Crystal Lake Season 1 Review & Spoilers Discussion

0:03 Hello, ladies and gentlemen, and welcome to Crystal Lake Season 1 Review?

0:10 Series Review?

0:11 I don't know.

0:11 Who knows?

0:12 We'll talk about it. I am the chef, Tresnell.

0:16 I'm joined by.

0:17 I am the Argonaut, Taylor Field.

0:21 Yes, ladies and gentlemen, I'm joined by the Argonaut. If you're wondering....

0:26 You have to tune the video to find out why Taylor is sounding the way he's sounding. Not the only time this appearance is going to happen, but here we are talking about Crystal Lake.

0:36 We have binged it.

0:37 This came out last Thursday, and we are here to talk about it. We will still do an overall non-spoilers opening, so probably about 15, 20 minutes up top. We're just going to give our views, our recommendations, our overalls. And then as usual, we will get into the spoilers breakdown. We're not going to go episode by episode. We'll probably just do like a big overall discussion. So that's why if you're like, oh, I'm two episodes in, I can listen to a little bit.

0:59 No, no, no. If you haven't finished it, shit out of luck. You know, that's what we did. We did the binge and it'll be here. It'll be here. Save me a little pocket, big pocket.

1:07 I don't know what type of pockets you have, but the podcast will be waiting for you in the pocket or on your TV or on your computer, wherever you listen to podcasts.

1:15 And where are we? We're everywhere.

1:16 We're everywhere.

1:17 Down below is where you can find us. But we've got lots to talk about. Lots to talk about with this show. We've got lots to promote later on with Extra Life and big reviews coming up. But Taylor Field, give a brief elevator pitch.

1:31 Of your F-13 fandom.

1:33 And then what did you think of Crystal Lake in the non-spoilers way?

1:39 Okay, so my.

1:41 I've got to turn you off. You're so quiet.

1:43 Am I still quiet? I cranked it. I'm surprised it's still so low.

1:46 You weren't even at 200.

1:47 I'm not even at 200. All right. We're full. We're full sun now. So... My love for Friday the 13th is.

1:56 It's like Taylor under there. It's somebody and he just has a microphone somewhere else.

1:59 I'm using the voice changer, yeah.

2:01 Exactly. Yeah, Madison's sitting in for you.

2:04 Yeah. My love for Friday the 13th is exponential. I think, again, the game alone. I mean, we put so many hours into that game. I just love that universe. And when you look at all of the films in that franchise, it's fun to... go through them all. It's fun to just kind of pick and choose which ones are your favorite.

2:23 Like I'm definitely, I love part three. And again, I love the final chapter. Um, there's just, there's different things from them. Like Jason takes Manhattan, you know, Jason X, all those fun ones. You got Freddy versus Jason, lots of different iterations in with this character. That's awesome. Even the new, what was it?

2:41 The 2009 one.

2:43 That's when they redid it, the Transformers.

2:44 Yeah, the remake of Quantum Dunes, yeah. It is in the same universe, apparently.

2:49 Same universe, yeah. So even that one, that's a heck of a good time. So I've always been there for the Friday the 13th. I think it's a good time. I still need to watch that documentary that you keep on shouting out.

3:01 I've been telling you, I've given up.

3:02 I've told Taylor and Kirk, and with Taylor specifically, obviously, Network on Elm Street he hasn't watched, so he wouldn't.

3:08 Do that, but... great... I'm re-watching it right now for the infinite number of times.

3:14 It's on whenever you get AMC Plus to finish Lestat.

3:17 It is on there.

3:18 It's called Crystal Lake Memories, and it is a six-hour documentary, but they do a deep dive into every single facet of each film, and I highly recommend that and the Never Sleep Again doc. They're two of the best film docs for me, because there's so many docs that just go and they cover a little bit, then.

3:33 They move on quickly.

3:34 No, this is, you're getting segments, and it's refreshing as they talk about things sucking and not working, so... You should watch that if you're such an avid fan, Taylor.

3:43 But I'm going to make it happen. I hear that six hours. I'm like, gosh, six hours, that's an undertaking. But you're right. If it's on AMC +, then I haven't redeemed my free week yet. I've been waiting so I can binge Lestat. So maybe I'll tax that in there too. But yeah, the franchise is just, it's something I've wanted a new piece of. friday content for so long i mean 2009 to where we're at now holy smokes it's been so long for something new right we did have that short which i believe you and me reviewed didn't we we talked about it but somewhere on here yeah yeah so that was that was awesome that was a really really good time um and so getting into this like this has just been a mostly anticipated

4:28 piece of work for me. Just excited to get into it. Even though, yes, it's a prequel. Yes, it's Pamela Voorhees, all that kind of stuff. That's totally fine. It's in that universe. And I wasn't really sure where they were going to take it. Are they going to retcon some things? I don't really know a lot about Pamela Voorhees outside of the chapter one, or part one.

4:50 This is a doc spot. Just six hours about Pamela.

4:52 Just six hours about Pamela. There we go. But yeah, I think that this show, it really, really it's, I'm not going to say surprised me, but it did a really good job of just kind of cementing itself and propping itself up and just kind of creating a narrative. And it, it decides to go about things in a way that I, I can get behind. I, it reminded me kind of like for an equivalent and I'll explain it in the spoilers portion, but for now, when you look at, um, It's Welcome to Derry. I think, okay, It's Welcome to Derry introduces the military, introduces this kind of more of an explanation to certain things. It's like, okay, I can get behind that because It's Welcome to Derry is definitely one of my favorite horror shows. I really,

5:36 really like it and I'm excited that we're getting a part two or season two. This, I could absolutely do without another season. I think that they can just do the one because I feel like this is just a great start to finish story and Everyone knows the legend that follows, right? You know where it's going to go after that.

5:57 I don't think so.

5:59 No? Really?

6:00 No.

6:00 We're talking spoilers, but I don't think so. I think the show takes its own path.

6:06 Really? I feel like there's one significant difference. And maybe it's kind of a record.

6:13 I don't know. It's a very big significant difference.

6:16 See, we'll have to get in the spoilers to highlight that because I'm not sure. Okay. Um, yeah, I just, I think that, uh, it's, it takes some swings that are very, very bold, but it's swings that I do like. And I was reading online some people's reception of it. A lot of people are not very fond of how they took it and what the, the, like what they were trying to do with this show. Um, heck, even some people before the show even came out, they were upset because they were just hoping like, okay, well, I know there are the two counselors that Pamela Voorhees kills.

6:47 Then they're like, I hope that Pamela doesn't kill anyone else. because that just wouldn't work and other people are like well you know there could be people that she kills that you don't know about leading up to the events of like the original part one and stuff like that so there's just I guess people kind of have a set idea of how Pamela Voorhees would be and would be acting and killing all that kind of stuff but there was a lot of fun in here there were definitely some brutal kills very very brutal and some wacky moments but I think they got the era pretty captured pretty well And it just feels like everyone had a lot of fun doing this. And shout outs to Dorf.

7:27 Was that his name?

7:30 Dorf?

7:31 Yeah. The sheriff's partner.

7:35 Maybe. I guess it could be his name. I forgot his name. I'd say that character was a.

7:40 Low light for me, so I don't got much room for Dorf.

7:42 Oh, okay, okay.

7:43 You just, your brain for me, because I'm pretty sure it's not the exact same, but there's a character in the new Minions named Dorf. He's played by Jesse Eisenberg, and he has a big role. So when you said Dorf, I'm like, why are.

7:53 You talking about Minions and Monsters right now?

7:55 Big crossover.

7:56 Yeah, guess what, you're like the.

7:57 You're like the, God, what the hell is that? Michael Bolden sketch. You guys ever seen the Pirates of the Caribbean? You ever seen Minions and Monsters?

8:05 That's right. Well, I'll close it off with, again, and maybe if he was mentioned, I don't remember, but there was an actor that came in here. I was like, holy smokes. I did not expect that.

8:14 Not mentioned, I don't think.

8:15 No, but I'm not going to say it. I was like, wow. Of course, this person is here, and it's a welcome surprise. It really was.

8:23 Yeah, this fucking guy just pops up everywhere nowadays. Seriously. So do you recommend it overall?

8:31 I recommend it, absolutely. I've yet to obviously get into Carrie, but I'm assuming, like, you guys are talking pretty good about it, right? So, I mean, it just seems to be a pretty good.

8:41 Yeah, yeah, I think Carrie is worth it.

8:44 No, I won't say that. I think it is worth it no matter what. I think it's a great show. I'm going to talk about it on a trance. I told you just a second what we've been watching soon. like a minor spoiler cast. I think the ending trails off a bit, but I think some people disagree. So I think it's much like this show where they're definitely doing different things with the lore.

9:02 So if you don't like that at all, if you just want a one-to-one.

9:04 Retelling with new updated visuals and actors, then don't jump into that show either.

9:11 If you have to pick only one, what would you recommend people watch? Carrie or Crystal Lake?

9:16 I lean to Carrie. But it depends on what type of mood you're in.

9:20 If you are in the more slasher kind of more, I'd say this is more campy and more.

