ACOTAR: The Prison Deep Dive | Eighth Court Magic, What is Lanthys, Maasverse Theories, and more!

0:00 Nesta also says the magic feels different from Night court magic. And we have clues that there was an 8th court here, right? So is this the magic of whatever court was here? Very interesting seeds being planted. We shall see where they grow. So we did a little binge watch OK the other day, yesterday, no Friday night, we watched 3 Christmas movies, two of which were new Netflix Christmas movies, which I guess Netflix has just decided that they're going to be the home of the cheesy Christmas romance movie. OK, instead of Hallmark.

0:47 The first one was called, I shit you not Hot Frosty. And the plot was the plot was. Can you guess the plot, Ronnie? The plot was a small town, had a snow sculpture competition. Someone made a hot man. That hot man came to life. And the local widow, because they're always a widow, the spouse is always dead. There's no divorce in these worlds. So the local widow finds this man running naked through the streets, takes him in, and spoiler alert, they fall in love.

1:17 So that's hot Frosty. The next one was called Secret Santa. This one was actually kind of fun. The plot of this one was a local woman. Actually, she was a single mom. We don't know what happened to the father of her child, but it's not implied that he's dead. A local woman who lives in a town with a ski resort gets fired from her job right before Christmas. Her daughter wants to go to snowboarding school. I know her daughter wants to go to snowboarding school, and if you become an employee of the hotel where the snowboarding school is, you get 50% off.

1:45 However, the only job that's available a week before Christmas is as a Christmas Santa. And she is a woman. But thankfully she has a gay brother who's obsessed with Halloween and it's very good at Halloween costume. So he makes her a very elaborate prosthetic Santa costume and she goes and becomes Santa.

2:03 And it's a little bit of a what's what's the movie? It's a little bit of a Misses Doubtfire and a she's the man situation because her love interest is the general manager of this hotel and he is both falling in love with her as a woman, but also her as Santa Claus. So he's a little confused about what's going on.

2:20 And then we watched The Holiday, which is actually a good movie. Well, that's actually a good movie I have seen it's. A great movie. It's a great movie and I was just reminded at how fucking good the holiday is. Compared to these? Yeah. Compared to like, this new age shit. Shit movie. Yeah. Yeah. I won't lie, I like, I'm not particularly well versed in Christmas movies.

2:44 I mean, my fiance's favorite Christmas movie is National Lampoon's Christmas Vacation. Yeah, that's derricks. Too. Yeah, I feel like it's a very men. 'S yeah it's like the Christmas movie they're allowed to like you know cuz there's no problem this is. This is fun and macho. Yeah, actually, fun fact, our Wi-Fi password for our entire relationship has been taught. And Margo, do you know Todd and Margo? I actually love Todd and Margo in. That we we believe that our neighbors believe us to be Todd and Margot.

3:17 OK but Todd and Margot are the only reasonable saved people in that whole fucking. Movie No, no, I agree. We agree. So our Wi-Fi password if you ever you know, if you if you were ever in the vicinity and see a Todd and Margot Wi-Fi or sorry, not the password, the network, the network. The network name is called Todd and Margot. But yeah, I guess we watched a Christmas story. Of course, the whole home alone situation. I feel like we overwatched those. I love a nightmare before Christmas because Tim Burton can do no fucking wrong in my mind.

3:49 I don't like I feel like people are going to come for me. I don't like elf I'm so sorry. It's. It's like kind of the only way out. I don't like Will Ferrell. I actually did like him in Talladega Nights I. Didn't see that one. I didn't see. This pretty good. It was pretty good. Yeah. I just, I think during the holidays I watch Harry Potter and then I watch The Night Before Christmas and I actually really like those claymation ones.

4:14 My God I love them. What is the one? Not a year without a Santa Claus, but the Rudolf Roder's reindeer is not bad. I like the year without a Santa Claus. No, there's a, there's another one. I know what you're talking. About like the it's just the one that's called like Saint Nicholas or something. Yeah, where it's like the origin story. Of yeah, it's like the one about Santa Claus coming to town. Santa Claus coming to town.

4:35 Santa Claus coming to town. Yeah, that's that's my favorite one. Yeah, yeah, I love those. Yeah, I agree. And then you watch them as an adult, you're like, these are 20 minutes long. How does this pass? And that's perfect for me. Do you consider Love Actually a Christmas movie? OK, so we were talking about this the other day.

4:54 Here's my issue with categorizing Love Actually as a Christmas movie. There's a porn subplot. I cannot watch this movie with my parents which I found. Out. That's why accidentally watching it with my parents, because I forgot about it and it made me deeply uncomfortable. So that's not a Christmas movie by definition. Yeah, that's fair.

5:13 Google considers Love Actually a Christmas movie. Like it considers itself a Christmas movie but I have issues with it. All right. Anyways, hi, I'm Ronnie. I'm Abby. This is Dragons in the Details, where we pick apart our favorite fantasy series over the course of an undetermined number of episodes. We are covering A Court of Thorns and Roses, the series also known as A Guitar by Sarah J Maths. We will cover all 5 published books, so these episodes will contain spoilers for the entire A Guitar series. We will announce any other Maths for spoilers ahead of time and we keep them to the end.

5:51 So if you're new here, we have an ACOTAR only spoiler section, and then we have a mass versus spoiler section. That mass versus spoiler section is the second-half, usually ish half of the episode, and we announce it ahead of time. So if you've not read Crescent City and thrown of class, you can leave. You don't have to leave.

6:07 We just you can. You will be spoiled if you don't. So we'll announce that when the time comes. Disclaimer This podcast is rated R. These are adult books. We also are adults and we curse. We probably already have. I don't even know. Don't listen to it with your children. Each week we dive into a specific topic in depth. This week we are focused on the Spooky Island prison, home to many monsters and keyed to the blood of our favorite High Lord Illyrian baby.

6:34 We come with receipts. We will have quotes to back up any theories so you can follow along if you are skeptical. Abby Announcements. Sorry, my brain just went on a what's it fucking called? Like quantum communication where you have like spooky particles at a distance. You remember what do you know what I'm talking about?

6:51 There's it's like when, when like particle A like impacts particle B, but there's no obvious like connection between them. Do you know what I'm talking about? You're talking about quantum physics right now. Yeah, yeah. We can't do quantum physics on this podcast. That's. Just what it made me think of made me think. Oak is talking about the library and the prison at the end of our last weeks episode and now you're talking. About those are kind of like the particle A, particle B situation here.

7:18 Should I see if we could have a guest moment, maybe later? Maybe at our mass version. OK anyway the word spooky just triggered my brain to do that, so if you found. Anything major in the house should the needle. All right, announcements, Deep Dive Music is brought to you by Schwidley, where you've decided we're going to plug the masters here. If you guys have not met, read the masters. We highly recommend reading the masters so you can know what we're talking about with spooky islands at a distance from each other.

7:45 And we are also trying to remember to do this. Please like, comment, subscribe if you like what we're doing. We are small podcasts, but we're trying to grow and it helps us out so much. Ronnie last week said it doesn't matter what platform you listen to. That is true. However, if you listen to us on Apple Podcasts, you can leave a review and we don't have that many readings there. So if you want to read us on Apple Podcast, we would greatly appreciate that, but that is totally up to you. You are a free person with free will to do whatever you would like.

8:11 Those are our yes, amazing. All right, corrections, omissions, social media shout outs, also known as cobbles. Abby, do you have any to share with the class? I do, so 1 is a kind of correction omission. So we got a comment from a user named Milky Way I believe. This was on Spotify. Great deep dive in chapter 17.

8:30 This was on our Eris deep dive. Sorry. This is talking about Eris in chapter 17 of ACOTAR. I'm on tells Farrah that in the Autumn court the strongest brother will inherit the court and not the eldest. That may be why Heiress is sure he will get it. Tamlin also tells Pharaoh that Lucian left Autumn and abandoned his title. So basically the idea is we know that there are markings and we talked about this in our High Lords episode that there are markings on which High Lords son will basically be his heir. We talked about Eris being so confident that he's the heir. You and I were both like, we don't really know why he thinks this, but it's a fairpoint that like Tamlin knew he was the heir before his brother's side,

9:06 right? Like Tamlin knew other people knew. Like there are markings. So it's possible that that is what's happening with Eris, but no one has really explicitly mentioned that. And Ameren even says like if he thinks he can control the magic. So I do think it's a fairpoint, but I'm not totally sure that is what's happening with Eris. But I want to acknowledge it.

9:24 Totally fairpoint. Great call out Milky Way. That is cosm #1 cosm #2 since we're talking about smart things with Quantum 6, we got a DM from a listener that I just want to read out to you guys because I loved it. I thought it was great. I sent it to Ronnie. So this is from, I'm not gonna read her full name, but she is a doctor. She is a neuroscient neuroscientist. All right, so she has a PhD, so her, her messages, y'all are doing great things.

9:53 I'm a neuroscientist and what I love about your pod is that deep dives are unknowingly invitations for critical thinking. And what I love even more is that it's critical thinking about something that is not real. That to me is probably one of the best ways to train your brain. As someone who deals with nonfiction on the daily, I get so much joy from reading about worlds that people created in their own mind and built a story for us to connect with as readers. Like how cool is that your that your brain can connect to someone else's thoughts and it ultimately creates a world that's probably different from the authors perspective, but not at the same time.

10:23 The brain is wild, reading is cool. Keep doing the deep dives. They're awesome. So that is from our listener. Hold on, I'm going to try to find her real name. Doctor Aya, we'll say that's her name. So that is our listener, Dr. Aya. First of all, thank you so much for the message. That was so kind, that means so much to us. But for you guys, if people are like, why are you spending so much time listening to this podcast? You can say you're training your brain. This podcast does good things for your brain. You heard it from a neuroscientist. We're very happy about that.

10:50 So yeah, now you have carte blanche, basically. It's a list of training. Everyone, you're training your brain. This is actually a brain workout. So there you go. There you go. OK, amazing. We got an interesting cosm on our YouTube video. We publish on YouTube. If you didn't know that if you feel like watching on YouTube instead of whatever channel you're listening on right now, you're welcome to, but you don't have to. 85 So we were talking in our heiress episode 2 weeks ago about how heiress communicates with his hounds, which is a fair question. How heiress are you learning that your hounds are picking up these very specific sense yeah and Shmandy left a comment that said could Eris's hounds

11:35 actually be shifters, which I think is an interesting question right. We only have one two now true like shifters that we know of on Pythian, which seems strange right We you don't often you don't really see power that unique in general. So Tamlin, right, can shift other people and we assume himself, although we of course have not actually seen that other than just into his beast form. He can shift other people into.

12:02 He strips his sentries into wolves. And then we see Pharah shift herself into just about anything she wants. Yeah, I am. P shifts herself into other other people. So could Aris hounds actually be shifters? This might answer some of the questions that we've had about how he knows some of this information, right, How he seems to have this, like, network of spies, right?

