Season 2 Kickoff: Deep Dive into ACOTAR and the Maasverse with Abby and Ronnie!

0:18 I'm so excited. I've been so excited all week for this day. Honestly, I'm just like so excited that we're finally talking about a guitar. So excited to be here. I've been like literally counting down the day. I know, I'm so excited too. I also just like really enjoyed. Now that I'm past a Court of Wings and Ruin, I'm just like having fun again.

0:38 Yeah, Ruin is stressful. I'm stressed. I'm Ronnie. I'm Abby, and this is Dragons in the Details, where we pick apart our favorite fantasy series over the course of an undetermined number of episodes. We've only done one season before, but we really did not know how many episodes were going to happen, and we are carrying that theme through to our next season.

0:59 In fact, I have no idea how long this is going to last this particular topic. Could easily be over 50 episodes I think, depending on how we. Structure it, it certainly could be. And so we're we're launching a new season here, which is focused on the Court of Thorns and Roses, the full series, not just the book I find that confusing by Sarah J Math. So we're here to talk about Akatar. If you listened to us in the past, you know that we have been largely focused on the Empyrean series by Rebecca Yaros. If you're still with us from that season, yay. Thanks for staying with us.

1:34 And for those who are new, maybe you didn't read the Empyrean but are now engaging in Akatar and have read just Akatar or the rest of the Sarah J Maas series is we're thrilled to have you here. Yay. Welcome. We're talking about Akatar. We're talking about Akatar. We're excited these episodes will contain spoilers before we even just start making small talk about the series. I'm just going to put a.

1:58 Spoiler tag up. These episodes will contain spoilers for the entire Accord of Thorns and Roses series, all five books. We will be announcing any other books spoilers ahead of time and we're keeping them kind of to the end. So Abby will talk a little bit more about that. But note for those new to this Series, A term called mass verse is a term in the fandom that's used to describe all of Sarah J Masses works.

2:23 That includes A Court of Thorns and Roses, Crescent City, and Throne of Glass, just so everyone's familiar with that term. If you're new ish to the fandom, if we say mass verse spoilers, which we won't until later, that means something very different. If you haven't read all of those books, you should leaf. But for now, just A Court of Thorns and Roses spoilers. And we're so happy you're here.

2:42 Yay. Abby's gonna talk a little bit more about the structure, but each week we typically dive into a specific topic in depth. We ask ourselves questions if you're if you're new here, our structure is more Q&A based, but we each kind of answer those questions before we get into deep dives. We're just a fun episode kind of reacting to these books. And so this episode is going to be all about our reactions to the five published books in a court of thorns and roses. The series we come with receipts. We always have quotes to back up any theories that we have so that you can follow along if you're skeptical. This episode I think will be pretty theory light, but we'll, you know, we've been wrong about

3:18 that before, so we'll see where it takes us. Abby, would you like to talk more about the structure? Yeah, So if you're new here, welcome. We're very happy to have you. Or if you're sticking with us after our Imperian wild ride, we're happy to have you too. Thanks for sticking along with us. That was a fun journey. It was very enjoyable.

3:38 We will, just as a disclaimer, we're we're keeping things separate, right? So if you're here and you haven't read the Imperian, that's totally fine. We're not going to spoil anything from the Imperian for you. They are separate. We will not talk about the books crossovers. I hate when people do that. And so we will definitely not talk about the Imperial. We're going to do our best not to spoil anything for every anyone.

3:56 How we're structuring this season and just how we structure our episodes in general. Ronnie talked on this a little, but just to further kind of go into that, we do not do the chapter by chapter read along thing. So just to reiterate, all five books are in play. If you have just picked up the 1st 1/4 of Thorns and Roses book and you're on chapter 6, go no further.

4:14 This is not the podcast for you at this moment. It will be the podcast for you when you finish all the books and we will be more than happy to have you when that happens. I'm sure you guys know Aqatar six. The first drafts have were just finished, so it's a great time to join the Aqtar community. Everyone is very excited about that. All right, So how we're structuring this season, we are focused on Acatar, but as Ronnie mentioned, the larger mass versus also at play.

4:36 So the first parts of our episodes we think are always going to be structured or always going to focus on Acatar solely. But there will be a Part 2 to our episodes. So most of our questions should be just on Acatar, but there might be a couple questions at the end focused on the mass first. We will give you a spoiler warning. We will say, hey, spoiler alert, we're about to talk about Crescent City.

4:54 We're about to talk about Throne of Glass. That is your warning if you have only read a guitar to stop and go no farther, basically. I know it's been said a lot on social media that you have to read Crescent City if you're going to read a Guitar 6. Sarah J Mass herself has not said that, so we're not necessarily subscribing to that, but you should. I mean, if you want to, you should. You should not feel that you have to. But I do think it certainly enriches the experience. I'm not going to get into it more than that. I'm just going to say my official and not necessarily Ronnie's official.

5:23 My official stance on this is you don't have to read Crescent City to enjoy ACOTAR, but it will enhance your enjoyment of ACOTAR, is my belief. Yeah. I think it was great, I think. It was. We won't go into it more than that. That's just our official stance, not necessary. We'll add to the enjoyment of all right, the other piece for this season, we're still going to be doing the deep dives like we do. That's our thing.

5:45 However, they might be because ACOTAR covers a larger sphere and there are more ACOTAR books than there were in the Imperium series. We might not be doing a specific character deep dive. We might go into a specific event instead. Like so, for example, and I'm not saying we're going to do this instead of doing a more episode, we might focus specifically on what happened between Eris and more, right? That might be a whole episode.

6:08 So that doesn't really matter for you guys. Just to set the tone, just to set the structure, we're trying to not do these mammoth episodes anymore. We're trying to deep dive on a specific topic. We think that will give us like more clarity on that topic and just also make it more enjoyable for you, the listeners as well.

6:24 I think that's pretty much it. I think that's it too. Great and season one season 1 on the Imperium now streaming on all platforms. If you have read The Imperium and you like us, and you want to go back and listen to our inferior coverage, it's available for you. It's all out there, all 22 episodes.

6:40 What did we even end up at? I think. We ended up at 20, three, I think we ended up at 23. They're all there guys. So if you read 4th. Wing iron flame and Onyx storm go have a listen if you've not finished all of those, strongly recommend you. Do not listen. Do not listen. Do not. Our friend's staff actually texted me. She's like, how come when I search for 4th Wing on Spotify, I don't find you guys?

7:01 I'm like, because if you've only read 4th Wing, you shouldn't listen to our podcast. Yeah, like that's not, that's not. What? Don't go there. Yeah, yeah. But good tag on our SEO keywords. We'll work on that. I think they're all pretty good. Yeah, I think our SEO is fine, but yeah, all right. All right. Shall we deep dive?

7:20 Shall we deep? Well, let's start with a fun question first. What was your overall impression of the Accord of Thorns and Roses series? I mean, and I don't think my experience is that unusual. Basically, this was my second. I read Imperium first, as you can guess by the seasons of this podcast. I read Imperium first and then I was like, basically, Ronnie, what should I read next? And you were like, like, I think I texted you at some point. I was like, I fear that I have to read Acatar. I feel that I'm going to have to do this and that it will take over my life.

7:49 And that's exactly what happened. That's what happened. That's what happened and I'm not about it. There's so much. There's so much content to go through. Like there's so, so, so much. And I love it. I think what Sarah J Maas does so, so, so well is character development. Like the characters in these books feel so real. They feel so 3 dimensional.

8:11 I feel like they're my best friends. Yeah. Like she is so good at making them just pop off the page. And it's really obviously to her benefit, right? Because these are highly, these are books that are highly dependent on emotions right there. They are fantasy books. There's a lot of fantasy elements to it.

8:28 That's obviously what we're going to focus on. But I think her her, her strength and what I would say she even maybe does better than Rebecca Yaros is, is the character development just kind of from day one, you're like, OK, I understand who Farah is. I understand what motivates her. It's it is simple, but it is well done.

8:46 And I think that I think that really speaks speaks volumes. And I think she's really, really great at that. And I think she's really great at taking. Obviously, she's great at this taking your perspective of a character and then completely flipping it on its head. So you're like, you think I think I know this character.

9:03 I think I understand what motivates them. And then you get their point of view. And you're like, I didn't actually, yeah, I didn't actually understand any of this. This was not. This did not play out the way I think it did. Yeah. So I think she's she's great at that. I think the world building, I feel like she kind of figured it out as she went.

9:21 I'm very happy with where she ends up with it. But I do feel like it wasn't necessarily out of the gate like the strongest in terms of like, OK, there's a clear set of rules. I understand what's going on here. I understand how all these pieces should fit together. But I think by I'm going to say a court of wings and ruin. I think she I think she got there. I think she figured it out.

9:40 I think the world building is really good. I don't think we fully realized, like, I don't think that plot has fully come to fruition yet. So it's kind of going to depend on how it all turns out. But I really, really love this series. I really love these characters. I think about them at least once a day.

9:54 How about you? Yeah, I mean, I also love the series. How I I don't even really fully remember how I found it, to be honest with you. I think I read it also after I read what was what was out in the Imperial series. So I started with 4th Wing, think maybe I read Iron Flame and then I started A Court of Thorns and Roses. And I remember before I started it I had never read any Faye. And so in my head this was like a loss, like I had no other. Like I was like, these are elves, like there's going to be elves.

10:29 And that was what I expected. And I had no comprehension of Faye magic systems or any premonitions heading into the series. And obviously the first book in the series is A Court of Thorns and Roses. We'll talk more about like what that book entails. But I was pretty, I mean, I wasn't ripping it apart the way that I was ripping the Empyrean series apart.

