Maasverse: Places of Prythian Deep Dive | The Pool of Starlight, The Middle, Ramiel, and More!

0:00 We have what seems to be a first light core, we have a misty place, we have Fion dying, and we have the land withering when Fion dies, right? So like, we don't know anything about Fion. What power could be contained within Fion? What power made him High King? All right, I have a banter topic and you might be mad at me about it. Yeah.

0:36 I'm not going to be happy about it. What you're doing this here now? But I had to get your reaction going to cry loud. Don't cry. Happy for you. Thank you. Yay. My heart was racing and then we're having all these bike issues. I was like, Oh my God, I'm going to have a heart attack. I just want to on Friday. This happened on Friday.

1:13 Yeah, I know, I know, I know. I haven't told anyone else. You're the first person I told well outside my family, but you're the first friend I told. Because I got you. OK, Tell me to tell you first. But I knew we were recording on Sunday and I was like, maybe I'll just wait. I'll just. See what I I cannot believe you just put me through that in a fucking intro.

1:31 What the fuck? Was like, she's either gonna love this or she's gonna hate it, but we can cut it if you don't like, you know, we can keep. It we can keep it. Tell me what happened. My God, I'm shaking all right. I know I'm shaking too on Friday. All right, so for our listeners, I'm engaged, which is the first time I think I've really said that out loud, which is kind of crazy.

1:53 Yeah, we should probably clarify. And we just held up a fucking ring for anyone who's listening on a non video platform. And Ronnie might want to get a little strong on Friday. So first of all, he was being like, really like. Loving like and like very sweet all day and he was kind of sick. So I was like, this is really strange. Usually when you're sick, you try to stay away from me. I try to stay away from you, but he was just being like really sweet all day and I was like, okay, like we're back up north. I guess he's like really happy to be here. I don't really like know what's going on like this is this is weird, but like, that's fine.

2:27 And then I had dry cleaning to pick up. So he was like, oh, let's go pick it up like right at 5. Like we have he, he had made dinner reservations, which should have been my first clue that something was up. He's like, oh, I made dinner reservations for us at this restaurant we really love. It's at 7:30 and I'm like, oh, great, he he took care of it. That sounds fucking great.

2:44 So we go, we pick up dry cleaning and then we go to Ace Hardware, the most romantic place in the world. Ace Hardware, right? I actually. I really love Ace Hardware. I love. Ace hard this, grow this. Love Ace Hardware. And then he goes, do you want to take a detour before we go home? Like we have like an hour and a half before dinner.

2:59 Do you want to take a detour? I'm like OK, sure sounds great. So we drive down to this like. Gambled on you wanting to take a detour on the way back from Ace Hardware? On me being willing to take a detour. What if you were like, no, I'm exhausted, I want to go home? That's what I said to him. That's what I said to him.

3:14 Like, what if I had been like, oh, I'm really fucking tired. I don't know, I want to go home. And he's like, I would have figured it out or I would have like insisted or something. And I was like, OK, sounds good. So we drive. There's this like beach at like the southernmost point of like where we are. And there's like a little hill that you can walk up. And when you walk up this hill, there's like a lighthouse on the left and you can see water from like, like basically you're basically surrounded by water on all, all sides. So we drive down there and we've like been to this place before. Obviously it kind of means a lot to us. We get down there and it's freezing. It's fucking freezing because

3:47 we're like literally right on the water surrounded in all sides. And it is so like blustery. And so there are other people there, but they're like in their cars. There are other people in their car. Yeah. In the Morris, basically I'm like, are we going to get out? And he's like, yeah, we're going to get out.

4:01 I'm like, OK, so we go, we walk up this like little hill and I like, take it in. So it was not a nice day. It was like a really like grey cloudy, like New England spring day, right? But there was just, it was like sunset. It was like just at the edge of the like horizon. You could see like this like just ribbon of like orange, pink, like right above the waterline, which is really beautiful.

4:24 And we like get up there. I'm like, OK, I'm cold. This is really beautiful. I'm really happy we're here. But like, I'm kind of cold. Like maybe we should go back in the car, you know? Like we have dinner. Soon, yeah. And he goes OK, we'll go back in the car. And then he turns to me, turns to face me and I like I didn't I had no idea.

4:45 I had no idea this was coming. I had no fucking idea. I knew like things were like in the works, but I was like figuring like he'll probably like it'll probably be around Christmas time, like it'll be like way, way later this year, like not right now, right. So he like, turns to me and he was like, do you remember when we were here like five years ago and we were like, so scared about the future?

5:05 I was like, yeah. And literally like, I like, realize what he's doing. I realize what he's doing. And I go, what are you, What are you doing? What are you doing? And then I went like this. I was like, Oh my God. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. Like I just I literally covered my eyes. Your nails look great though.

5:24 This. I happened to get a manicure last week for the first time since before COVID. Since before COVID. That's crazy. It's crazy. Do you think he saw that and was like, it's time? No, well, apparently my entire family was like working this like fucking like spy network to like kind of get me to get a manicure.

5:44 So like I had texted my mom, I was home. I was like, I'd really like to get a pedicure while I'm home. And then she was like, we're going to get and manicured, We're going to do a pedicure and then a manicure. And I didn't think, I did not think anything of it. I did not think about it at all. And then yeah, so like, basically he like said really nice things, but I'm like this the whole time. I'm like, Oh my God, Oh my God.

6:03 Oh my God. Just like in fucking shock. I had literally no idea he was going to do this. So now I'm like, I closed my eyes for the whole fucking thing. I literally closed my eyes. Like I was like, I was like this. I was like, I know what he said, but I'm like, I don't, I didn't like watch it. Like that's so dumb.

6:20 Why did I close my eyes? But like, he's like, will you marry me? And I, and he's like, you have to say, yeah, yes, I'm like, yes, please, of course I'll marry you. And then I'm still like this. So he's like, you haven't even looked at the ring. And I'm like, oh, my God. So I look at it, I'm like, it's beautiful. It's so beautiful.

6:34 And then I put it on this finger and he goes, that's the wrong hand. I've never been engaged before. I'm sorry. It's the first time. My first time where I get engagement ring. I don't know. You should have. Lost this. Hold it. I'm not going to cry. Probably everything should be fine. Oh my God, right now.

6:53 Right. Are you willing to maybe do a face reveal for a special occasion? Come here. I have news. He heard the news. Because I'm scared. He heard the news. Hi, show her congratulation. Thank. You. So exciting. We're very excited. When did it happen? Friday wow, wow, what a treat you guys what a treat so. That was my banter topic, I hope you liked. It yeah, we can't do anything else. There's no banter topic.

7:24 I want to be clear, Roddy texted me yesterday. She's like, Oh my God, I have the best banter topic about Tessa Virtue and Scott Moyer. We have to talk about it. And I was like, Oh yeah, I have one too. I have a banter topic too. Obviously this is a better banter topic, but we did. I was editing Weathering yesterday. It was like we did talk about Tessa Virtue and Scott Moyer in this episode and then you did proceed to go spiral the way that I did.

7:47 But obviously that doesn't fucking matter because you are engaged. I'm engaged. I was just a crazy thing to say. Wow. Your very own romanticy story, guys. There's no drag, I guess. I guess we're the dragon. We're the dragon, yeah. Derek's marrying a dragon. Derek's marrying a dragon. Whether he knows it or not.

8:08 Connor's marrying a dragon. We're all marrying Dragons. Yeah. All marrying Dragons. Yeah, but that's the news. Everyone, everyone with that one week, Crabby's getting married. Crabby. 'S getting married hashtag. Do people do wedding hashtags anymore? I don't know. Doesn't matter based on the fact that I have not thought about it at all and I've probably not wedding for a year, Probably not Probably not. I agree, probably not.

8:35 So I guess with that, I'm Abby, I'm Ronnie. It's going to be hard to recover. Here is Dragons in the Details, the podcast that helps you a better understand your favorite fantasy books through a series of deep dive episodes. We are currently in between our ACOTAR and Crescent City seasons. What a time to be alive. What a time to be in between our ACOTAR and Crescent City seasons.

9:00 Thank you to the gods for everything working out this way. We're very happy. This is a bonus episode, so not officially in our actor season. Not officially in our Crescent City season, no. Not official. Not official. Don't come for us when we tell you what's coming next. So this episode is called Places of Prithean. The reason why it is not in either season is because it is a full mass first episode.

9:23 So this is full mass first spoilers. Sorry to our actor only listeners, we recommend you read the masters. We've been recommending it for a long time and a lot of you guys are going to do it, especially now that Actor 6 and Actor seven are coming out. We highly recommend you read the Mass first. Disclaimer, this episode is rated R.

9:42 Do not listen to it with your children. We curse like sailors. These are spicy books. We are spicy people. We will talk about spicy things. Would you guys? Describe this as spicy people. I'm very curious. I've always. Thought a little spicy rather. Yeah, I guess we're kind of spicy. Sometimes we say shit that people get mad about. That's true.

10:02 That is true. It's OK. We're still going to be here. All right. Announcements, Ronnie. I'm not well this. Is going to be a tough episode guy. Deep dive music brought to you by Schwidley, Abigail's fiance. That's the HWOOELEY. Check him out on Spotify. He's great. We love him. Abby's marrying him and reminder Season 3 is on Crescent City, so get cracking. If you have not started either your first read or your reread and you would like to stay with us, we would suggest that you you start.

10:37 We are going on a break to reread Crescent City ourselves. So we want to make sure that we're bringing you guys fresh stuff. Even though we have been kind of half rereading Crescent City, I feel like the entire actor. We are going to fully reread it. So I am in the midst of a reread. Abby's in the midst of a reread.

10:53 We are going on a little break to 1 ensure that we do not fry ourselves and to reread Crescent City plan out season 3. We are going to come back around the end of April, but follow us on Instagram or TikTok or join our Discord and keep up with us there to hear when we're coming back and like, comment, subscribe, follow, do all the the things we want to bring you the best that we possibly can. And to do that, we need your support and very much appreciate it in advance.

11:20 Yeah, it's an exciting time to be a mass first fan, guys, so very exciting. You want to stay up to date on all the latest stuff that we're doing, all the latest stuff that's happening. Our Discord broke the Akatar 6 release date guys. We sure did our discord is the one who figured it out. So if you want to the latest up to date Akatar news, that is where you want to be.

11:40 And I'll also say our Discord, we keep it civil. There's no ship wars. That's not what we're about. We're really theory focused. So if that's your bag, if that's what you're looking for, subscribe, comment like join our discord. That's that's what we're about. I will. Also say our discord is always going one thing that we get on TikTok and Instagram and our DMS a lot is like, wow, we're so glad that we found the podcast.

12:04 We don't have like friends who are into these books. If that is you, the discord is full of your new friends like. Everyone's becoming friends. It's so great. Like it's awesome. Yeah, yeah. They're talking about like several different channels on several different series topics all the time. All the time. Would recommend checking it out back to you. All right, Cosms, do you have any? I have several.

12:31 I will keep them pretty short because I think you also have several. I have many that's a big cause of episode. Cause of episode we did release I think 4 episodes in between now and when we last recorded so I guess it's to be expected. And if you're somehow new here, COSM stands for Corrections, Omissions, Social Media.

12:49 Shoutouts yes, so I will. I will just be punchy here. Just Write gaming 333 commented on at one of our episodes about your theory that the stars aligning on the blood right time period were planets, which was a super fun theory. I want to shout this commenter out because you and I both are STEM ladies and respect science and we love physics here.

13:18 It is highly unlikely that these are planets because planets do not usually align at the same time every single year because they would need to have the same orbital length as each other every single year. So it's high. They basically commented that it was very unlikely and I was like, you know what? I respect the scientific call out. I will shout this out.

13:37 Stars do this all the time. Stars. Plan. It's not possible. Makes sense. Totally fine, totally love science. We another shout out we talked about Reese potentially seeing other worlds. You mentioned this when he died, just like Aylan did. Reminder everyone's mass for spoilers. Get out of here if you haven't read everything.

13:57 Full masters full mass for spoilers. Haley Huckabee on TikTok commented and reminded us that when recent Farah went and talked to the bone Carver in Akama, he asks Farah specifically if she saw other worlds. Which I thought was such a good call out. Specifically the bone Carver said I pulled the quote, there was no other world the bone Carver pushed. If there was or is, I did not see it. No light, no portal.

14:21 So the bone Carver was specifically looking for did you go through other worlds? Did you see another world? So I think that's a point for that theory. Thank you. Haley Huckabee, great shout out. Also shouting out. Not sure whether you have this one. Maisie on Discord off the back of the Call Her Daddy episode that Sarah J Maas went on, we learned that Briaxis is a she. And this is kind of a wild one, but I like it. Thanatosa is having issues with his daughter and we have talked about in the past, is Briaxis a demon of hell? Is Briaxis Thanatosa's daughter?

14:54 Briaxis being Thanatosa's daughter is by far my favorite theory on Thanatosa's daughter so far. I know there's. A lot about Fury for sure. But I really like the. Idea I like. It Yeah. I love the idea that Brie Axis has been chilling in the library with other traumatized ladies, which by the way, is still in the Night Court, and now there's issues and she's out and about. I don't know.

15:19 I like it, love it. And then one, it's a correction on my part. AJ Thurlow, who I think is a frequent commenter, so hi AJ Thurlow pointed out that rigeless makes sense as a pronunciation because the star Rigel is pronounced Rigel. So. I've never heard of this *. I accept it's a real star. I accept this stance. I accept this this pronunciation rationale. Thank you.

15:46 AJ Thurlow. OK, these are my cousins. OK, so I actually broke it down into corrections, omissions and social media shout outs this week. So corrections on our Illyrians episode, the Merbodons, a lot of you guys pointed this out. We do actually know where the Merbodons are. They are between the night court and the day court. They are the mountain range between the mountain night court and the day court.

16:04 Thank you for reminding us they're not on the map. It's kind of what I meant. But you are correct in that we do actually know where they are and they do exist. So shout out on the Merbodons. I mentioned in our question about the Mitten Guard worm and how it's able to absorb Nesta's and Azrael's power. I mentioned that the Crystalis demon is able to absorb Hunt's power and I posited that it was a like calls to like situation and that they are both of hell.

16:29 I am now doing my Crescent City reread so I read more about the Crystalis demon and his venom. They're the Crystalis Stephen venom nullifies everyone's power. Everyone. It's not just Hunt, it's everyone. Which is really interesting. But that doesn't quite work for it being a like calls to like situation anymore. So I'm still perplexed by the mid and guard worm. I have an omission about the mid and guard worm too as well, because again, I was reading this quote and it made me think of the worm.

16:54 When Bryce sees the crystallos, she says even without a specific identification though given its speed and what had had done that, the demon fit with something belonging to the pit, perhaps a pet of the Star Eater himself. Only in the depths of the pit could something like that evolve. A creature who had never seen light, never needed it. That is House of Earth and Blood chapter 12. I forget what the first Christian said he's called How's the written blood Chapter 12?

17:20 You had the theory that the worm went through hell on its way to Prithean. I'm starting to think it might just actually be of hell. It doesn't have eyes. When it looks more like the. Yeah. Yeah, I agree. OK, so the word might be of help. We don't know. We don't know where the worm is from. Very interesting. I think we'll certainly talk more about the worm as we talk about Crescent City.

17:42 I don't think we're done talking about the worm. One thing that we both missed, I think that I think is really interesting. Again from our Illyrians episode, I completely forgot about this. Azrael is able to charge Bryce up the way that Hunt is able to charge Bryce, right? If starboard power is Asteri power, which we're 99% sure it is, we're the Illyrians basically created as battery packs for like this, for like the Osteri, like I I think that adds another layer to this.