12:26 To Ferris's hounds are somehow shifters then? Yeah, as hounds are actually a squadron of spies. That could be interesting. I hadn't really thought about that. I still like the idea of him being a dog dad. So I'm kind of stuck on that idea. But yes, I think that's a very interesting thought provoking call out.

12:44 Thank you, Shamandy. And it doesn't potentially being shifters. It doesn't even, they don't have to be shifters, right? It could be shifters as well, shifting them, which is what Tamlin can do, which is also what Cassian kind of implies. He's like, maybe Eris is more like his hounds. Then I thought, yeah, maybe Eris is a shifter, which would open up.

13:06 And he does call his brothers dot dot dot brothers. Right. So, like, there's open questions about his his parentage, in our opinion. Yeah. I think that would be interesting. It would be interesting to know where that power comes from, why it seems to be so rare. Yeah. I like that. Yep. Thank you.

13:19 I like it. Thank you, Shmandy. Cool, all right, fun Question Time. All right, I kind of struggled with this fun question, but I've landed on I've landed on one. So so we're going to do fuck marry, kill inmates edition. So Abby fuck Mary kill Blanthus Ameren the bone Carver. Can we just? Before we get into this, shout out our discorders.

13:44 Who by God who the fuck was it? Someone on our discord hold. On Are you about to shout out the other prisoner? I mean, we can. Throw them in the mix. I just. Don't know enough about them. We don't know enough about them. All right, As you guys may or may not remember, there are some prisoner, there is prisoners called Lubia and Blue Anise in the prison.

14:10 And one of our discorders referred Maddie, referred to Blue Anise as Blue Anus, which I cannot stop like Blue, which I cannot stop cracking up about. So we will not include them in this fuck Mary Killer because we don't know enough about them. But I believe Blue Anus is a female. You know, she, she. But yeah, so shout out to Maddie. That was like the best fucking thing ever. I don't think I responded in the moment, but I did read it and have a great chuckle.

14:40 Are we talking? Well, somebody I think L better be responded was like who is that? But I knew immediately they were referencing. That was like, Oh yeah, my girl blue anise. My hello anise over now on. We will refer to blue anise as Blue anise on this podcast, or at least I will. Thankfully, they don't come up that much.

15:02 But like, yeah, Sarah Dumas knew exactly what she was doing when she named 2 prisoners Blue, Anise and Lubia and you can't tell me otherwise. What's? Going on there, Sarah. All right, fuck Mary Kill. Is it bad that my initial impression was like? I would probably fuck any of them to be honest. I mean. I mean, Lampus sends a very compelling vision to Nesta of him in bed.

15:24 A bone Carver can appear however the fuck he wants and everyone. Was too easy. And then I sat for a minute and I was like, I don't think so. Oh my goodness all. Right, I think I would. I'm I'm a little bit stumped if I'm being honest. I think Lanthus at the end of the day, bad guy, bad guy. I'm just going to go with the easy one and kill Lanthus. That being said, that vision you sent to Nesta sounded pretty fun, so we'll kill with the asterisk that would fuck before he died.

15:53 I think I would fuck Ameren and marry the bone Carver. The bone Carver seems much more interesting than ever. Oh yeah, yeah, that's my answer. OK yeah I'm a little stumped as well cuz I agree with you. The vision that Lanthus sent was quite compelling, and his true form is also quite compelling, I'll be honest. You like a?

16:15 Blonde. Yeah. I mean, no, actually, not really. Not a real blonde. Yeah, not like a true bond. Yeah, no, but I mean, the bone Carver. Yeah. The bone Carver would just have such good stories, you know, like I would, like, sit on a porch with the bone Carver and chat until I died and probably never get bored. Yeah, I agree.

16:37 So I think I am. Shockingly, I think I'm marrying the bone Carver. That's what I did. Yeah. Yeah. So then, then what am I doing with Amarin and Lantus? Amarin's just kind of scary. I. Know, but so is Lanthus. But all you have to do is sleep with them. I think I'm going to fuck Lanthus and kill Amron. OK.

16:55 Sorry, Amron. Sorry, Amron. It's not personal. Yeah. So I'm marrying the Bone Carver. I'm fucking Lanthus, and I'm killing Amron. Hopefully she's not enrolled, but if she is, then I'll feel better about that decision. Yeah. Fun. OK. All right, that's the inmates. I think those are the ones that we like know well, right?

17:12 Maybe we can have another run of the Bone Carver and Death Gods. Real quick, we are not talking about the Bone Carver this episode. We are going to do a Bone Carver episode however. Yeah, we're doing a Bone Carver episode. That is coming, yeah, but not this. Episode. It's not this episode. It is not all right.

17:27 Shall we deep dive? Yes, we. Shall. I'm getting the most beautiful winter sunset out my window right now. At what time is it? 4:20 PM. But it's beautiful, depressing. All right, Abby, what is the prison? All right, so we have a couple interesting things to talk about here. I'm going to start with the island that the prison is on and what we do and do not know about it.

17:59 So actually, as you mentioned in the last episode, the prison is on an island in the heart of the Western Isles of Prythian beneath a mammoth flat topped mountain of greystone and Moss. You guys are going to remember that we just did a library episode. Sounds pretty similar, right? Like Mammoth Flat Top Mountain. I think those sound similar.

18:20 That is also the description of the House of Wind Harris, our favorite boy. Aris points out that this is actually a bit of a pattern within this world. So we have barren mountains with quote UN quote palaces carved beneath them, the prison under the mountain. And Ramiel, we do not know that the prison is a palace.

18:38 We don't know why Aris called it that, but interesting to think about that there is a kind of a barren mountain pattern and we don't know what's underneath Ramiel, but we know that there's shit underneath the prison apparently also. So it is always cold and misty. So the quote for that is apparently the prison was cold and misty no matter what the time of year. Aqua Chapter 22, which I think is kind of interesting to think about in a world where whole courts are held in a seasonal spaces, right?

19:06 Like we have whole courts underneath the middle that are held in summer that are held in winter. So like, is something similar happening here where we've told we're told the solar courts are different, but it's something similar happening here where this weather pattern is always help. We also find out from Nesta's vision when she's crying for the harp in the library that there are symbols carved into the mountain above the prison.

19:28 So the quote we have for that is she was flying toward it, towards a massive misspelled mountain the land barons saved from Moss and stones and Gray stormy sea around it. The mountain itself had two peaks. I fucked up copying this over, but the mountain itself had two beats. 2 peaks dot dot dot. The stones jutting from its sides were carved in strange ancient symbols as old as the song itself. The song she is listening to in the library as she scries. So that's kind of just what we know about the island that the prison is on.

19:57 We also get some interesting lore for the prison. We get this from Reese. So the quote for that is this place was made before High Lords existed, before Prithian was Prithian. Some of the inmates remember those days, remember a time when it was Moore's family, not mine, who ruled the North. So again, we're getting the idea that this is a very old place, again, similar to kind of the House of Wind in the library. No one can winnow in or out.

20:25 Again, I didn't mean for these to be all these parallels, but since we just talked about it, So what happens when you want to get into the prison is that you have to winnow into the to the island and then hike up to where the prison is. So the quote for that is the hike will get your blood warming reset. Since we can't winnow inside or fly to the entrance, the wards demand that visitors walk in the long way. That's in Mist and Fury Chapter 17 we also find out, which I think is pretty interesting.

20:56 You can't use your Damati powers while you're in the prison if you happen to have them, So the quote for that is when you're in there. Resaid. The words barely audible over the wind and silver streams running down the mountainside. You won't be able to reach me. Why? I rubbed my already freezing hands together before huffing a pot breath into the cradle of my palms. Words and spells far older than Prithian was all resaid. He jerked his chin to Cassian.

21:22 Don't let each other out of your sight. And that's an ACA war chapter 22. And we get this with Cassie and and Nesta later when they fight against Lanthus, like when Nesta basically leaves before she decides that she's going to stay and fight. She's like, I have to get outside and hope that Reese has some like system in place where I can just scream his name into the wind, basically, right, because we we can't.

21:43 Reese cannot contact you mine to mine when you are within the prison, which if you think of this from a prison, makes sense, right? This totally makes sense that you can't winnow in or out. Obviously you wouldn't want inmates to be able to do that, and you also wouldn't be able to want them to communicate with the outside.

21:58 World. Well, yeah, especially seeing as Lanthus seems to have exactly how many other prisoners have the same abilities. Yeah. Now that being said, obviously both Lanfus and the Bone Carver talk about hearing wind under the prison, so it's not like a foolproof system, but it's pretty good. Seems to be pretty good, yeah. Cool.

22:21 You have anything you want to add on the island? On the island, too. Cool thing. All right, so. The prison itself, we have some quotes I have written down. It's old, old, old. We get some insights into why it might have been built from Cassian. So we got that quote about from Reese about it being from a time when Moore's family ruled the North. Then we get some more speculation. We get this twice, that the island may have been an 8th court.

22:48 So the quote for that is no, The prison is law into itself. The island may have even been an 8th court, but it falls under my jurisdiction and my blood is the key to the gates. That's when Reese and Farah first visit the prison in Mist and Fury. Then we get from Cassian in Silver Flames. Your guess is as good as mine, someone who existed that's was asking who built the prison.

23:07 He says your guess is as good as mine, someone who existed before the High Lords ruled. Reese told me once that this island might have even been in 8th courts. We have two mentions of that. We also have some other interesting things about this island that are kind of random. We are told that this island is the place where Helions Pegasuses come from. So when Helios arrives in Night Court in Silver Flames to look at the mask, he arrives on this great winged horse. And what we learn about that is, according to legend, the Pegasuses had come from the island that the prison sat upon, had once fed in fair meadows that had long given way to Moss and mist.

23:47 Perhaps that was part of the decline. Their homeland had vanished and whatever had sustained them there was no longer. So what we also learned is that the Pegasuses are in decline as well. There's, I think there's 8 breeding pairs left and Helion has them all, which is kind of interesting. Like, is this, we've talked about how there's this idea of this gradual decline in Prytheon, right?

24:06 Is that part of this or is this something else? And why did Helion end up with these Pegasuses if the prison is key to Reese's bloodline, Right? Like, if the prison wards are within his jurisdiction, which he clearly says they are, why did the Pegasuses end up with Helion? Yeah, they don't know. And then we also get some speculation from Cassian on why the prison may have been built.

24:32 Which is. Part of me wonders if the prison was either built or stocked with its inmates to hide the harp's presence. There are so many terrible powers here, and the wards on the mountain itself. I wonder if someone hid the harp knowing that it'd never be noticed with so much awful magic around it.

24:46 Which good theory? It's a good theory, Cassian. You could be a guest on this podcast if you wanted. Cool. So that's kind of what we know. And then here are some kind of similarities that we have with prison and with other things. So the last one we talked about in the last episode, we talked about the darkness at the bottom of the library and the darkness of the cauldron.

25:06 We also have incredible darkness in the prison. So the quote for that is Nesta's body melted away, her bones and the stones of the cavern a distant memory as she flowed into the mountain, beheld towering carved gates and pass through them into a darkness so complete it was primordial darkness that was full of living, terrible things.