9:25 The cheesy fun and.

9:27 Where Carrie is much more thought-provoking and it's very much about our times in.

9:32 The school system.

9:33 It's a show that is going to make you very scared to be a parent when you watch Carrie because you're just going to get really mad in certain situations because you just know there are going to be real-life situations that kids could go through.

9:43 Go ahead.

9:46 Oh, I just think this one doesn't have anything like, I think Pamela is a pretty unique character. So I don't think there's anything in the show that I'm like worried about going through, you know, like for multiple, multiple things. Like I think there's like certain aspects. but like i'm not a black man so i'm not gonna go through those aspects of the things.

10:03 That like that there have for myself it's like i don't think.

10:07 That there's anything here scary for me you know so so not the supernatural psychic abilities it's the the racial component.

10:17 Uh what like Like, afraid of being a parent reason.

10:22 Well, yeah, because I can, I'd say the only thing in this show that is, that touches upon, like, big real life, I guess there's two things, right? I guess I can take that back a little bit. There is the bullying aspect in the show for children, so absolutely, right? So I guess there is that aspect of you would hate to, for your child to go through these things.

10:39 So I would say that is true, but I feel like the thing is with this show, and that's why I, because obviously one of the main characters of the show is a black cop, and there's, you know, some racist stuff.

10:47 I can't, I can't, you know, understand, I can't understand completely.

10:50 I can acknowledge and try to understand what they're going through, but I can't feel what they're going through. So that's, I mean, where obviously I have kids, I'm going to have teenage girls. Carrie's all about teenage girls and getting into stuff and everything where Crystal, like, I feel like they have some things and I do actually think they do a good job in one portion, which I guess we can talk about. But yeah, I think that Carrie's a bit more like politically charged, but not in a bad way.

11:11 But I'll talk about Carrie another time. Cool.

11:16 Go for it uh yeah so um let's see where should i go i guess i should jump off that point maybe i'm gonna tarantino and i'll start at the uh end and then go to the beginning where yeah i think that's where the show did a very good job as far as i think episode one is is excellent i think episode one is a show that i could watch like in a bubble and watch it by itself and even granted too that's the thing right because there's so many people that talked about like oh, there's this weird plot line, there's this plot line, it gets a little man near the ending and everything. If you look at the Friday the 13th franchise, there's not much great in there. I even think it's one of these franchises where it's not like Halloween or Nightmare. The first

11:57 one to me is one of the weaker ones. It's different because of the time it came out and the influence and the impact it had.

12:02 Absolutely, right? So it definitely has that.

12:04 But I can still watch the first nightmare on the street by itself and be, you know, I love it.

12:08 Same thing with Halloween.

12:09 There's multiples of that where this is like, okay, there's, there's definitely ones I prefer. And the first one has a level of cheese and it doesn't have the, the psychological stuff. And I don't, and obviously I think Halloween is a much better like slasher and everything.

12:21 So I do love the franchise from that point of view. It's, I love slasher.

12:25 So it's a fun slasher sometimes beat them up. I love the Jason Voorhees character. These are movies that like, even if, this fits in the category of this movie could be a six but i could be absolutely excited to re-watch it again because they're just certain things like with that are cheesy and kind of just a chicken soup for the soul type of movies and that's what these are right and that's where for this obviously i agree many people where this crystal lake is from a quality standpoint easily the best thing in the friday the 13th franchise because of the storytelling at times obviously linda carolini we've That's not even a surprise.

12:59 I feel like when she.

13:00 Got cast as Pamela, we were all like, oh yeah, she's going to kill it. And she absolutely does. She carries the show, even in times where the show's a little weak. And that's where some people might not like it or everything. But I feel like, of course, in the original movie and franchise, they go, oh yeah, her kid drowned, and that's why you can understand her motivations.

13:19 But in the movies, they're never trying to get you to sympathize for her. They just use that as her motive. And that going forward, you understand it, but you don't like it. Where this is the full-on... you are sympathizing for this character, and they do a great job. Episode 1, and I still like the entire series, but I think there's times where I might just watch Episode 1 by itself as a mini-prequel, and then you could watch Friday the 13th too. This is a very interesting show where I think that it's in two parts, and I think the eight episodes maybe was a bit too long, like you're talking about Dwarf or whatever. I think there's some storylines that don't pay off or the amount of time they got, I think you still could have.

13:57 Got there quicker. I think this probably would have been better with six episodes, which is.

14:00 Funny because so many times with Marvel, we'd be like, oh, six is way too short. But these are actually like longer episodes. Sometimes they're close to an hour, right? So that's a lot different where the Disney Plus episodes were, you know, sometimes like 20 to 30 minutes.

14:14 Not enough, right? So with this, I think there's kind of two sides for it.

14:19 And I don't think it's exactly this where it's like, oh, right in the halfway it changes.

14:23 I'm just going to say it's somewhere in the half, maybe a little bit.

14:25 Sooner a little lesser um or a little further i feel like it starts off like batman begins and people gotta walk on walk with me for a little bit but no one took the idea of okay how could batman this character live in the real world how could he function how can you get this done x y and z and i feel like that's what they do and they even do this like throughout the series it's not like oh they stop and completely okay we get to episode six and that's it it's changed no They do this throughout, but I feel like the beginning is very much like, okay, we're going to take Jason and his mom, and even how Jason is indestructible, even the continuity stuff of, if you watch part one and part two of the movies, they don't make sense. They actually,

15:06 in the show, make it that it makes sense. You could now headcanon, and they gave you a can of like, oh, okay, that's how we got there. So I think that stuff was good, and I'm not saying the changes are different or saying they're bad, but when the changes come in, they feel very much like Wicked and specifically Wicked Part 2, where it's like, oh yeah, this thing happened, but you didn't know this was really happening on the side.

15:28 No, this didn't happen on the side. I guess I don't want to say more. I'll get into spoilers, but that's what.

15:34 I feel like.

15:34 At one point, it felt like the show was very much like, oh, this is a prequel to the movie series. And then it became, this is its kind of own thing. You could take it or leave it. And that's fine. I'm fine with it being its own thing. It didn't really bug me.

15:46 I think near the end, though, the changes isn't the thing that I end up not enjoying.

15:52 So I think it starts off very strong.

15:54 I think it gets a little long and then I think it kind of ends on like a, all right, like not a bad ending.

16:00 I I've seen worse finales.

16:02 Uh, and that's where like, yeah, for me, like I, I was, I really enjoyed care, but I really didn't like the finale where this isn't on that level. Uh, but I think the whole season overall was stronger. So for me, I, I think, I could see myself re-watching this. I definitely could see myself re-watching the pilot because I think that pilot's amazing. The whole series, I think it'll be a little bit because I think it's very good, but it's also, you know, with the slasher, it's usually, you know, hour and a half. It's a quick and rip it. There's a bunch of characters and stories and kills and everything. Where this is has those, but they're much more spread out. It definitely, I'd seen this comparison before.

16:39 If you like Bates Motel, I do think it's similar to that. And yeah, you just have to look at it as a new interpretation. So I think this is a really fun show, a really good show with some questionable stuff along the way. But I think it's a great Halloween watch. And if you're a fan of this franchise, like I am, because I grew up with this. I grew up with Freddy, Jason, and Michael.

16:57 And even Chucky. I watched those a bunch. I binged through them.

17:00 I remember me and my auntie got a bunch at Blockbuster and watched them all. I still have the original eight-movie collector set that has all the way up to Takes Manhattan. It doesn't even have Jason Goes to Hell because that wasn't even in there yet.

17:12 Or the final Friday. Whatever they call it. So yeah.

17:16 I was very much looking forward to this. But curious about it. And I think it scratched the itch.

17:21 It did that. Yeah sure.

17:22 I want an actual Jason movie at some point. But if it takes a little longer. It's not as bad. Because we got this.

17:29 So yeah. I did enjoy it. I recommend it too. If you like horror films. Or if you like Friday the 13th.

17:34 Like I said. If you're somebody that really doesn't like the idea of. Oh they didn't fall. This X, Y, and Z.

17:40 They did their own thing. Then no. I'd say no.

17:42 Tap out, because they do make some changes, they take their own path at times, and I think that's okay, because, you know, it's an interpretation, it's like fucking the Halloween franchise, right, there's like four to five different timelines, that's okay if Crystal Lake has its own timeline, so I'd recommend it the most, but it's also not like with a Carrie, or like a Midnight Mass, right, I recommend to everybody, where I go, oh, you gotta watch that, where Crystal Lake is, oh, I'm gonna recommend it to horror fans, or Friday the 13th fans, or people that watch something for Halloween, I don't think it's like a like a home run series that's a must watch i think there's i think even the heights of it welcome to dairy

18:17 were probably better than this i don't know where i think they're pretty equal in a show wise because it welcomed dairy part two not part two just the show or what was it no was it welcome to dairy right the show yeah yeah okay yeah which i tried to i watched episode one again for that and then i because i was gonna try and rewatch and i just wasn't I wasn't digging it because I can't remember why. Oh, because we were watching The Shining. And I was like, oh, The Shining. And we got all The Shine going on.