18:12 And again, I'm sure we're not done talking about the Illyrians, but I thought that was really interesting and I'd completely forgotten about it until I was kind of prepping for this episode. It's, it's interesting, right, Because it's like, to me it's a question of is this killing power just killing power, or is it like the laser power that Bryce has and that Azrael is able to use that charges?

18:36 Yeah, Bryce up. Yeah. Like does it just happen to kill and like happen to also be the Illyrians like core warrior skill set? I also I don't know whether that's like unique to Azrael. Like Azrael's clearly not just, well, I think he's not just Illyrian. No, it's an excellent point. Is it unique to Azrael? Because we think there's a lot of Hell or Valg slash both involved with Azrael?

19:01 Or could any Illyrian charge of any starboard or a starry? I don't think we know. We don't know, we don't know, and the quote for that is in case you guys are like what the fuck is she talking about? This is when Bryce and Azrael and Nestor are in the caves. The quote is. Azrael struck before she could exhale, searing sharp power, a bolt of blue right into her star.

19:21 Bryce bent over, coughing, breathing around the burn, the alien strangeness of the power. Are you all right, Nest? To ask, was something like concern? Was it his power or something about this world? Even Hans hadn't felt like this, so undiluted, like 100 proof liquor. Bryce closed her eyes. Guys encountered to 10, breathing hard, letting it ease into her blood, her bones, it tingled along her limbs.

19:41 So the idea of it being more undiluted, I think there's a couple things. Like, it could be the parasite, right? Hunt's been dealing with the parasite, so his magic is not as strong as Azrael's. But it also could be that like, this is actually what Azrael was made for. Like the Illyrians were actually made to charge up the Osiri. But I don't know.

19:57 One other fun thing about this scene, which we will not talk about now, but what occurred to me is that this is when. They're in the tunnels and they have to like, jump across and they're trying to get Bryce to transport them across with her transporting power because Azrael says my wings won't fit.

20:12 But Azrael can winnow. And we like Azrael just doesn't let her know that he can winnow. Like he just keeps that secret for some reason. I don't know why. Have Truth Teller, Yeah. Are they under the prison at that point? They're in the tunnels. They're not under under the prison yet. They're, like, on their way somewhere in the night Court.

20:30 Yeah. Weird. Yeah. All right. Social media shoutouts. I have two, both of which I really love. First one, a lot of people shouted this out, so sorry, I'm not giving specific credit, but good job if you are one of the people. This was in response to our video about the harp and the horn making archways. There is an archway in Aurelia.

20:48 There's an archway in the waist that Ansel tells us about. So the quote is when I was 8, my sister was 11. She and I and Maddie, one of her friends, snuck out of Briarcliff Hall a few miles away. There was a giant tour with a lone watchtower on top. The upper bits were all ruined because of the Witch Wars, but the rest of it was still intact.

21:06 See, there was this archway that went through the bottom of the watchtower so you could see through it to the other side of the hill. And one of the stable boys told my sister that if you look through the archway on the night of the summer solstice, then you might see another world. I think it's really interesting for two reasons, but mostly because of what we've been talking about with Romeo and with the stars along. Like we're starting to get this idea that there's like thin times as well as thin places for lack of a better world. But like there is there are times where like the veils between worlds, worlds is like thin and we can actually like world block more easily.

21:38 Is this proof that the harp and the horn were on Aurelia? I don't know. It seems like kind of a different type of archway, but I could be, I could be. I don't really know which would which would be interesting and mean that obviously what we know to be true about the trove is not actually true anymore. Yes.

21:55 Or at least something has happened with timelines because like, could it, could it feasibly still work? Because we know that Vesperous and Rigilous knew each other and we knew that Rigilous was on. We know that originalist was on. Or really. Was on or really at? Some point so there's like feasibly a time during which the horn and the hark could have been created and exchanged or created and like brought by somebody to Aurelia and the harp can to help you travel through time.

22:24 So and maybe it doesn't even need to right, Like we don't really know at what point in time or really a the story of throne of Glass is told in exactly. So I wouldn't rule it out honestly. I want to I didn't actually have this prepped, but we got an e-mail about this this week and I was thinking about bringing it up but I didn't write it down. But I'll just kind of free associate it. The e-mail was a question about how we can be speculating that any characters are descendants of other characters when it seems like all of these worlds are happening in parallel. Because we know that Alan falls through both Crescent City and Prithean seemingly during 1/4 of Silver Flames. And it's totally fair.

23:03 It's a totally fair question. I think the reason or the way we know that that the timelines are being fucked with somehow is because Lydia Cerebos has seemingly Rowan's wedding ring. And she says that it's a family heirloom. So they're both described as gold rings with I believe rectangle cut rubies in them. And she says it's a family heirloom. And she says that she is descended from Brandon. So it's a pretty fair bet that she has Rowan's wedding ring and that she has had it for many generations of her family, right?

23:36 So if Rowan has Rowan's wedding ring, and if Lydia has Rowan's wedding thing, and if Alan is falling through the world at the same timeline as Rowan as a quarter silver flames, and then Bryce shows up seemingly seven months later in Prithian, the time there has to be timeline fucker. Like it cannot be a linear timeline.

23:56 I think is. The short answer here? Something also has to have split because Lydia is a descendant of Brandon, not Ailan. She could be a descendant of Ailan, but she's not saying Ailan. She's not saying Ailan, which is a it's a good question, but she seems to have Rowan's wedding ring, which would imply that she is a descendant of Rowan and Ailan, which would also mean that any children that Rune and Lydia have are the convergence of Reese's bloodline and Ailan's bloodline.

24:21 But we can get to that later. Yeah. Anyway, that was a tangent. All right. This is my favorite cosm we have possibly ever gotten. Our Discord went crazy over this one. I'm so fucking excited about it. I know you already know what I'm talking talking about we posted Ronnie's amazing theory about Balfazar, who is the Illyrian warrior who helps Nesta in the blood right, potentially being the bone Carver.

24:43 It's a great theory. I totally love it. We got a comment on Facebook from Rebecca, woman named Rebecca. She goes OK in the A court of silver flames audiobook, Nesta just makes it to the blood right? The voice of the person in the Graphic Audio version who helps her find a cave that first night and tells her what to do, that's sounds exactly like Adis from the Crescent City Graphic Audio book.

25:08 I haven't heard anyone talking about it, but I think Adis came to make sure that NASA survived. All right. We put our Discord on it. It's 100% the same person. It's absolutely the same actor. I can tell you that. The voice of Adis is an actor named Patrick Boylan, and I can tell you that in a court of silver flames, Patrick Boylan is credited. Couldn't.

25:32 I cannot confirm what role he plays. However, our discord went through and found the clips and I'm telling you, you can find them. Maybe we'll publish it, I don't know. It is the same person. It is absolutely, 100% the same person. So was Adis hiding out in the blood? Right. To make sure that Nestor survived?

25:52 To make sure that Nix was born, to make sure of all of these things. It's so big. It's such a big fucking theory. I love it so much. Thank you, Rebecca. Well, the the brilliant part for me was that Nesta needed to give Bryce the mask like Nesta needed to help Bryce. Nesta needed to live. Whether he gives a fuck about Nix or not, I don't know.

26:15 I don't care. Like I hope so. I hope Nix plays a huge role. I would love all roads to lead to Knicks, but no matter what we have a very clear domino in that. Nesta helped Bryce massively. Bryce could not have done what she did with the Asteria without Nesta's help, and Nesta got a lot of shit for it.

26:33 I'm pretty and like. No one else would have done that. No one would have done that except. Her love this idea of I and I and I think it's I totally think it's right now that I've heard these voices like I totally think it's definitely the same actor whether it's. Intentionally the same actor? I don't know if it's intentional, I don't know.

26:49 Shit, we had this guy. We need him real quick. But. Just cuz I don't. Love it. How like Rebecca Yaros is that kind of person who would be like, I'm going to use the same voice actor in the graphic audio and make sure that it is and tell no one what it means? I don't know if Sarah's like that. But regardless, the fact that it made us think of this, now that I'm thinking about it, I'm like, yeah, this makes perfect sense. I don't know whether he.

27:16 He knows so much he calls Farrah curse breaker he. So that means he's been like, paying attention since Akatar, right? Like he. And it would make sense, right? Because he loved Saya. Bryce is not Thea's only air. Reece is also Thea's air, right? So would it not make sense if he could see into Midgard that he would also be keeping an eye on Thea's air's appreciate?

27:38 I think it makes a lot of sense. I'm so excited for a guitar sex. OK so Rebecca shout out. That was fucking amazing. Such a good call. Well done, well done. Well done, Rebecca. All right. We've ever done fun Question Time, Ronnie. If you had to live full time in any of recent favors properties, we have the townhouse, the Moonstone Palace, the House of Wind, the River house, the cabin.

28:05 Which would you choose? Assume you can also come and go easily from any of them. This. Question made me realize how many properties. I know he's a fucking mogul. I think I would live in the townhouse because I am. I mean, I live in, I live in New York City, I love walking to get my coffee. But I bet if the House of Wind loved me as much as it loves Nesta, I would choose the House of Wind.

28:29 But I think my answer, my official answer, is the townhouse. What about you? I think I'd be very happy in the Moonstone Palace, if I'm being honest. The Moonstone Palace seems fucking lovely. I want fucking city. I want to take a bath in that bathtub. Whatever they can be under there. I don't have to deal with that. It has all these books in it.

28:46 It's got these views. I can be alone like I have a moonstone palace girl. So good. The fact that it is indoor, outdoor, it's really appealing. It's indoor, outdoor, it's heated year round, but you have views of the snowy mountains, which is right up your alley, actually. Yeah. Yeah. Gorgeous. Yeah. I would not pick.

29:06 I mean, the townhouse seems nice. I was between that, the Moonstone Palace and the cabin, probably. But now the cabin is covered. The cabin. Would be lovely, but they're fucking ruined it. Yeah, I don't know. Pharah painted the whole thing. I don't know. I mean, maybe it's beautiful again, we still don't know whether Pharah is actually a brilliant painter or not.

29:26 I'm going to talk about some of Pharah's paintings in this episode. It remains exciting. Are you going to talk about the gates of eternity? No. So I'm happy that you are. OK. Maybe I don't remember what they're called. The gates of eternity is what she would have fainted the the King city. Oh, the human city. The human city, right?

29:46 Yeah, yeah. So not directly, but all right. Shall we deep dive? That's deep dive. Half an hour and I think it. Was OK, Ronnie starting off all right. And also I want to apologize. We did omit this from our Call Her Daddy episode recap. That's my bad. I made the outline for it. I missed it. What is the Pool of Starlight?

30:10 Yes, OK. So we in Full disclosure for how this outline is structured, it is literally just the things. So I it's pool of Starlight human city under the mountain middle. So I have what it is contextually and then just like if there are theories on it, what are what are the theories that I have? And then we can just riff off from there.

30:31 All right. So full of Starlight, which apparently is top of mind for Alex Cooper and many others. Real quick, I just want to give the response because we didn't shout this out in our Call Her Daddy response episode. What Sarah said was Alex said, why is there a pool of Starlight in the Supreme Court? Is it a portal?

30:46 What Sarah said is who thinks of these things? People read too closely. I don't know. I'm not answering that. Hello, it's us. The people, yeah, we read too closely. And also, Sarah, you write very closely as well. So yeah. And just put a pool of Starlight in the middle of the Spring Court. All right, So there is a pool of Starlight.

31:04 And I want to also call out the seemingly very special Glen that the pool of Starlight is in. And the cordophones and roses. And it's described in Chapter 18. So I want to talk about both the pool and the Glen. And contextually, when it comes about South, right after Amarantha dumps a fairy with its wings cut off over Tamlin's border and Tamlin Berry's said fairy, he takes Farrah to a Glen along with Lucian. Which is an interesting move because Tamlin is clearly trying to make a move and he just brings along Lucian, which I think is hysterical.

31:38 Well, support, he's nervous. Yeah, he's nervous, and Lucian is, I guess, a good wing man. I mean, he really is. Pharaoh describes the Glen as. I couldn't come up with any words when we arrived and knew that even if I had been able to paint it, nothing would have done it justice. It wasn't simply that it was the most beautiful place I'd ever been to, or that it filled me with both longing and mirth, but it's the just seemed right, as if the colors and lights and patterns of the world had come together to to form 1 perfect place, one true bit of beauty. And then we get hints that something is kind of different and special about this, Glenn Farah says. I'd never felt grass like it, and I certainly wasn't going to ruin this experience by sitting

32:18 on a blanket. So she's been in the Spring Court for a while now. She also has obviously been in the human lands. She's never felt grass like the grass in this Glen. Weird. Then some stuff happens, and then later in the passage. Rushed whispers were exchanged behind me. She's still got the glamour on her at this time, so this could just be other fairies around. I don't know.

32:38 Rush. Whispers were exchanged behind me, and before I could turn around to investigate, Tamlin took a seat at my side. His jaw was clenched tight enough that I stared ahead. What is this place? I said, still running My fingers through the grass. Out of the corner of my eye, Tamlin was no more than a glittering golden figure. Just a Glen.

32:54 Behind us, Lucian snorted. Do you like it? Tamlin asked quickly. So we get whispering. I definitely thought that whispering was just just Lucian being like dude go fucking talk to her. Like I thought it was just Lucian being a wig man but I could be wrong. Yeah, maybe it's maybe it's just that whispering. I don't know.

33:10 And we clearly get an exchange between Tamlin and Lucian that indicates that Lucian knows this place is more than just a Glen, and so does Tamlin. And Farrah is out of the loop, right? Like Tamlin says, just to Glenn, and Lucian snorts. So something special about it. Then we get the green of his eyes matched the grass between my fingers, and the amber flecks were like the shafts of sunlight that streamed through the trees. Even his mask on in foreign seemed to fit into the Glenn, as if this place had been fashioned for him alone. I could picture him here in his beast form curled up in the grass dozing.

33:45 So Farrah is imagining this place is literally made for him. Like it ties into everything that he is. Looks like she feels like it was literally created for for Tamlin. And then Tamlin leads Farrah into the trees over some hills and that's when they find the Starlight pool. So that description is?

34:03 We stopped to top a mound, and my hand slackened at my sides. There, in a clearing surrounded by towering trees, lay a sparkling silver pool. Even from a distance, I could tell that it wasn't water, but something more rare and infinitely more precious. I'm skipping a bit. He crouched by the pool and cupped his hand to fill it.

34:22 He tilted his hand, letting the waterfall have a look. The silvery, sparkling water that dribbled from his hand and set ripples dancing across the pool, each glimmering with various colors. And that looks like Starlight. I breathed. He huffed a laugh, filling and emptying his hand again. I gaped at the glittering water.

34:40 It is Starlight. So we have confirmation that this is canonically a pool of Starlight. It's not. It's not a mystery. Or if you believe Tamlin, a pool of Starlight. Right? Feyer asks how, and Tamlin basically shrugs. He says, I don't know, I never asked and no one ever explained. So I might ask more questions if there were a pool of literal Starlight in my backyard.

35:04 Then they kind of chat about Lucian's back story were kind of taken out of out of the pool of Starlight concept there, which is a tactic by Sarah. Whenever we're given something important, she like, distracts with something else that takes up our attention. And then Fair eventually changed the subject. Changes the subject back by asking what would happen if she drank the Starlight water, Which is kind of a random question, and it takes Tamlin off guard too. I looked at the pool of glittering Starlight and let out a heavy breath.

35:28 I needed to change the subject. What would happen if I were to drink the water? Tamlin straightened a bit, then relaxed, as if glad to release that old sadness. Legend claims you'd be happy until your last breath. He added. Perhaps we both need a glass. I don't think that entire pool would be enough for me.