25:24 So this sounds pretty like the primordial darkness. Sounds like the cauldron, sounds like the bottom of the library. Feyre also mentions when she first goes into the prison how how dark it is. Interestingly, we've seen this happen in the prison twice. I don't know if we've ever seen this happen anywhere else. Both the harp room and the bone gates to get into the prison are hidden by like a fake rock illusion. So the quotes for that, the first one is in Mist and Fury. This is about the bone gates.

25:53 I shivered again and stared up at the sheer Stonewall. I can't climb bare rock like that. You don't need to reset. Laying a hand flat on the stone like a mirage, it vanished in a ripple of light. Pale carved gates stood in its place, so high their tops were lost to mist Gates of Bone. That's Mist and Fury chapter 18.

26:11 And then in Frost and Starlight, Well, we'll talk about it in the harp room. But basically the harp room is also hidden behind a stone own wall that looks like it's stone, but then Nessa places her palm on it and it's an illusion, right? So I think this actually points to the idea that Cassian's theory is right, right?

26:26 Because whoever built the harp room basically had whatever this magic was where they could hide illusions in stone. So I think, I think that's a good theory here. The we've talked at length about Reese being the only person who can open it. I don't think we need to get into that more. The other notes I had here, we've talked about places in Prithian being alive.

26:49 There does seem to be some idea of the prison being alive, although I don't know if it's just the magic of the wards or if it's actually the prison itself. When Ameren has to escape, she said she has to give something up. I had to give me up to walk out. I had to become something else entirely, something the prison would not recognize. So I bound myself to this body.

27:11 So does the prison have a sentience? We've talked about Ramiel comes up a lot. And again, the house having a heartbeat, like, are these places actually somewhat alive? Just adding fuel to that fire there. Yeah. And then just to give you a sense of scale, it takes 2 hours to reach the bone Carver cell from the gates of the prison, right? So the quote for that is with so many, and this is from Akawa chapters 39 and 40, it actually spans a chat. The quote is with so many listening ears in the house, I sat down the bond.

27:41 Take me to the prison right now. Recess, no questions. That's the end of chapter 39. Then chapter 40, standing before the bone Carver two hours later, the ancient death God still wearing my would be sun skin. I said find another object that you desire. So it takes 2 hours. I mean, I realized there's a little bit of a hike involved too, but it takes 2 hours for Pharaoh to get all the way down to where the bone Carver is at the bottom of this process, which is really fake. That's far right.

28:09 All right. The only other thing I have to talk about is the harp room. Do you have anything you want to talk about here? I. Have a couple things, mostly related to just like prison rules that seem a little fuzzy. Yeah, there are two things, in my opinion that get a little confusing about the prison itself and like, weird gaps. And maybe they're not gaps.

28:28 Maybe they're just like things are supposed to be happening off page. But one Ree says that when someone is sentenced to the prison, they can never be free. So Akimath Chapter 18, could you free the inmates? No. Once the sentence is given and a prisoner passes those gates, they belong to the prison.

28:44 It will never let them out. I take sentencing people here very, very seriously. We learn that he's sentenced someone. We never learn who that is. I'm kind of curious who it is. You anus. Obviously, that's not true, right? Because we see two, maybe three people who have been freed from the prison over the course of the series.

29:06 Ameren who allegedly freed herself, though we were not there to see it. So that happened off page to the bone. Carver, seemingly by Pharaoh, slash himself off page. So the moment is implied by Pharaoh saying, let's begin. And then Lanthus is freed from his cell, not really from the prison necessarily, but by Nesta and the harp. So this whole like once you belong to the prison, you're never free is not true.

29:33 Like that doesn't hold. Reese also says that the prison is key to his blood. But in A Court of Wings and Ruins Chapter 22, Reese just winnows Cassian in favor to the base of the slope and leaves. And Cassian even says worth the misery of being Reese's mate. Yeah. Implying that it's being a mate that got her in.

29:52 Maybe she just has a kernel of him. And like, that works. And she later shows up alone, like without Reese even knowing that she freed Bone Carver, Right. So Baera can totally go to the prison by herself. And that's not Reese's blood. So like, that's not true. It's his magic. It also opens for Neston Cassian in chapter 53 of A Quart of Silver Flames. He just brings them to the base of the slope. So did we just like abandoned this whole like, key to Reese's blood situation?

30:25 Is it implied that he got them to the gates? Like is the slope after the gates? I didn't think it was, but like, what happened there? And then also in 1/4 of Silver Flames, like Reese expresses concern that Baron would try to free the inmates. Again, key to his blood. Like how like, did we just give up on this? Are there exceptions?

30:45 So far the exceptions seem to be for Farah, Nesta and Baron, or someone Baron knows. These are two rules that are laid out pretty clearly that seem to just be totally not applicable in certain situations, specifically as it relates to at minimum Farah and Nesta. I have some thoughts. I agree with you, definitely inconsistencies. My first is perhaps, perhaps the key is in the word sentencing and perhaps at least the bone Carver. I know, I don't know about Amarin, but perhaps at least the bone Carver was not actually sentenced. Yeah, to the prison.

31:22 And he could have been supposed to be there. Yeah. He could have been put there before it was in prison, which is fair. Yeah. Could have just been there. Yeah. Second thought is we talked a lot about Briaxis last episode. When Favor wants to make the bargain with Briaxis, she has to bring Ameren with her, and she's kind of asking Ameren, can you undo the wards that bind him to this place? Right.

31:43 She's kind of assuming that there are wards that bind Briaxis the way that yeah, I'm assuming these wards would bind. And Ameren was like, got you. And Ameren was like I can do it. Is it a similar idea where yeah, I mean Reese is just wrong that he's the only one can do it. Clearly the harp can do it too, but like does Ameren have some kind of power like that too?

32:05 But Reese doesn't say he can do it. Reese says it is not possible. Oh, right, Reese says it is not possible. Well, Reese doesn't know shit. Yeah, we know that. Yeah, that's kind of what I'm getting. That is like Reese doesn't know shit. He says no shit, I agree. Yeah, the blood thing, I think maybe just something else is going on there that we'll learn later.

32:22 The freedom thing, I think he's just wrong. I think he's just. I agree. I think it's just wrong. Yeah. So that's all I have, except maybe with the bone car Rd. Maybe. But this is not our bone car Rope. Not our bone car rope. Yeah, cool. And then the last thing for the harp room. So we talked about the illusions. The quote for that is she laid a hand on it only to find it was an illusion.

32:45 And she passed through it down another long hall beneath the mountain itself. And then she stood in a cavern almost twin to the one the priestess is saying in, as if they were LinkedIn song and dreaming. So again, I think this is evidence that Cassian was on the right track, that the true purpose of this and was the harp room and what is in the harp room, which is the harp.

33:06 Other other things we get about the harp room which are interesting and which we haven't really seen anywhere else, but are mentioned three times, I think, or maybe twice. There are symbols carved into the floor of the harp, right? So the quotes for those are raised. Symbols carved into the floor cast shadows against the Crimson light. The entire round chamber was full of them. And in its center, the golden harp covered in intricate embossing set with silver rings.

33:30 That's 53. And then again, we get Nesta study the carvings in the floor. They all seem to spiral towards one point. I think these are stars. She breathed constellations. And like a golden sun at the heart play at the center of the system. Nesta also says at one point the magic feels different from Night Court magic. And we have clues that there was an 8th court here, right? So is this the magic of whatever court was here? The quote for that is, this is the Night Court, Cassian said dryly.

34:01 But it felt different from Night Court magic somehow. Nestic pause before the harp. So that is Cassian speaking. But we are getting Nesta's feeling that the magic is different. So we have symbols both within the harp room and on the prison itself, because Nesta saw symbols on the mountains, right? We don't know what those are.

34:18 And then we have magic that feels different than Night Court magic. And we had rumors of an eighth. So very interesting things happening, very interesting seeds being planted. We shall see where they grow. Indeed. Yeah. Yeah, she says. They feel old. Incredibly old, those words. Which is exactly what she says about the bottom of the library too, right?

34:38 That whatevers down there felt older than reactive so. Cool. OK, All right. I'll ask myself, who are the prison? Guards. All right, so you're probably wondering, how do we keep all these terrible inmates inside this prison? Where are the guards? Farah asked the same question and Reese said they dwell within the rock of the mountain. They only emerge at feeding time or to deal with restless prisoners.

35:05 They are nothing but shadows of thought and an ancient spell. With the small lights floating ahead, I tried not to look too long at the Gray walls, especially when they were so rough hewn that the jagged bits could have been a nose or a craggy brow or a set of sneering lips. So this is Farrah and Reese visiting the prison.

35:25 And Farrah is recognizing these, you know, humanist traits in the stone. And Reese is saying that the guards are in the stone in in the walls of the prison. Azriel also says that the prison sentries nobody is is it because they are shadows of an ancient spell and therefore he can speak to them? Unclear.

35:43 But Reese says that these entries, the prison guards are in the walls of the prison. So we're sitting here wondering how the heck who the heck are the are these guards in the walls of the prison? We know that there are wards, right? We know that there are wards around the prison, We know that there are guards in the prison.

36:01 But Reese makes them sound personified in some way, right? Like the They emerge at feeding time. They are beings of some sort. They deal with restless prisoners in a court of silver flames. Chapter 53 When NASA finds the harp, she has a vision of Faye being trapped, seemingly trapped in stone. And that quote is Faye screamed, pounding on stone that hadn't been there a moment before, pleading for their children's sakes, begging to be let outlet, outlet out.

36:32 Nesta had the sensation of falling, tumbling through air and stars and time. It was a trap and our people were too blind to see it. Eons and stars and darkness plunge around her. We have no context for what's happening here, absolutely none. She's just in the harp, having a vision. They clawed at stone, tearing their nails on rock where there had once been a door, but the way back was now forever sealed, and they begged as they tried to pass their children through the solid wall.

36:59 If only their children could be spared. We aren't sure what this vision is off exactly, but Nestor recognizes it as a memory that the harp held. She says. But I think someone very wicked used this last. She stared into the darkness above. I think they used it to trap their enemies and their enemies children into the stone itself.

37:17 Was that what had been happening to her just now? The harp had been pushing her into the rock, fusing her soul with it. She shivered. Cassian demanded. Are you hurt? What happened? So this memory is the only tie I could find, at least two literally souls being pushed into the stone. And it seems like the harp might have done this and the harp might have been doing this to Nesta, like fusing these souls into the stone.

37:43 So are these Fay, the prison guards? Are these souls like whoever they were, whatever they were, the ones who are forced, it doesn't seem willingly to guard these beings that live in these walls for whatever reason. Seems like they lived there or they were trying to get out, trying to go to a different place and now they just are in the walls of this place and deal with the prisoners.

38:05 You think that's one option and I and I think that's like I, I like that option. I had the same thoughts like the harp trying to like seemingly fuse Nesta into the stones, people trying to come through the stones and then we have the the faces with the stones like that all seems like they might be pointing towards the prison guards.