18:42 I want to watch that. And Dick Holleran. And then I just kind of already fell off. So I'm going to try it again. So yeah, that's who I'd recommend it to. Any other non-spoiler thoughts there?

18:52 You remind me because I have a steelbook for Friday the 13th. I found it at Walmart.

18:56 And he's giving away tonight.

19:00 Yeah. It was $ 40 or $ 50. It has the first eight movies in here. But digital copies, Blu-rays... It's the whole bag. That's a banger.

19:09 I didn't even get.

19:11 There's just DVDs back in the day. So yeah, you don't have the final Friday in there, right? Like Jason Goes to Hell or whatever?

19:17 No. That's so funny.

19:18 There must be some legal thing, because my box.

19:20 I thought you were reaching, but it's so funny, because I got it right here on the shelf.

19:23 I stole it from your house.

19:25 No, because mine didn't have that either, and I think that might be because I can't... The last one's still Friday the 13th, Jason Takes Manhattan, right? Yeah.

19:34 That's the last one in this bunch. Yeah, that's the eighth one.

19:36 But is it still called Friday the 13th?

19:39 Let's see.

19:40 It's called.

19:41 Because remember, there's.

19:43 That whole, you know.

19:44 Friday the 13th, part 8, Jason Takes Manhattan.

19:49 And that's why I think, because if you look at the movies now, I don't know how it happened with the remake, how they figured that out, but I feel like that's with Jason Tate, or the, whatever, Final Friday, Jason Goes to Hell, Jason X, and then Fray vs. Jason, all those movies had Jason in the title, right? And that's the whole thing where... You know, they can't use Jason.

20:07 Like I said, I don't know how they pull off with the remake, if they, like, figure them all out. And I don't know, because now it's back to that lawsuit issue that shut down the game.

20:15 I don't know.

20:16 So I think, like we said, we both recommended it to certain groups of people. If you have not seen the show and are interested in listening to the spoilers review, now is the time to bow out, because we're going to do that.

20:27 So we're going to take our first ad break, and then we'll be right back with the spoilers. And those spoilers are coming. Your mic okay over there, Taylor?

20:34 Okay.

20:35 Yes, it's all good. It's all good. Is it?

20:39 Yeah.

20:39 So where to start? I guess, yeah, where do you want to start?

20:45 I would actually like to start with the two counselors. So obviously we knew that they were sleeping on the job, you know, the result of Jason getting killed. But I'd love to... I'd love to highlight the fact that when she was coming clean because she was just like born again and she found God talking to pastor, whatever his name was, um, the whole buildup of the reveal that Pamela would find out who was really responsible for not watching Jason. I thought that it was going to be, um, grace that actually told Pamela, they kind of set that up cause they get close. They have a friendship. It doesn't happen that way. No, the counselor's just crying. Boyfriend's cheating on her with, uh, the hippie and, Then she's

21:29 just like, I was having sex and wasn't watching Jason. And then she hugs Pamela. She's like, oh, pastor was right. It feels so good just to get this off my chest. Thank you for listening. It's like you just told Pamela like you're responsible for her son dying and you think you're vindicated. Holy crap. No, not a chance. That just for some reason stands out to me.

21:49 Yeah. Yeah, I did.

21:54 I was happy that was not the reason because they set up where, okay, the original, the classic tale. We'll go back to the first episode in a minute, but the classic, okay, these counselors are having sex.

22:02 They're not watching Jason. He's out there drowned.

22:04 And then they do like a nine-month jump. And then they have them when they're going to reopen the camp.

22:10 They're back.

22:10 They're going to be counselors. And they're just kind of happy-go-lucky. And they're talking about not having sex. And she's just like, oh, well, you know, if you like.

22:18 I can't remember what it is.

22:20 Like, I'm not.

22:22 Bastard what is it like but not betray abuse like the skin or abuse the flesh or whatever it's not gonna be a little special like she gives him this reason of the flesh something like that we're doing it too much so we should stop and kind of make up for that but then i did like that they went back and made it because at first it was a note for me of well like they she bumps into them at nine months later and they're just like oh yeah we love jason and we're gonna you know uh make his memory and they just seem so happy as like For this show, that's kind of taking a deeper dive.

22:50 I was like, oh, this is kind of lame.

22:51 They didn't do that with the guy, but I did appreciate that that's actually the real reason why she wasn't having sex. She just said everything that was happening was bad. You bring up a point, did bring up to me the show's... I'd say from about, even episode one, but really from two to seven, I think the show's repetition.

23:11 And where it became....

23:13 A little formulaic is, okay, so I feel like every episode at the end, something would happen and Pamela would kill somebody, right? And then the next episode would start. She's kind of like regretting her, doesn't know what to do. She's cleaning up the body with the bear, with this, with that, yeah, yeah, yeah. She lives a normal life.

23:30 She's trying to, she's a little shaken, but she gets back to her normal life. She'll blow off the cop or one of her friends and then cut to 20 minutes later where she's like, you know what?

23:37 Yeah, like I, you're wrong. I got to get back out there.

23:39 You're right.

23:39 I am a powerful woman.

23:41 And then some character will say or do something and then Pamela will look over and just be crazy. Now, I don't mind that as I thought we were building up to, but the problem was, it felt like it would be, she'd go crazy, and because it's eight hours, you know, roughly, it's actually 6.5, but still, because it's at run time, it's like, she'd go crazy, okay, we gotta pull her back.

23:58 We gotta go crazy, we gotta pull her back. And I didn't know that's what was gonna happen.

24:01 I thought it was going to be maybe a kill here or there, but I actually thought it was gonna be the slow build up to, okay, we're gonna get to the night where she gets her head lobbed off, right? We're slowly gonna get to the point where you know, maybe a little fighting here, a little kill, but then it's like, I'm killing all these people. And we get that like a little bit where she kills all these counselors, which I have a problem with, we'll get to later.

24:20 But that was an issue for me where it was just, when you talk about that hug, when she's like, yeah, and I just feel so much better now. We were watching Jason, she just looks over. Now, luckily, you know, she didn't kill those people with somebody else, but that was one thing for me where it just felt, we were kind of just doing that over and over. But how did you feel about Pamela? Were you happy about the kind of push and pull? that, you know, she'd go on, like, I won't say a killing spree, but she would kill people in a spree like that, where it was brutal.

24:46 It wasn't, like, a stab, and she'd go, oh, what'd I do?

24:48 Like, that girl's mom, she, like, lobbed her whole face off with a fucking cleaver and then put her in, like, the, like, she was.

24:53 In a deep fryer, yeah.

24:54 Yeah, she was killing them in Jason, brutal video game franchise slasher ways. That's why I wasn't, like, that's, I guess, where it was tough for me, where she would act so violent, where I'm, like, I don't understand how you go back to just being, like, completely normal right now. But yeah, how do you feel about Pamela's ascendance?

25:13 That's, I guess, how would you head candidate when you look at... You can't.

25:18 This does not work with the original movie.

25:20 No, not in that sense, but her back and forth, her, you don't call it bipolar, but just being pulled back, whatever you want to call it, but her mental state is not well, and I would say that's probably... because the scientists for Bellflower were just saying like, Hey, we put you on this new medication that's supposed to help with you, but you don't have any more. So now like the longterm effects, you're fucked without having any more of it.

25:43 Right.

25:43 And so that's, that's the result here. Then you get a whole episode of her just talking to this guy saying, see what happens when you mess with people's heads. Right. Like there's just, I think a lot of just the, her mind has been really fucked around by, by things. Plus they were injecting God knows what into her when Jason was, you know, in her. So, I mean, they, like she definitely got fucked around, uh, a little bit. Um, I, I think, I think you're right.

26:09 That does work.

26:10 I think it just, as a show, like it just, um, like I said, it just got repetitive. So for me, it was just kind of been there, done that, but I don't think you're wrong, but that's a, that is a good coverage for, you know, you know, that happens with bipolar and whatever they did to her was probably a big, big mess up.

26:25 As far as her mind going.

26:27 Yeah. And I mean, she, she, I mean, This is a very different light because I don't get the gist from her at all when I look at her in the part one versus here where part one, she's not afraid of dying, the cops, anything like that. And here, I just feel like she's genuinely... Whatever the idea is that, okay, the cops found the body from the bears eating... The bear eating humans or whatever like that. She starts to get very freaked out. I don't think she's trying to control Lee, but she's definitely... It's weird because there's like a moment of like.

27:00 It starts to be a little bit when she just checks up on him to be like, oh, any crazy things going on around town?

27:05 To get information, yes. But he still is good at kind of like keeping a distance or doing his own thing. He likes her, obviously. They sleep together. But I feel like her choosing to sleep with him was more so... Well, no, I can't say that because it was definitely distracting because the place was burning down. She just murdered the mom.

27:25 She was feeling super like, passionate and horny and just went straight to him. And then he was distracted and couldn't see the fire trucks driving by and all that kind of stuff.