10:52 But I really, really liked and I just personally prefer Sarah J Mass's style of writing to Rebecca Yaris is kind of in some of the things that you were mentioning, right? Like she's she writes more traditionally. In some ways. She's more inventive in her language and descriptions of things, which I really appreciated. And we'll talk more about what I liked about the actual books when we talk about the books.

11:14 But I really, really enjoyed Sarah J Mass's style. I agree with you that she does character development really well and she also uses POV's really well. Absolutely in that like she's creative with when she chooses first and she chooses 3rd and like who she brings in and when, which I think like thickens the plot.

11:33 I agree with you that her world building is confusing, but I don't think that's unintentional. Yeah, I won't. Say that's what we're here for. Yeah. Without that there would be no podcast, so that's fine. Yeah, so I love them. This series got me into just the phase genre in general. Like I wasn't bought in until this, so yeah.

11:58 I totally. I don't remember if it was you or Derek, but I was saying to someone like, OK, so the the fae are just the owls and they fuck, right? Like that's pretty much what the fae are. And it's like, not really, no, but like, yeah, kind of. But yeah, I totally agree with yeah. Her language, her word choice, it's just so good.

12:17 And it's like when you read a book that doesn't have it, it feels so empty, right? When you read a book that doesn't have this evocative language for something that's seems like literally she'll take 2 characters that are standing side by side, right? And it'll be like 3 short paragraphs, but 33 good paragraphs that are like describing like how they're drawn to each other or like his like left pinky twitches. And you're like, OK, this is awesome because you're getting so much detail and so much insight into like what's going on in the characters minds.

12:48 But then also like you mentioned, a lot of the times it's first person so you only get one person's view of it. And it's like you have to decode it along with the characters, which I love. And every scene is so rich with with detail and emotion and it's great. I really love. It Yeah, I really, really appreciate Sarah J Maas as a writer.

13:08 Yeah, yeah, I agree. She's a she's like a linguist, almost like first like like her. Her language is so beautiful. And then she's great at building characters and that she's great at building worlds. So it's great. Highly recommend. Highly recommend. I mean, you shouldn't be here if you you shouldn't be.

13:25 Here if you haven't read it, but if you're looking for an effusive review. Yeah. Sarah J Mass. You got it. Yeah, the last thing I'll say about my impression of the Quarter Thorns and Roses series is first read drastically different from second read like that. Like we'll get into it. I really appreciate more the earlier books, having read the later books in the series.

13:49 And just starting in general to love a reread, I feel like a reread is almost always worth it. Like you should finish that book and you like immediately go back and reread it because like you're not supposed to fully understand it the first time you read it. And this is for, like, any book, really, right?

14:04 And then you go back and you're like, oh, look, here's all the little bread crumbs that they left. So I'm pro reread in jail. Yeah. Very cool. OK. All right, So we're going to start off by just going book by book and talking a little bit about our reactions. We're not going to go super deep here, otherwise we would literally be here for days, but we'll start.

14:23 The rest of this season as well. And then we'll talk a little bit about some specific questions, but we'll start with initial reactions to A Court of Thorns and Roses, which is book one in in the series. Obviously, I liked this enough on the first read to keep going. I really like Fayrah's character and that she was both strong and weak, strong willed as a huntress keeping her family alive.

14:48 But we're like very quickly introduced to her weaknesses and that she was this fragile little human teenager that was on the verge of malnourished. I really liked the beauty and the beast trope of it all that especially because it was a twist Beauty and the beast right? Like we did not get the ending but everyone was maybe expecting like the happily ever after with Tamela and Farah.

15:10 Really liked that that wasn't the case. I also, I don't know if you did this, but did you encounter Tamlin like the Scottish ballad? Yeah. Also loved that, like love that we just took a whole that was a little bit less of a flip on the head. But I love that we started with a very traditional storyline and then Sarah G Mass was like, actually throw that out the window. That was a nice little appetizer. We're going to dive into this the rest of this big bat world. On the first read, I found a quarter thorns and roses like especially early kind of boring.

15:43 I did. I clung to Tamlin because he was really all there was to cling to. There are three characters. There's three characters as fuck. Yeah, like there's not that many people to become interested in. Yeah, so obviously fair was a given. I did cling to Tamlin. He was like, he was the love interest.

16:02 Lucian was swoon in my opinion. Think I want to talk about this turning I want to talk about two kind of main things one about the turning the trope on its head right. This book is fucking genius on a reread. This book is fucking brilliant on a reread because it takes all of those tropes that have traditionally been like, so sexy. Oh my God, this man is so powerful. He's blonde, he's shirtless, he bites her neck. We love him, right?

16:31 And because you're seeing it through Fayrah's point of view, right? You don't notice. You don't notice that he orders her around. You don't notice that he explodes in fits of rages and destroys his own house, right? You don't notice that he's like literally sacrificing his own men so that he can find a girlfriend because he said something stupid 50 years ago, right? Like, you don't notice all the bad shit that he's doing because it's written in Favor's point of view. And then you reread it and you're like, my God, this is a nightmare.

17:00 This is actually a nightmare. This whole book is about gaslighting. It's about him leading her to believe that he is something he is totally not. It's genius. It is genius. It flips every trope on his head. It is like, I fucking love it and we'll get into it in the next episode. But like, I truly think this is one of the smartest books ever written.

17:20 I really do. Once you. Once you have the once you reread it, Yeah. The second book, yeah. I mean, on the second read, I felt like I couldn't pay close enough attention to everything that was happening. I was, compared to all the other books I've reread this one line by fucking line. I was like noticing things left and right.

17:38 I was also just absolutely Lord that Farrah did not for one single second think, wait a second. I've been massively manipulated and used this entire time. Like, you're a smart girl. He has lied to you, OK? He has lied to her since day one. His claws are constantly coming out because he cannot control his temper. He starts bleeding like there are. And she finds all of this out and she's like, oh, he couldn't tell me.

18:04 She's just like, Oh my God, I have to go save him. I'm like, he has been lying to you. He literally manipulated your arrival. We're going to get into it in next episode. Next episode is our talent deep dive. We'll go on record right now. I hate talent. I hate him, I fucking hate him. Anyway, we'll get into that the next episode. I just think there is so much violence underpinning his character this whole time.

18:28 Like the claws coming out is such a tell. I wrote in my notes, I wrote Red Flag. I wrote that at least 16 times just in the chapters before Under the Mountain, Right? And there's not that many chapters where Feyer and Tamlin actually interact. But like, yeah, Oh my God, it is so bad. It is it, I said it before, I'll say it again.

18:45 It is actually a Horror Story. And this is like, this is before she's, she's spying on him or manipulating him at all, which I know a lot of people use as an excuse for his bad behavior. This is just when she's a human, right? It's like it's terrifying anyway, but on the first read. Like because I do, we are reacting to this book.

19:02 Like on the first read, I did like Tamlin. I liked Lucian more. I think both of those characters have been completely flipped. I agree. I agree. I like Tamlin. I absolutely like Tamlin. I think you have me on record. I think we recorded somewhere that I said I like Tamlin and I did because I was a fool. I was a.

19:19 Fool. Yes. All right, now that I'm off. One other note that I had, one thing that I noticed both on the first read and on the second read was how weirdly afraid Lucian was. Slash is of Tamlin. Tamlin, like Lucian, is a High Lord son and like a powerful. Well, this spoilers for the entire series. Lucian is a High Lord son.

19:42 Not the High Lord that we initially thought in this book, but he is a High Lord son. He's very fucking powerful and like flags going off in this book about what the is going on with Tamlin and we will talk about this later that Lucian was so freaked out by Lucian say the wrong thing. Absolutely. As much of a victim in this as favorite is, I have a little less sympathy for him.

20:04 But I totally agree with you and I think we'll get into it more in the next episode. Yeah. Other than Tamlin, I also think, and and this isn't unique to Sarah J Maas, but like the way she introduces us to Perithean in this book I really liked because it's the same thing, right? Where it's Ferris point of view.

20:22 All we get is spring core. All we really know about Perithean is being fed to us through Tamlin and Lucian, right? So like it seems like we it seems kind of unsteady. It seems kind of shaky. It seems like she's saying one thing here then contradicting it. They're like, oh, the fake can lie. Oh, the fake can't lie.

20:38 The fake can lie. Oh, iron hurts them. No irons fine, but Ash is it's bad. Like it seems like she can't really like pick a structure and then you realize it's no, it's because Pharah didn't really understand what was going on yet. And so we don't really understand what was going on yet. And I think, I know I complain like, oh, the beginning of this book is is kind of boring, like there's only three characters. But I actually think that does work because just like Pharah, we would have been overwhelmed from the get go if she had just unleashed this full world upon us. Well, and it also worked as a plot device because then we found out that Tamlin was hiding everyone, so that was also interesting.

21:14 Yeah, then we found out that somehow Tamlin can go into Farah's brain and literally change what she's thinking, which sounds a lot like someone else, but we'll get to that. Shameless plug I. Mean glamour. There's a lot to talk about with glamouring in general, this elusive glamouring that seemingly only high Lords can do, Yeah. Yeah.

21:31 All right, what else do you want to say about book one? I have one more note. I mean, just that I thought that the from when we got to Under the Mountain onwards was some of the best, the best trial style writing I've seen. I. Love. Once we got under the mountain, I was locked in. I was like, OK, this is going somewhere really good.

21:49 We had Hamlin being, well, now we know that he's in character, but at that time he was being out of character. We've got these villains, we've got Amarantha, we've got Reese being super fucking sketchy. But obviously we now know that there's reasons for that. Like the the first read, that part of the book made me much more engaged.