35:43 I said, and he laughed. And then they swam in it. They literally jumped into the starlane swan. The liquid was delightfully warm, and I strode in until it was deep enough to swim out a few strokes and casually tread in place. Not water, but something smoother, thicker. Not oil, but something pure, thinner, like being wrapped in warm silk.

36:04 I was so busy savoring the tug of my fingers through the silvery substance that I didn't notice him until he was treading beside me. And then Farrah describes the water as light, but also she kind of implies it has some healing capabilities. Treading that silky, strange water, I hardly had to put any effort into it.

36:19 The water was so warm, so light, that it felt as if I were floating in air, every ache in my body oozing away into nothing. Other notes in the scene. I actually just have one other one in the scene, and I think only in the scene. Starlight dances in Tamlin's eyes, which is very Reese. He came a step closer, as if forcibly leaving behind the dark, sad stain of what had happened to Lucian, and the Starlight danced in his eyes as he said. What would be enough to make you happy? So in this moment, in this very early book in the series, we get Starlight associated with Tamlin 2, which is interesting. So that's the description that I have of the Starlight pool. Before I get into theories,

36:57 anything that I missed that you would add? I think I have just theories I would probably just add at this point. For me, I really, truly in my heart of hearts, I don't really think this is anything. I think this is something she wrote in the first book and kind of was like, oh, this would be fun, but I don't really think there's any lore attached to it. However, that's not what this podcast is. So we're going to speculate.

37:18 I'm just letting you guys know that I think this could be totally nothing, but we'll speculate. It's fun. I think there's a, there's a couple things that like if, if this were somehow, and again, like I, I think my hypothesis on how Sarah writes at this point is she writes things that could turn into something and decides whether to come back and plug them in as things.

37:37 I think there are things she could choose to plug this in as I think she could also have just been writing the first book in this series and have just not figured it out yet. I don't. Know why people think this is a? Portal. Personally I don't the portal thing. I don't know whether evidence. Like, we've got that Lauren exists.

37:54 I don't know. Yeah. Right. And I mean there are like beasts in the Spring Court and we're not clear where they came from. But I don't this does not match any type of portal we have gotten so far. So I don't know why the portal ideas are there, but we'll talk about what we do have. Yeah. No, nothing in here that I have is that it's a portal. It's no portal.

38:17 All right. So I have an Aquifer focus theory, I have an Asteri focus theory, and then I have a couple WHOO theories that we can talk about. The first theory is an actor focus theory. I think it is, in my opinion, the simplest theory and therefore probably the most likely if anything were to ever actually take hold here because again, this was early.

38:39 She probably didn't have the story fully like fully baked yet. She wrote actor and Akimath in one swoop. And starlet imagery is mostly associated with Reese Reese. So this is, in my opinion, just the simplest to come up with. It's a popular one, but I think it's worth discussing. And it's about relations between Reese's family and Tamlin's family.

38:59 Think we talked about it in maybe our It might have even been our very first Akutar episode. I don't really remember. The punch line of this theory is that the pool of Starlight, possibly the Glen, might have been created by Reese's sister. Here is the underlying rationale. First, the motive for Tamlin's father targeting Reese's mother and sister does not quite like make sense in terms of the gravity.

39:24 Honestly, if it's just because Reese and Tamlin were friends, they had to be either like, very, very good friends, or Tamlin was involved with Reese's sister, or they were just doing more than what was appropriate. Like, were they plotting? Were they like actually in opposition to family's father?

39:41 And the reason I think that is this is a throwback, but Akamai Chapter 45. I befriended him, sought him out whenever I was able to get away from the war camps or court. Maybe it was pity, but I taught him some Illyrian techniques. Did anyone know? He raised his brows, giving a pointed look to my hand. I scowled at him.

39:59 Some song she's she needs to do magic in exchange is what this is getting at. Cassian and Azrael knew, Reese went on. My family knew and disapproved. His eyes were chips of ice, but Tamlin's father was threatened by it, by me, and because he was weaker than both me and Tamlin, he wanted to prove to the world that he wasn't.

40:17 My mother and sister were to travel to the Illyrian war camp to see me. I was supposed to meet them halfway, but I was busy training a new unit and decided to stay. My stomach turned over and over and I wish I had something to lean against, as Reese said. Tamlin's father, brothers, and Tamlin himself set out into the Illyrian wilderness, having heard from Tamlin from me where my mother and sister would be, that I had plans to see them. I was supposed to be there and I wasn't, and they slaughtered my mother and sister.

40:41 Anyway, A couple things here. If Reese and Tamlin were just friends and like Tamlin's father decided no, not OK, I need to demonstrate power and like murder two children and like the wife of another high Lord. Like that's fucking crazy. It's such a stupid move. It's so stupid. Like what did you think the consequences of these actions would be like? Which is why, like, it just feels like something's missing. Yeah, it doesn't make sense.

41:09 Yeah. It feels like something more was going on there. If if Tamlin were involved with Reese's sister, which is a popular theory, it could make sense. One thing that came up in the discord this week that I think should be in omission, honestly, from our Tamlin episode, we really glossed over. I taught him some malaria techniques.

41:25 Yeah, I just thought about that. A wild. Statement until you remember where the Tamlin can fucking shift. So could he have taken an Illyrian form and like learned how to fight like an Illyrian warrior? That would probably really piss off that. 'D be really cool, yeah. Like really piss off his Spring court high Lord father that thinks that you know Reese and Reese's sister probably should have never been born and are like bastard children.

41:50 Especially if he has a. Secret wind power. What could you do with that? Secret wind power and secret wings, right? Yeah. And that if you're seeing your, your son influenced to like take on the form of 1/2 breed that like everybody kind of widely accepted was not what you wanted your son to do, then yeah, maybe I would target all of the half breeds in the night Court royal family to make a statement against my son.

42:14 It just sounds like you're reading it back. You guys know, I'm no lover of Tamlin, but it does seem incredibly out of character for Tamlin to have haunted down Reese's mother and sister. That does not seem like something he would do. I definitely think there's we, we've said this many times. There definitely seems to be more to this story, right? Like this just doesn't seem he is not that cruel. He's he's not that that guy.

42:38 Yeah, yeah, I definitely think something more was going on here. Just like dramatic, like a dramatic reaction to them being friends, Right? Yeah. And then the Glen and the Starlight pool clearly means something very like, important, important to Tamlin. Ocean, who's been around a long time, knows that it means something to him.

42:56 We get this again when Phaera paints it for Tamlin and he's like overcome with emotion. He can't even. He can, like, barely look at it. Tamlin chooses to bring Phaera there right after Amarantha dumps a fairy with its wings cut off on Tamlin's doorstep, which would probably elicit a certain memory, such as one in which the mother and sister of a friend were murdered by his brothers in front of his eyes and had their wings cut off. And the reason that I think if anything, like if there were any like terraforming done by anyone here, it would be Reese's sister, it's because 1 Starlight is linked to Reese in the night, night Court time and time again.

43:33 I'm not even going to pull quotes for this like starry eyes, starry power, Asteria, like you get the drill. But two, I think based on what we know of Reese's lineage, like he's descended from Faye and Celine and women tend to be the ones bearing extreme power. Like we haven't really talked about this much, but his sister was probably very powerful.

43:51 Like his sister was probably quite, quite powerful. We know that Celine could alter. Could tell? Basically, yeah. Yeah. At least at least in Dusk Court. I don't know that she could do that anywhere. Yeah, but but Tamlin seemingly can, right? Because Tamlin. Yeah, he's got this. Yeah. Covers the Pharaoh's room and vines and we also see that with Flynn and Sathya in Crescent City like it is a power.

44:21 So it would be like a nice inter, like, interlocking of their. Yeah. Potential abilities. Yeah. And so maybe it could have just been Tamlin and Reese. Yeah, that's good point. Tamlin says it was his favorite haunt as a boy, which is when he would have been hanging out with Reese and potentially Reese's sister.

44:37 And it would just explain why he was so emotional and chose to come there when he saw a wingless fairy die, but also why he didn't take that painting from Farrah. Like it's not something that he wants to remember. And then finally, this is a little bit of like a loose link. Well, I actually think it's kind of fun.

44:56 Ferris Starfall gown, which Reese's mother made, is like liquid Starlight. Like word for word. Chapter 44 crafted a tiny blue gem so pale they were almost white. It clung to every curve and hollow before draping to the floor and pooling like liquid Starlight. So I think if anything, this is maybe a link between Tamlin and Reese's friendship.

45:16 Tamlin and Reese's sister, maybe. I think that's the simplest based on where we were in Sarah's creation of the story and all of the like points in which that pool came about. That's theory #1 any reactions? I didn't have any thoughts like that, but I like everything you said. OK, a stereo focus theory pretty short. I think there's a possibility that every court has a sort of first light power reservoir and that this is the spring courts. It is a spring.

45:45 We keep calling it a pool of Starlight, but like it's the spring and it's in the spring court. Night court having multiple would make sense, which I think it does because dusk is really its own because it's really two courts own region and Reese is exceptionally powerful. So if he's technically overseeing both, that could make sense. We'll talk more about Ramiel later, but we have Vespers saying that there's power under those mountains. And I would like this because it would mean that we have the potential to find like more power reservoirs. And it it also could explain like how the magic might be regional, even like the fact that this particular power reservoir is like in the Earth,

46:24 like it's spring E Yeah. And then like something about the night and dust power being like underground. Like what else could we find in day and all those? Yeah, so I had a note, but I actually just realized. I'm completely wrong that we have never seen a liquid form of like Starlight before. But that is not actually true because in The Cave of Princess in a Valin, Helena, I guess I'm calling her Helena. Her cave drawings, her cave drawings depicted a river of Starlight, right?

46:56 So. Oh, yeah, you're right. Yeah. So I guess there is no reason we have not seen liquid Starlight since this really. But I guess there is no reason why there can't be liquid Starlight if she's drawing a river of it in her carvings, which I would like to talk about more at some point. And we will. Yeah.

47:15 Crescent City season. Yes. Yeah. So that'd be good. And then Speaking of. Crescent City season, and I want to revisit this later. This whole, this whole like prep for this episode. I was like, I feel like all of my opinions on all of this are going to change, honestly. So like everybody just fucking chill about that.

47:32 But theory #3 I want to talk about the underground waterways. OK, Just bear with me. We'll talk more about this maybe later. But there are underground waterways running from the middle to all of the other courts. And we learn about this in chapter 31 of A Court of Silver Flames. I think we talked about this in our Creatures episode.

47:49 We definitely did, yeah. Ameren says. Warriors were laid to rest in Orid's night black waters. But Orid changed to a place of darkness a long time ago, filled with such evil that no one will venture there, and only the worst of fairies are drawn to it. They say the water there flows to under the mountain, and the creatures who live in the bog have long used its underground waterways to travel through the middle, even into the mountains of surrounding courts. So I think this is probably unlikely, but I think it would be fun.

48:17 What if this Starlight pool is somehow like an outpost like a of Orid of of Orid? And what if these underground waterways are like the Ley lines in Crescent City? Like what if the bog is like a spoiled pool? And like something about these waterways has like, I don't know, some kind of liquid magic going through.

48:40 I mean, we'll talk about the bog at. Least I was. We'll talk about later. I think that's a really interesting idea because we know that the bog changed basically when Fian died, right? But if this is an outpost of it and this was kind of separate. From that is this with a bog? Used to look like before Fian's death. I think that would be interesting. I don't have follow up thoughts on it, but I think be interesting.

49:03 Yeah. And I I regret that we don't have. Like a great picture of what the bog really looks like right before we know Fionn so little you. Know. It's so little also just like so. Little about Fionn in general I. Know I know we will talk about that this. Episode and then crack theory it's described. As silk.

49:22 So like Irenaea, I don't know, our spiders we like spitting silk into or the Karen Kui spitting silk into the pool Starlight. I don't know. So yeah, I agree with you. I think this could very well be actually nothing, but she could come back. She could make it something. What about you? What you have? I had a couple of follow on thoughts. One.

49:42 Of what you didn't really mention at all, but I'll start with the Asteri because we love to talk about the Asteri on this podcast. So we are not told by Celine that any Spring Court Fay come over to Midgard, right? We are not really explicitly told that there is an Asteri presence in what is now the Supreme Court.

50:01 However, as I mentioned, Tristan and Sofia, who knows how you say her name? I'm going to say Sofia. Tristan and Sofia Flynn both seemingly have Spring Court magic. So it does seem like the Asteri probably had some kind of presence in the Supreme Court and some Spring Court Fay probably came over with the fire bringers. I don't know that for sure.

50:22 I'm just pacing that off what we know of the magic here. There are also spring court markers all over Crescent City itself, right? Faye live in a neighborhood called 5 Roses, so we have a lot of rose imagery with Tamlin. We also have in the Faye Archives, the building is covered in flowers. So we have she hurdled past the marble behemoth that was the Faye archives, covered in drooping veils of flowers that ran down as many columns, roses, Jasmine, wisteria, all in perpetual bloom no matter the season. That's spring court magic.

50:56 Like that is the definition of spring court magic right there. So like, I don't know how they did it. I don't know the mechanics of this, but we definitely have spring court magic in Crescent City. So we have this Glen that you read quotes about before. We sat atop a grassy Knoll overlooking a glade of oaks so wide and high they could have been the pillars and Spires of an ancient castle. And then we have out of the corner of my eyes, Tanlin was no more than a glittering golden figure, just a behind a solution sorted, right.

51:23 So like she says, these these trees could have been the pillars of an ancient castle. Like was this basically the Spring Court version of the Asteri palace, whatever that is? I don't really know what that looks like. I don't really know what the Asteri looks like on Prythian. We know that they kind of drink the Lance magic.

51:39 I don't really know how it works. But was this an Asteri palace at one point in time? And as you said, this was kind of like their Starlight reserve maybe. I don't know. And of course, Tamlin does the tithe, which we've talked about being and a steri leftover. So there were definitely a steri here. Here's a totally different out of left field thought about this because this is so spring coated, right? We have the idea of elementals in this series and we haven't really talked about them or touched on them and Prythian at all.

52:08 But this seemed kind of very elemental to me. So we have Rabbath, the Lord of the Western Wind, who we've talked about at Lake, who was mentioned once in 1/4 of Silver Flames. We know nothing about him. And we have the River Queens and the Ocean Queens. The quotes we have are about this is about the River Queens daughter. She glided toward him on bare feet, the chill water coating the floor seemingly not seemingly not bothering her at all.

52:32 She always moved like that, as if she were floating underwater. She had no mayor form, was actually only a was only a fraction mirror. Actually, she was some kind of elemental humanoid, as at home in the open air as she was beneath the surface. Part woman, part river. And then for the River Queen, again, that dismay on her face, she'd do that to one of her own kind.

52:52 Destroy your fins to confine you. She isn't mayor, he said. She's an elemental and yes, she does it to punish mayor all the time. And then we also have, I'm just trying to remember what fucking point I'm getting to as well. We have the Faye from Aurelia who are also described as being more elemental, right?

53:10 That's that's the word that's used. So the quote for that is there were two types of Faye from 2 seemingly unconnected and distance worlds. The new these new Faye bore elemental magic strong enough to make Pelleas worry of them and then look. Ethan said and held out a hand. Ice rolled in his palm.

53:25 A gasp went through the crowd. Even Emily. Amelie, Amelie in shock. Ethan said, letting the ice cross his fingers. Magic, elemental magic. It was lying there dormant in my veins all the time. And then we also have re sang. The Faeon prytheon used to be more elemental, right? So we have this idea of elementals. We have this incredibly spring, like the perfect archetype of spring.

