action, like your actions matter. And that's not necessarily like in the moment, Aang of course is like, okay, you're telling me I need to actively kill this guy, but that doesn't mean anything.

22:41 It's just like you can't just stand by and hope everything's gonna work out.

22:45 I do think, yeah, Kurik's advice is way better than Roku's. Roku, I don't think, was a good avatar. I don't think he's a good guide for Aang. Not at all. Not into that relationship.

22:55 No.

22:55 Yeah, Roku, this is all his fault. Everything that we watched.

22:58 Well, Fire Nation. I know I can't trust him. It's like a Slytherin.

23:04 Best friends with the Fire Lord. Okay, like you're complicit, Roku.

23:10 Uh and then Yang Chen. Did I say that right?

23:13 Yeah, ooh. But this is just like in the in the series, like in the lore, it's like everyone like loved Yang Chen, but everyone kind of like forgot about Kurik. So it's it's impressive that you're like, I don't know, sir, forgetting.

23:23 Well, I wrote K-O-R-U-G, but I was like, is that right? Did I write it right? And then Yang Chen's, like, everyone else had like actively shaped your destiny. And then Yang Chen, I was like, oh, this is long, I can't write this all down. Selfless duty calls you to sacrifice your own spiritual needs, but then he said like two more sentences.

23:39 But I was like, okay, also solid advice, but kind of weird to be like, you kind of need to portray your own teachings and life upbringing as the avatar. It didn't really make sense to me.

23:50 Well, I think Katie had a good impr like take on that. It was like because Aang is the last airbender, he feels even more like attached to those teachings, and he can't like forsake them as other avatars could. They're like, oh, I'm kind of like separate than these other people.

24:08 Right. Like you can take it with a grain of salt, be like, yes, I do like represent this element, but as the avatar, I I really represent all of them. Right. Right. In perfect balance. But right, for Aang, yeah, he is the last. It's like like his teachings are different than everyone else's. And yeah, yeah.

24:28 Okay, okay. Keep going.

24:29 This is good. But I just feel like he like they were good teachings, the air nomads, they weren't like teaching them crazy stuff, like being like selfless and not trying to actively hurt people and only hitting out in defense, which is what he's doing. So yeah, but then to just like pull up with uh following the oh gosh, the lion tortoise.

24:51 Lion turtle.

24:52 Lion turtle. Which uh okay, can we talk about the lion turtle?

24:56 Some Deus Ex Machina.

24:58 Okay, uh what okay? So when Ang's on this floating island, I was like, this is like a freaking Pokemon he's on, right? He's on a Pokemon. What?

25:07 What, Blastoise?

25:08 No, did you watch Detective Pikachu?

25:10 I did, yeah, yeah.

25:11 So remember they like go to like the laboratory and there's the job. I don't remember what they're called, like Terados. Yeah, he was on one of those, but was a lion face. I don't know. In the I mean that probably Pokemon appeared post Avatar in the Pokemon World, because I don't think it's one of the original.

25:28 It's true, it's Gen 4.

25:30 Yeah. But I was like, oh, this is crazy. But okay, so then uh I'm going way back. So they're like, Zuko, your whole life is chasing the Avatar. You're an expert on this. You'll help us. And he's like, I know exactly what to do. And he just goes ask someone else. I was like, what? All this is just like actually, I just have one person that I know who can do this better.

25:50 Like, I have never like, was he never able to track the avatar? Anyway.

25:54 He always had buddies. It was Iroh the whole time.

25:58 So just because he was on some turtle in the middle of the ocean, the I don't remember, Anne Eater, what was her special?

26:04 Oh, the uh Jane June. June? June? And the sheershoe.

26:10 Sheershoe. He like smells and he's like, doesn't exist. He does exist. He's just in the ocean. It's like being on a boat, just on an animal. Like, does the lion tortoise like have some kind of like sorry?

26:22 I think because it's like it was like I guess in the water it should be a turtle.

26:24 I don't know why I keep saying that.

26:25 Do you imagine it was a tortoise, though, just like walking around? It'd be like Howl's Moving Castle. That'd be cool. So I think because the lion turtle uh is like one of the ancient creatures of the world, it probably has like some spiritual energy that can kind of negate anything. Is my interpretation just you know smell?

26:44 Kind of yeah, smell. Yeah, the senses, all gone. But I do think that the spirit world was actively conspiring with the side of good to kind of course correct history throughout the finale because the line turtle like literally takes Aang right in the path of Ozai. Just all these things kind of happen.

27:02 Right.

27:02 I mean, when Aang like leaves, and I was like, is he sleepwalking? Is he in a trance? Like, what is going on right now?

27:07 And because of because Aang is like the bridge between the spirit world and the physical world, I do think there was some sort of like act of providence going on in the finale. I don't think Aang would have been able to solve all the all the problems by by himself.

27:21 Right. So when the Lion Turtle talked, which I was like, okay, this is the first animal we've seen talk. It was really the spirit world talking to him, you think?

27:28 I think he's like a spirit, a spiritual creature. Like the lion turtle, like in series lore, is like one of the original creatures. When you you'll see eventually, the lion turtles are the ones who bestowed the power of the elements on the people.

27:41 Oh whoa. So Yeah, so don't be down on the lion turtle.

27:45 Not down on the lion turtle.

27:47 But the lion turtle, like And we saw Momo and Apa Talk. Remember?

27:52 Okay, but like was in a post-sleep shroom state.

27:59 So what did you think about um just that that episode, The Old Masters? That's the uh episode before things like really get crazy. We have uh Aang Talk and all of his old lives, but then we have uh quote unquote the old people show up who we find out are all part of a secret society. Like, were you surprised that like here comes Boomy and P and Dow and Paku?

28:22 Uh I mean I was surprised for a second, but I was like, of course, of course, this is what's happening. This is great. Finally, we get these guys back. Of course, Boomy, who's like ripped. And I was like, all these old men are like super muscular. I was like, how do they still have muscles? Like they should have been like starving, like he was like in that cage, like who's feeding him up?

28:42 Well fed, they respect a king. Plus, you know, he was earthbending like all sorts of crazy stuff. He was probably earthbending snacks to himself. Also, can Boomy metal bend? I don't know. He like shoots like those rocks into the cage and then like frees himself. Whatever. Boomy.

28:59 But when Ira was like, I'm gonna go back to Pongsix, I'm gonna take it because I saw that vision and now I understand what it is, and then I'm gonna go back to my tea shop and have my tea shop life. I was like, is he gonna die? Like that was my initial reaction because it was way too positive. Oh yeah.

29:15 Like, there's no way everything's gonna go fine. And I was like, this is setting it up. Oh my god, he's not gonna die. But he did die, or he didn't die, which I was excited about, but I really like was like, wait a second, because it's like I hadn't even considered it that he could die. And then I was like, oh no.

29:30 Well, I guess Mako's gone, so then we didn't even see like anyone really get hurt the whole Bong Suzai.

29:36 They just kind of was like No, those those old men, like they they take Basing Sei to the ground. They they are pr fierce protectors.