22:08 On the second read, I was like, this is amazing. Like it was just, it was my favorite part of the book by far. I love, I loved loves, loves under the Mountain. It took, it just raised the stakes. So like, it pushed the ante so much. It got so dark. Favor is so broken, killing two innocent people.

22:28 This is pretty funny. There is a day Derek and I were long running and we were like, what are we going to talk about our law on our long run? He goes, I know, why don't you tell me the plot of Acatar in great detail and I'll react to it over these 10 miles. And I was like, OK, so that's what I did. And we get to Under the Mountain and I'm telling him about the three trials.

22:47 And I'm like, OK, so she brings out these three Fey and they have bags on their heads. And the trial is that Farah has to kill all three Fey and he's like, well, obviously she doesn't do it. And I'm like. No, she just does. She does it. It's fucking. Crazy. It was crazy. You don't. I mean, and you think that, though, as you're reading, you're like, oh, she's going to find a way out of this.

23:06 No, she doesn't. She doesn't. The heart. Yeah, it's wild. It's totally just we just went, she gets. Rock fully to rock bottom. Yeah, she really does. And I love it. I mean, I didn't love it for her but like, it was so good. Yeah, as a reader, it was amazing. And I think we talked a little bit about this a long time ago. But like, I these books I think were initially marketed as young adult books, which is fucking crazy. Like, even if there's not much sex in the first agreement. Yeah.

23:34 But this gets to the whole like female writers being like shoved into YA because publishing houses thought that what that was what would sell like. And it's and it's total bullshit, but like the idea that you have literally are heroin murdering two people in full blood essentially for her stupid fucking boyfriend, right? Like and that's why a is just just insanity. I mean those and those scenes were like gut wrenching too. Like they didn't like they didn't want to die. Only one of them was remotely OK with it and she was still devastated.

24:09 Horrible. I also thought this is a total side note, but the scene where Pharah is hungover, I thought that was a really well written scene. I was like, I feel hungover reading this scene right now. I have felt this way. I know how this feels. I'm right there with you. Yeah, yeah, I did enjoy her little cell scenes for sure. I also just think like there, there were really interesting little Nuggets left in book one that I don't think we still have good answers for.

24:35 And we don't need to talk about them now, obviously. But like Lucian wearing a fox mask, like, yeah, we see him be a little trickster here and there throughout the series, but I don't feel like that fully really manifested into something confirmed that we understand. And I think I'm. Still waiting for Alice to come. Back.

24:54 Yeah. Alice, I mean, we see her again in Summer Court, right? We do, yeah. And the fact that, like Lucian is the reason that Feyer was able to save them all. Like her overhearing Lucian is. Is or like her overhearing things is why? Whether you attribute that to Lucian or the adder, I don't know. I think there's the adder is dead. So only one of those could be interesting. Yeah.

25:16 OK. I was paying book 1. Book 1A. Little boring, starts a little boring, so good on a reread. Highly recommended if you haven't reread it. Like if you haven't reread it, it is a completely different book. There's something, there's a specific name for this, where you see one thing one way the first time, it's like a puzzle box, and then you see it a different way the second time.

25:35 Optical illusion no. No, no, no, no, no. It's like heavily referenced in Glass Onion, that mystery movie that came out a couple years ago. Whatever. Someone's going to know what I'm talking about, and that is what this book is. Cool. All right, all. Right. Tell me how you felt about A Court of Mist and Fury. I love this book.

25:55 I love this book. I think this is a beautiful, beautiful, beautiful book. I really do. I think it's nearly perfect. My notes is a great, beautiful book and it is nearly perfect until you read A Court of Silver Flames, which is a which is a spoiler for how I feel about A Court of Silver Flames. But I love this book.

26:12 I think this is a beautiful book about love and healing that is cleverly disguised as a romantic. I think it's a romance 1st and that's that is fine with me. I think Farah and Reese's love story and the way that they find each other and the way that they like meet each other where they are and help each other heal is just so beautiful and poignant.

26:36 As I've previously mentioned, I find this writing to be so like emotionally deep. I, I love it. I don't have that much to say about it. I love that Faye released Tamlin. I love that she doesn't end up with Tamlin, right? I feel like we just have two bold choices back-to-back, right? We have her killing two Faye.

26:50 We have her leading Tamlin in the back third of ACOTAR and then in the first third of Miss and Fury. And I feel like those are such brave choices to make as an author. Like, you spend a buck having your readers fall in love with this one guy. And then it's like, Nope, she's going to go with this totally different guy who I kind of made you hate last time.

27:08 And I think that's really brave. Obviously she has become who she is because she made those choices, but I think those are really risky choices. Yeah. Like I love Night Court, I love Valeris, like it's feels so full and rich and lived in and like, I love the inner circle. Like again, they feel like full characters, maybe not as real, but we'll get to him, we'll get his book.

27:31 I'm excited about that. I just love it. I just can't say enough good things about this book. How do you feel about? It, Yeah, it is. I know we're not picking favorites, and I don't even know that it would be #1 but it sure as hell be tied for #1 for me. Like, this book was so beautiful. It healed a part of me I didn't even know was broken, like Pharaoh's brokenness in this book.

27:52 And generally the type of pain that characters feel in these books, like Reese and Nesta too, is to me like so beautiful and complex and like personally something that I find more relatable. Like she didn't have some horrific event where she like got cheated on or someone broke her heart or like there was some crazy plot twists that like meant that who she loved was like terrible or anything like that. She just like changed and did things that she needed to do to get to where she is and like her guilt of that change and like self loathing and wanting different things and becoming a different person just like ate her up inside. And we see it again.

28:29 We see this with other characters, but this is the first time that we did see it in the series and it was like a new type of grief for me. And reading right, like in reading about a character's like ordeals challenges and so that resonated with me so much more and watching her time with Reese like heal her even though she didn't necessarily think that she deserves to be healed was like actually so joyful to read honestly so joyful. Chapter 54 and 55.

28:56 I have read them so many times. I cannot even mostly chapter 54 cannot even count. And him like bringing her out of her shell and showing her who she could be is like the most attractive thing about Reese. Like they're true mates in the sense that no one else in this book has even seen, like no one has been the type of mates that they seem to be.

29:17 And so I loved it. It was sad, but it was happy. I think you raised a really good point, even though the things that led to, I would say Farrah and Tamlin breaking up were magical in plot, right? So it was hurt like it was under the mountain, right? That is kind of ultimately what what breaks them up. You're so right in that it is ultimately at the end of the day, her growing and him not be able being able to handle that or manage that.

29:42 And that is what breaks them up. It is not. It is not a magical thing that breaks them up, It is fundamentally not being able to see each other and like meet each other. Where you're at? And Tamlin just being a piece of fucking garbage in general. But it is and it shows how quickly that can become a really scary situation, right? Like how quickly things can spiral out of control. I think it's a great book.

30:06 I think it's a great fucking book. It's. Just a great love story. It doesn't have too much more to it than that, honestly. Yeah. No, it's not thick on plot, I don't care. I don't care. I don't care. It's a it's a character development book and there are a couple of those in the series and I love them. Like I'm good with them.

30:23 I'm good with their purpose of existing. It is actually. I was just thinking about this. Remember when we talked about we talked about this within period, but this is not a spoiler for Imperian that Rebecca was writing them in like the West format. That is what what this is, right? Like 1-3 and five are heavy on plot and then two and four or more. Well, if you count Frost and Starlight as 4, but two and four are more like character development. Yeah.

30:46 I mean, I'm just assuming that we're all just accepting that a 1/4 frost and Starlight is. I know it came out as 3.5, but like, it's four at this point. Otherwise, Sarah J Maas is about to blow all of our minds with. I know. No, no, no. I think yeah, she did this to herself. Like I know she didn't want to call it a Guitar 4 but. It was a put out of 4th book, Yeah, I think. I don't know whether this is fact at all, but I feel like I read somewhere that the original plan was to have Frost and Starlight and Silver Flames both be novellas, and so that it would be like 3 1/2 and four.

31:21 And then she just couldn't stop writing Silver Flames and thank God. Oh, my God, I don't want to live in that world. Yeah. Oh my. God. OK, so someone tell me whether that's true because I read it somewhere. But as Abby and I can both attest to, we have had lots of fandoms hallucinating recently so. Yeah, you really guys, you've got to verify what you see on social media and I am strictly talking about romanticy at this point in time and not everything else, but like. Generally you should, but specifically romantic. Like, I have seen so many theories about quotes and I'm like, that quote doesn't exist.

31:57 It's literally not in the book. She does not say that. Like it's it's fucking wild. But that's why we're here. And that's why we bring receipts. Indeed. All right, okay, wings and ruin. Important wings and ruin aquar. Honestly, I like this one more than most people do. I think this is probably the one I hear the least about in terms of like appreciation, but I love vengeful Pharaoh in the first half and for someone who doesn't like battle scenes like I'm, I'm not really like a battle scene obsessor. I devoured slowly every single stage of the war with hybrid that they fought.

32:35 I thought it was so beautifully written. It tied emotions of the characters together with visuals of the battle while the plot still ran behind the scenes. Like I loved it. I I really, I actually really appreciated this book, especially on the second read, especially after, you know, after the war kicks off.

32:54 Basically, I really, really enjoyed it. I loved the little Cassie and Anesta hints that we started getting like I was so for that, like from the like awkward moment when Cassie and like basically lays down like swears his life to her when she's still human at their at their property. I just was so excited about that. I love how we start to see how like complex and fierce Nesta is in this book.

33:19 I also really came to loathe more in this book. Like this book to me was like the beginning of Moore's death in my mind. Like this bitch is so mean, Like so mean for no reason to Nesta. But then you start thinking about like the rest of everything and how she's been stringing, stringing so long for centuries for centuries.