53:51 A spring Glen, a spring glade, a spring pool in the spring court. Was this not? This question kind of gets down to like, what are the elementals? How are they different than the asteri? But do they also have a form of Starlight? And is their Starlight liquid? Like is that, was that what this Starlight is? And is that what this Starlight Glen is? And why it seems so different than every other Starlight manifestation?

54:15 We've never gotten liquid Starlight with the exception of the carvings, right? But we've never actually seen liquid Starlight in the mass first before. So that's my only thought that this somehow ties to the elementals instead of the asteri. But I don't know. I really think this is nothing that's previously mentioned, but it's fun to talk about.

54:33 Could be something, could be nothing and it's. Probably nothing. Yeah, sorry. Yeah, OK, OK, cool. Probably nothing. What? Is so excited. For this one, what is the human city? Ron, I got to tell you, I'm so worried this episode's going. To be 5 hours long, like there's so much to talk. So we know what the human city is.

54:53 I'm not going to get into like real deep details. We know what the human city is. It's under the Moon Palace. It is the former seat of power of the night Court. Now it is Volaris. We'll get into that a bit. And it is a very hell like place. It exists under a mountain, not under the mountain, but under a mountain. It was the inspiration for under the mountain for Amarantha. And there's a lot of scaly clawed imagery and Kier rules it and he, the Dark Bringers live there. And basically the evil, the bad fae kind of choose to live in the Court of Nightmares.

55:26 First thing I want to talk about, right? There's no other. I don't know what the dark bringers are, I. Don't know whether the dark bringers are something else. But when they go there, there's only high Fey, only high Fey, only high Fey, right? So these are like this gummy talk about the dark bringers, obviously. Obviously, we're going to talk about the dark. OK, so the first thing I want to talk about are Celine's cave drawings.

55:50 This mass first. Episode we're going to talk about Celine's cave drawings that Bryce sees as her. Azrael and Nesta are merry. Band of friends are going to the prison. The quotes we have. Are. The last carving before the river had been one of transition. A fae king and queen seated on Thrones, a mountain different from the one with the palace atop it behind them with three stars rising above it. A different Kingdom then some ancient High Lord and Lady Nesta has suggested before approaching the river. I think this is most likely Thea and Feeon, but it could be Celine and her husband who was the first High Lord of Night Court.

56:27 But I think it's most likely that this is Thea and. Fionn I always. Assumed it was Thea and Fionn. So I went back and reread The Cave drawings. Like 3 times and every time I did I came back with a slightly different interpretation of what we were talking about. But I think I think. That this is Thea and Feehan in.

56:49 The Moonstone Palace and the reason I think that is because the bottom half of this painting seems to depict the Hulen city. So what we get for that is she hadn't commented on the lower half of the carving, which depicted A hellscape beneath their Thrones. Some kind of underworld humanoid figures writhed in pain amid what looked like icicles and snapping scaly beasts. Either past enemies conquered or an indication of what failure to bow to the rulers would bring upon the Defiant. And that is Hopefest chapter 14.

57:19 I believe that this is the Moonstone Palace. OK, maybe it's 11. I believe that this is the moon. It was from the like 3. Episodes, yeah, and the Human city, but it's not a. 100% confirmed that that's what this is, but I think that's what this is. What's really interesting to me about these carvings, just right off the bat, as I mentioned Helena's carvings in our last question, in The Cave of Princess in a Vall in, there is no equivalent hellscape, right? So the quote for that is they didn't tell the story that Celine carvings had narrated.

57:50 There was no mention of a slumbering evil beneath their feet, just a river of Starlight shadows the river Starlight into which long ago Faye had apparently dragged those Pegasuses and drowned them. So Prithian has the hellscape beneath it, but Midgard doesn't. Bryce interprets this as the hellscape as being a representation of a warning about Vesperus slumbering beneath their feet, but Celine seemingly did not know about Vesperus, and we do have a literal hellscape in the Hewn City beneath our feet.

58:22 So I don't know that Bryce's interpretation really holds up here. And I think it's really interesting that even though both of these planets have been conquered by a Steri, only one of them has a hellscape underneath it. Right, Like we're getting signs. This is a sign towards hell basically as far as I'm concerned. But let's get into it a little bit. So first question, did Thea and Feeon rule all of Prythian from the Moonstone Palace slash the human city? We know that Thea kept the prison for herself, but did they kind of rule together?

58:52 And did Vesperus also kind of rule together from Or I guess we know Vesperus ruled from the prison, but did Thea and Feon rule from the Hewn city? When Phaera is in the Moonstone Palace, she describes it as fit for an Empress, which is what Thea was right? Thea was an Empress basically. So the quote is the room was fit for an Empress with the marble floors, silks, velvets, and elegant details.

59:13 Only an Empress could have afforded it. That's why I want to live there. I try not to think what Reese's chamber was like if this was how he treated his guests. So like, was this Thea's room maybe? So we can kind of imply that Thea and Feon ruled from Hoon City, Moonstone Palace. I think that's pretty safe bet.

59:29 Not 100%, but that's what I think. We're also told that the Court of Nightmares used to be the seat of power for the Night Court and that Venice switched to Valera. So the quotes we have for that. There was a time when the Night Court was a court of nightmares and was ruled from the Hoon City long ago.

59:44 But an ancient high Lord had a different vision, and rather than allowing the world to see his territory vulnerable at a time of change, he sealed the borders and staged the coup, eliminating the worst of the courtiers and courtiers, courtiers and predators, building Valaris for the dreamers, establishing trade and peace.

1:00:02 That is Akamaf Chapter 29. So like at some point, some high Lord of the night Court came around and said, hey, I don't want to rule from the Court of Nightmares anymore. I want to establish Valaris. Was this the same high Lord who also stopped telling Celine's story and who also decided like, hey, I don't want to. I don't want to have this be part of my history anymore. We're moving to Valaris.

1:00:23 We're. Getting rid of this, I don't want to be associated with Thea. I don't want to be associated with Theon. I don't want to do this anymore. And that kind of makes sense, right? Because if this is where Thea and Theon ruled from, or Thea really, if this is where Thea ruled from, then we moved to Valeris instead. Could also all be bullshit, could all be wrong, right? Because we know that a lot of the history that we get is wrong.

1:00:43 I think the only comment. Is I think it would just have to be like erasure from erasure of Celine, right? Because I think Celine did basically everything she could to erase Thea and Helena. She said she did. She was like, I basically made it so that my mother and sister just faded into the background. Yeah, you're right.

1:00:59 Or nothing. OK, so the same question. It's still important because he stopped passing it down like it was supposed to still be. He carried the story, like the full story, and passed it down to his heir and only his heir. And he could have been the one that said I'm never going to pass it down to my heir again. Yeah, exactly.

1:01:18 I am betting that the. Same person who moved the capital to Valaris is the same person who stopped telling the story. That's my bet. I don't know who it was. Yeah. I mean, it's like. Other politics. We have the steward. Of the Hewn City is legally entitled, entitled to refuse to aid my armies, Reese explained to Nesta to me. It was part of the agreement my ancestor made with the Court of Nightmares all those thousands of years ago. They would remain within that mountain, would not challenge or disturb us beyond its borders, and would retain the right to decide not to assist in the war.

1:01:50 The whole thing is really giving minds of Moria. Also, we have some politics, we have some theories, just trying to decide what we want. All right, so just a little a little background, some key quotes the court of nightmares that lay behind a mammoth set of doors carved into the mountain itself and from the base the mountain rose so high I couldn't see the palace I had once stayed in atop it.

1:02:08 There was no one outside no village, no signs of life, nothing to indicate a whole city of people dwelled within that is Ackerman chapter 42. So again, very very Moria like basically you have no idea from the outside that there is this entire civilization inside it. It was said to inspire Amaranthus creation of under the mountain.

1:02:26 So we have Amaranthus Court had been the the work of a child, the Court of Nightmares was the work of a God, while under the mountain had been a series of halls and rooms and levels. This, this was truly a city. And then we have Moore led me down the avenue toward another set of stone gates thrown open at the base of what looked to be a castle within the mountain, the official seat of the High Lord of Night Court.

1:02:48 Great scaled black beasts were carved into those gates, all coiled together in the nest of claws and fangs, sleeping and fighting, some locked in an endless cycle of devouring each other. So we believe we've we've gone into great depth in this podcast talking about, we believe that these are Dagwan Hounds, the Dagwan.

1:03:04 Hounds that were. Used for the Wild Hunt, right? And they're everywhere. They're absolutely everywhere in the Hewn City. They're on the throne, they're on the pillars. They literally live under the Hewn City, right? They're everywhere. So we're getting a lot of a Steri imagery, but but Bryce calls it a hellscape, right? Bryce calls it a hellscape.

1:03:25 We talked. We read that quote already. Kir and the Dark Bringers are shadow wielders, right? So you've, you've talked to me about this before, But the quotes we get for that are Cassian. I couldn't even spot him beyond the blazing flare of his siphons near the front lines. Crimson glowing amid the vicious shadows of Kir's Dark Bringers as they wielded them to their advantage, blinding swaths of Highburn soldiers and sudden darkness, then blinding them doubly when they ripped those shadows away and left nothing but glaring sunlight left nothing but their awaiting blaze.

1:03:55 And then Helion, Tarquin and Calius struggled to hold our lines. Jury and Tamlin and Baron still battered the northern flank while the Illyrians and Peregrines slam back the Aerial Legion. Kears Dark ringers now little more than whiffs of shadow amid the chaos. That's Aquaar chapter 70 and 71. So we have a hellscape. And we have Faye with shadow powers, which are very hell based powers.

1:04:21 And we have two planets that have been conquered by a Steri, but only one of which has a hellscape beneath it, right? So it's really giving hell. It's also very reminiscent of the city in Hell that Hunt and Bryce visit when they are doing the mind speaking in the Caves of Fallen. So we get the Erie green light illuminated Black Rock carved into pillars and buildings, walkways and temples, ancient and empty. A city hewn into the rocks of hell, right? And then we get, it's like a city of the dead. Hunt murmured, draping a wing around Bryce. Ada's turned from where he stood at the prow, holding in his hands a long pole that he used to guide them. That's because it is.

1:05:04 He gestured with a pale hand to the buildings and temples and Ave. avenues. This is where our beloved dead come to rest, with all the comforts of life around them. That's Hofast chapter 58. And then we also have Ada's classic quote. We might command nightmares, but we are not the monsters, right? This is called the Court of Nightmares, Ada says. We command nightmares.

1:05:24 I mean, it's so. Hell, it's so hell. I don't know what to do with it. I I'm having trouble believing that hell has never been to Prithean when we have a literal hellscape. I think we have ample. Reasons to believe that hell has been to birth the end. Yeah, I mean, So what? But then how does it work like hell? Came here, built this city, and then the Esteri took it over because the Esteri were also clearly here, right? The Esteri were clearly involved. There's Daglin hounds all over the place. Hell also helps though, right?

1:05:59 I mean, I hope we get the back story. I hope, Yeah, I hope we obviously get the back story. We talked about the human city is extremely hell coded. How did hell establish themselves there? I think it's a question of whether it's was before, during or after the events of things exiting to Midgard, right.

1:06:15 I believe and I didn't write this code down and I should have when Ada's offers his support when he says it, he says like, have you come to accept help from hell now at last implying that she has maybe encountered them before. So have they been there like have they been around? Is there history to speak of? And then two, I guess the other option is once they did leave and everything transpired and Celine was there, did Atis Thanatos like keep looking after Prithean? I don't.

1:06:51 Know was atis at the blood, right? Like it's really seeming like they did. It's seeming like they are basically guardian angels. Of Prithean guardian hell. Guardian demons. Yeah. Guardian demons yeah. There is a Lord Thanatos in the human city as we speak I mean and you've also even got you've got here and like his line and more all look like Atus and Napoleon.

1:07:13 The human city. I don't know if you pick this up, but like, when they're there, for some reason, Reese is freezing. When they're there, he is icy multiple times when they first go. And that scene that everyone loves, including myself and Farah is playing the role of, Oh yeah, he's freezing. He's freezing. When he's freezing, his fingers were. Icy on my chin as he lifted my face. Cold.

1:07:36 His hands were so cold I almost yelped. He must have felt the silent flinch. A heartbeat later, his hands had warmed. He had to warm himself with magic. He's freezing when he's there. And then when they go back and act warm when she sits down on the throne, it was bitingly cold. It's freezing. Yeah. Anything.

1:07:55 They anything she touches there. Including Reese is freezing men. Hell is cold. Obviously hell is cold. Yeah, I mean the. The Dark Bringers. I think the question for me is, are the dark bringers and the hounds the the like the scaly, the black scaly things also seem quite valid and I'm I'm convinced that they're the same, but not everyone is convinced that they're the same.

1:08:22 And the shadows and the hounds are pretty valk looking as well. Kira himself is a shadow wielder right? So that is also of note everything that the Esteri made in. Prythian is very valk, right? These Daglin hounds are very Valk. The Illyrians have. Oh, a lot of you guys called this out too. I'm sorry if we admitted this.

1:08:44 We totally think that the Wyvern wings are also a possibility for the Illyrians. Like I maybe we didn't mention that, but like there's that bonus chapter where Ember calls them dragon wings, which I think is totally fair. Of course. Yeah, right. So we have the potential dragon wings on the Illyrians.

1:09:00 Like everything on Prythean that the Esteri supposedly made is really, really Valg. And even the one Esteri that we get on Prythean bleeds fucking black, Right. And then on Midgard, it's not on Midgard. We have angels with feathers. I mean, I know we have the peregrines and the I don't remember the other ones.

1:09:22 I know we have those two other types of yeah, Seraphim. I know we have those two other types of winged creatures. We don't know if the asteri made them good bet that they did. But yeah, it's it's interesting that the things that the asteri make on Midgard are not quite as hell coated seemingly. I don't know, like did they really make the Daglin hounds or did they just Co opt them? Did that?

1:09:43 Did hell actually make them? And then the asteri, we're like, oh, we can control these. Yeah. And I think it's is. Understandable that we have more confusion on Pythian because of the obvious commingling that we know for a fact happened. We don't actually have any definitive proof. That Hal has been to Pythian except for the one line mention of Thanatos.

1:10:07 One line mention of Thanatos. I'm willing to. Bet it I'm certainly. Willing to put money on it, but I don't think we have any confirmation. Yeah. I mean, I guess, yeah, the only overlap we have is that. Like it was Faye's home and this was her mate. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That is pretty much all we have. I find it extremely hard to believe. That hell is not connected to the human city in some way, especially since that I like, I very much accept that carving to be the court of the court of nightmares at Hellscape. And it is described as a hellscape. Yeah. 1L by Bryce.

1:10:43 Like she looks at it and she's like, that's hell by someone who knows what hell is meant to look like. But yeah, we we have a direct connection between those hounds and the Daglin who were said to be the Asteri by Amarin. And we have a trustworthy source, but there. You have it. This is. Actually one of the only times we see this but.

1:11:02 When Reese goes to the huge city, this is our favorite Akama. Chapter 42 says no wings, no weapons, no sign of the warrior, nothing but the elegant, cruel high Lord the world world believed him to be. His hands were in his pockets, his black tunic seeming to gobble up the light. And on his head set a crown of stars. That's vast versus crown.

1:11:21 We know that's vast versus crown, right? So he's wearing an Asteri crown in this court, which may be a hellscape, but maybe was made by the Asteri. But like, we don't really have I and this is not our Crescent City season, so correct me if I'm wrong. With the exception of the catacombs under the Crystal Palace, we don't have this underground network in Midgard that we have and the, and the caves of which we know that Helena carved out. But like, I don't think we have this like underground thing as much in Midgard.