29:43 Well, yeah, it's like years of pent up energy.

29:46 But were you kind of like, but took you so long?

29:49 You know, they needed that extra motivation. So, wait, what did you think about Uncle Iro and Zuko's reunion?

29:57 It was good. I so Greg didn't know that Iroh had died, and then later when I told him, which I forget that he doesn't listen to the podcast and isn't here to listen to our conversation, so he doesn't know everything that I know. Um, but he was like, Oh yeah, the voice did sound different. And I was just like, Yeah, it would have been better if it was the original voice.

30:16 Because you could tell, like, even the line readings, I didn't feel like it was Uncle Iroh talking. Like I felt like too sh there wasn't enough like jokes interspersed with the the like it was very like heartfelt, like I'm proud of you, like I'm not mad at you, and it was good, but I feel like there wasn't enough like and I'm also making tea on the side while we're having this conversation.

30:41 Or I don't know, like it was just it was good, but there was like a little like secret sauce of Uncle Iroh that I felt like was missing from that moment. Made me sad. Was Greg crying? No.

30:52 Were you crying?

30:53 No. I actually didn't get choked up at all.

30:57 Dang.

30:57 I know.

30:58 I mean, Katie and I like we shed many tears, and this is not the first time we've watched the finale. Like, I understand.

31:05 Not even the first time in like the time of a month.

31:08 Like we were like, I sure was the second time we watched the finale.

31:11 Right. I almost like with Troy, and I'm like, I just like can't it's too much. Because you know what? And the other thing is if you go in it watching and like thinking about how that's not the same, Iroh. So I just feel like you have to put that on the shelf and be like, no, it's Iroh. It's a little at least it's uh Mako's friend, you know, who voiced the colour.

31:31 Yeah, I almost feel like if they would have had him talk more during the season, we would have gotten used to the voice. And so it would have been more Uncle Iroh, but since it's been used so sparingly, and then all of a sudden he's talking a lot, and then it's just a lot in a slightly different voice.

31:45 That was what was drawing.

31:46 But could you be like, well, he was roughed up. I mean, he was in jail, prison for Treated very poorly. Mm-hmm. You know, so maybe he was a little rough around the edge edges anyway.

31:59 I don't know. I think that doesn't go with Iroh's character really, because I feel like he can take hardship pretty well and bounce back.

32:05 Well, not like that. I mean, I think he really believed in Zuko and was very disappointed and hit a pretty low point.

32:14 But then got ripped.

32:15 Then he got motivated.

32:18 But I mean, when you reflect on the season as a whole, like thinking about book three of Avatar, like I don't think about it and miss Iroh, but I also would love to have had him more. But I'm curious, like, what they could have done that would have been satisfying for us. Like, what do you think we should have seen to get more Iroh?

32:37 Well, it's just like how many episodes was it from when we saw him escaping the jail to when we finally see him again on screen?

32:46 Like almost 10.

32:47 Yeah, so I feel like in that whole thing, it would have just been nice to get a couple glimpses of him. Like, even if we didn't know what he was doing, but like just like you see the like uh little sign of the white lotus, just like and then like the nod, or like you know, just like a little glimpse of him, like and be like, oh, something's he's scheming up something.

33:07 I mean him him getting the band together would have been really satisfying to watch. Like shows up at like P and Dow's place and he's like sword fighting people, but maybe you don't know it's Iroh.

33:16 Yeah, I mean along the way he teaches people how to make tea properly, and he's still like, you know, still rocking that tea life.

33:23 There's room for improvement, you guys. So for the reboot, gotta get it right.

33:29 I mean, did you catch that Aang had the opportunity to kill Ozai during the final battle, but then took the path of showing him mercy by like shooting the lightning off like into the into the distance? Like, what was that moment like for you?

33:42 I mean, yeah, because of like I guess I was saying a while ago, you they did build it up to the point where I thought maybe he would go through with it and kill Ozai. And then as soon as he didn't, I was like, yeah, yeah, this would be like a betrayal. He's also like a tiny little boy. He shouldn't be killing people.

34:00 I know. People are always like, oh, like Aang's a pacifist, like he doesn't like hurt anybody, but there is a moment in the very middle episode of the series, book two, the desert, where angry Aang, like, freaks out and kills a buzzard wasp. Like, you know that thing died because he shoots off like a blast of air and it falls down.

34:19 I think if Ozai would have killed Apa, he would have killed Ozai.

34:23 Oh my god.

34:24unknown Can you?

34:24 I just feel like that would be something that would provoke him.

34:27 Oh yeah, he goes into Avatar state and just like, well, sorry.

34:29 Yeah.

34:30 But do you think Ozai like realized how Aang learned how to redirect lightning? Do you think that was part of like was he like, oh no?

34:39 Like, I don't I don't know. I don't think Ozai gives people enough credit to like I don't know. I don't think so.

34:45 Because like the ability to redirect lightning, I mean, as far as we know, the only person that knows how to do that is Iroh, who taught Zuko, who used it on Ozai.

34:54 Right.

34:54 And so I do love that both Aang and O and Zuko both had opportunities to like kill Ozai by redirecting his own power against him, and then both chose not to.

35:03 Right, which probably Ozai feels like they are both weak for not doing it.

35:07 Right. Yeah, because then Ozai really like, like, really tries to like kill Aang, and like that episode ends with him berating him and his people for being weak and how they don't deserve to like live on his world.

35:18 And I will say when Aang finally does his like tighly adjacent but permanent work on Ozai. I was like, oh, is he just like killing him? Not killing him, but like sending his spirit to the spirit realm in like a more pacifier way. Like I wasn't sure he was still gonna be within this world. Thought maybe he would like somehow like bring him into alignment and then send him to the spirit world, like a better person.

35:48 Like, I didn't think and then I was like, well, he can't be doing this, and then all of a sudden he's like a different person, and he's like, Oh, thank you. Like now I like understand the woes in my way. But it was almost a little disappointing that it was just like, well, you'll never build a firebend again.

36:02 Because it was like, Well, we've seen Ty Lee do that to people. But not permanently, right? Not permanently.

36:09 Well, and it's like taking away his power, like his real threat.

36:14 Well, that all like he had no threat without his spending. Is it an interesting idea that like his people weren't gonna keep following because he ruled based on fear, so no one's gonna be like, well, I gotta well, Greg made the point, like, okay, but like, what about all those like war crazy fire lord generals?

36:30 They're not just gonna like like why would they start following Zuko now? They hate Zuko.

36:35 You gotta follow the monarchy, man. Like, oh, I guess it's you. It is interesting to like remove this thing that kind of looms over the series, Ozai's firebending, this thing that kind of sent Zuko on his journey, this thing that damaged Zuko, and then Aang removes it. And I think it's another thing where you just see like Aang and Zuko's storylines kind of parallel and how important they are to each other.

36:58 But yeah, I agree with Greg, like just because you remove someone's like superpower doesn't mean like the lead your legions of followers are just going to all of a sudden bend the knee to Zuko because he won an Agni Kai against Azula.