38:21 My only other thought is Azrael's line. I'll go the prison centuries know me what I am and the line they are shadows of thought in an ancient spell. I think your theory is good and I think that's probably what's happening here. But the we do have shadow wraiths in this world right? And they can walk through stone going to walls right? So we have new Allah and Sarah Dwyn who are half race and can walk through walls.

38:47 We don't know what a full Wraith is. Amarin Amarin actually gives us a quote for this. I didn't fully but I remember it. Razor nothing but shadow and mist, able to walk through rolls, stones, you name it. And then I believe the end of the quote is fade. Females will literally stick their Dicks in anything as I believe what the quote is as to where Nuala and Sarah Edwin came from.

39:08 Which is a good fucking point, right? Yeah, yeah. And that would make more sense too, because if that vision is how those souls got into stone, like, how the fuck did they just agree to guard? Yeah, like, guard this prison, right? Like, how did they become willing centuries, right? I don't. Right.

39:27 I don't know. And how are they like shadows of thought in an ancient ancient spell? Again, Reese doesn't know what he's talking about, but that. Could be the answer. Reese doesn't know what he's talking about. A little more on the I don't think they are race these guards because Reese knows. Well, Reese doesn't know what he's talking about, but Reese presumably knows what wraiths are.

39:47 However, we do have another shadow shadowy being and an ancient spell in play here and that is with Koche. And the line for that is I believe this is jury and talking. Koche is no mere sorcerer. He's confined to his lake only due to an ancient spell because he was outsmarted once. Everything he does is to free himself. So are do these ancient spells come from the same place? We have shadow imagery with all of them who cast these spells? Like what is kind of the what is kind of the genesis of these prison?

40:20 Guards. And how do they link to Koche? Is the person who trapped Koche the same person who created the prison and presumably the guards within it to hide the harp? I don't know. I don't know. So I have a conclusion. So I don't know what these guards are, but we potentially have ties to Nuala and Sarah, Dwin, Azrael and Koche, all of which points to them playing a role in Elaine's story, in my opinion.

40:43 Right, Because we have Elaine's love interest, we have big bad we're getting set up for, we have Elaine's best friends. So I think whatever the Prison Guard cards are, I think we're getting set up for them to play a part in Aqatar 6. Yeah, I would like it. I would like it to. I like it. All right, well we have a shorter Aqatar only section today but it was hopefully a goodie and we are going to head into our mass first spoiler section now. So we are about to start talking about Crescent City and Throne of Glass spoilers.

41:12 If you do not want to be spoiled then we recommend you head on out. We love you though, and you can find us on social media, Instagram, YouTube, TikTok, Dragons in the details pod on all of those. We have a website, dragonsinthedetails.com. Our Discord server is Dragons in the details and we still have our e-mail address dragonsinthedetailspod@gmail.com.

41:33 But you can also just reach out via the contact form on our website goes to the same place. We answer in the same way, like rate, comment, subscribe and we love you. We're going to do mass for spoilers now. 321 love you bye. All right, Mass first Cosms Abby, do you have any to share with? Class I do not this week.

41:52 No, OK, I have one. So in our Eris episode we were talking about how Eris would know that the prison was once palace and we were ruminating on the fact that Celine did not intend for everyone on Prithean to forget. She wanted her line to remember. We left out a very important fact. It is a fact when I think about it from a court of Silver flames when discussing this.

42:16 And shout out to Morgan and Dasha on TikTok for reminding me of this. In a court of silver flames, Reese tells Cassian he at least tells Cassian that he put a shield around the prison. This is our prison episode. Yay. Because he was worried that Baron would try to let out the inmates and use them in battle like he and Farah used the Bone Carver.

42:38 Why on earth is Reese worried that Baron could use the prison inmates? Unless Baron has a way to get into the prison? A lot of people, I will say, a lot of people I can't we're not even going to like call out handles names. A lot of people think that Eris could be a saline air. Not a lot of receipts came with that. I'm not going to lie, you guys, this is the only receipt that even remotely came with it and the whole Vol in Autumn King mirror image.

43:05 And we know that the Autumn King line crossed with Morgan's line. So it could not have happened in Prythian as well. Sure, we don't have any. We don't have a receipt for that. So there's that. But we do have this, which is could Baron's line have crossed? Maybe. I think we have a few options here and I've bulleted out some options.

43:22 I'm curious what you're thinking too. One one option, Reese's line possible weird to toss in there when this book was released in February 2021 and House of Sky and Breath was released the year after. I think that would be weird to like have this happen when she wrote in that Celine's bloodline was keyed to the prison like right then. But it's totally possible that Reese is lying. I think in a court of silver flames. One of the things that I'm excited about and hoping for in future a guitar books is that we get the plot line of what was happening with Reese and fair because I think a lot was going on.

43:52 I think what a lot was happening with them with fairs, pregnancy and what Reese was going through and whatever was happening behind the scenes with them to Reese is actually worried about someone else getting into the prison, but just blamed Baron because it was easy because everybody else kind of knew that Baron was a suspect figure, which means there is another descendant of Celine or somebody else who can get in.

44:12 But maybe it's not Baron. 3 Baron is somehow descended from Celine, which would explain Eris knowing things. Maybe 4 Eris or someone Baron knows somehow descend from Celine, which we've talked about or five Baron has found a way to operate outside the normal rules of magic. Or maybe Eris has and Reese is worried that he will and this may be the case, right. We'll team up with Briellen or Briellen will use the trove or something somehow to get in.

44:38 So Reese is like, all right, I'm going to ward the shit out of this place so that no one can do anything because the harp can break shit. That's exactly what I think. This is, I think this is Reese being worried that Baron will team up with Coach J, who again, the wind can get into the prison, right? And Koche whispers on the wind, right? So like in theory, Koche could be communicating with the inmates in the prison.

45:03 And the Trove is now back in play. And we know the Trove. You just, we just talked about this, right? Like the harp releases Lampus. I don't know if Reese knows that yet. But like, I think that this is more about Rialan and the Crown and Koche and Baron allying them then. Baron being starborn, but it could be.

45:19 Or Baron being Celine's there, but it could be in the heart. We know, like Ironclad opens. Yeah, it's the trove, Yeah. The prison. I think it is interesting because I'm thinking in the world of like, what Reese actually thinks is possible, right? If he thinks the crown can control somebody. And again, thinking from Reese's perspective, right, What is Reese actually doing? Reese knows or thinks that Brielle might have access to the crown.

45:41 So Reese is like, Briellen can control someone. I'm going to give a dagger to Eris that I think might protect Eris. Maybe he's worried that Briellen can control Eris. Maybe he's worried about Eris being able to get into the prison. That's really interesting. Right. Like that, that like those things together.

45:57 Yeah. Maybe Eris is an error. Like maybe that's maybe that's really interesting. And maybe that's maybe that's still points to Eris being an error. It is an interesting piece of information, but I still think there's a lot of things that could have driven him to do that. However, Lucian is an error in theory.

46:12 In theory, the prison doors should open for Lucian, right? If Helion is descended from Celine and then, which he is, he's only confirmed from Thea. But it has to be Celine, right? She's the only one who stays in Prithean. Have to be. Celine Thea had two daughters, as far as we know. Celine, Celine and Helena.

46:32 Helena goes to Midgard, has children there. Celine stays in Prithee and has children here. We don't. Know nobody ever came back from yeah Midgard. Could not be, certainly, Certainly, certainly. But we got to get Lucian to this prison, is what I'm saying. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So maybe he was worried that. But then like, if I'm Reese, like I'm giving Lucian a dagger. Yeah, I mean, Grace doesn't know shit, but yes, I agree. I agree.

46:59 I agree. I agree. Yeah. So I don't think it's Baron, I think it's the troph. But it's a good point. Yeah, Yeah. Yep. Cool, that's my omission slash social media channel. All right, OK, so Abby, what is the prison for real this time? OK, we subtitled this Dusk court deep drive. However, this is not going to be a full dusk court deep dive.

47:17 Because this is not Are we going to have hours? We yeah, we have not. OK, All right, so we're not going to do a full desk court deep dive here. However, we will talk about this at kind of eye level right now. So basically we know the prison was once an Asteri Palace and it was Thea's seat of power slash dust court.

47:38 However, I wrote in parentheses here. Not really. It wasn't really dust court because when Thaya ruled there were no courts. And after Thaya ruled, this became right. When Celine got back, this became the prison. So I don't really know that the dust court thing is a true name for this aisle. However, we know that Vast versus Power was the Evening star and Thea says that the evenings the power of the land was twilight dust.

48:02 So we can call it dust court with the asterisk that I don't ever think it was actually called desk court with the timeline we've been given. But that's that's a couple things I want to talk about with the prison. And the first one was what you brought up about the potential prison guards being the fae from Midgard, right, Which I think is kind of wild. I really don't know what's going on here. The quote we have for that is we don't need to read the quotes. I'm just I'm just agreeing with you. I don't know what's going on with the fact that they are seem to be faces in the walls of the prison and and it seems like the harp is trying to fuse Nesta's face to the prison floor. Like I don't know what's going

48:40 on there. Very fucking weird. We won't get into it now, but that probably in a harp episode we want to talk about that. We do find out that Celine carved the constellations into the floor of the harp room. However, the 8 pointed star was already there. Celine did not create that. So I think we need to assume that the Esteri put that there. The quote for that is Celine studied the spot where she knelt on the 8 pointed star in the center of the room. The only adornment.

49:05 And then we find out Celine carved planets and stars and gods, a map of the cosmos, of the world she had abandoned. When she finished, she laid behind the harp, curled around the dather sheet. She's at her waist. So again, we already have that 8 pointed star. That 8 pointed star means something to the Osteria.

49:23 We still don't really know what it means, but it means something to the Osteria. And then that makes sense, right? Because the Elyrians use it as a fighting technique, that the Elyrians were made by the Osteria. So just kind of keep that in mind. We know that Celine carved the constellations, we don't know where the 8th pointed star came from. And then we also find out that Celine made the carvings in the tunnels that led to the harp room to leave a record of what of what Thea did basically, right? So we get a lot of explanation for what we see around the prison in House of Flame and Shadow. This is really interesting.

49:52 The way that Celine actually created the prison. I don't think we've ever seen anyone have this power. So she created the prison by walling off all of the palace. Like literally like moving the earth. So the quote for that is. She wandered through rooms that have that must once have been familiar to her, pausing as if lost in memory. Then she waved a hand and entire hallways were walled off with the natural rock.

50:15 Another wave and ornate throne rooms were swallowed by the mountain until only the lowermost passages, the dungeons and this chamber far beneath remained. So remember in the in the acotar section where I said it took two hours for Feyra and Reese to get to the Bone Carvers cell? That's because they are literally walking through what used to be this underground Esteri palace that that Celine has somehow walled off with her magic, which I don't.