33:42 And I'm like what she gave is obviously a very important reason, but like, not a good enough reason to string along Azrael for centuries. Mean mean. Agree with you. We'll talk about more. Do you think? Yeah, we'll get we'll get into it later. Yeah. So this book was the start of that for me. Like 1/4 wings in Ruin. I agree.

34:01 I like vengeful Farrah. I like it's more it's less about her being vengeful. It's that she's like powerful now. It's like she understands how to use her power. And I enjoy seeing that from her. To your point about the battles, I really like that Farrah. At no point does she become an amazing warrior in this book, right?

34:17 At no point is she on the front lines leading the charge. Like, that is not her role. That is not what she's here to do. She stays behind. And I think that's part of why I like it, right? Because like reading fight scenes is like, what am I supposed to do with that? Like, that's not that's not very interesting. But the the version of the war that we get from her eyes is very interesting and there's a lot going on. I also think this is where she really starts to build the world, right?

34:42 We get a lot of lore in this book. Yeah. We get a lot about the Cauldron. We get a lot about Dracon. Dracon and Miriam. Yeah, a lot. Like the world just starts to feel bigger. And you start to feel like, OK, she's starting to have a plan here. And you're thinking, that's funny because it feels like she's wrapping this series up. But then you realize Throne of Glass has eight books. And you're like, maybe she's not wrapping this series up, not even a little bit.

35:06 Yeah. I think there's some weaknesses to this book. I I'm still not clear on what the King of Highburn, Why did he even come to Prythian at all? Why not just go around Prythian and go straight to the continent? Like why did he make the choices that he makes? We can get into that in another episode too. It's a little shaky plot wise.

35:24 Yeah. But it's it's great. I like seeing and I like seeing more of the world too, right. We go to Summer Court, we go to Dawn Court. We go to, we don't go to day court actually, but we go to Winter Court. We like you meet the other high Lords. We get a bigger view of Christian. It just feels like a bigger world. And I really like that.

35:41 And as you mentioned, we get a lot more with Elaine and Nesta. Yeah, I. Love the blossoming of Elaine that we got in this book. Yeah, like, and they again, this is what I was talking about at the beginning. Even with the Archer on sisters who now no one even questioned, well I guess people are like fuck fuck Nesta but they can go fuck themselves as far as I'm concerned.

36:00 But even Elaine in book 1 was painted as an unsympathetic character right? And now like who wouldn't level Even Reese is like Elaine is Elaine, Elaine is Elaine. Like Reese literally says I will never be able to look at your sisters and not think about what they did to you. And then he's like no Elaine is Elaine.

36:16 I love her like. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. So I think it's a good book of the three we've just mentioned. It's at at my bottom, but yeah. Yeah, I also love a couple other things about this. So you mentioned Elaine. I love that she starts to kind of come into her own with Azrael support. I think that starts to tell us more about Azrael that we didn't really process or appreciate. And I also love that monsters became our friends in this book. Maybe not our friends, but our allies. Like characters that have plagued us in prior stories and plot lines become our allies and fight alongside us. And I think that's actually so cool, like. Is that not?

36:55 Is that not this entire story? The monsters that plagued us become our friends this and Fast and Furious that. Those are the two franchises that. Happened. I just loved how the bone Carver was this terrible creature that even Cassie and dreaded seeing and then he found peace and Briaxis was also obviously deeply feared by literally everybody and then came and fought at our side. Like, I loved that element of it. Yeah, I want to talk about those too, at great length. I really do.

37:23 Yeah, and Striga. And Striga, yeah, it's a great book. It's a great book. I don't recommend it as highly as Miss and Fury. This isn't a recommendations episode, though. This is just, if you're reading them, you're reading all of them. So. Yeah. All right. Frost and Starlight. So Frost and Starlight.

37:40 First published as book 3 1/2, then seems to be book 4. Obviously very short. People told me or like social media told me that I would not like this book. This book to me was a warm hug. Like I love that we just got to watch the gang like pal around. We started to see like what being, you know, high Lord and lady is actually like, like it's office work. I love that we started getting more PO VS like we started seeing more inside Reese's head, Moore's head, Cassie and it answers kind of it it to me starts to address some wild conspiracy theories that were coming out at that time about, you know, who's really good, who's really bad, like who feels this way about who like.

38:19 I think a lot of those get start to get cleared up and it sets us up for other books from those PO VS which I found exciting. I find it hilarious still that none of us really know how good of an artist to favorite is. That's one thought that I. Had when reading Oh my God I love have you seen the memes?

38:37 That's like Pharah gives, like Pharah doing the portion of Reese and it's like a stick figure. Like I love them so much. They're so good. Yeah, yeah. I mean, I don't have tons on a Court of Frost in Starlight. Like people hate it. Some people like it. I'm in the group that liked it. I found it non stressful to read.

38:56 It was cute. I like it. The only thing that's an issue to me in this book is that Pharah is fucking insufferable in this book. I actually can't stand well. And that starts her transition. Like, I think that yeah, I think her, the perspective of her from this book onwards is that she's annoying. It's not only that she is annoying.

39:16 Farah treats Nesta in this book the way that Tamlin treated Farah, right? So she sees that Nesta is struggling. She sees that she's not OK and she just kind of is like, whatever, she'll figure it out. I'm not going to get involved here, right? She just, she just leaves her, she just abandoned her and kind of treats her like garbage, right.

39:37 And, and it doesn't really make sense. Like, that's not really what we've been led to believe Favor would do based on everything she's done up to this point. I just, I, I just like can't get past that. Like, I really, I really like she's so into like, charity and helping everyone in the city and helping everyone rebuild.

39:54 And her own sister, who is so clearly struggling, she's like, yeah, not my problem. I'm not going to deal with it. She'll figure it out on her own. And I'm like, Tam, I did this to you. It doesn't work. You know that it doesn't work. Yeah. What the fuck? What are you doing, Tara? Other than that, I agree. It's a warm hug, kind of.

40:12 Until Cassian tries to give Nesta a present and ends up throwing it in the fucking oestros. And that was really sad. Or the Sedra. Sorry, Sedra, that's a different river, different book. Yeah, it's sad. It's a sad way to rap, but it also sets up our next story. Well, and what you said about Pharaoh leaving Nesta in the dust, like, that's another thing that bothered me about how more treated her is.

40:35 Like, this was a version of Farah at one point. Like, Farah did not want to fucking come to the Night Court. Like, she was miserable. She was closed off. She was mean to everyone. She was, like, not kind and open and forthcoming. Like she just was Nesta. Yeah, and instead we're just letting Nesta abscond to some, like, slummy apartment. Yeah, it sucks.

40:55 And I wrote this down South. Pharah's first words to Nesta in this book are Nesta's playing poker with two Fey. And Nesta said, Pharah says so which one are you going home with tonight? So bitchy, such condescension. Like, yeah, be nice, Pharah. Like, help her. Yeah. It's it's it's such a similar journey, right. Pharah arrives at Night Court so broken, and they all welcome her with open arms.

41:19 They're like, here. We'll take you in. And Nestor arrives at Night Court so broken and Cassian is the only one who is like, I will help you. Who is all who's like I I'm see you hurting and that hurts me and I want to make it better anyway. Also, Yeah, I have. Literally the only OK, literally the only difference is that Nesta has been broken for like most of the most of Pharaoh's conscious life.

41:43 Like that's the only difference. Right, right. I mean, so the inner circle, they met Feyra and Nesta like pretty much at the same time. So like, why are they? Yeah, I don't know. There is a lot of lore in this book too. There's just there's a lot of world building, which is nice for us. It's like, yeah, it's an it's an interesting mix of like, nice Christmas story. What am I going to get everyone for Christmas? Nesta?

42:06 We're just going to let her rot in that gross bar over there. Oh, here's all this world building. It's an interesting. Book and Let's Have a Baby. Let's have a baby. Seems like a good time. Yeah. All right. OK. Court of Silver Flames, what was your reaction? When I die, I want you to bury me with this book. Yeah.

42:30 Love this book. I love this book. Yeah, I mean, it is like regardless of whether you're more of like a, whether you enjoy Mist and Fury more like this is the masterpiece of the series. I undoubtedly. Agree, it is everything Mist and Fury is, but it is better like Nest. It has plot, it has plot. It's just Mist and Fury plus plot. And I think I would, I think I know you just said no one has a love story like Reese and Farah, Yes. But I think Cassie and a Nesta have their own amazing, amazing love story.

43:03 Like I think Nesta, her pain feels so real. She's so broken, exactly the same as Farah at the beginning of Miss beginning of fist and Fury, right? She has no way out. She has no one like throwing her bone. What I meant though was no one's mates like Reese and Farah, like they are a different kind of match from Cassian and Nesta. Cassian and Nesta are very different people. Like they're different people.

43:26 Cassian has always been whole. He's always had like this very strong sense of self and he got compliment to Nesta and that she does not. Or she did not. Absolutely. They are opposites. And Risa Farah are are not opposites. Yeah. So I love their love story. I love how good Cassian is to her. Like from the gecko, I know that there are moments where he's not great to her. I've heard complaints about how he treats her on the hike. I think that was some tough love. We should get into that at another point. I just think Nesta's pain feels so much realer and more of a true reaction than the way and that's it. Not to say Faye's pain, the way Faye reacted to pain was not real, but like, anger is a valid

44:11 reaction to pain. People feel anger all the time. Like I have certainly done this, right? We're like, I'm hurting and you just kind of lash out at the people around you. Hopefully they still love you, right? But like, that felt so real. Yeah. And Cassian is so good to her Despite that, right when everyone else abandons her, Cassian is like, I'm here, I will, I'm here for you, right?