37:12 Well, you could say that about what's happening politically currently.

37:16 True that.

37:16 Right, like if there was another season, it would probably be like one of the Fire Lord generals trying to like take control of the Fire Nation from Zuko. Would probably be like, you know, at least part of the storyline.

37:31 I do think one of the comics, because the story is continued in a series of graphic novels, I do think one of the more recent storylines has been these people who have who are loyal to Ozai. But I think the general like sense of the Fire Nation would be like, oh, we're just gonna, you know, life will continue as normal, because like as we spent the first half of the book three of the kids like going to just random villages.

37:55 I mean, some of these people didn't even like really consider the war. It was like, oh no, it's just us sharing our like prosperity and right, right.

38:03 It's more just like the military and yeah, like, yeah, and then I don't know like necessarily the aristocracy class, like obviously May's uncle was fine with Zuko. Well, because he has an inn with Zuko, right? Like, if he hadn't had an inn with Zuko, do you think he would have felt differently?

38:20 Mm-hmm.

38:21 And if Zuko was like, I'm gonna abolish and be like the aristocracy and everyone's gonna be the same, they probably would be against him, you know, if he did some crazy moves like that.

38:31 Right. So were you satisfied ultimately with the ending of the show?

38:37 I was other than like, and then I was like, well, obviously they can't get out of all this. So it was glossed over a little bit, then it was like, and now the fire nation is fine.

38:44 And now we're good again.

38:45 Yeah, we're we're great now. And I was like, okay, a little bit, but it's also like, okay, well, what are they gonna have another season that's just like cleaning up everything? Because that's not also that satisfying to watch when you already got rid of the big bad. So yeah, and I thought it was sweet that we like end back in the Earth Nation and they're like getting tea, having a good time.

39:06 Uh oh, so it was like a tease. Zuko's like, tell me about my mom. No resolution. I was like, okay, why even bring it up again if you're not gonna do anything about it?

39:16 For drama. They apparently had storyboarded like a whole thing, like following down that that line of Zuko, but I don't know, they just kept that part.

39:25 Um, I was just that we didn't see Azula like in a jail cell next to her dad or wherever she is. Like, okay, so no closure other than like seeing like her like in like whatever.

39:37 But we agree that that final scene we see of Azula is like just basically disturbing. Like she's chained up, she's howling like an animal. Like, it's just so sad.

39:47 It is sad. That's why I wanted to see her like it should.

39:49 We should have had one more scene. Yeah. You know, or even like you go.

39:53 Maybe she's like doing like forced community service and she's still like sassy and like annoyed about it, but like, you know, and like Ty Lee's like in charge of making sure she does it correctly and she keeps like taking away her firebending. Something cute. Although I did love Ty Lee becoming part of the Kyoshi Warriors.

40:10 I think I wrote like the happy ending for Ty Lee I didn't know I wanted.

40:15 Uh I do appreciate like just Suki's character and how how much she was able to contribute in the like the final stretch of the series.

40:23 I at one point wrote down, should Suko do Suki do better than Sokka? I mean, I think they're very cute together. And I love them. But sometimes Sokka, like, it's like, oh yeah, like this whole plan would have been terrible without Suki. And again, like we said before, I think in a past episode, like if Suki was with him the whole time, things would have gone a lot smoother.

40:45 Um and it's sweet that she loves him, but like sometimes we're just like, Saka, you gotta up your game for this girl.

40:52 Hopefully he does. That would be good. And then I just don't, I didn't I think Toph, speaking of doing dirty, I don't I think Toph didn't quite get the satisfaction at the end of the end of the series I would have liked.

41:04 Yeah, she's like, oh Zuko, we're gonna have our heartwarming, like fun adventure together. And I got so excited, I don't know where it is in my note. Okay, yay, Toph and Zuko. And then like minutes later, oh poor Toph. Like, I was like, so quickly he like shuts her down. I was like, Zuko, like it's okay.

41:21 You can have a good time with Toph. What's your problem?

41:24 I know. It was the age difference.

41:26 But I mean, it wasn't to her advantage to be up in an airship, although that like metal bending scene where she like becomes like an Iron Man and then like crawling on the ceiling. Yeah, it was insane. It was great. But yeah, for Toph. Always, you know, second fiddle to everyone else because she came in the second season.

41:46 I mean, do you think there's a future with Toph and Sokka romantically? That's kind of a weird question. But there's like there's the sparks there. I think there's there's potential when they're not, you know, 12 and 15.

41:58 With Toph and Sokka, I don't see it.

42:00 I've always felt it. And I want it.

42:03 Well, right, because Toph's definitely into Sokka. Yeah.

42:07 But we've addressed in the series everyone's into Sokka. I mean, I'm into Sokka.

42:13 He does have a lot of game. It'd be funny if Azula had a crush on Sokka. That'd be such a funny combo.

42:21 What was it about that final scene of Katara and Aang smooching?

42:26 I was just like watching it and I was like, I don't want to be watching these children kiss right now.

42:31 Yeah, no, it's not as satisfying and I was like Indian.

42:35 I don't understand why Kitara's into this. Like, I understand this is what Aang wants, but like we've seen her like a boy. Like, she liked Jet and she's liked another boy, didn't she?

42:47 I mean, she seemed like she was interested in Haru.

42:51unknown Yeah.

42:51 You know she's into Zuko, you know what I'm saying?

42:53 Mm-hmm. At certain points, but then I feel like when he came back and joined their team, she was like never back into him.

42:59 No.

43:00 And it was the mustache. Whatever. Which is funny because Aang's like so paranoid about it, and at that point you're like, dude, look at the science. She's not into this guy. But like, I like I never really like I feel like she's like open to it, but like, and she cares a little bit Aang, but I don't know.

43:15 The kiss, it just didn't feel right to me.

43:18 I mean, especially like doing the podcast and kind of analyzing like every episode and thinking about like Katara's like where she's at and where Aang's at, and even though like they're in a war and Aang has these responsibilities, you still don't really get, especially in season three, you don't get like that relationship.

43:35 They they play with it in in book two in a few episodes, and that that felt better, but I think Katara had more growth, like she just outgrew Aang in book three, where Aang kind of stayed the same.

43:46 Right, which is interesting because you think he of all the people should be growing in book three.

43:51 Mm-hmm. Well I mean Aang did have growth, but ultimately, like he was just kind of like the same character.

43:57 Well, right, and there was so much pressure about like Are you ready for this? And you know, are you gonna be able to do what you were born to do?

44:05 But even up until like the last couple days, I mean, he's like building sandcastles, they're like surfing. They were all screaming, and like Zuko's the only one who's like, guys.

44:13 I do think they just the writers and just the the episode in general kind of wasted valuable time in like that first episode of the finale where we're just kind of like goofing around for like three quarters of it.

44:24 I was like, they never tell Zuko their plan, like you're all on the same team, right?

44:28 No, it didn't make sense.

44:29 Also, how do they know when the comet's coming?

44:32 I mean, we don't we we're never told when the comet is coming, we're just told that it's coming like by summer's end. Like, is it late September? And they're like, Well, I guess it's uh any day now.