50:39 I don't remember seeing that anywhere else in the Mass first, do you? No, I don't think so. Cool. I almost was like, oh, she's an earth wielder. And then I was like, that's not this book. Different universes, different series, Yes. Different author. Oh, I actually just lied, sorry. After after Bryce absorbs Celine's third of thing is power.

50:59 Bryce can now do this too with the prison. So the quote for that is at a mere thought from Bryce, stalactites and stalagmites formed, closing in on him. Him being Azrael, the room became a wolf. There's a wolf again, always wolves. With Sarah, it's just snapping for the winged warrior. The rock had moved for her as it had for Celine, so.

51:19 But it's her power. Sure, but it's Celine's power. Yes, but I don't know what this is. I don't know what this is. Is something about having the power of the Evening Star and being on the land where the power is, the Evening Star, like is does that give you like control over this land? Does this tie into the idea that Perthian is alive? Should Reese have this power?

51:39 Should other High Lords? I don't know what this is, but I think it's really interesting. Yeah, and we've never seen Reese try like a reason to manipulate the land. Yeah, we got another quote again about the idea of Christian being alive, but it's a little stronger here. So the quotas. And with the Daglin gone, as the centuries passed, as the tithe was no longer demanded of us or the land, our power strengthened.

52:06 The land strengthened. It returned to what it had been before the Daglin's arrival, millennia before. We returned to what we'd been before that time too. Creatures whose very magic was tied to this land. Thus the Land's powers became my mother's. Dusk, twilight. That's what the island was in its long buried heart. What her power bloomed into the lands, rising with it. It was as she said, as if the island had a soul that now blossomed under her care, nurtured by the court she built here.

52:34 Which is so fucking interesting, because they're still in a steri on this island. They're still in a steri in a sarcophagus. And in theory the island has taken in right we talked about in Harlot high Lloyd's episode. I drank some lands magic. The lands magic drink from me right again think I think this is like an Euro Burrows.

52:53 I don't know the start of this. I don't know if the island is dusk because of Vesperus or if Vesperus is the Evening star because she drank the Land's magic. But now we have Thea getting that power too, right? Which is kind of exactly what we're talking about happening with the High Lord. So it says that magic became my mother's. That's exactly what the High Lords seemingly do when they get their magic from the land.

53:14 So like kind of wild here. Just just summarizing. But the mechanics of this are fucking crazy. So again, we actually talked about this last episode too, but there are three things buried underneath the prison apart from the harp. Apart from the harp. So when we were talking about all those crazy things happening with the library, This is why we think that could happen.

53:32 So we have Celine's third of Faye's star. The quote for that is. She dropped to her knees and slammed her hand atop the 8 pointed star. Bryce reached with her mind through layers of rock and earth and there it was, slumbering beneath her. Not first light, not as she knew it on me on Midgard, but Rafe power from a time before the drop.

53:50 Like a small sun emerging from the stone itself, a ball of light burst from on the floor, a star twin to the one in Bryce's chest. Her Starlight at last awoke again, as if reaching with shining figures for that star hovering inches away. With trembling hands, Bryce guided the star to the one gleaming on her chest, into her body. White light erupted everywhere.

54:10 Power, uncut and ancient, scorched through her veins. The hair on her head rose, debris floated upward. She was everywhere and nowhere. She was the evening star and the last rays of color before dark. So we are again getting this idea that Bryce's this power from Celine is the Evening Star. But I am no longer sure if that is because it is Vesperous or because it is this Lance power. I'm not totalish.

54:33 I still think that like I still think that Vesperous is Saya's mother and this is all a genetic thing. But like I'm not clear on if this is a Steri power because she calls us Rafe power, right? So I'm getting confused but. Yeah. So that's one of the things that's under the prison. The second one is Vesperus, who are bad bitch Vesperus who we know and love.

54:56 There is also a core of first light power which is kind of skimmed over, but we should talk about this. So the quotes for this, she let them out. This is Bryce communicating mind to mind with the prison. So she actually like has a Damati moment with the prison, which is kind of wild. And the prison is giving her this vision. The island that the prison is on is giving her this vision. The quote for that is, and this is about the other prisoners in the prison.

55:19 She let them come out if she restored the mountain to its former glory. And in that moment the mountain, the island, spoke to her alone. It was so alone it had been waiting all this time, cold and adrift in this thrashing. Gracie, if she could reach out, if she could open her heart to it, it might sing again. Awaken.

55:37 There was a beating, vibrant heart locked away far beneath them. If she freed it, the land would rise from its slumber, and such wonders would spring again from its earth. So that's about the heart of the island. We don't really know what that is and I think we definitely need to like look at this passage in more detail when we do dust a true dust cork deep dive because this is pretty fucking wild.

55:58 Like Bryce is literally talking to the land here. So we have a heart of the island and then we also have a core of first light. I don't know if those are the same things, but they might be. And the quote for that is in true Bryce fashion again, Vasper's tells us that there are cores of first light power hidden in thin places all over Prytheum. We know that the prison is a thin place and and at one point, Vasper's basically looks down and implies is that there's power underneath that.

56:21 And Bryce goes, oh, God, there was a fucking first, like core here far beneath their feet. And Bryce doesn't claim it, right. Bryce doesn't. Bryce doesn't ever take that power because the island basically tells her if she takes that power, the inmates would be freed. So I know we asked the question previously on if the aisle, if the prison was restored towards former glory. I think we have confirmation here that it's not because that would mean all of the inmates would be freed. Yeah.

56:47 Yeah. So I don't know, I don't really have any theories here. These are just interesting things that I certainly think we should talk about more when we do a full dust court deep dive. Because the magic from the land versus the magic from the Esteri and the land being alive and Bryce fucking talking to it is sending me up a wall today.

57:05 But I don't know what to do with it. Yeah, yeah, trying to think of what to add and how far to go. This land was stay as court. To your point, dust court is not actually used right as a term at any point. It's not a real thing. This is a thing that like the fandom kind of made-up dust Twilight. That's what the island was in its long very part what her power bloomed into the lands rising with it.

57:26 That's the closest we really get. But it was Faye's court. The only thing that I would maybe add like a hypothesis, and this is not a it's not a crazy hypothesis by any means. I feel like it's kind of obvious actually. But this court, like this land is basically a mirror to a Volun right on the other and under a Volun is of course, like Peleus's sarcophagus.

57:48 And hidden beneath Pelee sarcophagus is the secret passage into these caves that allow them to basically make these phone calls to hell. We didn't really check under the sarcophagus of vespers. Actually, maybe we should have. But Bryce like freeze of Alan, right and restores the land. And so I guess the question is, will the prison be restored at any point? Only if they do something about all the inmates, right? Yeah, yeah.

58:15 The answer for a Volun was like the return of this power, the star sword and truth teller, and like the return of Bryce and if they as light and all that stuff. I guess the question is, is the power to be freed by the return of something, or is it to be freed by the lack of all of these inmates? Yeah, I think claiming the power. Let me read this.

58:37 If she could reach out, if she could open her heart to it, it might sing again. Awaken. There was a beating of vibrant heart locked away far beneath them. If she freed it, the land would rise from its slumber and such wonders would spring again from its earth. So if someone, in this case it's Bryce, but if someone is able to reach out their heart to the island, then in theory it would awaken again.

59:01 But yes, then all of the prison inmates would be freed. And that would be bad. I think the question is, who is this person to do this right? Because the prison is firmly in Reese's jurisdiction, but obviously Nesta is kind of the starborn one at this point. Farrah should also be starborn. Elaine should also be starborn. Yeah, yeah.

59:20 So maybe Nestor just claims it, or someone just claims it and then and it's all. OK. And we kill all the inmates or we make some deals with them. I don't know. I don't know. But yeah, I mean, I just to get back what we were talking about previously. I do feel like the prison, the inmates in the prison and obviously the prison itself will play a big role with the Coach J outline that we seem to be getting, feels like they're going to be very important and that he might try to use the prison inmates to do his bidding. In which case maybe it's a moot point and we can just make the prison into the dusk court again, for lack of a better, better word.

59:53 All right, next question, Ronnie, what is Lanthus your fuck buddy all? Right. Lanthus Apollyon's twin on Prythian. They're calling him a death God. He seems to be more like an Asteri warrior, Not really an Asteri, not quite that powerful. Or if he was, then the Prythian fair, way more powerful than we ever gave them credit for. And maybe they are, but this is Cassian's recounting of his capture of Lanthus.

1:00:19 Cassian's calling him first Gods. He's calling him Death Lords, calling him a lot of love things. Cassian's very. He likes to embellish. Based on ancient near primordial beings who existed here before the High Face split into courts before the High Lords. Some call them the First Gods. They were beings with almost no physical form, but a keen, vicious intelligence. Humans and fae alike were their prey. Most were haunted and driven into hiding or imprisonment ages ago, but some remained lurking in the forgotten in forgotten corners of the land.

1:00:49 When I was nearing 300 years old, one of them appeared again, crawling out of the roots of a mountain before he went into the the prison and confinement weakened him. Lanthus could turn into wind and RIP the air from your lungs, or turn into rain and drown you on dry land. He could peel your skin from your body with a few movements.

1:01:08 He never revealed his true form, but when I faced him, he chose to appear as swirling mist. He fathered a race of fairies that still plague us who thrived under Amarantha's reign. The Boggy. But the Boggy are lesser mere shadows compared to Lanthus. If there is such a thing as evil Incarnate, it is him. He has no mercy, no sense of right or wrong. There is him, and there is everyone else, and we are all his prey.

1:01:32 His methods of killing are creative and slow. He feasts on fear and pain as much as the flesh itself. So Cassian ended up capturing Lanthus using a mirror bound in Ashwood and dumping him into a prison Ashwood again. Very interesting. Yeah, Ash is typically lethal to to Faye, but Cassian calls him a death Lord and kind of lumps him with Coche. I told you of Lanthus, the wound he gave me, he's literally deathless.

1:02:02 Nothing to kill him. Coche 2 cannot be killed. He's the master of his own death. They are death Lords. Amarin shudders at him. So, so Lanthus, according to Cassian, right, Cassian has limited knowledge. So let's just like taking Cassian's description into account. Lanthus seems to be non primordial.

1:02:19 He is shape shifting. He he kind of has like a a Brie axis type feel to him where he's he can take the form of mist, he can take the form of rain, he can take the form of whatever he created the boggy so that that comp is there and we see this happen right when he and Nesta face off right in the prison.

1:02:38 So she accidentally frees him from his cell seemingly although he takes credit for it and describes himself as a true immortal and he is typically non corporeal. But when Nesta uses Ataraxia, which is the sword that she made, she binds him to his true form seemingly. So when she uses Atorexia, Lanthus screams with shock and fury. I'm just going to paraphrase.

1:03:01 The mist contorts, shrinking and writhing as if it fought an invisible enemy. And then it became solid, blooming with color. And then we see Lanthus true form, which is naked golden haired male stood before her. He was of average height, his golden skin sculpted with muscle, his sharp boned face simmering with hate.