27:36 So I think that was like a, to me, like melding of the situations because she did do that to distract him. But then after they kind of pseudo started dating. Right. So I think if she just slept with him and then was like, okay, no, like this can't happen, which she did, but that was more so it was like emotional response. So I think she went over there and was charged up. But I also think that, she did want to sleep and, you know, be with him, and I actually really liked the actor, I don't think I've seen that actor in anything, I'll have to look at his IMDb, but I really liked him in this show, he was like a great, like, he felt like he was ripped right out of the 80s, he had a great vibe, he had like a kind of badass vibe,

28:10 but also super caring guy, he felt like he was actually trying to, obviously the show was written that way, but I mean, like, his portrayal of trying to help Pamela felt like a person that was genuine and very kind.

28:21 And I liked everything about that. Even when he had to do the standoff with the husband at.

28:24 The end, it felt like, Oh, he's going to, he's, he might not survive this, but he's going to take down as many guys as possible. And then, you know, they added the whole, we got the backstory of him accepting some money from a deal. Like he became a dirty cop, but he only did that because all the other cops did that.

28:39 So he didn't want to like, feel like a, like.

28:42 Worried they were gonna hurt him or rat him out or put it on him which even though he was the only one that got caught but um i really liked um what the hell was that character i'm gonna bring up and i showed that actor's name but.

28:52 Um where is it yeah that was lee.

28:55 Yeah lee okay i gotta find his name there was another thing i was gonna say with um i guess you kind of brought it up as far as it's interesting with the show right so they have it where And this is where I'll kind of be jumping all over.

29:09 But okay, so up until episode six, it's what we just talked about. You know, she's living her life.

29:16 Something bad happens, kills some people, rinse and repeat. Different variations, different situations, but something like that. And then she's kind of caught dead to rights by Lee and his sister saying, hey, you got to tell us what's going on because we don't know. We can't help you. If not, we're just going to bring you in and arrest you. So then she tells the story in episode seven. And then we'll get there. We'll get back there in a second. But then we get to episode eight where they. okay, well, we got to help you.

29:41 I think that's the weird thing where I'm always down for a show.

29:45 With a gray character area. Like, covering the gray characters. I usually prefer those. But I just felt it was like.

29:56 Like, Lee doesn't have the full... Like, those.

29:59 everybody, they were being to me very meticulous for a while of everybody. She was killing was like, Oh, this was a bad parent or she misunderstood the situation.

30:07 But when she killed all those hippies, it was like, all right.

30:10 That's a step too far. They didn't do anything like, like some of those hippies didn't do anything at all. They were just there like living their life.

30:17 She was just getting pissed off at them though.

30:19 Yeah.

30:20 That's where, for me, it was odd where I feel like the finale tried to make her very sympathetic in a, in almost like a hero way, not the first episode, because the first episode I think did an amazing job of showing us on the loss or kids showing someone that's dealing with a kid that has special needs and all the people are bullying him and he feels left out and it did. And I actually think the kid who played the majority of young Jason, I thought he did great. He did.

30:42 It was a fantastic little Jason.

30:43 And that's where for me, I know some people might look at that and go, cause I feel like people do that with the Rob zombie Halloween, right? Like, Oh, they make Jason or Michael whiny bitch. And he's like, goes to therapy at the one. I, I, you know, if you don't like that take, then you just don't like that. But again, as interpretation too, that's where the Batman begins part came in. Cause I thought to me, it was like, okay, we're going to explain like, how does Jason and his mom really get here? Right.

31:04 How do we get to this point? And it's not just cheesy and hammy. So I liked it all.

31:08 I guess it was just at the end when, you know, Pamela's life is at risk and there's other people like Lee and the other cop that are going to sacrifice himself for her. To me, it's like, she's not a, I guess it's tough with the experience. You don't really know, but, She still should be probably locked up. So that's where I guess for me, I think with the hippie kills, it was great to see them because, oh, Fun Friday 13th kills. But I think they went overboard with making her unlikable for me. Not like I don't like the character, but just in a way where I'm not going to really cheer for you making it out alive because you just took all these young, innocent people alive.

31:44 So I don't know. How are you feeling out of her at the end? Were you ruined for you? What was going on there?

31:50 Like, not rooting for her to kill the counselors.

31:53 No, but yeah, just.

31:54 Like, I don't know, did you feel bad that she might get kidnapped again? I don't know, because at this point, she thinks her son's dead, so she's just alone. You know, obviously, these are also bad people, but she's doing tons of bad things, too.

32:04 She's, well, of course, she's mentally unwell, too, at this point.

32:08 But then people get help. Not Lee, who's just like, let's run away together. Or she says that, and he's like, yeah, let's do it. You know, she needs clinical help. And Lee, I don't think, even knows about the hippies, right?

32:17 He doesn't.

32:18 No, and he doesn't know about the restaurant. He doesn't know about the restaurant.

32:23 No.

32:24 He just knows about the origin.

32:25 Yeah, so there's a lot of red flags there. But she's willing to let it slide, right? She's going to let that other chick who got away. Well, she's going to let it slide. The girl that got away is going to take the fault, right?

32:38 Yeah, that's easy. instead of going to prison for decades or a death row, it's like, Oh, let the hippie take the fall.

32:45 Yeah. But I mean, when it comes to her, like.

32:48 Pamela to win in this situation, right.

32:51 At the end when they're doing the standoff and like, Oh, why should I root for Lee to get her out of there when she's a terrible person?

32:58 Yeah, that's fair. I mean, I think at that point, I think it's hoping that you feel the weight of her actions is justified because of just how she was brought up and tortured and just had to live in this horrible bellflower community. Um, I mean, I look at where that one woman did that one woman, a woman in Bellflower who had the baby, she just shot or like cut her neck open. Right. Like, so it clearly, it just goes to show she's not the only one.

33:22 There's people that have survived this process are not all mentally there in the head. Uh, it's not going good for them. So, um, but her in this situation, I mean, at the end there, when you got, uh, her, her former husband showing up there, which again, crazy, uh, He's just fucking popping up in everything. Oh, my God.

33:42 Do you feel as Lee wanted to lock her up after they dealt with the scientists, I think?

33:49 I didn't get that vibe.

33:50 No, I didn't get that.

33:51 I got that vibe before she told the story, but I didn't get that.

33:55 But he already knew because he read the file. So he's like, I already knew it matches with everything.

34:00 Yeah, I guess so.

34:01 But I guess he just wanted to hear it from her mouth, know that, like, she was sympathetic, but again, she did pitch like running away and he is, he was thinking about it, you know?

34:09 So, and he, again, he was willing to sacrifice. That's right. He's willing to die for her with this.

34:15 Yes. And I'd say she was also willing to die for him too, because I mean, he's, he's up there and she's down below and she comes up on her own volition and stops and diffuses the situation.

34:26 Right.

34:26 She didn't have to, she was terrified. So she does that and kind of, you know, protects him for the most part. Um, Yeah, just her, if you get in her way, obviously she's going to see you as a problem. She's going to take you out. But then if you also act as like, you kind of, I don't know, like a supporter too. I mean, like I thought for sure she was going to kill that blonde haired woman that was just kind of like took her to the show.

34:56 No, she ended up help saving her life.

34:59 Ends up help saving her life. She got Dorf to.

35:01 Go help Lee. I remember she went to go talk to him. And that was the story.

35:06 Like, I didn't really care for anything with her and Dorf, like that stuff going on there.

35:11 I didn't either. And they don't really dive into a lot of it. I mean, they just, I'm glad that they didn't. I mean, the last time that we see them was, yeah, she shows up. She's like, you know, Dorf, I came to you. You know, there's something going after Pam. You need to just go and follow through and look at it. And it's like, okay, perfect. That's the extent of that. we've moved on. That's great.

35:31 And that's where, cause I know someone might be like, Oh, well, you know, they use that because they're going back and forth, but she trusted him. And that's where, why end up at the cop shop. He could just end up there. Like he's a cop. Like he could just, he could just end up there. It's the same thing with Ralph, right?

35:43 Like he went out there cause he was mad cause he had the bad sex. And he's like, I'm going to go prove Ralph is a bad person. Literally.

35:50 He could just have a hard on for Ralph and being like, I think he's a fucking killer.

35:53 Like I, that's my problem with the storyline is there's not like a, there, I think there's, excess fat on the show that you could cut and just get to that place easier. To me, 10 out of 10s, obviously they changed things, but 10 out of 10 no-notes, I loved everything they fucking did with Crazy Ralph.

36:07 I loved the little.

36:09 We dove into some of his backstory, but not too much. He wasn't a central side character, but he's always popped around. I thought that actor did a good job of mannerisms and looked a little bit like that original actor. Obviously, he just has the red herring for a little bit, but I thought Crazy Ralph was....

36:25 A welcome addition here.

36:26 And I, I will say, I guess I should have said non-spoilers too, even though it's making its own path, I think the show gives lots of love for the entire series.

36:34 Also, you got the title cards and like the titles.

36:37 Those are so good.

36:38 Yeah, those are good.

36:39 But the actual titles too, where it's like a new beginning and first blood, but yeah, the opening sequence for the first episode and then the rest of the series, that's fantastic.

36:47 So, I, I, I regret not saying that too.