1:11:54 I could be wrong about that. It's been a minute, but we just have the. We just have the. Ley lines and the sewer, that the crystal, the sewer, yeah, Yeah, that's it. Yeah, Yeah. I think the only other thing. That's maybe. Worth mentioning is the concept that perhaps they have been on the same world at some point and this could be potentially one of those worlds. Yeah, they being hell and hell and the story. Yeah, Yep.

1:12:22 OK. All right. Anything else? I mean I had a lot but like not. So much that's worth saying, I think to pan through. There are. I don't have much to say about this, but I'm just going to say it. There are vines of Jasmine and moon flowers in the Hewn City. How do they survive? How do they grow?

1:12:41 Why are they there? I don't know. But we do have vegetation and growth. It's kind of giving Persephone vibes in the Hewn City. So there are moon flowers there and Farrah does look at but I have. I still haven't decided. Whether I make? Theories of this or not, but Pharaoh will like look at things and decide that she's going to paint it and decide what she's going to call it at random points when she looks at the human city and the entry gates, she decides that she's going to call the painting the gates of eternity for whatever reason. So what's interesting about that to me, in the spirit of this, a Steri versus hell debate is the gates of eternity is what you would typically call the gates

1:13:24 to heaven, right? Not the gates to hell, but this is looking like hell, so that's interesting and and the city that the. Esteri rule from in Pandura is the eternal city if I'm not wrong. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It is the Eternal City, Yes. I mean, we talked about the Dark Bringers. I think the only thing that was worth noting there is, like, we do not have tons to go off of as far as exactly what they are and what they do. They just fight with shadows and they're like clean, neat fighters.

1:13:55 Where do they come from? Who are they? Are they high Faye that just have shadow powers? Like we don't actually know. We don't know any fear of them because. He also wield. Shadows. We we have no, we have very, very little description of the dark. Fingers, right? Because we are told that Reese's dad, like, prized having Azrael because he was a shadow singer.

1:14:19 And being a shadow singer is so rare. And then it turns out there's an entire court in the Night Court that just can wield shadows. And I'm not clear how that's different than being a shadow singer. But I mean, there has to be a difference, right? I imagine. It's something related to the shadows actually speaking to you and you speaking to them.

1:14:39 And we know the interesting Rune and Cormac have different shadows too. Like, we do know that, but yeah, right. Yeah, like, but yeah. Does Azrael have a connection? To these dark bringers, I like, I don't know, I think it's interesting. And then we already talked about the parallels with the the fact that everything that Pharaoh touches is freezing in the heating city, which I also thought was of note.

1:15:00 I do think that's of note and it's hewn. It's cartoon. I was. Just was just thinking. About if when Adis shows up as a cat, we don't really know because we we never actually see Adis as a cat, but like, if he's really cold to the touch, but we actually really only get it as a flashback. And then Bryce kind of sees Adis as a cat when she's falling asleep. But it's one of those we don't really know what's going on situations.

1:15:22 Yeah, yeah, one interesting. It's not related to the human city, but. I like didn't internalize until we did research for this. So the fact that the human city is basically like its own district, like Kier can technically refuse his forces, The fact that that has happened twice, twice, two different wars, What the?

1:15:43 Fuck were those? Wars. Which wars And like, why were they refused and. Also, who made that? Arrangement like yeah, these are back stories that I or questions that I want the back story of. Yeah, I agree. She really just likes to. Toss. She likes to toss those in there and. I read them for the 11th time and I'm like, oh I should be asking these questions.

1:16:02 Give us the spin off about these wars. Sarah OK. All right, Next we have some big one under the. Mountain and the. Middle yeah, I would literally done a whole. Episode I think, just about. Yeah, but that's OK. Yeah, I will. I will say. I want to talk about this again. I think we're going to talk about it again. So I will keep it like I'll try to keep it reasonably sized and then we can always come back to it. We are introduced obviously to under the Mountain first as Amaranthus Stronghold, and it is in the middle. That's what we're talking about here. It is basically it's neutral territory. And we know that it's a former Asteri playground, right? So let's talk about the mountain first. Like let's start with the actual

1:16:41 mountain because there are three sacred mountains in Prythian. The mountain, this mountain which mysteriously does not have a fucking name. Like it's just the mountain Ramiel. And then the mountain that the prison is built under, which also doesn't really have a specific is that one called sacred.

1:16:55 So the let me. Get the quote. Eris, Eris, and of course, the Silver Flames. Chapter 62 Eris, who knows things that he shouldn't says there are three of them, you know, sister peaks. This one the mountain called the prison and the one the Illyrian roots call Ramiel. All bald, barren mountains at odds with those around them. That's the paragraph right after the sacred mountain, the mountain under which Pharaoh Reese and all the other high Lords have been trapped by Amarantha. It rose like a wave on the horizon. So they're at, they're near the mountain. So immediately we I at least I'm thinking about how the mountain relates to Romiel, which is a sacred mountain to the Illyrians and has this like magical

1:17:39 monolith coming out of it kind of thrums with power, but we don't really know its exact significance yet. And then the prison which we know harbors a core of first light and had a sleeping Esteri underneath it. These are the sister peaks that we are working with. The mountain itself, the under the mountain mountain is this like barren? It's described as a barren terrible lone peak in the center of Pythian.

1:18:01 They're all bald and lifeless looking, which is interesting considering they are all powerful seemingly. And Rhys calls it one sacred and acotar. I assume this is because it's been kind of corrupted by Amarantha and under the mountain is kind of the the central peak in Prythian, so there are shortcuts to it from all these other places. Fair is able to get there from the Spring Court through a cave shortcut.

1:18:26 We know that there are other ancient shortcuts from other places as well. Ancient. Who put them there? We don't know. I assumed that it was the Esteri. Somebody left a hilarious comment. I didn't write it down so I'm sorry. But it was these wormholes which are hilarious, yes. So when Farah is under the mountain, Under the mountain is Hewn as well, but nowhere near the level of the Hewn city, right? Reese does say the Amaranth are very much modeled it after the Night Court, and because we just read it, we strode through two ancient enormous stone doors, taller than Tamlin's Manor, and into a Vash chamber carved from the pale from pale rock, upheld by countless carved pillars.

1:19:08 That small part of me that had again become trivial and useless noted that the carvings weren't just ornate carvings, but actually depicted fairies and high Fey and animals in various environments and states of movement. Countless stories of Pythian were etched on to them. Chandeliers of jewels hung between the pillars, standing the marble floor with color here with hi Fay.

1:19:27 So it's like a very, very similar description to the human city. And of course, Farrah draws a direct comparison, says the human city is much more ornately done. But like, those descriptions, to me feel like Sarah kind of took it and said, OK, we're going to change a little here, embellish a little there.

1:19:46 And the description is also, I don't know if you felt this way, kind of reminiscent of the library in the night Court, which is, of course, also close to the human city. And there are also carvings in all of these mountains, which reminds me of the caves underneath the human city and the prison. Yeah.

1:20:03 Under. The mountain When Amarantha. Is there there's specific people that are allowed to be there with her, but not everybody is allowed to be there with her, right? We learned that the midden guard worm lives there as well. Had tunnels and a layer under the mountain. It's plug for creatures of Prythian episode. You should check out that as well. So that's the mountain, and under the mountain it is another carved palace under a mountain.

1:20:28 The worm is literally there. We have talked about how there have been references to things carved out by great digging beasts. You know that the word is a great digging beast. It looks like these things have been carved out of the mountains. Clearly they have, right? Clearly they've been carved out under the mountain is in the middle.

1:20:44 The middle is a very interesting wild, neutral place. We've talked a little bit about the middle here, but I couldn't find an episode where we went like super deep. So this is the episode recap here. It divides. The solar and the seasonal courts, right? So everything north of the middle is a solar court, dawn, day and night, and everything South of the middle is a seasonal court, winter, summer, autumn, spring. So there are literally different types of power north of the middle versus South of the middle. You should remember that.

1:21:14 And it is a neutral territory. In ACOTAR, we learned that the land in the middle kind of like dies and changes, or at least the bog kind of dies and changes when Fionn dies, which is interesting and infuriating because we know nothing about Fionn's power or what he was or who he was or what his link to the middle could have been. But we know that something about the middle changed with his death, and what the middle was before that we don't really know.

1:21:40 But now, in like present ACOTAR, it is a wild place. So Reese says. In the heart of Prythian there's a large empty territory that divides the North and South. At the center of it is our sacred mountain that's under the mountain, this forest and the Weaver of the woods forest is on the eastern edge of that neutral territory.

1:21:58 Here there's no high Lord here. The law is made by who is strongest, meanest, most cunning, and the Weaver of the woods at the top of their food chain. The middle is the home to several otherworldly notable things that we should probably talk about. Striga probably being like one of the less significant ones.

1:22:14 Well, not the less significant, but like the bog is definitely the most significant in my opinion. It's the home to Striga, who is now gone. I'm not going to say dead, but she's somewhere. What? I just had to put some things. Together, but keep going. Do you want to say it? Sure, I'll just go. For it, you talked about the worm. Being under the mountain, there's almost certainly a core first light under the mountain based on the fact that the worm is there, right.

1:22:38 Like the question is, is it still there? Yeah, the. Question is totally is it still there but we have. The bone Carver in the prison over a core of First Light. We have Shriga in the middle near the mountain, which is a core of First Light. When Azrael goes to Cochet's Lake, he says this place feels like the middle, reminds me of the middle.

1:23:00 So now we have three of our death gods in seemingly First Light core. Heavy thinned places potentially. I don't know anything about Cochet's. Like, it's definitely misty. I'm pretty sure it was certainly misty there, Yeah. Which that's not a coincidence. I don't, yeah. It's feeling like that Fey. Warrior used that somehow to to trap them. Trap them?

1:23:22 I don't know. That's speculation, obviously. Wild speculation. Well, keep going. Sorry, that idea just occurred to me and I. Had to get it out, Yeah, but they are. They're all. Centered around something like that. And that also begs the question, what the fuck is under Romiel? Yeah, Srika. Scott is under. Romiel too, but yeah.

1:23:39 Keep going. Yeah. Who? Who is? It was something wrong. Srika was trapped by that long ago fae warrior and confined to the middle. So she's in the middle. She was in the middle along with all of her antiquities. The bog of Orid is in the middle, which is also where the mask was found. We do not know how it got there definitively.

1:24:00 The kelpie were also there, a whole bunch of creatures like, yeah, so many creatures. And it's it's said, right? I'm not going to quote kill us here, but it is said that creatures that were left kind of roaming, these otherworldly creatures fled to the middle so that the middle would basically defend them because the middle has this wild, unchecked magic that nobody can really contend with.

1:24:23 Well, we're also told it was in a Steri game park. We are told it's it's in a Steri game park like. Kathy doesn't know that, says that fled to know. Yeah, the. Cereal was in the middle when Elaine was looking for it, and it died there at the hands. Of I anthe that. Bitch, it is said to be where the Wild Hunt of the Daglin Warriors took place.

1:24:49 So a steri game ground. Like that's where all of the creatures were, that's where the wild Hunt occurred. And Vespers says that it's a land for creatures like her. It is a land for the unwanted, she says. Actually it's just said multiple times that it's a land for the unwanted. Both by her in Ho fast chapter 25. They have a place in this land for creatures like me the unwanted it is called the middle. I have dreamt of it, seen it in seen it in my long slumber and then in 1/4 silver flame.

1:25:17 Actually think that's a really. Interesting quote, right? That means Vesperous. She doesn't know about it. She doesn't know about it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't know what that means. Yeah, we will get to that. We will definitely. Get to that, but also in in 1/4 Silver Flames chapter 32, it's also called A Place for the Unwanted by our gang the Inner. Circle Gang, Yeah.

1:25:43 And this is sorry, this is the. Quote where all of that. Comes out so the middle lies under no high Lords jurisdiction. It's long been the dumping ground for any unwanteds. And this part is is interesting. Not the prison. Their crimes are one of nature. A kelpie is designed to lure and kill, just as a wolf is designed to hunt and pray. The middle keeps them separate from us without punishing them for what they were made to be.

1:26:07 No one will come rid the world of them. The middle is full of primal magic. It has its own rules and laws. Hunt the kelpies or light singers without provocation and you might find yourself trapped there. So basically they're saying the middle is where we put creatures that haven't done anything wrong. They just like probably shouldn't exist. Like they're doing what they do.

1:26:26 They're doing what they were made to do, which is basically like the hysteria created them to be these like depraved beings, and we just shove them into the middle. Basically. If you look at the middle on a map, it's obviously the middle. It's called the middle. We have a bunch of Asteri stuff there, and we know that the Asteri ruled Prythian Once Upon a time.

1:26:44 The only Asteri that we know of in Prythian is Vesperous. But also, if you look at geographically exactly like you just said, if you look at geographically where the middle is, it would make sense that the middle was a place where a ruling seat was, right? It is central, like it's central to everything and it was clearly a place where the Esteri were present. We found like a mask of a long forgotten king. In the middle there is a quote from Aris that he says the tunnels.

1:27:14 Amarantha basically came in and decorated, but the tunnels under the mountain far predated Amarantha, basically. Yeah, Yeah. So it would make. Sense for the middle to be a place where the Asteri were, where the Asteri ruled. But Vesperus describes it as a place for the unwanteds. So whether she's just describing it as that because she has been asleep and seen that this is what it's become, or whether she actually didn't know what the middle was when it was the middle like that.

1:27:47 If the latter, then I don't really know what the Asteri ruling structure was when they were on Pythian because I assume, I do assume the Vespers was not the only one right, that was in power. Like I assume that was the case. But I also assumed that there was somebody or multiple Asteri that were ruling from the palace on the mountain.

1:28:09 Like I do think that was probably the case in Celine's carvings. There are multiple. Esteri Yeah, yeah. So yeah, couple more things. According to Reese, at some point in the. Past an ancient Council of High Lords decided that the middle was never going to be mapped. Why? Why? Like why? The why that he gives. Right is it is forbidden to map beyond vague landmarks. We respect it as its own entity and don't wish to provoke its wrath by revealing its mysteries. Who was the ancient council of high Lords? Like were these the first high Lords ever? What is mapping the middle actually do that's a problem? Like is this the underground waterways? Are there magical Ley lines?

1:28:54 Are there massive power sources that they're trying to hide that are like reasons that Prythian has power and is still alive? I don't know. It's it's feeling like that that don't map. The middle command. And the fact that it still persists is something that's going to come back. I totally agree.

1:29:12 I totally agree. There's a. Lot of mention and I can kind of go through it in more detail, but there is a lot of mention of the magic in the middle being different and being primal and not being the same everywhere else. Which raises a lot of questions when you think about the idea of the Esteri feeding off the land and also giving back to the land, right?

1:29:32 Like why is this magic different? What is different about it? Why is this the dividing line between the solar courts and seasonal courts? Like this land feels different to me. It feels like not of Prythian. The core question for me is what was the middle? Before it was the middle. Why is the magic different? And why is it the border between 2 completely different types of magic?

1:29:53 Yeah. So I had to. I do think it is fair to. Assume that this was an Asteri palace. We have the ornate carvings we had like we had in the Hewn City. We have that depiction of Thea and Theon seemingly ruling from the Moonstone Palace and the Hewn City. We also have. I skipped this. I actually moved the I answered the questions in different order, so I meant to mention this earlier, but I didn't.

1:30:15 We have in Celine's video this idea of the Asteri keeping things underground. Right? So we have. But Bryce could only watch as the vision showed Thea's hand snatching the objects from black pedestals, spiriting them away from the subterranean mountain holds where they were kept, using cave archways to move swiftly across the lands. I think that's confirmation that the items of the trove were kept.