1:03:18 Not a repulsive, awful creature, but one of beauty. His black eyes narrowed upon the blade as he hissed. That is not Narpan. The name meant nothing to her. So here's the part where I get confused about Lanthus. Candidly, everything about him, everything about his description to me screams hell. Like he looks like our friends from hell are Princess of hell. His eyes are black, which I guess is not like the Princess of hell, but it's like it's valglike. So it's like dark beings of beings from a world of like dark, ice, wind, etcetera.

1:03:46 He takes the form of wind. But Lanthus Rd. in the Wild Hunt, which was specifically a daglin activity, so he says I rode in the Wild Hunt before you were even a scrap of existence, which from Orid, which is what Nesta said she is. I summoned the hounds and the world coward at their bang. I galloped at the head of the hunt and Faye and Beast cowed before us. He then seduces Nesta calling her queen of Queens and shows her what they could be together.

1:04:13 Everyone loves Nesta, everyone wants to marry Nesta, everyone wants to procreate with Nesta. So he has these Damati like skills and sends her visions of what they could be together and sends her a vision of them seated together on a black throne. We talked about this in a prior episode with matching crowns, and they are guarded by these enormous, enormous Onyx beasts scaled like the ones that Nesta had seen in the Hewn City pillars.

1:04:42 So Lanthus is sending her these visions, and that's when Nesta is like, no, like you're not. That's not happening. I love Cassie and get out of my brain. So the Wild Hunt is the best clue, based on what we know, to what Lanthus actually is. Because Reese tells us that the Wild Hunt was basically a scare tactic where the Daglin had their best warriors hunt down a bunch of beasts.

1:05:03 So that quote is the Daglin delighted in terrorizing the fae and humans under their control. The Wild Hunt was a way to keep all of us in line. They'd gather a host of their fiercest, most merciless warriors and grant them free rein to kill as they pleased. The Daglin possessed mighty, monstrous beasts. Hounds they called them though they didn't look like hounds. We know that they used to run prey to ground before they tortured and killed them.

1:05:26 So unless unless hell beings were a steri warriors, which like that would be interesting. I think when this isn't a steri warrior but that's my mental battle is like. I'm in the same. Way speaking, Lanthus seems to be an Assyria warrior, but descriptively speaking Lanthus seems to be hell adjacent. Yes, I totally agree.

1:05:48 I mean, that's, that's pretty much what I have too. Like he says he is a true immortal. Like that's a that's a quote he says about him. Amarin uses almost those exact same words. And we think that Amarin was a sterry maid, right? He says he could hear the final note of the harp echoing in the stone. The quote for that is I.

1:06:09 I see it now. Long have I wondered who would come to claim it. I could hear its music, you know, its final note, like an echo in the stone. I was surprised to find it down here, hidden beneath the prison, after all this time. Like calls to like, right? So if he can hear this final note and in the harp, Nesta can hear it too. Nesta is made right.

1:06:26 Is Lanthus also made by the Esteri the same way Again, atorexia glows when it strikes him, which I think you mentioned. The the blade began to glow, the miscontorted shrinking and riding as it fought an invisible enemy and then it became solid blooming with color. Like is that again a steri power kind of reacting to a steri power? I don't know that was just a theory. I have your same note other people described as golden haired and golden skinned.

1:06:52 A Polygon. A Polygon 100% and also Tamlin, but a Polygon. Yeah, also Tamlin, I mean the Princess of Hell specifically say that the Asteri created black crowns to control beings from hell, so it is not completely crazy to think that hell inks from hell were. Yeah, Asteri warriors by by force. Yeah, yeah, Yeah. I mean, the other thing he knows, he seems to know about Deanna, which we've talked about the quote for. That is whose fire burns silver in your gaze. You know whose fire she stalled, but it struck true somehow. Laphosis, skin drained of color.

1:07:29 It is not possible. We think Deanna is an Asteri. So like, that would kind of make sense. And then did you read this quote about when Bryce is in Prithean? OK, So when Bryce is in Prithean, Nesta and Bryce actually talk about Lanthus. She says she doesn't think that Lanthus is an Asteri, but there's a little kind of legal room here. The quote for that is tell me about the Daglin. I don't know anything about them. She considered an added.

1:07:52 I slew one of their contemporaries, though, about seven months ago. Bryce's browse browse rose. So not an A Steri Daglin, I mean. Azrael shifted Nesta glance sidelong at him, marking the movement, but said to Bryce. I don't think so. The creature Lanthus was a breed unto himself. He was horrible. So not in a Steri, not a full of Steri. Right?

1:08:11 But I do think perhaps we have a clue that there's wiggle room for him to be made by a Steri. A breed unto himself though. I mean, maybe he was just here or maybe he just came and he's something else and he just was like, hey, these Asteri guys look good. Or maybe he was a Prince of hell that was being like coerced or worked with them willingly.

1:08:30 You know, the Prince of hell have duplicitous motives, to say the least. But then the real Valgi parts of it, which some of which you mentioned, the black guys, right? Like he's bleeds black, he feeds on fear and he can make people see visions, right? So those are all very Valgi things. We've talked at length about that.

1:08:48 So I am also with you where I don't. And this is kind of where the convergence of these three things stops making sense. Like, are they all the same? Are they not all the same? Are we reading too much into this? Probably that. That's probably the answer. But like, we're getting hell. We're getting a stare. We're getting Val clues all in one. All in one character.

1:09:09 Yeah. And I don't really have an answer as to what he is or if you were coming here for answers tonight. Guess it's not happening. Seems Val hell and a staring all for the price of 1. Yeah. And then killed like pretty kind of easily, just like at the end of the day. Yeah, just with that or axiom. Yeah, he's not even like a major villain. He's like a little side plot villain. Yeah, you know, but.

1:09:31 Cassian is like, honestly terrified of. So that's kind of insulting to Cassian, but, well, whoops. I'm trying to say here it feels like Coach J is going to be a much bigger deal. Yeah, OK. All right, Savvy, what is the connection between the room where the harp is found and Elena's tomb? All right. This was fun.

1:09:50 This was a fun one. This was a fun one and I will tell you my answer ended up having nothing to do with ACOTAR. So sorry. Sorry, this is not really anything to do with that guitar, but I think it's fun. I wrote this is loosey goosey, but I think it's fun. And I will warn you this answer has nothing to do with Britain. All right, so the heart room, we talked about this a bit has constellations from Midgard carp into it. Bryce says we have both constellations and planets. Those constellations are the Great ladle, Orion, the Archer, the Scorpion and the fish and the planets which somehow have faces.

1:10:22 I'm not really clear on that. We seem to be have some kind of Norse mythology thing going on here in Midgard. Obviously we have Sith Orestes, Odin, Lacos Thur fair Faria. Sorry, don't know how to say that. One soul. And then Midgard again, heavily, obviously heavy influenced by the Norse gods. We find out from Celine's Ted talk, as we mentioned earlier, that she carved these constellations into the harp chamber, but we we don't know why.

1:10:49 It kind of doesn't make sense, right? Like she wants to cover up that she had ever been to Midgard, that this existed, and then she literally carves constellations from Midgard into this harp chamber, which seems like pretty obvious proof that she was there, right? When Aylan finds Elena's tomb under Rift hold, the description we get is this. She tripped on something and as she as she staggered she noticed the floor.

1:11:16 Her mouth fell open. It was covered in stars, raised carvings that mirror the night sky and the ceiling depicted the earth. Why were they reversed? She looked at the walls and put a hand to her heart. Countless word marks were etched into their surface. Aylan only starts to pay attention to the word marks after that. Basically right?

1:11:34 Like the constellations are pretty pretty much forgotten, but however now we have 2 rooms underground palaces right underneath palaces with constellations carved into them. Again, this isn't really an Acatar theory, this is this is more of a mass first theory. But we know with certainty that the Asteria were once in Aurelia, whether or not they are the Throat of Glass gods like we we know that the Asteria were in Aurelia. We know this because of this line from Crescent City 3. We were still waging our war on the humans when the door between worlds opened again.

1:12:05 More Faye appeared from another world. This time they were Faye like us, but not The ears, the Grace, the strength were identical, but they were shape shifters, all of them, and each even in their humanoid body equipped with elongated canine teeth. And they answered directly to Ridgelis. It seemed, in fact, like they'd known Ridgelis a long while. And that's in House of Flame and Shadow chapter 20. We don't really know much about the timelines in this world. However, if we are assuming a linear parallel timeline, which Bryce kind of implies that, we can assume that she says that time passes the same way.

1:12:39 Elena's choom is only 1000 years old and the Esteri would have been on early 15,000 years before before the events basically of Throne of Glass. If we're assuming this is all like let's just assume timeline parallels for now right? And the quote we have for that, the reason we know that is no fae had married into the Heaviliard line for 1000 years and there had been only one and she was 1/2 breed at that.

1:13:07 If this were true if she was fae or half fae, then she was she was and then we find out she's Elena and we this is I believe in Throne of Glass. And we also know that one of the word keys was buried in Elena's this tomb, but Aaron found it before Aylan could. So now what we have are two chambers deep underground with objects of immense power in them that happen to have constellations carved on the floor on worlds that the Esteri had previously been to.

1:13:32 Those are just facts. Those are that is what we have here. Again, I want to shout out our Discord because there's been a lot of chatter on our Discord about this. And this is where I start to get into kind of wacky theory territory, so just stay with me. There's a lot of chatter on our Discord about Rift Hold and the idea that Rift Hold might be a thin in place because it's fucking named Rift Hold, right? Yeah.

1:13:52 So my kind of thoughts on this are what if something similar happened in Rift Hold? Obviously the word keys came later. Take the word keys out of these the equation right now, right? But like, what if someone came to Aurilia either from Midgard or from somewhere else similar to what Celine did? What if someone was able to go back, landed in Rift Hold, and then carved the constellations into the chamber that later 14,000 years?

1:14:18 Yeah, I think 14,000 years later happened to become Elena's tomb. But this chamber was originally something else. Because if you think about it, we have a Crystal Palace in Crescent City, and then we have a glass palace in Rift Hold, Right? Like it feels very similar. Feels like the Asteri maybe also built the palace in Rift Hold.

1:14:36 And this also might be a chamber underneath an Asteri built palace, certainly. And my theory on this is not a great one admittedly, but I have two thoughts. So either one of the shifter fae went back and was able to do this. But the only person that we really know that should be able to carve things into rock is Celine, right? And Celine had the harp.

1:14:56 Like no one left in Midgard had the harp or the horn. The horn was destroyed during the that first war. So like, I think if someone did come to Aurelia through a thin place and carved this, it might have had to have been Celine, right? I don't know why she would have done it though. But here's where it gets fun.

1:15:13 If it was Celine or Helena, either of them works for this, right? OK, everyone says why does Maeve look like Reese? What if it's because Celine or Helena was in Aurilia and she saw them and was like oh I want to look like that girl, right? And it's not that Reese looks like Maeve, it's that Maeve looks like Reese.