44:32 I love that. Also, this book is fun as hell. It is so fun. The adventures that they go on, the sex, fucking great. Love it. Honestly the best of the series. Like, let's just say it out loud. Hands down hands down the best sex scenes of the series. But also the adventures. Except for the trials. Except for Amaranthus trials.

44:51 Honest to God, I think these are the best magic action sequences. Yeah. I will call them that. We get like the bag of word is so good. The scene in the prison is so good, like Ramiel is so good. It is great. It's. And the trove is like the first, like the cauldron just feels. The culture has felt fluffy and like, not solid as like a magical artifact plot piece like the Trove does, not the Trove feels. It feels not out.

45:20 It feels like she actually made a white board. I was like, OK, here are the rules. Like this is what the. Trove does, yeah. I totally agree. I totally agree and I like seeing the story from different characters eyes, right? Like we start to see Reese and Farah differently. We see obviously we see more differently, but it's nice to get a different perspective on this world rather than Reese is perfect, Farah is perfect, they're perfect, right?

45:47 It's it really again, it widens the scope of the universe without actually going anywhere new, right? We're not conquering any new. I guess we go a little bit to the continent, but for the most part, we're still in Prythian. We're retreading old ground, but it feels new and it feels fresh. And I think, I mean, I imagine, I don't know, but it feels like we got our recent favorite trilogy, right.

46:09 Then we had our Christmas episode and now we're getting our Nesta Elaine trilogy as my hope is like, I think we're getting set up for our next 3 bucks here. I think it'll be who knows, But like, we are absolutely getting into our meat and potatoes, right? This is our goblet of fire, basically. Yeah. Like, this is not an addendum.

46:28 This is not the end. This is the yeah. So what do I think? I mean, I I just love Cassie and Ernesto. Like I don't need to add anything in terms of that. Like I think he yes, he is really, really good to her. I think the only thing that, like, irritated me a little bit was the whole like the re emergence of the just sex. Like we're just doing this casually. Like you guys, clearly they cannot stay the fuck away from each other.

46:51 Like, can we stop playing? Yeah. But who among us hasn't played that game before? I could forgive. It. I know. Yeah. I forgive it. But I've just like about that. I was like, come on, guys, we're adults here, but they're really not. They're actually very young. Well, Nesta's Nesta. 'S pretty old fuck.

47:07 But love that love their whole romance. I really actually liked and people like use this in different ways, but I really liked that we started seeing recent affair of more as how they claim to be perceived. Like in this this whole series so far, Reese's like talking about his like facade of being like a monster and being high Lord and cold and like his power is described as dark.

47:31 Like I know that he's a very dark character to everybody else, but we never see that because we're seeing him from his mates perspective or from within his own head or from his best friends. And this is the first book where I feel like we get a taste of what that actually looks like and I find it helpful to understand when I reread.

47:48 Honestly, I'm like, yeah, you seem like cold governors basically like who make tough calls and maybe aren't the most understanding all the time and I like appreciated seeing them from that perspective and favorite we start to see in that as well, which I find interesting we. Appreciate that we see choices that Reese makes with Eris specifically that don't really make any sense, right?

48:13 Because we're told time and time again that Reese has plans, right? To us that Reese has plans. Tarkin specifically says this has plans on plans and you will not know that you're even part of those plans until they're over, right? He will not tell you what they are and we've never really seen that because.

48:27 He and Cassian has said too, like his best friend is like Reese has had plans that make my heart stop dead. Right. And now we're kind of getting that because you're like, Reese, what the fuck are you doing with Eris here? Like, what is going on? What are you thinking? And it's kind of cool to see the follow through on that. Yeah.

48:45 And I also love this kind of gets back to what you were saying, but I love there are moments, I don't have the specific post, but there are moments where the inner circle is ganging up on Nesta. And Cassian is like, I hate the way they're talking about Nesta or I hate the way Reese is talking about Nesta. And he like, or he'll like position himself to protect Nesta against the inner circle.

49:06 And I love that. I just love like, he's like, no, fuck you guys, you're wrong on this. And I'm not scared to tell you that you're wrong on this, You know, like, I don't care. I don't care what they think. Like when Nesta's like, your friends are going to know we're together, aren't they? Aren't they going to think it's a bad idea? And he's like, I don't care.

49:22 I don't. Care and the one thing that I like really wish I knew or like wish I was in Reese's POV 4 is the fucking decision he made to not tell Farrah that her pregnancy was fatal. Like that to me was like the first thing that Reese has ever done where I'm like, dude, I do not get this one. Like what the fuck, man?

49:44 Awful. I don't know. I don't really have a justification for that. I think that's. Of course. Yeah. Neither of us will. Yeah. Yeah, that was tough. As a Reese lover, that was tough. Yeah, I mean, none of these characters are perfect. And that's kind of part of the fun of it. Just because we think Reese made the wrong call there doesn't mean that we are like, well, fuck Reese.

50:02 We're done with him. You know, it's these characters are complex. You know, they always make tough choices. And clearly with Reese, like Reese has been making tough choices since J one. Yeah. And they did bind their lives to each other, so. Not to quote Amaran was one of the dumbest fucking things they could have possibly done.

50:21 Really. I think I'm. Paraphrasing Amaran, like when they did it, it was all of two sentences and that happened and I was like a little more forethought, guys. That's a poorly worded bargain. Like the actual words of those that bargain was. We will leave this world, leave this world together. Yeah, I'm just gonna put that out there.

50:41 We'll let that hang. Yes. So we'll probably get into the various bargains at some point. Yeah. I'm. Sorry. All right. So now we're going to dig into some questions. There are reaction based questions so we'll just answer them in our typical format. Abby, who is your favorite character from the Acatar series And you cannot pick favorite or resend? OK, based on everything we've just said, do you know the answer?

51:09 I actually don't know which one you're going to pick. I think I'm going to pick one and you're going to pick the other. So then I know which one you're going to pick, I think. Cassian. Yeah. Tell me what I just said. I love him. I love him, OK? Like, he loves a woman who is hard to love, right?

51:27 And are we not all women who are hard to love? And do we not just want someone who will love us anyway? Like, Oh my fucking God, I love him so much. Reese loves someone who is easy to love, right? That's not that hard. Yeah, Reese is the hard one to love, unfortunately, which he acknowledges he does.

51:46 I just, I just love him. I just love him. Like, first of all, you know, I have a thing for guys with longer hair. So that works indeed, for some reason in my head also, can I just say like I always pictured Tassian as a dirty blonde. I know that he's not like I know that he's not, but I pictured him as like not dirty blonde, but like my hair color, yes, which I also feel like is you.

52:06 Well, that's and he's not I. Mean that's what yes, I know. Well, I think I texted you this. There's like he is described canonically as black hair, but there's so much fan art where he has sandy brown hair. Like I think it's the fan art's fault honestly. Yeah, it works with Sandy Brown. I just think the way that Cassian loves Nesta is so, so good. Like he he supports her, but he's not overbearing. He even says when she gets abducted and has to go through the blood, right, He says he would never take away the chance for her to save her yourself, which I think is just so, so beautiful, such a beautiful idea. Again, contrast that to Tamlin, right, like where Tamlin would just like do absolutely fucking

52:49 nothing or like not even let her right, Like and Cassian is like, I recognize that you have to do this and I and I'm giving you space to do it right. Like it's very much the not the let them, but he's like she has to do this and and it's not even go ahead. He's he's just willing to go through a lot of pain himself for her.

53:09 That is the overarching theme, in my opinion. When she ends up in the blood, right? He's like, I know that the worst thing that's going to come out of this is my pain about the situation that she's in. And I can sit with that. Love that. Can I just, I have more things to say about Cassian. Can I just do a side note here? Debunking a popular theory?

53:27 OK Cassian, Sorry Nesta, Gwynn, and Emery all get kidnapped and thrown into the blood, right? Right. Cassie and Nesta are mates. Cassian is freaking the fuck out. Cassian is with Azrael. Azrael is not freaking the fuck out. If Azrael and Gwynn were mates, Azrael would be freaking the fuck out. Anyway, that's my debunking that theory anyway. We'll get into an Azrael episode. Aside from that theory debunking, he's good to everyone.

53:54 It's not just Nesta. He is good to absolutely everyone he meets, right? He's a little sassy when we first meet him. That's fine. I don't think we fully figured out the character. But like there's literally not a single person that he is mean to or bad to even Eris by the end, right? Who he should kind of hate, right?

54:08 Eris like wanted to marry Nesta. He says to him, I think you're a good male. Like he's good to everyone. He is such a champion of women too. Like the way that he is trying to get the girls trained in Illyria because of his mom. Oh my God, his father. I know when the Illyrian thing basically doesn't work out, he's basically like, fuck you, I'm gonna train these women myself.

54:29 And he just kind of sets up camp with Nesta and trains all the priestesses and like, yeah, he's doing way more than Reese's this front, right? Like he's. A champion of woman. Well, he does that with Pharaoh too. He's like, alright, we're training like you're gonna, I'm not leaving you defenseless.

54:45 Like you're not even my mate. You're my best friend's mate. So like, come along, we're going to make you a fighter like this. Relationship with Pharah is so good too. Like they're so like there's a moment where he knocks her shoulder with his wing and he's like, he says something, it's in silver flames and he's like, most males would be so territorial about it. But like Pharah and Reese are like are like totally chill because like they understand that I need the physical contact like and it's just such a like unusual thing for a man to admit.

55:13 I feel like, but he's like, no, I get it. I had a horrible childhood. So I like to be touched like and I just like that's such, that's. So mature, yeah, their relationship also when they yeah, their relationship is actually so good, like when they go to the prison too. I'm like, I just love them. I just.