36:50 I should have sold that harder for, uh, F 13 fans that if you love the series, I think there's, you can tell they are taking a lot of Easter eggs and making use of them and having, you know, some fun. I'm like when Jason gets his machete, he's just this little kid. He's like, I am the, whatever the woods, you know, it's like.

37:07 These are my woods. Yeah.

37:08 It's like, to me, that's, that's fun. You know, I, I like that.

37:11 Some people might not like anything is cheesy, but, I think it's a fun way of, okay, everyone that.

37:16 Watches the show, not everyone, but a lot of people watch the show.

37:18 Love this franchise, have lots of callbacks to it, lots of things they connect to, and I feel like they did try to connect to, probably up until Jason goes to space and Final Friday, but they tried to connect to a lot of different things in this franchise, which I very much appreciated.

37:33 Another Easter egg, too, that I noticed that I do appreciate is when Pam went with that other lady to that retreat thing. They were staying at the Pakenack Lodge. If you got that sign, which is, which is a shout outs to, uh, is it part three? No, no, it's part two. Uh, Pakenack Lodge. So yeah, uh, part two, that's where I'll show you here. The, the, that's where it takes place. You might remember the map too.

38:05 Oh, yeah, yeah, okay. Yeah, I love that. That was a fun map, yeah.

38:08 Yeah, so that's Packanack Lodge. It was a shout-out in that episode, which is pretty cool that they called that. Yeah, that was a fun map.

38:15 Yeah, I was going to say, the guy's name that plays Lee is William Catlett, and I guess you have to look out for it because you really like this movie.

38:21 Apparently, he's an Abigail. He plays Rickles. So look out for that the next time you watch it. Yeah, the guy plays Lee, so. What were we talking about? Yeah, shout-out to Crazy Ralph and all the Easter eggs. I think that was great. um let's see so we covered um all the kills there.

38:39 And yeah the kills were i think they're good i think it was definitely an overabundance of cgi on the kills like i think there's some kills that just took me out of it because it's too computer animated but i like that they're you know going for that um yeah i guess that's where too you which way should we go first i'm trying to think if Cause you threw out something.

39:01 Maybe we'll go here and then we're going to get, we'll circle back to what you're talking about. Non-spoilers.

39:04 So in episode seven, so yeah, episode one to me, great pot episode two, I think is like the weakest episode where she takes the, like the trip to the guy that does like the therapy and everything. I get what they're going for, but I thought that episode didn't, didn't give me too much. And then I'd say from five to about, or from three to about six, we have, it's just, you know, stuff going on around Crystal Lake, dealing with the loss of Jason, and then her losing her mind.

39:31 Seven, we get the origins.

39:33 And man, did I laugh when I saw, and he pops up in episode six, but in episode seven, we get.

39:38 The big origin of her soon-to-be husband. It was weird.

39:42 They kind of did this like, oh yeah, he's just my friend, but they, they, They almost made, like, I don't know if he is for sure the father or not. Like, it was weird where I didn't know for sure if Jason was his biological son. Because they never gave us that clarification and there was something odd there. So I wasn't sure if it was, like, she got pregnant and he's a friend helping her out and then they fell in love that way. Or if they just got pregnant before marriage. There's lots of ways. But they never clarified and that's okay. But that friend is the one and only.

40:07 The fantastic.

40:08 The great. You know, he's Batman. He's your favorite pastor. Hamish Linklater, who.

40:14 Man, it's just so funny, between Gen V, obviously he was advertised for that, but he was in Gen V, and then, you know, spoilers, jump, 15 seconds, you haven't seen Widow's Bay, I guess, but, you know, I'm spoiling it there, but there's a character in Heavy Prosthetics that he plays, and then here he is, Friday the 13th, I love this, it's becoming his gimmick, where he's popping up in horror shows, and, you know, he's not announced, and here he is, he plays one of the scientists and the husband of of Pamela Vore. She's some of the other name here, but this is where, again, where it felt the Batman Begins stuff of, okay, and I'll actually time the origin with my two points here before I throw the tailor, is I guess for the whole series,

40:53 because Jason dies, but they never find his body, and the whole time Pamela thinks he's out there, and then as things are going on, people keep seeing some sort of figure. We know it's Jason, or we presume it's Jason, and obviously it is, but that, to me, actually did a good job of explaining, because people always go, okay, it doesn't make sense, and the movie's jason dies his mom kills everybody she gets killed but then jason comes back what is that like how that makes sense that he was out there but i like this as far as like okay he was kind of out there like he drowned we don't know how long it took for him to get back he like overgrown because of whatever was going on with the radiation they gave him so

41:28 i kind of liked that origin of oh yeah while pamela was losing her mind jason was off there in like the forest doing his own thing so i like that and then two The idea of, even little Jason says, is like, oh, I'm strong, or oh, it takes a lot for me to get hurt. Like, they're pretty much just insinuating this guy's like a brick shithouse. And I think we had seen this and talked about this in the trailers before, that they explain that he, they're testing, like, nuclear radiation stuff, like all these things to make, you know, the human vessel the ultimate, I don't know, vessel or ultimate weapon.

42:01 They're all worried about war. So it's like, well, how can we, you.

42:03 Know, survive? So they took cockroach DNA.

42:06 Exactly. How do we survive? How do we do this?

42:08 Well, we're going to start experimenting on babies and children. And that's what happened here where I don't know how they did it.

42:15 Cause she, in episode seven, she's.

42:16 About to have a miscarriage, which the fucking doctor and they're talking about them. And it's just like, Oh, some women are just not built for it. You know, which I could believe they would have said that back then, but she had the miscarriage. They definitely, that corporation helped keep the baby alive.

42:32 Right.

42:32 I think they did.

42:34 Yeah. Yeah.

42:35 Because when they get checked, the doctor kind of lies, like, oh, the baby's still alive, look at that, but it's like, I think there's a lot of stuff going on there, so it's like, technically, it's tough for Pamela, because you go, okay, Odo lost his child, I love this child, I want this child, at first she didn't even want the child, but then she grew to love it and wanted it, so it's like, okay, you wouldn't have this child without this corporation, but then this corporation's taking advantage and experimenting on your child, when he picks up the radiation ticker at the birthday party, it's like going off the ether there, so they just explain that, yeah, like Mike says here, he's Roach Man, that That's how, in these movies, if

43:06 you were to take it that way, how he could get shot, burned, whatever that... Sometimes they showed, even as a baby, he drowned, and he took a couple minutes to come back alive, because Pamela fell asleep with the bathtub still.

43:17 Going, because he was just freaking out.

43:19 But I loved of, okay, yeah, he was still around when Pamela was losing her mind, and yeah, that's a... To me, some people might not like that, and I get that, but to me, if you were doing the Nolan Batman begins of, okay, how could we explain that Jason is an unstoppable force? Well, science people were experimenting on them so what did you think about the two things as.

43:39 Far as jason uh being around a lot more than.

43:42 Because obviously in the original movie they do retcon eventually but he's just dead and then too what did you feel about all the episode seven stuff with hamish.

43:50 Link later and the uh the experiments in the labs.

43:55 Link later popping in was just Yeah, completely caught me off guard. And when I saw his face, I just kind of felt like, oh, fucking course he is. That's, yeah, why?

44:05 No one else.

44:06 He makes sense. So that kind of cracked me up, obviously. And yeah, he just plays that role so very well. And I kind of have this weird theory that, because he just kind of said he worked in sales for Bellflower. And I just kind of took it as, it'd be weird if their version of sales was to recruit women, uh, to get them pregnant. And then you can do the experimenting testing on or something like that. Cause he was so gung ho for them to be testing out this stuff on right away.

44:42 She's having miscarriage. Oh, I know some people. I know some people that can help us out.

44:46 That's right. That's right. So I just think that maybe there's some kind of, there's some kind of scheme there. And then it was kind of like, it comes down to, okay, the person that actually succeeds in this, well, they get to get the promotion and lead like the, the R and D department or whatever. I just feel like there's something along those lines that kind of fits that, that MO. So, but we don't have confirmation obviously. Anyways.

45:08 Yeah.

45:08 I just, I liked when he came into play and how cool and composed he was when he was dealing with Lee and all that kind of stuff. But then, yeah, just the, their life just deteriorating more and more and getting, shittier well i guess hers was getting shittier and just that the idea like i couldn't i can't even fathom like get home from the hospital like all right you know first night see you madison i'm out and you leave and she's just gonna deal with the screaming baby and yeah it was making me sweat when the water was filling up and the baby crying in the bathtub i was thinking oh for fuck's sakes i don't like this making me uncomfortable um Yeah. But then obviously everything kind of after that, it's like, oh, wow, he survived. Like,

45:53 holy shit, we we got to now run these experiments. He's subject J or whatever they were calling him. And it just because he's the only one that survived.

46:04 Right.

46:04 The only one that was born out of all the testing.

46:08 I think so.

46:08 Obviously later on there was other babies, so they must've perfected that. But I think, I think he was the first.