1:15:31 Are you following? Did I fuck this off? Because I'm certainly looks. Maeve certainly looks like somebody else. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, Maeve certainly looks like. I think Maeve looks like Selena or Helena or Vespers. I kind of like that Maeve would look like Vespers, but I'm with you on that. I guess my question would be word marks have been in play on Irelia for the.

1:15:54 Whole. Time and there seem to be. We know because Maeve exists that there are wayfarers other places as well. So why does it have to be for Midgard that somebody came and carved the cancel the constellations? I think it has to be someone starborn because Celine used her starborn power to carve the constellations. But it totally doesn't have to be. They could have just done it a different way because someone carved.

1:16:18 All the way to. Yeah, this is a loose theory, totally willing to agree with that. But I think the parallels between these two things are like so strong. Yeah, the parallels, the parallels. I'm 100% with you are really strong. I was just saying I like the thought, man. It would be, yeah. I don't know. I think it's probably not what happened. I don't think Celine just also pieced over to Aurilia. But what's interesting is that Celine definitely knew it existed, right?

1:16:45 So like what if she was like where did those other fake come from? I have a tool in my possession that can let me travel. Worlds right? Well what I was thinking is also the mirror constellations were also on a world where someone who looked exactly like her was like. I know that Maeve is not Celine, but. Are you thinking about it now?

1:17:04 Because I think, no, we don't actually know the end of Celine's story. Yeah, we don't actually know what she did. And we don't know now I'm just like, what if Celine is made like? I'm going through the same exercise. I think I'd need to actually sit down and think about it. Like we'd have to look at Mave's story and see if it lines up with what we know about Prithian.

1:17:28 Yeah, I don't think it does. And obviously Celine didn't just appear like Celine was born to Thea, although it's kind of sketchy the circumstances of her birthright. Yeah. Well, also like Vesperous was just down there, yeah. What do you mean? Like Vesperous was just down there and also looks exactly like Maeve, right? OK, at some point we'll talk about Maeve. Truly.

1:17:51 Not this season. Yeah. OK. What did you have for this one? I mean, I had the same 2 parallels, right? The constellations maps into the ground and the word marks all over the thing that I thought was interesting. We didn't get like the same attention paid to the details right in each piece. So like in Elena's tomb, we got the constellations on the ground and the earth on the ceiling.

1:18:15 Like no one looked at the ceiling of the chamber, unfortunately, right? That was a bummer. Like, was the earth on ceiling there? Would have been nice to know. We also didn't really know There are two languages, two different languages spoken, I presume, on these planets. Somewhere in the chamber room was on Times Rift, written somewhere in symbols that were different. I don't know.

1:18:38 That would have made the connection even more overt, right? Yeah. And also would have been interesting because it could have played on, like something being on top of each other, right? Like, that could have been like Times Riffs. Like those are two places that those are one place in different time, which could have been very interesting, but we didn't really get that level of detail.

1:19:02 And we know that we know Elena's team was within place in Throne of Glass because that was where she came to Selena. That was where she from the realm. Of the dead. From from the realm of where she was trapped and slipped past like the gargoyle guardians to give Selena the eye of Elena the amulet, just like the prison is in Prithean. And so my, my only thought was like, were these were these constellations drawn?

1:19:31 And were these were the constellations drawn as like a map for the word marks to be marked purposefully to build that like portal to a specific place to allow for that thin place to be utilized very specifically between two places like the constellation was the map and the word marks were the bridge. I guess I'm going to make.

1:19:52 I'm going to write these in the way that plots this between the two places specifically. So you're saying that when Celine drew the constellations, carved the constellations in the prison that also carved the constellations in the Elena's tomb room in Rift Hold? And then later someone came because it's a thin place, because these are places that exist on top of each other and it's a thin place.

1:20:14 She was able to just kind of. Yeah, that would be fun. I'm more saying I was more saying the constellations were the map and the person who was creating the wordmarks was using the map to draw the wordmarks and say I'm using the map to write the wordmarks to the right place. Like like we see in these Steri archives under the Christian palace. Yes, fuck fuck, fuck, fuck.

1:20:39 I love that. So it's. Just like here's where I'm going, I'm going to write wordmarks so that I go to the right place or so that I'm like building the bridge to the right place. So this is our really a version of the Dusk Truth room in once again beneath a Crystal Palace, right? Yeah, I love that. I love that.

1:20:59 But it's weird. We still don't really have one in Prythian, though. We're still not clear why Celine did this. But yeah I I agree we don't have a room but that's mid guards constellations. The harp chamber is the one we're talking about right now. Yeah, I know, but I'm saying in the Asteri Palace it's of Mid guards sky, right? Yeah, and in in Prythian it's also mid Guards Sky. Yeah, that's really interesting.

1:21:27 OK, that's really fucking and that's, that's probably why nobody can find Prythian, because there's a map of Prythian sky. Write it down. Unchartered territory. Yeah, cool. I like it. Oh my God, I'm so excited to talk about Throne of Glass. Let me do that in what, 2027? Yeah. I'm gonna do that in one million years. OK, All right.

1:21:45 Why is the mountain on top of the prison covered in Word marks? Kind of similar flavor of answers to this, but let's talk about the receipt as to why we're even asking ourselves this question. So in 1/4 of Silver Flames chapter 52, when Nesta is scrying by accident, which we've read the full passage at this point so we'll just read a very short version.

1:22:06 Nesta is in the service that Gwen invited her to in The Cave in the library and she's accidentally scrying. She's flying towards the prison, toward a massive mist veiled mountain, the land Baron safer Moss and stones and a Gray stormy sea around it. The mountain itself held two peaks at its very top and the stones jutting out from sides were carved in strange ancient symbols as old as the song itself. The song was playing so strange, ancient symbols were carved into the stones jutting from the sides of the mountain. We think these are word marks.

1:22:41 I think that's a fairly good guess. So why? Why is the mountain on top of the prison covering word marks? We know that there are various wards on the prison, and we also know that the wards on the prison are not familiar wards to anybody currently living on Prythian like they were. They predate Reese, they predate anybody who really understands them.

1:23:00 They can't be really unwoven by anybody who's there. Some thoughts on what these word marks do and also just what word marks are generally used for. The one that I want it to be is because of what we were kind of just talking about because it is a thin place and because it is kind of a bridge between worlds.

1:23:19 That's what I want it to be. And we know that word marks have been used and we talked about it at length, right? Like why? Why are we so reliant on the horn and the harp and all of these other things to open portals when like in Throne of Glass we just see word marks do it and like it's fine? That's what I want it to be.

1:23:37 Other things that very well could be that are much simpler and like totally fair game. We also know that word marks just are used as barriers. Are these the words that keep people out and keep prisoners in? Are these what contain the prisoners? Are these word marks that are used to contain Vesperus and keep her in place and keep her in stasis and that's also totally fair. These are the very simple thoughts I have. That's it.

1:24:01 I have a lot of evidence for your first one and I kind of ties to your second one, but it's a it's a much bigger idea. But I really like, I think I agree with you. It's about thin places. So I put aside whether or not these are word marks, right? The words that were used to describe them are strange ancient symbols on top of the mountain, right. So I look for other places in the mass first where we have strange ancient symbols outside of Throne of Glass, because obviously in Throne of Glass we have word marks fucking everywhere #1 the Bone Corridor, which we've talked about a lot today.

1:24:33 So the quote for that is? Bryce halted suddenly between 2 black obelisks, each engraved with a different array of those odd symbols, these obelisks and the obelisks and dozens more behind. Beyond them, linked would seem to be a central walkway stretching into the mist that's in Crescent City 2, Chapter 29. We know the Bone Quarter is a thin place, right? It's wreath and mist.

1:24:55 It's one of the places that Bryce thinks of when Vesperus mentions thin places. And it seems to be a thin place between Midgard and whatever our afterworld realm is, right? Like there's a gate, there's a whole thing. It's definitely a thin place under the ocean in Crescent City. We have these as well, so we have two quotes for that. Are those carvings?

1:25:13 Rune asked as Cindy's LED them back down the hall. Yes, she said, a shade softly from long, long ago. Aryan said. What was down here? He scanned the passing walls of the Canyon floor, all of them carved with strange symbols. This was a highway, not as you will find above the surface, but a grand Ave.

1:25:30 The mayor once used to swim between great cities. So that's again Crescent City 2, Chapter 45. And then again we have Bryce said from the back. I used to work at an antiques, sorry, an antiquities gallery, and my boss once brought in a statue from the Sunken City. I always thought she was fudging the dates, but she said it was almost 15,000 years old. That it came from the original beneath as old as the Asteri at least, or at least their arrival on Midgard. Right.

1:25:54 So we have again this idea of these symbols being attached to the asteri on the statue of Erd, which is you'll recall was originally called word in Irelia. But on the statue of Erd in House of flame and shadow chapter 21 have the under king lounge on a throne beneath A behemoth statue of a figure holding a black metal bowl between her up raised hands. Symbols were carved all over the bulk, continuing down her fingers, her arms, her body.

1:26:22 Thing could only assume that it was meant to represent Erd. No other temples ever depicted the goddess. No one even dared. Most people claim that fate was impossible to betray, portray in anyone form. So we have Erd holding a black bowl, which sounds very similar to what Bryce does to talk to the Princess of Hell, right?

1:26:38 Which is again a thin place. And she's covered in these word marks, right? She's word like they're word marks. The quote we get a little more explanation from the under King about Erd. And she, the under king went on gesturing to that unusual depiction of Erd towering above him. It was not a goddess, but a force that governed world, a cauldron of life brimming with the language of creation.

1:27:00 We know in the Fae origin story that there are symbols when the call children is is poured out, right? Like I think we're getting confirmation those are word marks here. Erd, they called her here a bastardized version of her true name word. We called her in that old world and that is flame and shadow chapter 81. So I think these are word marks.

1:27:18 I think we have confirmation. I think in thin places we need an abundance of word marks. And this totally fits into your last theory. I think we need an abundance of word marks to keep the world's apart, right? Because we know from Baba Yellow Legs that the world's are overlapping on each other, right?

1:27:36 Basically. So I think what these word marks do in thin places is keep the world's apart. So it is war. It's like what you were saying, but it's literally like world shaping words, right? Like if they don't have the word marks that things start to go really bad. Because remember what Ridgel has said about Bryce's tattoo? Tattoo.

1:27:53 I can teach you things you've never even dreamed of. Original is promised the language into Ings on your back. It is our language from our home world. I can teach you how to wield it. Any world might be open to you, Bryce Quinlan. Name the world and it shall be yours. So if the word marks are actually from like the Asteria home world and they're from Word, like they seem to be pretty.

1:28:15 Like we seem to get confirmation that they're from Word, whatever the fuck Word is. Like where the fuck are the Asteria from? Like what is this? What is this? Are the Asteria like? Are they just like the creators of the universe? Like what the fuck is this? Yeah. So I that's what I think the word marks do, which fits with your theory too about them being in Rift hold.

1:28:35 If we think Rift Hold is a thin place that they are like keeping the world's apart because that's what words power is. She's a force that governs, right? Yeah, that's that's my thinking right now. Yeah, interesting word marks. Someone needs to make a dictionary. I need a dictionary please please please please please please.