55:29 Love them and when he gets. Mad at her. I. Know when he gets mad at her, we're thinking she wasn't essential. I know, I know he gets mad at her because she didn't tell him that she was high lady and she didn't think she was essential and like I just want him in my life. Yeah. And this is another skill that I think gets overlooked a lot. He is the greatest warrior, the greatest Illyrian warrior in centuries, right?

55:56 And he will only use fighting as a last resort. He is always, always, always trying to defuse situations with words before he launches into a fight, right? Like, he's always, like, positioning himself between people. He's always, like, cracking a joke. Like, he's always like, hey, let's talk about this instead. Like, he really only uses violence as an absolute last resort.

56:18 Yeah, which says a lot. Considering he would win basically every. Fight he would win every fight, he would win every fight and. Yeah, I. Just cannot say enough about this man. Yeah, he is great. All right, Ronnie, why is your favorite character Nesta? So I actually chose. I had a backup in case you said that.

56:37 No, I knew you were going to fake Nesta so. But she is my favorite character and what I'll say about that because I know like I am on social media, I have friends who read the series. I know people really hate Nesta and find her unforgivable. And people that hate Nesta and find her unforgivable. I'm super happy for you because it means that you have never had mental illness.

56:55 However, like that's an exaggeration. I'm not coming after people who you know, they're all forms of mental. Illnesses. But like does mean like you've never. Felt this had self loathing like yeah, yeah, she she is mentally ill. She is a controversial character who just needed therapy. And unfortunately, the closest thing that we have to therapy in Prythian is training with Cassian. And you know what that does fix it. When she started doing Prythian therapy, she became pretty Dang likable.

57:23 Like she did, like I said, like I just love the non traditional form of grief that she goes through, like forms of self loathing that make you absolutely want to hate her. Like grab her shoulder, shake her, she goes all the way down to rock bottom. And then we get this beautiful story of her with all sorts of amazing symbolism, like the stairs in the House of Wind and how she's like, some days are good, some days are bad. Sometimes she can't make it more than 100 steps. Some days she's in such a good place that she can make it to like almost the bottom and then almost back up. And I just think like her development is unlike any other character that we've seen yet in this series. I think Azrael has a path there

58:04 as well, but I think she's she is the most complex character I think in this series so far. And also I just love her. And I also think she's just a badass and is obviously stunning and perfect. I love. So feminist like love. Her. She's such a feminist. And I love, as you brought up, her recovery, for lack of a better word, her journey.

58:28 It's not linear. She has good days. She has bad days. You know, you think she's all better. You think she's not going to do something that will really hurt her and the people around her. And then and then she does, right? Yeah. And whether that comes from a place of love or self loathing, we're not really sure.

58:43 But yeah, it's not it's not linear. The way she's treated is bullshit, as previously mentioned, like a lot of the people around her are just being really terrible to her. And she kind of says like, fuck you guys, I'm going to heal anyway you. Know Yeah, yeah, she's so great. Yeah. She's also my favorite character because she has such a cool place in this story. Like she is the queen of death.

59:05 Like how fucking sick is that? She can now use the dread trove without being driven mad. She can put on the mask. She literally has the power of death. Like she actually has such a she is such a cool plot device in this series as well as just being like a really well developed character. I think Nesta is more powerful than Farrah, I'm willing to put that.

59:27 On her, I think she's the main character I. Think Nesta is the main character. I kind of agree. Like it's like, yeah, what Farrah could do is cool making little water animals. That's it's fun, but. Like all right, don't do favor like that. Like she can actually can do more than make little water animals, but she does have the power. She has like a drop of power from each high Lord, not the power of the cauldron.

59:50 There is a moment, there is a moment where Nesta wakes up and is engulfed in flames. And that is a key from Sarah J Maas that this woman is way more powerful than she has realized yet, right? That happens in another place. We won't get into it, but like, I think that is a hey, neon sign. Nesta is really fucking important. You should pay attention to Nesta. That's my thinking.

1:00:15 I think also we have yet to see what's left, right? Like she gives power back, but we know that she's allowed to keep some. So we'll see, yeah. We see a little, but yeah, yeah, that's fair. Yeah. And we can talk about it later, but the way that I picture this is like she and the mother are friends. I think that she will continue to be really powerful because she is in the good graces of the horses of power, right? I think she's going to be important. Right.

1:00:45 Pharaoh doesn't have the mother whispering in her ear the way that Nesta seems to. I'm so excited when we start talking about Nesta. There's so much to get into. Yeah, I just love her. She's my favorite. Did we mention Yeah. All right, so if you're looking for recent favorite lovers, we are. But we're really Cassie and a Nestle.

1:01:02 Lover. Yeah. Yeah, all right. Who's your least favorite character and why? More More is my least favorite character. I just don't like her. I get a bad vibe. Like I know that we have good good enough reason to like her. I know she's Reese's cousin. I know we get her PO VS we like. She generally seems benevolent, she's defensive of Cassie and I get the sense that Sarah J masks like wants us to like her, but she's been straining along Azrael for literal centuries. Same with Cassian in a way she is horrible to Nesta and if she had approached her with the same like love and understanding that she had approached Pharaoh with, I think Nesta would have been so different and so good so much

1:01:41 earlier. I literally made a list of the things that more has thought seemingly were good ideas. One sleep with Cassie and Azrael practical brother because she thought it would be better long term for Azrael than sleeping with Azrael himself. Like girl what? Sleep with literally anybody else like you.

1:01:58 Literally. Only know two people. Yeah, you just need to sleep with somebody who wasn't your cousin to, like, make you sullied so that you wouldn't have to marry heiress. Like, why Cassie? And like, why put everybody through that? Why continue stringing him along for centuries and flirting with Cassie and like a good amount while you do it?

1:02:17 And then when Cassie mate finally shows up, be horrible to her and drive her away from the inner circle. I could see her being suspect and maybe have something lurking beneath her and we'll talk more about more, obviously. But I think there's a reason that Reese gave Ameren second and Moore third. Like, I'm not big on Moore.

1:02:33 I don't like her. I just don't. I also feel like her power is super underutilized and I don't like that she's not. I don't know that she's choosing to not be more helpful, but she's like not helpful. Like she's ranked above Cassian and Nazreal not because of rank, like because of royalty, but because of power.

1:02:49 Like Reese explicitly says that he would call in more when Cassie and Nazreal are dead. Her power. Makes no sense because not only she says her power is truth, not only does she lie, she is lied to and she does not know that she's being lied to. So like, what is this power? How does this make any sense? Yeah.

1:03:07 Yeah, so I mean, I actually think she's a really interesting character, but as far as like people that I just am not big on, I'm like, I don't like more. I don't like her. Her treatment of Nesta I mean. And I'll say this now because Sarah J Mass always turns things on their head. So again, I reserve the right to change my mind later.

1:03:24 Her treatment of Nesta is indefensible and unforgivable as far as I'm concerned. Like there is nothing Nesta did not do anything to more right. Nesta also did not string Cassian along. That's not what was happening. It's like, as far as I can read it, Moore saw that Cassian like Nesta Nesta was like kind of being a bitch to Cassian.

1:03:43 And so Moore decided that she hated Nesta without ever talking to Cassian about it. Like it it's just so weird. It's such weird behavior. Or it was more saw that Nesta was going to like take Cassian away from her and got jealous and like decided also horrible. It's I don't know, and I mean, we just talked about Nesta. How Nesta those horrible things out of self loathing. So if we find out that that's what's happening with more, OK, but it just seems like petty jealousy. Yeah, I know.

1:04:10 And I'm OK with having my mind changed about more. Like, again, I think she's interesting. She's clearly powerful. Maybe she'll turn it around. Like she hasn't had that moment yet, in my opinion, where her value is super clear and obvious. Yeah. And so I think that's to come, but it just seems catty and I don't.

1:04:30 Like, and I'll just say for all of this, we can only go off of what's been written, right? Like we could, we could speculate to the cows come home about what will happen in future books. But like, yeah, like these opinions are as of today, as of Silver flames is the latest book that's out right. So this could change.

1:04:45 Could change, but yeah. And I'll be the first to say if I suddenly am obsessed with more, but right now I'm not. Yeah. Who is your least favorite character? So I. Had an answer here, but I might change it on the fly because if I'm being honest, in my heart of hearts my least shape of character is Tamlin by a mile. Yeah.

1:05:04 And we are doing, we are recording a Tamlin deep dive very soon. So you guys will hear more about that. The undercurrent of violence and rage that that is in all of Tamlin's actions in the first book is just, is just terrifying. Yeah. Inexcusable. Like this is. This is like abuser behavior 101. Yeah.

1:05:27 He literally explodes. He destroys furniture. He throws a table at Pharaoh. I know that's in Book 2, and I know she defends herself, but he had no way of knowing she would be able to defend herself, right? He does it twice. He does it in Book 3 too. Yeah, and his. Flaws are constantly coming out.

1:05:43 Lucian shows up at in Valeris covered in bruises because him and Tamlin got in a fight like he he is just and I and I and I know that like hurt people hurt people. I know we're getting set up for a Tamlin redemption arc. As I've previously stated, I can only go with what's been written so far. And like, out of the gate, he is a bad fucking guy. Like there's just no excuse for, for his behavior as far as I'm concerned.

1:06:10 We'll get into that more in the next episode, but it's really I, I just really can't get past the the inability for him to control his emotions and his rage like that. It's just, it's just not OK in my opinion. So that wasn't the answer I had prepared. That was my off the cuff mark, but that's how I truly feel.