46:13 Yeah. He was the first. Yeah. So I think that it's a great kind of backstory actually. Like I, I'm down for it with, he's the, they, they, they cover like, yeah, this is how he can handle all the pain, the tolerance of the threshold. And I jive with it too. When you get to, um, what, uh, Oh God, was it, it was part five. What was part five called? That wasn't New Blood. That was... A New Beginning? I think it was New Beginning. Yeah. Yeah, because that's one of the...

46:44 What's his name? Was it Tommy Jarvis?

46:49 Are you talking about the movies now?

46:52 Yeah.

46:53 Yeah, that's the one where they.

46:54 He comes back.

46:55 They make him the killer.

46:58 Well, yeah, because he goes to the graveyard at the beginning, right? And stabs like.

47:01 No, that's Six.

47:03 That's Six. What was Six called?

47:04 Before the final chapter... 6 is a new beginning. I think it's a new beginning, right? And maybe 5 is the new blood or something like that?

47:14 Let's see here.

47:15 Because 4 is when they have Tommy Jarvis as a kid.

47:19 New beginning. Jason lives. Okay, there you go. Then new blood. Then takes Manhattan.

47:25 6 is Jason lives because it was like the Halloween 3 thing.

47:29 They really wanted you to know that he was in that. Because 4 is Tommy Jarvis as a kid. Takes out Jason.

47:35 Five is, like, the people that have special needs, and Tommy's there, and they try to make Tommy the killer. And that's why you should watch the doc. Like, people just hated that, so that's why they went back to Jason and Six.

47:48 So Jason lives, so.

47:50 And don't they kill Tommy in that one, I thought? Because he shows up at the graveyard.

47:54 He's recast, though.

47:55 He's recast, yeah. He puts the pole in. But that one in particular... He has.

47:59 The Frankenstein monster.

48:00 The Frankenstein, yeah. And I think it works because Jason's just this weird... like cockroach DNA, right? Like you can just survive. So he got lightning striked and now he's, he's back in action. Um, but the growth acceleration thing, that was something I didn't really click with. Cause when you watch the first chapter and say, okay, he's supposed to be a kid when he sees his mom get decapitated.

48:24 And then all of a sudden you get to chapter part two and it's a full grown adult going into the woman that cut the head off. Uh, and he just takes her down.

48:32 Right. So, yeah.

48:34 I never really made that connection before, which is kind of funny, but.

48:37 Watching it here. That wasn't the plan back then.

48:39 They just like, they just were picking up, they were just throwing like fucking darts at a.

48:44 Board trying to figure this out. Yeah. But I can appreciate them covering it and just now with like, yeah, it's a, he just, he has that growth acceleration through trauma, right? It just kind of expedites the growth. And so with that, it makes even more sense why Jason, when he sees his mom, he's just, he does like back off and relinquish his, you know, attempt to kill her, but he, he's just so out to fucking lunch. Uh, he's, he's, yeah.

49:15 Plus we don't know how long he did drown, but he could have been under that. Like it was nine months.

49:19 He, could have been at the bottom of that lake for a while.

49:22 Right.

49:22 And just like float it up eventually.

49:24 Because I take it as like the way, obviously when he was a baby and he drowned, then it was only a couple minutes he was back. I still take it that he could go down there and drown and maybe be down there for months. Eventually he'll like get pushed or float back and he'll survive. But like the regen time might, take a little bit more. Like the way Wolverine does, right? Like it's like, oh, you know, cut her a shot.

49:41 That's fine.

49:42 But if the whole skin gets blown off, it's like, okay, Wolverine needs some time. Or like Deadpool when he gets his hand chopped off, right? Like that's the way I take it. It's like he could have been down in that lake for months, still just drowning until like eventually, he could have froze down there in the winter and then thought he could have been like Captain America, you know, and thawed out.

49:58 So let's take our next ad break and then we'll be right back. We're back. Taylor, were you going to say something there?

50:06 Well, yeah, just you reminded me of, was it Manhattan?

50:12 Yeah, Jason takes Manhattan when he's at the bottom. He's just chilling there.

50:15 In the lake, and it was the psychic that wakes him up? No, the psychic wakes him up, but then the psychic wraps the chains around him and puts him in the lake. Isn't that right?

50:27 No, no, that's Tommy. Tommy throws him down there, and the psychic does wake him up. But yeah, Jason is just.

50:32 At the bottom of the lake for a long time.

50:35 Right. Yes.

50:36 Just chilling there.

50:38 Yeah. Because, yeah, that's right. The boat drives or sails by, latches on, and he cuts on the boat, and then he floats into the fucking cargo ship to New York.

50:45 Right. But in that continuity, he was Zombie Jason because he was the Frankenstein's monster Jason, right?

50:51 Lightning brought him back to life.

50:52 That's right. Yeah. So there you go. Because I guess.

50:55 No, go ahead.

50:57 Yeah, one last thing. 2009 kind of retcons all this and acts as like a part two, doesn't it? Yeah. Because he goes burlap sack to hockey mask.

51:07 Yeah, they kind of do that.

51:09 I don't think they do the Halloween 2018 thing where it is like, oh, ignore. I think that's kind of doing its own continuity, but that is the idea of like, oh, let's make it that he actually saw the death. And that's where, for me, when you send the non-spoilers, when you're like, oh, it kind of links back up with the movies. I think it does a little bit here and tells some stories, but for me, that's where big deviation, and I'm fine with it, but big deviation where She doesn't get her head.

51:36 Shot.

51:36 The final chapter, the ending of this, is not the, oh, Pamela is going to kill all these people, these counselors. She does with the hippies, and then that's kind of it. The final chapter is her husband trying to get her back, the big do-goo-roo there kind of.

51:48 She gets out of there. She gets in the woods.

51:50 He's chasing her throughout the woods, and Jason's also there. Of course, when he's driving Linda Carlini, Jason's just standing in the middle of the road like, yo, of course he'd be here in broad daylight doing this. Never seen him, but okay, sure, whatever. and then when they get there, you know, Hamish is still chasing her down in the woods, Jason gets there, like you mentioned, he does kill his dad, whether it's biological or not, kills his dad, goes to kill the mom, doesn't, and then he just goes, he does the classic disappearing Jason thing, and then she's just out there in the woods laughing, crazy Ralph was trying to kill Jason, but didn't, that to me is, that's completely different than obviously the continuity of the movies, right,

52:28 because she, it's supposed to be, she's killing the counselors, she gets her head chopped off, and then Jason's there the following year or whatever, where they're both actively alive.

52:37 She's not dead.

52:38 She didn't do the whole mass murder of the counselor thing in the way of the movie. So that's why when you're talking about non-spoilers, you're like, oh, does it not? To me, it does take a full-on 360 or 180.

52:49 I guess. Well, they never show who kills. In part one, they never show who kills the two counselors, right? And here, it actually lets you see and they show you it's Grace I mean yeah in part one it implies and this is just kind of like really in part one yeah in the.

53:06 Movie yeah in the movie yeah here I know it's Grace but like even then it's like she still kills all those other counselors in part one so there's.

53:13 No yeah but I mean you can I mean you can look at it can you hear the glass in the background by the way oh yeah I got her headphones but she's she's mucking around.

53:26 She's making some glass she's glass making She's making glass. He's trying to like stare at her. He's trying to use like mind control, but.

53:32 It's not working. He's got headphones on. Listen to Murder Mystery. Full volume. So when it comes to, if it gets bad, let me say something. I'm going to go yell at her.

53:44 Just talk through it.

53:45 Just talk through it. When it comes to the part one, I just think that, I think that obviously they kind of expand on it because you have the perspective of the killer going to kill the two, but they don't show that it was Pamela Voorhees. So I think they're just thinking they can get away with showing, Hey, you know, we're doing the same thing with this, but it's actually grace.

54:06 And it fooled me because I thought, Oh, this is where Pamela is going to go and kill it. But no, it's like, Oh, it's grace. So I think, okay, that doesn't feel necessarily like a retcon. It feels like them just kind of showing you what really happened in this perspective. And then you also.

54:19 Get, how do you explain if you're trying to do, because like I said, that's where at times I thought it was doing the whole, like, okay, we're doing the, the wicked thing, right? Where it's like, Oh, you know, Alfie is not an actual bad witch.

54:33 Just she was painted that way. Right.

54:34 But then you can't do that with the movies because like Pamela doesn't get her head cut.

54:38 Off like in the series.

54:39 Right.

54:39 And they're still alive as Jason's like a adult teen, whatever it may be.

54:44 And that's that's that's another thing I was just thinking was going to happen. Like, OK, she's going to get her head cut off. We're going to go that route. But they didn't. Yeah, they went the route of she ends up finding and confirming that he is alive out there, which definitely kind of caught me off guard. So, I mean, unless there's just another point where... What's that behind you?

55:07 What's jumping up?

55:08 Madison's coming for me. Yeah. Unless there's another point where, I mean... I don't feel like this Pamela would be in the mental state that that Pamela is at when you look at part one, because that Pamela is, you're right. Like she's like revenge, you know, you should have been watching. She's super fucking delusional. Um, but I wish I could remember at least remember how many years part one is after Jason dies.

55:36 Um, I don't know. I feel like it's maybe just the year after, but I don't know for sure, but there's no way you're making this work.