44:43 Because they knew when the eclipse was coming because of the library, but they didn't have the exact dates of the comet.

44:49 Which, I mean, okay, but I would like to have seen that. Be like, okay, well, we know, well, I don't know. I don't know. How do they know when it's coming? Unless Roku, like, secretly was like, hey man. Roku always tells them. No, Roku's he does not. Ugh.

45:03 Well, I would assume the Fire Nation tracks that because if it comes every I mean, like, we know in like Haley's Comet it's coming by or whatever. Well, maybe Zuko. Maybe it's just common knowledge that they know, you know.

45:14 That's true.

45:15 I mean, they did spend you would think the Fire Nation would have like festivals that day.

45:20 Right. I mean, all right, firebending competition.

45:23 And maybe the rest of the Fire Nation was. Maybe the rest of the Fire Nation was having a really good time while the military enacted genocide.

45:35 Just flash over to the Fire Nation and they're like partying day.

45:39 What was that about Ozai?

45:40 I said Ozai is fit, capital F I T. Because yeah, he like takes off his like robe and then he's like Arnold Schwarzenegger underneath that thing. Like, I was like, we saw Iroh working out. We never see Ozai working out. I don't know. It just seemed like insane muscles that they were giving him.

45:56 I mean, there's some good genes in that royal family. I mean, when Zuko's shirtless, I mean homeboy's looking pretty good too. You know what I'm saying?

46:03 It's true.

46:03 But man, when Aang is what about Sokka when he's shirtless?

46:09 No. I was going back to like Katara being into like, yeah, Zuko or Aang. It's like, well, obviously Aang. Aang's got the bod.

46:18 And uh I mean, there was no reason for Katara not to get with Zuko. You know what I'm saying? I mean, he wasn't really with Mei. She got she's in jail. Like, we don't have to we don't have to think about her.

46:29unknown Okay.

46:30 They're not a thing.

46:31 But, you know, if we just overlook Aang being a child, and they do share some nice moments, and they've been through a lot together, and obviously they care about one another. And so I could buy into it, but yeah, it wasn't I don't think that they did enough to really make me believe that that was an appropriate ending, and like that that was some sort of like happy ending for the two of them.

46:57 I don't know.

46:58 I feel like we have Sokka and Suki as like a cute couple that we're like following and they're flirty and they're doing things like I don't need that resolution for Kitar and Aang. Like, it would have been better if we got the same show. Show up a couple years and then get together. I'm fine with that, but like at the current point of time, it's just too much.

47:18 Because we have that epilogue, like we don't that epilogue doesn't need to take place like with the crew that we know. Like the epilogue could have been like a Deathly Hollows-esque epilogue where we like we fast forward a little bit, we're dropping off their little benders at Bender School. You know, we've named our children after our dead friends.

47:38 The cabbage tailsman's there. Cabbage Talesman should have been there. I just realized. Total failing. That's how it could have been in season three. They were in Bon C say.

47:47 He just looks up and the fire comes, destroys his cabbages.

47:51 I'm saying at the happy ending, like he's like at the table over, like gives them like a look and like drinks his tea.

47:57 No, he takes a healthy bite of a cabbage. Yeah.

48:00 Like chairman caga just or like walking in and like accidentally like hits something and it like causes his like cabbage cart to clock. Because he he should have said my cabbages.

48:09 But obviously, I mean the crew at Nickelodeon probably know now, obviously, that people are really into Cabbage Guy, but maybe in that moment they didn't he doesn't show up at all in season three.

48:20 Right.

48:21 Well they name Check him in the Ember Island players.

48:24 Yeah, a very knowledgeable cabbage merchant.

48:26 Yeah, it was very exciting. So they knew. They must have known. Or also they were really into Cabbage Guy.

48:32 It's true.

48:33 Because he's the best.

48:34 The execs were like, actually, can you guys tone this down?

48:38 Yeah.

48:38 I have a cabbage allergy. It's very severe. Jessica, I'd like to know who had the most satisfying storyline in Avatar The Last Airbender.

48:47 The most satisfying storyline.

48:50 Cabbage guy.

48:51 Cabbage guy finally became a playwright. I mean, I knew that he needed that all along.

48:57 A man of the arts. He's a Renaissance man.

48:59 I almost want to say Uncle Iroh because he gets to live his dream of being a tea merchant and putting the Fire Nation back on track and like having this second son like come back to him on his own and like follow the right way. And I mean, would any of this been possible without Uncle Iroh? It was very important.

49:26 I feel like that was very satisfying. You saw the whole arc. I feel like Katara, like, you know, as the Ember Island players say, she's always talking about how having hope and being good, and like that was consistent. And she did grow. And we did see her like confront her mom dying and the guy, but like, I don't know, like, I just felt like Katara was such a staying presence the whole time that like her evolution wasn't as satisfying.

49:53 Zuko is just like so emo, and I'm just never gonna be like the emo character's number one fan. It's just like not who I am. I can't like put up with it for so long. I did, I was happy for Zuko. I thought it was weird that like they said he was pure of heart now after not being pure of heart. I didn't agree with that.

50:10 I think he'll be a fine. Although, do we think Zuko's gonna be a good Fire Lord? I don't know, I'm not so sure.

50:16 It's really interesting considering Zuko and his journey because the first time I watched it, like I wasn't invested in Zuko until like the book two finale, where you get like this opportunity for redemption for Zuko, and I had never considered that for him. I mean, I wasn't really considering it because it was a new type of show for me at that point.

50:38 Like, you really, as a you know, 15-year-old, I wasn't experiencing shows where like characters have opportunity for redemption, like he was the bad guy. And so for me to like have that betrayal from Zuko and then know that that opportunity was still there, all of a sudden I was like hungry for what Zuko could be.

50:56 And I'm curious for you, because you you did not know Zuko was on a path to redemption when you first watched it at the beginning, right?

51:04 I didn't know, I suspected.

51:07 And so for me, like re-watching, like all of a sudden Zuko's story becomes so much more satisfying to me, like every time I watch it, and you just pick up you pick up more about like Zuko's motivations and where he's coming from, and the fact that his heart's really not that into capturing the Avatar, it's just out of desperation, it's like he doesn't really have much more going on.

51:27 And so, yeah, I do think Zuko is pure of heart, and I do think he just had a really rough few years.

51:33 I do think he had the most growth of all the characters, because he had the farthest to go from. Like, yes, he's being manipulated into thinking he needs to support the Fire Nation and do what they're doing, even though all along we find out that he's never really had his heart into the mission of the Fire Nation.

51:51 He wants to protect the soldiers and you know, like ha thinks there's a value of human life, like is a reasonable person. Yeah. And he has this like bumbling uncle along with him, and he's just like, you know, like at the beginning, he has like no real respect for his uncle, it seems like. And then by the end, he's like figured it out, figured out how to be on the right side, figured out that his uncle Iroh is like the most important person in his life and really took care of him when he needed it.