1:06:27 Yeah, I agree with you. His redemption arc has started, but it doesn't excuse the fact that he like he's still to your point, he's just like, he's a guy who beats his wife. Like what do you do with that? What do you do with that? How do you how do you justify that? Yeah, like no matter who you are, no matter what you do, like you're still a guy who beats his wife.

1:06:49 Yeah, and his best friend, like, beat his best friend up. Like, you can try to justify it till the cows come home. But I have seen so much on social media about, like, how excited people are for Tamlin's redemption arc. And I'm like, can you go reread ACUTAR, please, Please. There's so much violence in that book and it's just it's just kind of like slightly off frame because favor doesn't want to see it. But like literally Google his claws came out like that's his tell or don't Google it.

1:07:15 Search for it in your Kindle. That's his tell. It happens so often. It's when he can't control his temper, right? He can't control his anger. He's like simmering and his claws come out, which is really scary. Like, and someone I actually did kind of get into it in social media a bit with someone because they were like, do you think someone, anyone else in this in this story is an abuser? And I'm like, has anyone else thrown a table at their mate? At their not their mate, but at their wife? Like, no, yeah, that's why two cents. If you guys want to not listen to me anymore because of that, that's fine.

1:07:43 But like, I just think this guy's straight up beating up his wife. So that's it for yeah. Yeah. Who is the pick that you didn't share? Well, it is Lucian, but I do think Lucian is also a victim of Tamlin's rages moods. Let's say I don't like Lucian because I think if he is Elaine mate, he's being really terrible as a mate.

1:08:02 He's just being so inactive. But that's because like, look at what Tamlin did. He's learning from the best of them. I'm I'm willing for Lucian to have more to do in later books, but it's kind of like he was there in book one. I thought he was good in book one but I didn't. Think he was great necessarily.

1:08:18 Yeah. I thought Lucian in in book 3 was Lucian in book 3. Is good, but whose side is he on? Right? It's, it's very weird because he's being like, OK, so let's just talk about this like. Mourning his best friend. So that's tough. He has to know. He knows that Pharaoh is spying on them, right? Because his eye can see, he. Definitely knows all.

1:08:42 The time so he can see the tattoo, Right? So like, he knows what's going on and he just kind of goes along with it, which is just like, strange behavior because he's so obsessed with Elaine that he wants to go see Elaine. Is that what's happening here? Yeah, it's very strange behavior. Yeah. Who he then like, I don't know, I guess.

1:09:00 I know he's under strict words. My thing with with Lucian is his inaction. But that's what kind of grinds my gears. Kind of like, what are you doing? Are you going to are you going to take charge? You're going to do anything here? You're just going to sit back and let things happen to you. But I don't hate him because of that the way that I hate talent. In conclusion.

1:09:15 Yeah. OK, good. OK, great. Good talk. Feel like I got some things off my chest. I'm so glad for you. I can't wait for a Lucian episode now. Or an episode will be fine, yeah. Lucian Okay, so our next question was who is your sleeper pick character? It can be a sleeper pick for anything, but you need to explain why it's a sleeper pick. You're going first.

1:09:39 My sleeper pick character is the House of Wind because the House of Wind. I think in my mind this is not Canon but loves a romance novel and therefore does things throughout the entire Silver Flames plot to push Cassie and a Nesta together because it wants to see them together and I fucking love that. The House of Wind is also Nesta's best friend. And he?

1:10:00 Says this friend. It's so. Sweet. I love it when the House of Wind gives them all the like. Toys basically for their sleepover. It's so it's so great. I love it. One of my favorite things about A Court of Silver Flames is that we like are going down like a Pixar fairy tale route where like nest is just like befriending a magic house. I love that.

1:10:22 And it works. It works. It works. Yeah, it works. It's a house. What's yours? I feel like this isn't as sleeper pick of a pic as the house. Like the house is very obscure but mine is Eris. I love Eris. Like I am as of Silver flames, like objectively an Eris fan. I think I was an Eris fan even by the time I started Frost and Starlight. Eris is just in case you need a refresher. Eldest son of the High Lord of the Autumn Court, whose name is Baron and he's terrible.

1:10:52 Baron is terrible. I personally don't think that Eris is terrible. I think that Eris is the next coming of the Reese persona. Exactly. We've been given plenty of reasons to believe that he might be that type of character. He reveals that he got Lucian to the spring border. He saved him from the fate of his brothers and kind of did what he could.

1:11:12 And multiple times, like when like even the more situation was brought up, heiress is like you don't know anything about what happened, which it's just it's a little it's still a little sleeper in my opinion, because we also get Moore's memory of it and it's pretty damning, But I hate Moore. I think he he also knows, like he strongly alludes to the fact that he knows the Moore is gay and he kept that secret.

1:11:38 I think he's a good human being. He regrets what happens, what happened. And he even says to Reese he's like, not all of us are so lucky with their friends and family. I think his vibe for power is a good thing for us. I think like us being the inner circle, like I think things will change once he's in that seat, so.

1:11:56 I totally agree. I think we're getting set up. I think we're getting set up for great arc for Eris. Most importantly, he knows things he shouldn't know. I don't want to get into it here because it's kind of more mass for spoilers, but he knows Moore's sexuality is one of them. He knows things about Prithian that no one seems to know but that are correct.

1:12:18 So it's like, how did he know those things? I think we're getting set up for a lot, a lot with Eris. He also at one point kind of implies that his brothers are not his brothers. And I'm like, who are OK? Are they not your father's son? Or are you not your father's son? Eris? Like what's happening here, which would be interesting.

1:12:35 And we're getting all the Reese parallels. And now I'm like, fuck it. I don't really think that's what I'm like. Is Eris Reese's son? I don't think so, but let's find out. That would be crazy. That would be crazy. The thing that I can't pinpoint is like, I want, I want Eris to like make it. And right now I don't have a great love interest in mind for him.

1:12:54 I just kind of feel like if you're gonna do that, like you need one. We'll see. One will crop up, I'm sure. I'm sure we'll meet someone. I mean, maybe Bossa. Yeah, maybe Alasa and Jury and our Lucian. True. Yeah, I was more going off of like, it would be cute if Lucian was friends with this person already.

1:13:11 One point, I can't remember why I thought this, but I thought we were getting set up for perhaps Eris and Elaine, but I can't remember why I thought that. Also, Eris wants to marry Nesta and he says he has his own reasons for it and like what are the like? We just have so many interesting questions around Eris. He's so interesting.

1:13:28 I think there's so much to talk about there. I'm excited to do it. Big Eris fan. Nice Libra pick. Yeah, I think that's a good one. So I know it seems like we're really liking the least liked characters in this series. However, we have reasons. I promise. OK, all right, so next we're going to talk about our top three favorite moments of the series. I'm curious whether we overlapped. I wouldn't be surprised I actually chose more than three in case we did, but I still have my 3:00 that I want to say. My first favorite moment of the series was Azrael and Cassie and landing on the ice to save Farrah and Lucia. That scene.

1:14:04 I need it in film. I need it in film. Like the like this is where like CG Mass's writing is just so good for this stuff. Like slamming into the ice as they land. Like I literally just picture it in my head to a score of music. I have a. Score. I have a fucking soundtrack for this. It's a wild, it's Oh my God, so good, so good. So just context because context is important. Fair.

1:14:29 And Lucian are escaping the Spring Court. They're trying to make their way to the Night Court, but they both get poisoned with Fabian. They don't have access to their powers, so they're like trudging through ice and trying to survive. And Lucian's brothers, brothers, half brothers find them and are like terrorizing them and their magic is coming back but not fast enough.

1:14:50 And they're like losing this battle basically. And then Cassian and Azrael land and start engaging. And like Azrael and Lucian are fighting side by side, like engaging the brothers that aren't heiress basically. And then Cassie and Farah are fighting heiress. And it's just so like, if and when that is made in cinema, like bury me with that it's. So good.

1:15:12 It's so good. It really is. Yeah, I have. That's so good. A great fucking moment. Yeah, I have no notes on that one. OK, you do 1. I'm also going to pivot and change mine because I had Pharaoh's last challenge under the mountain, but we really already talked about it. So I'm going to say instead that's kind of A2 parter. I'm going to say Cassian and Nesta in the battle of the against the king of Hybrid in the last battle. Two parts to that.

1:15:37 The first when she screams Cassian and saves his life because she knows what's about to happen and he pulls her away. She pulls him away from the cauldron exploding and saves his life. Like I think I started crying like just fucking gut wrenching because for the double knowledge one that she cared enough, obviously she cared enough to save his life, but she was like devastated, right?

1:15:57 She's like, and they have no connection. They haven't even kissed yet, right? Like they're kind of like frenemies at this point. And she's like, Oh my God, he's about to die, have to save his life. That. The knowledge that he will bear that like his whole squadron died, but he got to survive. Like the guilt that that will have for him because Nesta happened to love him, right?

1:16:17 That saved his life. The second part, I have no regrets in life, but this, that we did not have time, like, Oh my God, my God, that light, just incredible. And then they're going to die together. They just decide like we're just going to die together. We know when. She lays her body when she. Lays her body over his like Oh my God Oh my God like and again nothing. They haven't even kissed, like there is nothing there except. To do that, I think at that point they have. Yeah, he kisses.

1:16:45 He kisses her, like very gently. It's just so beautiful. It's so good, so good. It's so good, so good. Yeah, yeah, that a whole that a whole battle, man, like I'm. Yeah. But what was good about that battle is that it was made-up of these small personal moments, right? That's what everyone says, but that's what she did. It was not swords and Spears and whatnot. It was just these moments.