55:44 I don't know why you're looking at it. It's like time travel debate. Like they're, they definitely go there. And that's fine with me.

55:48 I didn't have a problem with that. I was like a negative. I was like, okay, they want to do this.

55:53 And I don't know what juice there, if they want to do a second season, which I don't think they've confirmed. I don't know if it's a mini series or not, but like, I don't know what the juice would be there after the fact. I think there's still definitely like things open that you can do Pamela, but, I don't know.

56:07 I guess it's just we're still trying to find Jason or just knowing he's out there.

56:10 So it was.

56:11 I was taken aback that we... Again, it's not bad. I just didn't think we were going that route. I thought we'd still eventually get into her head cut off with Jason out there. But he's already got the sack and she's still alive.

56:21 She's still alive, yeah. So, okay. So the movie, part one, is a year after Jason drowns. So this TV show is nine months after he drowns. So, yeah, just... if we got a season two, I'd have to see her kind of descend more and more into being crazy. And I mean, maybe the fact, I don't know, like he, she knows he's alive out there and doing his own thing.

56:42 So I feel like that kind of gives him, gives her peace to her character versus part one, where, you know, it is different. It's changed because in part one, she does things, Jason's dead and she's delusional and she's just killing counselors because they're all responsible for his death and whatnot. So that's definitely like the, the major difference. shift and change in there. And I, I wish that we got a little bit more of that Pam descending into madness leading, leading into that, but I can overlook that. I think it's, it's, it's fine. I'm not gonna dock at points for that.

57:14 It's just, it's creating its own kind of narrative.

57:16 And I guess you gotta look at like the Halloween ones, right? Where you got your own, you got different variations.

57:21 And that's right.

57:22 13th, you have the original, you have the remake, and then you have this. And then I'm sure there could even be another one somewhere in there. But, uh, even then you still have three different kinds of timelines, right?

57:34 You do. And I get, I was not expecting to get like full on Jason in here with the sack. That was super awesome. And I was hyped for it, but yeah, that completely caught me off guard when it's like, okay, he's, he's actually here and he wasn't killing everyone. Like, uh, what was his name? Uh, uh eons or emails or whatever he was that one hunter guy who's always in the the cafe and he got shot in the neck and he went down then he saw jason walk up to him um but jason didn't kill him which is interesting uh i don't know there's a few other characters too that didn't get killed obviously the hitchhiking hippie she got killed by jason jason decided to string her up inside Ralph's fucking little cabin there. Yeah, Ralph. Just framing Ralph.

58:23 Yeah, come on. What has he ever done?

58:24 Super Mike says they could have her go back to kill the counselors when the camp.

58:28 Reopens after the hippie's death. Yeah, I guess.

58:32 But what's the point?

58:33 Yeah, it would just be more of the, like, they piss her off, they're bad kids, whatever.

58:39 They could do that. They would just have to have a whole new motivation for it, right?

58:41 It wouldn't be the idea of they kill Jason unless they did something where they, like, killed jason and she thought he was dead and then again but uh i don't know like i think i think i'm with you where i think this show i'm kind of fine if it stays here as like uh like like on its own because i just feel like the only thing you could do from here is i guess you could tell more pamela stories but i feel like it would be like okay well now you get into jason and what he's been up to and they get like you would almost just do like welcome dairy where it's like oh it's a friday 13th movie but as a show where it's a bunch of counselors and they're getting killed by jason and there's a story there because i.

59:16 Just don't i don't know what more there is to do.

59:19 There you know so uh super mike says i was in a good point because one of the last things i had in front of my nose was i was just he said he was disappointed in where the Grace story went. They just ditched her after episode six. I like the idea of Jason having a friend, but not much payoff after she kills the counselors. Yeah, that's where, for me, it's tough, right?

59:36 Where did they ditch her? Was she ditched in the hospital?

59:38 No, I think, maybe.

59:39 I think he just means, like, the writers. Like, the show ditched the character. I don't think they did that sort of sense. But, yeah, I really enjoyed that character and that storyline. I like the idea of the one nice kid to Jason, so she has a tie to Pamela. I like the idea of the bad mother.

59:54 I like the.

59:55 Mix-up where Pamela thinks her mother's beating her, but it's actually just Grace smoking and, like, you know, self-harming. So big screw-up on Pamela. But even then, the mother, I'm not saying she deserved death, but I don't think she was also the greatest mother either. So this idea of kind of, like, they might need each.

1:00:09 Other, right?

1:00:10 And that was a storyline, like, I glom onto because I always talk about that with Izzy where we lost our first dog because he got sick very, like, when he was just about to be five. Then we adopted Izzy when she happened to just be turning five. And it was like this kismet of like, well, we lost her dog and her owners didn't want her. And that's what I, I can really glom onto that storyline. I appreciate that where it is. Obviously Pamela was the reason that her mom died, but it's in this sense of, okay, like she's looking for a good pair parental figure and Pamela wants to be then Pamela when she's normal as a good parental figure.

1:00:43 So they could try to find each other.

1:00:45 I liked all the storylines of her kind of being jealous with the, the hippies, like trying to take her on and do everything.

1:00:50 But, I agree with you, Mike, where the kill happened and it just kind of went there.

1:00:53 And that's where the weird thing with the show is, like we just talked about, I could see the show where what they did with Pamela and Jason, I can see that, oh, that's the end. And that's the end of this timeline here. And Jason went on to just be a killer and Pamela's kind of nutso. But there is multiple things. I think Grace's big one where that feels like, oh, we'll circle back to this in season two.

1:01:10 But it just, I don't know.

1:01:12 It just, it felt way too open in the sense of, I didn't, you should still try to, Even if you want another season, try to finish off the stories in that singular season in case you don't.

1:01:22 Right.

1:01:23 Because then it feels complete where that great story feels like completely wide open where she killed the counselors. And I guess they just all just put it open on the other hippie. But that was a character we spent a lot of time with. So I agree where started really good. I like that actress, the child actress, but I don't think it it ended well enough for me to be happy with it on the whole there.

1:01:42 Yeah, I'd agree with that. I mean, it kind of really escalated and concluded after the hippie thing. And I guess after she kills the two counselors, then she really just takes a back seat and they don't really touch upon her again in the future. No. So it would have been nice to get some more depth with that for sure because the buildup is absolutely there. Friending Jason, friending Pamela, all that jazz. Then her just, doing the acid, which stressed me out when she did like three dabs of that. And, uh, I mean, that's not good. Um, but then her, like, I liked the moments too, where she went to that teenager party. And again, the one girl who was the guilty counselor just tried to like be friendly and get her out of there. And then

1:02:25 she went total bitch mode on her, like, and then they became enemies. Um, yeah.

1:02:32 Um, fuck.

1:02:34 I had another point. What was it? It's, well the part with grace when she was with the hippies oh yes i remember but i'll save it for after this so grace was uh she went into the boat the one guy was like the one guy's like shit sorry and like threw her to the ground and then when pamela gets there you can see okay he's got the machete or whatever in his head and it's just like okay like well great uh grace is safe but this is jason coming in to fuck around and yeah and then shit but one thing that caught me off guard and I had a kick out of it was buddy from Halloween, 2018 Halloween. He's crawls into the van when the counselor is with the, yeah.

1:03:13 Yeah.

1:03:14 Just like, let's, uh, you know, let's, let's get into it. And he just felt so, um, like sexually, um, uh, what would be the word? Um, not, not, not, um, fuck, what is the word? Um, Uh, vulnerable, not vulnerable, but, uh, not conflicted, but, um, yeah, he just so much so that he had to go and find his, his ex former girlfriend and just like, just like, yeah, like, you know, I'm a man, I love women, you know, cause he just, so he felt so attacked. This guy crawled in there and was like, yeah, you know, we'll take turns. I'll, I'll do you or he just, he was just not having it. Um, yeah.

1:04:01 Fuck.

1:04:01 And I had another point that I wanted to bring up too.

1:04:03 Shit.

1:04:03 Shit.

1:04:05 Yeah, that was something.

1:04:05 They teased her figuring out Pam was the one who killed her mother at the seance, but they never went back to it.

1:04:09 Yeah, it was odd. And now, yeah, I just, I don't think it worked in the long run.

1:04:17 It felt like they, because even season two, I just don't feel like, what, she's trying to prove she might be the killer?

1:04:21 It's like, well, Jason's still out there. I don't know. It just, yeah, there is some loose ends with that.

1:04:28 Yeah.

1:04:29 I did want to shout out to, was it her? I can't remember.

1:04:33 I think it was her mom, and I think her name was Grace Snell, but very fun.

1:04:37 I had to pause. I showed Emily, and I.

1:04:39 Showed a bunch of people at work, but Valerie Snell was the name of the mom that ate it and Pamela killed in the restaurant there and burned it down, and if you don't know, that's the name of my lastborn child, one of the twins, Valerie Snell.

1:04:55 I was like, okay, look at that.