1:30:41 And isn't it interesting that there are four items of the Trove, but we only have three sacred mountains right now? But maybe not really, right, But that the four items of the trove were kept in different subterranean mountain holds, right? Like I think that's pretty much confirmation like this is this is a dairy subterranean mountain holds my bet on the 4th 1 is the library by the way.

1:31:00 Maybe not, I don't know. So basically I think it's a fair bet to assume that because the Mittagard worm is there, there is some kind of first light somewhere in the middle, whether that's directly under the mountain or somewhere nearby. I think that's fair. We also know, we are told in book one, this mountain feels really, I know Romeo, we're getting set up for Romeo being like, really important, but this mountain actually feels like the most important one to me.

1:31:25 Alice tells us in Book 1, all dark and miserable roads lead under the mountain. So literally every pathway that the Esteri made leads under the mountain, under the mountain. Right. And we have the same idea with the waterways that you were mentioning. Like the waterways come out from the middle.

1:31:40 It's like, it's like everything stems from the middle. I want to talk about the Yeah, so I want to talk about the primal magic. Right, so that quote you read, it's forbidden to map the Middle beyond vague landmarks. He pointed to the sacred mountain in its center, where he'd been held for nearly 50 years.

1:31:57 The mountain, the woods, the bog, all can be seen from land and air. But it's secrets, those discovered on foot, those are forbidden. Ferris frowned. Didn't lighten by whom? An ancient council of high Lords. The Middle is a place where wild magic still dwells and thrives and feeds. This wild magic sounds a lot like what Lanthus was talking about, right?

1:32:17 So the quote we get for that is, we shall rebuild to what we were before. The Golden Legions of the Fake cast off their chains and overthrew us. We shall resurrect the Wild Hunt and ride rampant through the night. We shall build palaces of ice and flame, palaces of darkness and Starlight. Magic shall flow untethered again.

1:32:35 And Favor describes the middle as feeling older and more aware than any place she's ever been. Like it feels like the magic in the middle is this wild magic that Lanthus was talking about. I don't know why it would be, actually. I do have some thoughts on why it would be. I'll get to that later. So I want to talk about the bog for a minute. So to go along with this idea of there being a sacred mountain, we are told that Orid was also once a sacred place. So what Amarin says is Orid was once a sacred place. Warriors were laid to rest in its night black waters, but Orid changed to a place of darkness.

1:33:10 Don't give me that look for sand. You know what I mean? A long time ago, filled with such evil that no one will venture there and only the worst fairies are drawn to it. They say the water they're flows to under the mountain and the creatures who live in the bog have long used its underground waterways to travel through the middle, even its mountains of surrounding courts.

1:33:27 So that's the beginning part of what what you mentioned before we get in the bog. Heavy air, no wind missed. We absolutely 100% have missed in the bog. We have Nesta saying. Orange stretched before them. She had never seen a place so dead, a place that made the still human part of her recoil, whispering that it was wrong, wrong, wrong to be here. Even the cauldrons water hadn't been as solidly black as the water here, as if it were made of ink. In the shallows mere feet away, where the water met the grass, not one blade was visible.

1:33:59 Where the surface touched it, dead trees, Gray with Asian weather, jutted like broken lances of 1000 soldiers, some draped with curtains of Moss. No leaves, no leaves clung from their branches. Most of the branches have been cracked off, leading jagged Spears extending from the trunks. The tangle of thorns were a mockery of what might have been, as if Orid had ever produced roses. Not a single flower bloomed.

1:34:22 So that's what Orid is like now, in Hofast, House of Flame and Shadows. We have, and this is all we have. This is literally all we have. This is what Brownie was referencing before the image shifted to some sort of marsh. A bog. Theon Rd. A horse between the islands of grass bow at the ready as he ducked beneath.

1:34:39 Trees in bloom. So these trees were in blue. We still have these trees, but now they are jagged thorns and Spears. When Theon was there, they were trees in bloom. My parents often went hunting in the vast slice of land the Daglin had kept for their private game park, but they had crafted terrible monsters to serve as worthy prey. It was there he met his death.

1:34:59 A dark haired, a dark haired pale creature that could have been the relative of the Knock and Jessica's gallery dragged a bound and gagged Fee on into the inky depths of the bog. The once proud king screaming as he went under. Petals began falling from the trees, leaves with them, birds took flight as if sudden winter gripped the bog, as if the land had died with his king. We, we have a couple.

1:35:21 We have one other instance of this on Prithean, but I want to talk about a Fallen because the way that this is described, it's very similar. Nesta saying it's wrong, wrong, wrong is actually really similar to what the Flynn siblings say about a Fallen with their Earth magic, right? So what they say is. No, Flynn said.

1:35:41 Gravely shaking his head. I told you my magic hates this place. What do you mean? Bryce asked, peering at him over his shoulder. Flynn shrugged. The earth feels rotted, like there's nothing for my magic to grab onto or identify with. It's weird. It bothered me the first time we were here too, right? And we know with Eval and we had the same thing. We have a once beautiful island archipelago. We have, We had life.

1:36:02 And then Helena hit a core first light underneath her, underneath Eval, and we get an explanation. I'll read that in a second, but basically what happens is like the land dies to keep, to keep this power contained, right? So the quote we have for that, this is from Lydia. This is when after Bryce and Hunt come back from talking to the Princess of Hell.

1:36:21 And Bryce is like, I don't know where this last final third of the first light of the Starlight core power would be. Lydia says. I think it's part of the land and the very bones of Evalin. Bryce and Athlar raised their eyebrows, but Rune glanced to Lydia and nodded. And explains a lot. Bryce cut in.

1:36:37 Like why Evalin was once part of an archipelago but now it's only 1 island? Rune said. You said Helena drew upon a ball and sleigh lines to contain her mother's star to hide it here, right? I think doing so drained all the lanes, Matt, all the Land's magic from the sleigh lines and repurposed it to engage Thea's power and made the land wither. Just as you said, Celine's own lands withered around the prison while it held her share of power. So we have this with the prison too, right? So I think we have a couple things going on here. We have what seems to be a first light core. We have a misty place, we have Feon dying, and we have the land withering when Feon dies, right?

1:37:15 So like, we don't know anything about Feon. What power could be contained within Feon? What power made him High King? Right? Did some power die with Theon? And as our discord has pointed out, a bog essentially mummifies you. So like, his body, in theory is still there. Like, is the did the land die because it is trying to contain whatever immense power is in Theon's body?

1:37:40 Yeah, I don't know, I'm throwing shit at the wall here. But like this is kind of this is kind of the only other place we'd get it, except, except we're back to the Valkyries, the Golian Mountains where the Valkyries died. This has seemingly happened to as well. So we have the quote again. This is from Amarin.

1:37:57 I liked those females. Never let a male boss them around, though I could have done without their foolish King Cassian then says it had taken him a long, long time to get over that battle. He'd never been back to that pass in the Golian Mountains. But rumor claimed it's rocks remained barren, as if the earth still mourn the females who'd given their lives with no visitation, who had laughed at death and embraced life so fully.

1:38:18 I have no idea where this is. We have such little context about this, but it is so similar to what happened to Theon. Yeah. Is it the Earth Morning or is it some kind of with some kind of power buried with the Valkyries too? Like, I don't know. But in the Mass for so far, when the land has died, with the exception of the waste, maybe a witch has cursed this, I don't know. But what there are supposed to be witches in Oreid. This is this is what dead land means. It means there's immense power buried under the land. So I do think we have a core of First Light. I do think we have primal magic that is different than every other court.

1:38:54 And I also think we have something going on with Fion and Fion's body and the magic that could be contained within Fion's body. And I think it's a thin place. I think that goes without saying. Like it's misty, it's a thin. Of course it's a thin. Place, I guess the question on Fion is like would I think?

1:39:12 I think it's really interesting and it also makes me kind of wonder whether the other first like course came from an extremely powerful beings death. Well, I do think there's a difference here. I think there's a difference. Between first light cores and the Starlight power, I do think those things are different like because yeah, right, Bryce claims the Starlight power in the prison, but she doesn't claim the first light core, right.

1:39:35 But she could absorb the first light core. Definitely, definitely yes, yeah, I guess if it's if it's from a dead. Person it would be second light but my question was would in fiance case if there's a core of first light under the mountain it would not in theory kill the middle it would just kill I don't think so which it has the mountain. Has.

1:39:56 Yeah, so there's still a core of First Light under basically all of these mountains because all of them are dead. Romeo's Baron too. I'm pretty Romeo is Baron. I'm thinking about the Asteri. Palace in the Eternal City. I don't know if the land around it is dead. I don't know if a core of First Light does the same thing as a as a like Starlight as a star basically, but it might.

1:40:15 It's very confusing. They're very similar things, but Bryce takes firstly the the third of Thea star leaves the core of first light in the. Prison, yeah. So this I think this is what is confusing. There is a core of first light in the prison and there is 1/3 of Thea star of the prison. She takes the third of Thea star but she leaves the core of first light because she knows if she grabs the core of first light all of the inmates would be released. But she also knows if she takes that core of first light then the prison would be returned to its former state. Which is why I'm saying I think it has to be really to the core of first light because she took they as light and the prison is still dead and the prison is

1:40:54 still dead. I think you are right, but what's confusing is in a volin it's not a core of first light. It is 1/3 of Thea * and she takes that and the island comes back. So I think basically it's whenever you are storing great magic. When you are storing great magic, the Ley lines. The explanation that Lydia gave gives us is that the Ley lines basically redirect to keep this power stored and it drains the land of all other magic. So there needs to be no first.

1:41:25 Light core and nor no Starlight neither for the land to have for the normal amount of. Magic Restore, but it's yeah, it's so. Interesting though, because the Bo middle is not what I would describe as dead. No, I mean that the Weaver's Cottage certainly has. Matter. So maybe it's just the bog. We don't really know how it works, right?

1:41:47 Like we don't really know the boundaries of the magic. Yeah. And I could be wrong. This is all a theory. Yeah, totally be wrong. Yeah. Yeah, because my last point was the one that was just like, messy. What? Like what was Fionn and what was his powers Link to the middle? Why did the middle die with him?

1:42:05 Is he still there? Yeah, I yeah. Why did the land die with this? Right? Yeah. Did the middle, did the bog die? Would. Anywhere have died Where Fionn died is kind of my question. I don't know. And also does that link Fionn? To the middle, I guess he was high king of all of Prythian. But to your comment at the beginning of this section, you were talking about Fionn ruling from potentially the Moonstone Palace with Thea.

1:42:33 Yeah. Could he have been ruling from under the mountain? He was high king of everything. Yeah, I don't know. OK, the last. Thing I have. We already talked about it, but it is so interesting to me. Fast versus line about the middle is so fucking interesting. Like they have a place in this land for creatures like me, the unwanted. It is called the middle.

1:42:56 I've dreamt of it. Seen it long in my slumber. She's never been there. She knows what it's called, but only because of her dreams. She doesn't know what it is. Seemingly in a steri palace, though. So, like, what's going on here? I don't know. I don't know. Was it called something else? Did it look different when she was around?

1:43:13 Like, yeah, I don't know. Much to ponder there. Much to ponder? No idea. Yeah, I also felt like she was maybe lying out of her. She could have been lying. Because, well, I'm more saying. Because if like. If you had let Vesperus loose in the middle, she's getting every. She wants to go to the middle.

1:43:31 Yeah, yeah. There's a core feeling like everybody in the middle because they are her plaything. Yeah, she made them, Yeah. I just. I really think, yeah, so. I the last bonus thing I had was Azrael said Cochet's Lake reminds him of the middle. I do not think it's a coincidence that our deaf gods are aligning on these thin places.

1:43:51 Core first light places, seemingly. I mean, Cochet's Lake is misty up the wazoo, so certainly. Yeah. OK. All right. Oh, my God. I have. To answer this. Question. Yeah, I have. I have the most. Notes for this one, hilariously. All right. What is Ramiel? What the fuck is going on with Ramiel? All right? Let's talk about it.

1:44:11 So what we learn in ACOTAR, Ramiel also called a sacred mountain. Not a coincidence, I don't think. I don't know if he'll a sterry made it sacred. I don't know if they were sacred before. I don't really know what the deal is with calling at least two of these places sacred mountains, but clearly a pattern we're getting here.

1:44:29 There are a lot of strange creatures in the Illyrian mountains. I want to call out one thing really interesting here. So the quotes we have most high Fay believe the Illyrians were the greatest menace in these mountains. They didn't realize that far worse things prowled between the peaks. Some of them hunting on the winds, some crawling out from deep caverns in the rocks itself.

1:44:48 Are the ones that hunt on the winds Wyvern? Do we have Wyvern in this world? And no one knows because they're just up in Illyria? Like what else is hunting on the winds? I realized many other things could have wings, but I thought that was a potential Wyvern clue, which would be really fun. That's in Frosted Starlight chapter 3. That'd be great.

1:45:04 No one is allowed on Romeo except during the blood, right? Feels a lot like no one's allowed to map the middle feels very similar. Feels like the same people were making these rules. It feels different, we are told. It feels different than the sacred mountain in the middle, which I do think is important and I don't have an answer about. So what Cassian says.

1:45:21 Is Cassian sore toward it, unable to resist Romeo's ancient summons? Different. The mountain was so different from the barren presence of the Lone Peak in the center of Prythian. Ramiel had always felt alive somehow, awake and watchful. So we're getting clues that these are different things. Even though Ramiel seems very steri coded.

1:45:42 We're getting clues that or maybe under the maybe under the mountain isn't a steri, I don't know. But we're getting clues that these are both ancient, powerful, terrible things, but not the same thing. We are told that the first ruler of the Night Court made it. The Night Court's insignias quote we have is no wonder that first ruler of the Night Court had made it his Insignia, along with the three stars that only appeared for a brief window each year, framing the uppermost peak of Ramiel like a crown.

1:46:07 It was during that window when the right occurred. Which had come first, the Insignia or the right? Cassia didn't know. He had never really cared to find out. This is Celine's husband, right? This is Celine's husband, we are told. We know that the no matter what, we know this mountain was important to the Esteri. We'll get into that later, but we know that this mountain served a purpose for the Esteri.

1:46:26 Why would Celine's husband make this the Night Court Insignia? Like what? What was he trying to do, making such an asteri thing when Celine desperately wanted everyone to forget about the asteri, the Insignia of his court? Like was he trying to hide it in plain sight or was he trying to tell people something? I don't know, I don't have an answer. Good theory on that all.

1:46:47 Right, Ramiel itself. We'll talk about the Onyx Monolith. It has an Onyx monolith on top of it. All right? So the goal of the blood, right is to touch the Onyx Monolith. The quote we have for that is. He'd only set foot on it once, on that final day of the right, when he and his brothers, bloodied and battered, had scaled its side to reach the Onyx monolith at its summit. He could still feel the crumbling rock beneath his boots.

1:47:10 Blah, blah, blah, blah blah blah, I don't care. As one, the three of them had touched the stone, the first to reach its peak at the end of that week at the uncontested winner. So we have an honest monolith at the peak. No one knows who puts the monolith there, but it's and Ramiel and the mountain in the middle. By the way, we didn't touch on this, but there is a quote about the mountain in the middle being immune to the weather. The weather does not touch it.

1:47:32 So we have. Who had put the stone atop the peak? He didn't know. Legend said it has existed before the Night Court formed, before the Illyrians migrated from the Murmidons, before humans had even walked the earth. Even with fresh snow, crusting, crusting Ramiel, none had touched the pillar of stone. And then we have later.