1:28:55 And they seem to literally do everything. Like if you need, if you need someone to not enter a room, here's a word mark for that. If you need a map back to your world on your back, tattooed Rowans got you for that. And like truly anything. Wait, was that what Danica did to Bryce too? Did she put the coordinates to Midgard on Bryce's back? Is that what her tattoo is like?

1:29:19 The actual words? I didn't think they were the coordinates, but I haven't read that that recently. I haven't either, but that's what I thought you were talking about Bryce. And then you said Rowan. And then I was like, fuck, wait. I just thought Rowan put and map on Aylan's back. Yeah, but I would have found her way home. Maybe Danica did too, but I don't know. That's just an out there theory.

1:29:39 I don't know. It's a theory. I don't think we have confirmation. We're told what it, what it means. I can't remember it's. Yeah, it's it's through love all as possible, but I thought that was just her password. Yeah, just tattoo my password on your back where you in ancient symbols and you'll definitely be able to see it and understand it. Originalist will tell you one day and then it'll be the password to the file on my computer that shows you how I was murdered.

1:30:06 But it could be a fun idea that it's also coordinates either to Prithean or back to Midgard, right? That maybe like Danica was trying to send Bryce somewhere. Anyway, that's just a crazy starving no sleep thought from my OK. Yeah, that was a fun one. Yeah, but that makes sense. I mean, holding the world's apart suddenly thin place certainly is, and they definitely are. Yeah, I think that makes sense.

1:30:32 And yes. And yes. And and yes. Yep, Yep, Yep. OK, cool. All right. Precog corner. What is your precog corner theory? OK, my precog corner theory is about word Marks and about holding words perfect. OK, you ready? I would like to read a very important quote from our bad bitch #2 Baba. Yellow legs a favor. All right, Yellow legs, Look toward another mirror. The word governs and forms the foundation of this world. Not just Aurilia, but all life.

1:31:03 There are worlds that exist beyond your knowledge, worlds that lie on top of each other and don't know it. Right now you could be standing on the bottom of someone else's ocean. The world keeps these realms apart. As you will recall in our last question, I read 2 quotes about the number of strange carvings at the bottom of the ocean in Midgard, right?

1:31:24 Which I think means it's a thin place based on everything we just talked about. And we know that we're getting House of Many Waters as our next Crescent City book. I think that Alan was standing at the bottom of Midgard's ocean when Baba Yellow like said that. And I think that we are going to get a plot line where we are going to Midgard through the ocean. Then that's my precog theory, which I would love. That would be so good.

1:31:49 Are you fucking kidding me? Yes, yes, I think we are. You're gonna put that in Throne of Glass book too and have it pay off in Crescent City book for you? Fucking beautiful genius. I love you. Yeah, yeah. And that is how I think we're going back to Irelia. That is, that's what I think. That's what I think it makes total sense too, because the Myrrh are descended from Shifter Fay of Aurelia.

1:32:14 Yeah, Yep, yeah. They are not their own race. Fun fact. Fun fact. And we have the Well, OK, that was a bit of no, that might be a sleepy, hungry thought. We won't follow. I was gonna say we have the in ill way we have that like Sunken city, right That I have not done much research here. I have not prepped this, but that sunken City sounds pretty similar to maybe whatever is underneath the ocean, right?

1:32:40 So I think maybe that's the link, but I don't know. I haven't I've been putting off I've actually been resisting my throne of glass reread because one it just like is going to take. It's a bear. It's going to suck me away from everything else. It's not going to be hard for me to do because remember I I accidentally re read a book and a half because I just got excited. Yeah, I just started I started reading, started reading like 1 scene in Miss Ward and then I was like, I just have to keep going.

1:33:07 I just love them so much and I do all right. I have a just for fun pre corner theory and then I have one that like maybe it's interesting and maybe you'll just be like this is stupid. My just for fun is that I think we're getting a more in Emory romance. I think we are yeah. And the reason for that is we Emory blushes when she talks about More and says that she's gorgeous. And I think that means we're getting more and Emory romance. The receipt.

1:33:30 I wanted to see where you 2 work. I always forget how beautiful she is. She never comes to Windhaven these days. Windhaven. Windhaven. Nesta could have sworn pink stole over Emory's brown cheeks. Indeed, in the library's deep gloom, More shown like a ray of sunshine. So I'd be very, you know what?

1:33:46 Like nothing will bring More and Nesta together quite like being Emory's girlfriend. That's such a good fight. Oh my God. They better make up. They better be friends. Yeah, yeah, Honestly so excited for that. And then my actual pre card corner theory is so we talked about this like weirdness of.

1:34:05 And by the way, I think I'm starting to in the back of my mind make sense of the fact that women are not high Lords and I think it's because they're actually high Queens. Like, I think that's what's going to end up happening because. OK. This whole like actual starborn power. Notice it's not wielded by any men so.

1:34:22 I mean, we don't know about Pelleus. It's unclear. No, no, no. Pelleus faked it. Never mind. Well, Rune has it. Rune has it, though. Yeah, but he doesn't really. But after the parasite. But maybe. Yeah. But yeah, no. Keep going. Yeah. Anyways, that's not really the point. What if so we don't really understand how this high Lord power like chooses, right?

1:34:43 But we know that it chooses seemingly sort of at random, right? But like kind of follows bloodlines. What if it's actually following the power is just following whoever has the strongest a Steri bloodline. So Bryce and like the whole Starborn line, right? The only people who can absorb any light are people with the Starborn line, right?

1:35:06 People with Starborn power. What if this like high Lord power can only transfer to people who have a Steri bloodlines and it just finds whoever has the strongest, the next strongest Asteri bloodline from the right Asteri. And so every all of this like court magic that we've been talking about, like that whole like thing that we ruminated on with like maybe Mala's and Asteri.

1:35:30 Maybe all of these other court specific powers are like Asteri specific powers. Maybe it's just finding like whoever has the strongest bloodline associated with that Asteri and going to that person and that explains how it moves and how it we'll find the next person. I still have Wams, I guess would be the word about the idea of all High Lords being descended from mystery.

1:35:54 Because, I mean, to be fair, Bryce only meets Reese, right? But Bryce says that Reese's power is on par within Asteris, and Reese is way more powerful than all the High Lords from what we know. So I don't. But that doesn't mean that doesn't necessarily mean anything, you know? Yeah, I it just, it does feel like the High Lord structure is tied to the Asteri, like the whole the whole thing. Like the fact that Tamlin still does the fucking tithe, right? Like, yeah, why?

1:36:22 Why would he do that? Like, in theory, the Asteri were gone before where the High Lords existed, so why would there be a steri ceremony in the Spring Court? You know? I mean, the High Lord of Spring was just like, oh, yeah, I want to be like them. I liked, I saw what they were doing and I liked it.

1:36:36 Like, that doesn't make sense. They were like their oppressors. They hated them. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I think. Cycling magic. And yeah, I was looking for a way to explain why magic would gravitate to only select individuals. And yeah, like only Bryce could claim certain magic. Only Rune could claim certain magic. So.

1:36:56 So it just seemed to mirror and to, yeah, like the universe is already, the world's already crossed. So yeah. No, I I see what you're saying. I see. I do see what you're saying. Yeah. It's like, right. And when and when Bryce claims that piece of Celine Starr, she can talk to the land now, right. Like, she's kind.

1:37:15 She kind of became High Lady of Duskort in that moment. Yeah, right. Yeah, That's pretty wild. I wonder whether, like, it's more evidence that Celine and Helena were not F Beyond's children because the land just died. Yeah. I don't know. I like it. Food for thought. I like it. Food for thought. Food for thought.

1:37:35 OK, Well, that was fun. What are you reading? I. Am reading the night and the moth. I'm jealous. It's really nice. It's really good. Yeah, I've heard it's so good. What I really like about her worlds that I've now kind of, as this is her third book I'm reading out of three, I believe, is that her worlds are not enormous. Her worlds are small, her worlds are contained. But there's always something interesting going on there. There's always some kind of central mystery. There's always some kind of system, right, that you find out is not what you thought it was.

1:38:09 I don't think that's a spoiler. That's just a conceit of many books. Yeah. There's always A twist, it's always original. She's really good at writing characters. Like this book is funny. Like I am laughing reading this book, which is so unexpected. Honestly. It's just really, I just really, I love the characters.

1:38:29 They feel very like fully realized, like it's much closer to 2 twisted crowns than one dark window in my opinion, which makes sense because she was progressing as a writer. I think you'll love it. I'm not done with it yet, but I would definitely recommend it. And it's it's good because it still tickles my brain. There's still like a central mystery. But I read I'm kind of like taking a break between alchemized and the will of the many because I finished Alchemize.

1:38:52 I'm I'm kind of rereading Alchemize, but I want to start the will of the many. So it's like it gets my brain going enough, but it's not like the full-fledged like, Oh my God, what the fuck is going on here? That was alchemized and that I think the will of the many will be. So yeah, it's great. I'm highly, I'm really enjoying it.

1:39:08 That's it's always, always fun to read a Rachel Gillig book, in my opinion. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Cool. Yeah, it's on my list. It's just a matter of whether I read it before the will of the money at this point. Are we going to read the will of the money at the same time? I don't know. Well, you have to get through alchemized.

1:39:24 Yeah, I'm going to take. A while to get through alchemized, so I don't know. It depends on how well I read through the holidays. I'm in a bit of a slump, honestly. I was. I got out of the slump with with the Shepherd King duology, and then I really just fell right back into it. I did. Brimstone did not Get Me Out of the slump. Now.

1:39:42 Brimstone kept me right in it. I came out of it for the Quicksilver reread, and then I came back into it. Yeah. So, but maybe alchemist as well. I mean, I, yeah, I fucking, you know how I feel. That alchemist, I thought it was great. Yeah, OK, cool. Well, we are, if you're still here, we already said where we were on social media, but we are on social media, Instagram, Tiktok, YouTube, Dragons in the Details pod. We have a website, dragonsinthedetails.com. We have an e-mail address, stilldragonsinthedetailspod@gmail.com, but we also have a contact form on the website. All goes to the same place.

1:40:14 So whichever way you like better works for us. And we have a Discord. It's LinkedIn, all of our social BIOS, but it's Dragons in the Details. Is our server. Super fun? Discord is the best place ever. Oh. My God, I love our discord so much. You got like discord listeners you get you get me through my days. I just want you to know that like, I look forward to checking the discord so much.

1:40:35 As do I, And if you're here, you know, if you're here, you know who I am at this point. And honestly, you could probably guess. I feel like you could guess at this point if you are in the discord. Yeah, I think you can maybe guess who I am. Yeah. And that's all I got. Thanks so much for listening like rate, comment, subscribe.

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1:41:19 What do you mean? What do you you got to come in the OK. We're trying to make a heart, but we're I'm just going to put it over here. We're old. So this isn't working. OK. Love you. Bye.