1:04:57 It was so weird, and it's funny because in Carrie... It's because the original, but there's also a Snell in there in the Carrie 70s or whatever. There is a character named Snell, but I'm like, oh, the name's having a big comeback. But I just got a big kick out of would never thought in movie. It's like Valerie Snell, because like Snell's not like a very common name you hear.

1:05:14 And then just the fact that was Valerie. So good kick out of that there.

1:05:17 So. Did you also see as well when it was, I think, Lee's first scene when he walks in there and he's at the diner. And the lady goes up. He's like, hey, hey, chief, you want a Lime Ricky? He's like, yes, please. And he gets his Lime Ricky.

1:05:31 Oh, no, I missed that.

1:05:32 Yeah, it was a nice green Lime Ricky that he's drinking at the diner.

1:05:38 Was it green too?

1:05:39 It looked pretty green to me, yeah. That's funny.

1:05:42 All right, let me just check my notes here, see if there's anything else I got. Let's see here.

1:05:52 What was your favorite kill? My favorite kill?

1:05:55 Hmm. Hmm.

1:06:03 Yeah, the two people, the hippies having sex, and then the head gets cut off and the blood pours on the guy.

1:06:08 Yeah, I think just all the hippies together was something.

1:06:12 I think that was a fun time. So probably that.

1:06:14 That was a good time, and Linda Carlini was just popping off. Because the guys at the beginning that were a part of the corporation, that was fine.

1:06:20 That was more of a brawl. Lots of the kills were very quick.

1:06:24 It was like shot to the face, shot to the eye. So I think the hipsters were.

1:06:29 The best ones.

1:06:30 Did you think that Pamela was going to use the bowling ball and kill that guy? mental guy.

1:06:35 There was a chance, but just because we're all in public, I'm like, how is she going to get away with this?

1:06:39 But there was a chance.

1:06:40 I definitely thought what they're alluding, I was like, okay, that could happen. Yeah. But no, I'm out of notes on this.

1:06:50 Yeah, I can't think of anything else note-wise. I think that that is it.

1:06:56 I'll go first. I'll give it a nice solid seven. Maybe it could go up in the future. Maybe it could go down. I don't know, but I actually think seven is... Where I happily am. And again, I guarantee you at some point, I'm looking forward, it's crazy that we've.

1:07:08 Been this long in the podcast, 11 years, you know, next year will be 12. We just had our 11th year, but still, it moves fast.

1:07:15 And we still have yet to do Halloween, Nightmare on Elm Street, or Friday the 13th. At some point, we will. We will.

1:07:21 We were going to do Halloween for the 2018 movie, and then we just ran out of time back then. And Nightmare on Elm Street, and same thing, Friday the 13th, we'll always be like, oh, we're waiting. And Crystal Lake, we just didn't have enough time, so Maybe one year we don't have, once we finish.

1:07:33 All the Marvels and stuff, we'll get there. But it is funny. So I don't know for sure.

1:07:37 We'll have to wait until we review all those. But I think I can guarantee there's probably a lot of movies in there that aren't sevens. I feel like those Friday the 13th movies, like a lot of horror films that go on for, or franchises that go on like plus six movies, I bet there's a lot of four to six scores in there.

1:07:53 So I think seven is pretty good.

1:07:55 And again, that's higher than what I'd give the fucking original movie. You know, even though like there's, There's some fun nostalgia to look back on it, but then there's the actual score. But, yeah, I'm confident with a seven on this, and maybe I'll watch this again in the future. I'm in no rush, but I think Linda Carlini and a lot of other people are good. You know, the guy who played Lee, Hamish Linklater, but I think she really carried this and made it big time worth the watch.

1:08:16 I think if there was somebody that was a lesser actress or didn't get the material as well and sell it as well, this could.

1:08:22 Have not been as good of a watch. So, yeah, I think that's where I'm at, a seven.

1:08:27 I like that. I'm going to go 7.5. I would have done an 8, but I feel like you said at the start, this could have probably gone down to like 6 episodes. I would agree, because there were some bits I just thought, this is really, really long, really stretched out. Yeah, and I almost feel like part of me wants that finale episode to be... It just, it's...

1:08:55 It felt like there was still a lot to kind of cover in that final episode because you have basically... the like link later kind of appearing there and just you got everything in the sheriff and then it's like okay it's wrapped up really really quickly when they get in the car they drive off and then boom that's that's jason appears and then it just feels like it's wrapped up really, really quickly. I'll say it is wrapped up with a bow. Cause I think it's, it's fine, but it just is very expedited. And I would have liked it if that was like episode five. Cedric agrees with me. That was episode five. And then episode six is just more of like the fallout and kind of like, then heck get into the part where she gets decapitated

1:09:32 or something like that. That would have been, that would have been perfect. Hang on one second.

1:09:39 Hang on one second. I got nothing to say. Nothing left.

1:09:43 Alright, I'm back. I'm back. He was just making his pathway across the hallway so he was loud.

1:09:52 That's an interesting question, Mike.

1:09:55 Brian Fuller, you probably don't I don't think you've seen Pushing Days or anything like that, but he did. He was the original showrunner on this. I think they stopped before they went to this guy. I don't think it's a situation where they're making the show and then they took over halfway. It's like they're making a version that went there. Uh, he's the guy that did Hannibal. So that's where obviously it's a big thing for me. Um, I would say for me, yes, I love Brian Fuller stuff.

1:10:21 It's not for everybody. I think there is some, you know, long sequences and he, he's, he's very, uh, can get a very artsy. And that's one thing about Hannibal. If you love Hannibal, it is a fantastic, you know, pun intended dish. It is, at Pristine, it's one of those at the, you know, Chef Tales where you see, like, look at what they did there, and there's this and that.

1:10:41 I think with Crystal Lake, um, so I enjoyed this show, and I had a lot of fun with it, but at the same point, I don't know how much I'm going to be, oh, he's still creating the first episode, okay, there you go. And yeah, I'd heard about their, they did, like, a big ice chase or something that was in the original script. I think there's some stuff that's out there.

1:10:57 It was, like, Jason, like, on frozen ice or something, I don't know, but, um, I think because this is a seven, a seven's like, oh yeah, I like that, but it's also, like, I'm not too attached. There's definitely guilty pleasures or sevens I wouldn't want to give up. I don't think this is in that category where it's such a strong seven. And obviously it's tough, right? Because I fucking, I love Hannibal. That's a top ten show.

1:11:17 I think I put that in my number two spot for when we did our rankings on Patreon for our ten years. So it's in the top three at least. I think that is one of the greatest shows ever made of all time. Not in the decade, of all time.

1:11:29 So yeah, I would.

1:11:31 But I could understand though where Even though it's A24, I can still understand where they might be coming from and could have thought it might have been too artsy or too out there. So I'll say yes, Mike, I would have for my personal taste. But I still like what we got.

1:11:47 Nice.

1:11:48 Anything else?

1:11:49 Are we getting another Friday the 13th movie? Is that kind of the rumor right now? There's no date or anything?

1:11:53 I think they're working on it, but I think it's still just legal stuff. I think it's always just like, let's see, Friday... the.

1:12:01 13th new movie update. Let's see what an article or Google AI tells us. Let's see a new.

1:12:07 Movies in development following the announcement, uh, March 16th by the original director and co-creator Sean Cunningham in, uh, 2026 confirmed the film treatment for our new old school.

1:12:17 Jason Voorhees, uh, is complete for TMZ.

1:12:21 That's the next mainline feature that is moving forward years after franchise legal disputes, entire return and classic Jason style, uh, Yeah.

1:12:29 So I think they are.

1:12:30 It's in development though. So development's still like that. They could still be working on a script and everything.

1:12:35 Right.

1:12:35 Cause then you've got a script, there's still pre-production and getting a director and casting.

1:12:39 So they announced that in March of this year.

1:12:42 So I, I still say we're probably a, when did the original one, didn't that come out in 85?

1:12:47 Am I wrong? I think I'm right.

1:12:51 I'd say you're right. Oh, really? Oh shit.

1:12:55 So like, Not that I want them to.

1:12:57 I guess there's a part where they could wait for 2030.

1:13:00 Their 50th anniversary?

1:13:02 Yeah. I hope not, though.

1:13:05 We'll see how it works for Star Wars. And then if it works out, we'll be like, okay, let's do it for ours.

1:13:09 Re-release the original cut.

1:13:11 Well, there you go, ladies and gentlemen. Me and Taylor will be back tomorrow with Vision Quest. We've got some other stuff going on this week. Clayface this week as well. Extra Life, I forgot to say. Everything is down below.

1:13:21 I completely forgot to promote that. But please go there. Read all about it. We're going to start giving out all the details.

1:13:26 Soon, the goals, the events, and then the people that are, because we have announcers that are participating in the trivia battle, just locking all those names down.

1:13:34 So we'll be back tomorrow. Let us know. We have Discord.

1:13:37 Obviously, we don't have a Friday the 13th channel, but if you watch and want to talk about it, we have the spoilers tag in the comments, wherever. So yeah, let us know in YouTube, Discord, wherever you want to chat. We'll chat if it's all civil, and we hope you enjoyed this episode, and I promise when you hear from us next, it'll not be boring. Mm-hmm.