52:21 So I agree, it's a really great arc. I'm just it's never gonna be my favorite.

52:26 Totally. Well, it's like the Zuko thing. Like, I wonder if a lot of that growth was just Iroh's like persistence and just like, I know you're not listening, but somewhere deep down subconsciously, I feel like I'm making a change. And almost like through Osmosis, like Iroh's like infiltrating Zuko. And it's interesting to think that Iroh was maybe actively just grooming Zuko to be Fire Lord because it's almost like correcting like Ozai's rule because Iroh was supposed to be Fire Lord, and then his son was supposed to take over for him, Lutan, who was killed.

52:58 And so it is interesting for Iroh to kind of get his own kind of legacy back in that way. It's like, I will instill in you these ideas that I think are important, and now Zuko can rule like that theoretically.

53:10 Right. And I'm not to get like super off track, but it is interesting to think about like if he had stayed in the line of succession and the his father would have died and he would have taken over. Because up until that point, he's the general of the army, he's doing what the Fire Nation is supposed to be doing, he's like, you know, conquering, he's trying to conquer Bong Si-Sei.

53:32 So when his father died, would he have kept doing all that stuff? Or would he have been like, actually, let me back off of this a little bit. I don't really want to do this anymore.

53:41 But I do think in some monarchies it is common for the prince to like be involved in some way in that way, so that when they do eventually take over and that succession happens, like, oh, this person has like some experience like being in the military, which is so important in monarchies. So I think Iroh, yeah, he would have just like stopped and be like, oh, I'm gonna go sit on the throne now.

54:02 This was fun.

54:03 And be like, actually, we don't kill dragons anymore. Thanks, guys.

54:06 We didn't do that.

54:07 Okay. So what was the most surprising takeaway from this experience?

54:14 The most surprising takeaway from this experience of the podcast of watching the show?

54:19 Yes. You mean the show?

54:21 Either or.

54:22 I don't know. I'm trying to think. I don't have a good answer for that right now.

54:25 I wasn't surprised at all.

54:27 I mean, it was not like I wasn't surprised. I just can't think of like, you know, it's not like it's not like there was like a crazy twist that like Azula was good the whole time. Well, that would have been a crazy twist.

54:38 Was the show better than you thought it was gonna be or worse or what you were expecting?

54:44 Um, I mean, I feel like I had not high expectations going in, but like reasonable, like this is a quality. Like, I don't think you and Jordan would be doing a podcast about a show that wasn't very good or interesting, or that it would be Jordan's favorite show. Um, but I think it did have more layers for a Nickelodeon kid show than I would have expected.

55:04 Yeah. That we are talking about all these things and like, you know, that they address, like, okay. One of the most surprising things was the whole series when they were in Patsise, and there's like that whole subplot with the Dali, and they're like turning people into zombies and hypnotizing them, and it's like a really creaky, like nanny state.

55:23 Like, I wasn't expecting that at all. Like when they get there, yeah, we were just like, oh, this is like unrelated to the final mission of the like comet and the fire lord, and there's just all this other crazy political stuff going on, and we're gonna address it in this like kid show. That was surprising.

55:38 I don't think I appreciate it as much, uh, especially because partly like I just I have this nostalgia for it, and just that the whole story is just kind of ingrained in me at this point. Like for you, fresh, you're like, oh, we have point A, point B, we gotta get here. And yeah, partway through the series, you get this kind of curveball with this political intrigue going on, and yeah, it would be very surprising.

56:01 But for me, it's like just a part of the story, and so I until we did the podcast, I wasn't able to like really break it down. Yeah, it's totally like a random, random adventure they have to go on.

56:11 Well, and does it feel like it was a product of its time? Like that it came out. Does it feel like it came out 10 years ago? Is that what it is?

56:21 No, it came out 15 years ago.

56:22 Does it feel like it came out 15 years ago?

56:25 Half your life ago?

56:27 No, it's not like there's like a bunch of dated references or anything in it, and I don't feel like I don't remember any like cringe moments necessarily other than Katara kissing this like 12-year-old boy.

56:39 Until the very end of the series.

56:41 You're like, uh But is that because I mean, would you have felt differently 15 years ago? It's hard to say, right? Because now you're like if I was also a child, probably right, right, versus now you're like, well, this is not okay. Well, yes, exactly.

56:56 I also feel like, yes, my perspective is very different than if I was, yeah, the prime demographic.

57:01 Yeah, 18-year-old Jordan rootin' and hootin' and hollering.

57:04 Yay, they did it! They kissed.

57:07 Mm-hmm.

57:09 And I feel like I'm not afraid of like, yeah, don't go into it. But yeah, for some reason, just that because they've kissed before and it hasn't felt as weird as that final kiss. But uh yeah, I definitely feel like it holds up really well from its time period of thinking like what else was on. I mean, it's insane, like pairing this with like fairly odd parents, it's just weird.

57:31 I know, yeah. It's very and it's just so interesting to consider it Nickelodeon dubbed it successful enough that they would allow them to have a spin-off, which ended up being darker in some way.

57:42 It was just like really interesting, like what what happens next, just with what which it would be interesting to know I mean if you connect more with Korra.

57:53 Yeah.

57:54 Um one being a strong independent female, which you don't know that, but she is. Yeah. And um and the fact that they're older, they're not children. So watch it and let us know.

58:07 I just think something, and I to go back to the the characters that had some of the best growth, I do think we've we've mentioned that Aang maybe didn't grow as much, but I think that's because Aang had a moment earlier in the series where he just grew exponentially more than he had at any other point.

58:23 Because when you re-watch it, for me, you go through most of season one with Aang just kind of bumbling around and not really wanting to admit that he's the Avatar and kind of like rise up to this occasion until the very end of book one where he you know wants to save the North Pole and kind of like have this opportunity to save a culture.

58:43 And then from that point on, like Aang is kind of on this like upward growth and kind of plateaus almost. But yeah, that that moment where you consider the beginning Aang where he's like, Do you want to go penguin sledding with me? And the end Aang where he's like considering mercy and like whether or not to kill somebody actively is uh it's pretty far from where he where he begins in the iceberg.

59:02 Well, he definitely shows growth and yeah, end of season one, and like a a reason there was a reason for him to step up to the best of his ability in that moment. And then yeah, I think that he had had peaked for uh just his the growth that he was able to realistically do as a 12-year-old boy.

59:22 Exactly. 13, 13 at the end of the series. He is 13, okay. He's a teenager, so it's cool that he was kissing Katara.

59:29 Well, you know he's gonna turn into a mermaid the 13th year.

59:32 I would like to talk more about that. The 13th year came out when I was not 13 and I was mortified to turn 13. I was like, that's gonna be me.

59:41 Mermaid. Yep.

59:42 Merman. Get get in the pool. Get in the pool? Okay, moving on. So uh now reflecting on the beginning of the series, I remember like we were we would talk to you about some of the theories you would have. Like, do you remember some of the theories that you had? No, I don't remember any of them. You had some moment of like, oh, like, we haven't seen like a waterbending master.