1:17:09 It was great. Yeah. So good. OK, I am pivoting a little bit because that's fine. I also had that one. Sorry. No, no, no. It's good though because another one of mine was also part of that battle. I don't know why this hit me so hard, but the beginning of that final battle when Pharah and Reese both surprise each other with the bone Carver and Briaxis like Pharaoh was like surprised I brought the bone cover and Briaxis and Reese was like, well, shit, I brought Shriega and I'm like, so like they show up.

1:17:38 They're like surprising each other. It's like a goosebumps moment because it's like they're mating present. And then Reese and like mists this midsection of the army. And I was like, OK. Feel like the misting is just not used enough. We just don't talk about the misting. At all. He was like Pan afterwards.

1:17:54 So I think it does take like quite a lot, but like yeah, that whole that I mean the whole battle is spectacular, like amrons plot twist of freeing herself to kill them all. Pharaoh, like seeing everything that you just described through the cauldron. The cauldron Elaine with truth Teller stabbing the king of highborn.

1:18:13 Like honorable mention to when Ezrael lent Elaine truth Teller. Oh my God. We probably need to have a truth teller episode. Yeah, we need a Truth Teller episode. Yeah, I have more notes on Truth Teller than I probably do on Farrah, to be honest. Yeah, Yeah. OK. So that was my second one was the beginning of the battle.

1:18:33 Right, my second one does not have to do with battles at all. It is Reese and Farrah in the human city when they are aggressively pawing at each other. The reason? Wait so this was pre her emergence is highlighting. This is book 2. This is not book 3. This is when she's just on top of his lap and he's like touching, caressing.

1:18:56 They both realize they they are turning each other on. I love it because of the restraint. I feel like this is really where you get to understand who Reese is at at his core. Right? Like he wants her so badly and she clearly wants him, but he's still like, no, I'm not, I'm not doing this. I'm not doing this until like she's ready.

1:19:16 I don't think she's ready. Like, and she's clearly not ready, right? Because then they fly off and he she like kind of freaks out, but it's it's the restraint that he shows. And obviously the second part of this is when him saying it's natural, it's your body's reaction because obviously of what he went through with Amor.

1:19:32 Yeah, right. And like, he knows he knows what it is to be aroused, but not to actually be saying yes and to being consenting, right? It's such a complex interaction. It shows that the two of them are just so In Sync. So like on the same page as each other. I just think it's really, it's really beautiful.

1:19:52 It's really sexy on Reese's part, if I'm being honest. Like it's, I just think it's I think it's a great moment. I think it's not a moment you typically get in any other book that would have led to them having sex, right? But this is this is not that book. And I love it. Yeah, I think you get so much there. Like you obviously you get Reese's like little reveals as you mentioned of like what he went through and, you know, just your body reacting.

1:20:17 Don't stress out. This isn't you. But it also reveals like, kind of like the doubt that he had, like he knew at this point that they were they were mates. But like, he's still in the back of his mind in that moment was like, she doesn't want this. Like, I can't force this on her, right. Yeah. So attractive of him, honestly. I am.

1:20:37 I am a reef lover, as you know. OK. My third. Are we on your third? Are we on your second? We're on your third. Oh, I guess I, I called my second the beginning of that finally. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I have 4. But like, I'm just going to do. Your third, do your third, yeah. My third favorite moment was Nesta's breakdown when she says that she deserves Eris and not Cassian. Like that scene, my God, I cried during that. Like when she.

1:21:04 So context is important. So Cassian gives her the symphonia, he gives her music. And she didn't even know that there was a way that music could be given, but he found a way to give it to her. It was obviously like a deeply meaningful gift. And it all just hits her at once that like, he is so good and she is her.

1:21:21 Whether she thinks she's good or not, she is her. And she's like, I don't deserve you. I saying yes to Eris because I deserve someone like Eris. Like I deserve. I don't think Eris is terrible, but she's like, I deserve someone terrible and like, I can't do this. And Kathy and is like, fuck that noise, basically. And we are never going to be with anybody else ever. And she was like, yeah.

1:21:43 And that the scene was perfect. It was perfect. It's it's so funny because we just said with Reese, oh, it's so good that he showed the restraint and Cassian in this scene is not showing any restraint, but it's still you got to know when to push and you got to know when to. Yeah. And like, they were needed restraint. Like Nesta needed the opposite.

1:22:00 Nesta needed like Nesta needed someone to be like, actually I'm 1000% in on you. Yeah, and this is happening. Yeah, and he was. Oh my God, I love him so much. I love. Him. So OK, my third favorite moment is Nesta and Cassian in the prison. A couple of reasons. So this is when we get the harp. Nesta and Cassian when they go to the prison to get the harp, think we get the harp.

1:22:25 So this is our second trove item. But the first time they go get the mask, Nesta is kind of this helpless damsel. She doesn't really do anything. Cassian literally drops her in a tree and says stay there, don't leave this time they face. She gets the heart by herself first of all, like Cassian can't come with her, so she has to do it by herself. She goes through the wards, she grabs the heart. But then what the harp does is unlock the wards on Lanthus's cell.

1:22:48 And we know for context, Lanthus is this like horrible monster. We don't really know what he is. He doesn't really have a corporeal form. But she accidentally frees Lanthus and they have to face him. And Cassian has this great line where he was like Cassian knew two things He was about to die and he was going to do everything he could to save Nessa's life until he did right?

1:23:05 So again, it's showing their love. She does run away, but she she comes back, she cuts, she realizes what she's doing. She's like, I can't, I can't leave him, like I have to go back. And she really, this is kind of where she realizes how powerful she is, right. So she is the one who like forces Lanthus to become corporeal.

1:23:22 I she actually kills Lanthus like Cassian throws A dagger at him, but she's the one who actually, I think she beheads him and like slices him in half. Like it's Nesta coming into her not full power, but more fully accepting that she is like a trained warrior. She doesn't have to run away. Like it's kind of remember the moment where is like you forgot with with Pharaoh, like reasons that you forgot that you had all these powers. This is Nesta.

1:23:44 That's for a great moment. This is Nesta. Not right. This is Nesta remembering. Oh, yeah. I'm a warrior. I've trained with Cassie and I have this badass knife on my back or sword on my back that I can do things with like I've I have been made. So we think it's just a really great. It's them. It's we've got the harp with the lore.

1:24:01 We've got Nesta coming into her own. We've got Lanthus and his whole deal as lore. And we have these just great moments with Cassie and Ernesto, like. And there's a moment where Lanthus says if I didn't you, Faye, are so blind. Like, you're so clearly. And then Cassian throws A dagger at him to cut him off because he doesn't want him to say that him and Nesta are mates. But like, they're so clear.

1:24:23 Like, Cassian so clearly knows that Nesta is his mate at this point. Yeah. Just love it. Yeah, just love it. They're the best. Yeah, neither one of us said Chapter 54. It's on my list my The two that I didn't say that I had as backups in case we have the same ones were Pharah punching through and burning through Cassian's pads and she's like, it should have been me.

1:24:48 Pharah, yeah. Yeah, Pharah. Yeah, yeah. And then chapter 54. That's a great. One if you know, you know. We'll say no more about it. Chapter 54 Be honest with you. Can I say more about it? Yeah, you can. Yeah. I just assumed we didn't want to talk about it, but you can. It doesn't stay with me the way the smaller moments do. At the end of the day, 54, while great, is just exposition, right?

1:25:10 It is an expedition dump. It is just getting everything we've just seen through Reese's eyes instead of Pharaoh's. It does explain a lot, but it is not a moment you know. It is not a. It's not. It's a moment when you read it for the first time. Maybe we're far gone enough because I agree with you.

1:25:27 To me, there was actually so much there. And we can talk more about whether it was like a De Mahdi thing that he was able to like almost access his mate even like when there was a whole wall between them and they had literally never met. But like, she was on that planet at the same time as him, and he knew and influenced her existence in a way, and she influenced his.

1:25:50 And that, that to me, was a big, big reveal. I totally agree with you and it's a great reveal, but it is a tell versus a show. Right. So with with you, but you just mentioned where Farrah is punching through the punching bags and then Reese grabs her and wraps her in his wings and like cocoons her.

1:26:09 That's a show. Right. Even before that, when Cassian just like stay, his hands were bare and he was like, I can take it. Like do you need it? Right. And I to get back to what Sarah J Maas does so well is she does the showing, not telling most of the time. Chapter 54 is an exception. I think we're totally fine with it. Yeah, but it is the showing of the how characters feel about each other rather than the telling, which is so good in my mind.

1:26:34 Yeah, she's good. Fucking good. She's good. There's a reason she's so successful. I know she allegedly lived somewhere around here. Yeah, she was meant. On the street, yeah. I was looking out for you. Lived in your building. All right, all right. Well, that's all we had as far as questions for ourselves.

1:26:56 Those are our reactions to the books that are published in the Agatar series. Thank you for listening. We are on social media. We are on Instagram, TikTok, YouTube as Dragons in the Details pod. Our e-mail address is dragonsinthedetailspod@gmail.com. Please feel free to e-mail us your theories, this comment.

1:27:17 We love hearing from you guys. It's the best part of doing this whole thing. Like I think my theories would be way less creative if we didn't have you guys leaving thought provoking comments. And so we appreciate you for that. And this officially marks our first episode of our Akutar season. So for feedback and we're super excited to dig into it.

1:27:37 We're so excited. If you guys couldn't tell by I, I thought that was a very enthusiastic episode for us. So we're very excited. We are also on Discord so. We're also on Discord, we have a discord server, the links in our BIOS all take you there, and we also have book recommendations from our community. Just visit our Lincoln bio their stuff. And everything's always LinkedIn. Our show notes too.

1:27:58 Also LinkedIn the show notes, so whatever platform you're listening on. They're there. We're there, We're there. All right. Thanks for listening. Love you. Bye. Thanks for listening. Bye.