1:47:49 That's in for us in Starlight Chapter 3. In Silver Flames Chapter 68, we have. Gwynn studied Romeo's craggy, unforgiving slope. Not much snow graced its sides, like the wind had whipped it all away, or the storms had avoided its peak entirely. So we have no weather on these mountains again. I think that's really. Interesting because we have courts where the seasons are frozen, and then we have these mountains that seemingly exist outside of time itself, basically, right? We have only a dozen Illyrians in the past 500 years having touched the monolith.

1:48:21 Touching the monolith makes you feel an ancient force sing into your blood and it transports you dot dot dot somewhere. We have different places here. All right, so for Cassian we get. And he touched the honest Onyx monolith when he'd felt that ancient force singing to his blood in the heartbeat before it had whisked him back to safety.

1:48:39 The safety of Devlin's camp. It had been worth it to feel that. So Cassie and recent as go to Devlin's camp when in Emory, go to the River House. Reese is involved in both of these things. That's all I'm going to say about that. OK, so here's why we know the Esteri are involved with Ramiel no matter what And some of you guys have asked about this quote. How we know this?

1:49:01 This is the answer how we know this. So this is the tale of Annalius that we get that Emory tells Nesta and Gwen quote is long ago, so long ago they don't even have a precise date for it. A Great War was fought between the fae and the ancient beings who oppressed them, that is the Osteria. One of the key battles was here in these mountains. Our forces were battered and outnumbered, and for some reason the enemy was desperate to reach the stone at the top of Ramiel. We were never taught the reason why, I think it's been forgotten, but a young Illyrian warrior named Analius held the line against the enemy soldiers for days. He found a natural archway of stone, I don't know how natural it was, if I'm being honest,

1:49:40 amongst the tangle of boulders and made that his bottleneck. He died in the end, but he held off the enemy long enough for our allies to reach us. Which allies? The right is all to honor him. So much of the history has been lost. Yeah, it's a. The memory of his bravery remains. All right, so we have Analias, who?

1:49:58 We know Vespers, right? Vespers sees as Real's knife. And he says, did the traitor Analias give that to you? She knows who Analias is. If she's calling Analias A traitor, I'm assuming. I mean, she clearly survived this battle and knows what happened, right. Yeah, We have the ancient beings who oppressed the fae that was, that is 100% the Esteri, No question in my mind.

1:50:20 We have them desperate to reach the monolith on top of Ramiel. We know that. We know the monolith. Has an ancient. Force that sings to you and can transport you somewhere else. Can it transport you off world? I think that's the question on everyone's lips. We don't really have an answer. Certainly a good hypothesis.

1:50:37 No reason to not really think that. So this was basically the Esteri perhaps trying to escape, but we don't know that. We don't know what the monolith can do. It could maybe be for other reasons. The cauldron. We have seen the cauldron beneath the monolith. Was the cauldron there? I don't know.

1:50:53 I don't know. Yeah, I mean it. And. By the way, that's why. I think Ramiel is the Night Court Insignia is because it is the symbol of the Astiri defeat that makes sense, like an ally is. In my mind. The way that played out, and this is all obviously theory, is an ally is defending this pass. He's holding off the Astiri.

1:51:14 The Astiri need to reach Romiel for whatever reason, whether it's to escape, whether they need the power under it, whether they're like weakening, I don't know what it is, but like an ally is defense means that they lose. And I think that was if not the final moment of that battle, like one of the final moments of that battle that allowed a steri defeat. And I think the reason that Ramiel is the Night Court Insignia is because of because of that, because it was like their independent signal.

1:51:43 And that totally makes sense. So you think the Asteria were defeated? Under the three stars as well. Potentially, yeah, potentially, yeah. And that. Is why the blood? Right. Happens under those three stars as well, potentially if the blood right was not an Asteria thing, but we don't know. Yeah, I'm not sure.

1:51:59 About the positioning of, well, yeah, I have to think more about the star position. We'll think more about. Definitely think. That's why that totally makes sense, is so important. That totally makes sense. That's a great answer. All right, a couple things about Ramiel itself. Then we'll get into Ho Fest.

1:52:12 Then I have a couple other interesting things I want to talk about. When Nesta is approaching Ramiel, we get clues from Nesta herself and from Gwen and Emery that the mountain is basically making her extremely depressed. So the quote we have for that is, was it possible, but the breaking wasn't merely physical but mental as well, that this mountain somehow dredged up every bit of her fear and sucked her mind deep into it. They halted for lunch, if water could be called lunch. Gwen's leg was bleeding again, her face ghostly white. None of them spoke, but NASA noted their haunted eyes knew they heard their own horrors.

1:52:48 That's silver flames, chapter 69. It's giving Valk princey very very valg Prince. I don't know how a mountain can be a valg Prince, but that is what it is, getting one if it's being recharged by people. 'S fear and death, then it would be especially. I don't know if you went into this at all. I did a little. Research on Romiel.

1:53:08 Romiel is a not an Angel but like he is a part that it is a name in the Bible for a humanoid type God like not God. Maybe it is an Angel like associated with Thunder. So like there is kind of an idea of Romiel being a person but I don't know how that would work. And then the other thing Nesta feels the pass of Analius breathing.

1:53:28 So the quote we get for that is Nesta collided with someone hard, to the point where she thinks it's a person, right? No, not someone. Though she could have sworn she felt warmth and breath. She'd hit the archway of stone. They'd fallen all the way back down to the past finale, as dangerously close to the males who pursue them.

1:53:44 So she feels the past breathing, and Cassian says that Ramiel feels alive somehow. I don't fucking know, man. I don't know what to make of this. It's giving Wordstone for sure, for sure. But that's just the monolith. That's not this pass. Like, I don't know. Yeah, I I didn't really go into the. Pass.

1:54:03 I mean, Romiel, to your point on the actual name, I think the only thing I dredged up is that I think that that character was responsible for like overseeing on the Day of Judgement. So like that made sense, that checked out, that makes sense. But as far. As like the. Breathing a live element, Yeah. I mean, I'm now thinking about what you said about Theon dying lying, but I don't know word Stone makes. More sense for the.

1:54:32 Monolith, at least for the monolith, but not for the whole mountain, unless this. Is a whole mountain made of word stone, but I don't really think it is. All right, we'll table that for now. I'm sure we'll come back to it. Or do you have thoughts It doesn't need? In my opinion, this doesn't. Need to be connected to anything other than the fact that we have been told that in Prythean the land is alive.

1:54:52 Like the land is the power. Maybe these are the most powerful pieces of the land. Maybe these are the only places maybe these are the only pieces of the land with their innate power left. Potentially. Yeah, I don't know. I think it's possible, but it's a very. Vague, Very vague, Very vague sequence. All right.

1:55:09 Let's talk about. The Ho fess section and then I have AI have something that I think is really fun to talk about. All right, in Celine's vision we have snow drifted across the image. And then Thea was standing atop a mountain, a black monolith rising behind her. Ramiel. Azrael whispered from behind them.

1:55:27 From behind the wards, Thea embraced a handsome broad shouldered man amid the swirling snow. We assume this is Fionn. We are not told this is Fionn. It's not Atis. Well, it could be Atis I guess, if he has a different visage, but we're assuming this is Fionn. All right, so we get this is literally the next chapter, which is why I'm saying we are assuming that this is Fionn or sorry, this is the next sentence. My mother and father, Fionn had kept their love secret through the years, knowing that Daglin would find it amusing to tear them apart if they learned of the affair. But they were able to meet and meet in secret and to plan their uprising.

1:56:03 Fionn. Azrael murmured, all lacing his voice. Was your ancestor. I think this is really interesting. We have. They were able to meet in secret and we have multiple visions of them on top of Romeo. Why it seems like they were able to meet in secret on top of Romeo. Like why are these Steri kind of blind to what's happening on Romeo?

1:56:22 What what's going on there? What is that? Or I could be wrong. Could be ready to much into this. But like it seems like Romeo was kind of the headquarters of this rebellion, which fits in with your night court Insignia idea as well, right? Like this is kind of where the rebellion was hatched. We actually do have a clue I think from Adis and this throws out the word stone idea. This is no longer word stone with this theory so I don't know if it works.

1:56:46 But with the monolith we have this quote. In Ho Fest chapter 60. Hunt asked if a Valin is one of the stronger thin places that why did the Esteri even allow the fae to live here? And Ada says the black salt in such high quantity keeps them away. They never realized that its presence drew us as much as it repelled them. Apollyon said with satisfaction.

1:57:08 It has the same properties that made us a moon to the immune to the thrall of their black crowns. So is this monolith this Onyx monolith? Because Wordstone is never actually described as honest. It's described as Obsidian almost every time. Is this Onyx monolith actually made of black salt and not wordstone? And is that why seemingly the Esteri were maybe not able to see what was going on there?

1:57:31 And why we seemingly maybe see Princess of Hell? If the Princess of hell were those shadow cloaked figures on top of Ramiel as well I think. I don't know, but are are we dealing with some black salt here? I thought this was interesting too. We know that the cauldron was on top of Romiel at one point, so the quote is Bryce tense. This had to be the thing that had given them the edge. The snows around Romiel parted, revealing a massive bowl of iron at the foot of the monolith.

1:57:57 Even through even. Through the vision. Its presence leaked into the world, a heavy, ominous thing. The Cauldron, Nesta said, dread lacing her voice. How did they get the Cauldron to the top of Romiel? How did Thea and Feon summon the cauldron? Because the King of Highburn can do it right? But we don't really know how. How are they and Feon able to summon the cauldron to get to the top of Romeo?

1:58:21 Or was it always there? Is this where the cauldron was kind of actually birthed from and now it moves around but it was there for for a really long time first. I don't know. I think they probably summoned it and I think it's probably cuz Thea is vas worse's daughter. That's my theory, but I don't know.

1:58:36 Yeah, it would also. I mean the cauldron is so. Hell like that. If the black salt theory checks out too and Hell was helping, they could certainly have played a role there. I think to the point of how did they get to that point? Like how did they like how did they meet in secret on top of Ramiel I?

1:58:54 This is not a straightforward, like obvious answer by any means, but we obviously know that touching the monolith gets you to other places. I assume that there is some magic that we just do not understand that makes this monolith a place that you can travel from and to. I have ideas on that. Yeah, I do.

1:59:15 But also the winged horses. Sure. Also the winged horses. But like, you could see that, yeah. Yeah, no. That's a good point, right? And like we have the tunnels. But that doesn't get you to the top of like, meaning we have the shortcut tunnels, but that doesn't get you to the top of Romeo. I do wonder.

1:59:30 I do wonder you. Just made my my brain gears go like Sarah said in the call her daddy interview right? We're going to get answers as to how the Faye got into the House of wind, which is kind of a fun party trick throw away right? But like this is actually the answer we need. How did Faye and Fian get on top of Romeo?

1:59:46 Because we are told how fucking hard it is to get to the top of Romeo and we I see four figures up there and the cauldron. So if it is the same answer that the fae get into the House of Wind the same way the fae get onto the top of Ramiel, maybe it's sewing tauruses. Maybe Ramiel is hollow and you can just walk up inside. I mean, Ramiel's almost certainly hollow. Maybe you could just climb up.

2:00:07 Maybe there are other Onyx monoliths that let you transport to to this Onyx monolith. I don't know. But that is a real question that does need to be answered, I think. Yeah, when we're told it's so. Hard to get to the top. Of Ramiel, Yeah, assuming you can't just winnow. There at this point, assuming you can't just winnow there. Yeah, I forgot about winnowing.

2:00:26 Great point. Maybe you could just winnow there. Yeah, like they are High King and. Queen material also assuming that there is some capability, I don't know. Yeah, Yeah, great point. Maybe I'm totally. But Romiel, like it clearly doesn't allow. That today, so I don't know during the well you're forbidden. You're forbidden from going on to Romiel. Not that you can't, but like, yeah, some. I would be shocked.

2:00:50 If there was not something there but disallowed it, maybe I'm wrong, maybe I'm wrong. Maybe you just get sentenced to death. But like, how? How would you? There's got to be some alert set up at least. I don't know. I don't, I don't know. I don't know because. The Esteri clearly didn't know these meetings were happening, right? That's the implication that we're getting. Yeah, I'm more saying I find it.

2:01:11 Hard to believe but now there are not enchantments that don't allow if it is forbidden and it is to go on to Romiel has had the blood rate. OK, I have something fun. That I noticed and I'm wondering if you noticed it too. Could be something, could be nothing. Classic. We are getting clues in Silver Flames that Farrah is having visions of Romiel and we don't know why and we aren't really giving an explanation.

2:01:40 So we get this clue twice. She paints it twice. Yeah, OK, so the first clue is? Cassian paused before a landscape painting of a towering, barren mountain, void of life, yet somehow thrumming with presents. Snow and Pines crusted the smaller peaks around it, but this strange bald mountain? Only a Blackstone jutted from its top. A monolith, Nestor realized, stepping closer. Cassian murmured.

2:02:04 I didn't realize Farah had painted Romiel. I wonder when she saw it, Cassian muse, smiling faintly. Nestor didn't bother to suggest Farah might have simply peered into Reese Sands memory. That's Silver Flames chapter 20. Totally possible that she did. It is totally possible that she did. But we get another painting of Ramiel too. So for Solstice she gives Cassian a painting of him, Reese and Azrael at the top of the monolith. Which if you're thinking about it like if the painting is of the three of them, she can't have gotten that from Reese's memory because it would be from his point of view and it would only be of the two of them.

2:02:39 But that's kind of a little small detail. But is this Farah having visions of Romiel related to Nick somehow? Is it just obviously the easy answer? So she's peering into Reese's memory. But I think it's really interesting that we get two different instances here of Farrah painting Romiel for no apparent reason, and then her son is born on the last day of the blood, right?

2:03:00 A month early. I mean, it really all feels connected. It could have just been foreshadowing for what Nesta's journey was going to be. That is totally possible. But I have a precog theory. We'll get there later. I think it's, and the idea of Farrah having these visions of Romiel is interesting in conjunction with that precog theory.

2:03:15 That's all I'll say. Yeah. Yeah, I think it's totally possible. I think because we've now talked about Reese potentially being visited by Princess of Hell in his dreams and Princess of Hell just visiting people in their dreams in general. I've now been thinking more too about De Mati mating bonds and the fact that people can't shield while they're asleep.

2:03:35 And I'm just wondering where the lines are between what Feyre is dreaming about and what Reese is dreaming about and what Reese is dreaming about. And. Like how the? OK, we know that Ruin and Lydia. See each other in dreams and talk to each other in dreams. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So it's interesting. Yeah, I think there's whatever. I just, I'm more saying like whatever Pharaoh is doing I think is fair game to also wonder maybe what's going on in Reese's head.

2:04:03 I agree. Yeah, I agree. I like it. Cool. OK. Do you have? Anything to add I? Have one thing. About the three peaks, the three Baron peaks, kind of a theory tying this all together, but do you have anything else about Romeo? I mean, it's definitely hollow. We've talked about there potentially being almost certainly a core first light under Romeo, right?

2:04:21 Like pretty sure about that. I think one of the most interesting. Things about Romeo is an Oasis defense of Romeo because of why? Like because of what his defense meant and why the Astiri needed to get there so badly and why why it was so important that he succeeded in holding them off and who came to aid. I think hell.

2:04:42 I think hell came to their aid. Which would mean, right, that Hell was on Prythian. And also was there what? That could have been the point at which Hell and Thea crossed paths. It makes so much more sense for the. Monolith to be an entry gate for hell like the Northern Rift than it does for it to be an escape route for the because the asteri have the horn and the harp.

2:05:08 They don't need to go. They don't need to go all the way up fucking Romiel. I actually think this is proof. I can't remember if the asteri can winnow, but I actually think that the fucking passive analysis is proof that you probably can't winnow to the peak of Romiel because they would just winnow straight to the peak, right?