1:00:03 Uh, and when we do meet them, I'm curious if they'll have tattoos too. Like, ang.

1:00:07 Oh yeah.

1:00:08 Are we kind of disappointed that other cultures in the Avatar universe don't have like some markings or like some something to befit a master of their element?

1:00:17 Greg made a joke that like now that Tsuka's in charge of the Fire Nation, maybe he can bring like different colors to the fashion of the different nations. Like, hey Earth Nation, try some uh, you know, blue, fire nation, try green. Like, you don't have to just wear red all the time. It's okay.

1:00:34 That's like it's it's the Power Ranger rule. Like, you can only wear the color of your Power Ranger.

1:00:40 And like we've seen obviously like Katara, Suki, they all look great in like another nation's clothes.

1:00:45 Like great in red.

1:00:46 Mix it up.

1:00:47 Oh man, and really rocking that globalization.

1:00:50 I also like noticed for some reason on that final episode that Aang's like arrows like go into his armpits. And I was like, whoa, I didn't notice that before.

1:00:58 Yeah, they kind of like spiral around his arm. I don't know where they end. Like it just ends in the pit because then he has it on the back. I don't know.

1:01:07 Yeah.

1:01:07 It's not connected.

1:01:08 But yeah, I am a little disappointed that the water benders didn't have and the earth like or that the benders had some kind of like or masters in general that they like have something that make like denotes that like, oh, this is a master I'm in front of. Like they've mastered this.

1:01:23 I think it was a little uh oversight.

1:01:25 Like they no longer have their Padawan braid.

1:01:28 So where do you think the series goes from here? Because obviously it continues.

1:01:32 Well, from the small clips of Korra playing on Netflix, when you click by it, it's like in a semi-current future where they have like cars and like street traffic, and yeah, the cora's like 18, maybe older, I don't know. Um, and there's like hooligans that need to be like taken care of. I think that's like the whole clip.

1:01:56 Hooligans.

1:01:58 Yeah, it's like it's like maybe there's like gangs or something. I don't know. Um, I don't be interesting based on like my tangential knowledge. And I think as I said earlier at the beginning, what I was like, all I knew was that Janet Barney's the voice of Kar Korra, and I like Janet Barney. So yeah, I think I'll like it.

1:02:15 Although I wonder if me knowing what Janet Barney looks like will uh impact my ability to separate her from Cora.

1:02:22 Like Janet, I know you don't look like Cora.

1:02:24 Yeah, tall, blonde hair.

1:02:26 What were some of your favorite things about the series, Avatar the Last Airbender?

1:02:31 I did laugh quite a bit watching it, even though it's clearly like humor for children. Like my cabbages isn't like high culture, but I laughed every time. I laughed every time watching the intro and Aang like running into that stone. I don't know why. Every time get got me every time.

1:02:51 Uh you must uh you must be related to Katie because it was the same thing.

1:02:55 I'm not laughing now.

1:02:56 Okay. Um, and I loved like, yeah, getting to know these characters. And yeah, for some reason, I was really into getting to know Azula, May, and Tylee and like their whole clique. I loved that episode where they have the bonfire at the beach and they're just like hanging out with the Fire Nation kids.

1:03:14 That's like the spin-off I would watch, just like high school in the Fire Nation.

1:03:19 Azula and the Bad Girls. You can't sit with us.

1:03:22 Yeah.

1:03:22 Your fire's not blue.

1:03:24 Her like intimidating boys away from her accidentally.

1:03:27 How about you, Katie? What's some of your favorite things about Avatar The Last Airbender? You doing this podcast and learning that you smack your tongue.

1:03:38 Mm-hmm. Yeah, that's been really fun. You can't ask me after like an hour worth of recording, and I can't.

1:03:47 You can look inside yourself.

1:03:49 Okay, my favorite. What did you ask me?

1:03:51 What is your some of your favorite aspects about the series we just finished? Like the third time.

1:03:57 What I do enjoy is that it has been enjoyable every time. I think sometimes when you rewatch shows, it's like, oh god, you know.

1:04:06 It's kind of a law of diminishing returns.

1:04:08 Yeah, and I and yeah, and it has been new every time, and it is a little bit different, and you notice different things, and you can watch it through a different lens, and yeah, and we've we've touched on all sorts of stuff. Uh there's been lots of high points, and it's been really fun to do it with Jessica and Troy and with people that have never seen it before.

1:04:31 And someone who's seen it a ton.

1:04:33 Who? Well, for you, like, I didn't I never felt resistance from you to like watch the show in the beginning, but I was also like anytime I introduce someone to Avatar the Last Airbender, I have a little hesitation because I'm like, oh, like the first like handful of episodes are kind of rough, and you don't you don't get the sense of what the series will be from those.

1:04:54 I mean you can see that there's like potential in it, but you don't I can't be like, oh my god, so there's like uh arguably the greatest redemption arc in television history, but I feel like I can't talk about that to you. Here, watch this kid's show.

1:05:07 Yeah, that's on Nickelodeon, which was a big turnoff.

1:05:11 Well, and knowing that you have such like that it's so important to you, and it's like, oh, what if I don't like this show? And then what is Jordan gonna think of me? I mean, I my favorite show for a long time was Flight of the Concords. And when I started dating Greg, I was like, if you don't like this, I don't know if we can be together, which is a lot of pressure and retrospect.

1:05:33 And he watched it and he thought it was fine, and I very seriously considered our relationship at that point, being like, Like, if we don't have the same sense of humor, like, is this bad? But then lately Greg's come to it on its own, like watching the DVDs, and he loves it. He can like rewatch them all the time.

1:05:49 You come home and there's Greg like in pajamas, like laughing along with Brett and Jermaine.

1:05:53 Yeah. And so I think part of it too is like, you know, the organicity of like coming to it on your own and being like, maybe I'll try this again. And then, like, you know, it's like too much pressure to have that person be like watching you and being like, Are you laughing? Isn't that so funny? Right, right.

1:06:06 But see, Katie had watched a little bit of the end of Korra, and so she knew where and I had watched the first episode with an ex-boyfriend.

1:06:15 Oh my god. Dun dun dun. I've told you guys this. I know. Just guy told you, right? I don't know. Yeah, I'm pretty sure it was when I got back from the tour, and uh yeah, and Bill was like watching Avatar and like put it on. It was like, oh no, it's a really good show and wanted me to start watching it.

1:06:35 Why didn't we have Bill on the show? Oh my god. Katie guy, can he call in right now?

1:06:40 Well, let's find out. Oh no. No, he can't. But with Katie, like I I never had us watch it when we were just dating.

1:06:49 And I don't know if he waited until we were locked in after Jessica denied him.

1:06:55 Okay, this makes it sound like I was actively pursuing Jessica. Which maybe. But yeah, so I had waited until I waited until we got back from our honeymoon to be like, so how about we start this? And I did kind of feel like that thing where I was like kind of like just watching Katie to be like, is she happy?

1:07:17 Is she watching this? She's happy, is she but I just feel like you just kind of like gave me the space to watch it with you until I think probably season two, and I think Toph really changed the game.