2:05:26 If you could, yeah. Whatever Romul is very important to the asteri. They needed it. Someone came to help them. This is a reason that they lost, and I think this is how like it makes so much sense, right, like well, I shouldn't say it makes so much sense. We have no other plausible explanation for how fian and Thea one right, like how do you defeat the asteria?

2:05:52 Well, Bryce Connor just showed us how to defeat the Asteria. But like how? How would how would the? We're told, we're told aid came. We are told aid came. One of the key battles was here in these mountains. Our forces were battered and outnumbered and for some reason the enemy was desperate to reach the stone at the top of Ramiel.

2:06:11 That is either I there's two reasons that could be escape plan. This will get us off planet, but I don't think that makes sense because they have the horn in the harp. Or we need to destroy this because this will be our downfall. This stone, whatever it is, does. Isn't it more interesting if this is a gate to hell?

2:06:29 Because we saw this in Midgard. They sealed the northern rift. That's what they had to do to to win. So isn't it more interesting? This is a gate to hell. Hell is coming. We need to destroy it so hell doesn't come. I'm not saying this is what happened. I'm saying this is what's happening in my mind. Right.

2:06:44 OK. We were never taught the reason why. I think it's been forgotten. But a young Alerian war named Analius held the line against the enemy soldiers for days. He found a natural archway of stone amongst the tangle of folders and made that this bottleneck. He died in the end, but he held off the enemy long enough for our allies to reach us.

2:07:01 The allies came. Who are the allies? Who are the allies? Hell yeah. Hell, the right is all to honor him. So much of the history is with lost, but the memory of his grand Greek roommates, we think, hell yeah. So to me, we have no idea. Yeah, we have no idea. The biggest take away, though, is that we, we don't know what it is. We don't know why, but something about Romiel was so important that the asteri needed to reach it in order to win, and they couldn't and they lost, right?

2:07:31 So like, we're going to find out what that is. We're going to find out what that is that we're not. There's no way in hell we're not going. To find out what that is. The only other little like fun bit that I had was the Annalius imagery. I had a lot about Annalius, the Annalius imagery of him dying, climbing with his guts hanging out.

2:07:50 I think Sarah was very intentional in making him sound exactly like Cassian, and that scares me. But that's OK. I really don't think Cassian's going to die. I. Don't think he's going to die, I. Don't think he's going to die, but he is like word for word called the second coming of Analius. And I think she really played with that when she said his guts were hanging out and Cassian's guts were in fact hanging out at some point in this, I think in AC War, I can't remember exactly when. Right, so so Azrael has analysis. Dagger.

2:08:21 We don't know how he got it. We don't know if Moore gave it to him. We don't know. But the Cassian Analius imagery is, is very, very stark and he's even compared like people's people compare him to an alley. So I don't fuck the Illyrians compare him to an alley, which is the highest praise that you could possibly get.

2:08:39 One thing that I actually really, really hate, so I don't even know if I want to say it, but we have three barren peaks. One of them has a monolith on top of it that we know for sure. We don't know of any other monoliths. But we have also not been to the top of the prison, nor have we been to the top of the sacred mountain.

2:08:55 We have 3 clock towers in Irelia made of word stone that block magic entirely entirely. Obviously magic is not entirely blocked on Prythian, but we have the idea that magic was once Wilder, right? Are these three sacred peaks and potential monoliths? I don't really think there's monoliths on the other two mountains.

2:09:16 I think that would have been mentioned. But are these three sacred peaks? Somehow whatever these Steri have done to them, whatever it is fucking with magic, I don't really like it. It was just kind of the only thing I could think of with what this honest monolith is. But I really like everything.

2:09:30 We just talked through a lot more. The idea of it being a transporter, being a gate to hell, or being a like power source charge up the thing that I like. About it being gate related is that now it keeps going to reef? Well, there have been 12. Since then, we don't know where those guys ended up, but it'd be funny if they just ended up at the townhouse.

2:09:54 Like the Illyrians are also pretty hell. Coded. Yeah, I think if this is a gate to hell, that. Means the bottom of the library is not a mouth to hell, but I'm OK with that. Either of this is fine, yeah. I mean, if I'm choosing between the two, I'm. Definitely choosing the library, but yeah, just like purely because of the imagery.

2:10:11 I think if she had said this was an Obsidian monolith. Case closed. This is word stone. But she didn't. And Obsidian is the use, is the word she uses with word stone. And this is Onyx. Yeah. So we're kind of ignoring and it's OK. That we're ignoring it, but I just want to note that we're ignoring it for record keeping purposes. When I go back and listen to this before acatar sex, we are ignoring that it is tied directly to. The cauldron like.

2:10:37 The cauldron is sitting right there and the cauldron is also black metal. It's made of iron ish and has inky like it's yeah. Do you you think that the. Monolith and the the Cauldron is perhaps fashioned from the monolith. I don't know. Or that they're kin. I think they could be kin. I don't know. It's very 2000. 1A Space Odyssey. I'm, like, really excited about it, whatever it is. Yeah, yeah, Yeah.

2:10:59 OK. I had one more small thing. This was really more of a correction omission. But as I'm rereading Crescent City, we've read this line about the Ori, about the Autumn King's Ori many, many times. However, I noticed something new. So we have this quote. The Ori in the far back of the space drew Rune's eye, a working metal of their seven planets, moons and Suns made from solid gold.

2:11:20 Rune had been mesmerized by it as a boy, back when he'd been stupid enough to believe his father actually gave a shit about him, spending hours in here watching the male make whatever observations and calculations he jotted in his black leather notebooks. He'd asked only once about what his father was looking looking for, exactly.

2:11:36 Patterns was all his father said. And we have the three stars above Ramiel, and we have the summer solstice with the archway. So we're really getting the idea of celestial alignment here. For whatever reason, for whatever she's going for. There's definitely some kind of time. Times when it works, times when it doesn't.

2:11:53 I think someone somewhere has. Figured out how that happened. Not me though. Well, no, But should we talk? About Starfall. Let's talk about Starfall now. I'm really excited. I'm moving from place A to B on. One night every year, on one night, pretty close to the blood. Right, pretty close, same time.

2:12:13 All right, Ronnie, let's talk about Starfall. Let's talk about Starfall. All right, so Starfall is a day night court celebration that falls on the same day as Ninsar. I don't know if I'm pronouncing that correctly. Real quick guys, we realized Starfall is not a place. But we felt we needed to talk about Starfall.

2:12:31 We didn't know where else to put it. So it's your last question of this episode. I hope you enjoy. It's about an Otis question it. Is an annual migration of spirits across the sky for reasons unknown, but we're going to pop postulate on why we're going to get why that might happen. In Akimap chapter 44, we get all of the Starfall imagery and the crux of this is basically that we actually see stars, stars quote, move across the sky. We learned that they're actually spirits, right? So we see one star vault across the sky. That's kind of the signal that everything is starting. Interestingly, Reese knows when it's about to start. He realizes it's starting before it actually starts. I don't know why, just something

2:13:14 that happened. So one star passes. Crowd in city below cheered, raising their glasses that pass right overhead, and only when it had disappeared over the curve of the horizon did they drink deeply. Another star crossed the sky, twirling and twisting over itself as if it were reveling in its own sparkling beauty.

2:13:32 It was chased by another, and another, until a brigade of them were unleashed from the edge of the horizon like 1000 Archers had loosed them from mighty bows. The stars cascaded over us, filling the world with white and blue light. They were like living fireworks, and my breath lodged in my throat as the stars kept on falling and falling. So this is Farah when she's with Reese in the inner circle, watching Starfall for the first time. Then she goes upstairs with Reese and starts to ask some questions about what Starfall actually is. And she realizes they're not.

2:14:03 They're not stars, she says. They're not stars at all. Reese says no. Our ancestors thought they were. But they're just spirits on a yearly migration to somewhere. Why they pick this day to appear here, no one knows. She says there must be hundreds. He says thousands. They'll keep coming until dawn. Or I hope they will.

2:14:21 There were less and less of them the last time I witnessed Starfall, before Amarantha had locked away. Locked him away. What's happening to them? I looked in time to see him shrug. Something twanged in my chest. I wish I knew. But they keep coming back despite it. Why? Why does anything cling to something? Maybe they love wherever they're going so much that it's worth of it.

2:14:39 Maybe they'll keep coming back until there's only one star left. Maybe that one star will make the trip forever, out of the hope that someday, if it keeps coming back often enough, another star will find it again. And then we also learn that Starfall is not a secret right, even to outsiders. Even the Court of Nightmares comes out of the human city to look up at the sky.

2:14:57 And Marantha knows about it. Everybody knows about Starfall. These spirits are physical things that can in fact splat like goo, which is the worst thing ever. Like every time I think about it I'm like did someone just die because they hit recent Farrah in the face? Gross to think about. The one that splats on Fera is green. I'm just noting down colors because we obviously get a red one.

2:15:22 As I turn to face a more fully, something blinding and tingling slammed into my face. I reeled back, crying out as I bent over, shielding my face against the light that I can still see against my shut eyes. So wiped in my face. And when I pulled my hands down, I gaped pale green light like drops of paint glowed and flex on my hand.

2:15:41 And then one hits Reese, too. It's it's dusty. She describes it like paint, but it actually has dust. Yeah. So it's not it's not to me. It's not described like first light or anything like that. It is. It is like a physical paint, like a dusty paint, like a powdery paint is the consistency I think that we're getting here. And then we also have a star fall and a quart of silver flames in which we see a rare Red Star that is widely thought to be alien by the theorist community. Reese Reese notices it.

2:16:16 Fayer is pregnant at the time. The reason that that means it's we think it's alien is because in Kingdom of Ash, when this occurs, the Fay that slows Aylan down looks exactly like Reese and is standing next to a pregnant thing when he slows Aylan down. And that's in a court of silver flames. Chapter 62 Yeah.

2:16:35 So the full the full quote is the mood had to be been. Housed by a rare Red Star blasting across the sky. One day, and I'll omen, Nesta had heard the priestesses murmuring. If it's an I'll omen, this has happened before. They know what this is. I don't know I'm. Talking about it, I think we talked about it, yeah, it's happened before.

2:16:53 This has happened before. Yeah, Yeah, yes, yeah. So there have been red stars before. If the Red Star is alien, I guess one we've like, why do colors matter, right? We've got white, blue-green. Those all are apparently normal and fine colors. Then we've got red for alien, which makes sense for alien when you think about her fire imagery and being red.

2:17:17 But why is red rare? And why is it an I'll omen if these are spirits that are just traveling? Is it the kernel of Mullah's light? Like is it the fact that a God gave her this like piece of her spirit basically to allow her to go home? And this is like actually the spirit of a God that is traveling. And that's what's such an I'll omen in the sky is when gods are traveling.

2:17:41 I think there's something important to mention here. Just real. Quick with the Alen thing because I kind of forgot about this and then just remembered while you were talking. Alen's body is always at the salt mines of Endovie, right? She is. Her body is there. Like Rowan is seeing her body the whole time. I think at one point he starts holding her because he knows that she's dying, right?

2:18:01 So this is her spirit. She is a spirit. This is her soul. Whatever this is, this is not Ellen's body falling through worlds. This is some part of her. That's not her body. She is physically in front of Rowan. And the entire time, Dorian and Kale. Yeah. Yeah, her lovers. OK, so here are my theories. On what Starfall could mean or just theories on Starfall in general.

2:18:23 The first, well, it wasn't going to be the first, but because you just mentioned it, we'll just in my opinion, probably like the least likely because will require a lot of things to really beautifully come together and probably like 5 more books. But if we are going to get a world that has figured out these patterns, right? So like the theories that have to come together for this to happen, right?

2:18:42 One, there does have to be celestial alignment for mass transporting between worlds. And there's a way to do it probably without the horn and the harp, right? Because we know where those are are two Some civilization somewhere has figured out how to do this and for some reason travels between places in Mass and chooses to do this via the Night Court every year over. The Night Court well.

2:19:07 Not it doesn't. Necessarily need to be only over. The night court, it just needs to be the same path, right? So like always that same path, so always between the same two places. So they are every year going from one place to another place and they have figured out how then this could be a civilization going from one place to another every year.

2:19:28 The reason I think that that's a little bit loose, in my opinion, it's most fun. But the reason I think it's a little bit loose is because one, it seems to be no one's ever said that they switched directions. I don't know how the fuck they like unless they like literally actually orbit somehow end up back where they began.

2:19:46 That would be kind of crazy. And then to just a lot of things, a lot of things would need to come together for that to really be the case. So that'd be kind of wild. But maybe it is an actual migration and people have found a way to make celestial patterns align so that there is actual mass world walking, effectively civilization wide world walking, and there are casualties that happen when you hit recent fair in the face. I have theories that could be maybe a little bit more likely. 1 is that these spirits are on a migration. And it's a migration that's associated with death, like post death.

2:20:28 And the decrease in spirits each year is correlated with the discoveries by the Asteria that they can harvest second light. So as a reminder for everyone, we learn in the House of Sky and Breath chapter 29 from the Under King. And this is a plug for our Elyrians episode. I think we talked lightly about Second Light that the sailing and basically the entire concept of the Bone Quarter being a resting place is a farce and both he and the Asteria are actually consuming the the light of the dead, which is called second light. The difference between first light and second light is literally just that the first light comes from the living. Second light comes from the dead. Here's a quote.

2:21:06 How's the sky in breath? Chapter 29 Hunt's lightning surge. But he reigned it in. What do you want with her? What I want from All Souls who pass here, what I give back the dead gate to all of Midgard Energy, life power. You did not give your power to the illusion system. You made the drop outside of it.

2:21:22 Thus you still possess some first light, raw nutritious. First light nutritious Price, said the under king wave a Bony hand. Can you blame me for sampling the goods as they pass through the dead gate? Hunt's mouth dried up. You feed on the souls of the dead. Only those who are worthy, who have enough energy. There is no judgment but that whether a soul possesses enough residual power to make a hearty meal both for myself and for the dead gate.

2:21:44 As their souls pass through the dead gate, I take a bite or two. Hunt cringed inwardly. Maybe he'd been too hasty and deeming the being before him not evil. The underking went on. The rituals were all invented by you, your ancestors, to during the horror of the Offering. But Danica was here. She answered me.

2:22:02 Bryce. Bryce's voice broke. She was here, She and all of the newly dead from the past several centuries, just long enough that they're living descendants and loved ones, either forget or don't come asking. They dwell here until then, in relative comfort, unless they make themselves a nuisance, and I decided to send them into the gate sooner. But when the dead are forgotten, their names no longer whispering on the wind, then they are herded through the gate to become First Light or Second Light as it is called when the power comes from the dead, Ashes to and all that. The Sleeping City is a lie and asked. His mother's face flashed before him, a comforting one, as I have said.

2:22:35 The under King's voice again became sorrowful. One for your benefit. And we later learned this is obviously to power the Asteri and help them survive. So we know that souls can live on, but in Lunapian they are not because their power is being recycled to be eaten by the Asteri. Basically, if the power if the Asteri are either sharing this knowledge or even if it's only happening on Midgard, it would explain the dwindling population of these souls migrating. Everything that we've learned about death, at least in Prythian, has LED us to believe that it is movement from one world to another world.

2:23:10 Why it all happens on one day every year? I don't have an answer for that, but that is 1 theorem. Do you have any reactions to that theorem? Very much, very much reaction. So that I. Have. I think that is what this is. I think these are dead. I think these are dead spirits, basically. So when Elena shows up in Throne of Glass and talks to Selena Aylan, she says I'm a spirit basically. Like she uses the word spirit.