1:07:28 I also feel like I don't talk enough about Toph. I mean the fact that a person with a disability is one of the most badass characters in the show, and I feel like that was rare at the time. It's still rare to have people with disabilities, so I think that's really important and really cool.

1:07:42 Yeah, absolutely. And for I mean, just Toph like checks all the boxes for a fantastically inclusive character. We forget the fact that she's non-white, so she is technically a person of color, you know. We can assume she's maybe like Chinese, but we kind of gloss over that fact too. But yeah.

1:07:58 Are any of them white though?

1:08:00 Right. Yeah, see, none of them are white. It's a total like non-white. But when you if you just go into it blind, not really considering the fact that all the voice actors are, right?

1:08:08 Well, Dante Boston.

1:08:10 And Mako is of Japanese descent. But yes, I mean I mean Jason Isaacs is in it, who's arguably one of the whitest people in the world. Who's that? Zhao. It's Lucius Malfoy. Pale, pasty Lucius Malfoy.

1:08:26unknown Okay.

1:08:26 But yeah, so I am interested, like, one day when you rewatch the series, like I would I would love to hear like your take, Jessica, on just like the seeds of seeing like Zuko and his like redemption arc, and just watching it from the beginning again and being like, oh, like I know where everyone's gonna end up.

1:08:44 And so I think for me and I think for Katie can agree to this, like the show just becomes like so much more satisfying when you watch it a second time. Um, obviously, the Great Divide is literally the worst thing, so just skip that one.

1:08:57 Not Detroit, he loved it. I loved it too.

1:08:59 Ember players skipped it too.

1:09:01unknown Ugh.

1:09:02 They like call out skipping that one. Wait, who knows? Who does it? So I I rewatched that one before watching the final episodes.

1:09:09 Oh, Ember Island players.

1:09:10 Yeah. And like when they're like recapping and they're like play or whatever, and they're like, oh, the great divide, and they're like, oh, let's just go around and then they just like move on. Like they don't address it at all.

1:09:21 So good. So did you learn anything? Like, that was kind of like a loaded question. Did you learn anything like from watching it? Like anything that was a new thing to you?

1:09:32 Uh I mean, I'm sure I learned lots. I didn't nothing comes to mind off the top of my head immediately.

1:09:37 Did you learn anything about yourself?

1:09:39 Yeah, I learned that um I like, I mean, I did learn. I mean, so obviously, like, I don't know why I'm such an Azula fangirl. Like, I find it very interesting that I like this like psychotic character so much.

1:09:52 You like someone who's like showcasing that girls are strong and smart and she's like not afraid to speak her mind.

1:09:58 And yeah, I do feel like that is very of my personality right now. That that's what I'm like trying to become, where I'm just like sick of men, these white old men running our country. And so, like, yeah, Azula's acting like these like privileged white men and she doesn't give a fuck. And I'm like, yeah, girl, you do you.

1:10:20 Like, yes, everything you're doing is ultimately bad and wrong, but at least she like she's taking what she can take and she's going for it.

1:10:27 She's breaking that glass ceiling, yeah.

1:10:29 And it's all in a bad way, but also like again, like as a villain, I feel like you don't see girl villains like that. And so I think that's also why I felt so portrayed that like they had to weaken her, which I guess is like a benefit to her that she was so strong that they had to weaken her because they didn't weaken Ozai for Aang to take care of, like, you know, so it's just like I don't know.

1:10:51 God might crawl. But yeah, I think it's awesome. And I learned that, yeah, that's what I'm about. And it is like, but like Kataro's a strong female, Toph, obviously, the strongest, and like, you know.

1:11:04 I think that's just one of the series' greatest strengths is that they made the girls as strong, if not more strong, in several areas.

1:11:10 Like we said, Suki stronger than Sokka in every way. Like when they like formed their like Captain Planet, where he's like, We have earth, we have water, and I was like, Oh, Sokka's the heart, which we all know in the Captain Planet that the little kid who was heart was the weakest of the Captain Planet team.

1:11:27 Sword and fan. But yeah, I mean, even Aang, like objectively, like he's not that toxic masculine character. He's a pacifist, he has lots of feminine energy.

1:11:37 Right. Like the I mean, even Zuko's not even toxic masculinity, like I don't just early Zuko, he's not like anti-girls, right?

1:11:46 No, no.

1:11:47 He's just like wants the avatar.

1:11:49 I mean, Sokka is anti-girl for like single-minded. Sokka has misogyny at the beginning of the series, but he that gets corrected very quickly in the Warriors of Kiyoshi episode.

1:11:59 He puts him in his place.

1:12:00 Exactly. But you could also talk about just that Sokka grew up in a very small tribe where it's probably very traditional. Right.

1:12:09 And the men were the ones that went off to war.

1:12:11 Right. Conservative family values, and so he had to like get out of get out of the tribe, go be extremely girl.

1:12:19 They were gonna teach Katara. They were like, you get to go heal people. Which, okay, the whole Qatar being able to heal. I like I like that they address that like Katara can't magically heal them anymore. Like, that's off the table. Uh things like, gosh, just heal, it's only fine.

1:12:35 No, we uh use that all up, buddy. You uh can't do that no more. But yeah, I mean, yeah, uh we're we're breaking, like we just say breaking glass ceilings. Like Qatar gets to be the only like combative waterbender in the world. We have Toph who literally invents a new like subgenre of bending.

1:12:51 Yeah, it's just uh And to again talk about this coming out 15 years ago.

1:12:56 I mean, this is It was definitely like significantly ahead of its time. I think the series would have been way more successful had it come out now. And I'm curious because we have kids watching it now on Netflix who have no idea that it's 15 years, it's older than them, significantly older than them.

1:13:12 Like our friend's kid like thinks it it came out and stole things from Frozen 2.

1:13:16 Mm-hmm.

1:13:17 Um so I just think that everyone's gonna be watching it, and like the themes resonate so much more today. And I'm curious what Nickelodeon will do now with this property. And I think it has a bright future. Um right now we have the Kyoshi novels, which you should read, Jessica. I'm on the second one.

1:13:36 It's real good and LGBTQ friendly, which is fantastic.

1:13:40 And apparently kind of dark, so that rules me out.

1:13:42 It's too dark. It's fancy for me. It's very graphic at times. I'm like, oh, we're wow. This is not something I watched in the series either, Cora or Avatar. So we're taking some liberties with uh what we're able to do in uh the uh literature medium.

1:13:58 I just sorry, I don't want this to go on forever, but I am shocked that Katara didn't blip end in the final episode.

1:14:05 There's no full moon. She wasted her full moon opportunity.

1:14:07 It only happens- Oh, okay, I forgot about that wrinkle.

1:14:10 I don't know, but see, you'll pay.

1:14:13 But do you think she would have?

1:14:14 Oh yeah.

1:14:15 Because they're not like, oh man, too bad it's not a full moon.

1:14:17 Yeah, Zuko leans over, winks to Katara. Hey, hey, no full moon, right? Right? You know what I'm saying? Um well, friends, what a journey this has been.

1:14:28 Yeah, what a pandemic this has been. I know. It's crazy.

1:14:32 Start out, they were just we were just kids, and now we've gone and we've seen the world and saved the world.

1:14:38 I'm glad I have Korra to look forward to. I know. It would be sad if there was like nothing. And apparently Kiyoshi warrior novels.

1:14:46 And all the graphic novels, which are pretty good.

1:14:49 Which I am I mean, I read like a couple pages when I was really motivated after we finished recording The Last Pod.

1:14:56 And then How many times have you actually like read a graphic novel or a comic though?

1:15:00 I mean, I read Archie comics. So many Archie comics.

1:15:04 Have you speaking of comics, have you read Bone, the graphic novel? It's from the early 90s. It's uh real good.

1:15:10 I haven't read that many graphic novels, if I'm honest.

1:15:12 Oh yeah, I have one that I want you to borrow.

1:15:14 Oh, great.

1:15:15 Earth, Wind, Fire, Fire, Air.

1:15:19 Heart.

1:15:21 What element are you?

1:15:22 Oh, what element? What tribe do I subscribe to? I think Water, Water Tribe.

1:15:31 Katie.

1:15:32 Although, am I more of an earth bender?

1:15:36 Personality-wise or I think personality-wise. Well, if we go with the uh the astrology, the zodiac, you are a Taurus, which is an earth element. Yeah. And Katie over here, Water Girl. No air. Are you air? I didn't shave my head. I'm you'd be pretty hot with a shaved head and an arrow. What are you?

1:15:56 Uh, what's her face didn't have a shaved head?

1:15:59 Who? Oh, Yang Chen.

1:16:00 Yang Chen. Shaved hair.

1:16:02 Like the like the top, like the the edge had been kind of like shaved, which uh felt kind of weak. I think we just should have shaved shaved off her entire head.

1:16:09 She could have been like Tilda Switten and uh They didn't want people to get confused.

1:16:13 They needed to make it look a little different.

1:16:15 But either way, you could rock the blue arrow for sure. Thank you.

1:16:18 I'm an air nomad, I mean, obviously. Like, yeah. Pacifist. Enjoy the world. Roaming around.

1:16:24 Enjoy the world.

1:16:25 Yeah. Air nomad. Air for life.

1:16:27 Okay. Well, that's where we're at.

1:16:29 Okay. So Avatar The Last Airbender is a, again, it's just my favorite show. And it was so much fun to watch it. I actually learned some things about the series I didn't already know just from like talking to people with fresh eyes. And uh, even though we're not making a scent from this, it was a really fun thing to do, and I'm happy to spread the love and the knowledge because more media like this needs to exist to empower people with disabilities, empower females, empower just empower people in general, people of color.

1:17:02 And I think the show really does a fantastic job of that. And what do you do in listening to me more? Go start it over again. Start boying the iceberg, write meow.

1:17:12 Or create a different show. Take inspiration. Take inspiration, but take our notes of where it was lacking. Make something better.

1:17:23 Don't have your badass female antagonist go crazy, is the reason you defeat her. That's cheap. Beautiful. Yeah. Yep, yep. Hooray! Jessica, thank you so much for being here and being a part of this and starting this adventure with us. Had you not been willing to do it, I don't think that we would have gotten it off the ground because it's very hard for someone for me in my circle to find someone who A hasn't seen Avatar Last Airbender and B has any taste whatsoever.

1:17:53 So thank you for checking both those boxes. We really appreciated that.

1:17:56 I'm glad I waited until this opportunity to watch it.

1:17:58 Thank you for waiting.

1:18:00 Aww. I had something, but I lost it. Wait. When we started in January, we didn't even have a name, you guys. Remember?

1:18:09 No, nothing about names.

1:18:11 Okay, sorry. So what?

1:18:12 That was good. Just now.

1:18:14 Any last words? Appa and Momo forever.

1:18:18 Aw, the real, the real ship. And thank you to you, our dear listeners. All everyone of you in Antelope, California, because that's apparently the highest uh download.

1:18:33unknown Oh.

1:18:33 Because Antelope. Shout out to Antelope. More than Portland.

1:18:36 More than anywhere in Oregon, we have these people in Antelope. Uh listeners, and also those of you who aren't in Antelope, California, wherever that is. Uh, thank you for listening. If we had zero listens on this podcast, it would have been really uh difficult to be motivated to keep going.

1:18:49 So So to all five of you, thank you.

1:18:54 Uh yeah, so thank you so much. Uh, we really appreciated you um giving us an opportunity and listening to us dissect a show that maybe is one of your favorites as well. So thank you for letting us not uh tarnish any of that. So with that, Katie, Jessica, Troy in Spirit. Troy's been here the whole time.

1:19:11 Silent, like a lamb.

1:19:13 Classic.

1:19:14 Yep, yep.

1:19:15 Should we yep, yep? Yep, yep. Yep.

1:19:18 Yep, yep.

1:19:19 Not really for like the aliens from the Muppets.

1:19:21 Yep, yep, yep, yep, yep, yep, yep, yep, yep, yep, yep, yep, yep.

1:19:25 Is that a Nickelodeon thing? Yeah. Yes. Yep, yep.

1:19:34 No. I know all things about pop culture from the 2000s. Quiz me. Britney Spears, NSync. I know it all.

1:19:40 Okay, name all the boy band members of NSYNC.

1:19:43 Okay, well, you have Justin Timberlake, you have Joy Fatone, you have Lance Bass, you have JT, maybe his last name.

1:19:52 Carl? Is Carl the fifth one? Did you say Justin Timberlake and JT?

1:19:57 Yeah, isn't there a guy named JT? Wrong. JC failed. JC. JC Chavez. It's JC? Mm-hmm. What's the C stand for? Chavez?

1:20:07 Choreographer? He's like a really good dancer.

1:20:09 Jason Choreographer.

1:20:10 I don't know.

1:20:11 Maybe he's like a music producer.

1:20:13 I'm not into NSY.

1:20:14 I think JC Chavez is like the other guy in NSync that could have like had Justin Timberlake's career, but he didn't pop off like Justin.

1:20:22 Dang.

1:20:22 Didn't pop off. You know, pop off.

1:20:25 Because it's December. Merry Christmas, Happy Holidays, the NSync version. Uh JT's not even like the lead vocalist in that song. It's like doing backwards. JT is special in the show.

1:20:35 Maybe they gave it to JC because of Jesus Christ.

1:20:38 Ooh. Touche. Superstar? Jesus Christ, Superstar? Anybody? Okay, name all the members of uh 98 Degrees. Jessica.

1:20:45 Uh Nick Lachet. Drew Lachey? Wait, this is the third guy.

1:20:50 There's two Laches?

1:20:51 Yeah, there's two Laches.

1:20:52 Are they brothers? Are they cousins? Yeah, they're brothers. Are they lovers?

1:20:55 I think they're just brothers.

1:20:57 Well, I mean.

1:20:57 And they're true to their hearts. Be true to your hot. You must be true hot!